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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 12 post(s) |

Querns
GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation
467
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Posted - 2014.04.30 03:54:00 -
[421] - Quote
Zomgnomnom wrote:Fozzie,
You and Rise were doing sooooo much better with the pirate re balance..... and now this ****.
This is an entirely unnecessary change at this time.
There's so many problems with the stated goals I dont know where to begin.
If your true goal here is to get things done locally in null sec you need to re distribute all the resources to all the different regions.
For starters capitals all use differing fuel types that cant be found everywhere. By default we will be needing to import fuel from other regions for the various capital jump drives needing fed.
T2 production requires resources from moons, which by the way, are concentrated based on regions. Yet again we will need to import these things.
IF the goal of this was some bastardized attempt at nerfing power projection, it wont work. How many times have you guys seen that price is NOT a balancing factor. The blocs will pay the fuel bill without a second thought. The guys like me who have to pay for their own fuel on the other hand are now consuming 50% more fuel for an already minuscule profit and thankless job of logistics.
You want to de centralize Jita and make nullsec industry worth while. I get it and I like it. This change however has numerous secondary and tertiary side effects.
You've said before you guys wont interfere with the market unless its PLEX prices.
FUNNY, Plex prices are through the roof and here you are making a change to shore up a market, that may, or may not be affected by a change that you have no idea how the player base will react too.
On second thought, it's good to have "put drones on everything and make interceptors unstoppable, what could go wrong?" Fozzie back. We're used to dealing with his insanity. Man, for an "alliance" who lives in NPC Pure Blind, noted for its proximity to Empire, you sure are pent up about the changes. This post was crafted by a member of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay. |

Querns
GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation
467
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Posted - 2014.04.30 04:00:00 -
[422] - Quote
I'll give all you people a hint: you are not arguing particularly well towards getting the changes reversed. Here is a list of things you probably don't want to include in your argument:
- "small alliances"
- plex
- the subscription status of your account or imminent cancellation thereof
- the "sandbox"
- a litany of other, completely unrelated concerns that simply must be solved before the sacred cow can be touched
Use of these terms cheapens your argument considerably. If you need a refresher course on how to argue for or against a change properly, feel free to peruse my posting history. I've got a pretty good track record when it comes to feedback successfully affecting the game. This post was crafted by a member of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay. |

Zomgnomnom
Royal Black Watch Highlanders Mordus Angels
29
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Posted - 2014.04.30 04:01:00 -
[423] - Quote
Querns wrote:
Man, for an "alliance" who lives in NPC Pure Blind, noted for its proximity to Empire, you sure are pent up about the changes.
A horrible change is a horrible change regardless of where one lives or what alliance they're a part of. I also haven't always lived in Pure Blind nor do I intend on living here forever. This is a horrible change no matter who/where you are. |

Miss Everest
Elysium Accord
4
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 04:09:00 -
[424] - Quote
NO! CCP NO! *Gets rolled up holoreel* BAD CCP BAD! |

King Fu Hostile
Imperial Collective Unsettled.
71
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 04:31:00 -
[425] - Quote
Querns wrote:It's pretty amusing how many people are kneejerk posting on this thread and betraying their sheer incompetence at understanding basic economics.
It was amusing for a few pages, but 20 pages of these monkeys repeating the same misconceptions and baseless whining is just sad. |

Tore Vest
364
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 04:34:00 -
[426] - Quote
Strike... and miss
CCP fozzie You are not hitting your mark with this  No troll. |

Katanagari
Council of Grumpy Old Farts Brothers of Tangra
0
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 06:17:00 -
[427] - Quote
Querns wrote:Katanagari wrote:This change is a simple increase in transportation costs. It's bad for null sec, it's bad for highsec and in practice there isn't a single group of players who'll benefit from it.
People who mine topes benefit quite a bit! You can find those people across all bands of security space, except wormholers I guess. Poor wormholers.
People who mine topes won't benefit at all. There are two reasons for this:
1) The reduction in isotopes usage from towers will be offset by the increase in usage for jump fuel. That's the stated objective. So there will likely be no net increase in isotope demands or a sustained increase in isotope prices. There will be some movement in racial demands as caldari research towers are removed and archon jump costs increase. That is all.
2) The isotope price is actually set by other income producing activity in eve, such as mission running or ore mining. If the isotope prices become high enough Ice mining will attract enough players from other activities to bring to it back down.
Bottom line is these changes hurt almost everyone permanently to avoid temporary pain for the ice miners. Consider the alternative where lower demand (from a reduced number of towers) sends the isotope prices down - It just means some ice miners will mine something else, supply will shrink and the price will bounce back. Likely within the space of a couple of months. What's the harm in that?
The other two goals of this change are:
GÇó Help encourage cost competitiveness for local resource gathering in nullsec.
This will actually do the opposite, the cost of importation will always set the price difference between null and highsec. Even if more people are attracted to build in null because of higher margins the only competition will be importers. So instead of importing for X, people will now build for X +20%. Why is that better?
GÇó Although we don't expect this change to significantly impact behavior around jump drive power projection, it should at least provide a small incentive change through higher costs for moving huge capital fleets often.
If increased jump fuel costs even bother alliances with huge capital fleets, then I'm certain that power projection will be the last thing to be trimmed in the budget. Various member benefits (the rewards for being in a huge bloc) will be cut first, actually driving people back to hisec, or out of the game.
|

Rena Senn
Resurrection Ventures Un.Bound
99
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 06:26:00 -
[428] - Quote
Querns wrote:I'll give all you people a hint: you are not arguing particularly well towards getting the changes reversed. Here is a list of things you probably don't want to include in your argument:
- "small alliances"
- plex
- the subscription status of your account or imminent cancellation thereof
- the "sandbox"
- a litany of other, completely unrelated concerns that simply must be solved before the sacred cow can be touched
Use of these terms cheapens your argument considerably. If you need a refresher course on how to argue for or against a change properly, feel free to peruse my posting history. I've got a pretty good track record when it comes to feedback successfully affecting the game.
How well would this argument have gone down if it was posted during the summer of rage? You don't think these factors are relevant? Fine. That's for you to prove. Trying to blatantly shape the narrative by insisting anyone who disagrees with you is an idiot for even raising such concerns is only going to entrench opinions against you further.
But then again maybe that's exactly what you want. This "us versus the pubbies" song and dance always plays well with the home crowd, regardless of the actual validity of other people's concerns. |

Gorski Car
ElitistOps Pandemic Legion
271
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 06:36:00 -
[429] - Quote
Well I guess I am no longer going to use Black Frog for logistics thats for sure. #GORSKI4CSM https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4265138#post4265138
|

Joker Dronemaster
Association of Commonwealth Enterprises Nulli Secunda
36
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Posted - 2014.04.30 07:18:00 -
[430] - Quote
So let me get this straight..........
You make it so that anyone who wants to mine in highsec needs to have a pos; and make it possible by removing standings requirements. Which should cause a massive increase in demand for POS fuel.
You get worried about a demand decrease in POS fuel and then nerf fuel consumption for jump drives to protect isotope prices.
I R CONFUSED!!!!!!!!!
Question. Will CCP pay for the hospital bills of all the 0.0 Ice miners who get priapisms from the price spike? |

Dairokuten Maoh
Pwn 'N Play Nulli Secunda
24
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Posted - 2014.04.30 07:25:00 -
[431] - Quote
Instead of tweaking things left and right and pushing the StarCitizen to be more viable. How about someone in CCP kick this Fozzie dude out of office. S+Öpü«sëìpü½S¦¦pü»täípüÅpÇüS+Öpü«s+îpü½pééS¦¦pü»täípüù Before me, nobody stands. Behind me, nobody stood.
|

gascanu
Bearing Srl.
106
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 07:25:00 -
[432] - Quote
Fozzie? HELLO! Fozzie, you still around man? |

Althalus Stenory
Flying Blacksmiths
8
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Posted - 2014.04.30 07:30:00 -
[433] - Quote
The more is announced, the more I think this summer will sux... |

Jena Jamson
Pwn 'N Play Nulli Secunda
56
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Posted - 2014.04.30 07:39:00 -
[434] - Quote
Don't you see all the negative responses here?
WE DONT WANT IT!
CCP LISTEN TO YOUR PLAYER BASE WHO ACTUALLY PLAYS THE GAME! |

gascanu
Bearing Srl.
107
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 07:42:00 -
[435] - Quote
Althalus Stenory wrote:The more is announced, the more I think this summer will sux...
to be honest the number of changes looks insane, and based on previous experience i'm pretty sure something will go wrong; last time when CCP tried something like this was when they introduced the new "improved" united inventory... and we all know how that went... it took them about what, 6 months to fix the things that where not broken but the new "improved" version broke;
really, looking at the summer expansion... crossed fingers X  |

TigerXtrm
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
639
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Posted - 2014.04.30 07:42:00 -
[436] - Quote
I don't like this change much either. I fail to see or understand how increasing everyone's fuel cost, and by extension the prices of goods outside of high-sec, is a good thing.
I'm open to a good explanation though, maybe it'll change my opinion. My YouTube Channel - EVE Tutorials & other game related things! |

Althalus Stenory
Flying Blacksmiths
9
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 07:49:00 -
[437] - Quote
gascanu wrote:Althalus Stenory wrote:The more is announced, the more I think this summer will sux... to be honest the number of changes looks insane, and based on previous experience i'm pretty sure something will go wrong; last time when CCP tried something like this was when they introduced the new "improved" united inventory... and we all know how that went... it took them about what, 6 months to fix the things that where not broken but the new "improved" version broke; really, looking at the summer expansion... crossed fingers X  Well the difference between Unified Inventory and this patch, is that the latter will have many economic impacts... :/ (and the worst to say is that we all know we'll have to wait patch day + x month to get something "fixed")
I really like almost all updates from the start, but this devpost and the price devblog just throw everything in the water. |

Bad Bobby
Bring Me Sunshine In Tea We Trust
404
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 07:59:00 -
[438] - Quote
It looks like a good plan to me. I'm sure time will tell, either way! |

JanSVK
Benzene Inc. The Explicit Alliance
2
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 07:59:00 -
[439] - Quote
CCP Fozzie wrote:Hello everyone! The goals of this change are: - Stimulate the isotope (and therefore ice) market to help cushion any drop in demand from players using smaller starbases after the science and industry slot changes.
- Help encourage cost competitiveness for local resource gathering in nullsec.
- Although we don't expect this change to significantly impact behavior around jump drive power projection, it should at least provide a small incentive change through higher costs for moving huge capital fleets often.
For reference, this will increase the cost of running a max skilled Rhea from Jita to RIT-A7 (jump drive transit the whole way) from ~50m isk to ~75m isk.
Hello CCP Fozzie
I don't agree with these changes and with the argument provided. If anything the ice belts should get a buff because ...
* Stimulate the isotope... - The science and industry changes highly motivates people to use more POSs and JF so an increase in demad should be expected not a decline. Buf to Reprocessing Array = more POS. Also due to the reprocessing changes it is to be expected that mining will change so that Ore mined in hi-sec will be: 1, compressed (POS = isotope consumtion) 2, hauled to 0.0 (JF = isotope consumtion) 3, Refined 4, hauled to empire (JF = isotope consumtion) 5, sold, ect...
To the slot changes...
Building better Worlds Dev Blog wrote: So player corporations will now have the choice between the safety of NPC stations or the efficiency of Starbases to operate. The core goal is to motivate player entities to actually defend their Starbases if attacked or be reactive enough to take the blueprints out before they go into reinforced mode.
So it is logical that POSs will be used more and will use large POS because The core goal is to motivate player entities to actually defend their Starbases. It is much easier to defend a large POS than a small one. There is no argument about that.
Question If it turns out that your assumtions where wrong, can we expect
CCP Fozzie wrote: adjust further if necessary once we see the results. bact to original values or even lowering of isotope consumtion? |

Dracvlad
Taishi Combine Second-Dawn
397
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 08:02:00 -
[440] - Quote
In this thread a Goon said the impact on his alliance is trival, for my group it is not trival. Thank you CCP for making it even more difficult as a small guy in the fringes of 0.0.
The reason you did this was to try to take back some of the advantages you are giving to null sec coalitions in terms of industry, you realised that it would be too easy for them to flood hisec markets, and the only way you could try to stop that was transport costs. This does nothing for force projection apart from kick the small guys in the nuts even more.
I operate a JF and the jump fuel for that is already a pain, but that makes it even more painful, so the next patch, my main way of getting minerals (gun mining) gets a 50% nerf, and then you add to the pain by making it even more difficult to bring in minerals from hisec. Now what about adding hidden mining sites in NPC 0.0 at least, so we have a slightly better chance of gathering minerals, apart from ninja Venture fleets...
From all of this I am expecting you guys to nerf hauler spawns next, please at least leave them as they are in NPC 0.0.
Don't be a turd and follow the herd Instead be a Hero at Hub Zero |

Shiti Dama
Garoun Investment Bank Gallente Federation
10
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 08:19:00 -
[441] - Quote
My anticipation for the summer patch is up by 50%, desire to log in is down by 1/3.
|

Marlona Sky
D00M. Northern Coalition.
5053
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 08:45:00 -
[442] - Quote
Habris wrote:CCP Fozzie,
Please stop breaking our game. Your so called "balancing" is terrible. Firstly the black ops battleships have REALLY crappy holds as is, and you are suggesting this? Secondly of all the things that need addressing you pick this? Just please stop.
disgruntlely, Me Typical goon. Try putting forth a tiny bit of effort to read and you will have noticed isotopes are being reduced by 1/3 to offset the 50% increase in consumption. Effectively what you could bridge/jump before with your fuel bay will be identical after the patch.
Habris wrote:p.s. remember those interceptor changes? yeah this is about a good idea as that. Reminder: it wasn't. Interceptors are really taking you nullbears for a ride lately. Maybe form a gang to deal with them when they are around? I kill them all the time with a hauler and here you are crying bloody murder how they are destroying your game. Wipe those tears little goon. Go tell papa mittens to reimburse your ratting Ishtar and to do something about those bad, bad interceptors.
No seriously, stop crying. You are embarrassing null players.  . |

Vaju Enki
Secular Wisdom
1302
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 08:53:00 -
[443] - Quote
The biggest spoiled little brats in the game are crying like bitches, this just proves that the changes happening are way overdue.
Thank you CCP and keep fixing EvE Online. The Tears Must Flow |

Dave Stark
5205
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 09:10:00 -
[444] - Quote
Vaju Enki wrote:The biggest spoiled little brats in the game are crying like bitches, this just proves that the changes happening are way overdue.
Thank you CCP and keep fixing EvE Online.
considering there has been a lot of talk about people switching to shield caps (so, mostly caldari ships) you might want to take a moment to consider that if the entity in the game who has literally just been handed a monopoly on capital fleet fuel prices says "this is bad" they might have a point.
then again, they just might really hate being rich. *shrug* |

Rommiee
Mercury Inc.
694
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 09:15:00 -
[445] - Quote
Jena Jamson wrote:Don't you see all the negative responses here?
WE DONT WANT IT!
CCP LISTEN TO YOUR PLAYER BASE WHO ACTUALLY PLAYS THE GAME!
Think back over the last few years....
When have CCP EVER listened to the player base...they may make a few cosmetic changes to give the impression that they listen, but in reality they really do not give a sh!t what we think.
They have a fancy idea that some idiot dreamt up (probably while drunk, as no-one can come up with dopey ideas like this otherwise) and will bring it in regardless of what anyone says.
I have long since given up providing feedback on the test forums, as it is completely pointless. I donGÇÖt even bother looking at it anymore as it is totally irrelevant.
So, save your breath, they are going to do it anyway.
|

King Fu Hostile
Imperial Collective Unsettled.
74
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 09:23:00 -
[446] - Quote
Rommiee wrote: So, save your breath, they are going to do it anyway.
I'd do the same just to get to laugh for all these aspie tears, but they do it because it's good for the game.
Local industry creates gameplay, and regional resource differences encourage territorial conflicts. Both reduce stagnation and enrichen the game.
|

Amely Miles
Exiled Tech
10
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 09:25:00 -
[447] - Quote
i have started calling this "the Summer of Nerf" .... i am hoping what i imagine is about to come true ...the builing your own gates thing has me thinking of a Eve 2.0 universe next to this one allowing for server tidi to disperse between the two universes as well as power projecting, if i imagine this correctly the second universe would need to have us build gates on the other side as well to get back to this one so if this is true then it makes sense for CCP to be pushing people in to a self sufficent way of living and i agree ...if not then CCP fail big time. |

Tragot Gomndor
Krautz WH Exploration and Production Cerberus Unleashed
31
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Posted - 2014.04.30 09:35:00 -
[448] - Quote
Hello :D
you dont like that nerf? you live in 0.0? you still like isk?
JOIN WORMHOLES TODAY -no cynos -no jumpdrives -no icebelts -no supers -(almost) no goons and therfore -(almost) no tidi
ENLIST NOW TO THE LOCAL WORMHOLE CORP NEAR YOU 0.0 = GOONS = SAAAMMMMEEE!!!!1111222 |

Freelancer117
So you want to be a Hero
188
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 09:36:00 -
[449] - Quote
This could be a smart way to catch botting from RMT 
Because of the increased consumption, extra demand will increase the price and attract botters to this market segment more.
Once they are all in place in ice belts, CCP only needs to check the client and behavior of these accounts and BAN HAMMER TIME Eve rule no.1: The players will make a better version of the game, then CCP initially plans.
http://eve-radio.com//images/photos/3419/223/34afa0d7998f0a9a86f737d6.jpg
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Johan March
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
113
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Posted - 2014.04.30 10:05:00 -
[450] - Quote
I'm too much of a filthy casual to pretend to know how this change will effect every aspect of gameplay, but CCP usually does changes in the 10-20% range and then re-evaluates. A 50% change in fuel consumption just seems a bit much. |
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