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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 5 post(s) |
Redblade
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Posted - 2006.05.31 16:46:00 -
[211]
Edited by: Redblade on 31/05/2006 16:47:24
I compared dmg on the 1400, 425 and the mega beam t2's all with short range t2 ammo, basing it around the 425's time to empty the guns and do one reload wich is 234 sec and came up with this.
234 sec with 1400 = 104118 dmg (2x full loads with reload)
234 sec with 425 = 128576 dmg (1x full load with reload)
234 sec with MB = 131742 dmg (no reload needed)
Note: 6x 1400 on a tempest, 7x 425 on a mega, 8x mega beams on an apoc, all with 2x t2 dmg mods, lvl 5 BS and lvl 4 spec.
This clearly indicates the lower dot of the 1400's due to reloading, now if we change the clip size to 15 on the 1400 instead of the current amount that is 10 u get the following.
234 sec with 1400 = 124109 dmg
This is clearly more in line with the others.
As it stands now the mega out-ranges and out-damages the tempest, the apoc out-damages the tempest with mega beams and the apoc with tachyons has allmost the same alpha strike.
So Tux if u wouldn't mind atleast taking a look at this, it's not asking for much but it would help alot in laggy fleet battles where reloading/changing ammo take way more then 10sec.
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Imhotep Khem
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Posted - 2006.05.31 17:03:00 -
[212]
 Originally by: Sarmaul
...No, I bought 5 hawks within hours of it being announced it was going to turn into a missile ship and laughed as the price skyrocketed by 14m about an hour after I did so :). I have full plans on doing a nice resell when the changes go through :P
Since these changes have not been announced what you have done is called insider trading. I'll be contacting Concord about this 
Im lovin these changes. AF gettin some lovin.
____
If your not dyin' your not tryin'. |
keepiru
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Posted - 2006.05.31 17:07:00 -
[213]
Looks like we'll have to wait another week though, they aint making it this patch because of (yet more) db issues.
O well, hopefully we'll get some 'phoon fitting/hp restructuring on top of everything else. Me, im hoping for a ninja'ed BC agility boost =p
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Please fix BC Sig/Agility! |
Khonsu
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Posted - 2006.05.31 17:10:00 -
[214]
Originally by: Tuxford
So you see this is not really as simple as just making Vengeance a missile boat and everybody is happy because not everybody would be.
And those people will happily fly the Zealot and Retribution. Heck, they already do. I don't see what the problem is here, really? More missile slots for Veng and Sac (especially Sac)!
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Baalic
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Posted - 2006.05.31 17:13:00 -
[215]
Originally by: Tuxford
... and everybody is happy because not everybody would be.
^^Worst possible reason for a design decision.
Eve suffers badly from forcing people to run nearly identical setups in all their ships. Some of the most interesting and effective setups I've seen are ones that break the mold. An evil PvP Punisher with ACs or a passive shield tanked Cyclone with lasers for uber PvE funtime.
You could unnerf minnies for PvE in one fell swoop by adding a missile hardpoint to all their ships without adding high slots. TBFH all combat ships should have more hardpoints than highslots. Hmmm, do I put in 5 missiles and 3 guns or 5 guns and 3 missiles or 4 and 4? A phoon has a choice of 4 and 4, or 4 and 4 and possibly you could put in 4 and 4. On a scale of 1 to boring that's really boring.
If you are confused as to what bonus to add to a certain ship and have it be unique how about a general bonus? Amarr tend to need lots of cap. How about 5% to capactor per level? That would be interesting. Or 5% more ROF to ANY turrets, not just the type you expect to see on that ship.
Options and creativity are fun.
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Dr Tetrahydrocannabinol
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Posted - 2006.05.31 17:17:00 -
[216]
Tux is there a reason you took out the Kinetic damage bonus out of the Hawk?
Caldari - BS idea |
Tiuwaz
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Posted - 2006.05.31 17:17:00 -
[217]
Quote:
There is a static update being prepared but might not be ready for when the patch will be deployed. So for the time being we have removed all static changes from the patchnotes. Once the static is ready, it will be deployed to TQ and all the changes added to the patchnotes.
I knew the Minmatar suffering is hardcoded and the code itself is resisting any attempts to change it 
Originally by: Oveur
This is not the conspiracy you are looking for.
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paeronsoda
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Posted - 2006.05.31 17:20:00 -
[218]
Originally by: Tassi
Delete vengeance, give retribution another mid and everybody is happy.
Good idea actually 
And on a more serious note why is it so damn wrong with the retribtuion to have 2 med slots..... Has a dev ever stated why?
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Crellion
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Posted - 2006.05.31 17:37:00 -
[219]
Ok I havent read 8 pages and I appologise, but...
After these changes the AFs seem to mirror closely the HACs in race balance.
As I see it now the minnies will win bst HAC best AF best cruiser and be equal to the best out there in the BS and ceptor department.
Therefore: minnies enjoy. But if I here any more whinage from you, even a peep, I ll slap you on the face, all.
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Sarmaul
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Posted - 2006.05.31 17:58:00 -
[220]
Originally by: Crellion
Ok I havent read 8 pages and I appologise, but...
After these changes the AFs seem to mirror closely the HACs in race balance.
As I see it now the minnies will win bst HAC best AF best cruiser and be equal to the best out there in the BS and ceptor department.
Therefore: minnies enjoy. But if I here any more whinage from you, even a peep, I ll slap you on the face, all.
Actually, the assault frigates now (besides the amarr ones) are pretty much balanced with each other.
Originally by: General Apocalypse
the game is very well balanced
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HankMurphy
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Posted - 2006.05.31 18:18:00 -
[221]
Originally by: Crellion
Ok I havent read 8 pages and I appologise, but...
After these changes the AFs seem to mirror closely the HACs in race balance.
As I see it now the minnies will win bst HAC best AF best cruiser and be equal to the best out there in the BS and ceptor department.
Therefore: minnies enjoy. But if I here any more whinage from you, even a peep, I ll slap you on the face, all.
check out RedBlade's post above, think we (minnie pilots)have a valid argument w/ the howie clipsize.
Don't worry Crellion. Before you know it minmatar will be on top in all ship categories.... as we rightly should be 
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Kai Lae
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Posted - 2006.05.31 19:02:00 -
[222]
Could we keep our hands off the changes for AF until we at least get on the test server and find out what they're like? Considering how the price of vengeances has suddenly jumped due to greatly increased demand I'm guessing that people aren't upset about the change that's occurred.
Raptor and Ares Fix |
Tar Ecthelion
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Posted - 2006.05.31 19:06:00 -
[223]
Edited by: Tar Ecthelion on 31/05/2006 19:05:57
heh, glad I bought myself a vengeance and a jag few weeks back. 
As for Missile Khanid ships, I loved my Sac setup with 3 hvy beam II and 3 Hvy Missile II. Not as much damage output as a zealot, but with half your weapons using any damage type, and a mean tank on it. it wasn't bad.
But a Sac with 6 Hvy Missiles II .. OMFG !!!  DROOL !!! 
.....
"When you kill a man it costs nothing to be polite"
Winston Churchill
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Alex Harumichi
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Posted - 2006.05.31 19:09:00 -
[224]
Edited by: Alex Harumichi on 31/05/2006 19:09:53
Originally by: Kai Lae
Could we keep our hands off the changes for AF until we at least get on the test server and find out what they're like? Considering how the price of vengeances has suddenly jumped due to greatly increased demand I'm guessing that people aren't upset about the change that's occurred.
I think the discussion branched back there into suggestions on how to make the Sac a good ship, and into general "how to make the Amarr ships more varied". Seems the general consensus (happily shared by Tux) is that armor tanking missile spammers would be cool. But I think that was sort of a separate thing from this current batch of changes, and more aimed at future patches and general design direction.
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Crellion
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Posted - 2006.05.31 19:12:00 -
[225]
Originally by: HankMurphy
Originally by: Crellion
Ok I havent read 8 pages and I appologise, but...
After these changes the AFs seem to mirror closely the HACs in race balance.
As I see it now the minnies will win bst HAC best AF best cruiser and be equal to the best out there in the BS and ceptor department.
Therefore: minnies enjoy. But if I here any more whinage from you, even a peep, I ll slap you on the face, all.
check out RedBlade's post above, think we (minnie pilots)have a valid argument w/ the howie clipsize.
Don't worry Crellion. Before you know it minmatar will be on top in all ship categories.... as we rightly should be
Worry? Why worry? I can train can't I?
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Kai Lae
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Posted - 2006.05.31 20:36:00 -
[226]
Originally by: Alex Harumichi
I think the discussion branched back there into suggestions on how to make the Sac a good ship, and into general "how to make the Amarr ships more varied". Seems the general consensus (happily shared by Tux) is that armor tanking missile spammers would be cool. But I think that was sort of a separate thing from this current batch of changes, and more aimed at future patches and general design direction.
Well, as I said when sac was changed, set it to 4/4 hardpoint layout, laser damage for optimal range, and keep the missile ROF bonus. If you need long range heavy launcher II w/ about 75k range should do nicely.
Raptor and Ares Fix |
Phish1
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Posted - 2006.06.01 00:09:00 -
[227]
top teir arty clip size increase 4TW!
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Redblade
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Posted - 2006.06.01 08:21:00 -
[228]
Push to the top so Tux can get a chance to tell me why im wrong or perhaps right before this topic gets forgotten.
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Mortania
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Posted - 2006.06.01 17:57:00 -
[229]
Edited by: Mortania on 01/06/2006 17:58:57
If the Wolf is getting a falloff increase, can we get a targeting range increase as well? Minnies have some of the longest range weapons and yet both of the AFs have the shortest targetting range of all of the AF. As it stands now (before the patch) Tremor ammo is already limited by the Wolf's 50km targeting range (with LRT5). Are both of our AFs meant to be AC boats? Can we get one that gets the 45km base that we seen on nearly all of one type of the other races AFs?
It's probably asking for too much, but it can't hurt to ask.
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Elrich Zann
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Posted - 2006.06.02 07:03:00 -
[230]
Quote:
200mm, 425mm and 800mm AutoCannons have a 50% higher ammunition capacity
Sarmaul, all minny's owe you 
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Testy Mctest
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Posted - 2006.06.02 07:06:00 -
[231]
Originally by: Elrich Zann
Sarmaul, all minny's owe you
ZOMG!
Testy's Eve Blog - Updated 01/06/06
Today's forum noob level : Neutral.
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Dreamstalker
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Posted - 2006.06.02 07:07:00 -
[232]
Originally by: Elrich Zann
Quote:
200mm, 425mm and 800mm AutoCannons have a 50% higher ammunition capacity
Sarmaul, all minny's owe you
/bows
__________________________________
My name is legion for we are many. |
Xthril Ranger
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Posted - 2006.06.02 07:57:00 -
[233]
Originally by: Tuxford
Recon operation was supposed to give bonus to scan resolution which is the same as the leadership module so either the module or the skill would override the other one so that bonus didn't make much sense. So we changed it to EWAR module range.
I don't get it. Isnt Recon operation the leadership module? Which skill are we talking about?
you'll never jump alone |
Sentille
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Posted - 2006.06.02 16:13:00 -
[234]
3 things
Lots of hairy man love to Sarmual, Wierda, Naughty and Testy for all their efforts for us Minnie pilots.
Any chance of some new DPS numbers on 150/200 200/425 650/800 Autocannons?
Where can I DL Naughty spreadsheets?
Happy days!
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Naughty Boy
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Posted - 2006.06.02 16:27:00 -
[235]
Originally by: Sentille
Where can I DL Naughty spreadsheets?
You'll find it in the thread linked in my signature.
NB.
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Chode Rizoum
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Posted - 2006.06.02 16:41:00 -
[236]
425s.. still not worith fitting...
800s still not worth fitting.. they need their dmg mod buffed befor that.
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Sentille
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Posted - 2006.06.02 19:37:00 -
[237]
Originally by: Naughty Boy
Originally by: Sentille
Where can I DL Naughty spreadsheets?
You'll find it in the thread linked in my signature.
NB.
Many thanks NB
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Grimpak
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Posted - 2006.06.02 20:00:00 -
[238]
Originally by: Chode Rizoum
425s.. still not worith fitting...
800s still not worth fitting.. they need their dmg mod buffed befor that.
as nafri (it was nafri right?) said before, make the high-tier AC's short range alpha strike guns \o\
-------
Originally by: Abdalion
Originally by: Jebidus Skari
What, in EVE, is a Tyrant?
Me. Especially when it comes to troll threads.
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Fuyursuki
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Posted - 2006.06.02 20:10:00 -
[239]
Edited by: Fuyursuki on 02/06/2006 20:11:45
Originally by: Grimpak
Originally by: Chode Rizoum
425s.. still not worith fitting...
800s still not worth fitting.. they need their dmg mod buffed befor that.
as nafri (it was nafri right?) said before, make the high-tier AC's short range alpha strike guns \o\
Thought that was testy myself, a lonnnnnng time ago in the days mm ships used cardboard bullets and the amarrians fitted thier apoc's with laser pens...
'Suki
edit: forgot the damn quote 
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Imhotep Khem
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Posted - 2006.06.02 20:11:00 -
[240]
Boost again if you like. I already use 800s and 425s. They are good. And with the added ammo they should rock well.
____
"If your not dyin' your not tryin'."
"Are you prepared to go all the way, Alexi?" DuGalle |
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