So let me try something else. We don't want to remove the IGB until we have CREST up to the point of replacing it. The most common uses of the IGB are things like DOTLAN's radar or wormhole mapping software. Both those really just need your location information, which we can supply in the an even better way via CREST. Better CREST wouldn't require you to have the IGB open. Log into some website, give it permission to see your location, and even when you are not on that web site it know where you are. This means you get your whole corp to sign up and then only those looking at the mail need to open the browser. This is better in so many ways.

Are you trying to turn this into a nerf local thread?

The user is tricked into visiting a specially crafted web page hosting the exploit which will execute various payloads to ultimately download the Calculator from a remote location and launch it outside the sandbox (at Medium integrity level).

Anyways, nothing is happening anytime soon, when it does it will be because we, CCP and you the players and the CSM, have had a good long discussion about it

But here's the whole problem, you now need two monitors to effectively see what you could previously do with just one.
Heck, if I'm already using two monitors with a client on each, where the heck do you expect me to display the browser at the same time if its not inside the client? Do you want to go and change how EVE renders so its always in the background?

This! Maybe the leet types on the CSM all have multi-display setups but, I seriously doubt that to be the case for the majority of the player base. I have neither the desk space nor the inclination to purchase a second display just to play Eve.

We already have to rely on an out of game solution to avoid the monotonous Eve soundtrack.

Help! Someone busted the brakes on this thing.

Should have come to a complete stop withing 3 posts of FoxFour's explanation. Then again, I think GD never had brakes installed in the first place.

Mr Epeen

Really the only question and problem with moving from the IGB to CREST is the fact that you can browse the IGB from the client versus alt-tabbing. From our, or mine anyways, understanding most of you guys have multiple monitors and that's not an issue. There are also other applications that will overlay your current web browser with the game. Things like Overwolf I think it's called.

Or.... you could make the map useful in EVE and also add a wormhole mapping system +á la Siggy. Why does CCP have this fetish to leave features out for the community to build? Why must we rely on DOTLAN, Siggy and out of game fitting tools? Why do you think people are willing to buy multiple monitors just to be able to access information that should be available in game? Do you realize how crazy this all sounds? You have a great blind spot right here.

I think you've done a great job with the API CCP FoxFour, but lets not forget how long overdue this work is from the promises of CREST made 2 years ago. CCP is crap at managing expectations, you hype stuff like tessellation in a fancy demo at FanFest only to discard it completely the next year. It's no wonder CCP had to kick half the company.

There are also other applications that will overlay your current web browser with the game. Things like Overwolf I think it's called.

[17:43:11] XXX > fuckin overwolf
[17:43:15] XXX > i never wanna use that

Oh wow, this is a pretty amazing thread. Mostly filled with a lot of misunderstanding so let me see if I can clear that up before we get to the Jita riots. Before continuing though, please be advised this post comes to you from a phone and is therefore likely to be filled with even more terribleness than my usual posts. I may try and proof read this though.

So, first and foremost the IGB is not being removed anytime soon and defiantly not without a lot of discussion with the CSM and more importantly you guys. When I say not anytime soon I mean there is no plan to remove it, there is not even a plan to look into how much effort it would be to it. Removing the IGB is as best I can tell years away from happening.

So that probably doesn't help this that much as all i have done is confirm we CCP want to remove the IGB and that it is years away from happening. That doesn't help the fact that many of you use the IGB and feel losing the IGB would hurt your gameplay.

So let me try something else. We don't want to remove the IGB until we have CREST up to the point of replacing it. The most common uses of the IGB are things like DOTLAN's radar or wormhole mapping software. Both those really just need your location information, which we can supply in the an even better way via CREST. Better CREST wouldn't require you to have the IGB open. Log into some website, give it permission to see your location, and even when you are not on that web site it know where you are. This means you get your whole corp to sign up and then only those looking at the mail need to open the browser. This is better in so many ways.

The other big thing the IGB offers is the ability to open links in the client. I don't think we have looked to deep into it, but we should be able to have you press a button on web site and then via CREST it tells the server which tells your client to open some window. Maybe a tad shower but again not only is the format and technology better for developers but the number of uses and possibilities is far greater than the IGB.

I could go on listing so many other things but the bottom line is this: CREST is a far newer technology and more importantly one we can maintain far easier than the IGB. We would like to remove the IGB but we will not do so until CREST, or even maybe something else, gets us feature equal to the IGB.

Really the only question and problem with moving from the IGB to CREST is the fact that you can browse the IGB from the client versus alt-tabbing. From our, or mine anyways, understanding most of you guys have multiple monitors and that's not an issue. There are also other applications that will overlay your current web browser with the game. Things like Overwolf I think it's called. The benefits from us doing things through CREST and relying on you guys to use an existing browser are immense. We get to focus on making cool things instead of trying to maintain a customized browser in the client. Not sure you guys realize just how much work there is in maintaining something as complex as a browser and how much of a security problem for everyone this is.

Anyways, nothing is happening anytime soon, when it does it will be because we, CCP and you the players and the CSM, have had a good long discussion about it, and only once something else is in place to replace it.

I hope that elevates your concerns for now. Let's get back to blowing up spaceships and building an awesome universe together and enjoying the sun... Which I might be the only one doing :P

If you are low on ram don't touch the browser and you'll be fine. As far as I know the browser process will show up after you launch the browser ingame.

They can optimize the browser, there are open source browsers like kmeleon which use less than 200MB ram. We don't need the browser for complex stuff, we need something simple for gifs and sites like dotlan, whormholes, evekill, etc.


Removing IGB is a dumb ideea.

Do you have a phone?

So what you're saying is that the removal of the jukebox didn't really change anything and that their reasoning for dumping it was pretty much spot on.

Yes, I have a smartphone with a small (compared to my computer display) screen. But, that misses the point. Why remove a convenient in-game feature that's widely used and force us to rely on a second display, a smartphone, tablet, etc.? As another poster pointed out, when the current IGB was created it was touted as a major upgrade in terms of both functionality and future maintainability. Was that all just hogwash? Was CCP being dishonest with us then or, are they being dishonest now?

As to the jukebox, you ignored my main point again; in order to get beyond hearing the same 4 tunes over and over we're supposed to use a 3rd party app whereas before we didn't.

First of all, the question is whether it actually is widely used..

First of all, the question is whether it actually is widely used.

There's ten pages of posts here and the gist of them ten pages is to not remove the IGB. Not to mention the sheer number of Wormholers that use static mapper and wormhol.es and a number of other sites within the IGB...

What about those of us with low RAM? Firefox likes to omnom 40% of my System RAM or so. I can't afford more RAM, and I can't really have anything else running while I'm playing EVE. And I like being able to click on a fit and have it instantly pop up in EVE so I can save it.

Yes, but how many of thuse use it as an actual in-game browser rather than as a means to feed in-game data back and forth to out-of-game processing?

It's that last functionality that CREST is supposed to replace. The sites you listed are doing just that and seem to be pretty much exactly what CREST is aimed at. Granted, some sort of in-game data browser might be needed to view the output of that processing but really, that's not nearly as neat (or secure) as having a way to feed data back into the game through a purpose-built interface.

And not to be funny, but using WH mappers through the IGB is still using the IGB.

Yes, but it's a fairly silly and cumbersome hack compared to just automatically feeding the data to an external processor.

Better than tabbing out. We have a whole host of tools we use via the IGB that simply would be a nightmare to use if we had to tab out of the game all the time.

All garbage aside, I will not accept the possibility of them letting us use SSO to migrate our mapping tools over as a reason not to raise hell until they give us 100 percent concrete proof that they will do so.

Can/might/should is not will. There is lots of stuff they could do but won't our haven't.

Mapping tools are bread and butter to the entire way of life of wormhole corps who roll and scan out 10-20 chains a day. Doubly so if you have multiple corps in an alliance. They function to give a unified map to make your bookmarks match up.

It costs them nothing to leave the IGB in exactly as is now, it hurts noone by doing something.

It hurts an entire player base removing it for no other reason then certain people don't use/like it as much as some of us.

Better than tabbing out. We have a whole host of tools we use via the IGB that simply would be a nightmare to use if we had to tab out of the game all the time.

Anyways, nothing is happening anytime soon, when it does it will be because we, CCP and you the players and the CSM, have had a good long discussion about it, and only once something else is in place to replace it.

OMG, they did that to Chrome??