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Debaro Zeir	Posted - 2006.11.23 17:02:00 - [121] Originally by: Robert Dobbs Originally by: Debaro Zeir And I can't be caught on another end of the gate? Are you still whining? Who are you?
Typical Spy Caldari	Posted - 2006.11.23 17:05:00 - [122] A ganker also knows that 50% or more of your mods/cargo are going to be destroyed. A Ganker also knows that after he makes his kill, he cant kill again for at least 15 minutes (sometimes much longer) (this allowing better targets to pass by) and he can only make so many kills before he has to spend weeks fixing his security status. Also, I doubt a typical gank BS is going to do 15k modified damage before it gets owned. All that being said, you will only get ganked if you turn yourself into a juicey target. If your total cargo worth is only 50m isk a ganker prolly wont waste his time on you, seeing as he is likely to only get 25m isk and his insurance and modules had a cost. If you tank out even just a T1 hauler properly you can fairly safely carry upwards of 100m isk in goods. T2 raises that to 500m or so. While technically it is possible that 7 BSes all gank you even in a super tanked t2 hauler, I've never seen gankers with that level of cordination, need, and time. Still possible though, so use a freighter for highest security possible. ----- Selling all races battleships at great prices, convo me in game for details.
fivetide humidyear Gallente The Avalon Foundation	Posted - 2006.11.23 17:12:00 - [123] Edited by: fivetide humidyear on 23/11/2006 17:16:18 Yep, of course you can be caught on the otherside of the gate but the attacker has much less time to lock you, get the cargo scan results up and make a decision to attack as you align to warp. Then he has to be close enough to scramble you to stop you warping away. I've been the "victim" of 3 high sec ganks and I learnt the same lesson from them all: Number 1 carrying loads of mission loot in the ours to jita pipe, scanned by badger mkII attacked by lone Brutix. attack barely scratched Occators shield. ROFL'd as attacker wtfbbq by concord Number 2 carrying even more expensive cargo up same pipe about to jump into kisogo, attacked by 3 caracals and 2 brutix's. now this time i had to repair some damage to the occators armour, about 500 iirc. that annoyed me. LOL'd even more at the we should have popped it comments in local, got some good loot from their cans too and enjoyed bumping a couple of pods around. Number 3 Ganka raven attacked me for not very much cargo, possibly for my mods, care to guess the result? Occator suffered light scratching to armour, not actually repaired that armour damage yet. What did I learn? Industrial level 5 was one of the best skills i've trained. The occator was iirc about 25 days training that was well worth it and I'm mainly trained in shooty shooty stuff. You get the added bonus of the blocade runner for low sec and speedy hauling. it's been said before, don't carry 400million in a tech one hauler. On my occ with extra passive hardners for, good DC etc i have resists in the high 80's to 90's on loads of armour and good resists on the hull, I would guess that it would take at least 3 ravens to be sure of popping it, especially in higher sec systems where the concord reaction is faster. Going to try that next time I can get onto sisi with some corpmates. you can't tank a tech 1 hauler enough to be sure of fending off a ganka raven, maybe a iteron 5 could do it comfortably but hell thats a few million for a skillbook away from transports anyway. (and the cost of the Occator) I've made a copy of this for when the same omg i got killed in high sec post appears next week.
scabbsssjr Gallente M'8'S	Posted - 2006.11.23 17:14:00 - [124] Originally by: Debaro Zeir Originally by: radiogaga and you mistake is "Destroyed: Badger Mark II" NEVER HAUL EXTREMLY EXPENSIVE STUFF IN T1 HAULERS !! if you own 400+mills you can afford a good T2 hauler and fitting on it I can't operate transport yet. So I can't be a trader first 4 month o gaming. Now I'm know that. Since you have 400m worth of mins in your t1 hauler, you know what you should do? CARGO CANS, **** by my second week in eve I was using them. What ever I say is my own views and not of my corp.
Lumee	Posted - 2006.11.23 17:29:00 - [125] With the upcomming "warp-to-0km" change in Kali on the "supposed" 28th of November, this will all be over... In the mean time, one hint: INSTA BOOKMARKS! Some people sell them for a lot, but you can make your own, it's easy, just long... Set a route but disable autopilot. 1. Plan your route first, then get a shuttle (faster) 2. Bookmark the object (gate or station), call it like... 1. Gate 3. Then fly your route, and place bookmarks (manual) about 12-13km past the target (gate or station), while keeping your trajectory lined up, and call it 1. Warp 4. Warp back to the previous point, then back to the Warp bookmark, and be ready to right-click the Gate bookmark and click Activate (or dock if station) to test it, then rinse and repeat for each waypoint. It takes a lot of practice to get them perfect everytime, but they work very well...
Typical Spy Caldari	Posted - 2006.11.23 17:33:00 - [126] Originally by: scabbsssjr Originally by: Debaro Zeir Originally by: radiogaga and you mistake is "Destroyed: Badger Mark II" NEVER HAUL EXTREMLY EXPENSIVE STUFF IN T1 HAULERS !! if you own 400+mills you can afford a good T2 hauler and fitting on it I can't operate transport yet. So I can't be a trader first 4 month o gaming. Now I'm know that. Since you have 400m worth of mins in your t1 hauler, you know what you should do? CARGO CANS, **** by my second week in eve I was using them. Um... what do cargo cans do to save you? Do what the above poster said, use a t2 hauler. By the time you have enough money/goods to need a t2 hauler, you should have had 3x the time needed to train for one. So just train for it and use it. ----- Selling all races battleships at great prices, convo me in game for details.
Mak'shar Karrde Minmatar UK Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.23 17:40:00 - [127] Originally by: Sendraks Originally by: Mak'shar Karrde Well, ignoring everything else so far, in 0.0 you can secure the gates and make sure there are no neutrals/hostiles within a couple of jumps. While Empire is still pretty safe with scouts/instas; there is always the chance that the mega/raven/whatever sitting next to the gate will try his luck. Well a hauler caught in 0.0 alone is far, far more screwed than a hauler in high sec. If the hauler in high sec can tank fire long enough, concord will destroy the threat. Thats not going to happen in 0.0 or low sec. Moving a hauler with expensive cargo through 0.0 you take precautions. At bare minimum you use intsas. Then beyond that you check the route ahead for ship kills and pod kills. You ask in Alliance chat for reports of hostiles in the area. For greater security you fly with an escort with other people from your corp. People who can attack hostiles and or help repair your ship. You can do that in both high sec and 0.0, but the added advantage of high sec is that concord will come help you out. Well a solo hauler travelling through 0.0 with no intel deserves to be shot really. Even I would find that a hard target to resist. The difference is that in Empire you can only react to a situation. In 0.0 you can predict any threat and neutralise it before you send the haulers through. Not that I think Empire should be safer. I think it's fine as is, you really shouldn't transport that much wealth in such an inadequate ship. As to how much I can carry in my Battleship... Well not a lot, obviously, the only expensive things (50+ mil) I have to haul are usually loot/implants. I'm not much of a trader (though I can fly a transport ship). I'm eternally poor and can't justify buying the Freighter skill book considering how little use I would get out of it.
Taedrin Gallente Mercatoris Technologies	Posted - 2006.11.23 17:41:00 - [128] Actually, supposedly you can shrink wrap your cargo and cargo scanners (supposedly) won't see through it. Of course they may presume that if you went through the effort to shrink wrap it, it has to be something good. But that's why you should go around hauling shrinkwrapped trit every once inawhile, just to watch suicide gate campers get popped for .1m¦ of trit
Debaro Zeir	Posted - 2006.11.23 17:49:00 - [129] Originally by: fivetide humidyear Edited by: fivetide humidyear on 23/11/2006 17:16:18 you can't tank a tech 1 hauler enough to be sure of fending off a ganka raven, maybe a iteron 5 could do it comfortably but hell thats a few million for a skillbook away from transports anyway. (and the cost of the Occator) I've made a copy of this for when the same omg i got killed in high sec post appears next week. Thank you for that story.
Debaro Zeir	Posted - 2006.11.23 17:51:00 - [130] Originally by: Taedrin Actually, supposedly you can shrink wrap your cargo and cargo scanners (supposedly) won't see through it. Of course they may presume that if you went through the effort to shrink wrap it, it has to be something good. But that's why you should go around hauling shrinkwrapped trit every once inawhile, just to watch suicide gate campers get popped for .1m¦ of trit What is shrink wrap of cargo? I don't unserstand.
Debaro Zeir	Posted - 2006.11.23 17:52:00 - [131] Originally by: Lumee With the upcomming "warp-to-0km" change in Kali on the "supposed" 28th of November, this will all be over... In the mean time, one hint: INSTA BOOKMARKS! Some people sell them for a lot, but you can make your own, it's easy, just long... Set a route but disable autopilot. 1. Plan your route first, then get a shuttle (faster) 2. Bookmark the object (gate or station), call it like... 1. Gate 3. Then fly your route, and place bookmarks (manual) about 12-13km past the target (gate or station), while keeping your trajectory lined up, and call it 1. Warp 4. Warp back to the previous point, then back to the Warp bookmark, and be ready to right-click the Gate bookmark and click Activate (or dock if station) to test it, then rinse and repeat for each waypoint. It takes a lot of practice to get them perfect everytime, but they work very well... Thanks for that description. I'm made some instas already, but I don't have them for all paths :-)
scabbsssjr Gallente M'8'S	Posted - 2006.11.23 18:05:00 - [132] Originally by: Typical Spy Originally by: scabbsssjr Originally by: Debaro Zeir Originally by: radiogaga and you mistake is "Destroyed: Badger Mark II" NEVER HAUL EXTREMLY EXPENSIVE STUFF IN T1 HAULERS !! if you own 400+mills you can afford a good T2 hauler and fitting on it I can't operate transport yet. So I can't be a trader first 4 month o gaming. Now I'm know that. Since you have 400m worth of mins in your t1 hauler, you know what you should do? CARGO CANS, **** by my second week in eve I was using them. Um... what do cargo cans do to save you? Do what the above poster said, use a t2 hauler. By the time you have enough money/goods to need a t2 hauler, you should have had 3x the time needed to train for one. So just train for it and use it. If your goods are in cargo cans. I am 99% sure thay can't be scanned, meaning they won't know if your worth attacking or not. What ever I say is my own views and not of my corp.
Jacob Holland Gallente FIRMA Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2006.11.23 18:07:00 - [133] Edited by: Jacob Holland on 23/11/2006 18:08:22 Edited by: Jacob Holland on 23/11/2006 18:08:01 Originally by: Debaro Zeir Can you tell me good fitting for badger II? Main concept. Course there is very low PG. Start off by resigning yourself to 6k m3 cargo, then add Medium F-s9 Regolith Shield Extenders, with Power Diagnostic Systems in the lows, a little Engineering and Shield Upgrades you can fit four without trouble. You then need to make the choice between using an EM Hardener and an Invulnerability Field (boosts your resistances quite a chunk meaning you take less damage but need to be turned on every time you jump) or a Visceostatic EM Ward Salubrity/Magnetic Scattering Amplifier II and another Extender (IIRC this one needs to be small) (more shield HP but lower resistances, the primary advantage is that Resistance Amplifiers are always running - so if you need to run for a biobreak on a long haul you won't be defenceless). Tanking your hauler won't make it invulnerable, you may still lose the ship to a well set camp - but it will improve your chances and boost the costs for the gankers, 4k shield takes a while to chew through after all . Originally by: cordy Respect to IAC .Your one of the few people who truly deserve to own and live in the space you are in.
Taedrin Gallente Mercatoris Technologies	Posted - 2006.11.23 18:22:00 - [134] Originally by: Debaro Zeir Originally by: Taedrin Actually, supposedly you can shrink wrap your cargo and cargo scanners (supposedly) won't see through it. Of course they may presume that if you went through the effort to shrink wrap it, it has to be something good. But that's why you should go around hauling shrinkwrapped trit every once inawhile, just to watch suicide gate campers get popped for .1m¦ of trit What is shrink wrap of cargo? I don't unserstand. A shrink wrapped package is created when you create a courier mission. The items that you enter into the courier mission are all packaged together into one parcel (the shrink wrapped form). The parcel is not a container, but a unique item so (theoretically) scanners can't see through it. When shrink wrapping items, make sure that the courier missions is made to be available ONLY to you.
Henry Loenwind	Posted - 2006.11.23 18:30:00 - [135] So now you learned another lesson: Never try to tell noobs what is not safe in EVE---you'll be flamed to death by all those forum idiots.
Debaro Zeir	Posted - 2006.11.23 18:30:00 - [136] Edited by: Debaro Zeir on 23/11/2006 18:30:10 Originally by: scabbsssjr If your goods are in cargo cans. I am 99% sure thay can't be scanned, meaning they won't know if your worth attacking or not. As noticed twice before in this topic cargo ship scanner showing contaners cargo as well as ship cargo. So that is 1% :-). And BTW my cargo was in cargo conts.
Di Jiensai Gallente Myster0ns	Posted - 2006.11.23 19:06:00 - [137] Originally by: Debaro Zeir I don't know how to use that kind of experience in RL :-). But atacker loosing 0.5 of ss also. I don't know how much time need to gain it. The attacker looses 0.2 security, which takes roughly 1 hour ratting in 0.0 space to recover. --- The Story of the Big-Bad-Nos-Domi and the Brutix Selfproclaimed last instance on Rightousness Issues
Allen Deckard Gallente WTB Supplies	Posted - 2006.11.23 19:14:00 - [138] k now the man has learned not to fly what he cant afford to loose. But then again now he has no isk. So only thing he can afford to loose is an ibis. This makes making isk near impossible. Kind of a catch 22 :)
ELECTR0FREAK Eye of God Axiom Empire	Posted - 2006.11.23 20:04:00 - [139] Originally by: Debaro Zeir If posting a mail ensure you correctly snip the name of the player who killed you - Xorus You can't lost all you have when you piloting war ships. Course you have insurance. You can't lost all when you are mining, corse you have insuranse. But you can lost all when you trading. I'm have now this experience and just want to tell you about, seems that will be useful for beginner traders. You can lost all everywhere when you trading. Noone can protect your cargo. Nor your corp, CONCORD or your gang. Coruse you are at "High security" system. My Badger Mark II was destroyed in Kisogo system (SECURITI LEVEL 1.0). Higest security level system. Atacker was destroyed by CONCORD but I lost goods ~400 mils ISK. That was almost ALL my money, I made for 1.5 month of trading. That is equalent for 3 month TimeCode. I spent many many hours flying from one system to another. From one to another. And always was flying at "high sec" systems. And lost it all at once in 1.0 system. How that can be? Lets see a CONCORD letter: 2006.11.23 09:18 ----------------------- Victim: ******* Alliance: NONE Corp: State War Academy Destroyed: Badger Mark II System: Kisogo Security: 1.0 Involved parties: Name: snip (laid the final blow) Security: 1.5 Alliance: snip Corp: snip Ship: Raven Weapon: Bane Torpedo Destroyed items: Nanofiber Internal Structure I Giant Secure Container (Cargo) Nocxium, Qty: 89305 Nocxium, Qty: 300695 Nanofiber Internal Structure I Giant Secure Container (Cargo) Nocxium, Qty: 390000 ----------- This must be a day when I made first good money using my existing money. But instead I lost them all. That was my tool to produce new ISKs. When you loosing ship you can buy some lower ship by insurance payment. When you lost goods you can't do anything. Fu****g life. Attackers just fit: 1. Some t1 torpedo lauchers 2. Target painter 3. Some shield extenders/damage controls 4. Warp scrambler 5. Passive targeter. Them lost: 1. 20 mils for insurance payment. 2. 5-10 mils for t1 fitting 3. 0.5 security status You can't evade possible destroying in ANY place in the game. If you have trading using industrial. Every industrial with 100mils+ cargo is potential victim. Keep in mind - THERE IS NO SAFE SYSTEMS. Keep in mind everytime. There is no method to evade this. If you have 500+ mils cargo and good fitting your industrial them just can lost 2 ships and get your cargo. Every player can destroy up to 4 ship in "highsec" 80 mils to lost vs possiblitty to get 200-500mils - good enought? If you have more ss you can make this numbers 160 vs 400-1 bil and more. -------------------- Just remember - there is no safe systems when you trading. To trade safe you need spent here 4 month and use transport ships. P.S. if you willing to help me to reimburse some lost money I'm accept donations. I'm do not need much of money just 100-150mils to restore my business. If you will donate me even 1 isk - I'll feel less sad about my loose. Thank you and good luck. Welcome to the purpose of Transport Ships. Discoverer of the Missile Damage Formula
Epidemis	Posted - 2006.11.23 20:17:00 - [140] Originally by: Jenny Spitfire Edited by: Jenny Spitfire on 23/11/2006 12:52:28 How does a 3 month old character earn 600M ISKs? This char is 1 month old and I have the balance of 100m isk, dont think it's impossible to get 600M in 3 months.
Big Al The Aftermath	Posted - 2006.11.23 22:02:00 - [141] Originally by: Bistot Kid All you'll get here is people calling you an idiot and telling you how wonderful and brave the Raven pilot who blew you up was. The goon was wonderful and brave. Bad show though, recyclable alts in catalysts is what we expect from you! Kill a farmer, win some isk!
Bistot Kid Caldari	Posted - 2006.11.23 22:54:00 - [142] Originally by: Sendraks Seriously, the worst posts in this thread are from the high and mighty types such as yourself and some earlier posters LOL. I call this "RL PVP" as it looks like it's wound you up a bit!
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2006.11.23 23:58:00 - [143] Originally by: PMolkenthin Solution 1) Use an elite industrial, with hardeners if possible. These tough little bas**rds are rarely bother by suicide gankers. Solution 2) If 1 is not an option, buy a set of instas (you wont need these soon) and use your alt to scout for you. Non-solution: 1) less than 3 mont - can't fly an elite industrial as he has trained trading, not shiphandling skills, and even more can't fit one as he has'n trained the complementari skills; 2) ista prices is about 100 mil for region, right? 25% of his total capital, and as a trader he would need more than 1 region, and to end it the ista will be nerfed in revelation, good move buyin them. Alt scouting in high security is useless. The gankers use passive targeting, and detecting them with 50-100 persons in local is next to impossible. Possible solution is a player board of know gankers names, to add to the buddy list, but that will add to lag. Can't get why the deleted name in the OP post. Seen plenty of names in the forums. Nothing against posting one in the rules. It is something new or only a overzealous moderator?
darkmancer	Posted - 2006.11.24 00:00:00 - [144] The loss sucks but that eve sometimes. It's a harsh game but its better for it. Though 1 thing that annoys me is that concorde doesnt pick up the can and take it to the nearest station. You should never be safe in eve, but you should expect the 'police' to work in a vaguely inteligent way. --------------------------------------------------------------- Navy Apoc For Sale! Bidding starts at 850 mil [url="http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=
IntegralHellsing Gallente Space Perverts and Forum Warriors United	Posted - 2006.11.24 00:11:00 - [145] Shame on you, goonies! some lessons. 1. Never trust any solarsystem. be sure to fit passive tanks. 2. 1 WCS is helpful. 3. If you see someone (BS/Kessy) sitting on gate doing nothing, prepare to run. 4. perhaps use insta? ------------------------------
IroN HiDE GALAXIAN Rule of Three	Posted - 2006.11.24 00:11:00 - [146] HAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA Noob
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2006.11.24 00:18:00 - [147] Originally by: Debaro Zeir Edited by: Debaro Zeir on 23/11/2006 16:10:10 Originally by: Nimie this won't happen. the moment they see your nox they'll attack you. Just see kill letter carefully. My nocx was in conts, so this was just blind killing. I has only 7 cu vapor miner I in my cargo. Them could see only that. But he tries and completely loose his money. Them got ~3 mils from rest of cargo. But I was loose much more. From what I have found in others threads, nothing block cargo scanners.
Galimiy Portret R.u.S.H. - Fanatics	Posted - 2006.11.24 00:22:00 - [148] This same guys just killed my hauler with some stuff. Now, I understand the risk of EVE and bla bla bla, this is not the problem. The problem is that my KM is on Goon KB, but no loss mail for the raven the guy used. I am going to report this guy for exploiting because his ships should have been popped by CONCORD. And my mail is not the only one... http://killboard.goonfleet.com/player/Nurpicles ...now in RED
Marsha11 Bad Karma.	Posted - 2006.11.24 00:49:00 - [149] Edited by: Marsha11 on 24/11/2006 00:50:02 I posted on this thread earlier a pretty final and end of discussion comment. Now there is 4 (Edit: I just started page 5, what a joke...) pages of unessaccery whining because people cant learn once and for all if they expect to be able to haul millions or even billions of isk worth of stuff in a T1 hauler on auto pilot they are stupid and wrong. I stopped reading at the top of page 3 because i got so bored of reading about how someone isn't gonna get sleep tonight over some GAME money they lost that i contemplated starting a relief fund I dont know why i find it so annoying to be honest, its people that haul stuff around like they are the invincible Sultan of Jita that keep my wallet full so i can by endless high end faction mods for my ships... I think it might be something to do with the fact these threads of pointless drivel clutter up the forums and get in the way of all the interesting things people are trying to talk about. Can i just say to all the cry babies that think they should be able to haul this stuff around safely that my fellow gankers and I will be waiting at every **** high sec gate in every corner of EVE until you have nothing left to be worth the sec status... Good Day. End
Ogdru Jahad Amarr	Posted - 2006.11.24 07:13:00 - [150] They say that putting 200 bmsinto your cargo hold to lag out a scanner is a exploit. so what ya do is 500 seperate units of trit. -

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