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Gungankllr Caldari Celestial Horizon Corp. Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.12.05 12:39:00 - [1] Greetings- I've been dorking around with Drake setups to do missions when I'm waiting on the jumpclone timer. High: 7 Heavy Launchers Med: 2 Hardeners, 2 Shield Recharger II, 2 Large Extender II Low: 4 Shield Power Relays Is this pretty much the standard setup for passive tanking? I've read a little bit on the forums here and there, but I've never tried it before (Always went with an active tank) One of the issues I see is while it soaks up damage pretty well, the damage output with non-kinetic missiles is so utterly lame (Can't break the tank of certain BS) I have about 13 million SP in missiles, everything maxed. I know a good solution would be to switch to Tech II launchers for the ROF bonus, which I may do in the future. Hidden in this signature is a secret message. I like pie.
Kuolematon Space Perverts and Forum Warriors United	Posted - 2006.12.05 12:41:00 - [2] Edited by: Kuolematon on 05/12/2006 12:41:29 Try 4x Large Shield Extender II's and 2x Invul or 2x rat specific ones and 2/3x Shield Relays and 1/2x PDS II's And naturally 2x 15% shield rigs. That will give you 30k shields with 500sec regen. "It's great being Amarr, ain't it?Ö" "A world without pain"
CFC Fodder Gallente TARDZ Gods of Night and Day	Posted - 2006.12.05 13:57:00 - [3] Don't forget to try and stagger your shots, so that you deliver a constant stream of damage, and NOT just volleys. I find a steady stream can break a tank faster than trying to scare said NPC with your Alpha Strike abilities. Originally by: Arian Snow "GTC for ISK" promotes farming of isk to pay for your character those isk underminde the economy and creates inflation!!! Its like printing money in RL...
Tak Meirnoen	Posted - 2006.12.05 14:41:00 - [4] Originally by: Kuolematon Edited by: Kuolematon on 05/12/2006 12:41:29 Try 4x Large Shield Extender II's and 2x Invul or 2x rat specific ones and 2/3x Shield Relays and 1/2x PDS II's And naturally 2x 15% shield rigs. That will give you 30k shields with 500sec regen. I see where you get the 30k shields, but I'm not finding the 500 sec regen in your math. Fitting 3x Large Extender II, 3x Shield Recharger II, 4x SPR I, and 2x -20% recharge rigs (and 5% implants for shield hp & rech) I come up with: 17514 shieldHP, 305 shield/s peak With your setup (2x PDS II's with max fitting skills) I got to 30565 shieldHP, 160 shiels/s peak. Peeling off the hardeners for Shield Recharger II's gets it to 221 shield/s peak, and switching to all 4x SPR I, 3x extender/3x recharger gets to 258 shield/s peak. (The lesson being that Decrease Shield Recharge rig is better.)
Akita T Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force	Posted - 2006.12.05 15:09:00 - [5] 500 sec regen <> 500 shield/sec regen 30k shield regen in 500 sec, so in other words 150/sec peak regen. Ok, personally, I'd say go full passive, "just in case". So just fit 2 EM, 1 Kin and 1 Therm passive T2 hardner (L4 compensations at least) and 2x LSE-IIs Lows, of course SPRs... either SPR Is, or, if they prove to actually BE inventable, SPR IIs. Rigslots, 3x T1 purgers for -20% recharge time each can be fitted, heck, you could have 2 T2s (-25%) and one T1. In With SPR Is and T1 rigs, (and with the right skills/implants), you can get a 233 seconds recharge rate on your (roughly 15k?) shields ... I shudder to think what the recharge rate would be with SPR IIs and T2 rigs. _____ -sig- This is my only char. These are my skills Always question everything, including yourself
Pottsey Gallente Enheduanni Foundation	Posted - 2006.12.05 15:42:00 - [6] Alternatively you could go for high hitpoints and resistance and relay on the hitpoints pool over regen. I donÆt do this but it works for PvE. Fit x2 inv feilds, max extenders and max PDS T2 in the low slots. Passive shield tanking guide click here
Kasheem Cetanes	Posted - 2006.12.05 16:10:00 - [7] For the passive shield tank it really depends what you wanna do and how serious you wanna be able to pvp. But on the drake, opposed to the ferox, you are gunna run into a HUGE issue, that being your powergrid is very low because it is a missile ship, not a rail ship. So the ferox is a much better tanker because you will actually be able to fit it better. My ferox setup: 5 Heavy launcher 1 Mnos 1Neutralizer 3 T2 extenders 2 invuln 4 Shield Power Relay And you can do that np. On the test server I had problems doing anything like that with out RCUs and personally, I dislike RCUs. You are looking for more of a PvE build (wince) So lets just, for the hell of it, say you are killing guristas. High: 7 Launchers I think everyone can agree on that part. If you are going for a more pvp set up, use HAMs and a neutralizer (If you can fit it which you probably cannot) Medium: If you have Advanced Weapon Upgrades, level 4ish as well as shield upgrades, you should be able to fit 3 T2 extenders with no issues. You want 2 hardners, for pve the damage types of the stuff you are killing for pvp 2 invulns. And your last slow will be a shield recharger II. Lows, shield power relays, use an rcu if you have alot of fitting issues. So for PvE (like guristas) 7 Heavy T2 launchers 3 T2 Extenders 1 T2 Recharger 1 T2 Kinetic 1 T2 Thermal 4 SPR's T2 Use kinetic Heavy Missiles and 5 T2 Hornets For PvP (For those of you who are awesome and actually have the skills to do this) 7xT2 HAM /w percision Ammo 1x Energy Neutralizer or Smartbomb 2xT2 extenders 2xT2 Invuln Fields 1xT2Sensor Booster 1x something else (Web or 20km scram or target painter of remote sensor booster or cap recharger for more neutralizing or recharger for more tank, you probably cannot fit another extender) Lows, you will have to use 2 T2 PDU's and 2 T2 SPR For drones, There is no replacement for 5 Light ECM drones.
Shadarle	Posted - 2006.12.05 16:56:00 - [8] I've done quite a bit of work on the passive drake tank setups and have come to some rather odd conclusions. 1. It has a stronger passive tank than the Raven has active tank (unless the Raven uses expensive faction mods). Using T1/T2/Named items results in a far stronger tank for the Drake. 2. It passive tanks better than it active tanks. 3. It makes good use of Shield Recharger II's (first time I've ever found them to be worth using). Here is the best all-around setup that you can fit within CPU/Grid limitations (at least this is the best I personally could fit). This assumes BC lvl4. Hi: 7 Heavy Launchers, 1 Tractor. Med: 3 Large Extender II, 1 Shield Recharger II, 2 Inv IILow: 2 SPR, 2 PDS This gives you a peak regen tank of 495.99 dps averaged across the 4 dmg types. Drilling down you get: EM=58.60% or 309.19 max EM tank Expl=83.44% or 772.96 max Expl tank Kin=75.16% or 515.31 max Kin tank Therm=66.88% or 386.48 max Therm tank You have 18095.46 shields and regen them in 353.43 seconds. You will actually have a little spare cap... tho not enough to use 3 SPR instead of 3 PDS. This is the strongest T1 tank I've ever seen while using the spreadsheet I've made up to analyze tanks. It is overpowered to have such a massive tank on a t1 ship imo, but I am not complaining as I have every skill to use it. I can run with 1 setup (not bother switching anything between missions) and tank every level 3 mission. I do not have the 2 rigs to boost my shields/regen, but that would bring this tank up to T2 command ship levels... or close to it. If you think you have a better overall setup, please let me know what it is... but I don't think there is anything better if you're tanking all 4 damage types. If you want stronger EM and Thermal resists and weaker Exp/Kin you could go with this setup: 1 Active EM, 1 Active Therm, 1 Passive Kinetic, 3 Extenders II's 4 SPR You'll get 358.6, 403.42, 489.0, 448.25 EM-->Therm resists in the order from above and 424.82 average. Or if you want more EM/Therm still you go with: 1 Active EM, 1 Active Therm, 3 Extender II's, 1 Shield Recharger II 4 SPR You get 421.88, 474.61, 316.41, 527.35 EM-->Therm resists. 435.06 average. ********************************************** Tank Rankings - Ships & Fittings Compared! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=386174
Shadarle	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:07:00 - [9] Edited by: Shadarle on 05/12/2006 17:10:59 Dangit, forums are slow so I doubled posted. Sorry bout that. ********************************************** Tank Rankings - Ships & Fittings Compared! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=386174
Smakko Multiverse Corporation	Posted - 2006.12.06 19:16:00 - [10] Originally by: Shadarle I've done quite a bit of work on the passive drake tank setups and have come to some rather odd conclusions. 1. It has a stronger passive tank than the Raven has active tank (unless the Raven uses expensive faction mods). Using T1/T2/Named items results in a far stronger tank for the Drake. 2. It passive tanks better than it active tanks. 3. It makes good use of Shield Recharger II's (first time I've ever found them to be worth using). Excellent work. I love posts like this. Very interesting conclusions.

Arakasai Caldari Blueprint Haus Center for Disease Creation	Posted - 2006.12.06 20:02:00 - [11] The Ferox also offers a stronger Passive tank than the Raven offers for an Active Tank. T2 fitted that is.
Slayton Ford	Posted - 2006.12.06 20:51:00 - [12] I'm suprised no one has mentioned adding 1-2 BCUs in the low. Having 2 their makes a significant improvement in DPS.
Ghoest	Posted - 2006.12.06 20:52:00 - [13] Ya T2 fitted Ferox has always been able to tank many of the lvl 4 missions. It should be even better now. Wherever you went - here you are.
Shadarle	Posted - 2006.12.07 19:57:00 - [14] "The Ferox also offers a stronger Passive tank than the Raven offers for an Active Tank. T2 fitted that is." That is not true. A T2 ferox with passive tank used to be about 10% worse than an active tanked Raven, assuming you used optimal modules for both. I have been doing this kind of number crunching for a while, tho my current results are the most accurate as I constantly refine my excel formulas to allow for more fitting options. ********************************************** Tank Rankings - Ships & Fittings Compared! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=386174
Pottsey Gallente Enheduanni Foundation	Posted - 2006.12.07 20:01:00 - [15] "That is not true. A T2 ferox with passive tank used to be about 10% worse than an active tanked Raven," I have not ran the math yet but didnÆt Kail give a Ferox more then a 10% boost to its tank due to the large hitpoint change? Passive shield tanking guide click here
Shadarle	Posted - 2006.12.07 20:28:00 - [16] I didn't compare the tank between patches but people I know that use a ferox have told me they have more problems tanking since patch... so I don't know for sure. In any case I don't understand why anyone would use a ferox over a drake. ********************************************** Tank Rankings - Ships & Fittings Compared! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=386174
Lord Anubiros	Posted - 2006.12.10 12:48:00 - [17] I dont understand what constant,x every one is multiplying by their total shield hp/total shield regen to get their peak shield/sec. I have heard 2.3 but some one in this thread said 18k shield with 500 sec regen gives them 150/s peak. that means that 150/(18000/500)=2.5. Could some one pls let me know what this x value is.
Pottsey Gallente Enheduanni Foundation	Posted - 2006.12.10 19:31:00 - [18] ôI dont understand what constant,x every one is multiplying by their total shield hp/total shield regen to get their peak shield/sec. I have heard 2.3ö X isnÆt really a constant which is why different people use different numbers. Well x as a peak is a constant but not everyone is talking about peak. Peak is x2.5 ish itÆs not precisely 2.5 and some people use 2.4 to be on the safe side others do average over a battle so use 2.3. The shorter the battle the smaller the number x is. Very short battles might be 2.0, I tend to do 2.2 my self as average with 2.5 as peak. If you tank donÆt break use 2.5 If itÆs a long battle 2.4 Med length battle 2.2. Short battle 2.0. Those are just guide lines so modify as needed. Passive shield tanking guide click here
Thor Ba'aleron	Posted - 2006.12.13 05:19:00 - [19] I think I have a better passive tank setup for the Drake... 7 Heavy Launchers (Arbalest or T2) 2 Large Shield Extender II 1 Shield Recharger II 2 Active Hardener II 1 Invulnerability II 1 BCU II 3 Shield Power Relay II You can't fly a missile boat without a BCU... it's just not right. This tanks fine for 0.0 ratting or 6+ complexes
Greyshadow	Posted - 2006.12.13 11:25:00 - [20] Originally by: Thor Ba'aleron I think I have a better passive tank setup for the Drake... 7 Heavy Launchers (Arbalest or T2) 2 Large Shield Extender II 1 Shield Recharger II 2 Active Hardener II 1 Invulnerability II 1 BCU II 3 Shield Power Relay II Are shield rechargers II and SPRII seeded now??? damn I was only away for a month! ------ The Grim Reaper is out of the office at the moment leave a message and Greyshadow will get back to you!

MrLobster Cosmic Odyssey Chorus of Dawn	Posted - 2006.12.13 11:49:00 - [21] Originally by: Thor Ba'aleron I think I have a better passive tank setup for the Drake... 7 Heavy Launchers (Arbalest or T2) 2 Large Shield Extender II 1 Shield Recharger II 2 Active Hardener II 1 Invulnerability II 1 BCU II 3 Shield Power Relay II You can't fly a missile boat without a BCU... it's just not right. This tanks fine for 0.0 ratting or 6+ complexes Is using Active Hardys called a Passive tank? ______ Better? - MrLobster
Aries Acheron Caldari The Valour	Posted - 2006.12.13 11:51:00 - [22] Just use the 'cookie cutter' layout. Fits well, even with crappy skills. I've got weapon upgrades 2, engineering 4, electronics 3 and it's fine. 7x Heavy Launchers (I use malkuths because I suck) 3 Large Extenders, 3 active type hardeners of your choice 2x BCU, 2x RCU. Voila. Replace RCUs with whatever as powergrid permits. In the 8th slot, put a tractor beam for easier looting, or a NOS. Not that you need a NOS, considering the capacitor stabilizes around 50 percent with no cap skills. ~~~ Action! Suspense! Jita! http://survive-eve.blogspot.com/
Kella DelRae Ammu-Nation	Posted - 2006.12.13 14:54:00 - [23] Originally by: Shadarle Hi: 7 Heavy Launchers, 1 Tractor. Med: 3 Large Extender II, 1 Shield Recharger II, 2 Inv II Low: 2 SPR, 2 PDS This gives you a peak regen tank of 495.99 dps averaged across the 4 dmg types. Drilling down you get: EM=58.60% or 309.19 max EM tank Expl=83.44% or 772.96 max Expl tank Kin=75.16% or 515.31 max Kin tank Therm=66.88% or 386.48 max Therm tank I'm running this through Quickfit and I'm getting EM=48.25% Expl=79.3% Kin=68.95% Therm=58.6% Is there an error here? Or, now that I remember the drake... maybe quickfit isn't computing in the base level of BC... one second... EM Resistance bc 1 - 5% bc 2 - 9.75 bc 3 - 14.26 bc 4 - 18.54 bc 5 - 22.62 Invulnerability IIs 1st - 45.83 2nd - 62.08 Am I calculating the stacking on the hardeners wrong? I know theres a penalty but I thought that just meant they didn't static stack (i.e. +30% flat)
Kella DelRae Ammu-Nation	Posted - 2006.12.13 15:03:00 - [24] Edited by: Kella DelRae on 13/12/2006 15:05:21 Double post ftl
Fitz VonHeise	Posted - 2006.12.13 22:24:00 - [25] The Drake also uses the warfare links. Why not use the Shield Harmonizing Modual to boost your own shields... (you would need to be ganged/fleeted with an alt to work though) There are lots of people who do missions with alts along to help. So this is not beyond the realm of reality.
Pottsey Gallente Enheduanni Foundation	Posted - 2006.12.14 07:23:00 - [26] Edited by: Pottsey on 14/12/2006 07:24:31 ôIs using Active Hardys called a Passive tank?ö Yes itÆs still passive for various reasons. "Are shield rechargers II and SPRII seeded now??? damn I was only away for a month!" Shield Rechargers II have been out for a very long time. SPRII are still not out. Passive shield tanking guide click here
Hopea Solv	Posted - 2007.02.23 12:53:00 - [27] was playing in quickfit (latest version) this is just sheild regen fit no highs and 2 spaces for resistance modules mid 1 shield recharger II 3 large extender II low 4 sheild power relay II rigs 3 core defence field purger II dont think those rigs are out yet. from what quickfit said with that fit you get 337 sheild/second. is quickfit broken or is a passive drake guna be incredible with that fit? you cant kill anything with this fit was just playing around what yas think? with maxed powergrid skills you cant fit much but if you used faction mods you could prolly fit it out with 7 heavies. if your uber rich this looks sweet.
Bronson Hughes Caldari Knights of the Wild	Posted - 2007.02.23 14:59:00 - [28] Mild thread necromancy FTW! A shield tank is considered to be passive if it is relying on shield regen instead of shield boosting to absorb damage. Passive tanks still need to run hardeners for good resists. A truely capless passive tank would rely on shield regen and resist amps with maxed compensation skills. In some ways, this is actually beneficial because resist amps use less CPU so you can sacrifice some tank (lower resists compared to hardeners) for gank (more T2 launchers, more T2 BCSs, etc). Everybody who says you need a full tech II passive Drake to do level IVs has never tried it otherwise. Such a setup would let you do them faster, but isn't needed to do them. I've got just under 4 mil SPs that are fairly spread out in a lot of areas and this is what my Drake looks like for level IVs: High: 7x named heavy launchers, 1x drone control link* Med: 4x named hardeners, 2x named extenders Low: 3x BCU II, 1x SPR I Drones and ammo to match the mission. No rigs yet. * there is one combination of hardeners that does not allow me to use the drone link ATM due to CPU limitations but with better skills this will not be an issue. The two missions that I've gotten and cannot do are Worlds Collide and one mission with a 2mil bounty boss at the end; my tank just can't handle WC and I couldn't break the tank of that boss solo. I'm not trying WC again for a while (already lsot one ship to it), but I've gotten more damage output since the last time I tried that boss so I but I could take him now. Tech II shield stuff is coming in the near future so my tank will only be getting better. Maybe then I'll try WC again. I go for max resists and max damage instead of max recharge because in my experience the best way to tank damage is never to take it in the first place. I can pop most mission cruisers in 2-3 salvoes so I start with them and work my way up to eliminate incoming DPS quickly. I get a lot of questions about my drone control link. If I'm careful about my aggro, my drones do at least as much damage as an 8th heavy launcher (except kinetic due to the ship bonus) and the link lets me use them all the way out to max missile range. Once I get Scout Drones and EW Drones higher, I'll drop that module.
Eii69	Posted - 2007.02.24 21:34:00 - [29] Edited by: Eii69 on 24/02/2007 21:31:11 Originally by: Bronson Hughes Mild thread necromancy FTW! A shield tank is considered to be passive if it is relying on shield regen instead of shield boosting to absorb damage. Passive tanks still need to run hardeners for good resists. A truely capless passive tank would rely on shield regen and resist amps with maxed compensation skills. In some ways, this is actually beneficial because resist amps use less CPU so you can sacrifice some tank (lower resists compared to hardeners) for gank (more T2 launchers, more T2 BCSs, etc). Everybody who says you need a full tech II passive Drake to do level IVs has never tried it otherwise. Such a setup would let you do them faster, but isn't needed to do them. I've got just under 4 mil SPs that are fairly spread out in a lot of areas and this is what my Drake looks like for level IVs: High: 7x named heavy launchers, 1x drone control link* Med: 4x named hardeners, 2x named extenders Low: 3x BCU II, 1x SPR I Drones and ammo to match the mission. No rigs yet. * there is one combination of hardeners that does not allow me to use the drone link ATM due to CPU limitations but with better skills this will not be an issue. The two missions that I've gotten and cannot do are Worlds Collide and one mission with a 2mil bounty boss at the end; my tank just can't handle WC and I couldn't break the tank of that boss solo. I'm not trying WC again for a while (already lsot one ship to it), but I've gotten more damage output since the last time I tried that boss so I but I could take him now. Tech II shield stuff is coming in the near future so my tank will only be getting better. Maybe then I'll try WC again. I go for max resists and max damage instead of max recharge because in my experience the best way to tank damage is never to take it in the first place. I can pop most mission cruisers in 2-3 salvoes so I start with them and work my way up to eliminate incoming DPS quickly. I get a lot of questions about my drone control link. If I'm careful about my aggro, my drones do at least as much damage as an 8th heavy launcher (except kinetic due to the ship bonus) and the link lets me use them all the way out to max missile range. Once I get Scout Drones and EW Drones higher, I'll drop that module. Man , my setup exactly :D and i have around the same SP as you , but i'm putting my drake to T2 stuff , only not the launchers , becose i would lack of CPU , so i just bought 7x 'arbalest' :) waiting for my T2 active shield hardeners to be ready 1d13h left :P my setup will be like this : High: 7x 'arbalest' HML Med: 2x T2 Shield Extender , 4x active selectable T2 active shield hardeners low: 4x T2 BCS :) Rigs : 3x shield purger :) whit T2 setup in quick fit , i can get all resist near 80% , 12k shield , and quite good recharge ;) can do every L3 mission just way to easy :D and after i will get all T2 stuff , i will try to run L4 ;) DPS now whit my drake is just crazy :P this is for missions , for pvp i would use different setup :) i hope this will help some one :P if the tank is not good enought i can use 2x SPR and 2x PDS (3x SPR for ~20min , but then i need to warp out becose i will lack of CAP ) :D
Arion Daishi	Posted - 2007.02.25 04:45:00 - [30] High: 7 Arbalest Heavy Launcers, Tractor (or a remote rep for gang missions) Medium: 3 Resist Amps 2s, Shield Recharger 2, 2 Large Extender 2s Low: 2 SPR, 2 BCU2 With 2 shield purger (recharge time) rigs and a shield extender rig, I am sitting at 16k shields with a ~300 second recharge time (iirc). With my current skills and the Amps, I can manage low 80s on 2 mission specific resists and 60s-70s on the others depending on what I am tanking. If I need more resists on a mission I will drop the recharger or switch one of the amps for an active. I haven't looked much into using active hardeners with this setup yet. I enjoy the full passive nature of it too much :) It is something to look into though. Looking back, a third recharge rig could have worked just as well, but I like the comfort of a few thousand more HP the extender rig gives. Also, I find that the BCUs are critical for having enough damage for taking on some of the BS spawns. The best way I have found with dealing with them is to pop the scram and jam frigates first, the cruisers, the rest of the frigates, and then close range with the BSs to decrease the time to hit on the missiles. To the OP: Look into some Shield Purger rigs (shield recharge time) and switch in some BCUs for the extra damage and rate of fire. It can make a big difference. Just be prepared to have the sig radius of a whale. With what I described above, I'm a big fat and juicy 395m. I hope this helps.



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