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CCP Larrikin
C C P C C P Alliance
709
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Posted - 2017.03.27 14:54:03 -
[1] - Quote
Hi Space Friends,
Blood Raider capitals are coming in the May Release. There will be a Force Auxiliary, a Dreadnought and a Titan. This post won't talk about how to acquire these powerful ships, that will come in latter communcations.
However, we're very keen to get your feedback on these!
Force Auxiliary: Dagon Amarr Carrier bonuses (per skill level):
- 30% bonus to Energy Nosferatu drain amount, optimal range and falloff
Minmatar Carrier bonuses (per skill level):
- 5% bonus to Remote Armor Repairer cycle time
Role Bonus:
- Can fit a Triage module
- Can use two Command Burst modules
- Energy Nosferatu fitted to this ship will drain targeted ship's capacitor regardless of your own capacitor level
- 90% reduction in powergrid requirements for Capital Remote Armor Repairers
- 90% reduction in CPU requirements for Energy Nosferatu
- 50% reduction in CPU requirements for Command Burst modules
- 200% bonus to Command Burst area of effect range
- 200% bonus to Logistics Drone transfer amount
- 5x penalty to Entosis Link duration
Slot layout: 6H, 4M, 8L, 3R; 0 Turrets, 0 Launchers Fittings: 660,000 PWG, 540 CPU Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 90,000 / 126,00 / 190,000 Base shield resistances (EM/Therm/Kin/Exp): 0 / 20 / 40 / 50 Base armor resistances (EM/Therm/Kin/Exp): 50 / 35 / 25 / 20 Capacitor (amount / recharge / cap per second) : 82,500 / 5,000s / 16.5 Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 85 / 0.07 / 800,000,000 / 77.63s Drones (bandwidth / bay): 125 / 600 Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 110km / 65 / 7 Sensor strength: 70 Radar Signature radius: 11,500 Cargo Hold: 2,400m3 Ship Maintenance Bay: 1,000,000m3 Fleet Hangar: 10,000m3 Corpse Bay: 20,000m3
Dreadnought: Chemosh Amarr Dreadnought bonuses (per skill level):
- 15% bonus to Energy Nosferatu and Energy Neutralizer drain amount
Minmatar Dreadnought bonuses (per skill level):
- 20% bonus to Stasis Webifier optimal range
Role Bonus:
- Can fit Siege modules
- Energy Nosferatu fitted to this ship will drain targeted ship's capacitor regardless of your own capacitor level
- 25% bonus to Capital Energy Turret damage
- 5x penalty to Entosis Link duration
Slot layout: 6H, 4M, 8L, 3R; 2 Turrets, 0 Launchers Fittings: 858,000 PWG, 715 CPU Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 118,000 / 169,000 / 169,000 Base shield resistances (EM/Therm/Kin/Exp): 0 / 20 / 40 / 50 Base armor resistances (EM/Therm/Kin/Exp): 50 / 35 / 25 / 20 Capacitor (amount / recharge / cap per second) : 66,000 / 4,400,000s / 15 Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 80 / 0.04 / 1,290,000,000 / 71.53s Drones (bandwidth / bay): 0 / 0 Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 97.5km / 85 / 7 Sensor strength: 45 Radar Signature radius: 11,800 Cargo Hold: 2,400m3 Ship Maintenance Bay: 1,000,000m3 Fleet Hangar: 10,000m3 Corpse Bay: 20,000m3
Titan: Molok Amarr Titan bonuses (per skill level):
- 15% bonus to Energy Nosferatu and Energy Neutralizer drain amount
- 6+ bonus to ship warp core strength
Minmatar Titan bonuses (per skill level):
- 20% bonus to Stasis Webifier optimal range
- 6+ bonus to ship warp core strength
Role Bonus:
- Can fit Doomsday devices
- Can fit one Phenomena Generator module
- Can fit Jump Portal Generator
- Can fit Clone Vat Bay
- Can use three Command Burst modules
- Energy Nosferatu fitted to this ship will drain targeted ship's capacitor regardless of your own capacitor level
- 200% bonus to Command Burst area of effect range
- 1400% bonus to Capital Energy Turret damage
- 500% bonus to Armor Plates and Shield Extenders
- 80% bonus to Sensor Dampener resistance
- 80% bonus to Weapon Disruption resistance
- 80% bonus to Stasis effect resistance
- 80% increase to Remote Electronic Assistance impedance
- 5x penalty to Entosis Link duration
Slot layout: 8H, 6M, 8L, 3R; 4 Turrets, 0 Launchers Fittings: 1,375,000 PWG, 900 CPU Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 390,000 / 950,000 / 580,000 Base shield resistances (EM/Therm/Kin/Exp): 0 / 20 / 40 / 50 Base armor resistances (EM/Therm/Kin/Exp): 50 / 35 / 25 / 20 Capacitor (amount / recharge / cap per second) : 145,000 / 7,500s / 19.333 Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 65 / 0.03 / 2,400,000,000 / 99.81s Drones (bandwidth / bay): 0 / 0 Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 250km / 70 / 8 Sensor strength: 240 Radar Signature radius: 24,800 Cargo Hold: 12,400m3 Ship Maintenance Bay: 5,000,000m3 Fleet Hangar: 100,000m3 Corpse Bay: 200,000m3
Game Designer | Team Phenomenon | https://twitter.com/CCP_Larrikin
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CCP Larrikin
C C P C C P Alliance
709
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Posted - 2017.03.27 14:54:10 -
[2] - Quote
Reserved
Game Designer | Team Phenomenon | https://twitter.com/CCP_Larrikin
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The Scanner
Ganja Labs Exodus.
30
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Posted - 2017.03.27 15:03:23 -
[3] - Quote
IM GAY AND **** SO STOP REMOVING MY POSTS OK **** |
Panther X
High Flyers Northern Coalition.
118
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Posted - 2017.03.27 15:06:50 -
[4] - Quote
AWESOMESAUCE
CCP thank you thank you thank you thank you.
My Titan smells of rich Corinthian Leather...
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Ncc 1709
Fusion Enterprises Ltd Badfellas Inc.
358
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Posted - 2017.03.27 15:08:32 -
[5] - Quote
I was hoping for Doomday on the dread :(
The nos bonus on the Fax isnt enough
It needs to be 50% or 100% per level to make it properly useful |
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2792
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Posted - 2017.03.27 15:10:24 -
[6] - Quote
Man, nerf Moloks. Their corpse bay is 10 times as big as the fax and dread.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
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Henry Plantgenet
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
197
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Posted - 2017.03.27 15:11:00 -
[7] - Quote
200k m-¦ corpse bay someone's ambitious.... |
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2792
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Posted - 2017.03.27 15:12:17 -
[8] - Quote
These ships clearly need a role bonus for corpse tractor beams.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
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Creecher Virpio
Alcoholocaust. Test Alliance Please Ignore
10
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Posted - 2017.03.27 15:13:37 -
[9] - Quote
Why is a 90% PG reduction for remote armor reps necessary for the fax machine? |
Rowells
ANZAC ALLIANCE Mercenary Coalition
3176
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Posted - 2017.03.27 15:14:41 -
[10] - Quote
30% on the FAX vs 15% on the others is intended? Also, is the lack of resist bonus going to make the tank somewhat weaker than the Apostle? |
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Winter Archipelago
Autumn Industrial Enterprises
839
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Posted - 2017.03.27 15:15:34 -
[11] - Quote
Is the mass on the Dagon a typo? It's a third lower than the mass of the existing FAXes. Clocking in under a bil also makes it able to use a number of holes that other capitals can't, won't it?
For the Newbies: The 8 Golden Rules - The Magic 14 Skills - Finding the Right Corp - EVE University Wiki
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Rowells
ANZAC ALLIANCE Mercenary Coalition
3176
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Posted - 2017.03.27 15:15:46 -
[12] - Quote
Creecher Virpio wrote:Why is a 90% PG reduction for remote armor reps necessary for the fax machine? My guess is fitting numerous neut/NOS on top of the existing capital mods is a lot of fitting pressure |
Explorator Delfan Gruss
Harambe died for our ticks I too am gay
0
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Posted - 2017.03.27 15:17:15 -
[13] - Quote
Rowells wrote:30% on the FAX vs 15% on the others is intended? Also, is the lack of resist bonus going to make the tank somewhat weaker than the Apostle?
it has an extra low to compensate i guess |
Virtuozone
Spitfire Syndicate
40
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Posted - 2017.03.27 15:19:41 -
[14] - Quote
Looks good except that I'm a little confused why the FAX is going to be able to neut/nos so much harder than the dread? (Didn't look too much into the titan or super) Just wondering what the reasoning is for this. |
boxxykiller
The Big O. Badfellas Inc.
0
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Posted - 2017.03.27 15:20:06 -
[15] - Quote
You're a couple days early for April Fools day...
Member, Co-Founder, and CEO of The Big O.
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Tribal Trogdor
Better Off Red Unspoken Alliance.
40
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Posted - 2017.03.27 15:25:26 -
[16] - Quote
Virtuozone wrote:Looks good except that I'm a little confused why the FAX is going to be able to neut/nos so much harder than the dread? (Didn't look too much into the titan or super) Just wondering what the reasoning is for this.
Only gets a bonus to nos, not neuting |
ISD Max Trix
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
1698
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Posted - 2017.03.27 15:34:42 -
[17] - Quote
Quote: 5. Trolling is prohibited.
Trolling is a defined as a post that is deliberately designed for the purpose of angering and insulting other players in an attempt to incite retaliation or an emotional response. Posts of this nature are disruptive, often abusive, and do not contribute to the sense of community that CCP promote.
Removed a post for the above.
ISD Max Trix
Lieutenant
Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)
Interstellar Services Department
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Umino Iruka
21
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Posted - 2017.03.27 15:37:12 -
[18] - Quote
So...2 turret hardpoints on the dread and a 25% capital energy turret dmg role bonus.... |
Ncc 1709
Fusion Enterprises Ltd Badfellas Inc.
358
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 15:41:31 -
[19] - Quote
The nos bonus on the Fax isnt enough, a single heavy cap booster will equal 2 capital nos. It needs to be 50% or 100% per level to |
Mr Rive
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
140
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Posted - 2017.03.27 15:43:11 -
[20] - Quote
HOKAY where do I start.
You really should have someone who flies triage on the focus group mate.
Basically, the dagon is garbage. What possible incentive do I have to use a ship that costs a bazillion isk, when the job it does is no better, and potentially worse, than a t1 fax?
First things first. You gave it 8 lowslots. Okay fine, except the apostle has 7 low slots and a 20% bonus to resists. A t2 EANM gives you 20% bonus to resists too, except it stacks with your other resists. That means to get roughly the same resist profile on a Dagon, I have to waste the extra lowslot I have on an EANM.
If my math is right, a TS capital NOS gets you around 600 cap/s. Because of the remote rep 'bonus' the dagon has, each remote rep will take approximately 400 cap/sec to run. This means that for every remote rep you use, you will need at LEAST one faction capital NOS to keep up with it. That's before someone starts neuting you. The apostle gets the same percent bonus, but for amount, meaning you're not wasting cap, but getting a very similar bonus. Cycle time is better than rep amount for triage, for several reasons. However, for those same reasons, the ninazu and lif get bonuses to cap booster amount to allow them to run their reps. The Dagon does not get this.
The TL;DR of that last paragraph being, in order to reliably run its remote reps, the Dagon is still going to have to use cap boosters and cap batteries to ensure its cap stability.
Next, this means, that even with the PG reduction on remote reps, adding all the NOS, cap batteries, and cap boosters, is going to mean the Dagon is still running low on powergrid regardless. This makes fitting a third local repper very difficult. Why is this important? Well...
A 7 lowslot apostle with a 20% native resist bonus is going to tank just as well as an 8 lowslot bazillion isk faction FAX. But it gets worse.
Lifs tank WAY more than an apostle, admittedly with an expensive fit. That expensive fit costs about 4b. Which is obviously going to be way less than what the Dagon is likely to cost. On top of that, a lif can rep both shields AND armor. Which brings me onto my next point.
The Dagon only gets a single bonus to remote transfers, when each other FAX gets two. We do use remote capacitor transmitters on minokawas and apostles, it allows us to remain on the field much longer. The NOS cannot do that. They don't transfer enough capacitor to you for you to be remotely confident your cap can be stable.
So basically, the Dagon tanks like an apostle, has less versatility than an apostle, doesn't cap as efficiently as an apostle, has to use more capital mods than the apostle to work, is far more expensive than an apostle, and has a bright red 'shoot me im expensive' mark tatooed on it's hull.
I haven't even mentioned the fact that you can get a 2b fit ninazu, including hull cost, to tank more than it.
Basically, with the bonuses it's given, you're just giving the enemy a big target to shoot. It provides ZERO measurable bonus to the fleet it is in compared to a much cheaper ship.
What would I personally do with it? Well, this is a start:
Amarr Carrier Bonus: 30% bonus to Energy Nosferatu drain amount, optimal range and falloff. 4% bonus to all armor resistances 5% bonus to maximum capacitor pool
Minmatar Carrier Bonus: 5% bonus to Remote Armor Repairer cycle time 7.5% bonus to Armor Repairer amount 10% bonus to capacitor booster charge strength
Role Bonus: Can fit a Triage module Can use two Command Burst modules Energy Nosferatu fitted to this ship will drain targeted ship's capacitor regardless of your own capacitor level 90% reduction in powergrid requirements for Capital Remote Armor Repairers 90% reduction in CPU requirements for Energy Nosferatu 50% reduction in CPU requirements for Command Burst modules 200% bonus to Command Burst area of effect range 200% bonus to Logistics Drone transfer amount 5x penalty to Entosis Link duration
All other FAX get FOUR (count them) FOUR faction carrier bonuses. Is it really that unreasonble to expect a carrier which gets two different races worth of bonuses to get three per race?
This would allow the Dagon to tank better than its counterparts, but only marginally. It gains the rep amount of the lif, and the cycle time. It gets the cap pool bonus and resist bonus of the apostle. The NOS bonus would be as per the style of the ship, and still useful, but not a crutch. It then gets the boost charge strength to offset the cycle time bonus applied by the lif's bonuses.
It has 8 actual lowslots, instead of seven, plus the EANM to beef its resist profile up.
If I had to estimate how much this ship would tank, not having the PYFA thingy plugged in, I think a reasonable estimate would be around 120k with an ancil repper. This would put it about on par with a fully pimped lif. I really don't think that is unreasonable.
As it is, someone would be OUT OF THEIR GOD DAMNED MIND to buy one. It has to be at least appealing to a true FAX pilot, otherwise what is the point of adding it to the game? |
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Ncc 1709
Fusion Enterprises Ltd Badfellas Inc.
358
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Posted - 2017.03.27 15:46:26 -
[21] - Quote
@mr rive Your math is off. maxed skill the capital nos will get 2000 capacitor per 20 seconds. so its actually 100 cap/s |
MuraSaki Siki
Fuxi Legion Fraternity.
67
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Posted - 2017.03.27 15:46:51 -
[22] - Quote
Dreadnought: Chemosh Capacitor (amount / recharge / cap per second) : 66,000 / 4,400,000s / 15 i've believed that some typo here, or does it mean it draining someone cap is a must?? |
Mr Rive
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
140
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Posted - 2017.03.27 15:47:13 -
[23] - Quote
CCP Larrikin wrote:Questions & Answers
Q)Whats with the low fitting attributes and weird fitting bonuses on the Dagon? A) We've done this combination of low fitting attributes and fitting bonuses to Nos and Remote Reps to constrain some of the fitting options a available to the Dagon. We'd like to encourage Nos & Rep fits, and these bonuses do this. Its still possible to go for crazy fitting options but the trade offs are larger.
Q)Is the 30% bonus on the FAX vs 15% on the others is intended? A) Yes, it is! The 30% bonus only applies to Nos's, not neuts. This is simmilar to the bonuses on the Rabisu.
You're not encouraging people to fit NOS and rep fits. You are FORCING them to. And even then, it doesn't tank as much as a pimp lif which costs WAY less.
You're still going to have to fit cap boosters and cap batteries.
The ship really won't tank any more than the apostle, because you haven't given it ANY, literally ANY local repping bonus. If you want to incentivise people to properly local tank on it, give it an armor rep bonus. At least then I could understand your decision. As it is, there really is no point to buying the thing. And you know me, if it was at all better than a normal FAX, I would seriously consider getting one. |
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CCP Larrikin
C C P C C P Alliance
709
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Posted - 2017.03.27 15:48:05 -
[24] - Quote
Umino Iruka wrote:So...2 turret hardpoints on the dread and a 25% capital energy turret dmg role bonus....
Oops, thats a typo. its 3 turret hardpoints.
Game Designer | Team Phenomenon | https://twitter.com/CCP_Larrikin
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Mr Rive
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
140
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Posted - 2017.03.27 15:57:23 -
[25] - Quote
Ncc 1709 wrote:@mr rive Your math is off. maxed skill the capital nos will get 2000 capacitor per 20 seconds. so its actually 100 cap/s
Yes but the Dagon gets a 150% bonus. My math is terrible, but either way, the nos cannot be used to run the remote reps at all reliably, given the cycle time bonus the Dagon gets. |
Salvator Ambraelle
Tritanium Industries and Technology Goonswarm Federation
0
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Posted - 2017.03.27 16:01:45 -
[26] - Quote
Inb4 Active Dagon |
Ncc 1709
Fusion Enterprises Ltd Badfellas Inc.
358
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Posted - 2017.03.27 16:02:35 -
[27] - Quote
BTW, the games 1000 item stack limitation limits each to 1000 corpses... 2,000 m3 max |
Creecher Virpio
Alcoholocaust. Test Alliance Please Ignore
10
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Posted - 2017.03.27 16:03:45 -
[28] - Quote
Mr Rive wrote:Ncc 1709 wrote:@mr rive Your math is off. maxed skill the capital nos will get 2000 capacitor per 20 seconds. so its actually 100 cap/s Yes but the Dagon gets a 150% bonus. My math is terrible, but either way, the nos cannot be used to run the remote reps at all reliably, given the cycle time bonus the Dagon gets.
0 cap stability is nothing new to fax machines. You still have mid slots just like the apostle does, and you get the nos bonus |
Ncc 1709
Fusion Enterprises Ltd Badfellas Inc.
358
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Posted - 2017.03.27 16:05:15 -
[29] - Quote
Creecher Virpio wrote:Mr Rive wrote:Ncc 1709 wrote:@mr rive Your math is off. maxed skill the capital nos will get 2000 capacitor per 20 seconds. so its actually 100 cap/s Yes but the Dagon gets a 150% bonus. My math is terrible, but either way, the nos cannot be used to run the remote reps at all reliably, given the cycle time bonus the Dagon gets. 0 cap stability is nothing new to fax machines. You still have mid slots just like the apostle does, and you get the nos bonus
its no where near enough to make up for its cost and its poor at everything that fax's do because the bonus isnt enough |
Boombeczka
University of Caille Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2017.03.27 16:06:12 -
[30] - Quote
Q: how much are those will be expected to cost in mineral with current mineral prices? Q: with assumption that those will be super expensive to build(like serpentis ones), are those going to have unique hull models or just a copies like vehement/vendetta/vanquisher? |
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Mr Rive
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
140
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Posted - 2017.03.27 16:12:47 -
[31] - Quote
Salvator Ambraelle wrote:Inb4 Active Dagon
An active tank dagon is still going to barely tank any more than a lif or ninazu.
Look at it like this. Here is an apostle with 7 lowslots, tanked like a max local tank dagon:
[Apostle, Apostle fit]
Corpum A-Type Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane Corpus X-Type Armor Explosive Hardener Corpus X-Type Armor Kinetic Hardener Corpus X-Type Armor Thermal Hardener Dark Blood Capital Armor Repairer Dark Blood Capital Armor Repairer Capital Ancillary Armor Repairer, Nanite Repair Paste
[Empty Med slot] [Empty Med slot] [Empty Med slot] [Empty Med slot]
Triage Module II [Empty High slot] [Empty High slot] [Empty High slot] [Empty High slot] [Empty High slot]
Capital Nanobot Accelerator II Capital Nanobot Accelerator I Capital Auxiliary Nano Pump II
With max links and drugs, this fit tanks 121k dps unheated. Ignore for a second this kind of fit is COMPLETELY UNUSABLE because of the amount of cap it needs to run. You would never fit an apostle like this.
Now bare in mind the apostle gets a 20% bonus to resist amount. Imagine that the Dagon would have a little better resists because it would most likely fit an A-type EANM. This means the Dagon will tank a LITTLE more (not much mind) than the apostle with the same fit.
This means the Dagon, with this kind of fit, will likely tank something like ~130k dps. It would have to rely on cap boosters AND nos in order to reliably remote rep people. The local tank it can maybe rely on just its nos, if it can fit 3.
You can EASILY get those numbers off a lif, for a fraction of the price. I'm not going to post the fit to make anyone's life easier. Look at the killboards.
Why anyone in their right mind would buy a FAX that tanks as much as a lif, even if you only fit the lif with low end mods compared to the dagon, when they do the same repping except the lif can do shield, is beyond me.
You can easily see the Dagon won't tank nearly enough to make it viable. It's just a very expensive, less versatile apostle. |
Mr Rive
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
140
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Posted - 2017.03.27 16:19:44 -
[32] - Quote
Creecher Virpio wrote:Mr Rive wrote:Ncc 1709 wrote:@mr rive Your math is off. maxed skill the capital nos will get 2000 capacitor per 20 seconds. so its actually 100 cap/s Yes but the Dagon gets a 150% bonus. My math is terrible, but either way, the nos cannot be used to run the remote reps at all reliably, given the cycle time bonus the Dagon gets. 0 cap stability is nothing new to fax machines. You still have mid slots just like the apostle does, and you get the nos bonus
You're not getting it mate. The lif and ninazu have a bonus to cycle time like the dagon does. This makes their remote reps INCREDIBLY unstable. They NEED the cap booster bonus in order to make them at all viable. Without it, they would be unusable.
The NOS bonus in no way makes up the cap defecit the dagon will have with its cycle time bonus on remote reps. The cycle time on the NOS is too low, they NOS too little anyway, and they require FITTING to fit. This means you have to shunt other modules, like cap boosters and cap batteries, out of the way to fit them in the first place. The reduction in remote rep doesn't make up for this because it still has to fit the nos.
Think of it this way. An apostle generally fits 3 capital remote mods, if not four. If the dagon fitted 3 capital remote reps, then it needs at least 2 capital NOS in order to not instantly cap itself out. That means it has to fit boosters and cap batteries too, which completely remove any PG bonus it gets from remote reps. You're still going to run WAY out of powergrid before you can fit it solidly. |
Winter Archipelago
Autumn Industrial Enterprises
840
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Posted - 2017.03.27 16:39:06 -
[33] - Quote
Considering that we're limited to 1k stacks per container / cargo system (including cargo holds), and corpses take up only 2m3 each, I'd like to suggest a new type of container: a Meat Locker or Cryopreservation Storage Container or some similar such name.
This container would be 2k m3 inside and out, but the only thing that could go inside of it are corpses. Additionally, the corpse bays of these ships would be able to accept these new containers.
That way, a person flying one of these ships could have an actual chance of filling their corpse hole with corpses, instead of sticking 1k corpses in them and having tens of thousands of m3 still sitting empty.
For the Newbies: The 8 Golden Rules - The Magic 14 Skills - Finding the Right Corp - EVE University Wiki
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Biterno Sintaph
Iron.Guard Iron Armada
80
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Posted - 2017.03.27 16:47:09 -
[34] - Quote
In before this exchange in Arnon local:
Newbie > How do I kill Dagon? Troll > With dreadnaughts |
Blueberry cuddlemuffin
Muffin Collective
0
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Posted - 2017.03.27 16:50:00 -
[35] - Quote
What is the temperature inside of the corpse bays? Can't have the corpses go bad |
Mr Rive
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
141
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Posted - 2017.03.27 16:53:25 -
[36] - Quote
Okay get this. I dare you to plug it into Pyfa Larrkin. Pretend this is a dogon with 2 capital energy NOS on. To replicate that I have put five on the apostle to simulate that bonus. The remote rep PG reduction would mean you could most likely fit 2-3 extra capital mods over the apostle, so with that in mind, I have added a third local repper, and two capital cap batteries:
[Apostle, Apostle fit]
Corpum A-Type Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane Corpus X-Type Armor Explosive Hardener Corpus X-Type Armor Kinetic Hardener Corpus X-Type Armor Thermal Hardener Dark Blood Capital Armor Repairer Dark Blood Capital Armor Repairer Capital Ancillary Armor Repairer, Nanite Repair Paste
Dark Blood Capital Cap Battery Dark Blood Capital Cap Battery True Sansha Cap Recharger True Sansha Cap Recharger
Triage Module II True Sansha Capital Energy Nosferatu True Sansha Capital Energy Nosferatu True Sansha Capital Energy Nosferatu True Sansha Capital Energy Nosferatu True Sansha Capital Energy Nosferatu
Capital Nanobot Accelerator II Capital Nanobot Accelerator I Capital Auxiliary Nano Pump II
With links and strong exile, this fit is stable running its local reppers for 5 minutes and 9 seconds. The local reppers take up SIGNIFICANTLY less cap than remote reppers to run. I would imagine you MAY have 2 minutes worth of stability on 2 remote armor reps, if you fit it somewhat like this.
Basically, there is no way you can reliably use the NOS to keep your dagon cap stable. You still have to fit capital capacitor mods to stand a chance, and that's if you have enough powergrid. A triple rep fit puts it pretty much on par with a lif. Except the Lif has a bonus to cap booster amount, meaning its way more cap stable and doesn't have to NOS someone to BE cap stable.
So the TLDR is:
If someone fits at least one cap battery, you're screwed. If you are having to continuously remote rep someone, you're screwed. If someone shoots at you, you tank as much as a lif, except cost significantly more, meaning someone will dread bomb you for the kill and you will be screwed.
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Minty Aroma
Eternity INC. Goonswarm Federation
69
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Posted - 2017.03.27 16:54:06 -
[37] - Quote
Please don't make the dread and fax too expensive to field in anything other than a guarantee survival drop - 30b price tags with a suicide button plus a large 'shoot me' arrow isn't looking promising for anyone to field in a decent fight. |
commander aze
425
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Posted - 2017.03.27 17:07:14 -
[38] - Quote
Will the AT victory skins from last year add these to the set?
Commander Aze For CSM XII
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=506400
Support the Community #Broadcast4Reps
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Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
943
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Posted - 2017.03.27 17:40:09 -
[39] - Quote
Since the Molok has the ability to fit both Doomsday's and Generators of both races those are going to be Massive in wasted m3 space for unpackaged for refitting on the fly. You are talking an extra 10000 m3 or 1/10th of the Moloks entire Fleet Hangar being used for these two modules alone for just one type of race. Let's also not forget the m3 of Capital Nos, Neuts, Capital props, various non racial Doomsday types as well as every other various refit you'll need. Instead of giving the Molok some stupid gimmicky corpse bay half the damn thing and double the Fleet Hangar so we can use the ships versatility. I shouldn't have to fandangle and jumble around limited fleet hangar for a ship that costs 3x the amount of a regular Titan and stare at a near empty coprse bay. |
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2792
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 17:43:19 -
[40] - Quote
Tara Read wrote:Since the Molok has the ability to fit both Doomsday's and Generators of both races those are going to be Massive in wasted m3 space for unpackaged for refitting on the fly. You are talking an extra 10000 m3 or 1/10th of the Moloks entire Fleet Hangar being used for these two modules alone for just one type of race. Let's also not forget the m3 of Capital Nos, Neuts, Capital props, various non racial Doomsday types as well as every other various refit you'll need. Instead of giving the Molok some stupid gimmicky corpse bay half the damn thing and double the Fleet Hangar so we can use the ships versatility.
I love the "please buff the cargo capacity of the ship" crew, because they feel entitled to maximum tactical malleability for their ship. If you want more cargo, fit cargo expanders, or simply live with the fact that you might not be able to bring everything.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
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Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2792
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 17:44:46 -
[41] - Quote
also lol if you think the corpse bay was actually subtracted from the "points" available to this ship and that it exists as a bargaining chip for whatever you're trying to do
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
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Panther X
High Flyers Northern Coalition.
118
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 17:46:41 -
[42] - Quote
I am so looking forward to the Molok that I didn't bother looking at the stats of the fax/dread. The sad news is, they aren't all that great as seen by the number shown above. The dread is a nice idea, and better now that the typo for 2 turrets is fixed to 3. The neut pressure with capital neuts will be decent, but the price they will come out at will make it far from field worthy. Only those rich dirty birds from my NC bros and PL cousins, plus those icky goons will be able to field the molok. And that will be just for #nopoors status. I don't have a problem with that. But the dread and fax? Make their mineral cost reasonable so they can actually be made a reasonable cost.
My Titan smells of rich Corinthian Leather...
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Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
3259
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 17:48:08 -
[43] - Quote
Tara Read wrote:Since the Molok has the ability to fit both Doomsday's and Generators of both races those are going to be Massive in wasted m3 space for unpackaged for refitting on the fly. You are talking an extra 10000 m3 or 1/10th of the Moloks entire Fleet Hangar being used for these two modules alone for just one type of race. Let's also not forget the m3 of Capital Nos, Neuts, Capital props, various non racial Doomsday types as well as every other various refit you'll need. Instead of giving the Molok some stupid gimmicky corpse bay half the damn thing and double the Fleet Hangar so we can use the ships versatility. I shouldn't have to fandangle and jumble around a limited fleet hangar for a ship that costs 3x the amount of a regular Titan and stare at a near empty coprse bay. Aside from that loving the stats love the SMA size, the 4 turret DPS layout I would prefer an extra mid slot seeing as the Vanquisher already has the extra 8th low and a bigger increase to the raw Armor to make the Molok more of an incentive towards aquiring. So far everything else looks pretty dope.
What if it was meant so you had to make choices? |
Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
943
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 17:48:14 -
[44] - Quote
Querns wrote:Tara Read wrote:Since the Molok has the ability to fit both Doomsday's and Generators of both races those are going to be Massive in wasted m3 space for unpackaged for refitting on the fly. You are talking an extra 10000 m3 or 1/10th of the Moloks entire Fleet Hangar being used for these two modules alone for just one type of race. Let's also not forget the m3 of Capital Nos, Neuts, Capital props, various non racial Doomsday types as well as every other various refit you'll need. Instead of giving the Molok some stupid gimmicky corpse bay half the damn thing and double the Fleet Hangar so we can use the ships versatility. I love the "please buff the cargo capacity of the ship" crew, because they feel entitled to maximum tactical malleability for their ship. If you want more cargo, fit cargo expanders, or simply live with the fact that you might not be able to bring everything.
Are you fing ********? You just said to fit cargo expanders on a Faction Titan. Do you even understand that by adding the ability to racially fit two instead of ONE type of targeted DD and Phenomenon Generator it takes an additional 10000 m3 of space to DO so. Just shut up. |
Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
943
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 17:50:04 -
[45] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:Tara Read wrote:Since the Molok has the ability to fit both Doomsday's and Generators of both races those are going to be Massive in wasted m3 space for unpackaged for refitting on the fly. You are talking an extra 10000 m3 or 1/10th of the Moloks entire Fleet Hangar being used for these two modules alone for just one type of race. Let's also not forget the m3 of Capital Nos, Neuts, Capital props, various non racial Doomsday types as well as every other various refit you'll need. Instead of giving the Molok some stupid gimmicky corpse bay half the damn thing and double the Fleet Hangar so we can use the ships versatility. I shouldn't have to fandangle and jumble around a limited fleet hangar for a ship that costs 3x the amount of a regular Titan and stare at a near empty coprse bay. Aside from that loving the stats love the SMA size, the 4 turret DPS layout I would prefer an extra mid slot seeing as the Vanquisher already has the extra 8th low and a bigger increase to the raw Armor to make the Molok more of an incentive towards aquiring. So far everything else looks pretty dope. What if it was meant so you had to make choices?
Please explain how you "make" choices when they are limited yet CCP gives you a ship that can fit multiple variants yet not have the space to DO so. Not to mention the SMA is larger than a standard Avatar so why wouldn't the Fleet Hangar be as well when the modules it carries and uses are massive when unpackaged? |
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2792
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 17:53:39 -
[46] - Quote
Tara Read wrote:Querns wrote:Tara Read wrote:Since the Molok has the ability to fit both Doomsday's and Generators of both races those are going to be Massive in wasted m3 space for unpackaged for refitting on the fly. You are talking an extra 10000 m3 or 1/10th of the Moloks entire Fleet Hangar being used for these two modules alone for just one type of race. Let's also not forget the m3 of Capital Nos, Neuts, Capital props, various non racial Doomsday types as well as every other various refit you'll need. Instead of giving the Molok some stupid gimmicky corpse bay half the damn thing and double the Fleet Hangar so we can use the ships versatility. I love the "please buff the cargo capacity of the ship" crew, because they feel entitled to maximum tactical malleability for their ship. If you want more cargo, fit cargo expanders, or simply live with the fact that you might not be able to bring everything. Are you fing ********? You just said to fit cargo expanders on a Faction Titan. Do you even understand that by adding the ability to racially fit two instead of ONE type of targeted DD and Phenomenon Generator it takes an additional 10000 m3 of space to DO so. Just shut up.
I understand that you have a fierce, severe entitlement to carrying literally everything in your spaceship. I know there could be a situation where you really need a Sentient 'Unobtanium' Left-Handed Screwdriver II, but sometimes you can't have everything. You may need to make some choices.
Cargo's just one of those things you need to prioritize when fitting a ship. You clearly don't want to fit a cargo expander, yet you really want cargo. This sort of dilemma is great.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
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Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
3259
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 17:54:39 -
[47] - Quote
Tara Read wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:Tara Read wrote:Since the Molok has the ability to fit both Doomsday's and Generators of both races those are going to be Massive in wasted m3 space for unpackaged for refitting on the fly. You are talking an extra 10000 m3 or 1/10th of the Moloks entire Fleet Hangar being used for these two modules alone for just one type of race. Let's also not forget the m3 of Capital Nos, Neuts, Capital props, various non racial Doomsday types as well as every other various refit you'll need. Instead of giving the Molok some stupid gimmicky corpse bay half the damn thing and double the Fleet Hangar so we can use the ships versatility. I shouldn't have to fandangle and jumble around a limited fleet hangar for a ship that costs 3x the amount of a regular Titan and stare at a near empty coprse bay. Aside from that loving the stats love the SMA size, the 4 turret DPS layout I would prefer an extra mid slot seeing as the Vanquisher already has the extra 8th low and a bigger increase to the raw Armor to make the Molok more of an incentive towards aquiring. So far everything else looks pretty dope. What if it was meant so you had to make choices? Please explain how you "make" choices when they are limited yet CCP gives you a ship that can fit multiple variants yet not have the space to DO so. Not to mention the SMA is larger than a standard Avatar so why wouldn't the Fleet Hangar be as well when the modules it carries and uses are massive when unpackaged?
The choice is which modules you carry. You have space for X modules but you have Y fitting options. Y > X mean you have to make a choice of what you bring and what you don't. If you want to bring 12 different mods but only have space for 10, then you build a list and make decisions. |
Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
943
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 17:58:45 -
[48] - Quote
Querns wrote:Tara Read wrote:Querns wrote:Tara Read wrote:Since the Molok has the ability to fit both Doomsday's and Generators of both races those are going to be Massive in wasted m3 space for unpackaged for refitting on the fly. You are talking an extra 10000 m3 or 1/10th of the Moloks entire Fleet Hangar being used for these two modules alone for just one type of race. Let's also not forget the m3 of Capital Nos, Neuts, Capital props, various non racial Doomsday types as well as every other various refit you'll need. Instead of giving the Molok some stupid gimmicky corpse bay half the damn thing and double the Fleet Hangar so we can use the ships versatility. I love the "please buff the cargo capacity of the ship" crew, because they feel entitled to maximum tactical malleability for their ship. If you want more cargo, fit cargo expanders, or simply live with the fact that you might not be able to bring everything. Are you fing ********? You just said to fit cargo expanders on a Faction Titan. Do you even understand that by adding the ability to racially fit two instead of ONE type of targeted DD and Phenomenon Generator it takes an additional 10000 m3 of space to DO so. Just shut up. I understand that you have a fierce, severe entitlement to carrying literally everything in your spaceship. I know there could be a situation where you really need a Sentient 'Unobtanium' Left-Handed Screwdriver II, but sometimes you can't have everything. You may need to make some choices. Cargo's just one of those things you need to prioritize when fitting a ship. You clearly don't want to fit a cargo expander, yet you really want cargo. This sort of dilemma is great.
There should BE no deliema on a 300 BILLION ISK TITAN. Especially when the fittings it uses eats up an additional 10k to 20k m3 due to faction capital nos, neuts, racial Doomsday and phenomenon Generators. What's the damn point in owning one if you can't even use the modules it is bonused for???? |
Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
943
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 18:00:44 -
[49] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:Tara Read wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:Tara Read wrote:Since the Molok has the ability to fit both Doomsday's and Generators of both races those are going to be Massive in wasted m3 space for unpackaged for refitting on the fly. You are talking an extra 10000 m3 or 1/10th of the Moloks entire Fleet Hangar being used for these two modules alone for just one type of race. Let's also not forget the m3 of Capital Nos, Neuts, Capital props, various non racial Doomsday types as well as every other various refit you'll need. Instead of giving the Molok some stupid gimmicky corpse bay half the damn thing and double the Fleet Hangar so we can use the ships versatility. I shouldn't have to fandangle and jumble around a limited fleet hangar for a ship that costs 3x the amount of a regular Titan and stare at a near empty coprse bay. Aside from that loving the stats love the SMA size, the 4 turret DPS layout I would prefer an extra mid slot seeing as the Vanquisher already has the extra 8th low and a bigger increase to the raw Armor to make the Molok more of an incentive towards aquiring. So far everything else looks pretty dope. What if it was meant so you had to make choices? Please explain how you "make" choices when they are limited yet CCP gives you a ship that can fit multiple variants yet not have the space to DO so. Not to mention the SMA is larger than a standard Avatar so why wouldn't the Fleet Hangar be as well when the modules it carries and uses are massive when unpackaged? The choice is which modules you carry. You have space for X modules but you have Y fitting options. Y > X mean you have to make a choice of what you bring and what you don't. If you want to bring 12 different mods but only have space for 10, then you build a list and make decisions.
As if I already don't have a list in the Avatar I currently own. I am telling you that with the required additional modules for the Molok to carry it will NOT have sufficient space to do so. You also need a minimum of 5000 m3 of space for swapping so in actuality the m3 size is only really 95k m3. |
Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
3259
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 18:02:48 -
[50] - Quote
Tara Read wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:Tara Read wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:Tara Read wrote:Since the Molok has the ability to fit both Doomsday's and Generators of both races those are going to be Massive in wasted m3 space for unpackaged for refitting on the fly. You are talking an extra 10000 m3 or 1/10th of the Moloks entire Fleet Hangar being used for these two modules alone for just one type of race. Let's also not forget the m3 of Capital Nos, Neuts, Capital props, various non racial Doomsday types as well as every other various refit you'll need. Instead of giving the Molok some stupid gimmicky corpse bay half the damn thing and double the Fleet Hangar so we can use the ships versatility. I shouldn't have to fandangle and jumble around a limited fleet hangar for a ship that costs 3x the amount of a regular Titan and stare at a near empty coprse bay. Aside from that loving the stats love the SMA size, the 4 turret DPS layout I would prefer an extra mid slot seeing as the Vanquisher already has the extra 8th low and a bigger increase to the raw Armor to make the Molok more of an incentive towards aquiring. So far everything else looks pretty dope. What if it was meant so you had to make choices? Please explain how you "make" choices when they are limited yet CCP gives you a ship that can fit multiple variants yet not have the space to DO so. Not to mention the SMA is larger than a standard Avatar so why wouldn't the Fleet Hangar be as well when the modules it carries and uses are massive when unpackaged? The choice is which modules you carry. You have space for X modules but you have Y fitting options. Y > X mean you have to make a choice of what you bring and what you don't. If you want to bring 12 different mods but only have space for 10, then you build a list and make decisions. As if I already don't have a list in the Avatar I currently own. I am telling you that with the required additional modules for the Molok to carry it will NOT have sufficient space to do so. You also need a minimum of 5000 m3 of space for swapping so in actuality the m3 size is only really 95k m3.
If your Avatar already has a list, then I don't see why you have a problem having one for this one... It's literally the same principle applied to a new ship of the same class. |
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Michael Oskold
BURN EDEN Northern Coalition.
29
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 18:11:04 -
[51] - Quote
yeah the fax is pretty underwhelming. i dont see anything outside of meme nos, neut setups. doesnt tank as well as the other fax and the nos on a capital level doesnt matter tbh. |
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2792
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 18:13:30 -
[52] - Quote
Tara Read wrote:Querns wrote:
I understand that you have a fierce, severe entitlement to carrying literally everything in your spaceship. I know there could be a situation where you really need a Sentient 'Unobtanium' Left-Handed Screwdriver II, but sometimes you can't have everything. You may need to make some choices.
Cargo's just one of those things you need to prioritize when fitting a ship. You clearly don't want to fit a cargo expander, yet you really want cargo. This sort of dilemma is great.
There should BE no deliema on a 300 BILLION ISK TITAN. Especially when the fittings it uses eats up an additional 10k to 20k m3 due to faction capital nos, neuts, racial Doomsday and phenomenon Generators. What's the damn point in owning one if you can't even use the modules it is bonused for????
Woah, simmer down there Sparky, there's no need to get flustered. It's a video game.
A thing having a high cost is not proof against fitting dilemmas. That's silly.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
943
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 18:38:01 -
[53] - Quote
Querns wrote:Tara Read wrote:Querns wrote:
I understand that you have a fierce, severe entitlement to carrying literally everything in your spaceship. I know there could be a situation where you really need a Sentient 'Unobtanium' Left-Handed Screwdriver II, but sometimes you can't have everything. You may need to make some choices.
Cargo's just one of those things you need to prioritize when fitting a ship. You clearly don't want to fit a cargo expander, yet you really want cargo. This sort of dilemma is great.
There should BE no deliema on a 300 BILLION ISK TITAN. Especially when the fittings it uses eats up an additional 10k to 20k m3 due to faction capital nos, neuts, racial Doomsday and phenomenon Generators. What's the damn point in owning one if you can't even use the modules it is bonused for???? Woah, simmer down there Sparky, there's no need to get flustered. It's a video game. A thing having a high cost is not proof against fitting dilemmas. That's silly.
No you're entire groups posting history on this topic is stooped in blatant ignorance and stupidity. I've sat for hours coming up with particular refits, modules, squeezing every last drop of space out of a fleet hangar on a regular Avatar. And I am telling you in it's current state with bonuses to capital nos and neuts (meaning you'd usually have two fitted two stored) you are going to incure an increase of (wait for it) 8000 m3 due to having two of each type of NOS and Nuet. An additional 10,000 m3 due to having two racial phenomena generators, and another 5000 m3 of space for needing to carry an additional racial Doomsday. Then you need an additional 5000 m3 of empty space to refit.
That is a total of 28000 additional m3 needed MINIMUM to have the Moloks capability to refit for its bonuses in a combat situation. Engage your damn brain. |
TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel
1279
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 18:48:59 -
[54] - Quote
do we really want siege/triage ships being able to receive cap through nos |
Minty Aroma
Eternity INC. Goonswarm Federation
70
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 18:50:05 -
[55] - Quote
Tara Read wrote:Querns wrote:Tara Read wrote:Querns wrote:
I understand that you have a fierce, severe entitlement to carrying literally everything in your spaceship. I know there could be a situation where you really need a Sentient 'Unobtanium' Left-Handed Screwdriver II, but sometimes you can't have everything. You may need to make some choices.
Cargo's just one of those things you need to prioritize when fitting a ship. You clearly don't want to fit a cargo expander, yet you really want cargo. This sort of dilemma is great.
There should BE no deliema on a 300 BILLION ISK TITAN. Especially when the fittings it uses eats up an additional 10k to 20k m3 due to faction capital nos, neuts, racial Doomsday and phenomenon Generators. What's the damn point in owning one if you can't even use the modules it is bonused for???? Woah, simmer down there Sparky, there's no need to get flustered. It's a video game. A thing having a high cost is not proof against fitting dilemmas. That's silly. No you're entire groups posting history on this topic is stooped in blatant ignorance and stupidity. I've sat for hours coming up with particular refits, modules, squeezing every last drop of space out of a fleet hangar on a regular Avatar. And I am telling you in it's current state with bonuses to capital nos and neuts (meaning you'd usually have two fitted two stored) you are going to incure an increase of (wait for it) 8000 m3 due to having two of each type of NOS and Nuet. An additional 10,000 m3 due to having two racial phenomena generators, and another 5000 m3 of space for needing to carry an additional racial Doomsday. Then you need an additional 5000 m3 of empty space to refit. That is a total of 28000 additional m3 needed MINIMUM to have the Moloks capability to refit for its bonuses in a combat situation. Engage your damn brain.
Jesus... I was told people on this forum can be cancer... I know you're in PL but please try to at least be a little less entitled!
Anyhow, fitting in EVE is all about trade-offs, this just creates one more. Besides, if you can afford a Molek, then you'll likely have another account that can quite easily use a cap that doesn't require all of its cargo space, so just keep them close and refit out of your 2nd cap's hanger.
On top of that, you don't actually need both types of damage in DDs - the bonus of being able to use either is a strong bonus in of itself, as it makes the Titan less predictable, it also allows it to do 3 damage types using Minmatar DD with Lasers which is also great against Reactive Armour Hardeners - hit the target with lasers for a few shots then fire that DD on the created resist hole.
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Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2796
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 18:54:25 -
[56] - Quote
Tara Read wrote: I've sat for hours coming up with particular refits, modules, squeezing every last drop of space out of a fleet hangar on a regular Avatar.
Maybe you should go outside.
Tara Read wrote: And I am telling you in it's current state with bonuses to capital nos and neuts (meaning you'd usually have two fitted two stored) you are going to incure an increase of (wait for it) 8000 m3 due to having two of each type of NOS and Nuet. An additional 10,000 m3 due to having two racial phenomena generators, and another 5000 m3 of space for needing to carry an additional racial Doomsday. Then you need an additional 5000 m3 of empty space to refit.
That is a total of 28000 additional m3 needed MINIMUM to have the Moloks capability to refit for its bonuses in a combat situation. Engage your damn brain.
Okay, and? It's got a 100,000 m^3 fleet hangar. I understand that you'd have a little less room for meme items such as exotic dancers.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
943
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 18:59:54 -
[57] - Quote
So after looking at the relative comparison to the Vanquisher the Molok feels a little underwhelming. Where the Vanquisher gets the extra low the Molok has only 5 mid slots. I propose several crucial changes for the Molok to make it a competitive alternative:
1. The slot layout needs to be 8/6/8. There is no slot difference functionality wise compared to a base Avatar.
2. The base Armor of the Molok needs to increase. You only have a 30.7% increase in raw armor compared to the Vanquishers 30.0%. Lackluster when the Avatar has always been considered the king of Armor Titans in regards to tank.
3. The Fleet Hangar size of the Molok needs to ne increased by around 50k m3. Doing so will allow for the Molok to carry the various racial Doomsdays and Phenomenon Generators as well as carry the compliment of Faction Capital Nos and Neuts that make the bonuses for this Titan even worth considering. A failure to increase the Fleet Hangar will incur major headaches for groups who already have set requirements for their Avatar contingents and to be frank Titans in general need a Fleet Hangar increase in general for all the additional modules they now require to be used effectively. |
Cade Windstalker
1165
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 19:01:15 -
[58] - Quote
Any word on how these are going to be acquired and the costs?
Are they going to be in line with the cost of the Serpentis Caps? |
Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
943
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 19:06:01 -
[59] - Quote
Minty Aroma wrote:Tara Read wrote:Querns wrote:Tara Read wrote:Querns wrote:
I understand that you have a fierce, severe entitlement to carrying literally everything in your spaceship. I know there could be a situation where you really need a Sentient 'Unobtanium' Left-Handed Screwdriver II, but sometimes you can't have everything. You may need to make some choices.
Cargo's just one of those things you need to prioritize when fitting a ship. You clearly don't want to fit a cargo expander, yet you really want cargo. This sort of dilemma is great.
There should BE no deliema on a 300 BILLION ISK TITAN. Especially when the fittings it uses eats up an additional 10k to 20k m3 due to faction capital nos, neuts, racial Doomsday and phenomenon Generators. What's the damn point in owning one if you can't even use the modules it is bonused for???? Woah, simmer down there Sparky, there's no need to get flustered. It's a video game. A thing having a high cost is not proof against fitting dilemmas. That's silly. No you're entire groups posting history on this topic is stooped in blatant ignorance and stupidity. I've sat for hours coming up with particular refits, modules, squeezing every last drop of space out of a fleet hangar on a regular Avatar. And I am telling you in it's current state with bonuses to capital nos and neuts (meaning you'd usually have two fitted two stored) you are going to incure an increase of (wait for it) 8000 m3 due to having two of each type of NOS and Nuet. An additional 10,000 m3 due to having two racial phenomena generators, and another 5000 m3 of space for needing to carry an additional racial Doomsday. Then you need an additional 5000 m3 of empty space to refit. That is a total of 28000 additional m3 needed MINIMUM to have the Moloks capability to refit for its bonuses in a combat situation. Engage your damn brain. Jesus... I was told people on this forum can be cancer... I know you're in PL but please try to at least be a little less entitled! Anyhow, fitting in EVE is all about trade-offs, this just creates one more. Besides, if you can afford a Molek, then you'll likely have another account that can quite easily use a cap that doesn't require all of its cargo space, so just keep them close and refit out of your 2nd cap's hanger. On top of that, you don't actually need both types of damage in DDs - the bonus of being able to use either is a strong bonus in of itself, as it makes the Titan less predictable, it also allows it to do 3 damage types using Minmatar DD with Lasers which is also great against Reactive Armour Hardeners - hit the target with lasers for a few shots then fire that DD on the created resist hole.
Do you understand how Titans bounce? Does your small little brain even comprehend the logistical nightmare of combat refitting in a Faction Titan where it is probably likely any additional capitals will be either volleyed or bumped away? You also realize you STILL need the empty space to place said modules and swap into the fleet hangar. You also said you don't need both DD's???? So what if the enemy has different kinds of dreads? Would it not be beneficial to DD wait out the agression timer, reswap to the other DD and use said resistance hole to alpha another dreadnought???? God are all of YOU this dumb when it comes to capital warfare? Of course you all are because you have zeeo clue what the hell you are talking about. Also it isn't entitlement its practicality and usability on the Battlefield. I suggest learning above a fifth grade reasing level or hooked on phonics for you to comprehend basic fitting tactics.
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Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
943
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 19:10:25 -
[60] - Quote
Querns wrote:Tara Read wrote: I've sat for hours coming up with particular refits, modules, squeezing every last drop of space out of a fleet hangar on a regular Avatar.
Maybe you should go outside. Tara Read wrote: And I am telling you in it's current state with bonuses to capital nos and neuts (meaning you'd usually have two fitted two stored) you are going to incure an increase of (wait for it) 8000 m3 due to having two of each type of NOS and Nuet. An additional 10,000 m3 due to having two racial phenomena generators, and another 5000 m3 of space for needing to carry an additional racial Doomsday. Then you need an additional 5000 m3 of empty space to refit.
That is a total of 28000 additional m3 needed MINIMUM to have the Moloks capability to refit for its bonuses in a combat situation. Engage your damn brain.
Okay, and? It's got a 100,000 m^3 fleet hangar. I understand that you'd have a little less room for meme items such as exotic dancers.
I'm done arguing with the mentally challenged. I suggest you go to a neurologist and cure the reason why your neurons fire so slowly when it comes to daring to form an opinion about Capitals. |
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TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel
1279
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 19:18:03 -
[61] - Quote
jesus tara |
Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
3261
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 19:19:12 -
[62] - Quote
Tara Read wrote: Do you understand how Titans bounce? Does your small little brain even comprehend the logistical nightmare of combat refitting in a Faction Titan where it is probably likely any additional capitals will be either volleyed or bumped away? You also realize you STILL need the empty space to place said modules and swap into the fleet hangar. You also said you don't need both DD's???? So what if the enemy has different kinds of dreads? Would it not be beneficial to DD wait out the aggression timer, reswap to the other DD and use said resistance hole to alpha another dreadnought???? God are all of YOU this dumb when it comes to capital warfare? Of course you all are because you have zero clue what the hell you are talking about. Also it isn't entitlement its practicality and usability on the Battlefield. I suggest learning above a fifth grade reading level or hooked on phonics for you to comprehend basic fitting tactics.
The fact you have all those possibilities does not mean CCP want you to be able to carry them all at the same time. |
Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
943
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 19:29:15 -
[63] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:Tara Read wrote: Do you understand how Titans bounce? Does your small little brain even comprehend the logistical nightmare of combat refitting in a Faction Titan where it is probably likely any additional capitals will be either volleyed or bumped away? You also realize you STILL need the empty space to place said modules and swap into the fleet hangar. You also said you don't need both DD's???? So what if the enemy has different kinds of dreads? Would it not be beneficial to DD wait out the aggression timer, reswap to the other DD and use said resistance hole to alpha another dreadnought???? God are all of YOU this dumb when it comes to capital warfare? Of course you all are because you have zero clue what the hell you are talking about. Also it isn't entitlement its practicality and usability on the Battlefield. I suggest learning above a fifth grade reading level or hooked on phonics for you to comprehend basic fitting tactics.
The fact you have all those possibilities does not mean CCP want you to be able to carry them all at the same time.
Either you've suffered severe brain trauma because the recording that reminded you to breathe stopped for a few minutes or you all really are just trolling, |
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2797
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 19:30:11 -
[64] - Quote
Tara Read wrote:Querns wrote:Tara Read wrote: I've sat for hours coming up with particular refits, modules, squeezing every last drop of space out of a fleet hangar on a regular Avatar.
Maybe you should go outside. Tara Read wrote: And I am telling you in it's current state with bonuses to capital nos and neuts (meaning you'd usually have two fitted two stored) you are going to incure an increase of (wait for it) 8000 m3 due to having two of each type of NOS and Nuet. An additional 10,000 m3 due to having two racial phenomena generators, and another 5000 m3 of space for needing to carry an additional racial Doomsday. Then you need an additional 5000 m3 of empty space to refit.
That is a total of 28000 additional m3 needed MINIMUM to have the Moloks capability to refit for its bonuses in a combat situation. Engage your damn brain.
Okay, and? It's got a 100,000 m^3 fleet hangar. I understand that you'd have a little less room for meme items such as exotic dancers. I'm done arguing with the mentally challenged. I suggest you go to a neurologist and cure the reason why your neurons fire so slowly when it comes to daring to form an opinion about Capitals.
I mean, so far your argument has been "because this ship costs a lot, I should be able to carry every pair of tweezers and every jar of vaseline." The mental challenge appears to be yours.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Minty Aroma
Eternity INC. Goonswarm Federation
70
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 19:33:10 -
[65] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:Tara Read wrote: Do you understand how Titans bounce? Does your small little brain even comprehend the logistical nightmare of combat refitting in a Faction Titan where it is probably likely any additional capitals will be either volleyed or bumped away? You also realize you STILL need the empty space to place said modules and swap into the fleet hangar. You also said you don't need both DD's???? So what if the enemy has different kinds of dreads? Would it not be beneficial to DD wait out the aggression timer, reswap to the other DD and use said resistance hole to alpha another dreadnought???? God are all of YOU this dumb when it comes to capital warfare? Of course you all are because you have zero clue what the hell you are talking about. Also it isn't entitlement its practicality and usability on the Battlefield. I suggest learning above a fifth grade reading level or hooked on phonics for you to comprehend basic fitting tactics.
The fact you have all those possibilities does not mean CCP want you to be able to carry them all at the same time.
This, seeing as CCP has nerfed refitting on the fly anyhow.
Plus it's not hard to use 2 cynos and warp one cap to another to avoid bouncing - there's something Quote: your small little brain didn't .
Unfortunately, you seem a lot more likely to scream and sperg than git gud and think how to get past any limitations; Quote:I suggest learning above a fifth grade reading level or hooked on phonics for you to comprehend basic fitting tactics.
|
Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
943
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 19:34:52 -
[66] - Quote
Querns wrote:Tara Read wrote:Querns wrote:Tara Read wrote: I've sat for hours coming up with particular refits, modules, squeezing every last drop of space out of a fleet hangar on a regular Avatar.
Maybe you should go outside. Tara Read wrote: And I am telling you in it's current state with bonuses to capital nos and neuts (meaning you'd usually have two fitted two stored) you are going to incure an increase of (wait for it) 8000 m3 due to having two of each type of NOS and Nuet. An additional 10,000 m3 due to having two racial phenomena generators, and another 5000 m3 of space for needing to carry an additional racial Doomsday. Then you need an additional 5000 m3 of empty space to refit.
That is a total of 28000 additional m3 needed MINIMUM to have the Moloks capability to refit for its bonuses in a combat situation. Engage your damn brain.
Okay, and? It's got a 100,000 m^3 fleet hangar. I understand that you'd have a little less room for meme items such as exotic dancers. I'm done arguing with the mentally challenged. I suggest you go to a neurologist and cure the reason why your neurons fire so slowly when it comes to daring to form an opinion about Capitals. I mean, so far your argument has been "because this ship costs a lot, I should be able to carry every pair of tweezers and every jar of vaseline." The mental challenge appears to be yours.
No that has never been my argument. If you stopped trying to lick that scratch and sniff sticker at the bottom of the local kiddie pool maybe you'd compehend basic English. I'll break it down nice and simple for you. Okay? Good Bobo. Now Bobo I don't have colored pictures and bright happy shapes to convey my opinion so you'll need to try really really hard. Okay? Good Bobo!
Because Titan use lots of Big module compared to regular Titan it mean Titan has lots of cool stuff but Titan only have so much space. Titan need bigger place to keep fun stuff because Titans fun abilities use fun modules. Not having enough room for stuff make Titan pilots sad. CCP need to make Titan pilots happy so they can use all their cool stuff.
Understand Bobo? Good! Here's a banana. You earned it. |
TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel
1279
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 19:37:33 -
[67] - Quote
have you considered storing your excess modules in a station or citadel |
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2797
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 19:38:36 -
[68] - Quote
Tara Read wrote:Querns wrote: I mean, so far your argument has been "because this ship costs a lot, I should be able to carry every pair of tweezers and every jar of vaseline." The mental challenge appears to be yours.
No that has never been my argument.
Are you sure? You posted the following:
Tara Read wrote: There should BE no deliema on a 300 BILLION ISK TITAN. Especially when the fittings it uses eats up an additional 10k to 20k m3 due to faction capital nos, neuts, racial Doomsday and phenomenon Generators. What's the damn point in owning one if you can't even use the modules it is bonused for????
which reads awfully like you think that a ship's cost should reflect its utility. Then you posted this:
Tara Read wrote:And I am telling you in it's current state with bonuses to capital nos and neuts (meaning you'd usually have two fitted two stored) you are going to incure an increase of (wait for it) 8000 m3 due to having two of each type of NOS and Nuet. An additional 10,000 m3 due to having two racial phenomena generators, and another 5000 m3 of space for needing to carry an additional racial Doomsday. Then you need an additional 5000 m3 of empty space to refit.
That is a total of 28000 additional m3 needed MINIMUM to have the Moloks capability to refit for its bonuses in a combat situation. Engage your damn brain.
It sounds like you're just mad that a ship won't be able to double as a Quafe hauler.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
943
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 19:40:15 -
[69] - Quote
TrouserDeagle wrote:have you considered storing your excess modules in a station or citadel
Go back to flying frigates Trouser this doesn't concern you. |
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2797
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 19:44:13 -
[70] - Quote
Live on forums dot eveonline dot com, the mental breakdown of a pilot who absolutely positively demands that a ship must be able to carry everything. "Why do ships have limited cargoholds at all?" the poster wails in between ragged, gasping breaths, interrupted by frequent wet sniffles. "I NEED to have shield rechargers in my cargo hold! I NEED IT!"
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
|
Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
943
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 19:45:32 -
[71] - Quote
Querns wrote:Tara Read wrote:Querns wrote: I mean, so far your argument has been "because this ship costs a lot, I should be able to carry every pair of tweezers and every jar of vaseline." The mental challenge appears to be yours.
No that has never been my argument. Are you sure? You posted the following: Tara Read wrote: There should BE no deliema on a 300 BILLION ISK TITAN. Especially when the fittings it uses eats up an additional 10k to 20k m3 due to faction capital nos, neuts, racial Doomsday and phenomenon Generators. What's the damn point in owning one if you can't even use the modules it is bonused for????
which reads awfully like you think that a ship's cost should reflect its utility. Then you posted this: Tara Read wrote:And I am telling you in it's current state with bonuses to capital nos and neuts (meaning you'd usually have two fitted two stored) you are going to incure an increase of (wait for it) 8000 m3 due to having two of each type of NOS and Nuet. An additional 10,000 m3 due to having two racial phenomena generators, and another 5000 m3 of space for needing to carry an additional racial Doomsday. Then you need an additional 5000 m3 of empty space to refit.
That is a total of 28000 additional m3 needed MINIMUM to have the Moloks capability to refit for its bonuses in a combat situation. Engage your damn brain. It sounds like you're just mad that a ship won't be able to double as a Quafe hauler.
It seems to me like you fail to comprehend that BECAUSE said Titan is bonused to use CAPITAL nos nuets dd's and generators it specifically needs to be able TO CARRY AND REFIT SAID MODULES. The cost of the Titan has little relevance in regards towards the modules it is bonused to USE. If the Titan was not bonused to use 2 racial doomsdays, three addirional types of dds, capital nos and neuts as well as two phenomena generators we would not be having this discussion. |
Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
943
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 19:47:16 -
[72] - Quote
Querns wrote:Live on forums dot eveonline dot com, the mental breakdown of a pilot who absolutely positively demands that a ship must be able to carry everything. "Why do ships have limited cargoholds at all?" the poster wails in between ragged, gasping breaths, interrupted by frequent wet sniffles. "I NEED to have shield rechargers in my cargo hold! I NEED IT!"
Live on the forums. A monkey in a bee costume typing at the keyboard. Keep being reminded to mouthbreathe because your utter stupidity is frankly staggering. |
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2802
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 19:48:45 -
[73] - Quote
Tara Read wrote: It seems to me like you fail to comprehend that BECAUSE said Titan is bonused to use CAPITAL nos nuets dd's and generators it specifically needs to be able TO CARRY AND REFIT SAID MODULES. The cost of the Titan has little relevance in regards towards the modules it is bonused to USE. If the Titan was not bonused to use 2 racial doomsdays, three addirional types of dds, capital nos and neuts as well as two phenomena generators we would not be having this discussion.
By your own math, the fleet hangar of the Molok is in size far exceeding the 'required' modules. By three times.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
943
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 19:53:31 -
[74] - Quote
Querns wrote:Tara Read wrote: It seems to me like you fail to comprehend that BECAUSE said Titan is bonused to use CAPITAL nos nuets dd's and generators it specifically needs to be able TO CARRY AND REFIT SAID MODULES. The cost of the Titan has little relevance in regards towards the modules it is bonused to USE. If the Titan was not bonused to use 2 racial doomsdays, three addirional types of dds, capital nos and neuts as well as two phenomena generators we would not be having this discussion.
By your own math, the fleet hangar of the Molok is in size far exceeding the 'required' modules. By three times.
No these modules are in ADDITION to an already near maxed fleet hangar on a regular Avatar. I know you Goons have zero clue how to use or refit capitals but please for sake of the rest of everyone else's sanity try and keep up. |
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2802
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 19:55:00 -
[75] - Quote
Tara Read wrote:Querns wrote:Tara Read wrote: It seems to me like you fail to comprehend that BECAUSE said Titan is bonused to use CAPITAL nos nuets dd's and generators it specifically needs to be able TO CARRY AND REFIT SAID MODULES. The cost of the Titan has little relevance in regards towards the modules it is bonused to USE. If the Titan was not bonused to use 2 racial doomsdays, three addirional types of dds, capital nos and neuts as well as two phenomena generators we would not be having this discussion.
By your own math, the fleet hangar of the Molok is in size far exceeding the 'required' modules. By three times. No these modules are in ADDITION to an already near maxed fleet hangar on a regular Avatar. I know you Goons have zero clue how to use or refit capitals but please for sake of the rest of everyone else's sanity try and keep up.
The only person who appears to be losing sanity over this is you, friend. Take a breath.
It's okay if you can't fit every can of Quafe into your capital. Infinite tactical malleability isn't a right. It's something you have to make choices about. Do I really need a Shield Power Relay? Can I skip on the auto-targeter? Choices.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
3262
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 19:55:22 -
[76] - Quote
Tara Read wrote:
It seems to me like you fail to comprehend that BECAUSE said Titan is bonused to use CAPITAL nos nuets dd's and generators it specifically needs to be able TO CARRY AND REFIT SAID MODULES. The cost of the Titan has little relevance in regards towards the modules it is bonused to USE. If the Titan was not bonused to use 2 racial doomsdays, three additional types of dds, capital nos and neuts as well as two phenomena generators we would not be having this discussion.
It can, just not all at the same time. Which bring meaningful choices to the table about how you will kit out your 300 bill ship. DO you bring 8 Doomsday or ony 4? DO you bring 2 cap NOS or maybe 4 in case your burn out a pair? Do you Bring 2 or 4 cap neut since they also can burn out? Do you also bring a cap fit? Do you bring a max shiled tank fit in case somethign bad happen? Do you bring a max armor fit in case **** happens? DO you bring a set of guns to swap long range/short range? How much ammo do you bring?
Those are all options and you can't put a check mark beside every single one of them. It's the case for all Titans and from what we see right now, it will continue to be the case even for the pirate ones. You will still get into combat with a hand of cards, not the whole deck. |
Mr Rive
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
144
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 20:00:09 -
[77] - Quote
From what I can tell his argument is thusly:
Why bother using a faction titan, when that faction titan can only fit the modules of one race of bonuses in its hull?
Effectively, you are saying 'here are the bonuses' but then negating that because the titan can only use one type of bonus without docking up to refit.
In essense, the extra DD bonuses are pointless.
Of course, it's still an advantage because the enemy won't know which DD you have fit until you fire it.
That being said, it does seem a bit pointless to have a ship which can only use one bonus at a time without docking. For the price, you might as well buy two titans with the same racial DD's, as you could just do the same effective thing with them. |
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2803
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 20:01:26 -
[78] - Quote
Mr Rive wrote:From what I can tell his argument is thusly:
Why bother using a faction titan, when that faction titan can only fit the modules of one race of bonuses in its hull?
Effectively, you are saying 'here are the bonuses' but then negating that because the titan can only use one type of bonus without docking up to refit.
In essense, the extra DD bonuses are pointless.
Of course, it's still an advantage because the enemy won't know which DD you have fit until you fire it.
That being said, it does seem a bit pointless to have a ship which can only use one bonus at a time without docking. For the price, you might as well buy two titans with the same racial DD's, as you could just do the same effective thing with them.
You can use both of them, you just have to sacrifice some of your cargo space to do it. Seems fine to me.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
943
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 20:01:57 -
[79] - Quote
Querns wrote:Tara Read wrote:Querns wrote:Tara Read wrote: It seems to me like you fail to comprehend that BECAUSE said Titan is bonused to use CAPITAL nos nuets dd's and generators it specifically needs to be able TO CARRY AND REFIT SAID MODULES. The cost of the Titan has little relevance in regards towards the modules it is bonused to USE. If the Titan was not bonused to use 2 racial doomsdays, three addirional types of dds, capital nos and neuts as well as two phenomena generators we would not be having this discussion.
By your own math, the fleet hangar of the Molok is in size far exceeding the 'required' modules. By three times. No these modules are in ADDITION to an already near maxed fleet hangar on a regular Avatar. I know you Goons have zero clue how to use or refit capitals but please for sake of the rest of everyone else's sanity try and keep up. The only person who appears to be losing sanity over this is you, friend. Take a breath. It's okay if you can't fit every can of Quafe into your capital. Infinite tactical malleability isn't a right. It's something you have to make choices about. Do I really need a Shield Power Relay? Can I skip on the auto-targeter? Choices.
It's a crying shame your parents didn't have the choice to use protection because if they had maybe we wouldn't need to read such garbage opinions by those who will probably never even use this thing in actual combat. Choices right? I mean you can always mess aeound in one like your bumble bee comrade in a Vendetta with no refits but for the rest of us id prefer to use the full capability of this Titan in a Pvp scenario. |
Mr Rive
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
144
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 20:02:48 -
[80] - Quote
basically what I'm saying is the problem the faction titan faces is hilariously tiny compared to the faction FAX.
BTW I ran some numbers. The dogon has less of an effective local tank in both passive and active fit than the apostle.
Considering that is on a ship whose only defense is it's local tank, I call shenanigans. |
|
Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
943
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 20:04:51 -
[81] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:Tara Read wrote:
It seems to me like you fail to comprehend that BECAUSE said Titan is bonused to use CAPITAL nos nuets dd's and generators it specifically needs to be able TO CARRY AND REFIT SAID MODULES. The cost of the Titan has little relevance in regards towards the modules it is bonused to USE. If the Titan was not bonused to use 2 racial doomsdays, three additional types of dds, capital nos and neuts as well as two phenomena generators we would not be having this discussion.
It can, just not all at the same time. Which bring meaningful choices to the table about how you will kit out your 300 bill ship. DO you bring 8 Doomsday or ony 4? DO you bring 2 cap NOS or maybe 4 in case your burn out a pair? Do you Bring 2 or 4 cap neut since they also can burn out? Do you also bring a cap fit? Do you bring a max shiled tank fit in case somethign bad happen? Do you bring a max armor fit in case **** happens? DO you bring a set of guns to swap long range/short range? How much ammo do you bring? Those are all options and you can't put a check mark beside every single one of them. It's the case for all Titans and from what we see right now, it will continue to be the case even for the pirate ones. You will still get into combat with a hand of cards, not the whole deck.
Not being able to even carry the basic refits due to their size is a massive hindrance. No one is saying shield refits or Quafe like your fellow idiots praddle on about. I am saying the BASIC refits to even USE the bonuses the Titan is made for! |
Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
3263
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 20:06:44 -
[82] - Quote
Mr Rive wrote:From what I can tell his argument is thusly:
Why bother using a faction titan, when that faction titan can only fit the modules of one race of bonuses in its hull?
Effectively, you are saying 'here are the bonuses' but then negating that because the titan can only use one type of bonus without docking up to refit.
In essense, the extra DD bonuses are pointless.
Of course, it's still an advantage because the enemy won't know which DD you have fit until you fire it.
That being said, it does seem a bit pointless to have a ship which can only use one bonus at a time without docking. For the price, you might as well buy two titans with the same racial DD's, as you could just do the same effective thing with them.
If you carry just that, it fit int he hangar. Of course, you are not carrying just that since there are other things you carry around even in Titans without that options. The point will be to choose if you bring the extra DD, how many different ones of them and what do you sacrifice to bring them. More options will bring your harder choices to make because the extras actually cost you some of the "basics". |
IcyMidnight
Nobody in Local Of Sound Mind
12
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 20:07:03 -
[83] - Quote
Ncc 1709 wrote:BTW, the games 1000 item stack limitation limits each to 1000 corpses... 2,000 m3 max
Two most important questions: - How will we store more than 1000 corpses?! - Will there be a nice red/black SKIN so that we can ditch that silly splatter paint? At least the Minmatar do it properly getting an even coating with the blood of the Amarr for their paint jobs! |
Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
943
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 20:08:18 -
[84] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:Mr Rive wrote:From what I can tell his argument is thusly:
Why bother using a faction titan, when that faction titan can only fit the modules of one race of bonuses in its hull?
Effectively, you are saying 'here are the bonuses' but then negating that because the titan can only use one type of bonus without docking up to refit.
In essense, the extra DD bonuses are pointless.
Of course, it's still an advantage because the enemy won't know which DD you have fit until you fire it.
That being said, it does seem a bit pointless to have a ship which can only use one bonus at a time without docking. For the price, you might as well buy two titans with the same racial DD's, as you could just do the same effective thing with them. If you carry just that, it fit int he hangar. Of course, you are not carrying just that since there are other things you carry around even in Titans without that options. The point will be to choose if you bring the extra DD, how many different ones of them and what do you sacrifice to bring them. More options will bring your harder choices to make because the extras actually cost you some of the "basics".
This is the stupidest garbage I have ever read. |
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2807
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 20:09:22 -
[85] - Quote
Tara Read wrote:Querns wrote:Tara Read wrote:Querns wrote:Tara Read wrote: It seems to me like you fail to comprehend that BECAUSE said Titan is bonused to use CAPITAL nos nuets dd's and generators it specifically needs to be able TO CARRY AND REFIT SAID MODULES. The cost of the Titan has little relevance in regards towards the modules it is bonused to USE. If the Titan was not bonused to use 2 racial doomsdays, three addirional types of dds, capital nos and neuts as well as two phenomena generators we would not be having this discussion.
By your own math, the fleet hangar of the Molok is in size far exceeding the 'required' modules. By three times. No these modules are in ADDITION to an already near maxed fleet hangar on a regular Avatar. I know you Goons have zero clue how to use or refit capitals but please for sake of the rest of everyone else's sanity try and keep up. The only person who appears to be losing sanity over this is you, friend. Take a breath. It's okay if you can't fit every can of Quafe into your capital. Infinite tactical malleability isn't a right. It's something you have to make choices about. Do I really need a Shield Power Relay? Can I skip on the auto-targeter? Choices. It's a crying shame your parents didn't have the choice to use protection because if they had maybe we wouldn't need to read such garbage opinions by those who will probably never even use this thing in actual combat. Choices right? I mean you can always rat in one like your bumble comrade in a Vendetta but for the rest of us id prefer to use the full capability of this Titan in a Pvp scenario.
Really, now. I think you'll be fine in a PVP scenario without all the projected ECCM and reactor control units you think you might need. You'll just have to make some choices.
The entitlement pile doesn't stop from getting taller around here.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
3263
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 20:10:27 -
[86] - Quote
Tara Read wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:Tara Read wrote:
It seems to me like you fail to comprehend that BECAUSE said Titan is bonused to use CAPITAL nos nuets dd's and generators it specifically needs to be able TO CARRY AND REFIT SAID MODULES. The cost of the Titan has little relevance in regards towards the modules it is bonused to USE. If the Titan was not bonused to use 2 racial doomsdays, three additional types of dds, capital nos and neuts as well as two phenomena generators we would not be having this discussion.
It can, just not all at the same time. Which bring meaningful choices to the table about how you will kit out your 300 bill ship. DO you bring 8 Doomsday or ony 4? DO you bring 2 cap NOS or maybe 4 in case your burn out a pair? Do you Bring 2 or 4 cap neut since they also can burn out? Do you also bring a cap fit? Do you bring a max shiled tank fit in case somethign bad happen? Do you bring a max armor fit in case **** happens? DO you bring a set of guns to swap long range/short range? How much ammo do you bring? Those are all options and you can't put a check mark beside every single one of them. It's the case for all Titans and from what we see right now, it will continue to be the case even for the pirate ones. You will still get into combat with a hand of cards, not the whole deck. Not being able to even carry the basic refits due to their size is a massive hindrance. No one is saying shield refits or Quafe like your fellow idiots praddle on about. I am saying the BASIC refits to even USE the bonuses the Titan is made for!
You are paying a hybrid tax for being able to DD in 2 different damage profile. And no, ISK is not the way that tax is paid. |
bob910
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 20:12:48 -
[87] - Quote
Are the corpses fuel for the dd and jumpdrive? |
Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
943
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 20:12:56 -
[88] - Quote
Querns wrote:
Really, now. I think you'll be fine in a PVP scenario without all the projected ECCM and reactor control units you think you might need. You'll just have to make some choices.
The entitlement pile doesn't stop from getting taller around here.
Lol entitlement. No one is entitled to jack. Stop trying to convey functionality for entitlement just because YOU will never fly one.
|
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2807
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 20:13:20 -
[89] - Quote
bob910 wrote:Are the corpses fuel for the dd and jumpdrive?
If they are, they better add that corpse tractor beam. Capital ships are way too slow to properly loot a battlefield.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
943
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 20:13:51 -
[90] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:Tara Read wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:Tara Read wrote:
It seems to me like you fail to comprehend that BECAUSE said Titan is bonused to use CAPITAL nos nuets dd's and generators it specifically needs to be able TO CARRY AND REFIT SAID MODULES. The cost of the Titan has little relevance in regards towards the modules it is bonused to USE. If the Titan was not bonused to use 2 racial doomsdays, three additional types of dds, capital nos and neuts as well as two phenomena generators we would not be having this discussion.
It can, just not all at the same time. Which bring meaningful choices to the table about how you will kit out your 300 bill ship. DO you bring 8 Doomsday or ony 4? DO you bring 2 cap NOS or maybe 4 in case your burn out a pair? Do you Bring 2 or 4 cap neut since they also can burn out? Do you also bring a cap fit? Do you bring a max shiled tank fit in case somethign bad happen? Do you bring a max armor fit in case **** happens? DO you bring a set of guns to swap long range/short range? How much ammo do you bring? Those are all options and you can't put a check mark beside every single one of them. It's the case for all Titans and from what we see right now, it will continue to be the case even for the pirate ones. You will still get into combat with a hand of cards, not the whole deck. Not being able to even carry the basic refits due to their size is a massive hindrance. No one is saying shield refits or Quafe like your fellow idiots praddle on about. I am saying the BASIC refits to even USE the bonuses the Titan is made for! You are paying a hybrid tax for being able to DD in 2 different damage profile. And no, ISK is not the way that tax is paid.
Hybrid tax????? Wtf are you even smoking? |
|
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2807
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 20:14:30 -
[91] - Quote
Tara Read wrote:Querns wrote:
Really, now. I think you'll be fine in a PVP scenario without all the projected ECCM and reactor control units you think you might need. You'll just have to make some choices.
The entitlement pile doesn't stop from getting taller around here.
Lol entitlement. No one is entitled to jack. Stop trying to convey functionality for entitlement just because YOU will never fly one.
The ship is plenty functional, and has adequate space. Cargohold limitations exist for a reason.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
943
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 20:16:45 -
[92] - Quote
Querns wrote:Tara Read wrote:Querns wrote:
Really, now. I think you'll be fine in a PVP scenario without all the projected ECCM and reactor control units you think you might need. You'll just have to make some choices.
The entitlement pile doesn't stop from getting taller around here.
Lol entitlement. No one is entitled to jack. Stop trying to convey functionality for entitlement just because YOU will never fly one. The ship is plenty functional, and has adequate space. Cargohold limitations exist for a reason.
Its not a cargo hold its a fleet hangar. Again because the ship is functional it needs space to carry the modules that MAKE it functional. |
Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
3263
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 20:20:47 -
[93] - Quote
Tara Read wrote:Querns wrote:Tara Read wrote:Querns wrote:
Really, now. I think you'll be fine in a PVP scenario without all the projected ECCM and reactor control units you think you might need. You'll just have to make some choices.
The entitlement pile doesn't stop from getting taller around here.
Lol entitlement. No one is entitled to jack. Stop trying to convey functionality for entitlement just because YOU will never fly one. The ship is plenty functional, and has adequate space. Cargohold limitations exist for a reason. Its not a cargo hold its a fleet hangar. Again because the ship is functional it needs space to carry the modules that MAKE it functional.
Fleet Hangar limits also exist for a reason. |
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2810
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 20:21:14 -
[94] - Quote
Tara Read wrote:Querns wrote:Tara Read wrote:Querns wrote:
Really, now. I think you'll be fine in a PVP scenario without all the projected ECCM and reactor control units you think you might need. You'll just have to make some choices.
The entitlement pile doesn't stop from getting taller around here.
Lol entitlement. No one is entitled to jack. Stop trying to convey functionality for entitlement just because YOU will never fly one. The ship is plenty functional, and has adequate space. Cargohold limitations exist for a reason. Its not a cargo hold its a fleet hangar. Again because the ship is functional it needs space to carry the modules that MAKE it functional.
Splitting hairs.
The ship will function just fine without a jump freighter-sized fleet hangar. You may need to leave some stuff behind, however. This makes you a little more vulnerable in some situations, of course, but that's okay.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2810
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 20:23:08 -
[95] - Quote
Besides, just think -- if you can't carry as much in your fleet hangar, the total ISK value of your killmail will be lower. Perhaps if you optimize this well enough, you won't have to drop corp or unplug implants when you get caught doing something dumb.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Gabriel Karade
Noir. Mercenary Coalition
325
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 20:24:32 -
[96] - Quote
'Corpse bay' seems pretty silly to be honest, serves no actual purpose, and from a fluff perspective who the hell builds a warship with a totally pointless space?
War Machine: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=386293
|
Elizabeth Norn
Nornir Research Nornir Empire
1040
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 20:53:11 -
[97] - Quote
Gabriel Karade wrote:'Corpse bay' seems pretty silly to be honest, serves no actual purpose, and from a fluff perspective who the hell builds a warship with a totally pointless space?
Maybe a cult called the Blood Raiders ;-).
https://community.eveonline.com/backstory/chronicles/the-blood-raiders/
Quote:Omir has abandoned that practice, but instead his sect has started targeting cloned people, as they believe blood from clones is better suited for their freakish blood rituals. In their search for cloned people, OmirGÇÖs sect has taken to space and in few short years their frequent attacks on passenger ships and other space vessels have made them feared throughout Amarr space and far beyond.
Free 3rd party services
21 day trial, you keep the whole PLEX
|
Canadian Fire
Mighty Putty Inc
1
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 21:37:42 -
[98] - Quote
I can't really speak for the other caps, but my initial impression is that I'm not sure the dagon will provide enough of a practical improvement over the apostle to warrant actually ever using it. Maybe I'm just not seeing the intended use, but I really don't think the nos power is going to be able to hold it up the same way the bonuses on the other fax can. I suppose I'll have to wait until they're out on the test server to find out for sure. |
Insidious
Hax.
23
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 22:25:17 -
[99] - Quote
thats fantastic
now nerf capitals |
Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
943
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 22:39:38 -
[100] - Quote
Querns wrote:Besides, just think -- if you can't carry as much in your fleet hangar, the total ISK value of your killmail will be lower. Perhaps if you optimize this well enough, you won't have to drop corp or unplug implants when you get caught doing something dumb.
That was almost as funny as imagining you with a helmet and mouth guard typing this to make a funny. Congratulations you get a Pap Link. |
|
Minty Aroma
Eternity INC. Goonswarm Federation
73
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 23:00:55 -
[101] - Quote
Tara Read wrote:Autistic Screeching
By your logic, there is no need for cargohold limitations at all - the same principle can be applied to any ship that can be used effectively in other configurations - ie: most of the ships in EVE. Some ships like the Machariel have a decent amount of space to refit for most encounters, others such as Carriers/Supers cannot carry enough for any situation, so you must plan and compromise when figuring fighter loadout, EWAR burst and tank modules; same goes for the Molek.
Forward planning is a part of what makes a skillful player - instead of getting hysterical over the limitations, use your head to think a way around them to push the effectiveness of the ship to its limit. |
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2816
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 23:05:31 -
[102] - Quote
Tara Read wrote:Querns wrote:Besides, just think -- if you can't carry as much in your fleet hangar, the total ISK value of your killmail will be lower. Perhaps if you optimize this well enough, you won't have to drop corp or unplug implants when you get caught doing something dumb. That was almost as funny as imagining you with a helmet and mouth guard typing this to make a funny. Congratulations you get a Pap Link.
You seem awfully desperate to paint me as being subhuman. My question is, why go to the trouble? Surely the mellifluous, well-reasoned, not at all autistic screeching nature of your posting will stand alone, causing all who read to instinctively agree with you.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Mr Rive
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
145
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 23:38:15 -
[103] - Quote
Can everyone please stop yelling at each other so we can all collectively yell about how poorly the dogon tanks??
We can all agree on that :3 |
cutthroat kane
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
5
|
Posted - 2017.03.27 23:54:48 -
[104] - Quote
The Avatar is already one of the more common titans. The Molok is just a better version of the Avatar; seems a little OP. |
GOB the Magician
Enlightened Industries Goonswarm Federation
103
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 00:52:56 -
[105] - Quote
Tara Read wrote:Querns wrote:Tara Read wrote:Querns wrote:
Really, now. I think you'll be fine in a PVP scenario without all the projected ECCM and reactor control units you think you might need. You'll just have to make some choices.
The entitlement pile doesn't stop from getting taller around here.
Lol entitlement. No one is entitled to jack. Stop trying to convey functionality for entitlement just because YOU will never fly one. The ship is plenty functional, and has adequate space. Cargohold limitations exist for a reason. Its not a cargo hold its a fleet hangar. Again because the ship is functional it needs space to carry the modules that MAKE it functional.
Don't worry I'm sure in a few years you'll be able to buy more cargo space for your space vessel with microplex . |
Astrid Farnsworth
Broke and Famous
10
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 01:06:00 -
[106] - Quote
I know this is technical stuff but, will this ships have there own designed? Or just name and color change from other caps and fax?
"Amateurs talk about tactics, but professionals study logistics."
- Gen. Robert H. Barrow, USMC (Commandant of the Marine Corps) noted in 1980**strong text**
|
Whale Sex
Patriotic Tendencies Goonswarm Federation
5
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 01:25:30 -
[107] - Quote
With the addition of the Corpse Bay as being a "thing," will we also see this change on the other blood raider ships? |
ight8
Patriotic Tendencies Goonswarm Federation
32
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 01:38:13 -
[108] - Quote
Every ship needs a specialized Corpse bay. This needs to be a thing. |
Tuzy
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
0
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 01:41:21 -
[109] - Quote
Tara Read wrote:[quote=Querns][quote=Tara Read][quote=Querns]
No you're entire groups posting history on this topic is stooped in blatant ignorance and stupidity. I've sat for hours coming up with particular refits, modules, squeezing every last drop of space out of a fleet hangar on a regular Avatar. And I am telling you in it's current state with bonuses to capital nos and neuts (meaning you'd usually have two fitted two stored) you are going to incure an increase of (wait for it) 8000 m3 due to having two of each type of NOS and Nuet. An additional 10,000 m3 due to having two racial phenomena generators, and another 5000 m3 of space for needing to carry an additional racial Doomsday. Then you need an additional 5000 m3 of empty space to refit.
That is a total of 28000 additional m3 needed MINIMUM to have the Moloks capability to refit for its bonuses in a combat situation. Engage your damn brain.
Your shows possessive ownership. You're means "you are".
|
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2816
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 01:52:19 -
[110] - Quote
Tuzy wrote:Tara Read wrote:[quote=Querns][quote=Tara Read][quote=Querns]
No you're entire groups posting history on this topic is stooped in blatant ignorance and stupidity. I've sat for hours coming up with particular refits, modules, squeezing every last drop of space out of a fleet hangar on a regular Avatar. And I am telling you in it's current state with bonuses to capital nos and neuts (meaning you'd usually have two fitted two stored) you are going to incure an increase of (wait for it) 8000 m3 due to having two of each type of NOS and Nuet. An additional 10,000 m3 due to having two racial phenomena generators, and another 5000 m3 of space for needing to carry an additional racial Doomsday. Then you need an additional 5000 m3 of empty space to refit.
That is a total of 28000 additional m3 needed MINIMUM to have the Moloks capability to refit for its bonuses in a combat situation. Engage your damn brain. Your shows possessive ownership. You're means "you are". Eh, cut him some slack. He was clearly flustered, and posting with turbulent emotions. Grammar and accuracy are the first to go.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
|
Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
943
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 02:20:50 -
[111] - Quote
Astrid Farnsworth wrote:I know this is technical stuff but, will this ships have there own designed? Or just name and color change from other caps and fax?
The models themselves will remain the same as their non faction counterparts. |
light heaven
JUST SET TIMES Fraternity.
9
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 02:21:50 -
[112] - Quote
I feel little disappoint about Dagon. It will feel better with 7.5% cap armor remote repair instead of 5%. And a bonus for denfend instead of an extra low slot. This will make Dagon deserve to deploy in battlefield. |
FOl2TY8
Hole Violence Goonswarm Federation
115
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 02:24:06 -
[113] - Quote
cutthroat kane wrote:The Avatar is already one of the more common titans. The Molok is just a better version of the Avatar; seems a little OP.
I agree, maybe a cargohold nerf? |
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2816
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 02:41:45 -
[114] - Quote
The poor Molok, cut down in its prime. No longer to dream of being a clown car, host to an innumerable number of clowns, it must relegate itself to a lesser fate. An ignoble fate. We weep bitter tears as we mourn its passing.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2816
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 02:51:28 -
[115] - Quote
I mean, you could use the corpse bay, but man, there's nothing that kills the mood faster than dead clowns. Yuck.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Retar Aveymone
DJ's Retirement Fund Goonswarm Federation
1085
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 03:38:58 -
[116] - Quote
Tara Read wrote: Its not a cargo hold its a fleet hangar. Again because the ship is functional it needs space to carry the modules that MAKE it functional.
do you not own keepstars or something
do you need us to pass around a collection plate for your poverty-stricken faction titan havers who can't afford a keepstar to dock in to refit |
Callduron
Pandemic Horde Inc. Pandemic Horde
638
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 03:48:29 -
[117] - Quote
You had me at Dagon.
I+ñ! I+ñ! Cthulhu fhtagn!
I write http://stabbedup.blogspot.co.uk/
I post on reddit as /u/callduron.
|
Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
943
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 03:53:35 -
[118] - Quote
Retar Aveymone wrote:Tara Read wrote: Its not a cargo hold its a fleet hangar. Again because the ship is functional it needs space to carry the modules that MAKE it functional.
do you not own keepstars or something do you need us to pass around a collection plate for your poverty-stricken faction titan havers who can't afford a keepstar to dock in to refit
Unlike Goons we tend to deploy on the regular. You may have seen us a few times when you were evicted from the North? Or maybe when a certain Vendetta ate crow? What about the Rorquals almost on the daily that died to us? Naw of course not you were too busy sh@tposting here to defend your own space or your members. At any rate, any capital pilot with half a brain knows you refit IN COMBAT. You refit for certain situations and for adaptability. Not having the space to do so and use the Molok to its full potential is frankly a waste in even owning it in the first place. I know you guys are just trolling this thread for responses but really some of us here are actually pretty stoked at what CCP is releasing and want it to be well worth the investment and the risk when used. |
Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
943
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 04:21:03 -
[119] - Quote
So I've compiled a list of basic modules to illustrate exactly how tight the space is in regards to the Moloks fleet hangar. First we will start at 90k m3 for bare minimum refitting purposes and go from there since you need that space to refit Titan modules. This is assuming you have the following fit: x4 of either a HAW or Anti Capital class beam or pulse weapon. X1 Doomsday (can be any). And x2 Capital class nos or neuts. Mind you this is ONLY dealing with space in regards to capital sized weapons. We aren't even touching the refits you'll have with you as far as tank modules, EWAR, Charges, Fuel and other various items you would carry in a combat scenario.
1. X4 Other Energy type weapons. 4000 m3 x4: 16000 m3.
2. X1 Racial Doomsday. 8000 m3. Lets also say you use two out of the three additional Doomsday devices and carry them with you. X 2 variois DD's: 16000 m3. Total 24000 m3.
3. Phenomena Generators of both races: 16000 m3.
4. X2 other facrion capital Nos or Neut since we have 2 already fit: 8000 m3.
So now that we've added up just the basic capital refits for a standard scenario with NO additional items added be it EWAR or the other items listed we have a grand total of only 26000 m3 remaining, this does not include capital capacitor booster charges or capital prop modules, heavy tackle nothing. Which leaves hardly any sort of wiggle room when it comes to the Titans usability or ability to carry proper combat refits. Let us also say you wanted to do a full neut/nos combination with said titan. You would not have enough space to even consider carrying any sort of full refit. |
TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel
1283
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 06:55:17 -
[120] - Quote
they could reduce the cargo on other capitals |
|
Tappits
North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion
227
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 07:47:07 -
[121] - Quote
Tara Read wrote:Since the Molok has the ability to fit both Doomsday's and Generators of both races those are going to be Massive in wasted m3 space for unpackaged for refitting on the fly. You are talking an extra 10000 m3 or 1/10th of the Moloks entire Fleet Hangar being used for these two modules alone for just one type of race. Let's also not forget the m3 of Capital Nos, Neuts, Capital props, various non racial Doomsday types as well as every other various refit you'll need. Instead of giving the Molok some stupid gimmicky corpse bay half the damn thing and double the Fleet Hangar so we can use the ships versatility. I shouldn't have to fandangle and jumble around a limited fleet hangar for a ship that costs 3x the amount of a regular Titan and stare at a near empty coprse bay.
If Only CCP had not of made this thing Where you can dock Titans which lets you have all the refits you like and you can pick what your fit is before you undock. I cannot remember what there called but there's one Called TrumpsWall in this small northern system which you can use. |
Albert Madullier
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
62
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 09:16:35 -
[122] - Quote
CCP Larrikin wrote:Questions & Answers
Q)Whats with the low fitting attributes and weird fitting bonuses on the Dagon? A) We've done this combination of low fitting attributes and fitting bonuses to Nos and Remote Reps to constrain some of the fitting options a available to the Dagon. We'd like to encourage Nos & Rep fits, and these bonuses do this. Its still possible to go for crazy fitting options but the trade offs are larger.
.
the more you restrict choice, the worse the game becomes |
Lug Muad'Dib
Wise Humans Sword
57
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 10:23:57 -
[123] - Quote
Albert Madullier wrote:CCP Larrikin wrote:Questions & Answers
Q)Whats with the low fitting attributes and weird fitting bonuses on the Dagon? A) We've done this combination of low fitting attributes and fitting bonuses to Nos and Remote Reps to constrain some of the fitting options a available to the Dagon. We'd like to encourage Nos & Rep fits, and these bonuses do this. Its still possible to go for crazy fitting options but the trade offs are larger.
. the more you restrict choice, the worse the game becomes
When your restrict fitting, you have to make choices, and variety is good for the game. |
Tappits
North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion
227
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 10:29:05 -
[124] - Quote
Mr Rive wrote:Can everyone please stop yelling at each other so we can all collectively yell about how poorly the dogon tanks??
We can all agree on that :3 Maybe it's not designed around max tank but maybe other situations that require lower raw tanking and more cap stability. |
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2825
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 10:40:27 -
[125] - Quote
Tara Read wrote: Unlike Goons we tend to deploy on the regular. You may have seen us a few times when you were evicted from the North? Or maybe when a certain Vendetta ate crow? What about the Rorquals almost on the daily that died to us? Naw of course not you were too busy sh@tposting here to defend your own space or your members.
Sure, but you guys didn't use titans for any of the ganks you did in Delve, and had access to keepstars in the north. Looks like you still had the option to refit them before entering combat.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2825
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 10:42:39 -
[126] - Quote
I mean, I get that at the rate that your alliance loses keepstars, it may be a bit of a sour bargain to rely on it, but that's life in Eve Online, noted space-themed spreadsheet.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Juvir
Omega Nebula BattleWorks Requiem Eternal
46
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 10:50:21 -
[127] - Quote
WTB more info on corpse hangars.... |
Retar Aveymone
DJ's Retirement Fund Goonswarm Federation
1085
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 11:22:20 -
[128] - Quote
Tara Read wrote: Unlike Goons we tend to deploy on the regular. You may have seen us a few times when you were evicted from the North? Or maybe when a certain Vendetta ate crow? What about the Rorquals almost on the daily that died to us? Naw of course not you were too busy sh@tposting here to defend your own space or your members. At any rate, any capital pilot with half a brain knows you refit IN COMBAT. You refit for certain situations and for adaptability. Not having the space to do so and use the Molok to its full potential is frankly a waste in even owning it in the first place. I know you guys are just trolling this thread for responses but really some of us here are actually pretty stoked at what CCP is releasing and want it to be well worth the investment and the risk when used.
so that's a yes on that you're rattling a tin can for a keepstar because you literally cannot bear to not have enough space to change your fit? |
Joe Barbarian
I'm fine and You aren't Goonswarm Federation
4
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 11:49:28 -
[129] - Quote
Tara Read wrote:So I've compiled a list of basic modules to illustrate exactly how tight the space is in regards to the Moloks fleet hangar. First we will start at 90k m3 for bare minimum refitting purposes and go from there since you need that space to refit Titan modules. This is assuming you have the following fit: x4 of either a HAW or Anti Capital class beam or pulse weapon. X1 Doomsday (can be any). And x2 Capital class nos or neuts. Mind you this is ONLY dealing with space in regards to capital sized weapons. We aren't even touching the refits you'll have with you as far as tank modules, EWAR, Charges, Fuel and other various items you would carry in a combat scenario.
1. X4 Other Energy type weapons. 4000 m3 x4: 16000 m3.
2. X1 Racial Doomsday. 8000 m3. Lets also say you use two out of the three additional Doomsday devices and carry them with you. X 2 various DD's: 16000 m3. Total 24000 m3.
3. Phenomena Generators of both races: 16000 m3.
4. X2 other faction capital Nos or Neut since we have 2 already fit: 8000 m3.
5. Jump Portal Generator: 10000 m3.
So now that we've added up just the basic capital refits for a standard scenario with NO additional items added be it EWAR or the other items listed we have a grand total of only 16000 m3 remaining, this does not include capital capacitor booster charges or capital prop modules, heavy tackle nothing. Which leaves hardly any sort of wiggle room when it comes to the Titans usability or ability to carry proper combat refits. Let us also say you wanted to do a full neut/nos combination with said titan. You would not have enough space to even consider carrying any sort of full refit.
Question: But do you really need a jump portal generator? Do you really need both Phenomena Generators? Can you not balance both the nos and neuts in the cargo depending from undocking?
After reading through this entire thread of the slap fight between you and querns you're failing to understand his point. You're trying to get your point across that you NEED this space but you are failing to explain why and degrading yourself to petty insults.
What if CCP says no will you insult them and question theirs parents sexual habbits or will you try and explain your case. Devs will read this thread and see your degrading posts and how inadequate you are at providing a suitable case to have a JF with guns.
E: I'll be honest, i'm still new to supers / titans and I spend time thinking on how I can make it all fit and what I could do with in combat and whats a luxury module for my PvE activity(s) When I go PvE I drop some of those essential PvP modules in my cargo when I PvP I drop some of these essential PvE modules. Honestly I'd love to have space for everything and turn my ship into a personal space station, but I can't and I understand why. |
Retar Aveymone
DJ's Retirement Fund Goonswarm Federation
1086
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 12:37:06 -
[130] - Quote
maybe if you JUST CANT DECIDE WHAT TITAN FIT TO USE and it causes seven pages of rageposting just stop being poor and get two titans |
|
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2828
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 12:51:25 -
[131] - Quote
Or a personal keepstar. Having one is cheaper than a Molok.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Aleverette
Peoples Liberation Army Goonswarm Federation
10
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 12:53:53 -
[132] - Quote
Have fun messing with faction caps whatever you CCP want :D Good new toyz though.
I still doubt if anyone would buy a 20b dread/fax and have some "pvp^200" fun on it. |
KillCamSpecteR
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
9
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 12:55:24 -
[133] - Quote
Useless ships for 90% of the players . Faction Battlecruisers when ?
|
Aleverette
Peoples Liberation Army Goonswarm Federation
10
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 13:02:09 -
[134] - Quote
KillCamSpecteR wrote:Useless ships for 90% of the players . Pirate faction Battlecruisers when ?
Faction caps are useless to EVE :) Even to those who obtain one. |
Joe Barbarian
I'm fine and You aren't Goonswarm Federation
4
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 13:04:00 -
[135] - Quote
Aleverette wrote:KillCamSpecteR wrote:Useless ships for 90% of the players . Pirate faction Battlecruisers when ? Faction caps are useless to EVE :) Even those that are existing.
Wasn't this once said about T1 capitals? |
Aleverette
Peoples Liberation Army Goonswarm Federation
10
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 13:13:07 -
[136] - Quote
Joe Barbarian wrote:Aleverette wrote:KillCamSpecteR wrote:Useless ships for 90% of the players . Pirate faction Battlecruisers when ? Faction caps are useless to EVE :) Even those that are existing. Wasn't this once said about T1 capitals?
If I have another 20b, I am pretty sure I would buy another t1 super carrier instead of a faction dread. My decision won't change over time :) |
Cristl
587
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 13:49:16 -
[137] - Quote
So the titan could have 60 effective capital energy weapons. Whew. Maintain transversal! |
ISD Chanisa Nemes
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
104
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 14:00:28 -
[138] - Quote
Deleted several offensive and off-topic posts. Please be respectful guys!
ISD Chanisa Nemes
Lieutenant
Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)
Interstellar Services Department
|
Aleverette
Peoples Liberation Army Goonswarm Federation
10
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 14:23:23 -
[139] - Quote
Cristl wrote:So the titan could have 60 effective capital energy weapons. Whew. Maintain transversal!
Surprisingly the dps is as same as a max skill avatar :)
|
Bronson Hughes
The Knights of the Blessed Mother of Acceleration
3107
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 14:52:53 -
[140] - Quote
Tara Read wrote:Which leaves hardly any sort of wiggle room when it comes to the Titans usability or ability to carry proper combat refits. I think I've found your problem. CCP is on record as wanting to force people to make fitting choices prior to initiating combat instead of being easy to refit while in combat. You're complaining about a new ship not having an ability that CCP has been trying to limit.
Relatively Notorious By Association
My Many Misadventures
I predicted FAUXs
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Cristl
587
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 15:24:03 -
[141] - Quote
Aleverette wrote:Cristl wrote:So the titan could have 60 effective capital energy weapons. Whew. Maintain transversal! Surprisingly the dps is as same as a max skill avatar :) Good point. Multiplying by 5 is tricky
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Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
944
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 15:36:07 -
[142] - Quote
Tappits wrote:Tara Read wrote:Since the Molok has the ability to fit both Doomsday's and Generators of both races those are going to be Massive in wasted m3 space for unpackaged for refitting on the fly. You are talking an extra 10000 m3 or 1/10th of the Moloks entire Fleet Hangar being used for these two modules alone for just one type of race. Let's also not forget the m3 of Capital Nos, Neuts, Capital props, various non racial Doomsday types as well as every other various refit you'll need. Instead of giving the Molok some stupid gimmicky corpse bay half the damn thing and double the Fleet Hangar so we can use the ships versatility. I shouldn't have to fandangle and jumble around a limited fleet hangar for a ship that costs 3x the amount of a regular Titan and stare at a near empty coprse bay. If Only CCP had not of made this thing Where you can dock Titans which lets you have all the refits you like and you can pick what your fit is before you undock. I cannot remember what there called but there's one Called TrumpsWall in this small northern system which you can use.
That doesn't matter in an evolving battlefield especially when you are flying something like a Molok. Depending upon a Keepstar when YOU should know this we deploy beyond and well outside of Keepstars is a terrible compromise when a ship that is bonused for capital sized nuets and nos along with two racial types of DD and Phenomenon Generators cannot carry them let alone refit in battle. If a ship is bonused for something would it not ideally be prudent to carry said modules the ship is bonused for? Only recently has CCP fixed things like that Nestor issue in terms of refitting.
The Molok is the only Titan that is specifically bonused for Capital sized Neuts and Nos with enough utility highs to use them. Carrying those extra mods is a pain. Or have you forgotten how tight it is with Fleet Hangar sizes? Saying "hurr durr we have a Keepstar" fails on two points:
1. You cannot actively engage in combat with several fittings and limits your adaptability in the field.
2. Relying upon a Keepstar to even be able to use said Ship. This also applies to ALL Titans. It would be better if CCP reduced the m3 of the DD"s and modules like the Jump Portal. It would save a lot of headache. |
Mr Rive
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
152
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 15:49:25 -
[143] - Quote
Tappits wrote:Mr Rive wrote:Can everyone please stop yelling at each other so we can all collectively yell about how poorly the dogon tanks??
We can all agree on that :3 Maybe it's not designed around max tank but maybe other situations that require lower raw tanking and more cap stability.
It isn't anywhere near cap stable. That's the problem. The cycle time bonus of the remote reps means it is absolutely necessary to fit cap boosters, or something stupid like a single remote rep and 4 NOS, which will JUST about work.
As for the tank, You can get an apostle cap stable with a single faction local rep, which will likely tank as much if not more than a dogon. For like a quarter of the price.
It just makes no sense. Not as a FAX anyway. |
Siginek
BAND of MAGNUS CeskoSlovenska Aliance
23
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 16:12:56 -
[144] - Quote
Mr Rive wrote:What would I personally do with it? Well, this is a start:
Amarr Carrier Bonus: 30% bonus to Energy Nosferatu drain amount, optimal range and falloff. 4% bonus to all armor resistances 5% bonus to maximum capacitor pool
Minmatar Carrier Bonus: 5% bonus to Remote Armor Repairer cycle time 7.5% bonus to Armor Repairer amount 10% bonus to capacitor booster charge strength
Role Bonus: Can fit a Triage module Can use two Command Burst modules Energy Nosferatu fitted to this ship will drain targeted ship's capacitor regardless of your own capacitor level 90% reduction in powergrid requirements for Capital Remote Armor Repairers 90% reduction in CPU requirements for Energy Nosferatu 50% reduction in CPU requirements for Command Burst modules 200% bonus to Command Burst area of effect range 200% bonus to Logistics Drone transfer amount 5x penalty to Entosis Link duration
i dont think any faction or price can justify something this much OP ... actual faxes are way too strong alredy, and you would give this thing literally every bonsu faxes have now? those rep bonuses would double its RR power compared to other faxes, while simultaneously having immunity to can warfare thanks to booster bonuses and quite strong tank thanks to resist bonuses and 8 low slots all availabel for tank mods thanks to cap boosters ... this would be literal incarnation of OPness like EVE havent seen yet
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CCP Larrikin
C C P C C P Alliance
719
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 16:12:59 -
[145] - Quote
Hi Space Friends, please check the OP, some updates have been made!
Update (2017-03-28 1610)
- Added local repair bonus to Dagon
- Reduced Corpse bays for all
Game Designer | Team Phenomenon | https://twitter.com/CCP_Larrikin
|
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Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2830
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 16:24:40 -
[146] - Quote
The poor corpse bay. *sniff* I'll miss your largeness, even if it was mechanically impossible to actually fill them.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Astrid Farnsworth
Broke and Famous
10
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 16:40:34 -
[147] - Quote
Tara Read wrote:Astrid Farnsworth wrote:I know this is technical stuff but, will this ships have there own designed? Or just name and color change from other caps and fax? The models themselves will remain the same as their non faction counterparts.
Sucks, I know it take a lot of time but new ships designe would be so good. and people would go for them because they look different.
"Amateurs talk about tactics, but professionals study logistics."
- Gen. Robert H. Barrow, USMC (Commandant of the Marine Corps) noted in 1980**strong text**
|
Joe Barbarian
I'm fine and You aren't Goonswarm Federation
4
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 16:51:05 -
[148] - Quote
Aleverette wrote:Joe Barbarian wrote:Aleverette wrote:KillCamSpecteR wrote:Useless ships for 90% of the players . Pirate faction Battlecruisers when ? Faction caps are useless to EVE :) Even those that are existing. Wasn't this once said about T1 capitals? T1 caps and their faction variants are completely two business I think. If I have another 20b, I am pretty sure I would buy another t1 super carrier instead of a faction dread. My decision won't change over time :) After all, with that many years have passed, did Revenant become useful in cap battles?
I don't think you got what I meant. I've only heard rumors go going back 7-9 years back when capital battle weren't even a thing because they cost so much to build that owning one was a complete secret.
One day the same will happen to todays factions capitals, we'll throw them away like they are T1 dreadnoughts. |
Tappits
North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion
227
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 17:03:45 -
[149] - Quote
CCP Larrikin wrote:Hi Space Friends, please check the OP, some updates have been made! Update (2017-03-28 1610)- Added local repair bonus to Dagon
- Reduced Corpse bays for all
You Caved to Mr Rive, #2017 |
Rowells
ANZAC ALLIANCE Mercenary Coalition
3176
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 17:35:09 -
[150] - Quote
CCP Larrikin wrote:Hi Space Friends, please check the OP, some updates have been made! Update (2017-03-28 1610)- Added local repair bonus to Dagon
- Reduced Corpse bays for all
Riot |
|
Cristl
587
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 17:50:31 -
[151] - Quote
Rowells wrote:CCP Larrikin wrote:Hi Space Friends, please check the OP, some updates have been made! Update (2017-03-28 1610)- Added local repair bonus to Dagon
- Reduced Corpse bays for all
Riot They have enough of our devs.
|
Duke Dread
Northern Syndicate. Rate My Ticks
0
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 19:30:18 -
[152] - Quote
Please give the Fax the apostle resistance bonus. Without that it is complete trash sadly. |
Atum' Ra
Nomen-illis-Legio Legion of xXDEATHXx
108
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 20:19:33 -
[153] - Quote
CCP you are very funny. For the first, these ships will cost trillion isks that's why nobody will use them in real battle. neut/nosf titan... really? Where you think to use it? If you don't know I can open your eyes about using of titans: only a HIT and RUN tactic! The only purpose of all Titans right now is a portal for small ships. Looks very stupid how 40 ships can destroy a dred when they are smaller than cartridge shell the target
CCP please rename EVE to Frigates online remove all caps and supers. Do not need to disgrace yourself |
Mirian Elnara
Nomen-illis-Legio Legion of xXDEATHXx
2
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 20:30:25 -
[154] - Quote
Joe Barbarian wrote:Aleverette wrote:Joe Barbarian wrote:Aleverette wrote:KillCamSpecteR wrote:Useless ships for 90% of the players . Pirate faction Battlecruisers when ? Faction caps are useless to EVE :) Even those that are existing. Wasn't this once said about T1 capitals? T1 caps and their faction variants are completely two business I think. If I have another 20b, I am pretty sure I would buy another t1 super carrier instead of a faction dread. My decision won't change over time :) After all, with that many years have passed, did Revenant become useful in cap battles? I don't think you got what I meant. I've only heard rumors go going back 7-9 years back when capital battle weren't even a thing because they cost so much to build that owning one was a complete secret. One day the same will happen to todays factions capitals, we'll throw them away like they are T1 dreadnoughts.
In the past titans were strong. They had AOE DD. Now they are just a portal I don't really understand the matter of using faction caps/titans. they are 5% better than T1 and much more expensive. Unless to measure whom has longer. |
Mr Rive
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
152
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 20:53:39 -
[155] - Quote
CCP Larrikin wrote:Hi Space Friends, please check the OP, some updates have been made! Update (2017-03-28 1610)- Added local repair bonus to Dagon
- Reduced Corpse bays for all
That is slightly better. Before, the dagon tanked less than an apostle, now it will likely local tank a little more.
Myself and mukk ran the numbers for the dagon, and even with a full 8 low passive fit, the native resist bonus on the apostle means a 7 low passive fit on the apostle tanks significantly more.
I still seriously think you're going to run into problems with cap. That cycle time bonus is going to kill it. I suggest looking at a ninazu with 2 remote reps running to see what I mean. It's also likely never going to be as practical in normal settings as a lif.
Is there a particular reason you don't want to give it three bonuses per race?
Let me put it this way, a PRACTICAL, full tank, full pimp lif tanks 160k dps unheated. This is going to tank MAYBE 120.
I'm like 100% confident this isn't going to be used anywhere like what you intend it to be used for. |
Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
3267
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 20:54:41 -
[156] - Quote
CCP Larrikin wrote:Hi Space Friends, please check the OP, some updates have been made! Update (2017-03-28 1610)- Added local repair bonus to Dagon
- Reduced Corpse bays for all
Any comment on the hangar size debate so we can put it to rest? |
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2833
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 23:00:47 -
[157] - Quote
Mr Rive wrote:CCP Larrikin wrote:Hi Space Friends, please check the OP, some updates have been made! Update (2017-03-28 1610)- Added local repair bonus to Dagon
- Reduced Corpse bays for all
That is slightly better. Before, the dagon tanked less than an apostle, now it will likely local tank a little more. Myself and mukk ran the numbers for the dagon, and even with a full 8 low passive fit, the native resist bonus on the apostle means a 7 low passive fit on the apostle tanks significantly more. I still seriously think you're going to run into problems with cap. That cycle time bonus is going to kill it. I suggest looking at a ninazu with 2 remote reps running to see what I mean. It's also likely never going to be as practical in normal settings as a lif. Is there a particular reason you don't want to give it three bonuses per race? Let me put it this way, a PRACTICAL, full tank, full pimp lif tanks 160k dps unheated. This is going to tank MAYBE 120. I'm like 100% confident this isn't going to be used anywhere like what you intend it to be used for.
You're comparing an active shield tank to an active armor tank?
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Xercodo
Savage Moon Society
4316
|
Posted - 2017.03.28 23:33:36 -
[158] - Quote
We need a blood raider SC with a bonus to the effective radius of web bursts >:3
Also CCPls Sisi?! When?!
The Drake is a Lie
|
ITTigerClawIK
Galactic Rangers EVEolution.
483
|
Posted - 2017.03.29 00:13:32 -
[159] - Quote
CORPSE BAY EXPLAIN NOW !!!! O_O |
Mr Rive
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
152
|
Posted - 2017.03.29 00:25:39 -
[160] - Quote
Querns wrote:Mr Rive wrote:CCP Larrikin wrote:Hi Space Friends, please check the OP, some updates have been made! Update (2017-03-28 1610)- Added local repair bonus to Dagon
- Reduced Corpse bays for all
That is slightly better. Before, the dagon tanked less than an apostle, now it will likely local tank a little more. Myself and mukk ran the numbers for the dagon, and even with a full 8 low passive fit, the native resist bonus on the apostle means a 7 low passive fit on the apostle tanks significantly more. I still seriously think you're going to run into problems with cap. That cycle time bonus is going to kill it. I suggest looking at a ninazu with 2 remote reps running to see what I mean. It's also likely never going to be as practical in normal settings as a lif. Is there a particular reason you don't want to give it three bonuses per race? Let me put it this way, a PRACTICAL, full tank, full pimp lif tanks 160k dps unheated. This is going to tank MAYBE 120. I'm like 100% confident this isn't going to be used anywhere like what you intend it to be used for. You're comparing an active shield tank to an active armor tank?
No I'm comparing an active tanking ship that remotes reps armor to another active tanking ship that remote reps armor.
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Mr Rive
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
152
|
Posted - 2017.03.29 00:30:59 -
[161] - Quote
Siginek wrote:Mr Rive wrote:What would I personally do with it? Well, this is a start:
Amarr Carrier Bonus: 30% bonus to Energy Nosferatu drain amount, optimal range and falloff. 4% bonus to all armor resistances 5% bonus to maximum capacitor pool
Minmatar Carrier Bonus: 5% bonus to Remote Armor Repairer cycle time 7.5% bonus to Armor Repairer amount 10% bonus to capacitor booster charge strength
Role Bonus: Can fit a Triage module Can use two Command Burst modules Energy Nosferatu fitted to this ship will drain targeted ship's capacitor regardless of your own capacitor level 90% reduction in powergrid requirements for Capital Remote Armor Repairers 90% reduction in CPU requirements for Energy Nosferatu 50% reduction in CPU requirements for Command Burst modules 200% bonus to Command Burst area of effect range 200% bonus to Logistics Drone transfer amount 5x penalty to Entosis Link duration i dont think any faction or price can justify something this much OP ... actual faxes are way too strong alredy, and you would give this thing literally every bonus faxes have now? those rep bonuses would double its RR power compared to other faxes, while simultaneously having immunity to cap warfare thanks to booster bonuses and quite strong tank thanks to resist bonuses and 8 low slots all availabel for tank mods thanks to cap boosters ... this would be literal incarnation of OPness like EVE havent seen yet
This just isn't true. It would have the same RR power as a ninazu. As for it's local tank, you're looking at about a similar tank to how shield FAX tank. At the very most, you won't be looking at much more than a fully pimp lif or ninazu tanks, for like 1/5th the cost.
FAX really aren't that overpowered. You just have to know how to deal with them. People who think FAX are OP generally don't fly them, and don't realize their weaknesses and how just goddamn squishy and hard to fly they are.
Honestly, for a hull cost of between 15-20b, it would be nice if the ship I'm buying has a reasonable chance to survive longer than a t1 fit ninazu...
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Mr Rive
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
152
|
Posted - 2017.03.29 00:33:58 -
[162] - Quote
For the record, I don't want the thing to be OP, that would be boring. I just want to be able to justify buying one for the job it is designed to do, namely triage reps.
All it is right now is a e-peen. The other faction capitals in the game make sense to buy, especially the revenant.
|
Aleverette
Peoples Liberation Army Goonswarm Federation
10
|
Posted - 2017.03.29 01:07:06 -
[163] - Quote
Joe Barbarian wrote:Aleverette wrote:Joe Barbarian wrote:Aleverette wrote:KillCamSpecteR wrote:Useless ships for 90% of the players . Pirate faction Battlecruisers when ? Faction caps are useless to EVE :) Even those that are existing. Wasn't this once said about T1 capitals? T1 caps and their faction variants are completely two business I think. If I have another 20b, I am pretty sure I would buy another t1 super carrier instead of a faction dread. My decision won't change over time :) After all, with that many years have passed, did Revenant become useful in cap battles? I don't think you got what I meant. I've only heard rumors go going back 7-9 years back when capital battle weren't even a thing because they cost so much to build that owning one was a complete secret. One day the same will happen to todays factions capitals, we'll throw them away like they are T1 dreadnoughts.
I totally know your point, but unlike t1 capitals, those faction caps offer no more utilities other than fanciness.
For example: a nyx is more tanky than a vehement, packed with more firepower against both caps and subcaps, more utility, even more cargohold, nor to say with so many keeps around it is so easy to own a super.
But they cost the same, WHY CCP? So why the heck I would pick a vehement over a nyx? Nor to say probably vehement itself is a giant taunt that cannot be remotely repped. |
Mr Rive
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
152
|
Posted - 2017.03.29 01:45:52 -
[164] - Quote
Yeah, that would be another way to do it. Significantly dropping the price of faction capitals would incentivise their use.
Why when faction battleships cost between 2-3x as much as t1 battleships, should faction carriers/dreads/fax cost 15x as much? |
Lelob
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
247
|
Posted - 2017.03.29 04:42:49 -
[165] - Quote
1. Does the web bonus affect grapplers?
2. If a ship is good enough, people will give 0 ***** about the price tag on it. Price is a bullshit excuse. You want to incentivize the use of faction capitals? Remove jump fatigue completely from them and give them the old 12ly range. Problem solved. |
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CCP Larrikin
C C P C C P Alliance
722
|
Posted - 2017.03.29 09:57:51 -
[166] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:Any comment on the hangar size debate so we can put it to rest?
Sure, we're happy with the existing fleet hanger size. Its the same as the Vanquisher.
Game Designer | Team Phenomenon | https://twitter.com/CCP_Larrikin
|
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Bronson Hughes
The Knights of the Blessed Mother of Acceleration
3107
|
Posted - 2017.03.29 11:25:23 -
[167] - Quote
Lelob wrote:1. Does the web bonus affect grapplers? Currently, bonuses to webs do not apply to grapplers.
If they did, Vindis, and to a lesser extent Bagglehorns, would be OP AF.
Relatively Notorious By Association
My Many Misadventures
I predicted FAUXs
|
Zesty Memes II
ShekelSquad Interhole Revenue Service
0
|
Posted - 2017.03.29 11:56:25 -
[168] - Quote
Bronson Hughes wrote:Lelob wrote:1. Does the web bonus affect grapplers? Currently, bonuses to webs do not apply to grapplers. If they did, Vindis, and to a lesser extent Bagglehorns, would be OP AF.
they would also give the ship the are grappling a negative speed
|
Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
944
|
Posted - 2017.03.29 12:05:04 -
[169] - Quote
CCP Larrikin wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:Any comment on the hangar size debate so we can put it to rest? Sure, we're happy with the existing fleet hanger size. Its the same as the Vanquisher.
What about a change to packaged vs unpackaged Titan modules in regards to m3 size? That way it's at least easier to carry refits and doesn't conflict with the design of unpackaged modules and refitting due to fleet hangar constraints? |
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2835
|
Posted - 2017.03.29 12:27:08 -
[170] - Quote
CCP Larrikin wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:Any comment on the hangar size debate so we can put it to rest? Sure, we're happy with the existing fleet hanger size. Its the same as the Vanquisher. Fair.
A question to the thread as a whole; did we have this sort of, uh, "conversation" with the Serpentis capitals?
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
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Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
3267
|
Posted - 2017.03.29 12:57:34 -
[171] - Quote
Querns wrote:CCP Larrikin wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:Any comment on the hangar size debate so we can put it to rest? Sure, we're happy with the existing fleet hanger size. Its the same as the Vanquisher. Fair. A question to the thread as a whole; did we have this sort of, uh, "conversation" with the Serpentis capitals?
I guess it was a bit less of a problem because webs are not capital sized mods so the cut to the usual carry-on toolbox was not as drastic. |
Spc One
The Chodak Void Alliance
313
|
Posted - 2017.03.29 15:46:12 -
[172] - Quote
Zesty Memes II wrote:Bronson Hughes wrote:Lelob wrote:1. Does the web bonus affect grapplers? Currently, bonuses to webs do not apply to grapplers. If they did, Vindis, and to a lesser extent Bagglehorns, would be OP AF. they would also give the ship the are grappling a negative speed Not really, max in eve is 99.9% you can't go past that and even that is impossible to achieve. Same with hardeners, you can't go past 99% resists no matter what you do. |
Ncc 1709
Fusion Enterprises Ltd Badfellas Inc.
360
|
Posted - 2017.03.29 16:25:00 -
[173] - Quote
CCP Larrikin any plans to revisit the nos strength on the Dagon ?
it really does need to be much stronger (or have an internal multiplier) to make it a viable option for the ship |
Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
3267
|
Posted - 2017.03.29 17:01:03 -
[174] - Quote
Spc One wrote:Zesty Memes II wrote:Bronson Hughes wrote:Lelob wrote:1. Does the web bonus affect grapplers? Currently, bonuses to webs do not apply to grapplers. If they did, Vindis, and to a lesser extent Bagglehorns, would be OP AF. they would also give the ship the are grappling a negative speed Not really, max in eve is 99.9% you can't go past that and even that is impossible to achieve. Same with hardeners, you can't go past 99% resists no matter what you do.
That's mostly because of how staking of mods is handled. In the case of a grappler, a single mod could end up with a value over 130%. A range bonus would not break things but a strength probably would. I'm kind of curious if CCP at least tested it for **** and giggles. |
Ncc 1709
Fusion Enterprises Ltd Badfellas Inc.
360
|
Posted - 2017.03.29 17:49:04 -
[175] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:Spc One wrote:Zesty Memes II wrote:Bronson Hughes wrote:Lelob wrote:1. Does the web bonus affect grapplers? Currently, bonuses to webs do not apply to grapplers. If they did, Vindis, and to a lesser extent Bagglehorns, would be OP AF. they would also give the ship the are grappling a negative speed Not really, max in eve is 99.9% you can't go past that and even that is impossible to achieve. Same with hardeners, you can't go past 99% resists no matter what you do. That's mostly because of how staking of mods is handled. In the case of a grappler, a single mod could end up with a value over 130%. A range bonus would not break things but a strength probably would. I'm kind of curious if CCP at least tested it for **** and giggles. negative value items over 100% have been tested before.... it gave unlimited gun range and perfect tracking |
Cade Windstalker
1180
|
Posted - 2017.03.29 19:09:35 -
[176] - Quote
Spc One wrote:Not really, max in eve is 99.9% you can't go past that and even that is impossible to achieve. Same with hardeners, you can't go past 99% resists no matter what you do.
Actually, funny thing, you can!
The caps are soft, not hard, except in very specific and hard-coded circumstances. If they roll over (generally due to rounding) you end up with, um, 'funny' results.
Like the DST that infamously managed to get over 100% resists, got shot, and took infinite damage and exploded!
Presumably without a similar hard limit on web speed reductions a Vindi-bonused grappler would result in a ship very briefly going infinity miles per hour, shooting out of web range, and slowing down somewhere around the next star system over... |
Mr Rive
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
153
|
Posted - 2017.03.29 20:30:42 -
[177] - Quote
OKAY seen as it seems to make a difference when I post hard math, let me do the math on the NOSing bonuses real quick.
So, each faction NOS you fit on the dagon gains you 100c/sec.
For local reppers, a DB capital armor repper (local) uses up 111.1 cap/sec.
For remote reppers, the bonused reps of the dagon uses up 413 cap/sec.
So, if you wanted to run the Dagon as a remote armor rep boat, to keep it cap stable using the NOS, you would need at least 4 NOS PER capital remote armor rep. As the Dagon has 6 highslots, this means you would have 1 RR, 4 NOS, and 1 Triage mod in the highs, if you wanted to be stable running ONLY the remote rep.
You would need one NOS per local armor rep you fitted.
This is all assuming you are not getting neuted.
So how would a dagon look with the current stats?
Assuming you fit 2 remote reps, and 3 capital nos, with consistent repping, the dagon still has a defecit of 700 cap/sec.
A capital capacitor booster, ignoring reload, gives you ~250 cap/sec.
Assuming your dagon looks like this:
[Dagon, Dagon fit]
Dark Blood Capital Armor Repairer Dark Blood Capital Armor Repairer Dark Blood Capital Armor Repairer Syndicate Damage Control Corpus X-Type Armor Explosive Hardener Corpus X-Type Armor Kinetic Hardener Corpus X-Type Armor Thermal Hardener Corpum A-Type Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane
Capital Capacitor Booster II Capital Compact Pb-Acid Cap Battery Capital Compact Pb-Acid Cap Battery True Sansha Cap Recharger
True Sansha Capital Energy Nosferatu True Sansha Capital Energy Nosferatu True Sansha Capital Energy Nosferatu Triage Module II CONCORD Capital Remote Armor Repairer CONCORD Capital Remote Armor Repairer
Capital Nanobot Accelerator II Capital Nanobot Accelerator II Capital Auxiliary Nano Pump I
You are still going to have way in excess of a 300 cap/sec defecit running the remote reppers. The local reppers ~should~ be fine, sort of.
So even WITH the NOS bonus the Dagon gets, you're still going to be constantly chewing through cap boosters in order to keep your cap up, even before getting neuted.
And before anyone says 'but you dont run your remote reppers ALL the time duh' you probably haven't been in the kind of fights I have been in with FAX then, because mine are going constantly. |
Mr Rive
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
153
|
Posted - 2017.03.29 20:36:43 -
[178] - Quote
So I guess the question is, are you happy with it not being stable on the remote reppers @larrkin? If someone if truly going to use this in fights, ESPECIALLY in wormhole space, where neuts abound like crazy, a single bhaal fitted with 7 neuts completely negates the bonus the Dagon gets to NOS.
My suggestion would be, if you really want to make the Dagon cap stable under it's noses, you have another look at the bonuses you're giving it. Realistically, a cap boosting lif or ninazu is FAR more resistant to neuts than the Dagon is.
Why?
A ninazu, using a single capital capacitor booster, has the same cap regen potential as a Dagon with 4 capital NOS (the cap booster gives 400 cap/sec.
Not only that, but the cycle time on the cap booster is better. |
Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
3269
|
Posted - 2017.03.30 00:02:24 -
[179] - Quote
Cade Windstalker wrote:Spc One wrote:Not really, max in eve is 99.9% you can't go past that and even that is impossible to achieve. Same with hardeners, you can't go past 99% resists no matter what you do. Actually, funny thing, you can! The caps are soft, not hard, except in very specific and hard-coded circumstances. If they roll over (generally due to rounding) you end up with, um, 'funny' results. Like the DST that infamously managed to get over 100% resists, got shot, and took infinite damage and exploded! Presumably without a similar hard limit on web speed reductions a Vindi-bonused grappler would result in a ship very briefly going infinity miles per hour, shooting out of web range, and slowing down somewhere around the next star system over...
That's a whole new level of "slingshot it into warp". |
Mr Rive
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
153
|
Posted - 2017.03.30 00:06:16 -
[180] - Quote
Also, another thing, why do they need to cost so bloody much?
If you look at any other faction ship in game, including faction titans, theyre like 2-3 times the cost of a t1 variant.
They aren't super OP, so making them cost that much just means people won't use them as anything other than a space penis.
If they cost closer to the 5b mark, they might actually be viable and practical ships to use, even though that would still be expensive, it would be great to actually be able to use them. |
|
sens1
Pandemic Horde Inc. Pandemic Horde
10
|
Posted - 2017.03.30 04:56:50 -
[181] - Quote
Is it intended that the dread does not have the armor or turret capacitor bonuses the revelation does? Without these its basically a useless, capless, anemic brick. |
Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc Test Alliance Please Ignore
3052
|
Posted - 2017.03.30 07:47:26 -
[182] - Quote
Ncc 1709 wrote:I was hoping for Doomday on the dread :(
The nos bonus on the Fax isnt enough
It needs to be 50% or 100% per level to make it properly useful Better yet, a Blood Raiders faction capital nosferatu.
The titan needs a doomsday that sucks ships capacitor dry and then causes them to deal damage around themselves based on the capacitor they lost.
FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."
Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."
|
Justin Cody
Hard Knocks Inc. Hard Knocks Citizens
355
|
Posted - 2017.03.30 08:30:07 -
[183] - Quote
sens1 wrote:Is it intended that the dread does not have the armor or turret capacitor bonuses the revelation does? Without these its basically a useless, capless, anemic brick.
Use the force...erm Nos I mean use the nos! |
Aleverette
Peoples Liberation Army Goonswarm Federation
10
|
Posted - 2017.03.30 11:08:51 -
[184] - Quote
sens1 wrote:Is it intended that the dread does not have the armor or turret capacitor bonuses the revelation does? Without these its basically a useless, capless, anemic brick.
Because the best use of it is a full buffer fit. Forget about turrents, noses, neuts and the siege module.
The mission of this ship is to drag as much as firepower as possible.
----Trash talk created by CCP's bad game design. |
Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
944
|
Posted - 2017.03.30 11:22:06 -
[185] - Quote
Reaver Glitterstim wrote:Ncc 1709 wrote:I was hoping for Doomday on the dread :(
The nos bonus on the Fax isnt enough
It needs to be 50% or 100% per level to make it properly useful Better yet, a Blood Raiders faction capital nosferatu. The titan needs a doomsday that sucks ships capacitor dry and then causes them to deal damage around themselves based on the capacitor they lost.
So an AOE DD mutiplied by the flat capacitor they lose? An interesting concept but not something I think CCP will impliment. It would be an awesome weapon though! |
Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc Test Alliance Please Ignore
3052
|
Posted - 2017.03.30 16:08:51 -
[186] - Quote
Tara Read wrote:So an AOE DD mutiplied by the flat capacitor they lose? An interesting concept but not something I think CCP will impliment. It would be an awesome weapon though! It could have an effect pattern determined by the weapon, and all damage done to a given ship in the DD path would be dealt based on the capacitor lost by the previous ship in its path. So the first ship hit would take no damage, and the last ship hit would deal no damage.
FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."
Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."
|
Cade Windstalker
1188
|
Posted - 2017.03.30 17:22:24 -
[187] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:Cade Windstalker wrote:Spc One wrote:Not really, max in eve is 99.9% you can't go past that and even that is impossible to achieve. Same with hardeners, you can't go past 99% resists no matter what you do. Actually, funny thing, you can! The caps are soft, not hard, except in very specific and hard-coded circumstances. If they roll over (generally due to rounding) you end up with, um, 'funny' results. Like the DST that infamously managed to get over 100% resists, got shot, and took infinite damage and exploded! Presumably without a similar hard limit on web speed reductions a Vindi-bonused grappler would result in a ship very briefly going infinity miles per hour, shooting out of web range, and slowing down somewhere around the next star system over... That's a whole new level of "slingshot it into warp".
I'm now imagining a ship aligning, getting webbed, shooting to Plaid, finally slowing down on the *other* side of the warp destination, and having to either stop and turn around to warp or literally warping backwards as it hits the velocity required to enter warp finally and the original warp algorithm kicks in...
CCPls let me test this on Sisi! Please!?!!?!?! |
HandelsPharmi
Pharmi on CharBazaar
1837
|
Posted - 2017.03.30 19:37:56 -
[188] - Quote
Well on the one side, the Molok needs more capacitor compared to the Avatar (up to 50 % reduction in cap use for energy turrets) and on the other side, for Cap NEUTs, it will need much more capacitor to be effective.
Capacitor pool is close to the Avatar (145 TJ compared with 135 TJ) at the same recharge time = around 7 % higher recharge rate
|
Cade Windstalker
1191
|
Posted - 2017.03.30 21:04:25 -
[189] - Quote
HandelsPharmi wrote:Well on the one side, the Molok needs more capacitor compared to the Avatar (up to 50 % reduction in cap use for energy turrets) and on the other side, for Cap NEUTs, it will need much more capacitor to be effective.
Capacitor pool is close to the Avatar (145 TJ compared with 135 TJ) at the same recharge time = around 7 % higher recharge rate
Don't forget that the Molok has 4 turrets to power while the Avatar has 6. That's an effective 33% reduction in cap use (or 33% more than the Avatar uses, aren't fractions fun). Also it can run 1 Neut and 1 NOS for the value of (about) two regular Neuts on another ship for less total cap per effective neut, or just run NOS.
And yeah, there's the higher cap pool plus recharge time, plus how both of those interact with skills and stuff.
Just pointing that out. |
Luna Le Fey
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
17
|
Posted - 2017.03.30 21:55:05 -
[190] - Quote
Off topic but anyone else disapointed that the unique blood raider ship design stopped at the Ashimmu ? |
|
Atomic Virulent
Dark Matter Industrial
188
|
Posted - 2017.03.30 22:52:47 -
[191] - Quote
It's funny. The replies to this are very telling. Before even reading any of them I thought to myself... "Wow, content for 3 groups. Goons, PL, and NC."
This is just documented proof. Nearly all comments are from those 3, almost like they know as well that they are sanctified by CCP.
Thanks CCP for providing content to 1% of the 1% of the 1% of those who keep your lights on.
Meanwhile, the rest of us will never see one on the field, much less have access to one. But we're ok being abused and harrassed out of the game by bulk-wardeccing bullies who ultimately have zero ambition in the game other than destroy the experience for as many as possible.
Well done yet again CCP, well done. You continue to amaze. |
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2836
|
Posted - 2017.03.31 01:56:52 -
[192] - Quote
Atomic Virulent wrote:It's funny. The replies to this are very telling. Before even reading any of them I thought to myself... "Wow, content for 3 groups. Goons, PL, and NC."
This is just documented proof. Nearly all comments are from those 3, almost like they know as well that they are sanctified by CCP.
Thanks CCP for providing content to 1% of the 1% of the 1% of those who keep your lights on.
Meanwhile, the rest of us will never see one on the field, much less have access to one. But we're ok being abused and harrassed out of the game by bulk-wardeccing bullies who ultimately have zero ambition in the game other than destroy the experience for as many as possible for giggles.
Well done yet again CCP, well done. You continue to amaze.
I mean, if you want one, just get one. You don't have to be in a specific alliance to own the shiny, as long as you have the ISK to pay for it. You sure as hell don't need to be in a specific alliance to get ISK.
Also, "bulk-wardeccing?" Is this some sort of tangent or something? We don't wardec folks -- suicide ganking is our forte.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Penance Toralen
Compass Fox
38
|
Posted - 2017.03.31 03:17:10 -
[193] - Quote
Querns wrote:We don't wardec folks -- suicide ganking is our forte. since Star Alliance, eh?
|
Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc Test Alliance Please Ignore
3052
|
Posted - 2017.03.31 08:41:21 -
[194] - Quote
I can assure you my alliance is one of the ones getting constantly wardecced.
Probably major capital alliances will be best able to put these ships to use, but anyone who can field capitals can field these capitals. It's just ISK vs risk, and these will probably cost more ISK.
FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."
Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."
|
Cade Windstalker
1197
|
Posted - 2017.03.31 13:48:00 -
[195] - Quote
Luna Le Fey wrote:Off topic but anyone else disapointed that the unique blood raider ship design stopped at the Ashimmu ?
Yes, but if CCP will remodel my bloody Basilisk hull to stop it looking like crushed luggage then I'll forgive them for waiting a few years to rework the Pirate hulls which currently don't look too bad.
Everything we know indicates that CCP's art pipeline is pretty full, so it's not surprising that they're not investing hugely in new models for these ships until they're certain they won't break the game. |
Panther X
High Flyers Northern Coalition.
119
|
Posted - 2017.04.01 13:12:29 -
[196] - Quote
CCP Larrikin wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:Any comment on the hangar size debate so we can put it to rest? Sure, we're happy with the existing fleet hanger size. Its the same as the Vanquisher.
Vanquisher doesn't have corpse bay, does it? Reduce the corpse bay a little more and merge it to the fleet hangar/cargo bay so it can carry /swap out that extra module.
My Titan smells of rich Corinthian Leather...
|
Cade Windstalker
1209
|
Posted - 2017.04.01 17:55:19 -
[197] - Quote
Panther X wrote:CCP Larrikin wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:Any comment on the hangar size debate so we can put it to rest? Sure, we're happy with the existing fleet hanger size. Its the same as the Vanquisher. Vanquisher doesn't have corpse bay, does it? Reduce the corpse bay a little more and merge it to the fleet hangar/cargo bay so it can carry /swap out that extra module.
The corpse bay is fun flavor, it's not a balance parameter.... |
Atomeon
The Scope Gallente Federation
80
|
Posted - 2017.04.01 23:04:50 -
[198] - Quote
Cade Windstalker wrote:Panther X wrote:CCP Larrikin wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:Any comment on the hangar size debate so we can put it to rest? Sure, we're happy with the existing fleet hanger size. Its the same as the Vanquisher. Vanquisher doesn't have corpse bay, does it? Reduce the corpse bay a little more and merge it to the fleet hangar/cargo bay so it can carry /swap out that extra module. The corpse bay is fun flavor, it's not a balance parameter....
Then give fun to the others too? |
Cade Windstalker
1211
|
Posted - 2017.04.01 23:13:35 -
[199] - Quote
Atomeon wrote:Cade Windstalker wrote:The corpse bay is fun flavor, it's not a balance parameter.... Then give fun to the others too?
The non-Bloodraider factions aren't crazed bloodthirsty maniacs. It would be weirdly out of character for anyone else to have a corpse bay (except maybe the Sleepers/Drifters) |
Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc Test Alliance Please Ignore
3053
|
Posted - 2017.04.02 04:04:54 -
[200] - Quote
Creecher Virpio wrote:Mr Rive wrote:Ncc 1709 wrote:@mr rive Your math is off. maxed skill the capital nos will get 2000 capacitor per 20 seconds. so its actually 100 cap/s Yes but the Dagon gets a 150% bonus. My math is terrible, but either way, the nos cannot be used to run the remote reps at all reliably, given the cycle time bonus the Dagon gets. 0 cap stability is nothing new to fax machines. You still have mid slots just like the apostle does, and you get the nos bonus Actually, the capital T2 remote rep at max skills will cost the Dagon 487 Gj/s to run, and keep in mind this is with the cycle time reduction. The nos pulling in 100 Gj/s is a very significant chunk of capacitor income and can do a lot toward making the fit cap stable, which is a lot more than can be said for a T1 force auxiliary. So this ship is most definitely more cap stable than a T1 fax. But if the nosferatus are affected by the triage module, it'll pull in 400 Gj/s, making it easily cap stable running 2 reps and 2 nos, and it can have a third rep on standby for when the ship has some extra capacitor.
And you're using the fax as a recon while it's playing logi.
Blueberry cuddlemuffin wrote:What is the temperature inside of the corpse bays? Can't have the corpses go bad It's thirty-five.
Thirty-five Kelvin inside the tubes, but the observation deck passageway is a balmy thirty-five Celsius.
FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."
Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."
|
|
Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc Test Alliance Please Ignore
3053
|
Posted - 2017.04.02 05:27:14 -
[201] - Quote
Atomeon wrote:Then give fun to the others too? It's more fun if it's more unique. Great way to ruin a great thing is make it cheap.
Cade Windstalker wrote:The non-Bloodraider factions aren't crazed bloodthirsty maniacs. It would be weirdly out of character for anyone else to have a corpse bay (except maybe the Sleepers/Drifters) What's the difference between an Amarrian and a Blood Raider?
One is a bloodthirsty hypocrite dedicated to nihilism, worshiping a font of eternal youth, killing in the name of a child-killing, slaver devil-god. The other's a Blood Raider.
FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."
Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."
|
Mr Rive
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
156
|
Posted - 2017.04.02 14:59:57 -
[202] - Quote
Atomic Virulent wrote:It's funny. The replies to this are very telling. Before even reading any of them I thought to myself... "Wow, content for 3 groups. Goons, PL, and NC."
This is just documented proof. Nearly all comments are from those 3, almost like they know as well that they are sanctified by CCP.
Thanks CCP for providing content to 1% of the 1% of the 1% of those who keep your lights on.
Meanwhile, the rest of us will never see one on the field, much less have access to one. But we're ok being abused and harrassed out of the game by bulk-wardeccing bullies who ultimately have zero ambition in the game other than destroy the experience for as many as possible for giggles.
Well done yet again CCP, well done. You continue to amaze.
why are you crying at PL and NC and goons about CCP making a ship too expensive?
Literally just said they should reduce the cost of the capital hulls before you started your tirade... |
Draclira Merlonne's Son
Collapsed Out Pandemic Legion
113
|
Posted - 2017.04.03 17:55:18 -
[203] - Quote
Mother will be proud. |
Tara Read
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
946
|
Posted - 2017.04.04 08:29:23 -
[204] - Quote
Draclira Merlonne's Son wrote:Mother will be proud.
Hahahahaha nice. |
Mr Rive
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
157
|
Posted - 2017.04.04 20:54:40 -
[205] - Quote
Reaver Glitterstim wrote: Actually, the capital T2 remote rep at max skills will cost the Dagon 487 Gj/s to run, and keep in mind this is with the cycle time reduction. The nos pulling in 100 Gj/s is a very significant chunk of capacitor income and can do a lot toward making the fit cap stable, which is a lot more than can be said for a T1 force auxiliary. So this ship is most definitely more cap stable than a T1 fax. But if the nosferatus are affected by the triage module, it'll pull in 400 Gj/s, making it easily cap stable running 2 reps and 2 nos, and it can have a third rep on standby for when the ship has some extra capacitor.
Sorry this is just wrong. First off, why on earth would they make triage effect the NOS bonus? No other FAX gets a NOS bonus in triage so unless they change the current bonuses, this just isn't possible.
The dagon also has far less of a capacitor pool to draw on than the apostle, due to the apostle's bonus to cap pool, making regen less.
You will STILL need a significant amount of cap regen in the form of cap boosters or something else. As I have said, you MAY be able to run your local reppers of a 3 NOS 2 RR 1 triage setup. The remote tank is FAR too cap intensive to be anywhere near stable.
As for the assertion that it is more cap stable than t1 fax, well... A ninazu with a single cap booster gets a 133 cap/sec bonus from its hull bonus ALONE, ignoring recharge. Same with the lif. So no, it is not more cap stable than t1 FAX, not by a long shot.
PLS, I look at this a lot, and I would rather CCP saw true information in here that might persuade them to look again at the role bonuses. |
Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc Test Alliance Please Ignore
3053
|
Posted - 2017.04.05 03:19:16 -
[206] - Quote
Mr Rive wrote:Sorry this is just wrong. First off, why on earth would they make triage effect the NOS bonus? No other FAX gets a NOS bonus in triage so unless they change the current bonuses, this just isn't possible. Maybe it should get a NOS bonus in triage. After all, the NOS is supposed to be its source of capacitor. If its capacitor problems as-is are as bad as you say, then CCP could give it a little role bonus:
Role Bonus: 150% increased capacitor gain from energy vampires while in triage mode (does not increase capacitor removed from target)
FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."
Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."
|
HandelsPharmi
Pharmi on CharBazaar
1838
|
Posted - 2017.04.05 10:59:49 -
[207] - Quote
Reaver Glitterstim wrote:Mr Rive wrote:Sorry this is just wrong. First off, why on earth would they make triage effect the NOS bonus? No other FAX gets a NOS bonus in triage so unless they change the current bonuses, this just isn't possible. Maybe it should get a NOS bonus in triage. After all, the NOS is supposed to be its source of capacitor. If its capacitor problems as-is are as bad as you say, then CCP could give it a little role bonus: Role Bonus:150% increased capacitor gain from energy vampires while in triage mode (does not increase capacitor removed from target)
Would be exploited like this:
Bring 10 of these carriers on grid, and start a "cap chaining".
Your NOS will remove X GJ of cap from me, transfer it with 150 % bonus to you and you will get 2.5X GJ of cap. I will start my NOS on you and will get 1.5X net back ^^ |
Panther X
High Flyers Northern Coalition.
120
|
Posted - 2017.04.05 14:07:47 -
[208] - Quote
Reaver Glitterstim wrote:Mr Rive wrote:Sorry this is just wrong. First off, why on earth would they make triage effect the NOS bonus? No other FAX gets a NOS bonus in triage so unless they change the current bonuses, this just isn't possible. Maybe it should get a NOS bonus in triage. After all, the NOS is supposed to be its source of capacitor. If its capacitor problems as-is are as bad as you say, then CCP could give it a little role bonus: Role Bonus:150% increased capacitor gain from energy vampires while in triage mode (does not increase capacitor removed from target)
That doesn't make any sense whatsoever. How do you take Y amount of energy from a target and turn it into Y times 150%? You're creating energy from nothing.
150% increased capacitor gain from energy vampires while in triage mode
Fixed
Triage should turn this ship into a super vampire
My Titan smells of rich Corinthian Leather...
|
Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
3292
|
Posted - 2017.04.05 17:11:50 -
[209] - Quote
Panther X wrote:Reaver Glitterstim wrote:Mr Rive wrote:Sorry this is just wrong. First off, why on earth would they make triage effect the NOS bonus? No other FAX gets a NOS bonus in triage so unless they change the current bonuses, this just isn't possible. Maybe it should get a NOS bonus in triage. After all, the NOS is supposed to be its source of capacitor. If its capacitor problems as-is are as bad as you say, then CCP could give it a little role bonus: Role Bonus:150% increased capacitor gain from energy vampires while in triage mode (does not increase capacitor removed from target) That doesn't make any sense whatsoever. How do you take Y amount of energy from a target and turn it into Y times 150%? You're creating energy from nothing. 150% increased capacitor gain from energy vampires while in triage mode Fixed Triage should turn this ship into a super vampire
If it's not OK to "create energy out of nothing", I guess all cap chaining logi needs to be deleted. |
Maiden Mayaki
Pandemic Horde Inc. Pandemic Horde
0
|
Posted - 2017.04.05 20:15:02 -
[210] - Quote
Molok should have a custom DD that consumes corpses and power of the dd is dependent on corpses consumed
edit: also now your April fools corpse collector makes sense and should be introduced |
|
Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
3294
|
Posted - 2017.04.05 20:22:10 -
[211] - Quote
Maiden Mayaki wrote:Molok should have a custom DD that consumes corpses and power of the dd is dependent on corpses consumed
edit: also now your April fools corpse collector makes sense and should be introduced
If the custom DD is good, people will spam pod their alt to create fuel for it. If it isn't, people will flat out ignore it. |
Soldarius
O C C U P Y Test Alliance Please Ignore
1603
|
Posted - 2017.04.20 15:20:55 -
[212] - Quote
HandelsPharmi wrote:Reaver Glitterstim wrote:Mr Rive wrote:Sorry this is just wrong. First off, why on earth would they make triage effect the NOS bonus? No other FAX gets a NOS bonus in triage so unless they change the current bonuses, this just isn't possible. Maybe it should get a NOS bonus in triage. After all, the NOS is supposed to be its source of capacitor. If its capacitor problems as-is are as bad as you say, then CCP could give it a little role bonus: Role Bonus:150% increased capacitor gain from energy vampires while in triage mode (does not increase capacitor removed from target) Would be exploited like this: Bring 10 of these carriers on grid, and start a "cap chain". Your NOS will remove X GJ of cap from me, transfer it with 150 % bonus to you and you will get 2.5X GJ of cap. I will start my NOS on you and will get 1.5X net back ^^
Just like remote cap xfers already do on T2 logi cruisers. Free Energy is real in Eve Online.
http://youtu.be/YVkUvmDQ3HY
|
Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
3333
|
Posted - 2017.04.24 15:45:17 -
[213] - Quote
Soldarius wrote:
Just like remote cap xfers already do on T2 logi cruisers. Free Energy is real in Eve Online.
While it is more prevalent on Logi, all ships in the game using a cap transfer generate free energy. |
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
3958
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Posted - 2017.04.24 19:31:53 -
[214] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:Soldarius wrote:
Just like remote cap xfers already do on T2 logi cruisers. Free Energy is real in Eve Online.
While it is more prevalent on Logi, all ships in the game using a cap transfer generate free energy. This assumes that Cap transfers & PG costs don't burn reactant. While they generate free capacitor energy they consume PG, which nominally would place more stress on the reactors increasing fuel use. Fortunately for us, fuel is part of the capsuleer package so we don't have to worry about it.
In any case, so it means these will be hard to neut out to shut down their local reps & hardeners, why is this a bad thing, I mean neuting out the kings of neuts/nos should be a hard thing. |
egyhenger
FREE GATES Circle-Of-Two
3
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Posted - 2017.05.08 06:58:24 -
[215] - Quote
Cade Windstalker wrote:Any word on how these are going to be acquired and the costs?
Are they going to be in line with the cost of the Serpentis Caps?
According to the recent funfest video, Blood Caps material cost will be 50% more than the regular counterparts |
Nick Bison
Serenity Engineering and Transport Company Circle-Of-Two
330
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Posted - 2017.05.08 22:08:01 -
[216] - Quote
Red through all the Dev posts as I was looking for any info on any future plans for the other pirate factions release dates. Or, will this remain a benefit to only a few "chosen" alliances?
Nothing clever at this time.
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Nasar Vyron
S0utherN Comfort Test Alliance Please Ignore
196
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Posted - 2017.05.09 02:41:58 -
[217] - Quote
If you watched fanfest you'd know Guristas is next. |
Grandpa Cholo
CryNet. Solyaris Chtonium
0
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Posted - 2017.05.09 14:01:02 -
[218] - Quote
. |
Pryce Caesar
Cloak and Daggers Fidelas Constans
94
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Posted - 2017.05.09 16:49:00 -
[219] - Quote
Nasar Vyron wrote:If you watched fanfest you'd know Guristas is next.
And Guristas may allow for Dreads and Titans to field fighters. |
Lugh Crow-Slave
3915
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Posted - 2017.05.10 14:56:24 -
[220] - Quote
Pryce Caesar wrote:Nasar Vyron wrote:If you watched fanfest you'd know Guristas is next. And Guristas may allow for Dreads and Titans to field fighters.
Still a bit sad they don't get a carrier or super carrier
I do hope before ccp is done with these we do see a stagnated carrier from one of the factions
BLOPS Hauler
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Marcus Tedric
Zebra Corp Goonswarm Federation
123
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Posted - 2017.05.11 16:20:10 -
[221] - Quote
Pryce Caesar wrote:..... And Guristas may allow for Dreads and Titans to field fighters.
Guristas 'Phoenix' with 2 x Launchers and 2 x Fighter Launch tubes......
Don't soil your panties, you guys made a good point, we'll look at the numbers again. - CCP Ytterbium
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Aleverette
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
17
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Posted - 2017.05.14 00:08:49 -
[222] - Quote
Dude I know you want to enjoy summer eagerly, but you cannot just copy everything from SISI to TQ.
WHERE IS THE LOCAL ARMOR REPAIR BONUS FOR DAGON? |
Tiddle Jr
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
900
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Posted - 2017.06.09 23:47:05 -
[223] - Quote
Out off topic but : This kind of strange that FAX's not being carrying anything other than a few drone stack meanwhile have race carrier bonuses and what is more strange the carrier's roles are no longer within RR so you do apply bonuses which are no longer existed within a Carrier's class. So why not to convert those bonuses into FAX's unique ones. Just a thought.
And he Dragon looks funny since it has to take care of itself - not to die in the first line since the engagement started meaning a fleet should be RR this thing heavily vs. bring the value onto the field as a RR FAX and as many said the big Red Cross "shoot me" + unreasenable price tag would kill it use anyway since to use its bonuses require to keep it somewhere on the frontline to drain the enemies. Otherwise you have to bring some sort of donor ship of your own from which it could drain the cap and provide reasonable RR support to the fleet.
"The message is that there are known knowns. There are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say there are things that we now know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know" - CCP
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Chevy Caputtos
Shadow Legion X Fidelas Constans
6
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Posted - 2017.06.10 21:23:22 -
[224] - Quote
Did somebody say isk faucet? |
Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
3413
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Posted - 2017.06.14 16:24:47 -
[225] - Quote
Chevy Caputtos wrote:Did somebody say isk faucet?
How many ISK were spawned in the economy by these? |
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