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Thargat
Caldari S-44 Coalition of Carebear Killers
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Posted - 2007.05.27 21:54:00 -
[61]
Devs should be allowed to play, anything else is just crazy.
About GM/DEV powers on chars. A different story, though I have to say I don't care much. Even if a GM or Dev does something "wrong" it still won't affect me or my corp as much as a decision from Seleene, SirMolle, TheMittani or any other alliance leader of the big alliances. If GS, RA, MC or BoB decided to "act" against my corp they'd prolly rip us a new "jumpgate" (so to speak). Even a concious "wrong step" from a GM or DEV has less impact on the game than most decisions from the big alliance leaders.
This however does not mean there should be no control or investigation of GM/DEV chars, "trust is good but control is better". I just think that the debate has gone way off track. People should be more interested in bug-reporting programs and helping CCP develope a better game (via the means already in place) than DEV/GM actions.
If you don't like what I say, just ignore it, or admit I got to you. |
Pan Crastus
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:01:00 -
[62]
This vote is pointless - BoB and pets will vote YES, their enemies will vote NO... Draw your own conclusions.
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Krugerrand
0utbreak
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:02:00 -
[63]
Originally by: Pan Crastus This vote is pointless - BoB and pets will vote YES, their enemies will vote NO... Draw your own conclusions.
yeah, because devs/gms are only in one alliance in the entire of eve 8-).
They are in different corps/alliances, but some people are on a witch hunt to try to prove bob keep cheating to cover up their own incompetences in game.
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CrestoftheStars
Perkone
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:02:00 -
[64]
actually what we pay for is the service. since i can hear your not much into law i can tell you that even taking money for the game and then the service is walking on a very thin line of what is legal in most country.
the problem with the law is that it is differend from country to country and that is why online games are so hard to see what is legally done and not. even so i will NOT begin to have a discoussion about the law involving in this (since it is not the topic)..
back on topic. devs, gm and isd ingame = mistrust, misuse = mistrust to the company ccp. i know (or i would suspect) that most dev/gm/isd is just thinking "shoot those idiots cheating" because this actually have a very negative impact on them, and they are good guy's but non the less, the trust have been broken and how we regain that trust is the importence.
first i would say either remove all accounts that are dev/gm or isd or spread them out to non importent corps/alliance, and make sure to fire any one that do anything out of order and thereby misusing there powers..
hehe i know it's a VERY bad thing to **** of the GODS... but some one have to do it before a bunch of angry people comes and trow them from the land (so to speak). but it is not anything i actually fancy or like to do... exspecially since "next time i need something reimbursed" i will just hope that they are not holding a crunsh against me ;P (ofcourse they will not, although the thought is there because of incidents like these that shows they are just as stupid as us and do what is best for theirs)
Originally by: Cergorach
Originally by: CrestoftheStars [ when you pay for a product you are right to say "i do not which that you do something that will advantually lead to a misuse. as i have pointed out (and this is how they actually do it in most mmo's) i am not saying that they shouldn't play the game, but that they should NOT be in it as a player, but only as a dev or gm as we are paying them and exspecting them to do.
i think you misunderstand what you pay for. You pay for the privilege to play the game, no rights can be claimed as laid out by the EULA and law in most western countries. The only right you have is to stop paying for the game.
Now, i do understand your pov, but please understand that it's never going to change, devs are going to keep playing this game (and imho that's a good thing). They are what's driving this game, they know what makes us drool, because it makes them drool too.
I know what your driving at, playing as devs instead as players sounds great in theory, but is rather difficult in practice. They already have a changed perspective, they already play the game from the pov of a dev. But understand that when you work on such a project for X*40 hours a week on such a project, chances are that you going to have your good and bad days, strong and weak days. Now that there's a IA division at CCP there is all the more reason not to do anything that's going to come back and bite you in the ass, it's just that little bit of extra reinforcement that doesn't make devs stray from their role. Now you can claim that the IA division is nothing but a joke, but if that's the case, why would you ever believe claims made by CCP that "From now on devs will never be able to play Eve again."? A lot of folks don't trust CCP. That's their right, but why they keep playing this game is beyond me...
In short, why not believe in CCP and the folks that work there to make the best of the situation, it's not as if we can set their policy...
ps. It's also not smart to **** of the 'Gods' by holding a petition so that they would have to stop playing the game they love...
___________________________________________ Humans take everything that is beautiful and sweet and turn it into something horrifying and ugly.
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Pan Crastus
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:03:00 -
[65]
Originally by: Krugerrand
They are in different corps/alliances, but some people are on a witch hunt to try to prove bob keep cheating to cover up their own incompetences in game.
Oh really, tell me more. Oh, it's just hearsay and CCP PR you are repeating, I guess.
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Fedacorr
Caldari School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:04:00 -
[66]
Edited by: Fedacorr on 27/05/2007 22:04:29 Devs absolutely should be able and encouraged to 'play the game'.
Devs should absolutely never be allowed to have those player characters be in any player corp or alliance. Not ever. If they need to understand corp play, let the dev characters form their own corp together.
Illicit contact: The rule should be that any out of game contact with a dev other than on this message board, in the open, or in a known, announced way (such as dev chats) should be very firmly discouraged, and that 'instant message' type contacts regarding anything occuring in game should be utterly prohibited, with discovery of such communications a firing offence. This means any such IM should be responded to with 'Do not send such messages, any further such message will result in banning of your character, you must use the petition system to request assistance or help in game'.
In game contact with a dev via the regular in game channels other than petitions and responses to them which involves any request to assist with in game problems should receive the same 'Discontinue this or be banned' response.
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Cypherous
Minmatar Liberty Rogues
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:04:00 -
[67]
Originally by: Pan Crastus This vote is pointless - BoB and pets will vote YES, their enemies will vote NO... Draw your own conclusions.
Seeing as i'm neither BoB nor anybodies pet i find statements like this annoying and down right untrue, common sense is what affected my choice and intial post and has nothing to do with being either a BoB alt a dev in disguise or a CCP fanboi so please stop talking about us like we are. ---------
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Pan Crastus
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:05:00 -
[68]
Originally by: Cypherous
Originally by: Pan Crastus This vote is pointless - BoB and pets will vote YES, their enemies will vote NO... Draw your own conclusions.
Seeing as i'm neither BoB nor anybodies pet i find statements like this annoying and down right untrue,
Sorry, I forgot to mention BoB and pets' alts.
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Dungheap
Caldari Dragon's Rage Intrepid Crossing
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:06:00 -
[69]
Originally by: Rod Blaine
Originally by: Sathamarid No GMs in non-NPC corps. Or put em all in the same corp. Having a dev with dev roles and rights in any player owned corp is a terrible idea -- conflict of interest.
There are no devs with dev rights or GM's with GM rights in player corps. There are just regular characters with no additional powers in player corps.
and you know this -how- ? if there's a ccp company policy about it feel free to link, post, or.. make it up. like the stats in your previous post...
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Dungheap
Caldari Dragon's Rage Intrepid Crossing
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:06:00 -
[70]
Originally by: Rod Blaine
Originally by: Sathamarid No GMs in non-NPC corps. Or put em all in the same corp. Having a dev with dev roles and rights in any player owned corp is a terrible idea -- conflict of interest.
There are no devs with dev rights or GM's with GM rights in player corps. There are just regular characters with no additional powers in player corps.
and you know this -how- ? if there's a ccp company policy about it feel free to link, post, or.. make it up. like the stats in your previous post...
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Cypherous
Minmatar Liberty Rogues
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:08:00 -
[71]
Originally by: Pan Crastus
Originally by: Cypherous
Originally by: Pan Crastus This vote is pointless - BoB and pets will vote YES, their enemies will vote NO... Draw your own conclusions.
Seeing as i'm neither BoB nor anybodies pet i find statements like this annoying and down right untrue,
Sorry, I forgot to mention BoB and pets' alts.
Again i am nobodies alt or ***** or slave or any such thing and i would kindly appreciate you didn't generalise players based on that. ---------
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Victor Ivanov
Minmatar Liberty Rogues
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:08:00 -
[72]
Originally by: Pan Crastus
Originally by: Cypherous
Originally by: Pan Crastus This vote is pointless - BoB and pets will vote YES, their enemies will vote NO... Draw your own conclusions.
Seeing as i'm neither BoB nor anybodies pet i find statements like this annoying and down right untrue,
Sorry, I forgot to mention BoB and pets' alts.
The irony is that LR has always been against BoB. But apart from that, I applaud your ingenuity and the witty yet efficient formulation of your post.
Truly, sir, you are a genius, nay, a DEITY in mortal guise. Please, accept my fealty to you so that I may be tutored in the ways of your incredible wit. ----------------------
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Cypherous
Minmatar Liberty Rogues
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:08:00 -
[73]
Originally by: Pan Crastus
Originally by: Cypherous
Originally by: Pan Crastus This vote is pointless - BoB and pets will vote YES, their enemies will vote NO... Draw your own conclusions.
Seeing as i'm neither BoB nor anybodies pet i find statements like this annoying and down right untrue,
Sorry, I forgot to mention BoB and pets' alts.
Again i am nobodies alt or ***** or slave or any such thing and i would kindly appreciate you didn't generalise players based on that. ---------
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Victor Ivanov
Minmatar Liberty Rogues
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:08:00 -
[74]
Originally by: Pan Crastus
Originally by: Cypherous
Originally by: Pan Crastus This vote is pointless - BoB and pets will vote YES, their enemies will vote NO... Draw your own conclusions.
Seeing as i'm neither BoB nor anybodies pet i find statements like this annoying and down right untrue,
Sorry, I forgot to mention BoB and pets' alts.
The irony is that LR has always been against BoB. But apart from that, I applaud your ingenuity and the witty yet efficient formulation of your post.
Truly, sir, you are a genius, nay, a DEITY in mortal guise. Please, accept my fealty to you so that I may be tutored in the ways of your incredible wit. ----------------------
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The Pointless
Gallente Lacks a Point Ltd
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:09:00 -
[75]
Originally by: Pan Crastus
Originally by: Cypherous
Originally by: Pan Crastus This vote is pointless - BoB and pets will vote YES, their enemies will vote NO... Draw your own conclusions.
Seeing as i'm neither BoB nor anybodies pet i find statements like this annoying and down right untrue,
Sorry, I forgot to mention BoB and pets' alts.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAaaaaaaaaaaaa *cough* *splutter*
Give it a rest, will ya? Just because peeps are of the opinion that the Devs should be allows to play doesn't mean they're BoB or BoB's pets. As I have said, I have never had any proper contact with anyone from BoB, ingame or out, excluding any forum posts here.
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"And I scream in a thousand voices!" |
The Pointless
Gallente Lacks a Point Ltd
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:09:00 -
[76]
Originally by: Pan Crastus
Originally by: Cypherous
Originally by: Pan Crastus This vote is pointless - BoB and pets will vote YES, their enemies will vote NO... Draw your own conclusions.
Seeing as i'm neither BoB nor anybodies pet i find statements like this annoying and down right untrue,
Sorry, I forgot to mention BoB and pets' alts.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAaaaaaaaaaaaa *cough* *splutter*
Give it a rest, will ya? Just because peeps are of the opinion that the Devs should be allows to play doesn't mean they're BoB or BoB's pets. As I have said, I have never had any proper contact with anyone from BoB, ingame or out, excluding any forum posts here.
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"And I scream in a thousand voices!" |
Krugerrand
0utbreak
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:10:00 -
[77]
Originally by: Pan Crastus
Originally by: Krugerrand
They are in different corps/alliances, but some people are on a witch hunt to try to prove bob keep cheating to cover up their own incompetences in game.
Oh really, tell me more. Oh, it's just hearsay and CCP PR you are repeating, I guess.
Common sense dictates this, if you want to be blinded for your hate towards BoB then so be it. If you think its affecting the game so much, quit.
GMs/devs are not meant to reveal their ingame chars.
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Krugerrand
0utbreak
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:10:00 -
[78]
Originally by: Pan Crastus
Originally by: Krugerrand
They are in different corps/alliances, but some people are on a witch hunt to try to prove bob keep cheating to cover up their own incompetences in game.
Oh really, tell me more. Oh, it's just hearsay and CCP PR you are repeating, I guess.
Common sense dictates this, if you want to be blinded for your hate towards BoB then so be it. If you think its affecting the game so much, quit.
GMs/devs are not meant to reveal their ingame chars.
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Pan Crastus
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:11:00 -
[79]
Originally by: The Pointless
Just because peeps are of the opinion that the Devs should be allows to play doesn't mean they're BoB or BoB's pets.
Yes, they might just as well be downright ignorant or stupid, but I didn't want to accuse anyone like that before they proved themselves in here. :-/
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Pan Crastus
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:11:00 -
[80]
Originally by: The Pointless
Just because peeps are of the opinion that the Devs should be allows to play doesn't mean they're BoB or BoB's pets.
Yes, they might just as well be downright ignorant or stupid, but I didn't want to accuse anyone like that before they proved themselves in here. :-/
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Stakhanov
kleptomaniacs
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:13:00 -
[81]
Edited by: Stakhanov on 27/05/2007 22:13:39 Have fun deluding yourself into thinking you'll have an impact on what the devs and GMs are allowed to do
Seriously , it's their game. They can do what the hell they want with it , regardless of the community's opinion. Saying they should be prevented from harming their own game is absolute nonsense and an insult to their intelligence.
Improving the game is a favor , letting players take part in it is a privilege. If they think a group of players is trying to ruin their game , blocking or banning them is self-defense. It's not like they are democratically elected to be in charge. They have invited you to their game , if you're not happy you can leave - that's the only right you have.
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Stakhanov
kleptomaniacs
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:13:00 -
[82]
Edited by: Stakhanov on 27/05/2007 22:13:39 Have fun deluding yourself into thinking you'll have an impact on what the devs and GMs are allowed to do
Seriously , it's their game. They can do what the hell they want with it , regardless of the community's opinion. Saying they should be prevented from harming their own game is absolute nonsense and an insult to their intelligence.
Improving the game is a favor , letting players take part in it is a privilege. If they think a group of players is trying to ruin their game , blocking or banning them is self-defense. It's not like they are democratically elected to be in charge. They have invited you to their game , if you're not happy you can leave - that's the only right you have.
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Pan Crastus
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:14:00 -
[83]
Originally by: Krugerrand
Common sense dictates this,
ROFL ... common sense dictates that just as much as it would dictate BoB having at least 1 member of the CIA, FBI, Opus Dei and the Mafia in it. Well who knows. ;-)
Quote:
If you think its affecting the game so much, quit.
It's just one of many good reasons to quit the game right now.
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Pan Crastus
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:14:00 -
[84]
Originally by: Krugerrand
Common sense dictates this,
ROFL ... common sense dictates that just as much as it would dictate BoB having at least 1 member of the CIA, FBI, Opus Dei and the Mafia in it. Well who knows. ;-)
Quote:
If you think its affecting the game so much, quit.
It's just one of many good reasons to quit the game right now.
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Thargat
Caldari S-44 Coalition of Carebear Killers
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:15:00 -
[85]
Originally by: CrestoftheStars back on topic. devs, gm and isd ingame = mistrust, misuse = mistrust to the company ccp. i know (or i would suspect) that most dev/gm/isd is just thinking "shoot those idiots cheating" because this actually have a very negative impact on them, and they are good guy's but non the less, the trust have been broken and how we regain that trust is the importence.
Speak for yourself and only yourself (unless you have a written permission from each and every user on this forum). I still trust CCP and the DEVs/GMs. It takes alot more than some unidentified characters posts to make me jump to conclusions (speaking of different slandering posts regarding CCP misconduct in other threads on this forum) about a well renowned gamingcompany.
If you don't like what I say, just ignore it, or admit I got to you. |
Gabba
The Three Hundred
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:15:00 -
[86]
Anyone remember Earth & Beyond? Same thing happened there, ill admit EVE is a better game, but thats only till something else comes along.
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Thargat
Caldari S-44 Coalition of Carebear Killers
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:15:00 -
[87]
Originally by: CrestoftheStars back on topic. devs, gm and isd ingame = mistrust, misuse = mistrust to the company ccp. i know (or i would suspect) that most dev/gm/isd is just thinking "shoot those idiots cheating" because this actually have a very negative impact on them, and they are good guy's but non the less, the trust have been broken and how we regain that trust is the importence.
Speak for yourself and only yourself (unless you have a written permission from each and every user on this forum). I still trust CCP and the DEVs/GMs. It takes alot more than some unidentified characters posts to make me jump to conclusions (speaking of different slandering posts regarding CCP misconduct in other threads on this forum) about a well renowned gamingcompany.
If you don't like what I say, just ignore it, or admit I got to you. |
Gabba
The Three Hundred
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:15:00 -
[88]
Anyone remember Earth & Beyond? Same thing happened there, ill admit EVE is a better game, but thats only till something else comes along.
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Pan Crastus
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:16:00 -
[89]
Originally by: Stakhanov They have invited you to their game , if you're not happy you can leave - that's the only right you have.
That would be the case if the game was free, but it isn't. CCP is bound by a contract and there are limits to the amount of misleading statements and advertising they can do.
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Pan Crastus
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Posted - 2007.05.27 22:16:00 -
[90]
Originally by: Stakhanov They have invited you to their game , if you're not happy you can leave - that's the only right you have.
That would be the case if the game was free, but it isn't. CCP is bound by a contract and there are limits to the amount of misleading statements and advertising they can do.
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