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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Agent Oskar
Wreckless Abandon Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2007.06.10 07:12:00 -
[91]
ORANGE SPECIES!!!
YOU SOB! You told me you were doing MC logistics! If your earning 2bil a day you can afford to replace my reaper now.
/me severely disgusted
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Arcane Mystery
Wreckless Abandon Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2007.06.10 09:11:00 -
[92]
I only have 3 things to say in this matter.
1. Congrats to Orange Species and friends for finding a very nice trade route.
2. Thanks for informing me that the Titan get immobilized by using jumpbridge, that's a thing I wasn't aware of. Now it may be worth trying to take it down.
3. To the crybabies: Stop whining and play the game. Just because you don't fly a Titan or that they are unbalanced at the moment doesn't mean those who do have one should be prohibited from using it.
Finally a small sidenote, if it wasn't obvious from #2 above. I'm not friends with BoB so don't start with that. They are neutral on my overview and I am neither with nor against them. Same goes with most of eve population. If I think I have a reasonable chance of survival I'll shoot almost any alliance I see in 0.0.
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Daveydweeb
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Posted - 2007.06.10 09:29:00 -
[93]
Originally by: Alias11 Jump bridging freighters to get risk-free isk isn't an exploit. It's just goddamn stupid, like nanophoons, and is something that should never have been put in the game in the first place
This is something that should have been obvious to the developers, and that would clearly lead to an exploitable situation that would profoundly benefit those players who already have the decisive advantage of a Titan. CCP's sense of game balance is laughably bad, especially for a company with as many years' experience as they do. Please email us as to why Your signature has been removed - Kreul Intentions ([email protected]) |
Cergorach
Amarr The Helix Foundation
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Posted - 2007.06.10 09:36:00 -
[94]
Reward: 210B+ investment and a 2B return on that investment in 40min. My investment for mission running Lvl.4 is 200M+ and i get a return of around 10M per hour. Compared to the first example i get a better return then the guy using a freighter, i'm guessing that i'm not the only one.
Risk: If you know what your doing, there is very little risk in flying missions, just as there here is very little risk trading with a Titan. There is risk, a simple one is that when there are 60B worth of trade goods in the hold, no one is buying them anymore (has happened to me, just not with 60B). Someone also using your route, someone blowing up your ship. Sure the above all cost a lot of money, money most folks don't have.
To be honest, at the level of titan use, money is less of a problem, then actually building a titan...
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Comstr
Technology Acquisition Collective Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.06.10 09:47:00 -
[95]
It won't get changed, because I'm sure CCP has analysis of statistics showing where money is coming and going, and you'd think one person getting 2 billion a day would be...noticeable from their end by now.
Right now Titan's are the ultimate I WIN in combat. They are also the ultimate I WIN in trade. They are the ultimate in PvP ships in general. (Trade is PvP in this game too).
Those 7(?) or so Titan pilots are the winners of Eve. The rest of us are only in the game to be their targets. I have full confidence CCP will do nothing.
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Daveydweeb
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Posted - 2007.06.10 09:50:00 -
[96]
Originally by: Comstr It won't get changed, because I'm sure CCP has analysis of statistics showing where money is coming and going, and you'd think one person getting 2 billion a day would be...noticeable from their end by now.
Well, you'd hope so. Please email us as to why Your signature has been removed - Kreul Intentions ([email protected]) |
Won Swunglow
Caldari Dead By Dawn
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Posted - 2007.06.10 09:51:00 -
[97]
Shall we all just agree to disagree?
Look at it this way. EvE is CCP's game. CCP are friends with BoB. Let them enjoy their game and feel glad that they allow us to pay them to fill the spaces that they dont want.
Your signature was inappropriate, email [email protected] to find out why (don't forget to include a link to it) -Sahwoolo |
Dimagus
School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2007.06.10 09:59:00 -
[98]
The investment vs. risk vs. reward of hauling 1,000,000 m3 of goods scales appropriately in my humble opinion. From Industrial to Freighter to Titan the amount of time and investment that goes into each seems appropriate for their capabilties at logistics. People seem to forget that there was a movement for an industrial capital ship, and with the DD getting nerfed the titan will be shifting more and more to that role rather than an offensive superweapon.
Kudos to Orange Species and associates for buying low and selling high. I do think there should be some updates to the market algorithm so the profit margin goes down when you're offloading 99% of the supply each day, but I find no fault with players utilizing all the resources available to them as they were intended.
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Cringeley
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.06.10 10:05:00 -
[99]
Originally by: Cergorach Reward: 210B+ investment and a 2B return on that investment in 40min. My investment for mission running Lvl.4 is 200M+ and i get a return of around 10M per hour. Compared to the first example i get a better return then the guy using a freighter, i'm guessing that i'm not the only one.
This is stupid, you are stupid.
Maybe you can make a higher percentage return per hour from mission running than from this, but you can't run 1000 missions at once.
Quote: Risk: If you know what your doing, there is very little risk in flying missions, just as there here is very little risk trading with a Titan. There is risk, a simple one is that when there are 60B worth of trade goods in the hold, no one is buying them anymore (has happened to me, just not with 60B). Someone also using your route, someone blowing up your ship. Sure the above all cost a lot of money, money most folks don't have.
The only way anyone else can run the route is with titan(s). At the moment there is no effective risk of loss because the freighters can dock and the titan can always safety jump before anyone can destroy it.
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Dimagus
School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2007.06.10 10:15:00 -
[100]
Edited by: Dimagus on 10/06/2007 10:14:39
Originally by: Cringeley The only way anyone else can run the route is with titan(s). At the moment there is no effective risk of loss because the freighters can dock and the titan can always safety jump before anyone can destroy it.
So there's some things a titan can do that others can't, yeah. Significant time investment and a 210B+ piece of hardware actually has a desirable logistic use. Correct me if I'm wrong though, but after the next patch can't the titan still just jump away, as the 10 minute timer applies to the doomsday being fired?
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Cergorach
Amarr The Helix Foundation
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Posted - 2007.06.10 10:46:00 -
[101]
Originally by: Cringeley This is stupid, you are stupid.
Maybe you can make a higher percentage return per hour from mission running than from this, but you can't run 1000 missions at once.
I think you have your definition of 'stupid' messed up. Let's refrain from calling people names.
While i can't run a 1000 missions at once, i don't have to, because Eve is built up in layers. A beginning player starts in a frigate, when he can afford it and has the skills he moves to a cruiser, then to a battleship (or branches out). At different layers you have different capabilities, but you also need different layers of finance to support those capabilities. You can't expect a battleship pilot to make the same kind of money as a starting player, the battleship pilots would revolt.
In a couple of months my skills at flying a drone BC would max out, so i wouldn't be able to fly Lvl.4 missions any faster, no matter how much i would try (i'm already seeing less and less return in skill investments). When i have enough capital and enough skills, i can enter a different (higher) layer of Eve. I already have a pretty good idea how to get to the 100B a month with very little time investment from my part, i'm not telling you how, but it ain't NPC trading...
btw. Trade routes have a nasty habit to dry out or change unexpectedly.
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Scatim Helicon
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.06.10 11:05:00 -
[102]
Edited by: Scatim Helicon on 10/06/2007 11:05:33
Originally by: Cergorach btw. Trade routes have a nasty habit to dry out or change unexpectedly.
That's what appears to be the issue, though. This trade route is still active because as long as 1 unit of the buy order remains unfilled, the NPC will continue to mindlessly put fresh orders up at the same price, day after day. Looking at the price history screenshot, there's probably been 60b+ of effectively zero-risk profit made over the past 6 weeks, because the jumpbridge allows freighters to safely take advantage of regional price variations on a massive scale, and because the NPC purchaser isn't smart enough to buy the remaining unit of plutonium for themselves and just keeps reposting the same order with the same profit margin after every dt. And this is just one example, who knows how many others there are?
This isn't a cheat or an exploit (not in the 'petition-able breach of the game rules' sense of the word, at least), its just a clever working of what appears to be flawed NPC AI.
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hybridundertaker
Amarr coracao ardente Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2007.06.10 11:07:00 -
[103]
well a logistic effort of that size deserves to be well payed, specially because u need backup to ensure the poses dont get blown up and ppl dont abuse your freighters. basically its not something one guy can do alone even with alts.
If an alliance can ensure ppl dont touch their poses they deserve to profit from it...
If u dont like it blow up their poses, bubble in ze freighters lay trap for ze titan... dont come to whine to forums its not ure mom...
EvE +NLINE - T+TALHELLDEATH SUPPORTER |
Sacul
Wreckless Abandon Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2007.06.10 11:45:00 -
[104]
roflmao....what a bunch of whiners djeez.
He is taking advantage of a good bussiness oppurtunity. Smart man and well played.
Now sit still OS so we can kill u, pls give date and time u are in system aswell. I will prep zee caps and u just be afk hmmk.
The stone age didn't end because we ran out of stones!
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Traxio Nacho
Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2007.06.10 11:47:00 -
[105]
Is this market discussion or CAOD because the amount of crying going on in here is funny. If this really bothers you why not point out the floor rather than whining about how you don't have a titan.
And if it really bothers you do us all a favour and hit that unsubscribe button
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Kyria Timeyu
Pie Vendor
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Posted - 2007.06.10 12:43:00 -
[106]
Edited by: Kyria Timeyu on 10/06/2007 12:51:56 Edited by: Kyria Timeyu on 10/06/2007 12:43:47 Where are people pulling the 210b cost number out from? Don't answer, I know from where
A titan has a material cost of about 50b. And now that you can unload freighters at a POS the opportunity cost of the work involved is probably less than 1b. Add another 5b or so for the small risk of BoB getting it blown up in production and you're still 75% short of the quoted number. Well, maybe the cynoship costs 150b!
So the 60b priced titan will pay itself off after 30 days. Not even a hulk BPO at the height of T2 production stupidity had that kind of money generating power.
Originally by: hybridundertaker If u dont like it blow up their poses, bubble in ze freighters lay trap for ze titan... dont come to whine to forums its not ure mom...
Bubbling ships that are 0m away from a station is amazingly useful
Originally by: Traxio Nacho Is this market discussion or CAOD because the amount of crying going on in here is funny.
You're talking about the people who base their opinion on whether this mechanic is balanced or not on alliance alignment, right?
Because i'd love to hear an argument based on facts why a completely riskless action that pays out 2b isk for 15 minutes of work is working as intended.
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CitzNo 097864
Lotka Volterra
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Posted - 2007.06.10 13:40:00 -
[107]
Hey guys!
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gordon cain
Minmatar x13 Anarchy Empire
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Posted - 2007.06.10 13:44:00 -
[108]
Originally by: Kyria Timeyu Edited by: Kyria Timeyu on 10/06/2007 12:57:17 Where are people pulling the 210b cost number out from? Don't answer, I know from where
A titan has a material cost of about 50b. And now that you can unload freighters at a POS the opportunity cost of the work involved is probably less than 1b. Add another 5b or so for the small risk of BoB getting it blown up in production and you're still 75% short of the quoted number. Well, maybe the cynoship costs 150b!
So the 60b priced titan will pay itself off after 30 days. Not even a hulk BPO at the height of T2 production stupidity had that kind of money generating power.
Originally by: hybridundertaker If u dont like it blow up their poses, bubble in ze freighters lay trap for ze titan... dont come to whine to forums its not ure mom...
Bubbling ships that are 0m away from a station is amazingly useful
Originally by: Traxio Nacho Is this market discussion or CAOD because the amount of crying going on in here is funny.
You're talking about the people who base their opinion on whether this mechanic is balanced or not on alliance alignment, right?
Because i'd love to hear an argument based on facts why a completely riskless action that pays out 2b isk for 15 minutes of work is working as intended.
Last time I checked the titan couldnt dock. So you acutally have 1 min to get in position with bubble, dictors and the dreads needed.
Gordon Cain "Allways remember. Never argue with idiots, they will just drag you down to their level, and beat you with experience"
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Traxio Nacho
Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2007.06.10 13:56:00 -
[109]
Originally by: Kyria Timeyu Edited by: Kyria Timeyu on 10/06/2007 12:57:17 Where are people pulling the 210b cost number out from? Don't answer, I know from where
A titan has a material cost of about 50b. And now that you can unload freighters at a POS the opportunity cost of the work involved is probably less than 1b. Add another 5b or so for the small risk of BoB getting it blown up in production and you're still 75% short of the quoted number. Well, maybe the cynoship costs 150b!
So the 60b priced titan will pay itself off after 30 days. Not even a hulk BPO at the height of T2 production stupidity had that kind of money generating power.
Originally by: hybridundertaker If u dont like it blow up their poses, bubble in ze freighters lay trap for ze titan... dont come to whine to forums its not ure mom...
Bubbling ships that are 0m away from a station is amazingly useful
Originally by: Traxio Nacho Is this market discussion or CAOD because the amount of crying going on in here is funny.
You're talking about the people who base their opinion on whether this mechanic is balanced or not on alliance alignment, right?
Because i'd love to hear an argument based on facts why a completely riskless action that pays out 2b isk for 15 minutes of work is working as intended.
15 minutes work? Even with 5/5 jump skills its 7 jump trip which certainly takes longer than 15 minutes!
This post isn't a "Do you think this is balanced thread" its a "OMG BOB have a titan and is making isk and we have to sell GTCs to make isk thread" otherwise the OP wouldn't have originally posted this in CAOD.
Oh and if you wish to make a point try using your main rather than a 4 month old alt
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Dylan Rhade
Caldari UK Corp FATAL Alliance
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Posted - 2007.06.10 14:01:00 -
[110]
Crying out loud ...
BoB have acquired Titans, and have strong financial and industrial backing.
Because they have acheived this, are the still supposed to do things the hard way?
90+ jump freighter ops??
The whole IDEA of the jump bridge is a reward for being able to build a titan with JBA in the first place.
Kudos to BoB for finding the trade route, and kudos for using the tool at their disposal to great effect.
For all those 12 year old crying babies, heres a chocolate bar ..
D
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Dimagus
School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2007.06.10 14:02:00 -
[111]
The 210B number prolly came from BPO + Materials + Fittings or some similiar estimate.
There's two separate issues here, the first of which is that 2.2Billion profit can be made from Plutonium per day. The issue is that amount can be held static without diminishing, while popular opinion (and comparison to real life economics) suggests that it should be different. 100% buy required to influence price was set by CCP, if they choose to re-evaluate that, they'll do so at their own discretion.
The second issue, is quite simply, Titan Envy. Get over it.
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Kyria Timeyu
Pie Vendor
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Posted - 2007.06.10 14:03:00 -
[112]
It's amazing how you managed to cram an irrelevant nitpick - so it's 30 minutes instead of 15, big deal, it's still several times as profitable as static 10/10 complexes and those are getting nerfed because they're too easy money - and two personal insults into a post and think you have made a point.
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Traxio Nacho
Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2007.06.10 14:14:00 -
[113]
Originally by: Kyria Timeyu It's amazing how you managed to cram an irrelevant nitpick - so it's 30 minutes instead of 15, big deal, it's still several times as profitable as static 10/10 complexes and those are getting nerfed because they're too easy money - and two personal insults into a post and think you have made a point.
I made no insults atall let alone personal ones
Also while we are at it its a 14 jump round trip so that takes even longer than 30mins, however my point still stands this is a whine about BOB not about the game!
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Tareen Kashaar
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2007.06.10 14:18:00 -
[114]
So, did you bugreport? --- WTS: Forum Signatures, price negotiable. Evemail me!
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Alice Cholmondeley
Christine.
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Posted - 2007.06.10 14:25:00 -
[115]
Originally by: Cringeley This is stupid, you are stupid.
You know what's stupid? GoonFleet. But then again, YCS has always been like that. |
Hoshi
Blackguard Brigade Phalanx Alliance
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Posted - 2007.06.10 14:36:00 -
[116]
Originally by: gordon cain
Last time I checked the titan couldnt dock. So you acutally have 1 min to get in position with bubble, dictors and the dreads needed.
Gordon Cain
Only way to do it atm is with a logon trap and then you have 1 min to login, warp in, lock and suck so much cap out he can not jump away. And all the ships doing this need to be tanked enough to survive a doomsday. Then you also need ships that can keep him bumped until he dies which also have to be able to survive a doomsday. Bubbles are not an option, he will hit doomsday and then hit warp before new bubbles are placed, after that it won't matter a thing how many bubbles you place on him.
It will be slighly easier with rev 2 with the fact that he can't jump inside a bubble or after doomsdaying but not much. Will give you maybe another 30sec or so to suck his cap and you still need to keep him bumped. ---------------------------------------- A Guide to Scan Probing in Revelations |
scabbsssjr
Gallente M'8'S Frontal Impact
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Posted - 2007.06.10 15:01:00 -
[117]
Originally by: Shirei
Originally by: scabbsssjr I am qouting this to show how pathetic you are. According to your logic any empire trader should be banned for following the same trade route using instas back in the day.
Said empire trader would notice that prices are going to adjust (rising at the source and dropping at the destination). This is apparently not happening in this case. Being able to run a route like that with a titan a few times is fine, but if the prices stay constant for weeks (months?), there is certainly something rather wrong with it.
Its working like it was orginally intended, before titans and jump portals. When jump portals were introduced no one thought this would happen and who can blame them?
My empire trader thing should have been clearer. I meant it to say if the hauler hauled all of it at once. ---------------------------
Originally by: Ductoris At this rate I'm going to ask for a BOB sub-forum.
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Bazman
Caldari Werda Fookarwii
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Posted - 2007.06.10 15:20:00 -
[118]
I knew about this trade route from a long time back, but i didn't catch on that this was the reason why I saw OS parked in H-PA in his titan every so often. Quite amusing to think about it. Needless to say everyone now knows about it and theres an oppertunity to kill the titan for anyone determined enough to make the attempt :P -----
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Erfnam
Time Cube Syndicate Legionnaire Services Ltd.
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Posted - 2007.06.10 15:55:00 -
[119]
CCP, thanks for moving this "award winning" thread over from CAOD. I do my best to avoid reading so many useless posts.
BOB, As a trader I think it's awesome that you guys are using the Titan out of combat. When the titan's jump bridge was announced, I had dreams about using it for trade routes.
Anyone who is unhappy about this, go to the station and wait till they buy up most of the order and then buy the rest. The price will go up and their profits will drop significantly. A few million invested in plutonium will cause BOB to miss out on many times more in profits. You can use your sizable stash of Plutonium (from the sell order) and a Carrier (or swarm of frigs/haulers/whatever) to fill the buy order. This would further decrease, if not completely erase their profits.
Market PvP ftw. Now please go back to CAOD. Sales: Capital Ships | Covetors Delivered - Bulk/Package/BYOM |
Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2007.06.10 16:00:00 -
[120]
Originally by: Erfnam CCP, thanks for moving this "award winning" thread over from CAOD. I do my best to avoid reading so many useless posts.
So that's how this ... >sneers< ... thread got here. Pity.
Originally by: Erfnam Market PvP ftw. Now please go back to CAOD.
Thread or people?
What am I saying, both!
The Eve-Online forums may not have invented whining, but they sure have perfected it.
ElweSingollo> Eve is P v P not P v GM. |
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