I don't frequent bot forums.

Funny that you do though.

Why would it be funny?

I have often admitted on this site that I visit bots forum. I also visit many RMT sites that sell isk to keep track of the price as that is the best way to see if CCp is being effective at banning bots.

Unlike yourself I research what I'm talking about before shooting my mouth off :)

So yeah, I know for a fact that most people that sell isk back to the RMT sites live in null and that the price of isk via RMT sites has never been cheaper.

Lol.. of course it is :)

Who sells isk to the RMT sites.... oh thats right, it must be the 1 person in mack botting in a ice field and not the 100's of bots in null earning millions of isk ratting bots?

Spend about 5 minutes on a few bot forums and you will see the vast majority of them live in null.

Big alliances electing CSMs run the risk of pushing the game to alliance and null sec, while constantly penalising PvE, WH and high sec players.

Your argument is based on a false premise. The CSM gets to raise issues and provide feedback. They don't get to specify game mechanics, CCP does that.

Just as it was CCP that raised the issue of ABC ores in wormholes and will be the ones to decide if it is an issue that requires a change.

so u jump 10 JF from ur 0.0 station to lowsec bordering highsec, warp to gate, fill on stuff scout the lowsec gate then cyno back

hell
ESCORT YOUR ****, u know, caps on standby, 100 or so battleships

A "plausible" scenario that you invented is the basis of your complaint?

I repeat. The CSM doesn't get to give mechanics or even directions, they raise general issues and provide feedback if requested. This has been stated repeatedly by members of the CSM. If ABC ores get removed from wormholes it will be because CCP consider it an issue.

Lets be realistic. At this point CSM has achieved nothing. Just like the player protests have currently achieved nothing. We are heading towards a decisive confrontation with an out of touch CCP management over resources for the core Eve experience. Until that fight begins and is won then nothing can be achieved really. This game is steering fearlessly towards an Iceburg and unless Hillmar can be convinced to alter course and fund the core game again in a serious fashion then any amount of re-arranging the deckchairs and furniture choices in a lounge is precisely irrelevant.

I think the CSM knows this and I think we know it.

But we should now be unified as comrades on the barricades preparing for the only fight that matters. Divisions and spite between CSM and players of all sides is now pointless.

We either get radically increased resources for Core Eve gameplay and a return to proper full content feature-rich expansions and genuine iteration on abandoned content or this game is going to sink with all hands.

The good people on the CSM are getting ready to fight. We need to get ready to fight too. There isn't going to be any prize for second place in this battle over resource priority.

Posted in another thread, but relevant here me thinks, and by someone who normally hates everything about Goons.

Yep.. and they all live in null :)

Thats an awesome story, but my experience in hiighsec carebear corps(both personal and from friends) is that 90% of the time the corp just implodes under the pressure of the wardec, and highboy either cycles into another highsec corp thats gonna implode under pressure, or quits the game out of frustration.

Take off your Jita-bought tinfoil hats for a second and make up your minds dammit: Are Mittani, the CSM and Goons irrelevant fuckwits with no power whatsover over CCP or are they the Great Enemy of all Pubbiekind, plotting to take away your precious ores and l4 missions?

The OP seems to believe the rights of high sec people are being trodden on by 0.0 alliances. To be blunt you have limited options:

1. Start your own alliance and evict some 0.0 members (can't beat em join em...)
2. Present yourself as a CSM candidate for 2012 and fight for the rights of H.S players in that medium
3. Use the advantages of High Sec to stifle 0.0 economies - Identify who your real trade partners are and only trade with High Sec dwellers.
4. Become a High Sec PVP corp and camp the pipes/gates/hubs frequently used by 0.0 alliances in High Sec.
5. Create threads bemoaning the bias exhibited by CCP toward 0.0 and comfort yourself with the warm arms of Cipher Jones embrace.

However CCP seems to not understand what brings players to 0.0 nor does the CSM....for example Goons continually tricking people into renting space only to blow them up....that's counterproductive to bringing people out. The fox doesn't kill every chicken in the coop when he comes. He takes the one he needs so that there are more later.

Nerfing High Sec will not bring them.

A single 0.0 system can support a dozen players at a time, and that's the real problem. Until a system can support hundreds of players at one time you'll never see a significant immigration to 0.0. 0.0 today cannot support a fifth of the population that hi sec can.

Right now we need to show CCP a united front as players, I think we can ALL support the current push which is nothing more that 'Get some developers working on EVE, fix it, and stop letting it stagnate'

Lets get behind them for now, and once EvE is getting the developer attention she deserves, we can go back to fighting over how that attention should be spent.

Oh I don't know , I find his postings rather amusing. His humor is a bit crude I agree, but I think his point is well taken.

Why does anyone play Eve? Certainly not to become a "lick-spittal", "step and fetch it", or "arse kisser" (like Ira keeps hinting).

I think his complaint is that, while the primary theme of Eve is the sovereignty wars in zero space, there is no meaningful way for new pilots to participate in it. It takes the better part of a year for a new pilot to learn the ropes and be vetted and judged worthy of membership in a zero alliance corp, and even then the only position they can play is what Ira termed "ass licking" cannon fodder.

I have to admit that his rather crude description of the situation is essentially accurate. The significant positions beyond "cannon fodder" are for the most part held by a handful of pilots who have acquired their positions through a combination of RMT, botting, and either the fact that they were playing Eve in the early days or were head of some 5000 member online club outside of the Eve game. The metagaming aspect of Eve is actually greater than the game itself and this is made worse by CCP's unwillingness or inability to design around it. This is not good for Eve and is detrimental to attracting new subscribers. The "Moons=Plex=Cap Fleet=Sovereignty=Moons" Syndrome excludes new blood from participating. Once the new subscriber figures this out, he either quits or limits his game play to WH, trading, or industrial activities mostly in highsec.

At this point the brainwashed of the "Dear Leaders" in zero storm in to protest that this is a lie and they sing unending songs to the glory of the rivers of benefits they receive from their masters. All to no avail for the thinking and self respecting of Eve because it is obvious to anyone what their true motive is from a cursory review of the forum. The Zero Space mafia requires grist for the mill...


Que the counter propaganda......

The metagaming aspect of Eve is actually greater than the game itself and this is made worse by CCP's unwillingness or inability to design around it. This is not good for Eve and is detrimental to attracting new subscribers. The "Moons=Plex=Cap Fleet=Sovereignty=Moons" Syndrome excludes new blood from participating. Once the new subscriber figures this out, he either quits or limits his game play to WH, trading, or industrial activities mostly in highsec.
.

Thread cleaned. Please try to post in a constructive matter.

Thread cleaned. Please try to post in a constructive matter.

That GSF were founded on taking those new guys and making them relevant in 0.0?

Honestly, accusing the leader of Goons of not understanding the value of new and casual players in 0.0 is like... similes fail me.

Thank you.

[
What are you thanking him for? It's still a bad thread.

If you think the Mittani's main concern is the "average player" of Eve... You are delusional. There is only room for one "Queen" in the Hive.