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Nanos should be nerfed

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NightmareX Quam Singulari Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.04.24 22:40:00 - [151] Originally by: ***zilla Originally by:** NightmareX So by saying that, is all Interceptors the new WCS to? Because it's 8586758 times easier to get out and survive with an Interceptor than it is with a Vagabond. Ceptors are balanced because while they can go fast they've no tank and not much dps. Nanos have greatly replaced ceptors as the premier tackler due to superior dps and buffer tank. I think that many asking to nerf nanos are specific about nerfing nanos on anything cruiser sized or larger. As it stands ceptors and assault frigs need a major buff if nano cruisers are to remain in game. The t1 frigs are useless against nanos. They need some serious love with nanos in the game. The eas hyena is the best frig at the moment. Requiring t2 frigs to play with nanos is silly. The thing you don't understand is that the Vaga can't hit targets any good when he have a speed faster than 4k m/s, and the other thing you also don't understand is that when a Vaga is webbed, he's ******* dead man. They might be strong when they are not webbed, but when they get webbed, it's over and out. And it's much much more of a challenge in a Vagabond anyways, because you have to watch out for webbers and you also need to watch out for neutralizers, also your cap, and you have to be very active with overview and handling in space etc. It's not like in a BS that just sit there and F1-F8 and then just sit there and watch. That's why the Vagabond is so fun to fly, it gives you more of a challenge.
Crackzilla The Shadow Order SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2008.04.24 23:03:00 - [152] Originally by: NightmareX The thing you don't understand is that the Vaga can't hit targets any good when he have a speed faster than 4k m/s, I understand this. However there are other nanos that aren't dependent on speed for damage. The vaga can always slow down for damage and speed up to escape. Originally by: NightmareX and the other thing you also don't understand is that when a Vaga is webbed, he's ***** dead man. They might be strong when they are not webbed, but when they get webbed, it's over and out. Thats the second problem. I'm not a fan of the extremes with webs. The most effective way to stop a nano is a rapier/huginn. And they're too effective. Anything else has difficulty getting a web on unless they're also nano'd. I'd like to see a happy medium where web != death and other ships besides minm recon can use a much weaker but long range web. This way it takes several ships working together to effective web a vaga. If the vaga can break from a few of the ships it should stand an excellent chance of getting away. A comedy setup with a blackbird and 6x long range webbers might be an easy to pop poor mans huginn. The hyena helps. The problem is still the strength of the web and we're back to requiring certain ships to be effective against nanos. Originally by:** NightmareX And it's much much more of a challenge in a Vagabond anyways, No question they are fun to fly. Fairly challenging. Much of the challenge with flying a nano is the same as flying a fast ceptor. But flying a nano is just that much better.
Lyria Skydancer Amarr Home 0f Bored Occultists	Posted - 2008.04.25 03:37:00 - [153] Originally by: Marcus Druallis Originally by: Lyria Skydancer You can't control the hac pilot. If he orbits he won't be drifting INTO you. That's a fact. There is nothing you can do about that. What is your point except typing one liners? Fit a MWD. I'm sorry but you're stupid. -------------------------------------- [Video] Angel of War
Sionide Minmatar THE FINAL STAND	Posted - 2008.04.25 04:02:00 - [154] Not sure what all the debate is about. The devs already stated they are going to address the nano thing...let's wait and see? === In Eve, never bring a knife to a knife fight.
Crackzilla The Shadow Order SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2008.04.25 04:54:00 - [155] Originally by: Sionide Not sure what all the debate is about. The devs already stated they are going to address the nano thing...let's wait and see? When do the devs address things in a balanced way? Either nanos will be nerfed to oblivion or it'll be something minor and ineffective. So best to talk about it on the off chance we can influence a decision.
Lyria Skydancer Amarr Home 0f Bored Occultists	Posted - 2008.04.25 05:44:00 - [156] Originally by: ***zilla Originally by:** Sionide Not sure what all the debate is about. The devs already stated they are going to address the nano thing...let's wait and see? When do the devs address things in a balanced way? Either nanos will be nerfed to oblivion or it'll be something minor and ineffective. So best to talk about it on the off chance we can influence a decision. Say goodbye to your noob warfare. L2P. Nano nerf is needed. -------------------------------------- [Video] Angel of War
Tolsimir Wolfblood	Posted - 2008.04.25 05:54:00 - [157] Cry me a river then get over it. They already nerfed the carbon riggs. What more do u want? Want them to nerf snakes? or maby take out the vagas speed boost? Lest cry some more about the blasterthron wile we are at it. Lets cry about the drake and and the Heavy dicers and there tank. Lets cry about the ishtar and its drones to. Find away to beat them or join them i say. Other then that if u are really that mad about it quit playing the game.
Lyria Skydancer Amarr Home 0f Bored Occultists	Posted - 2008.04.25 07:27:00 - [158] Originally by: Tolsimir Wolfblood Cry me a river then get over it. They already nerfed the carbon riggs. What more do u want? Want them to nerf snakes? or maby take out the vagas speed boost? Lest cry some more about the blasterthron wile we are at it. Lets cry about the drake and and the Heavy dicers and there tank. Lets cry about the ishtar and its drones to. Find away to beat them or join them i say. Other then that if u are really that mad about it quit playing the game. "The Whine is what gives a Forum Warrior his power. It's an energy field created by all living things. It surrounds us and penetrates us. It binds the galaxy together." -------------------------------------- [Video] Angel of War
Tolsimir Wolfblood	Posted - 2008.04.25 07:38:00 - [159] Edited by: Tolsimir Wolfblood on 25/04/2008 07:41:37 LOL! Forum Warrior. Sounds like a whiney care bear to me.
Euriti Gallente SniggWaffe	Posted - 2008.04.25 09:46:00 - [160] Originally by: Lyria Skydancer Originally by: Marcus Druallis Originally by: Lyria Skydancer You can't control the hac pilot. If he orbits he won't be drifting INTO you. That's a fact. There is nothing you can do about that. What is your point except typing one liners? Fit a MWD. I'm sorry but you're stupid. You seem to be.

Lyria Skydancer Amarr Home 0f Bored Occultists	Posted - 2008.04.25 10:02:00 - [161] Originally by: Euriti Originally by: Lyria Skydancer Originally by: Marcus Druallis Originally by: Lyria Skydancer You can't control the hac pilot. If he orbits he won't be drifting INTO you. That's a fact. There is nothing you can do about that. What is your point except typing one liners? Fit a MWD. I'm sorry but you're stupid. You seem to be. I would call not understanding something called mass of a ship is pretty stupid when he is on about how much he knows everything compared to me. Seems you and your buddy have something in common. Congrats. Now off you go to your noob intro movie. -------------------------------------- [Video] Angel of War
Inertial The Python Cartel	Posted - 2008.04.25 10:38:00 - [162] http://img126.imageshack.us/img126/1381/zomgnano2rn2.jpg WTH, somone to achieve that speed ! we are recruiting!
deadmeet	Posted - 2008.04.25 11:09:00 - [163] Lol, with that fit, maybe you can try to warp to a stargate without using warp technology, but nothing else ^^.
Mr Ignitious Gallente R.E.C.O.N. Insurgency	Posted - 2008.04.25 11:24:00 - [164] cap lasts 21 seconds \o/
Inertial The Python Cartel	Posted - 2008.04.25 11:34:00 - [165] Originally by: Mr Ignitious cap lasts 21 seconds \o/ Yeah. Its not really meant to be a practical fit, I can't image you can orbit something without leaving grid. More of a fun fit tough, and I think it would be awesome trying it. 2 seconds and you are 100AU gone, 10 seconds, 500 AU. I am not even sure if it can accelerate to that speed without capping out first. I think you need series of sensor boosted cap transfer ships (sensor boosted, so they can lock before the ZOOOMbond leaves grid). we are recruiting!
kyrv	Posted - 2008.04.25 11:35:00 - [166] Has anyone got a vagabond fitting or hugin of the nanno setup?
Euriti Gallente SniggWaffe	Posted - 2008.04.25 11:36:00 - [167] Originally by: Inertial Originally by: Mr Ignitious cap lasts 21 seconds \o/ Yeah. Its not really meant to be a practical fit, I can't image you can orbit something without leaving grid. More of a fun fit tough, and I think it would be awesome trying it. 2 seconds and you are 100AU gone, 10 seconds, 500 AU. I am not even sure if it can accelerate to that speed without capping out first. I think you need series of sensor boosted cap transfer ships (sensor boosted, so they can lock before the ZOOOMbond leaves grid). Would take 23 secs to accelerate to that speed =D
Rollerrat	Posted - 2008.04.25 11:37:00 - [168] Keep nano's as they are, and if anything. Apply a small buff to missiles.
Inertial The Python Cartel	Posted - 2008.04.25 11:40:00 - [169] Having thought this over. The 52.6 km/s Vagabond, is my new goal in EVE. I want to be the fastest pod EVAR! we are recruiting!
Ortos Abyssus Incendia THORN Alliance	Posted - 2008.04.25 11:41:00 - [170] Originally by: Inertial http://img126.imageshack.us/img126/1381/zomgnano2rn2.jpg WTH, somone to achieve that speed ! Seems like a cute way to bump someone.

Evengard Solar Dragons SOLAR FLEET	Posted - 2008.04.25 12:29:00 - [171] The problem of the topic starter and all others anti-nano whiners: 1) I can't kill speed inty in my uber drake \ raven with T1 fit. 2) Omg! i can't use my brain. ___________________ Recon and Intercept
Derek Sigres	Posted - 2008.04.25 14:14:00 - [172] Originally by: Captain Sonata Originally by: Derek Sigres Most nano ships can't go fast enough to evade fire completely those that can are unable to do anything in return. Ishtar, Curse, Rapier/Huggin, Vaga etc -- yeah, poor ol' them, and their ability to not do a thing at range. When I use an indefinite qualifer like "Most" it indicates that I leave room for exception. The Ishtar CAN of course do damage at it's most insane speed setting thanks to it's primary weapon systems being independent from the ship itself. However, the Ishtar's primary weapon system are EASILY destroyed. The Curse is more dangerous but still not terribly deadly left to it's own devices (but in a gang it's pretty spectacularly good). The Rapier/Huggin's primary job in the universe is to web nano ships and to accomplish that goal they inheritly have to move reasonably fast. But neither ship is terribly deadly left to it's own devices. The Vagabond may be staggeringly fast and it's one of the few Hacs that can reach invulnerable speeds but by the same token it doesn't have much of a bite for it's class under the best circumstances and when moving at breakneck speeds it's unable to land hits of it's own. The Vaga is, for all intents and purposes, a heavy tackler that has the option of slowing down and dealing a fair amount of pain. Most nano ships SOLO aren't a threat to a well set up battleship, especially if you carry even a single anti-nano system (with the neut being my favorite as the most reliable). Problem is that nano's generally don't travel alone because they need numbers to make up for their fairly severe sacrifices of firepower.
Red Thunder	Posted - 2008.04.25 21:52:00 - [173] nanos are soooo easy to kill ffs, people who keep dying to them are just noobs. 1. neuts, mwd, and web (works on any ship) 2. overload web 3. simply ceptors with a web fitted who know how to keep transversal high 4. a volley of cruise missiles really hurts a ship unless its going over around 2.7kms (a lot of nanos orbit slower than that) 5. decent tracking...if you have the same tracking as a vaga thats orbiting you then you will kill him as he has 0 tank. 6. ecm and suicide tacklers 7. tracking disruptors and tacklers 8. probably more but im tired and fed up of you noobs indyman, ur fleet is ********. If they had brought a single huginn or curse you would have killed the entire nano gang...but it seems you got what you deserve. red
Darth Kenzie Amarr Ganja Labs Insurgency	Posted - 2008.04.25 23:25:00 - [174] Here are why I think Nano's should be left more or less as is baring a major change in the game: Most of us think that blob warefare sucks balls. In 0.0 with the advent of hic's, large cap fleets, jump bridges, and cyno jammers the only way to do small scale raids on your oponets is to be able to move fast enough to get through bubble choke points, stay ahead of the blob up, and actually catch slopy isk ***s is to be fast (3k+). Now to be honest I perfer small scale skirmishes gang vs gang to ganking isk ***s, but nano's seem to lead to those as well. Since speacial tactics are needed to kill nanos (either other nano's or a well rounded suport fleet with tacklers/ew/remote repin') you actually get some fun fights when your targets form up to try to take you down. Nano's also have the advantage of being able to leave the fight if you jump bridge in lag inducing numbers or otherwise make the fight uncool. Unless you all know of another tactic where 4-15 men/women can get fun fights/kills in 0.0 without being blobed/cap'd to death as soon as they hit the intel channels please inform me. No you shouldn't be afraid to lose ships but you should also be able to fight in situations where you have a chance to take a few with you so all sides have some fun. True the guy ganked in the belt doesn't have fun but I think everyone who has ever killed a nano gang will admit its alot of fun knowing how much isk you just took out. The last thing I would like to mention is that Nano's aren't game breaking. They can be killed, it just requires tactics. They can't pack enough firepower to take out pos/station services, they can't actually do more in a war then destroy small groups of your ships (usually pilots I would clasify as having expendable assets anyways) and demoralize your carebears. Sure they can be frustrating but they aren't like oldschool supercaps where they could shift wars without risk. I know there is more to the game then 0.0 but to my knowledge nano's fare very poorly when they encounter sentry guns. As for empire wars, you should be able to figure out how your foe fights and outfit your forces acordingly. Long and short, Nano's are fine... I will only suport weakening them if the game shifts so that other tactics and ship loadouts are able to do raiding type warfare. I know the Black ops bs are suposed to be doing that but tbh they aren't being used because they are crap.
Elles D Caldari The Black Rabbits The Gurlstas Associates	Posted - 2008.04.25 23:28:00 - [175] NO U
Goumindong Amarr Merch Industrial GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.04.25 23:50:00 - [176] Edited by: Goumindong on 25/04/2008 23:50:28 Originally by: Red Thunder 5. decent tracking...if you have the same tracking as a vaga thats orbiting you then you will kill him as he has 0 tank This exemplifies the just what is wrong with the people who support the status quo. Give me September/October 2006 speed mod balance any day over this. Vote Goumindong for CSM
Anubis Xian Vertigo One	Posted - 2008.04.26 05:56:00 - [177] One of the things I've noticed from some people that argue to keep nanos as is, is that they seem to think people are complaining about interceptors and other ships that are intended to be fast. Ships intended to be ultra fast are not the problem. Originally by: CCP Oveur The client handles no logic, it is simply a dumb terminal. I'm the Juggernaut, *****!
AKULA UrQuan Caldari STK Scientific Black-Out	Posted - 2008.04.26 06:53:00 - [178] Originally by: Goumindong This exemplifies the just what is wrong with the people who support the status quo. Give me September/October 2006 speed mod balance any day over this. Tell you the truth Goumindong, it was just as wacked then as well. What kept the nano fits out of the mainstream was WCS/ECM being the status quo. 200M - 300M HAC prices also might have had something to do with it. I wouldn't be surprised if CCP took the same path with this as they did with the old dual MWD/AB setups. Ya get one overdrive, one nano, one I-Stab and that's it. Interceptors are left mostly untouched and the common nano HACs get reigned in abit. Nano HAC pilots juiced up on implants will still go loony fast, but since they'll spend a few billion for those I can live with that.
El Yatta Mercenary Forces	Posted - 2008.04.26 15:05:00 - [179] It beggars beleif that people who claim they can actually PVP in this game are whining for CCP to nerf a tactic which is reasonably easy to adapt to and combat. Do you need CCP to hold your hand in other aspect of the game? If you lose money on the markets, do you ask them to put in a "Give ISK now" button in high-sec stations? (This one is a joke, they did this in Exodus). The people who whine that "5 nanos attacked my 30 people and killed some then left" are the same people who whine that "blob warfare sucks!!" You cant have it both ways, you cretins - mobility and skirmish warfare are SUPPOSED to be an alternative to huge fleets. If they blobbed you, if they used speed ships, if they sniped you, if they got up close in your face and broke your tank, you whine. At the end of the day, you are ALL whining that you lost. Its because you suck. Get better. _______________________________________________ Mercenary Forces
Wet Ferret	Posted - 2008.04.26 16:03:00 - [180] Edited by: Wet Ferret on 26/04/2008 16:04:15 Originally by: El Yatta It beggars beleif that people who claim they can actually PVP in this game are whining for CCP to nerf a tactic which is reasonably easy to adapt to and combat. Do you need CCP to hold your hand in other aspect of the game? If you lose money on the markets, do you ask them to put in a "Give ISK now" button in high-sec stations? (This one is a joke, they did this in Exodus). The people who whine that "5 nanos attacked my 30 people and killed some then left" are the same people who whine that "blob warfare sucks!!" You cant have it both ways, you cretins - mobility and skirmish warfare are SUPPOSED to be an alternative to huge fleets. If they blobbed you, if they used speed ships, if they sniped you, if they got up close in your face and broke your tank, you whine. At the end of the day, you are ALL whining that you lost. Its because you suck. Get better. The thing that causes blob warfare is the same thing that causes nanos. People don't want to lose their ship. People also complain that Black Ops are useless. I wonder why. Why sneak past enemy lines when you can just fly right through them? People might blob less if they had reason to use these specialized ships, along with recons the way they were meant to be used (stealthy, not speedy). Nerfing speed would in no way be the end of the world. Anyway, nobody wants speed to be removed from the game. Don't be ignorant. People want more options to kill nanos. Right now, there are many "counters" but very few ways to effectively kill them. To say that they can't kill anything is just a lie, so there is a balance issue there. They are much more deadly that interceptors which are much more fragile, to offer you a comparison. edited- nicer words But, yeah. These forums seriously need some indicator that the post has ended and the sig has started.



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