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Naiary	Posted - 2008.07.25 21:57:00 - [1] Edited by: Naiary on 25/07/2008 21:57:07 ok first of all this aint a place for nano is good or bad i wont make a statement about it here to so please refrain from doing so. this is about the small fast ship we know as the interceptor. a small agile extremely fast ship with only one purpose. "Get to the enemy fast and lock him down" to do this it is small and hard to hit and can get indeed some great speeds. but now the dev are working on all the stuff that gives us the speed we so badly need. Interceptor have no tank to speak of and a lucky shot gets them down hard. a single pilot error and you are death. but yet we can survive due our high speeds and small sig radius. but even with that we survive but still die a lot as the interceptor is a ship that has a second name "I will die fast for sure" if the current dev plans get trough it means the interceptor will be nerfed hard. it will be slower in intercepting targets. It will die a lot and a dam lot more. it looses a chunk from the only thank it has "speed" please devs do not forget the little interceptors in your nerf wrath they are fine as they are they don't need nerfs or boosts. just make sure they remain the little fast ships that are flow by kamikaze pilots in a hurry and with the wallet to replace them 14 times a week. panda begs you and even gives you his bamboo if you do.
Reem Fairchild Minmatar Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2008.07.25 22:13:00 - [2] Severely weakened webs, and slower heavy assaults/recons. I think the future of the interceptors is looking very bright, if anything.
Hirana Yoshida Behavioral Affront	Posted - 2008.07.25 22:36:00 - [3] As someone in the blog thread mentioned, speed is going down across the board. The relative speed between the classes will remain and the Matari speed-bonus boats will still be Wiley Coyote compared to everything else. Notice that the speed Nozh has in that ugly chart is unchanged for the interceptors and only includes the MWD so will go a lot higher once speed modules are added.
thoth rothschild Krupp-Stahl Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2008.07.25 22:48:00 - [4] Edited by: thoth rothschild on 25/07/2008 22:48:45 Someone also mentioned in the blog that warp scramblers will turn off your MWD which is instant death for a ceptor pilot.
Ashen Angel Minmatar AA Mining	Posted - 2008.07.25 22:56:00 - [5] Originally by: thoth rothschild Edited by: thoth rothschild on 25/07/2008 22:48:45 Someone also mentioned in the blog that warp scramblers will turn off your MWD which is instant death for a ceptor pilot. Makes sense in a way... since they are the stronger warp disruption tool. So affecting micro warp drives makes a bit of sense.
whisk Mad Heroes	Posted - 2008.07.25 22:57:00 - [6] Originally by: thoth rothschild Edited by: thoth rothschild on 25/07/2008 22:48:45 Someone also mentioned in the blog that warp scramblers will turn off your MWD which is instant death for a ceptor pilot. what ceptor pilot goes so close to target?
J Valkor Invicta.	Posted - 2008.07.25 22:59:00 - [7] Originally by: thoth rothschild Edited by: thoth rothschild on 25/07/2008 22:48:45 Someone also mentioned in the blog that warp scramblers will turn off your MWD which is instant death for a ceptor pilot. As opposed to being webbed now which is what, ice cream for the intie pilot?
thoth rothschild Krupp-Stahl Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2008.07.25 23:00:00 - [8] arazu = 30 km scramblerange with overheat 40km. this should work for all ceptors
Reem Fairchild Minmatar Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2008.07.25 23:14:00 - [9] Originally by: thoth rothschild Edited by: thoth rothschild on 25/07/2008 22:48:45 Someone also mentioned in the blog that warp scramblers will turn off your MWD which is instant death for a ceptor pilot. Tech 2 warp scrambler range is slightly shorter than normal web range, and warp scrambler range on a Gallente recon is much shorter than web range on a Minmatar recon. In other words, it's no big deal. Also, mwd turning off is not as much of issue as being webbed while mwd stays on, because in the former case your sig radius goes back down to normal while in the latter you'll still be the size of a cruiser.
Reem Fairchild Minmatar Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2008.07.25 23:14:00 - [10] Originally by: thoth rothschild arazu = 30 km scramblerange with overheat 40km. this should work for all ceptors That's with faction gear and recon 5.
Giant Haystacks Ore Mongers Black Hand.	Posted - 2008.07.25 23:19:00 - [11] Originally by: thoth rothschild arazu = 30 km scramblerange with overheat 40km. this should work for all ceptors huginn = 60 km webrange with overheat 78km. this should work for all ceptors
AstroPhobic Minmatar	Posted - 2008.07.25 23:27:00 - [12] Originally by: Giant Haystacks Originally by: thoth rothschild arazu = 30 km scramblerange with overheat 40km. this should work for all ceptors huginn = 60 km webrange with overheat 78km. this should work for all ceptors WTB 15km scrambling webs.
Giant Haystacks Ore Mongers Black Hand.	Posted - 2008.07.25 23:35:00 - [13] Originally by: AstroPhobic Originally by: Giant Haystacks Originally by: thoth rothschild arazu = 30 km scramblerange with overheat 40km. this should work for all ceptors huginn = 60 km webrange with overheat 78km. this should work for all ceptors WTB 15km scrambling webs. Scrambling webs? Sorry, they don't exist, but if you look at the huginn you'll find it has more than 1 mid slot.
AstroPhobic Minmatar	Posted - 2008.07.25 23:38:00 - [14] Originally by: Giant Haystacks Scrambling webs? Sorry, they don't exist, but if you look at the huginn you'll find it has more than 1 mid slot. Does is have bonuses to disruptors too? You're comparing two different things. Don't.
thoth rothschild Krupp-Stahl Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2008.07.25 23:40:00 - [15] i consider out of pure sadism to fit power neuts instead of weapons for ceptors now. scramble em, web em , drain em, wait....wait send drones :D
Giant Haystacks Ore Mongers Black Hand.	Posted - 2008.07.25 23:43:00 - [16] Originally by: AstroPhobic Does is have bonuses to disruptors too? You're comparing two different things. Don't. A t2 disruptor doesn't need a bonus to outrange a arazu with a scrambler. The guy I quoted said the arazu would make ceptors unviable with the scram changes, I pointed out that a better inty killer is already in game and intys are still flown. I'm camparing two things for the same task, if that's not allowed then what sort of comparison is?
thoth rothschild Krupp-Stahl Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2008.07.25 23:47:00 - [17] Edited by: thoth rothschild on 25/07/2008 23:49:29 to late for a discussion ^^
AstroPhobic Minmatar	Posted - 2008.07.25 23:50:00 - [18] Originally by: Giant Haystacks A t2 disruptor doesn't need a bonus to outrange a arazu with a scrambler. The guy I quoted said the arazu would make ceptors unviable with the scram changes, I pointed out that a better inty killer is already in game and intys are still flown. I'm camparing two things for the same task, if that's not allowed then what sort of comparison is? Because you're posting numbers making it sound like a double web kills inties at 60km. They just warp off. You want to buy a domination warp dsiruptor, and overload it on your huginn, be my guest. Post that range instead, because web range doesn't mean anything if the ceptor isnt pointed.
Giant Haystacks Ore Mongers Black Hand.	Posted - 2008.07.25 23:55:00 - [19] Originally by: AstroPhobic Originally by: Giant Haystacks A t2 disruptor doesn't need a bonus to outrange a arazu with a scrambler. The guy I quoted said the arazu would make ceptors unviable with the scram changes, I pointed out that a better inty killer is already in game and intys are still flown. I'm camparing two things for the same task, if that's not allowed then what sort of comparison is? Because you're posting numbers making it sound like a double web kills inties at 60km. They just warp off. You want to buy a domination warp dsiruptor, and overload it on your huginn, be my guest. Post that range instead, because web range doesn't mean anything if the ceptor isnt pointed. I don't want to fit a huginn with domi webs any more than I want to fit an arazu with domi scrams, but the arazu proposed was faction fitted so I did the same for the huginn for comparison. Double web at any range will take a ceptor out of a fight, dead faster than he can align if you have any dps at that range or warped out if you don't.
Saietor Blackgreen The First Foundation Circle-Of-Two	Posted - 2008.07.25 23:58:00 - [20] Yes, inties will get a another threat now - Gallente recons. Effect - about -85% speed (mwd off), return of signature to base value, deactivation of MWD so no cap drain. OTOH Matari recons with dualwebs will now drop intie's speed by 85% also (with 60% T2 webs), which is slightly less drastic than current 98% (!!!) (2x90% T2 webs after stack penalty). Gallente recons will have less range - come on, guys, dont use Officer scramblers in your fits, its stupid and unrealistic. Plus, we dont know how faction webs and scrams will be rebalanced. Lets stick to T2 for a uniform comparrison. Thus Arazu/Lachesis will have just 18 km effective range in T2 fits with Recon 5, or 21.6 with overheat, which is allright for such a powerful weapon, I guess. Rapiers, OTOH, will lack the warp jamming effect, but have immensly longer ranges. Pls, be consistent people. --- Redesign local/scanner feature - make the place huge, dark and scary again!
AstroPhobic Minmatar	Posted - 2008.07.26 00:01:00 - [21] Originally by: Giant Haystacks I don't want to fit a huginn with domi webs any more than I want to fit an arazu with domi scrams, but the arazu proposed was faction fitted so I did the same for the huginn for comparison. Double web at any range will take a ceptor out of a fight, dead faster than he can align if you have any dps at that range or warped out if you don't. No, a double webbed ceptor doesn't just pop on sight. Especially if he's remotely aligned to anything. It also doesn't slow down immediately. A competent pilot will notice his speed dropping, and align or hit the closest celestial. So, if you want to compare full faction overloaded all level 5, whatever, but post the actual ranges that matter, not just the ones you want to make a point.
Boz Well	Posted - 2008.07.26 00:01:00 - [22] There are some fishy numbers floating around, someone was claiming 30km scram on Arazu and 40 overheated... but that's pretty far off from anything the Arazu can do with current t2/faction scrams. Anyways, I think it's fair to assume t2 or faction, and so you're looking at 20-30, depending on how much you spend and if you overheat. Still, that's pretty pwnage, considering it acts like a mix of a web and a scrambler (which isn't really bad though, since Arazu kinda needed something). You at least have a shot of warping off when webbed, but if you're caught by a 30km overheated scrambler, well, you're in trouble lol.
Rawr Cristina Caldari Omerta Syndicate	Posted - 2008.07.26 00:07:00 - [23] Not a big deal really. Not nearly as overpowered as Minmatar Recons in their current state. If you'd proposed a ship that could web a target to 1% of it's speed from 60km 3 years ago it'd never have happened. ...
Giant Haystacks Ore Mongers Black Hand.	Posted - 2008.07.26 00:12:00 - [24] Originally by: AstroPhobic Originally by: Giant Haystacks I don't want to fit a huginn with domi webs any more than I want to fit an arazu with domi scrams, but the arazu proposed was faction fitted so I did the same for the huginn for comparison. Double web at any range will take a ceptor out of a fight, dead faster than he can align if you have any dps at that range or warped out if you don't. No, a double webbed ceptor doesn't just pop on sight. Especially if he's remotely aligned to anything. It also doesn't slow down immediately. A competent pilot will notice his speed dropping, and align or hit the closest celestial. So, if you want to compare full faction overloaded all level 5, whatever, but post the actual ranges that matter, not just the ones you want to make a point. Ceptors can't stay aligned whle they're fighting, a few seconds to notice the web, start warp and align is all that it would take to pop the ship. And I did post the nukmber that mattered, as I said either warped off or dead means the same - he's out of the fight. Also as I said the huginns disruptor outranges the arazus scrambler.
AstroPhobic Minmatar	Posted - 2008.07.26 00:20:00 - [25] No, it takes at least 6-7 seconds before it slows completely down, and by that time it's gone. Competent inty pilot mind you. Regardless, both recons will be good at stopping inties now.
Boz Well	Posted - 2008.07.26 00:22:00 - [26] Originally by: Rawr Cristina Not a big deal really. Not nearly as overpowered as Minmatar Recons in their current state. If you'd proposed a ship that could web a target to 1% of it's speed from 60km 3 years ago it'd never have happened. Aye, the 99% slow is a little imbalanced when coupled with that range, heh.
Xyleya moon7empler Ev0ke	Posted - 2008.07.26 00:38:00 - [27] Ceptors will get only stronger by the proposed changes, not weaker. Warp Scrambler II = 9km. On a Malediction with Interceptor LvL 5 = 11.3km , overheated = 14.69km. Webs will slow you down only 60% with proposed changes and overheated have 13km. So yes, it's a very small, but still available advantage for the Interceptor. If there's a Arazu or Rapier in the opposing gang, you'll be dead by today's mechanics as well, so this not an argument at all. And about the speed.... An Interceptor will not loose any speed at all with the proposed changes (not counting Rigs, Claymores and Snake-Sets). A Malediction has 3 LowSlots, like alot of other Ceptors. And fitting 3 SpeedMods, like 2x ODII + 1x Nanofiber II is not going to stack horribly much still doing 5+ km/sec easily. .
AstroPhobic Minmatar	Posted - 2008.07.26 00:44:00 - [28] Originally by: Xyleya An Interceptor will not loose any speed at all with the proposed changes Pretty sure the devs said they were modifying the modules as well as microwarpdrives... so uh, what?
SuiJuris	Posted - 2008.07.26 00:49:00 - [29] Originally by: AstroPhobic No, it takes at least 6-7 seconds before it slows completely down, and by that time it's gone. Competent inty pilot mind you. Regardless, both recons will be good at stopping inties now. He doesn't have to stop, once he starts slowing down, Especially at that range, Turrets will be able to track and he will die, assuming all parties are competent at 60km a Cruiser sized weapons could already almost track him, atleast my Harby could :)
Mortuus Minmatar Demonic Corp G00DFELLAS	Posted - 2008.07.26 01:06:00 - [30] So my speed fit inty with no rigs and no implants will only do 6.5km now? DAMN YOU!!!! Seriously, only the 2pt scramblers turn off MWDs, and small ships are still going to be more than fast enough. Arazu bothering you? Kill it, 2-3 ceptors should tear it apart pretty fast. I for one see the changes for what they are, a huge boost to small fast ships like frigates and destroyers, and a slight nerf for cruisers in the speed department. Outside of that there is literally no change. Please note, the speeds shown on their graph are for ships with no modules, so yes my BC will cap out at around 1200 with a single MWD and no mods, but if I do the same fit I have now its 1900 or so, instead of 2200....OH GOD NO!!!! Occassus Republica <3
Nexus Kinnon SniggWaffe	Posted - 2008.07.26 01:24:00 - [31] Originally by: Mortuus So my speed fit inty with no rigs and no implants will only do 6.5km now? DAMN YOU!!!! a dual aux thruster rigged ares with 3 speed mods does 5km/s now.
Pohbis Neo T.E.C.H.	Posted - 2008.07.26 01:30:00 - [32] Originally by: AstroPhobic Originally by: Xyleya An Interceptor will not loose any speed at all with the proposed changes Pretty sure the devs said they were modifying the modules as well as microwarpdrives... so uh, what? "An Interceptor will not loose any speed at all with the proposed changes (not counting Rigs, Claymores and Snake-Sets)." ... post the actual quote that matters, not just the one you want to make a point Now go re-read the blog.
Mortuus Minmatar Demonic Corp G00DFELLAS	Posted - 2008.07.26 01:37:00 - [33] Which means that they will still break 6.5km/s with just t2 mods, and still go 4.2km+ with a plate. OH NO! Occassus Republica <3
Halock	Posted - 2008.07.26 01:45:00 - [34] As i read the blog its only the close range scrambler that will disable mwd's, so most of the peopel in this thread are throwing ahissy fit over nothing. Not to mention they are nerfing webs as well, interceptors future never looked as bright to be quite honest.
Vaal Erit Science and Trade Institute	Posted - 2008.07.26 01:49:00 - [35] The only part that afects interceptors is the 9km 2pt scram turning off MWDs. This is important as say a Pulse sader can put on the 9km 2pt and that will act as a web+scram. Other short range interceptors like the taranis might be able to use a 9km scram instead of the 24km and get a free mid slot for whatever. Interecptors generally don't fit many speed mods so I don't see them getting affected much at all, they will still be able to perma-tackle and do really low dps as intended. -- http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html
Zarnak Wulf	Posted - 2008.07.26 01:58:00 - [36] According to the blog, faction MWD will eat less cap but not give more speed. Polycarbon rigs will now be less effective then their module counterparts. Other mods will be tweaked/ nerf stacked. You should see interceptors that go 6.5km/s - 7.5km/s. 13km+ crows will become legend though...... On a side note, the assault frigates look like they gained a huge speed increase. They went from 1250m/s - 2100m/s on the chart to 2250m/s - 2750m/s. Add the other stuff happening and it looks like a closet AF boost.
Boz Well Minmatar	Posted - 2008.07.26 02:01:00 - [37] Originally by: Zarnak Wulf According to the blog, faction MWD will eat less cap but not give more speed. Polycarbon rigs will now be less effective then their module counterparts. Other mods will be tweaked/ nerf stacked. You should see interceptors that go 6.5km/s - 7.5km/s. 13km+ crows will become legend though...... On a side note, the assault frigates look like they gained a huge speed increase. They went from 1250m/s - 2100m/s on the chart to 2250m/s - 2750m/s. Add the other stuff happening and it looks like a closet AF boost. Nothing closet about it. It's a pretty clear AF boost.
Atsuko Ratu Caldari VSP Corp.	Posted - 2008.07.26 02:05:00 - [38] Originally by: thoth rothschild arazu = 30 km scramblerange with overheat 40km. this should work for all ceptors 18km with a 21km overheat*
Mortuus Minmatar Demonic Corp G00DFELLAS	Posted - 2008.07.26 02:05:00 - [39] Why would you not use a web on a ceptor that can fit one?? Ranis MWD+7.5+Web = close fast, web and scram target, they can't get away now, you eat them. Web+7.5km is now extremely deadly. Occassus Republica <3
Zarnak Wulf	Posted - 2008.07.26 02:10:00 - [40] Originally by: Boz Well Nothing closet about it. It's a pretty clear AF boost. I so glad i trained AF to lvl 5 w/ FW then....
Mortuus Minmatar Demonic Corp G00DFELLAS	Posted - 2008.07.26 02:13:00 - [41] Yea, I trained AF 5 about a year ago, and everyone laughed at me (but the Jag is so sexeh). Now who's laughing =) Occassus Republica <3
Halock	Posted - 2008.07.26 02:26:00 - [42] Quote: Yea, I trained AF 5 about a year ago, and everyone laughed at me (but the Jag is so sexeh). Now who's laughing =) First 2 years fo eve thats all i flew :)
AstroPhobic Minmatar	Posted - 2008.07.26 02:34:00 - [43] Originally by: Pohbis Originally by: AstroPhobic Originally by: Xyleya An Interceptor will not loose any speed at all with the proposed changes Pretty sure the devs said they were modifying the modules as well as microwarpdrives... so uh, what? "An Interceptor will not loose any speed at all with the proposed changes (not counting Rigs, Claymores and Snake-Sets)." ... post the actual quote that matters, not just the one you want to make a point Now go re-read the blog. Well, uh, they contradicted themselves there. Originally by: devblog Our current idea is to have MWD's only differ in capacitor capacity penalty as well as reactivation delay, instead of the speed progression between meta levels. This means they would all give the same speed boost, 500% Quote: Our intent is to have overdrives range from approximately 7% to 12.5% zzzz
Zarnak Wulf	Posted - 2008.07.26 02:51:00 - [44] Honestly I didn' have a problem with 13km/s+ crows. You could hit them in a destroyer. If they made a mistake they died. Their job was to close w/ big ships and tackle them for god sake. I hope this doesn't ruin the buff they got a while back.
Ezekiel Sulastin Gallente Central Research Nexus	Posted - 2008.07.26 03:10:00 - [45] Originally by: AstroPhobic Originally by: Pohbis Originally by: AstroPhobic Originally by: Xyleya An Interceptor will not loose any speed at all with the proposed changes Pretty sure the devs said they were modifying the modules as well as microwarpdrives... so uh, what? "An Interceptor will not loose any speed at all with the proposed changes (not counting Rigs, Claymores and Snake-Sets)." ... post the actual quote that matters, not just the one you want to make a point Now go re-read the blog. Well, uh, they contradicted themselves there. CCP Dionysus noted that a dual-aux-thruster'd Ares w/ 3 speed mods (can't remember which) would go 5 km/s. That's nice - my unrigged one nowadays goes closer to 8 in no gang. Yet another sign that this whole blog was a last minute crapstorm. I should have realized that the deletion of the original bandwidth blog was a sign of ill tidings. ---- WTB Armor Nerf Hardener II, 10^100 isk OBO
Rawr Cristina Caldari Omerta Syndicate	Posted - 2008.07.26 03:22:00 - [46] fitting speed-mods to inties these days is pretty much mandontary. If the affecting modules are getting a nerf, maybe it won't be and I can fill my lows with something other than Overdrives? ...
Boz Well Minmatar	Posted - 2008.07.26 03:29:00 - [47] Webs are getting nerfed, but missiles/tracking aren't. Considering you'll be going even slower now, even with all nano-mods on, I'm guessing you will still want as many speed mods as you can get. We'll see though.
Neth'Rae Gallente Decorum Inc Tygris Alliance	Posted - 2008.07.26 04:44:00 - [48] Edited by: Neth''Rae on 26/07/2008 04:45:01 Originally by: Mortuus Why would you not use a web on a ceptor that can fit one?? Ranis MWD+7.5+Web = close fast, web and scram target, they can't get away now, you eat them. Web+7.5km is now extremely deadly. Because with a 9km scrambler most stuff won't be able to go anywhere anyway, and if you have an AB you got 1600m/s, and 900m/s when webbed.. But if they have an AB and you have an MWD and they scramble you, they'll get away, unless you can blast before they get out of range. I'm playing with the thought of fitting both a mwd and ab, mwd for closing in and AB for orbiting and if you get scrambled. With no mwd you can fit t2 neutrons tho :> Request signatures at EVE-GFX
Zarnak Wulf	Posted - 2008.07.26 05:33:00 - [49] Bizarre settup # 1: (b/c the dev blog said you'd get MWD/AB setups like this) Stiletto: High: 150mm II x 2 rocket launcher Mid: MWD II AB II Scrambler II Webifier II Low: Overdrive II Nano II x 2 Rigs: Thruster x 2 Plenty of room to mess around w/ fittings. That's obviously a throw away up close one. Scramble 13km when overheated. Speed = who knows w/ all the nerfs. 4 mid stilleto might be useful again.
Meridius Dex Amarr Foundation Sons of Tangra	Posted - 2008.07.26 05:35:00 - [50] I love the idea of the new scram on my Ganksader -- scream towards any target with heat and shut down their MWD under 9 KMs. Total death on a stick. And, yes, I just put in my first ever buy orders for a bunch of AFs. :) -- Meridius Dex -- Amarr = EVE on Hard setting
Terianna Eri Amarr Terianna Eri Corp	Posted - 2008.07.26 05:40:00 - [51] Originally by: J Valkor Originally by: thoth rothschild Edited by: thoth rothschild on 25/07/2008 22:48:45 Someone also mentioned in the blog that warp scramblers will turn off your MWD which is instant death for a ceptor pilot. As opposed to being webbed now which is what, ice cream for the intie pilot? This is a good point - the worst case right now is the intie gets webbed and is stuck at 10% of its base velocity, or roughly 60% of its base velocity if it turns on its mwd while webbed (mwd is somewhere around 600% bonus at base). So at best it's going 60% of base velocity and burning cap to do so, and with a hugely inflated signature radius. If this change goes through, then if you get to within 9-10 km (basically the same range), then your mwd turns off, but even if you get webbed you're still going 40-50% your base velocity, with your tiny interceptor sig radius, and not burning all of your capacitor on a microwarpdrive to reach such a speed. Additionally web range is greater than scramble range, which means you actually can get a little bit closer without getting totally owned. Getting webbed and scrambled by a larger ship still sucks, sure, but it's much, much less threatening with these changes than it is right now, and I think that that is a good thing. Unless I'm missing something...? __________________________________ Originally by: Arthur Frayn How much to ruin all your holes, luv?
Zarnak Wulf	Posted - 2008.07.26 05:44:00 - [52] Originally by: Terianna Eri Originally by: J Valkor Originally by: thoth rothschild Edited by: thoth rothschild on 25/07/2008 22:48:45 Someone also mentioned in the blog that warp scramblers will turn off your MWD which is instant death for a ceptor pilot. As opposed to being webbed now which is what, ice cream for the intie pilot? This is a good point - the worst case right now is the intie gets webbed and is stuck at 10% of its base velocity, or roughly 60% of its base velocity if it turns on its mwd while webbed (mwd is somewhere around 600% bonus at base). So at best it's going 60% of base velocity and burning cap to do so, and with a hugely inflated signature radius. If this change goes through, then if you get to within 9-10 km (basically the same range), then your mwd turns off, but even if you get webbed you're still going 40-50% your base velocity, with your tiny interceptor sig radius, and not burning all of your capacitor on a microwarpdrive to reach such a speed. Additionally web range is greater than scramble range, which means you actually can get a little bit closer without getting totally owned. Getting webbed and scrambled by a larger ship still sucks, sure, but it's much, much less threatening with these changes than it is right now, and I think that that is a good thing. Unless I'm missing something...? Webs are only going to be effective for 50%-60%. The 90% effectiveness is going away.
Slade Hoo Amarr xPlaguex	Posted - 2008.07.26 06:28:00 - [53] Originally by: Xyleya Ceptors will get only stronger by the proposed changes, not weaker. this
Anubis Xian Reavers	Posted - 2008.07.26 07:59:00 - [54] Try discussing what you will do versus AB ceptors...those will be a pain. Originally by: CCP Oveur The client handles no logic, it is simply a dumb terminal. I'm the Juggernaut, *****!
Derek Sigres	Posted - 2008.07.26 08:05:00 - [55] Originally by: Anubis Xian Try discussing what you will do versus AB ceptors...those will be a pain. Same thing I do now if I'm not in a battleship or ECM boat: find the nearest thing to crowd next to, hope they bounce off and I can actually deliver some damage to drive them away. If I'm in my cerb I'd just merrily continue shooting precision lights because someone would have to invest a LOT in AB ceptor to outrun that explosion velocity.
Meiyang Lee Gallente Azteca Transportation Unlimited Gunboat Diplomacy	Posted - 2008.07.26 08:10:00 - [56] Originally by: Anubis Xian Try discussing what you will do versus AB ceptors...those will be a pain. Precision Lights should hit an AB interceptor quite well, because you'd need a fairly extensive speed fit to push the interceptor over 3kps. If I calculated it correctly (assuming values from the Dev Blog) a Malediction with 3 ODIIs no rigs a LG Snake set and full gang bonusses should do about 2.82kps on AB alone. Since I don't know the speed improvement the revised polycarbs will give I can't include those in the calculations, but I doubt you'll push them much above 3.5 kps, which is still within the capabilities of precision lights with explosion velocity rigs.
Derek Sigres	Posted - 2008.07.26 08:20:00 - [57] Originally by: Meiyang Lee Originally by: Anubis Xian Try discussing what you will do versus AB ceptors...those will be a pain. Precision Lights should hit an AB interceptor quite well, because you'd need a fairly extensive speed fit to push the interceptor over 3kps. If I calculated it correctly (assuming values from the Dev Blog) a Malediction with 3 ODIIs no rigs a LG Snake set and full gang bonusses should do about 2.82kps on AB alone. Since I don't know the speed improvement the revised polycarbs will give I can't include those in the calculations, but I doubt you'll push them much above 3.5 kps, which is still within the capabilities of precision lights with explosion velocity rigs. Really it's within the capabilities of unrigged precision lights. My Cerb pushes more than 5km/s explosion velocity with 2 rigs - about 3k/s without. Sure they'd get SOME damage mitigation from speed but the game would probably choose sig radius as granting a better bonus.
Slade Hoo Amarr xPlaguex	Posted - 2008.07.26 08:20:00 - [58] .interceptors are meant to be hit by precision light missiles. If you can boost speed that high to evade them, the patch would be useless. precisions make your ships go slower..so ceptor can always run away/warp out. We will see a new kind of interceptors soon....the AB interceptor. And anyone trying to track them with guns (24m sig, 2km/s speed) will want MWD interceptors back cause they are much easier to hit. They will be awesome
Y'Quiel	Posted - 2008.07.26 08:23:00 - [59] mm guess that my maladiction will switch its web for a 9km scram now. but still it looses speed and that kinda sucks.
Meiyang Lee Gallente Azteca Transportation Unlimited Gunboat Diplomacy	Posted - 2008.07.26 08:24:00 - [60] Edited by: Meiyang Lee on 26/07/2008 08:25:30 Originally by: Derek Sigres Really it's within the capabilities of unrigged precision lights. My Cerb pushes more than 5km/s explosion velocity with 2 rigs - about 3k/s without. Sure they'd get SOME damage mitigation from speed but the game would probably choose sig radius as granting a better bonus. Using the malediction as an example again, it has a 26.4m sig-radius at Interceptor 4, 24.75m at Interceptor 5. Precision Lights have an explosion radius of 20m, they'll hit them full on if you ignore the speed factor. But indeed AB Inties can be quite dangerous with this patch. Also, don't forget that the tackle inties get a range bonus to the Scramblers aswell, it may not be much (25% at Interceptor 5) but it'll help too.
Derek Sigres	Posted - 2008.07.26 08:27:00 - [61] Originally by: Meiyang Lee Edited by: Meiyang Lee on 26/07/2008 08:25:30 Originally by: Derek Sigres Really it's within the capabilities of unrigged precision lights. My Cerb pushes more than 5km/s explosion velocity with 2 rigs - about 3k/s without. Sure they'd get SOME damage mitigation from speed but the game would probably choose sig radius as granting a better bonus. Using the malediction as an example again, it has a 26.4m sig-radius at Interceptor 4, 24.75m at Interceptor 5. Precision Lights have an explosion radius of 20m, they'll hit them full on if you ignore the speed factor. But indeed AB Inties can be quite dangerous with this patch. Also, don't forget that the tackle inties get a range bonus to the Scramblers aswell, it may not be much (25% at Interceptor 5) but it'll help too. Whoops - was confusing the precsion light with heavies (75m on the heavies). Even a precision heavy would deal SOME damage to an AB inty and those are pretty much useless as of this moment.
Meiyang Lee Gallente Azteca Transportation Unlimited Gunboat Diplomacy	Posted - 2008.07.26 08:31:00 - [62] Originally by: Derek Sigres Whoops - was confusing the precsion light with heavies (75m on the heavies). Even a precision heavy would deal SOME damage to an AB inty and those are pretty much useless as of this moment. The Precision Heavies will need a bit of an explosion velocity boost to pull that off, base explosion velocity is 1000 m/s, same as Precision Cruise, so even an AB Inty will outrun that, if they boosted them to 2000 or even 1500 then you'd stand a chance of hitting them with rigs.
Anubis Xian Reavers	Posted - 2008.07.26 08:37:00 - [63] How long would it take a Cerb in optimal conditions to kill an equally rigged AB ceptor? Originally by: CCP Oveur The client handles no logic, it is simply a dumb terminal. I'm the Juggernaut, *****!
Xyleya moon7empler Ev0ke	Posted - 2008.07.26 10:44:00 - [64] Malediction atm: 1MN MWD T2, 3x OD II = 6720m/sec Malediction after changes: 1MN MWD T2, 3x OD II = 5270m/sec Sure you're getting slowed down, but not to a point, where it would be dramatical. With 5270m/sec you still take no damage from Missiles and if in Orbit, no Turrets will hit you. Slap in cheap Hardwirings (Rogue CY-1 + MY-1, Zor's Hyperlink) and you'll hit the 6km/sec again, without Rigs! .
Kelron Queldine Beyond Divinity Inc	Posted - 2008.07.26 10:55:00 - [65] As far as I can tell from the dev blog, inty base speed isn't being slowed. So hopefully we'll see an increase in interceptors not covered in speed mods, as they won't be any slower than before and there will be a wider gap between their speed and that of cruiser class ships.
Zarnak Wulf	Posted - 2008.07.26 19:01:00 - [66] I have circled a hurricane w/ perfect gunnery skills going 5.5km/s in a hyena. And I have done so going 7.2km/s in a stiletto. And the same hurricane going 8.4km/s in a claw. (Fighting the same character in different battles.) The hyena lasted 10 seconds. The stiletto survived the battle but was in structure in under 30 seconds. Only the claw lasted for over 3 min. And it COULD be hit. So in a world where interceptors will now be going between 5km/s - 6km/s, I am a bit worried.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2008.07.26 19:25:00 - [67] How would a Taranis with both MWD and AB fitted fare? MWD to target, activate scrambler, orbit with AB?
Danny Altenburg	Posted - 2008.07.26 19:35:00 - [68] Originally by: Anubis Xian How long would it take a Cerb in optimal conditions to kill an equally rigged AB ceptor? Depends if the Cerb is using Precision Lights or Heavies. Precision Light load-out was always the anti-inty fit for Cerb, and the one role it truly excelled at. With all skills at V, and with explosion velocity rigs fitted, the AML Cerb puts out ~215 DPS, with a missile speed of 8.5 km/s, explosion velocity of just under 6 km/s, and explosion radius of 20m. Thus, pre-nerf it would comfortably take out any non-pimped MWD Inty with 3 (at most 4) volleys of 815 damage, and 12-16 seconds of firing plus missile travel time. AB Inty would experience nearly exactly the same as an MWD Inty; the small amount of damage mitigation a speed of 6.5k gets you against 6k explosion velocity aside, 3-4 volleys is all it would take for any sub-7km/s Inty. For Precision Heavies, the situation is somewhat different. MWD Inties were essentially immune to these missiles, thanks to their maximum (with rigs) explosion velocity being 2km/s. An AB Inty, though it would have some damage mitigation due to speed, would still be taking substantial damage. However, it's not that simple, as an AB Inty has a signature radius of 25m. A Precision Heavy with full skills and no rigs (which is highly probable, thanks to explosion velocity ones being substantially better) has an explosion radius of 56m. Thus, an AB Inty will experience substantial damage mitigation thanks to this. I'd say at a guess that an AB Inty could expect around 70% damage mitigation of an HML Cerb's ~300 DPS with Precision Heavies, so we could expect the Cerb to be doing around 375 damage per ~5 second volley. 6 volleys would therefore take care of an AB Inty under ideal circumstances, possibly 5, maybe even 7. Any way you cut it, you're looking at 25-35 seconds plus flight time for HML Cerbs, and 12-16 seconds plus flight time for AML Cerbs, for AB Inty destruction.

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