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Falcon fix idea - never suggested before!

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Ephemeron North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2009.01.24 08:45:00 - [1] My idea is simple: Add a negative "side effect" to Signal Distortion Amplifier II -20% optimal range Think about it. A major problem with Falcons is that they are so powerful and easily operate in 140km ranges. Every Falcon pilot (who's not a newb) fits at least 2x Signal Distortion Amplifier, usually 3x. There's simply no point to fit anything else there. But now, with -20% range modifier, Falcon pilots would have to seriously consider if they prefer to be more powerful at shorter ranges, or less powerful at longer ranges. It is same idea as with guns - short range weapons are more powerful, long range ones are less powerful
Omara Otawan	Posted - 2009.01.24 08:56:00 - [2] Hmm, interesting idea, you think that could be a solution for the prevalence of high-dps Bss too, just have -20% range per damage mod?
fuxinos Caldari Guys 0f Sarcasm	Posted - 2009.01.24 09:00:00 - [3] Originally by: Ephemeron My idea is simple: Add a negative "side effect" to Signal Distortion Amplifier II -20% optimal range Think about it. A major problem with Falcons is that they are so powerful and easily operate in 140km ranges. Every Falcon pilot (who's not a newb) fits at least 2x Signal Distortion Amplifier, usually 3x. There's simply no point to fit anything else there. But now, with -20% range modifier, Falcon pilots would have to seriously consider if they prefer to be more powerful at shorter ranges, or less powerful at longer ranges. It is same idea as with guns - short range weapons are more powerful, long range ones are less powerful This would weaken the Falcons ability to survive a battle way to much, remember, he has NO tank. Apart from that, its a good idea, but Falcons NEEDS to get a defensive ability therefor to compensate. Either Dronebay, or the optimalbonus changed to resistbonus or more speed.
Ephemeron North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2009.01.24 09:06:00 - [4] It would still be operating within 50-80 KM ranges, which is pretty damn safe And nobody forces you to fight at closer range. If you prefer safety of 140km attack, by all means, just don't expect to perma-jamm 3 ships at once
Typhado3 Minmatar Ashen Lion Mining and Production Consortium Axiom Empire	Posted - 2009.01.24 09:59:00 - [5] seems like a decent idea. ccp fix mining agent missions % pls
Hugh Ruka Exploratio et Industria Morispatia	Posted - 2009.01.24 10:14:00 - [6] Originally by: Omara Otawan Edited by: Omara Otawan on 24/01/2009 08:56:17 Hmm, interesting idea, you think that could be a solution for the prevalence of high-dps BSs too, just have -20% range per damage mod? I like the damage mod suggestion :) OP's idea is fail ... there was a better one already that suggested to switch falcon optimal bonuses to falloff bonuses ...
Warrio Southern Cross Incorporated	Posted - 2009.01.24 10:20:00 - [7] Indeed.
Arous Drephius Perkone	Posted - 2009.01.24 10:53:00 - [8] Falcons don't need fixing. Whiners do.
Stefan F Enrave Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2009.01.24 11:24:00 - [9] Edited by: Stefan F on 24/01/2009 11:25:16 Sure... If you give it: - Scripts instead of different modules for each race - 7 slowslots to somekind of tanking it - 25m3 dronebay to have at least some DPS Then, i'm perfectly fine with the idea of the range nerfing attribute.
Malcanis R.E.C.O.N.	Posted - 2009.01.24 11:26:00 - [10] Look, the answer is simple, although not easy (1) Give Caldari recons a secondary e-war so that they have some reason to operate at medium range (2) Increase their combat ability and survivability to match the other recons so that they can operate at medium range; some speed, agility, extra low slots, a drone bay. Whatever. (3) Change the ECM range bonus to a bonus for whatever secondary e-war ability we're giving them. (4) (Optional) Change ECM altogether so that it works in a completely different way to what we have now, since even if Falcons were forced to operate at 500 meters, had 75 EHP, and CCP sent ninjas round to punch the pilot in the nuts, people would still whine that ECM was "overpowered". Hey presto: Caldari recons are much like other racial recons, with the additional bonus that they might even be somewhat viable solo ships.
Krystal Demishy	Posted - 2009.01.24 11:46:00 - [11] Originally by: fuxinos This would weaken the Falcons ability to survive a battle way to much, remember, he has NO tank. This is the most stupid thing you can say, and i hate when people say it! Other recons are made of paper too, but are far far away from the falcon efficiency! You said other extremely stupid things in your post, i don't want to waste my time with you anymore, becouse maybe you are just a f*ing troll.
Cibo Seidensha Amarr Biotronics Inc. Alternative Realities	Posted - 2009.01.24 11:47:00 - [12] Its funny to always hear "the falcon has no tank". It has a ton of midslots, thats where you could put your shield tank. You could fit a reasonable shield buffer tank here. Its not the ships fault, that everyone stuffs as many ECMs in here, as possible. It has no tank because it needs no tank. If it would need a tank, people would put a tank on it, then it would have one (kind of on par with the other recons). Its ECM power would go down, but thats the point. No other recon can fit 7 Ewar modules and still operate. To do this with the falcon and then complain about "no tank" is a horrible backward argument.
Malcanis R.E.C.O.N.	Posted - 2009.01.24 11:49:00 - [13] Originally by: Cibo Seidensha No other recon can fit 7 Ewar modules and still operate. . Curse can easily fit 2 tracking disruptors and 5 Neut/NOS.
Sarkiss Imperial Academy	Posted - 2009.01.24 11:51:00 - [14] I don't see why it should get a 2nd combat bonus, the other recon's bonus are barely used anyway. Pilgrim/Curse rarely use Tracking Disruptors, Minmatar recons don't use Painters from what I've seen, not that Ive seen many due to the web nerf which destroys them and gallente recons have been ****ed for ages. It's about time falcons get fitted like every other recon. I actually like this idea the OP suggested, forces them to choose, range or jamming power. So instead of fitting what is it, 5 ECM and MWD? You fit 3ECM and some shield extenders, like the other recons have to. Give it 25m3 dronebay/bandwidth too but keeps its highs the same and don't give it any sort of 2nd bonus.
fuxinos Caldari Guys 0f Sarcasm	Posted - 2009.01.24 11:55:00 - [15] Originally by: Ephemeron It would still be operating within 50-80 KM ranges, which is pretty damn safe And nobody forces you to fight at closer range. If you prefer safety of 140km attack, by all means, just don't expect to perma-jamm 3 ships at once Do you realy call 50-80Km safe for an 80mil-instapop-ship?
Malcanis R.E.C.O.N.	Posted - 2009.01.24 12:01:00 - [16] Originally by: fuxinos Originally by: Ephemeron It would still be operating within 50-80 KM ranges, which is pretty damn safe And nobody forces you to fight at closer range. If you prefer safety of 140km attack, by all means, just don't expect to perma-jamm 3 ships at once Do you realy call 50-80Km safe for an 80mil-instapop-ship? He means safe for the gang that might otherwise get jammed
The Tzar Malicious Intentions The Church.	Posted - 2009.01.24 12:29:00 - [17] Nice idea but if you're bringing the falcon in the same range as the other recons you also need to balance it in one or more of the following areas: Drone bay More mids for shield buffer More resists for shield buffer More Speed without having to gimp your EW strength (only recon that HAS to have full lowslot EW to be effective in its EW) Make ECM non-chance based if it engages at the same ranges as other recons. It definately is not fair if the falcon still might not jam whilst the Curse definately will TD at that range. The falcon IS NOT broken...., peoples ability to fit ECCM is. It bloody works, use it ffs.
lecrotta lecrotta Corp	Posted - 2009.01.24 12:33:00 - [18] Edited by: lecrotta on 24/01/2009 12:34:15 Originally by: fuxinos Originally by: Ephemeron It would still be operating within 50-80 KM ranges, which is pretty damn safe And nobody forces you to fight at closer range. If you prefer safety of 140km attack, by all means, just don't expect to perma-jamm 3 ships at once Do you realy call 50-80Km safe for an 80mil-instapop-ship? It is not safe, although its nicely within the range slightly boosted of pulse BS........yet another buff to i-win pulse BS. Falcons and ecm ships need range as they are chance based unlike other systems.
The Tzar Malicious Intentions The Church.	Posted - 2009.01.24 12:37:00 - [19] Originally by: lecrotta Falcons and ecm ships need range as they are chance based unlike other systems. Quoted for absolute truth. __________________________________________ 'Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear intelligent until they speak' __________________________________________
Sokratesz Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.	Posted - 2009.01.24 12:42:00 - [20] Originally by: Omara Otawan Edited by: Omara Otawan on 24/01/2009 08:56:17 Hmm, interesting idea, you think that could be a solution for the prevalence of high-dps BSs too, just have -20% range per damage mod? the 'problem' with high dps battleships is that there aren't enough with the crazy tanks people can field ever since the introduction of rigs. Your cap ship deserves CPR's!
Darwin Duck A Quest Millitia	Posted - 2009.01.24 12:43:00 - [21] So you want to take away the only really good PvP ship Caldari have? Sure make us pure PVE, that will be fun.
James Lyrus Lyrus Associates The Star Fraction	Posted - 2009.01.24 12:52:00 - [22] Originally by: Krystal Demishy This is the most stupid thing you can say, and i hate when people say it! Other recons are made of paper too.... And yet, they're not tying up their lowslots to do their thing, where the Falcon is.
Cohkka Celestial Apocalypse	Posted - 2009.01.24 12:54:00 - [23] Originally by: Stefan F Edited by: Stefan F on 24/01/2009 11:25:16 Sure... If you give it: - Scripts instead of different modules for each race - 7 slowslots to somekind of tanking it - 25m3 dronebay to have at least some DPS Then, i'm perfectly fine with the idea of the range nerfing attribute. Or you could tank it... just like any other recon has to. Sacrifice some med slots for surviveability or stuff a 1600mm in your lows + hardeners. Falcon is by far the most efficient/usefull and the safest Recon to be in. A nerf such as reducing range won't hurt...
TZeer BURN EDEN	Posted - 2009.01.24 12:56:00 - [24] Originally by: Ephemeron My idea is simple: Add a negative "side effect" to Signal Distortion Amplifier II -20% optimal range Think about it. A major problem with Falcons is that they are so powerful and easily operate in 140km ranges. Every Falcon pilot (who's not a newb) fits at least 2x Signal Distortion Amplifier, usually 3x. There's simply no point to fit anything else there. But now, with -20% range modifier, Falcon pilots would have to seriously consider if they prefer to be more powerful at shorter ranges, or less powerful at longer ranges. It is same idea as with guns - short range weapons are more powerful, long range ones are less powerful And you just ****ed all the other EWAR ships at the same time. Yeah great idea. NOT. 1: Falcon would still be better then a rook. Same stats, but with a cloak. 2: Use rigs and gangship instead to bypass the penalty on the modules. 3: Widow would be "lol 40km optimal" and die in a fire. 4: Scorpion would have loltastic jam stats or have some decent jam stats and never see fleetfight again... TBH, I have seen better ideas then this.
Vokradacka	Posted - 2009.01.24 13:07:00 - [25] give "restrictions" to jam modules: - +25% str to all - max 1 fitted to "normal" ships - max 2 fitted to BB/kitsune - max 3 fitted to falcon/rook/scorpion - +little more dmg to falcon/rook(150dps falcon, 250dps rook at lvl 5 skills) this ill bring caldari recons closer to battlefield
Murina Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2009.01.24 13:12:00 - [26] Originally by: Vokradacka give "restrictions" to jam modules: - +25% str to all - max 1 fitted to "normal" ships - max 2 fitted to BB/kitsune - max 3 fitted to falcon/rook/scorpion - +little more dmg to falcon/rook(150dps falcon, 250dps rook at lvl 5 skills) this ill bring caldari recons closer to battlefield How about just removing every ship and module that does not sit within your prefered gank/tank setup range?. Originally by: Amira Shadowsong Solo is all about skill not ship fits Originally by: Amira Shadowsong The anti inty fit is absolutely crap against cruisers and AFs.
Vera Vengeance	Posted - 2009.01.24 13:13:00 - [27] Originally by: Darwin Duck So you want to take away the only really good PvP ship Caldari have? Sure make us pure PVE, that will be fun. That just makes me lol... Do you solo with it? Do you fit a scrambler? Do you fit a webber? Do you ectualy do damage? Omg! only thing ppl do with it is fitting a full rack of ecm's! Besides, learn to fit caldari ships for pvp m8. They're awesome at it.
lebrata Hedion University	Posted - 2009.01.24 13:16:00 - [28] Originally by: Vera Vengeance That just makes me lol... Do you solo with it? Do you fit a scrambler? Do you fit a webber? Do you ectualy do damage? Omg! only thing ppl do with it is fitting a full rack of ecm's! So its useless at anything but jamming and even that is chance based and can and does fail at rather unfortunate times....and now you wanna make it useless at that as well?.
Sokratesz Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.	Posted - 2009.01.24 13:20:00 - [29] Originally by: Cohkka Or you could tank it... just like any other recon has to. Sacrifice some med slots for surviveability or stuff a 1600mm in your lows + hardeners. Falcon is by far the most efficient/usefull and the safest Recon to be in. A nerf such as reducing range won't hurt... It seems clear that you have no idea what you're talking about. Falcon without at least 2 and preferably 3 signal distortion amps = not worth much. Your cap ship deserves CPR's!
Vera Vengeance	Posted - 2009.01.24 13:20:00 - [30] So its useless at anything but jamming and even that is chance based and can and does fail at rather unfortunate moments............and now you wanna make it useless at that as well?. Did i said anything about nerfing it in my post? But yeah, tbh, they do steal away the fun off small gang / solo pvp. That's for sure.

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