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Ifni Zen Minmatar Shiva Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2009.03.25 21:41:00 - [331] Thank you CCP for taking the time to hear both sides and for being willing to re-evaluate a controversial decision. ---- rawr
Crumplecorn Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations	Posted - 2009.03.25 21:42:00 - [332] Knew it would happen, CCP have shown themselves to be silly on occasion, but also usually recover in the end. - DesuSigs
Lizhia Birath Minmatar Rogue Industrial Group The Fifth Syndicate	Posted - 2009.03.25 21:42:00 - [333] Originally by: Avon Edited by: Avon on 25/03/2009 21:29:55 Originally by: Lizhia Birath I seem to remember Kenzoku having sov in a few systems straight off the bat thou, so one might argue that you joined Kenzoku just to kling on to sov in the few systems you could.. But I dont remember exactly if that was the case. That is simply because corp towers which were already claiming sov continue to do so if you join another alliance, the 7 day mechanic does not apply in that case (and no, this is not a unique BoB feature, we knew it was likely to happen because we had heard of it happening before). What people are overlooking is that at the time no-one knew how the situation would be resolved, or how fast. Hindsight is 20/20, but at the time things were no-where near as clear. Precedent indicated that The Band of Brothers corp would have its name changed so that we could reclaim it, so there seemed to be no particular reason to create fresh alliance when there was an alt alliance just floating around. It was a logistical convenience. Other than that, there was no special advantage to joining that alliance. no I ment that Ken got sov right after BoB was disbanded not after the old bob corporations joined, thats the part thats a bit fuzzy, I do remember Ken getting sov in all systems pretty fast after ex-bob joined and that it was discussed as it seems not even god knows how the **** sov really works. And thus it could be claimed that ex.bob joined ken to get a few extra days of sov ticking in those systems.
Sir Marksalot	Posted - 2009.03.25 21:43:00 - [334] Originally by: Destination SkillQueue Originally by: Loki L'Odin This will get swamped but im gonna give it a try. Terrible decision by ccp to reverse their previous decision, simply because goons flood a thread with whines. It just doesn't look professional at all and personally it's lowered my view of them(CCP), goons view couldn't get any lower. Thought the CSM was made to try and stop CCP doing fail things in-game? It was obvious, that while many goons did indeed complain about it, so did many others. The initial dicision was very poorly justified and was infact a slap in the face to the stated naming policy. The goons had a legitimate grievance in this case. Unlike their opponents, they actually logically argued for their point of view. All the opposition could muster was basicly: LOL, look at the goons crying or goons lacked e-honor when they disbanded BOB, so bending the rules doesn't matter. Entertaining, but it's not going to convince anyone. gasp You're clearly siding with goons. You must be a goon alt.
Jack Gates Gallente GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.25 21:45:00 - [335] I am glad to see that CCP is no longer playing favorites and that it has put that ugly part of its history behind them. Thanks for being fair. :3
Khlitouris RegusII	Posted - 2009.03.25 21:45:00 - [336] Originally by: Loki L'Odin This will get swamped but im gonna give it a try. Terrible decision by ccp to reverse their previous decision, simply because goons flood a thread with whines. It just doesn't look professional at all and personally it's lowered my view of them(CCP), goons view couldn't get any lower. Thought the CSM was made to try and stop CCP doing fail things in-game? It's a good job ccp didn't change there decision because of goons then but because they did the wrong thing in the first place and had the balls to admit to it.
kiez'm Hahz Amarr Royal Amarr Institute	Posted - 2009.03.25 21:50:00 - [337] Edited by: kiez''m Hahz on 25/03/2009 21:55:22 somethingawful.com just happened here! edit: I'm gonna make some toast.... brb
Vladimir Griftin Minmatar	Posted - 2009.03.25 21:51:00 - [338] Originally by: Avon What people are overlooking is that at the time no-one knew how the situation would be resolved, or how fast. Hindsight is 20/20, but at the time things were no-where near as clear. Really the biggest mistake was assuming there was anything to resolve. In everyone else's eyes it was a perfectly executed piece of treachery using in game mechanics. You have to admit, the war dec thing was like icing on a cake.
Khlitouris RegusII	Posted - 2009.03.25 21:52:00 - [339] Originally by: XoPhyte Edited by: XoPhyte on 25/03/2009 21:43:48 Originally by: Talzaris Contacting GM's to get them to help you is for when something in their game bugs out and extraordinary measures are needed to rectify it. Not when you just don't feel like following the proper in-game methods of playing. So I guess the same should be said if you request your ship to be reimbursed? Or how about capital ship arrays? Hmmm. I guess goonswarm has issued petitions for things to be changed as well... Let me find those threadnaughts that we started where we call you cheaters.... Darn, can't find any. Since we should be responsible for enforcing the rules, can I get on the CCP payroll please? Also I love how a petition is "contacting the gm's" Don't you guys get tired of the tinfoil? a petition is contacting the gm's every petition ive put in has been answered by a gm anyway.
XoPhyte Black Nova Corp KenZoku	Posted - 2009.03.25 21:53:00 - [340] Originally by: Caius Proximus The fact that you guys seem to treat petitioning as a game mechanic is pretty illuminating. Huh? Corp names, character names, alliance names are petitioned all the time. So it's up to us to know and enforce all of these name change rules? Again, where can I sign up to get on the CCP payroll since apparently I have a lot more responsibility in this game than I had previously thought...
XoPhyte Black Nova Corp KenZoku	Posted - 2009.03.25 21:54:00 - [341] Edited by: XoPhyte on 25/03/2009 21:55:22 Originally by: Khlitouris RegusII a petition is contacting the gm's every petition ive put in has been answered by a gm anyway. Correct, which a legitimate mechanism. Quite a bit different then the "BOB cheated" threadnaught that is going on atm don't you think and that we "contacted the GM's". No, we simply submited a petition on the same day that the name was taken. It took 2 months for CCP to "investigate" and change the name and then 48 hours to "re-investigate" and overturn that decision.
Avon Caldari Black Nova Corp KenZoku	Posted - 2009.03.25 21:55:00 - [342] Originally by: Vladimir Griftin Really the biggest mistake was assuming there was anything to resolve. Precedent indicated otherwise about the name. Or are you saying rules shouldn't be applied equally and fairly? I thought that was what the whole feigned offence thread was about in the first place? アニメ漫画です
Momoha GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.25 21:56:00 - [343] Originally by: XoPhyte Correct, which a legitimate mechanism. Quite a bit different then the "BOB cheated" threadnaught that is going on atm don't you think? Oh, so you're not objecting to the fact that you cheated? Thanks for clarifying. All you care about is if the goonies look like the evil bastard they are, right?
Vincent Gaines Avis de Captura	Posted - 2009.03.25 21:57:00 - [344] Originally by: Avon Originally by: Vladimir Griftin Really the biggest mistake was assuming there was anything to resolve. Precedent indicated otherwise about the name. Or are you saying rules shouldn't be applied equally and fairly? I thought that was what the whole feigned offence thread was about in the first place? stop making sense.
Caius Proximus GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.25 21:58:00 - [345] Originally by: XoPhyte Originally by: Caius Proximus The fact that you guys seem to treat petitioning as a game mechanic is pretty illuminating. Huh? Corp names, character names, alliance names are petitioned all the time. So it's up to us to know and enforce all of these name change rules? Again, where can I sign up to get on the CCP payroll since apparently I have a lot more responsibility in this game than I had previously thought... You didn't make a new alliance because you couldn't because you had been wardecced and you knew that at the time. Instead of following the game mechanics and creating a new holding corp, you petitioned to CCP, hoping to cut some corners. Do you think it's okay for players to petition to CCP to skirt game mechanics when they know that they're doing so?
Momoha GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.25 21:58:00 - [346] Edited by: Momoha on 25/03/2009 22:00:30 Edited by: Momoha on 25/03/2009 22:00:13 Originally by: Avon Precedent indicated otherwise about the name. Or are you saying rules shouldn't be applied equally and fairly? I thought that was what the whole feigned offence thread was about in the first place? What precedent? No incident like this has ever occurred, which is why CCP jumping the gun and giving you the benefit of the doubt was the wrong course of action. You can see this reflected in the reversal.
Quaristice	Posted - 2009.03.25 21:59:00 - [347] This is pretty nuts. I cant believe CCP actually went back and reversed it. 3 cheers for fairness!!!
Sihirbaz Amarr	Posted - 2009.03.25 21:59:00 - [348] So, it took you 2 months to come to a decision on this complicated(it's just a name-change request ffs?) case. And, you forgot to check the creation date of the alliance in question.... This just proves that either you are not good enough to be in charge of such investigations or you are lying...Either way, I hope you won't be in charge of such investigations again.
Avon Caldari Black Nova Corp KenZoku	Posted - 2009.03.25 22:00:00 - [349] Originally by: Momoha What precedent? No incident like this has ever occurred, which is why CCP jumping the gun and giving you the benefit of the doubt was the wrong course of action. You can see this reflected in the reversal. Jumping the gun usually indicates acting too soon. This whole thing came about because they took so long. Just sayin' アニメ漫画です
Vincent Gaines Avis de Captura	Posted - 2009.03.25 22:01:00 - [350] Edited by: Vincent Gaines on 25/03/2009 22:02:19 Originally by: Momoha Originally by: Avon Precedent indicated otherwise about the name. Or are you saying rules shouldn't be applied equally and fairly? I thought that was what the whole feigned offence thread was about in the first place? What precedent? No incident like this has ever occurred, which is why CCP jumping the gun and giving you the benefit of the doubt was the wrong course of action. You can see this reflected in the reversal. yes, it did. CoW had it done, as was stated several times already. CoW got their name back, same circumstances with an enemy nabbing the name, only it was because CoW forgot to pay a bill
Sir Marksalot	Posted - 2009.03.25 22:02:00 - [351] Originally by: Avon Originally by: Momoha What precedent? No incident like this has ever occurred, which is why CCP jumping the gun and giving you the benefit of the doubt was the wrong course of action. You can see this reflected in the reversal. Jumping the gun usually indicates acting too soon. This whole thing came about because they took so long. Just sayin' Oh please. you're saying you'd rather be a beaver? At least now you're a bad ass anime. Japanese is cool, right?
XoPhyte Black Nova Corp KenZoku	Posted - 2009.03.25 22:02:00 - [352] Edited by: XoPhyte on 25/03/2009 22:06:48 Edited by: XoPhyte on 25/03/2009 22:03:44 Originally by: Momoha Originally by: XoPhyte Correct, which a legitimate mechanism. Quite a bit different then the "BOB cheated" threadnaught that is going on atm don't you think? Oh, so you're not objecting to the fact that you cheated? Thanks for clarifying. All you care about is if the goonies look like the evil bastard they are, right? Bolded and underlined for you. Seems like I have to do that for quite a bit of you goonies. But yes, we cheated by changing our name by requesting the change through in game mechanisms following previous precedent set by CCP in changing the name for COW. Hopefully this brings much needed closure in your life. I see how we cheated there and I personally apologize. /sarcasm
Momoha GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.25 22:03:00 - [353] Originally by: Avon Jumping the gun usually indicates acting too soon. This whole thing came about because they took so long. Just sayin' Thanks buddy. This has no relevance to the situation at hand. Again, what precedent was CCP enforcing with the original decision that was later reversed? I bet you can't answer this.
Vincent Gaines Avis de Captura	Posted - 2009.03.25 22:03:00 - [354] Originally by: Sir Marksalot Oh please. you're saying you'd rather be a beaver? At least now you're a bad ass anime. Japanese is cool, right? I'm sure they just want "Band of Brothers" back.
Vincent Gaines Avis de Captura	Posted - 2009.03.25 22:04:00 - [355] Edited by: Vincent Gaines on 25/03/2009 22:04:23 Originally by: Momoha Originally by: Avon Jumping the gun usually indicates acting too soon. This whole thing came about because they took so long. Just sayin' Thanks buddy. This has no relevance to the situation at hand. Again, what precedent was CCP enforcing with the original decision that was later reversed? I bet you can't answer this. ah clever. original decision.
Momoha GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.25 22:04:00 - [356] Originally by: Vincent Gaines I'm sure they just want "Band of Brothers" back. I'm sure they just want to have their CCP dev friends help them cheat.
Avon Caldari Black Nova Corp KenZoku	Posted - 2009.03.25 22:04:00 - [357] Originally by: Momoha Originally by: Avon Jumping the gun usually indicates acting too soon. This whole thing came about because they took so long. Just sayin' Thanks buddy. This has no relevance to the situation at hand. Again, what precedent was CCP enforcing with the original decision that was later reversed? I bet you can't answer this. You should wait for the large print version of this thread. It will have a maze at the back too. Maybe a little colouring in section in the middle if you are really lucky. Wouldn't that be fun? アニメ漫画です
Garathyal	Posted - 2009.03.25 22:05:00 - [358] Originally by: Orree Originally by: ArmyOfMe dear god, sad to see goons can pressure ccp into everything they want like this. clearly showes that if you spam enough on the forums you get your will Nevermind what was done was wrong and reversing it was the correct thing to do, right? C'mon, man...think about it. I have no doubt that some of the people who had a problem with it did or said what they did out of spite, but there were a good number of people who were appalled at the action as being on contravention of the rules related to name changes (mainly that they simply rarely, if ever, allow them). The action that was taken circumvented game mechanics. If Kenny wanted a new alliance name, all they had to do was pay the billion, form the alliance and have their corps join it...just like everyone else. The number of Goon postings on the subject really has no bearing on the matter at hand other than perhaps being annoying. You seem rational and honest but yet you and your alliance are propping Goons up in game and here. How can anyone trust your integrity or anything you have to say? The bob people are being honest - at the time what else would you do? Don't buy goon propaganda and build the new Bob - MM have a better name that that. Seriously mate - MM seemed a decent force in game and have a name - playing with a bunch of griefing whiners who like to spin things is pulling you down. Honestly take a serious look at yourselves. You are embroiled in the middle of it all and Goons are laughing at you all.
Poopsock Alarmclock Minmatar GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.25 22:05:00 - [359] Originally by: XoPhyte Don't you guys get tired of the tinfoil? haargoth sure did
Vincent Gaines Avis de Captura	Posted - 2009.03.25 22:05:00 - [360] Edited by: Vincent Gaines on 25/03/2009 22:05:18 Originally by: Momoha Originally by: Vincent Gaines I'm sure they just want "Band of Brothers" back. I'm sure they just want to have their CCP dev friends help them cheat. yeah you're about 3 years too late for that insult.

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