EVE Search - Is this an EULA violation or valid scam?

All Channels

Crime and Punishment

Is this an EULA violation or valid scam?

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]

Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 .. 13 :: one page
Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Everybruce	Posted - 2009.05.03 19:33:00 - [1] Just scammed a guy for 17.5 billion, he wanted to buy my char... but accepted a contract for a sleipnir for 17.5 billion.. here's the chatlogs (might take alot of reading through).. is this an EULA violation or not? There were NO forum posts, and NO evemails involved in this at all.. he just accepted my sleipnir for 17.5 billion as far as he can see - i've petitioned it, but would like advice from this forum... Quote: --------------------------------------------------------------- Channel ID: 2143102800 Channel Name: Private Chat (alone) Listener: ME Session started: 2009.05.03 15:22:09 --------------------------------------------------------------- [ 2009.05.03 15:22:15 ] ME > hey, sorry.. i was out [ 2009.05.03 15:32:17 ] HIM > np [ 2009.05.03 15:32:20 ] HIM > just got back myself [ 2009.05.03 15:32:38 ] ME > ah hello [ 2009.05.03 15:32:41 ] HIM > lo =) [ 2009.05.03 15:32:59 ] ME > your offer certainly interests me [ 2009.05.03 15:33:40 ] HIM > Good to hear :) [ 2009.05.03 15:34:45 ] ME > one sec, making a petition [ 2009.05.03 15:34:51 ] HIM > kk [ 2009.05.03 15:38:22 ] ME > okay :) [ 2009.05.03 15:38:36 ] ME > would you want any assets with the character? [ 2009.05.03 15:38:45 ] ME > I can chuck in a fitted thanatos, sleipnir, hurricane + rapier in the mix [ 2009.05.03 15:38:50 ] ME > they can come in the thanatos' ship bay [ 2009.05.03 15:39:31 ] HIM > While I wouldn't mind them, unfortunately I don't have the extra isk to toss in to compensate [ 2009.05.03 15:40:52 ] HIM > Atm I am consolidating assets, but I don't see being able to come up with much more than 17.5b. [ 2009.05.03 15:41:08 ] ME > aha no problem, I can sell them off myself [ 2009.05.03 15:41:26 ] HIM > k :) [ 2009.05.03 15:41:31 ] ME > though I would perhaps look for a bit more than 17b for ed, just a little more [ 2009.05.03 15:41:46 ] ME > if you were to go to 17.5 I could chuck in the sleipnir [ 2009.05.03 15:42:05 ] HIM > Hmm. [ 2009.05.03 15:42:30 ] HIM > It's in the cards, have to round off a few variables first. [ 2009.05.03 15:43:16 ] HIM > I have around 1.9b in ship assets (A Vargur + Maelstrom) to get off my hands, depending on what I have to let those go for, I'll see what I can do. [ 2009.05.03 15:43:39 ] ME > im not in a massive rush to sell, as in, I can give you time to reach that [ 2009.05.03 15:43:49 ] ME > as i'll have to line up a new char to buy [ 2009.05.03 15:45:59 ] HIM > Very similar position to what I am in :) [ 2009.05.03 15:47:28 ] ME > oh? [ 2009.05.03 15:48:15 ] HIM > This character is being sold, you're one of my potentional upgrades :P [ 2009.05.03 15:48:39 ] ME > aha I see [ 2009.05.03 15:51:48 ] ME > got a link to your char? [ 2009.05.03 15:53:00 ] HIM > SUre, sec. [ 2009.05.03 15:53:07 ] HIM > http://eve-sheet.com/skills/Rho_Jones [ 2009.05.03 15:53:25 ] HIM > Fairly similar to Ed, just less SP and a different crosstrain [ 2009.05.03 15:57:05 ] ME > aha will look now [ 2009.05.03 16:02:24 ] ME > aha not for me :) [ 2009.05.03 16:02:34 ] ME > if i sell ed i will have like 25b to spend on a char :) [ 2009.05.03 16:02:35 ] HIM > I already have a buyer, so that's ok :) [ 2009.05.03 16:02:48 ] ME > so when do you think you can buy ed? [ 2009.05.03 16:03:31 ] HIM > Well, I'm 90% certain I can get this characters sale completed in a matter of hours. That just leaves the sale of my Vargur / Maelstrom. [ 2009.05.03 16:09:26 ] ME > aha righto [ 2009.05.03 16:49:23 ] HIM > Alright, might be ready to roll in a matter of 30-60minutes [ 2009.05.03 16:49:54 ] ME > I will have to get some stuff sorted [ 2009.05.03 16:49:57 ] ME > gathering of assets and that [ 2009.05.03 16:51:19 ] HIM > Certainly [ 2009.05.03 17:04:44 ] HIM > Just curious on a timeframe that we're looking at - hours or a day or two? [ 2009.05.03 17:06:41 ] ME > a few horus I think [ 2009.05.03 17:06:43 ] ME > are you on tonight?
Everybruce	Posted - 2009.05.03 19:35:00 - [2] Quote: [ 2009.05.03 17:06:43 ] ME > are you on tonight? [ 2009.05.03 17:19:59 ] HIM > I'll be leaving in about 2 hours, and back on after about 6 hours. Then I will be available for several hours in the evening [ 2009.05.03 17:20:14 ] HIM > But I don't have a problem sending the isk and awaiting transfer if you wanted to get it done while I was away. [ 2009.05.03 17:21:01 ] ME > okay, can wait until tomorrow I think would be better [ 2009.05.03 17:21:03 ] ME > I live on EU time [ 2009.05.03 17:21:10 ] ME > so in 8 hours it's like 2am for me [ 2009.05.03 17:21:15 ] HIM > aye. [ 2009.05.03 17:27:10 ] ME > sure, could well do that [ 2009.05.03 17:27:14 ] ME > will let you know for sure in a minute [ 2009.05.03 17:35:09 ] HIM > kk [ 2009.05.03 17:38:58 ] ME > any chance you could go up to 18? [ 2009.05.03 17:39:02 ] ME > will include the carrier for that [ 2009.05.03 17:39:35 ] HIM > hmm [ 2009.05.03 17:40:01 ] ME > character forum says I cant include assets ont he char [ 2009.05.03 17:40:05 ] ME > so will contract them to you separately [ 2009.05.03 17:40:14 ] ME > nvm the thanatos [ 2009.05.03 17:40:17 ] ME > have a corp buyer for it [ 2009.05.03 17:40:46 ] HIM > kk, 17.5 it is then :P [ 2009.05.03 17:43:00 ] ME > you are selling rho? [ 2009.05.03 17:43:04 ] ME > or selling another char [ 2009.05.03 17:43:21 ] HIM > Rho. [ 2009.05.03 17:44:19 ] ME > ah i will delete that contract then [ 2009.05.03 17:44:41 ] HIM > Ah np, I can contract it from rho to my alt before transfer, no worries [ 2009.05.03 17:44:52 ] ME > ah will remake it [ 2009.05.03 17:44:56 ] HIM > :P [ 2009.05.03 17:45:02 ] HIM > For the Sleip I presume? [ 2009.05.03 17:45:06 ] ME > aye [ 2009.05.03 17:45:14 ] HIM > Set it up for 500m [ 2009.05.03 17:45:30 ] HIM > I will send the other 17b shortly [ 2009.05.03 17:46:32 ] ME > afk going to pick someone up [ 2009.05.03 17:46:34 ] ME > will be back in about 45 mins [ 2009.05.03 17:46:36 ] HIM > kk [ 2009.05.03 17:46:56 ] HIM > I will transfer the isk during that time probably. I will send a mail with the account to transfer to [ 2009.05.03 17:47:06 ] HIM > and a contact to talk with me in the future Quote: --------------------------------------------------------------- Channel ID: 2143110440 Channel Name: Private Chat (alone) Listener: ME Session started: 2009.05.03 18:36:17 --------------------------------------------------------------- [ 2009.05.03 18:38:47 ] ME > hey [ 2009.05.03 18:43:57 ] HIM > lo [ 2009.05.03 18:44:53 ] HIM > Alright, so I'm prepared to send the isk now, and have you transfer the character sometime tonight or tomorrow morning (obviously prefer tonight, but I'm pretty flexible). [ 2009.05.03 18:45:38 ] ME > what about the sleipnir? [ 2009.05.03 18:45:51 ] HIM > Either contract it now to Rho, or contract it later to Toscaria [ 2009.05.03 18:46:15 ] ME > contract is there now [ 2009.05.03 18:46:24 ] HIM > Not seeing it [ 2009.05.03 18:47:14 ] HIM > Set it up as a Item Exchange, private to HIM, 500m as price [ 2009.05.03 18:47:20 ] ME > [Multiple Items] [ 2009.05.03 18:47:30 ] HIM > Ah, I see. [ 2009.05.03 18:47:45 ] HIM > Odd that it doesn't show up [ 2009.05.03 18:47:56 ] HIM > Ah, nm found it. [ 2009.05.03 18:48:33 ] HIM > heh, out in 0.0, suppose I can manage something. [ 2009.05.03 18:50:26 ] ME > not a place well frequented [ 2009.05.03 18:50:33 ] HIM > Some irony that I used to live there. Anyway accepting now. [ 2009.05.03 18:51:49 ] ME > you just bought one goddamn expensive sleipnir [ 2009.05.03 18:51:57 ] HIM > :P [ 2009.05.03 18:52:30 ] HIM > For the transfer specifics, the account name is: 1337pyrax [ 2009.05.03 18:52:46 ] HIM > Give me 30 seconds to clear up a character slot (character is pre-deleted just needs to be finalized) [ 2009.05.03 18:52:50 ] ME > will be online tomorrow morning
Everybruce	Posted - 2009.05.03 19:36:00 - [3] Quote: [ 2009.05.03 18:52:50 ] ME > will be online tomorrow morning about 09:00 eve time [ 2009.05.03 18:52:51 ] HIM > Brb [ 2009.05.03 18:53:00 ] HIM > kk [ 2009.05.03 18:53:01 ] ME > girlfriend wants me over tonight [ 2009.05.03 18:53:08 ] HIM > That's fine. [ 2009.05.03 18:53:21 ] HIM > Your future contact after transfer is HIS ALT [ 2009.05.03 18:53:41 ] HIM > Will send a mail to confirm account name and various details [ 2009.05.03 18:55:08 ] ME > HIS ALT [ 2009.05.03 18:55:20 ] HIM > Yep - Info mailed [ 2009.05.03 18:55:34 ] HIM > Any questions? [ 2009.05.03 18:59:46 ] ME > its ok [ 2009.05.03 18:59:50 ] ME > on phone [ 2009.05.03 19:01:40 ] HIM > Alright, going to transfer this character to it's new buyer. Send any questions you have in the future to HIS ALT, my alt. o7 [ 2009.05.03 19:01:47 ] ME > plau [ 2009.05.03 19:01:48 ] ME > okay
Everybruce	Posted - 2009.05.03 19:37:00 - [4] If it is an EULA violation, or rules offence i'll send the isk back to HIS ALT in full.
Lanissum The Python Cartel.	Posted - 2009.05.03 19:40:00 - [5] Or, you'll just get banned XD But imo, can't see why not, if you didn't do any forum stuff. And it was just a contract... who cares how you got him to accept it? 'I have a large portion of Chribba's hord of Veldspar, but inorder ot access it, I'll need your help to pay a transfer fee of 17.5 Billion. If you help me, you'll get 30 bil of veld. Accept this contract w/ my Slephner as collateral.' -sig- Check this out! Get Free Mods!
Jimer Lins Gallente Noir.	Posted - 2009.05.03 19:45:00 - [6] Character scams are not allowed. Only CCP can tell you if what you did was a EULA violation. They'll tell you by banning your account if it was. I doubt that whether you've returned anything will factor into their decision. So, here's the possible outcomes I see: 1) Not a EULA violation, you keep ISK. 2) EULA violation, you get a stern warning, he gets ISK back. 3) EULA violation, you get banned, he gets ISK back. In any case, I'd avoid spending the ISK, as if you get #2, you'll want to have a positive wallet balance. Corp killboard-How to Kill Logoffskis
Dear Abby	Posted - 2009.05.03 19:49:00 - [7] Originally by: Jimer Lins Character scams are not allowed. Only CCP can tell you if what you did was a EULA violation. They'll tell you by banning your account if it was. I doubt that whether you've returned anything will factor into their decision. So, here's the possible outcomes I see: 1) Not a EULA violation, you keep ISK. 2) EULA violation, you get a stern warning, he gets ISK back. 3) EULA violation, you get banned, he gets ISK back. In any case, I'd avoid spending the ISK, as if you get #2, you'll want to have a positive wallet balance. 4) they both get banned for sharing account information and not using set up transfer methods for character transfers. If I was ccp I would take an loong look at the isk used since the player sending it seems to have acquired it without a knowledge of the game and its mechanics.
Myra2007 Shafrak Industries	Posted - 2009.05.03 19:51:00 - [8] Look, the only real answer can be given by gms. Tbh though - and thats purely my gut feeling speaking there - i think you might be in trouble. I do think character scams are forbidden and i don't think this rule is restricted to the character bazar. However now that is just freaking hilarious. How can people raise 17.5b in this game and not realize they're being set up like that? The chatlogs also contain character names and whats more important an account name. Personally i'd strongly advise you to at least remove the account name from the logs as posting real life or account info of people is prohibited iirc. Also don't forget to let us know what the official answer is. You must not post gm replies here, but paraphrasing the content is within the rules from what i've seen. -- Originally by: Jasper Dark I agree! Lets go back into caves and lick rocks!
Apoctasy The Python Cartel. The Gurlstas Associates	Posted - 2009.05.03 19:52:00 - [9] tbh it just sounds like a regular scam. You weren't specifically scamming him out of a character, such as for example making him pay 117 billion for a crappy char you lied about. You just socially engineered him to accept a sleipnir contract for 17 billion.
Everybruce	Posted - 2009.05.03 19:53:00 - [10] Originally by: Myra2007 Look, the only real answer can be given by gms. Tbh though - and thats purely my gut feeling speaking there - i think you might be in trouble. I do think character scams are forbidden and i don't think this rule is restricted to the character bazar. However now that is just freaking hilarious. How can people raise 17.5b in this game and not realize they're being set up like that? The chatlogs also contain character names and whats more important an account name. Personally i'd strongly advise you to at least remove the account name from the logs as posting real life or account info of people is prohibited iirc. Also don't forget to let us know what the official answer is. You must not post gm replies here, but paraphrasing the content is within the rules from what i've seen. A genuine mistake, im still a bit stunned by it all.. have removed all sensitive information from the post
Jimer Lins Gallente Noir.	Posted - 2009.05.03 19:55:00 - [11] Originally by: Apoctasy tbh it just sounds like a regular scam. You weren't specifically scamming him out of a character, such as for example making him pay 117 billion for a crappy char you lied about. You just socially engineered him to accept a sleipnir contract for 17 billion. The problem is that unlike other scam types, the character data cannot be verified, which is why CCP says specifically that scams involving characters are not allowed. All other scamming and lying in the game is allowed so long as the victim could have verified something along the way. I'm putting my ISK on this being a EULA violation and that the banhammer is already falling. Corp killboard-How to Kill Logoffskis
Michael Corinthos	Posted - 2009.05.03 20:05:00 - [12] Originally by: Jimer Lins Originally by: Apoctasy tbh it just sounds like a regular scam. You weren't specifically scamming him out of a character, such as for example making him pay 117 billion for a crappy char you lied about. You just socially engineered him to accept a sleipnir contract for 17 billion. The problem is that unlike other scam types, the character data cannot be verified, which is why CCP says specifically that scams involving characters are not allowed. All other scamming and lying in the game is allowed so long as the victim could have verified something along the way. I'm putting my ISK on this being a EULA violation and that the banhammer is already falling. From this thread about the rules involving character transfers: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1006123 Originally by: CCP Mitnal Agreements on the forums or in game, or winning an auction does not guarantee a character will be transferred to you. The seller may choose to renege on a deal at any time, prior to the transaction being completedAgreements on the forums or in game, or winning an auction does not guarantee a character will be transferred to you. The seller may choose to renege on a deal at any time, prior to the transaction being completed Now here, the victim sent ISK and the "seller" reneged. That doesn't seem bannable... CCP might return the ISK to the victim, but I'd be very surprised if they ban the OP. After all, I don't see anywhere where it's expressly forbidden to carry out a scam involving character transfers. By comparison, the unsecure transfer of GTCs IS expressly forbidden (see here: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1006107 "Any forms of GTC trades outside the CCP created systems are not allowed or supported by CCP.") which by extension makes running a scam based on GTCs against the rules. Further, the Character Bazaar Rules thread opens with the line: "In an effort to reduce the amount of character scams, GM workload and player frustration, the following changes are being made to the announcements concerning character sales or auctions for ISK." Of special note is the use of the word "reduce" rather than "eliminate." Like just about everything else in EVE, I think player stupidity is a sanctioned factor in these dealings. I'm very interested to see how this plays out.
Apoctasy The Python Cartel. The Gurlstas Associates	Posted - 2009.05.03 20:31:00 - [13] needs moar internet spaceships lawyers
Everybruce	Posted - 2009.05.03 20:38:00 - [14] Edited by: Everybruce on 03/05/2009 20:39:03 at the point he asked me to contract him a sleipnir for 500m infers a separate transaction, the fact that he accepted the sleipnir 17.5b could be another matter? would be nice if the rules were a bit clearer on this
Asuka Smith Gallente StarHunt	Posted - 2009.05.03 20:47:00 - [15] Regardless of what the first GM says make sure you escalate to a senior GM so we can get a definitive answer. I have a feeling that any scam involving character transfers, or even the appearance of a character transfer will likely be deemed a EULA violation. But on the other hand the in-game contract system is not capable of creating a EULA violating contract, and you got your ISK through the contract system, so it is pretty foggy territory.
Benedikt Miloslav	Posted - 2009.05.03 20:55:00 - [16] A few points in the dicussion, which you forgot to edit out (1.9b, vargur, maelstrom and "rho") make it pretty clear the victim here was Rho Jones' previous owner, although there was no indication of his alt's name, it's most likely Kaptain Klo. I do believe that this is still considered a character scam, but as there was no post in the forum (most of the rules directly relate to that), I think you might get away without a ban.
Maisonian Amarr The Green Machine	Posted - 2009.05.03 21:11:00 - [17] See, I'm not too sure here. The 'ACTUAL' scam was involving an in-game item placed on contract that was sold for an obceene amount. The fact that the OP's 'character' was supposedly being sold is immaterial. Its the same as saying "I have 'object X' I'd like to sell cheap, give me Y amount of Isk and I'll transfer it to you at a later date". As there was no garuntuee that any trading of character was to take place, I'd find it difficult to justify a ban for this.
isdisco3 Reaper Industries Eternal Rapture	Posted - 2009.05.03 23:34:00 - [18] he just accepted a 17.5b contract. He didn't send you 17.5b saying "this for the character." Therefore, it can't be a scam. Especially since you didn't say 'accept this contract and i'll send char later.' Should be legit imo.
Lord DevilHanzo Gallente The Crane Technique	Posted - 2009.05.04 00:13:00 - [19] Originally by: isdisco3 Should be legit imo. I agree, dont see this as being any different from the 1,499,999,999 invulnerability field scams I see in local all the time. If the guy wasn't clued up enough to check the items in the contract then thats his own fault. The amount should not make any difference, if CCP do see this as a break of EULA then I expect them to start banning all accounts in trade hubs that are pulling similar stunts on a regular basis.
Misanth The Glenn Quagmire Finishing School for Young Ladies Eternal Rapture	Posted - 2009.05.04 00:50:00 - [20] Originally by: Apoctasy needs moar internet spaceships lawyers - I'd tell you why but then I'll have to kill you. And to kill you I'd have to log in. And to log in I'd have to stop browsing these forums. Both you and me knows that'll never happen.
Tildes own Genos Occidere	Posted - 2009.05.04 01:01:00 - [21] Doubt it'll fly, good luck though
Maxxamo	Posted - 2009.05.04 01:09:00 - [22] Probably get it refunded. Maxxamo
Jat Goodwin	Posted - 2009.05.04 02:55:00 - [23] Originally by: Apoctasy needs moar internet spaceships lawyers
Lana Torrin Minmatar Republic Military Skool	Posted - 2009.05.04 03:03:00 - [24] Can we place bets on this one? I'm going to bet on 'he'll be fine'.. Mainly because I may use that in the future and I don't want to limit my options..
Colonel Cornbread Minmatar 37th Capital Fleet Screaming Eagles Gang Bang Theory	Posted - 2009.05.04 04:10:00 - [25] Originally by: Lana Torrin Can we place bets on this one? I'm going to bet on 'he'll be fine'.. Mainly because I may use that in the future and I don't want to limit my options.. I will be the intermediary. Everyone send their ISK to me with your side of the bet as the reason. ~~~ Usual Gamer Alias: NakieoN ~~~
Lana Torrin Minmatar Republic Military Skool	Posted - 2009.05.04 04:12:00 - [26] Originally by: Colonel Cornbread Originally by: Lana Torrin Can we place bets on this one? I'm going to bet on 'he'll be fine'.. Mainly because I may use that in the future and I don't want to limit my options.. I will be the intermediary. Everyone send their ISK to me with your side of the bet as the reason. Sweet! 2B sent..
Malcanis Vanishing Point. The Initiative.	Posted - 2009.05.04 07:38:00 - [27] If in doubt, petition it. That way you have at least some defence if it isn't allowed, and an unanswerable defence if it is.
Cyrdax Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2009.05.04 07:40:00 - [28] ashley sky advance petitioned when he ran the wardec removal alliance (ie you get dec'd, you join the alliance, you quit the alliance, bye bye wardec). the gm told him it would be perfectly ok then someone petitioned it once it got going and the gms shut it down --- tv where the horn go, boy can you top that?
Lana Torrin Minmatar Republic Military Skool	Posted - 2009.05.04 07:42:00 - [29] Originally by: Cyrdax ashley sky advance petitioned when he ran the wardec removal alliance (ie you get dec'd, you join the alliance, you quit the alliance, bye bye wardec). the gm told him it would be perfectly ok then someone petitioned it once it got going and the gms shut it down Yes well.. Your chances of being BANNED are much reduced as you have written evidence that you asked first. Also, im not convinced that Ash asked the right question and was deliberately obscure to get the answer he wanted.
Cyrdax Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2009.05.04 08:07:00 - [30] alls i know is there's no way to keep a gm from changing his/her mind --- tv where the horn go, boy can you top that?

Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 .. 13 :: one page
First page \| Previous page \| Next page \| Last page

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online, the EVE logo, EVE and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to EVE-Search.com to use EVE Online and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, EVE-Search.com. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.