Adding options means supporting code for both, which gets expensive. But I'm with you, it didn't take me long to discover that the new way of managing inventory was actually much easier than the old way. I manage reaction POSs and being able to control the POS modules from the inventory was an extra bonus too.

It was a bit of a shock to the system and change is hard, especially when it's something as habitual as a UI (I use 'Classic Menu' in Windows 7 to make it look like Win2k :) but progress carries a price sometimes.

All i have to say.. FIX FONT COLOR!... no idea why it have to have a darker font than everything else...

other than that, its just a question about getting used to it.

It still needs work but with some further iterations you will be able to have things working in a similar way to how you used to. One thing I'd like to see is opening up separate windows with just double click on the inventory menu list instead of shift + click, I tried doing that last night in the hopes that it might work but no :sadpanda:

I don't want them working like they used to. New inventory works perfectly fine. If I want multiple windows I just shift click and get another window its not feckin rocket science.

Why is it that nearly all forum warriors in EVE oppose change?

Having lived through the early years in EVE this still makes my life so much easier now. The filters make life easy if you looking for certain items in stead of just a mass of icons or having of remember the damn module name to search for it.

Hey guys,
In the pre-inferno days, I sometimes had to open several different windows for inventory stuff, for in-station stuff alone:
- Cargo bay
- Item hangar
- Ship hangar
- Cargo bay of other ship
- Corp hangar
- Secure cans in item hangar
- Secure cans in cargo
- Ship maintenance bay
- Drone bay

It was hell. At least for me.

I think this works a bit the same. The old inventory we used is about 9 years old now. A lot of players have gotten used to the "old way" and just refuse to change because they already got used to the old system and think it's fine that way.

For me, that was a total of four windows in the old system, and they occupided about Gàò of the screen in a neat row along the bottom.

You could replicate almost exactly what we have now with the old system. It is impossible to replicate what you could do with the old system using the new one.

No. People are quite willing to change if the change is for the better. In this case, the change is towards decreased functionality and lower efficiency. It's not a resistance to change GÇö it's a resistance to deterioration. It's interesting that you bring up the CQ since it was indeed the same thing, but you're paining it in the wrong light. People didn't complain because it changed GÇö they complained because it made things worse, because they lost functionality, because they lost efficiency, and because the new system offered nothing to improve on those two things.

Making an GÇ£old/newGÇ¥ toggle is also the exact wrong way to go. What they should have done was to ensure that the new system offers the same functionality as the old one, and then add more, new functionality on top of that. They couldn't do that with the CQ because they were two completely different systems and because the CQ in and if itself didn't actually offer any functionality at all.

I think the problem is Tippia is that a number of us are actually finding it easier to use the new UI. I am actually much more efficient with it than the setup having multiple windows. Not just a little bit either, but by quite a margin.

It could be simply an issue with how used one is to work with folders and lists as oppose to windows. You might find people who have their OS setup a certain way find the new UI easier to use.

It isn't game breaking though, in any way.

The rage coming across from certain people is a little disproportional to the change.

I think the problem is Tippia is that a number of us are actually finding it easier to use the new UI. I am actually much more efficient with it than the setup having multiple windows. Not just a little bit either, but by quite a margin. It could be simply an issue with how used one is to work with folders and lists as oppose to windows. You might find people who have their OS setup a certain way find the new UI easier to use.

You're one of the better people pointing out issues so I'm not arguing against your points. There are clearly problems with the new system in certain areas. As the poster above yourself stated full customisation is probably the way to do it, giving people the option (I suppose like Incarna but I don't think this can be categorised the same) to setup the system how they want.

It isn't game breaking though, in any way. The rage coming across from certain people is a little disproportional to the change.

its crap change it back is what i think.

For me, that was a total of four windows in the old system, and they occupided about Gàò of the screen in a neat row along the bottom.

You could replicate almost exactly what we have now with the old system. It is impossible to replicate what you could do with the old system using the new one.

No. People are quite willing to change if the change is for the better. In this case, the change is towards decreased functionality and lower efficiency. It's not a resistance to change GÇö it's a resistance to deterioration. It's interesting that you bring up the CQ since it was indeed the same thing, but you're paining it in the wrong light. People didn't complain because it changed GÇö they complained because it made things worse, because they lost functionality, because they lost efficiency, and because the new system offered nothing to improve on those two things.

Making an GÇ£old/newGÇ¥ toggle is also the exact wrong way to go. What they should have done was to ensure that the new system offers the same functionality as the old one, and then add more, new functionality on top of that. They couldn't do that with the CQ because they were two completely different systems and because the CQ in and if itself didn't actually offer any functionality at all.

Quick update to the inventory stuff:

We created a list of changes we'd like to make yesterday. Today we're going through it and planning when to do what. I'll post it up later today so you guys can see the changes.

One of the changes I'm mulling over two different options and I'd really like your feedback on it. Specifically, it's the POSs showing all the inventories you can interact with:

Solution one: All POS inventories are treated as wrecks. You fly to them, open them and they're put in your inventory with a little "x" next to them so you can remove them once you've used them.

Solution two: All POS inventories are put in to trees, so you can open/close whatever subsection of inventories you're currently interacting with.

Anyway, feel free to add some feedback to those two and I'll return with a more detailed list of changes later today.

QFT, tippia your great at this. I just wish I was half as good at making my idea's understood. Here is hoping they will at least commit to fixing some of this.

One of the changes I'm mulling over two different options and I'd really like your feedback on it. Specifically, it's the POSs showing all the inventories you can interact with:

Solution one: All POS inventories are treated as wrecks. You fly to them, open them and they're put in your inventory with a little "x" next to them so you can remove them once you've used them.

Solution two: All POS inventories are put in to trees, so you can open/close whatever subsection of inventories you're currently interacting with.

Of those twoGǪ

GǪsolution two, with the addition of allowing us to name everything at a POS GÇö every last battery and hangar GÇö and with things that are out of range being either greyed out, moved to the bottom beneath a separator, or otherwise clearly shown as being GÇ£present but not availableGÇ¥ from your current location.

Yes, it's much harder to implement, because it offers much more feedback and functionality. That's why it's the right thing to doGǪ Also, while we're at it, filters for the tree view, not just the item window itself.

Solution two: All POS inventories are put in to trees, so you can open/close whatever subsection of inventories you're currently interacting with.

There is one thing.. one thing only... Allow us to move stuff from one can to another when you have them opened in the same window (with tabs) by dragging stuff onto the tabs and I be happy again.

Quick update to the inventory stuff:

We created a list of changes we'd like to make yesterday. Today we're going through it and planning when to do what....

Quick update to the inventory stuff:

We created a list of changes we'd like to make yesterday. Today we're going through it and planning when to do what. I'll post it up later today so you guys can see the changes.

One of the changes I'm mulling over two different options and I'd really like your feedback on it. Specifically, it's the POSs showing all the inventories you can interact with:

Solution one: All POS inventories are treated as wrecks. You fly to them, open them and they're put in your inventory with a little "x" next to them so you can remove them once you've used them.

Solution two: All POS inventories are put in to trees, so you can open/close whatever subsection of inventories you're currently interacting with.

Anyway, feel free to add some feedback to those two and I'll return with a more detailed list of changes later today.

I have a better idea. Why not make a list of OUR requested changes?

Can someone just tell me how I can get my ACTIVE ship back into my hanger window? I want one window with ALL my current ships located within that station. I shouldn't have to leave my current ship to see it there. Worked before the 'eve is spreadsheets' ui patch. I'm not so humbly asking for it back.

I also want my 'Ships button' back. I'd REALLY like it if the window stayed open after I shift-clicked it into existence too. And I mean every time I dock.

If it wasn't clear, the list we're compiling is changes requested by the playerbase.

Quick update to the inventory stuff:

We created a list of changes we'd like to make yesterday. Today we're going through it and planning when to do what. I'll post it up later today so you guys can see the changes.

One of the changes I'm mulling over two different options and I'd really like your feedback on it. Specifically, it's the POSs showing all the inventories you can interact with:

Solution one: All POS inventories are treated as wrecks. You fly to them, open them and they're put in your inventory with a little "x" next to them so you can remove them once you've used them.

Solution two: All POS inventories are put in to trees, so you can open/close whatever subsection of inventories you're currently interacting with.

Anyway, feel free to add some feedback to those two and I'll return with a more detailed list of changes later today.

Adding options means supporting code for both, which gets expensive..

When you walk around with your head us someones ass (eve's dev's and Sony's ass) you are bound to bump into a wall. Grats on this joke of a change to inventory. Do you devs even undock and play this game? Have you tryed to mine out of a pos? Have you tryed to organise reactions at a pos with this change? The fact that your head is so deep up Sony's ass and EVE is going to die soon doesn't mean that you need to give it a push.

Hey guys,
In the pre-inferno days, I sometimes had to open several different windows for inventory stuff, for in-station stuff alone:
- Cargo bay
- Item hangar
- Ship hangar
- Cargo bay of other ship
- Corp hangar
- Secure cans in item hangar
- Secure cans in cargo
- Ship maintenance bay
- Drone bay

It was hell. At least for me.

And guess what? Now I see all the inventories I need, in one little list, in a single window that takes up less space than all of the above combined, as well as making it cleaner, without having to overlap or combine several of those windows. No longer do I have to search for stuff (it was like inventory within inventory within inventory.), do a few gazillion clicks to open new windows. No, I got them all in a single window now.
And if I still need some kind of a separate window, I can shift+click and open a separate window. Not that I had to use it as of yet.
Not to mention I can see the approximate market value of said stuff in the inventory, as well as the metric tons. And this is adjusted to what items I have selected. VERY useful.

This new system is intuitive and works just like the old system. Just drag and drop stuff, but now you only need 1 window to rule them all.
Personally, I think this was a much needed usability update.


BUT!!


I do think that some "forced changes" are bad.
We have seen this happen to Captain's Quarters, and we were given the ability to go back to the old hangar view with ship spinning (and a nice ship spin counter). Nobody complained since then.
I think this works a bit the same. The old inventory we used is about 9 years old now. A lot of players have gotten used to the "old way" and just refuse to change because they already got used to the old system and think it's fine that way.
So I'd suggest, instead of forcing this kind of change on players, allow for players to choose between separate settings; customise their way of inventory usage to their personal preferences.

For example, you could have these different settings:
- old way > nothing changes. You have to manually search for each window, open it, then drag and drop from one window to the other if you want to move stuff.
- semi-old way > just the inventory list without the attached window. When clicking one of the list items, a new window opens. You *can* drag and drop from an opened window to a list item in the inventory to move items there.
- new way > like it is now: inventory list + attached window. When clicking one of the list items, its inventory will be displayed in the attached window. When shift-clicking one of the list items, its inventory will be displayed in a separate window.


I think if this is done, *every* player will be happy about the new inventory system.

I hope this feedback is appreciated :)

1) Since you went for "the treeview" paradygm please have a look at how XTree Gold worked (yes I am that ancient). A free Win 32 / 64 version is here.
Out of the many features, there was the "on demand subtree logging".

2) The real estate used by the new UI is enormous. Now why did you put *two* rows in the status line? With two little numbers right aligned none the less. Just put them in one row.

3) The inner scroll bars (to the right of container names etc) are too thin, please add a 30% width.

4) The volume hystogram is very tall. The old one gave the same information, in 4 pixels or so. Please make it collapsible or something.

5) The new UI was perfect as assets window. It's really it. It's too big to keep it always open on a ship though, by default we should have something light at the center of the screen.

6) There's a bug: if you dock the new UI to the right of the chat, and you have autohide neocom:

- old behavior: any window docked to the right of the chat (or directly docked to the neocom) would cause all the docked windows to scroll left when neocom disappeared, all would scroll right when neocom re-appeared.

- new behavior: the chat still scrolls like before but the new UI won't obey to the dock and sits still.

7) Please add neocom buttons to directly open ship cargo / ships hangar, items hangar, corp hangar. All they would do is to do the same of clicking on the new UI tree icons to open the same objects.

If it wasn't clear, the list we're compiling is changes requested by the playerbase.

Quick update to the inventory stuff:

We created a list of changes we'd like to make yesterday. Today we're going through it and planning when to do what. I'll post it up later today so you guys can see the changes.

One of the changes I'm mulling over two different options and I'd really like your feedback on it. Specifically, it's the POSs showing all the inventories you can interact with:

Solution one: All POS inventories are treated as wrecks. You fly to them, open them and they're put in your inventory with a little "x" next to them so you can remove them once you've used them.

Solution two: All POS inventories are put in to trees, so you can open/close whatever subsection of inventories you're currently interacting with.

Anyway, feel free to add some feedback to those two and I'll return with a more detailed list of changes later today.

Quick update to the inventory stuff:

We created a list of changes we'd like to make yesterday. Today we're going through it and planning when to do what. I'll post it up later today so you guys can see the changes.

One of the changes I'm mulling over two different options and I'd really like your feedback on it. Specifically, it's the POSs showing all the inventories you can interact with:

Solution one: All POS inventories are treated as wrecks. You fly to them, open them and they're put in your inventory with a little "x" next to them so you can remove them once you've used them.

Solution two: All POS inventories are put in to trees, so you can open/close whatever subsection of inventories you're currently interacting with.

Anyway, feel free to add some feedback to those two and I'll return with a more detailed list of changes later today.

The idea was great and I'm sure I will get used to it but some of it could have been more user friendly. Adding stuff into your current ship is taking way to long and dragging multiple items is a mess.

If it wasn't clear, the list we're compiling is changes requested by the playerbase.

One of the changes I'm mulling over two different options and I'd really like your feedback on it. Specifically, it's the POSs showing all the inventories you can interact with:

Solution one: All POS inventories are treated as wrecks. You fly to them, open them and they're put in your inventory with a little "x" next to them so you can remove them once you've used them.

Solution two: All POS inventories are put in to trees, so you can open/close whatever subsection of inventories you're currently interacting with.

Anyway, feel free to add some feedback to those two and I'll return with a more detailed list of changes later today.

And guess what? Now I see all the inventories I need, in one little list, in a single window that takes up less space than all of the above combined, as well as making it cleaner, without having to overlap or combine several of those windows. No longer do I have to search for stuff (it was like inventory within inventory within inventory.), do a few gazillion clicks to open new windows. No, I got them all in a single window now.
And if I still need some kind of a separate window, I can shift+click and open a separate window. Not that I had to use it as of yet.
Not to mention I can see the approximate market value of said stuff in the inventory, as well as the metric tons. And this is adjusted to what items I have selected. VERY useful.

This new system is intuitive and works just like the old system. Just drag and drop stuff, but now you only need 1 window to rule them all.
Personally, I think this was a much needed usability update.

...

Adding options means supporting code for both, which gets expensive. But I'm with you, it didn't take me long to discover that the new way of managing inventory was actually much easier than the old way. I manage reaction POSs and being able to control the POS modules from the inventory was an extra bonus too.

It was a bit of a shock to the system and change is hard, especially when it's something as habitual as a UI (I use 'Classic Menu' in Windows 7 to make it look like Win2k :) but progress carries a price sometimes.

Quick update to the inventory stuff:

We created a list of changes we'd like to make yesterday. Today we're going through it and planning when to do what. I'll post it up later today so you guys can see the changes.

One of the changes I'm mulling over two different options and I'd really like your feedback on it. Specifically, it's the POSs showing all the inventories you can interact with:

Solution one: All POS inventories are treated as wrecks. You fly to them, open them and they're put in your inventory with a little "x" next to them so you can remove them once you've used them.

Solution two: All POS inventories are put in to trees, so you can open/close whatever subsection of inventories you're currently interacting with.

Anyway, feel free to add some feedback to those two and I'll return with a more detailed list of changes later today.

One of the changes I'm mulling over two different options and I'd really like your feedback on it. Specifically, it's the POSs showing all the inventories you can interact with:

Solution one: All POS inventories are treated as wrecks. You fly to them, open them and they're put in your inventory with a little "x" next to them so you can remove them once you've used them.

Solution two: All POS inventories are put in to trees, so you can open/close whatever subsection of inventories you're currently interacting with.

Anyway, feel free to add some feedback to those two and I'll return with a more detailed list of changes later today.

Quick update to the inventory stuff:

We created a list of changes we'd like to make yesterday. Today we're going through it and planning when to do what. I'll post it up later today so you guys can see the changes.

One of the changes I'm mulling over two different options and I'd really like your feedback on it. Specifically, it's the POSs showing all the inventories you can interact with:

Solution one: All POS inventories are treated as wrecks. You fly to them, open them and they're put in your inventory with a little "x" next to them so you can remove them once you've used them.

Solution two: All POS inventories are put in to trees, so you can open/close whatever subsection of inventories you're currently interacting with.

Anyway, feel free to add some feedback to those two and I'll return with a more detailed list of changes later today.

Quick update to the inventory stuff:

We created a list of changes we'd like to make yesterday. Today we're going through it and planning when to do what. I'll post it up later today so you guys can see the changes.

Quick update to the inventory stuff:

We created a list of changes we'd like to make yesterday. Today we're going through it and planning when to do what. I'll post it up later today so you guys can see the changes.

One of the changes I'm mulling over two different options and I'd really like your feedback on it. Specifically, it's the POSs showing all the inventories you can interact with:

Solution one: All POS inventories are treated as wrecks. You fly to them, open them and they're put in your inventory with a little "x" next to them so you can remove them once you've used them.

Solution two: All POS inventories are put in to trees, so you can open/close whatever subsection of inventories you're currently interacting with.

Anyway, feel free to add some feedback to those two and I'll return with a more detailed list of changes later today.

Quick update to the inventory stuff:

We created a list of changes we'd like to make yesterday. Today we're going through it and planning when to do what. I'll post it up later today so you guys can see the changes.

One of the changes I'm mulling over two different options and I'd really like your feedback on it. Specifically, it's the POSs showing all the inventories you can interact with:

Solution one: All POS inventories are treated as wrecks. You fly to them, open them and they're put in your inventory with a little "x" next to them so you can remove them once you've used them.

Solution two: All POS inventories are put in to trees, so you can open/close whatever subsection of inventories you're currently interacting with.

Anyway, feel free to add some feedback to those two and I'll return with a more detailed list of changes later today.

Why aren't you handling this business over in the official inventory thread? Segmenting out these conversations and threads is not helpful for keeping the dialog in one place.

Dev blog coming shortly.

Why aren't you handling this business over in the official inventory thread? Segmenting out these conversations and threads is not helpful for keeping the dialog in one place.

Quick update to the inventory stuff:

We created a list of changes we'd like to make yesterday. Today we're going through it and planning when to do what. I'll post it up later today so you guys can see the changes.

One of the changes I'm mulling over two different options and I'd really like your feedback on it. Specifically, it's the POSs showing all the inventories you can interact with:

Solution one: All POS inventories are treated as wrecks. You fly to them, open them and they're put in your inventory with a little "x" next to them so you can remove them once you've used them.

Solution two: All POS inventories are put in to trees, so you can open/close whatever subsection of inventories you're currently interacting with.

Anyway, feel free to add some feedback to those two and I'll return with a more detailed list of changes later today.

People just need to get use to it.

Solution 2b

- remember which groups are open and which are closed
- make option (esc menu?) to group corp divisions before single installations like this

- laboratories
-- div 1
--- lab 1
--- lab 2
--- lab 3
--div 2 (closed)
- factories
-- div 1 (closed)
-- div 2
--- ship factory 1
--- ammo factory 2
- hangars
-- div 1
--- named hangar 1
--- named hangar 2

Make the new system "remember" if I've shift-clicked a window - meaning I want it separate from the "unified" inventory system, and default to those satellite windows if I open such an item again - like a wreck, my cargo, and my items/ships windows in stations. This would let the new system work like the old system, with the slight frustration of us users having to "reinvent" the wheel on all our accounts on all our computers all over again. A nuisance, but a solution.

It actually already does this - it's remembered which labs/modules in the POS I had expanded and hadn't.

Dev blog coming shortly.

If it wasn't clear, the list we're compiling is changes requested by the playerbase.

My initial impression was very negative. The change was jarring and unintuitive.
I'm not saying that the system is better or worse than the old UI... I simply don't know enough about the new UI to form a proper opinion.

I think that was CCP's fundamental problem. There was no formal tutorial, instruction manual or guide on using the new UI.

Think of it like scanning or PI. Both of those activities don't have the most intuitive UI, and take some learning to get used to. In response, CCP created two very well made tutorial videos that show you how to scan and get your feet wet in PI.

The reason why this new UI is so hated is that it comes across as a complicated process akin to PI and Scanning. Unlike PI and scanning, people who are too lazy to learn about them can't simply ignore the UI and do something else the way they can with PI and Scanning. EVERYONE depends on the UI for everything they do.

Yet there is no clear official guide (or if there is one, it is not in a readily visible place) or video.

What CCP really needed to do is release a tutorial guide/video while the UI was still on SISI to explain it and compare it to the current UI.
"To access your corp hanger, you used to do X [Screenshot] but you now do Y [Screenshot]"
And then provide instructions on how to go on to SISI for players who normally don't touch the test server so they can try them out if they wish to.

If the transition was not so jarring, people might actually take the time to explore the new UI and find new benefits that might be helpful rather than hunkering down and clinging to their opinion that the entire new UI is trash and to the hope that they might get their old UI back if enough people complain loudly enough long enough.

Quick update to the inventory stuff:

We created a list of changes we'd like to make yesterday. Today we're going through it and planning when to do what. I'll post it up later today so you guys can see the changes.

One of the changes I'm mulling over two different options and I'd really like your feedback on it. Specifically, it's the POSs showing all the inventories you can interact with:

Solution one: All POS inventories are treated as wrecks. You fly to them, open them and they're put in your inventory with a little "x" next to them so you can remove them once you've used them.

Solution two: All POS inventories are put in to trees, so you can open/close whatever subsection of inventories you're currently interacting with.

can i ask you to: Buy 40+ ships , add 20 + containers and buy a corp office and then add containers and ships in those aswell. See how you like this new unified window then...

or **** around with industry in a pos with 20-30 manufactering arrays and 100 defence mods ( guns)

-snip-

I for one appreciate your attention, CCP, and hope we can reach a solution that benefits everyone without necessarily throwing out all the work you guys have done.

Thanks.

Quick update to the inventory stuff:

We created a list of changes we'd like to make yesterday. Today we're going through it and planning when to do what. I'll post it up later today so you guys can see the changes.

One of the changes I'm mulling over two different options and I'd really like your feedback on it. Specifically, it's the POSs showing all the inventories you can interact with:

Solution one: All POS inventories are treated as wrecks. You fly to them, open them and they're put in your inventory with a little "x" next to them so you can remove them once you've used them.

Solution two: All POS inventories are put in to trees, so you can open/close whatever subsection of inventories you're currently interacting with.

Anyway, feel free to add some feedback to those two and I'll return with a more detailed list of changes later today.

The reason why this new UI is so hated is that it comes across as a complicated process akin to PI and Scanning. Unlike PI and scanning, people who are too lazy to learn about them can't simply ignore the UI and do something else the way they can with PI and Scanning. EVERYONE depends on the UI for everything they do.

No.

People just need to realise that their limited use case isn't universal and that, regardless of whether they know it or not, a lot of functionality has been lost. No amount of GÇ£getting used to itGÇ¥ will make that functionality come back.

Don't be daft.

The reason the new UI is so hated is because it not just comes across as a simple process, but because it is simplified and that it has long a whole lot of power through that simplification. It no longer supports a large swath of use cases and it makes a different large set of use cases much more cumbersome and slow than before.

It has nothing to do with guidance or laziness GÇö it has to do with a loss of functionality. Of course, there are plenty of idiots who never managed to get their heads around the old system so they are ignorant of this loss and thus think that things have improved. The simple fact remains:

The new system does not properly support multiple windows.
The new system does not properly support complex collection of inventories.
The new system does not properly support old inventory management shortcuts that are still in the game.
The new system does not let you set up a consistent work space.
The new system does not offer any context sensitivity.
The new system does not offer any control over what opens where.

GǪand I haven't even begun to touch on the multitude of bugs that make all of these issues even worse and render any attempt at finding work-arounds meaningless.

So no, the problem is almost exactly the opposite of what you say: it's not the complexity that is the problem and that is making people angry GÇö it's the loss of complex functionality, and this anger is then increased by people who are were too lazy to figure out how the old system work and who come along and ignorantly claim that it has anything to do with GÇ£learningGÇ¥. Learning the new system will not make it suddenly regenerate the complex functionality that has been lost. Learning the new system will not suddenly make the daft simplifications go away.

Don't like it, but can live with it.

Specific complaint:
Looting multiple cannisters takes much more time.

Before:
Open all cannisters. Click 'loot all' button, cannister vanishes, to show next cannister. I could clean out twenty cannisters faster than you took to read this sentence.

Now:
Open one canister. Loot. Open next cannister. Loot. Repeat until done. Time elapsed it roughly three times as long as previously.

Quick update to the inventory stuff:

We created a list of changes we'd like to make yesterday. Today we're going through it and planning when to do what. I'll post it up later today so you guys can see the changes.

One of the changes I'm mulling over two different options and I'd really like your feedback on it. Specifically, it's the POSs showing all the inventories you can interact with:

Solution one: All POS inventories are treated as wrecks. You fly to them, open them and they're put in your inventory with a little "x" next to them so you can remove them once you've used them.

Solution two: All POS inventories are put in to trees, so you can open/close whatever subsection of inventories you're currently interacting with.

Anyway, feel free to add some feedback to those two and I'll return with a more detailed list of changes later today.

A right click menu with 15 options is about the worst functionality in the world.

Quick update to the inventory stuff:

We created a list of changes we'd like to make yesterday. Today we're going through it and planning when to do what. I'll post it up later today so you guys can see the changes.

One of the changes I'm mulling over two different options and I'd really like your feedback on it. Specifically, it's the POSs showing all the inventories you can interact with:

Solution one: All POS inventories are treated as wrecks. You fly to them, open them and they're put in your inventory with a little "x" next to them so you can remove them once you've used them.

Solution two: All POS inventories are put in to trees, so you can open/close whatever subsection of inventories you're currently interacting with.

Anyway, feel free to add some feedback to those two and I'll return with a more detailed list of changes later today.

A right click menu with 15 options is about the worst functionality in the world.

I have a better idea. Why not make a list of OUR requested changes?

Is a hybrid system of using the new inventory window -only- for ship, hangar, cargo and wreck inventory and using the old system for all other applications too much to ask for?

Seems the majority of trouble comes for far-reaching trade tycoons, POS management and corporate hangar management, (the Orca bug is just that; not a lag issue from the new system, but just a hiccup that comes from Unified-Winferno.)

Aside from a bigger load of coding for CCP, (sorry, ladies and gentlemen therein,) wouldn't this satisfy those who are happy with the new system (i.e. non-"power players" and miners,) and those who desperately depend on the old, (everyone else)?

New devblog: [Upcoming] Unified Inventory Changes

Everyone should read this.

I think your cargo hold should be seperate fom your inventory. No reason it should merge.


In space I want to see the old style hold with cans opening in a seperate window. Looting on the fly with limited space is basically impossible now.

In station you can keep the tree just have the cargohold seperate like before. I would like my hold to stay open and positioned just like the old version.

My cargo is not part of the station and there is no reason it should be treated as such.

i stopped reading at the..... Hello spacefriends....

New devblog: [Upcoming] Unified Inventory Changes

Everyone should read this.

Well, at least they put water in the buckets instead of gasoline. It won't quell the rebellion completely, but they're on the right track.

If you think of the tabs on the left as tabs used to be on the top of a bar, and if Shift+Click for a new window actually works, we're basically running at the same speed as before for looting, no? Aside from time to adapt to a new system, are we really suffering any delays on that part?

I like the new inventory system , but it needs some modifications.

A) Need to include ALL material form the "Assets" tab.
UInv should be just that, not much unified of all assets are not listed in one window.

B) WINDOWS (OLD v New)
Very easy solution here. The problem is you want the UInv window to do it all, not necessary.
1 - Keep all the same ways of opening inventory from before (Cargo, Cans, Hangars) Open and add stuff just as before.
2 - Make the Unified Inventory Window its own separate function. Whatever you to in the other windows, is reflected in the unified inventory if you want to open it.
3 - Basically, making the old windows the portals, and the UI system the hub for centralized auditing / moving.

C) Optimize ship cargo.
Now it takes longer just to view current ship cargo since it needs to load ALL my inventory.

Ships in Hangar
Duble click use to open cargo, now it activates ship and makes ship disappear.
Fix both of these. At least make it so not make the ship disappear when I activate it,

Granted, to support whatever troubles you might be experiencing, I'm speaking as someone who, since the new system was in place, has only shot rats, done PI export/import and can-mines. In those capacities, I love the new system. Perhaps I'm not getting what you mean by limited space?

We're not running at the same speed.

Old System:
- Open one loot can, position it where you want it, any time you have no loot can open and you then open one, it moves to that position.
- Open one loot can, open a second and put it into the tab with the first. All subsequent loot cans open in the tabbed window.
- Spamming "Loot All" closes a tab and puts the focus on the next loot tab.

New System:
- Open loot can into the same window as your cargohold.
- Cannot spam "Loot All" because after pressing the button focus shifts to your cargohold.

Result:
- Loss of functionality.

Your task is to move an item-stack from a cargo can into a corp hangar:

Disclaimer: Since I lack a picture of the old system, I had to emulate it, but I'm certain you recall still how it exactly looked like and ignore the rudimentary MSPainting...

Old: http://img814.imageshack.us/img814/7259/previously.png

New: http://img515.imageshack.us/img515/3988/andnow.png

Now tell me, which UI is more suited to this daily task?

Now let's increase the difficulty of the task. Say you want to move an item-stack from the corp hangar to the can you just emptied and an item from the same hangar into the Orca's cargo bay. Which one handles the task more sensible and less click intensive?

Oh man, you just suggested an awesome change: loot all buttons on the sidebar! Instead of organizing windows to make sure the Loot All works fine, you just click up in a line on all the cargo containers you're working with using a small button on the far right of each can in the unified window. The only loss at this point would be that, instead of spam-clicking in one spot, you do it in a line down or up the list of opened cargo containers. Trading that for an otherwise sweet UI upgrade is more than fair, presuming they fix all the other issues.

If you think of the tabs on the left as tabs used to be on the top of a bar, and if Shift+Click for a new window actually works, we're basically running at the same speed as before for looting, no? Aside from time to adapt to a new system, are we really suffering any delays on that part?

Granted, to support whatever troubles you might be experiencing, I'm speaking as someone who, since the new system was in place, has only shot rats, done PI export/import and can-mines. In those capacities, I love the new system. Perhaps I'm not getting what you mean by limited space?

I can see some justification in having the cargohold LOAD separately, but have it kept in the same window. The one-button access is a blessing, but loading my 400 items whenever I just want to dump minerals is a bit of a bother, I'll give you that.

So, given some time to get used to the space version and given an inventory window that doesn't load the hangar inventory until you tell it to, would you find the system satisfactory?

Let me just say the new inventory system is terrible for looting wrecks.

Under the old system, I always kept a very small window locked on the screen with my ships cargo. Opening a wreck would open a new window, and I could easily click "loot all" and see the items go into my ship's cargo.

Under the new system I am forced to use a (much) larger window because every single wreck or cargo can has to go into the same inventory management pane. This is not progress. Over half my screen is dedicated to windows I essentially need, local chat, overview, scanner, etc... while leaving the ship hud and locked target area clear. The bottom line is I want to free up screen space, not be forced to use more of it to use the new cumbersome inventory pane.

Please allow us the option to revert to the old inventory management system...at least while in space if nothing else.

POS stuff I would like:

- The ability to name previously un-nameable POS mods. This spares us all a lot of clicking around in the tree and trying to keep count of which module is my destination. Right now I can go straight to the relevant tab from the tree (good) but I have no way of knowing which CHA is the one that I want without clicking around in the tree first (bad). I can drag and drop to the tree as long as I know what my destination is. I wouldn't mind having back the ability to open a CHA from space, either.

- The ability to filter what appears in the tree (we're getting into feature creep territory here, but still). I want a filter for SMAs and CHAs only, a filter for defensive mods only, a filter for industrial mods only, a filter for wrecks only, etc etc. I'd like to be able to switch between filters with a single click or choice within dropdown menu. Splitting types of POS mods into their own trees is a good step in this direction, but for the ultimate awesome I want to make the tree as customizable as scan filters or my overview.

- The ability to separate out a type of window and have it stay there, remembering its size (which it does every time you re-open it, which is nice) and whether or not the tree was expanded. This way I can open my cargohold without being slowed down by the tree. I can live with loading times for SMAs -- I've been living with that for ages already. Loading times on my cargo hold make me unhappy.

The first point is a positive necessity for happy POS living. The latter two mean that I could take the load off of my overview for showing me random stuff in space. For example, I don't have to worry about cluttering up my "death to all moving objects" overview with wrecks when I'm looting/clicking around in space to find the relevant wrecks if I can have the inventory tree do all the work there.

Seriously guys, delete the OP on all the whine threads and replace the text with "shift click will fix it" then let them figure it out.

If they cant theyre too stupid to play EVE

How ppl play a game with a learning curve like this then are defeated by shift click is just amazing to me

Seriously guys, delete the OP on all the whine threads and replace the text with "shift click will fix it" then let them figure it out.

If they cant theyre too stupid to play EVE

How ppl play a game with a learning curve like this then are defeated by shift click is just amazing to me

Seriously guys, delete the OP on all the whine threads and replace the text with "shift click will fix it" then let them figure it out.

If they cant theyre too stupid to play EVE

How ppl play a game with a learning curve like this then are defeated by shift click is just amazing to me

To be honest, it took me a good 10 minutes to get used to the new inventory window, after that I kinda liked using it.

Seriously guys, delete the OP on all the whine threads and replace the text with "shift click will fix it" then let them figure it out.

If they cant theyre too stupid to play EVE

How ppl play a game with a learning curve like this then are defeated by shift click is just amazing to me

Seriously guys, delete the OP on all the whine threads and replace the text with "shift click will fix it" then let them figure it out.

If they cant theyre too stupid to play EVE

How ppl play a game with a learning curve like this then are defeated by shift click is just amazing to me

with 50+ ships, but It's something that we need to get used to.

...
One of the changes I'm mulling over two different options and I'd really like your feedback on it. Specifically, it's the POSs showing all the inventories you can interact with...

One of the changes I'm mulling over two different options and I'd really like your feedback on it.

Seriously guys, delete the OP on all the whine threads and replace the text with "shift click will fix it" then let them figure it out.

Seriously guys, delete the OP on all the whine threads and replace the text with "shift click will fix it" then let them figure it out.

If they cant theyre too stupid to play EVE

How ppl play a game with a learning curve like this then are defeated by shift click is just amazing to me

I liked having wrecks and cans open up in a separate window location which I had placed right below my Cargohold window to allow selective looting.

The new hangar, corporate hangar and tabs you all just implemented SUCK!!! Ok, they really suck. What a pain in the neck it is to try and find something, fit your ship, move things between POS structures and other hangars. Please, Please, put it back to the way it was.....

Hey guys,
In the pre-inferno days, I sometimes had to open several different windows for inventory stuff, for in-station stuff alone:
- Cargo bay
- Item hangar
- Ship hangar
- Cargo bay of other ship
- Corp hangar
- Secure cans in item hangar
- Secure cans in cargo
- Ship maintenance bay
- Drone bay

It was hell. At least for me.

And guess what? Now I see all the inventories I need, in one little list, in a single window that takes up less space than all of the above combined, as well as making it cleaner, without having to overlap or combine several of those windows. No longer do I have to search for stuff (it was like inventory within inventory within inventory.), do a few gazillion clicks to open new windows. No, I got them all in a single window now.
And if I still need some kind of a separate window, I can shift+click and open a separate window. Not that I had to use it as of yet.
Not to mention I can see the approximate market value of said stuff in the inventory, as well as the metric tons. And this is adjusted to what items I have selected. VERY useful.

This new system is intuitive and works just like the old system. Just drag and drop stuff, but now you only need 1 window to rule them all.
Personally, I think this was a much needed usability update.


BUT!!


I do think that some "forced changes" are bad.
We have seen this happen to Captain's Quarters, and we were given the ability to go back to the old hangar view with ship spinning (and a nice ship spin counter). Nobody complained since then.
I think this works a bit the same. The old inventory we used is about 9 years old now. A lot of players have gotten used to the "old way" and just refuse to change because they already got used to the old system and think it's fine that way.
So I'd suggest, instead of forcing this kind of change on players, allow for players to choose between separate settings; customise their way of inventory usage to their personal preferences.

For example, you could have these different settings:
- old way > nothing changes. You have to manually search for each window, open it, then drag and drop from one window to the other if you want to move stuff.
- semi-old way > just the inventory list without the attached window. When clicking one of the list items, a new window opens. You *can* drag and drop from an opened window to a list item in the inventory to move items there.
- new way > like it is now: inventory list + attached window. When clicking one of the list items, its inventory will be displayed in the attached window. When shift-clicking one of the list items, its inventory will be displayed in a separate window.


I think if this is done, *every* player will be happy about the new inventory system.

I hope this feedback is appreciated :)

can i ask you to: Buy 40+ ships , add 20 + containers and buy a corp office and then add containers and ships in those aswell. See how you like this new unified window then...

or **** around with industry in a pos with 20-30 manufactering arrays and 100 defence mods ( guns)

In the inventory the corp hanger right-click context menu contains an option to:

"Add to market quickbar".

Curious, I wondered what to expect if I tried to add a corporate hanger to the market quick bar. So I clicked on it, and opened up the market view to check.

Astonishingly the market view is accessed and behaves exactly as before. On the "Quickbar" (which should be called "Quicklist" but who's quibbling?) there is no hanger to be seen, but there is a new entry:

"office"

It's greyed-out and inactive because you can't trade offices (or hangers for that matter) in the market. But it does give helpful onMouseOver text that tells you, "This item type is not available on the market".

===================================================

So here's a new feature of the inventory that allows you to attempt to do something that cannot be done (view a hanger's market details) and still gets it wrong anyway by adding an "office" instead. Then it tells you that you shouldn't have done that.

I don't want to be pedantic, but I am a professional software tester since twenty years and these are precisely the kind of things I expect my test teams to raise defects on.

The test manger responsible for this needs to learn the hard way like the rest of us all had to. So fire hm or her and hire a replacement who can actually do the job please.

New devblog: [Upcoming] Unified Inventory Changes

Everyone should read this.

I wonder how many people that have said "Change it back!!!" over the last couple days have also said, "Eve is change, HTFU"?

Yes, the inventory has some bugs. no, it's not perfect. The lag and the delay with opening things is something that CCP will figure out. Managing a POS can be trouble but even with all the guns listed I was still able to get stuff moved around in a reasonable amt of time. Also, you have to expect a bit of a learning curve. What takes you 5 minutes now will probably only take 2 in the coming weeks. When you first started how long did it take for you to fit a ship? Did you ever complain that the fitting system sucked then? Do you complain about the fitting system now? Give things time to soak, let CCP figure out the issues and keep providing CONSTRUCTIVE feedback.

Vexx

New devblog: [Upcoming] Unified Inventory Changes

Everyone should read this.

Why?
And another why asking you how come you like it when it wasn't a hassle before?


I'm really trying to adapt to it, but I keep running into a concrete wall here.
Like I had this item, way way down the tree, imagine Orca corp hangars and corp corp hangars all displaying themselves while I didn't need them.

So this thing I need to move, way up there in my active (Orca) ship.
I grab this thing I need to move and try to drag it up the tree to place it in the Orca. Cept, the tree only moves up a bit never gets near the Orca so I'm having to open my inventory, which is not focused on my items so I need to refocus it, then I'm so stupid to double click on my Orca, which should open my cargo bay, where I do not want to put the thing but I cannot access my corporate hangars ANYMORE! from the right click menu when I select my active ship and the focused folder with the item I want to move is replaced by my Orca's cargo bay.

Really, toss it away, start over.
This is a menace.

Why does double click on a ship, not active, NOT open the ships cargo bay? Other way around, why would I double click on a ship to not get to its cargo bay? Who thought that up? Did we request that? What is the most used mouse gesture you do in EVE? Double click perhaps? And they changed that on a whim? Not taking any feedback in while just pushing it out on T?Q?

And more of this stuff. But whatever, the idiots coming up with this inventory clearly never ever played EVE. Why should we expect anything useful from the devs responsible for this anyway?


Oh I'm not going to quit. Been here too long. But this atrocity pushed down our throats is going to P* off quite a lot of current users. Yes we cried and begged and demanded for an updated modern UI.

THIS IS NOT IT!