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[Proposal] Add skill which reduces Jump Clone timer just a little bit.

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Avalloc	Posted - 2009.08.07 06:15:00 - [1] Current Situation: The Jump Clone timer is 24 hours. This restriction can create quite a lot of problems for players who have limited play time and want to utilize this time to the best of their ability. Case in point you normally log in at 8pm and play until Midnight. On Monday you log in with a fresh timer seeking something to do. At 10pm, in another Region a battle calls for your participation. You have a Jump Clone stored there and make the jump and have a merry good time until Midnight when you log off. Tuesday you log in at 8pm and discover there is action taking place in your home Region. Unfortunately you still have two hours to wait out the timer and have to miss out. Proposed Solution: I propose that a new skill be added that reduces the Jump Clone timer by at least hourly (two max, per level in skill) increments. It can even be a Rank 10 (or higher) skill. The purpose here is to give players a little more flexibility if they're willing to train for it. Pros: It will create an ISK sink as players will buy the skill to gain more flexibility. PVP participation will benefit from the change since players can jump in/out of implants more easily or to a far away Region more frequently. Cons: Increasing fun isn't a Con.
CommanderData211	Posted - 2009.08.07 06:30:00 - [2] I think a good solution might be to be able to jump twice within a 48 hour period. This allows people to conduct business and come back while still limiting clone jumping to the same number of overall jumps. Takers?
Charlemeign	Posted - 2009.08.07 06:31:00 - [3] Is it just me or are Goons actually making sensible, well-thoughtout forums posts now? /me faints
Mr Spot I Blame Chum	Posted - 2009.08.07 06:35:00 - [4]
Drake Draconis Minmatar Shadow Cadre	Posted - 2009.08.07 06:42:00 - [5] No. ========================= CEO of Shadow Cadre http://www.shadowcadre.com =========================
Rotnac GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.08.07 06:46:00 - [6] This idea is excellent, please implement it.
mynnna GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.08.07 07:09:00 - [7] Originally by: CommanderData211 I think a good solution might be to be able to jump twice within a 48 hour period. This allows people to conduct business and come back while still limiting clone jumping to the same number of overall jumps. Takers? I support the general principle, although I think this is a better solution than a skill to reduce the cooldown.
LaVista Vista Conservative Shenanigans Party	Posted - 2009.08.07 08:03:00 - [8] I raised this during CSM1, but was rejected by the CSM. I'd like to see it.
Syaran IMPERIAL SENATE Cool Kids Club	Posted - 2009.08.07 14:48:00 - [9] I especially like the twice in 48h principle, it feels right for some reason. The skill to reduce time might be an interesting alternative. I could even see both being implemented. If there is anything game-breaking about it, please feel free to post it, but I can't think of it.
Herschel Yamamoto Agent-Orange	Posted - 2009.08.07 15:42:00 - [10] Originally by: Charlemeign Is it just me or are Goons actually making sensible, well-thoughtout forums posts now? /me faints Actually, probably 80% of Goon threads in Assembly Hall have been serious, and 100% of Avalloc's. Even the jesters of Eve have problems with parts of the game that they'd like to see fixed.

SuiJuris	Posted - 2009.08.07 16:33:00 - [11] 24 hours is too damn restrictive, you have to make the decision if your going to spend your entire day in 1 clone or another. I think 6-12 hours would be much more reasonable. A lot of people hate having to clone jump out for a 2-3 hour corp op and then get stuck there for the next 21 hours..... --- It's like my mom always said... "I knew I should of drowned that one."
Isaac Starstriker Amarr Solaris Operations	Posted - 2009.08.07 16:56:00 - [12] No. Jump Clones do not need a buff. --Isaac Isaac's Haul*Mart - Closed
Fille Balle Dissolution Of Eternity	Posted - 2009.08.07 17:20:00 - [13] Sorry, but what's that timer for again? Ah, less pvp. Well, we want this game to become carebearland no? Remove that lame timer already. No need for a skill, just get rid of it already! /Support
maya ibuki2 THORN Syndicate Mostly Harmless	Posted - 2009.08.07 21:02:00 - [14] Originally by: LaVista Vista I'd like to see it. me too :3 supportin ma goonie brosef 0ok!
Gramtar GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.08.07 21:38:00 - [15] I can see 30-60 minutes per level, but more than that is ridiculous.
SuiJuris	Posted - 2009.08.07 22:01:00 - [16] Originally by: Isaac Starstriker No. Jump Clones do not need a buff. --Isaac Originally by: Drake Draconis No. So, Why not? Unfair trading advantage for market manipulation, People can very easily get as many free alts as they want to sit in varios regions to check market prices. Quick travel from region to region so someone can pop from Empire out to the middle of no where at a moments notice? Ya cause a 6 or twelve hour timer is going to be soo much less effective at this then a 24 hour timer. --- It's like my mom always said... "I knew I should of drowned that one."
chatgris Quantum Cats Syndicate	Posted - 2009.08.07 22:12:00 - [17] Originally by: Charlemeign Is it just me or are Goons actually making sensible, well-thoughtout forums posts now? /me faints This ^^ :)
Hashin Kyojin	Posted - 2009.08.07 22:27:00 - [18] Yes
Nur AlHuda Amarr Callide Vulpis	Posted - 2009.08.07 22:29:00 - [19] support
Pian Shu Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse Tread Alliance	Posted - 2009.08.07 22:37:00 - [20] Originally by: CommanderData211 I think a good solution might be to be able to jump twice within a 48 hour period. This allows people to conduct business and come back while still limiting clone jumping to the same number of overall jumps. Takers? I'd support the original, but I like the quoted idea better.

Ben Derindar Dirty Deeds Corp.	Posted - 2009.08.08 00:16:00 - [21] Not supported. The galaxy is already too easy to traverse thanks to jump clones (among other things) without making it even smaller. If anything, jump clone timers should be increased, not the other way around. /Ben
Drake Draconis Minmatar Shadow Cadre	Posted - 2009.08.08 06:03:00 - [22] Originally by: SuiJuris Originally by: Isaac Starstriker No. Jump Clones do not need a buff. --Isaac Originally by: Drake Draconis No. So, Why not? Unfair trading advantage for market manipulation, People can very easily get as many free alts as they want to sit in varios regions to check market prices. Quick travel from region to region so someone can pop from Empire out to the middle of no where at a moments notice? Ya cause a 6 or twelve hour timer is going to be soo much less effective at this then a 24 hour timer. What does jump cloning have to do with market prices? You must be in the wrong proposal... I suggest you search for those threads to do with market price checks and alts and not here. This is not the proposal your looking for... move along... move along. ========================= CEO of Shadow Cadre http://www.shadowcadre.com =========================
Raeza Wildly Inappropriate.	Posted - 2009.08.08 17:09:00 - [23] Edited by: Raeza on 08/08/2009 17:15:36 Originally by: Ben Derindar Not supported. The galaxy is already too easy to traverse thanks to jump clones (among other things) without making it even smaller. If anything, jump clone timers should be increased, not the other way around. /Ben Although your point is extremely valid I tend to disagree - yes it will make the EVE universe even more accessible; but I don't think it would damage / change the game mechanics, If anything it would just make it more fun Ben / other non supporters - just to add in, I am not necessarily saying you are wrong - EVE is a community based game so it's important to see the most popular preferences from both sides.
Santiago Fahahrri Galactic Geographic	Posted - 2009.08.08 19:50:00 - [24] Originally by: Ben Derindar Not supported. The galaxy is already too easy to traverse thanks to jump clones (among other things) without making it even smaller. If anything, jump clone timers should be increased, not the other way around. /Ben I agree with this. Not supported. ~ Santiago Fahahrri Galactic Geographic
Stil Harkonnen	Posted - 2009.08.10 02:38:00 - [25] I like this idea. Even if it is changed to the twice in 48 hours, if you have to jump somewhere real fast, you can jump back right away and not waste 24 hours doing almost nothing in your other clone. the 48 hour times is there so you can't do this constantly. Either way works
Carniflex Fallout Research Fallout Project	Posted - 2009.08.10 08:01:00 - [26] I support this.
El Liptonez	Posted - 2009.08.10 09:04:00 - [27] No support. Jump clones shouldn't be logistic clones.
SuiJuris	Posted - 2009.08.10 16:52:00 - [28] Originally by: Drake Draconis Edited by: Drake Draconis on 08/08/2009 06:13:54 Edited by: Drake Draconis on 08/08/2009 06:12:37 Originally by: SuiJuris Originally by: Isaac Starstriker No. Jump Clones do not need a buff. --Isaac Originally by: Drake Draconis No. So, Why not? Unfair trading advantage for market manipulation, People can very easily get as many free alts as they want to sit in varios regions to check market prices. Quick travel from region to region so someone can pop from Empire out to the middle of no where at a moments notice? Ya cause a 6 or twelve hour timer is going to be soo much less effective at this then a 24 hour timer. What does jump cloning have to do with market prices? You must be in the wrong proposal... I suggest you search for those threads to do with market price checks and alts and not here. People use jump clones to jump to 0.0 and back to high sec or other high sec areas. This unfair advantage your talking about? Is that the best argument you can come up with? I suggest you check out the Trading skills... and then realize that you can only have 3 toons per alt. Now please...move along... you made your vote of support..stop being a troll. Personally Jump Clones are too easy and make the game way too small. Lessening the time can make it worse... taking it away however is not so nice as I use them myself. 24 hours is more than adequate.... it forces you to plan ahead. If your unable to plan.... don't come crying to us. In your Original post you provided nothing but a Generic no. Its much more valuable to the discussion at hand when you actually type out a reason behind your vote. Think about it, if people are holding a vote and its split 50/50 but everyone who supports it gives a reason and everyone who doesn't just says no, which votes do you think are going to carry more weight? --- It's like my mom always said... "I knew I should of drowned that one."
Drake Draconis Minmatar Shadow Cadre	Posted - 2009.08.10 18:44:00 - [29] Originally by: SuiJuris Originally by: Drake Draconis Edited by: Drake Draconis on 08/08/2009 06:13:54 Edited by: Drake Draconis on 08/08/2009 06:12:37 Originally by: SuiJuris Originally by: Isaac Starstriker No. Jump Clones do not need a buff. --Isaac Originally by: Drake Draconis No. So, Why not? Unfair trading advantage for market manipulation, People can very easily get as many free alts as they want to sit in varios regions to check market prices. Quick travel from region to region so someone can pop from Empire out to the middle of no where at a moments notice? Ya cause a 6 or twelve hour timer is going to be soo much less effective at this then a 24 hour timer. What does jump cloning have to do with market prices? You must be in the wrong proposal... I suggest you search for those threads to do with market price checks and alts and not here. People use jump clones to jump to 0.0 and back to high sec or other high sec areas. This unfair advantage your talking about? Is that the best argument you can come up with? I suggest you check out the Trading skills... and then realize that you can only have 3 toons per alt. Now please...move along... you made your vote of support..stop being a troll. Personally Jump Clones are too easy and make the game way too small. Lessening the time can make it worse... taking it away however is not so nice as I use them myself. 24 hours is more than adequate.... it forces you to plan ahead. If your unable to plan.... don't come crying to us. In your Original post you provided nothing but a Generic no. Its much more valuable to the discussion at hand when you actually type out a reason behind your vote. Think about it, if people are holding a vote and its split 50/50 but everyone who supports it gives a reason and everyone who doesn't just says no, which votes do you think are going to carry more weight? Maybe if you spent more time researching why the majority say no and less time lecturing me you wouldn't come across as a total fool. This proposal has been brought up hundreds if not thousands of times and it has been shot down each time. I'm not going to repeat myself just for the pleasure of your foolish attempt at reasoning. And that goes for everyone here who seems keen on getting there oh so very easy insta-travel around New Eden. ========================= CEO of Shadow Cadre http://www.shadowcadre.com =========================
Sir Muffoon Debitum Naturae	Posted - 2009.08.10 19:06:00 - [30] Not supported.

pHenomena1337	Posted - 2009.08.10 19:57:00 - [31] I like both ideas. You got my support. ---------------------------------------------
Saulc Neslo	Posted - 2009.08.10 21:32:00 - [32] No go. Space is supposed to be big.
SuiJuris	Posted - 2009.08.10 21:37:00 - [33] Drake, First off, learn to count, this is being supported almost 2 to 1. Seondly, your trying to get ****ed at me because I asked people to back up there side of the arguement with a little reasoning. Because thats so much to ask, that people explain there point of view rather then just paroting it. --- It's like my mom always said... "I knew I should of drowned that one."
Aniel Zaar Light of Orion	Posted - 2009.08.10 22:17:00 - [34] Would like to see the timer reduced, and then maybe even more clones per character. -^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^ By the way, I am an Ishtar and T2 sentries fan. Fight to make the sentry damage rig work for all drones.
Drake Draconis Minmatar Shadow Cadre	Posted - 2009.08.11 00:42:00 - [35] Originally by: SuiJuris Drake, First off, learn to count, this is being supported almost 2 to 1. Seondly, your trying to get ****ed at me because I asked people to back up there side of the arguement with a little reasoning. Because thats so much to ask, that people explain there point of view rather then just paroting it. 33 posts and 19 supports. Seems like your math is off. As i said before... less time lecturing.. more time reading. ========================= CEO of Shadow Cadre http://www.shadowcadre.com =========================
Syaran Gallente IMPERIAL SENATE Cool Kids Club	Posted - 2009.08.11 08:13:00 - [36] Originally by: Drake Draconis Originally by: SuiJuris Drake, First off, learn to count, this is being supported almost 2 to 1. Seondly, your trying to get ****ed at me because I asked people to back up there side of the arguement with a little reasoning. Because thats so much to ask, that people explain there point of view rather then just paroting it. 33 posts and 19 supports. Seems like your math is off. As i said before... less time lecturing.. more time reading. It would seem that way until you realise that some people posted multiple times. If you don't support a proposal but 150 people do, and you alone make 151 posts in that topic saying you don't support, does that mean it's not supported?
bjtardiff	Posted - 2009.08.11 15:26:00 - [37] Supported You can only have a max of 5 jump clone and the skills not going to erase the timer ether its just going to lower it 24 hours time wait to something maybe at level 5 to 12 hours you can balence it by making it a a high rank skill.
SuiJuris	Posted - 2009.08.11 16:53:00 - [38] Edited by: SuiJuris on 11/08/2009 16:54:27 Originally by: Drake Draconis Originally by: SuiJuris Drake, First off, learn to count, this is being supported almost 2 to 1. Seondly, your trying to get ****ed at me because I asked people to back up there side of the arguement with a little reasoning. Because thats so much to ask, that people explain there point of view rather then just paroting it. 33 posts and 19 supports. Seems like your math is off. As i said before... less time lecturing.. more time reading. I did count, there were multiple posts by some people, also it was supported 16 to 9 ish (might of been 15 to 8) when I posted thats why I said almost 2 to 1. Now you done being jackass or shall I pwn you some more? --- It's like my mom always said... "I knew I should of drowned that one."
Kazzac Elentria	Posted - 2009.08.11 17:11:00 - [39] Supported, but no lower than 12-16 hours. Something that at least forces you to wait a day, since people still have to sleep (at least some of you dont anyway) but doesn't prevent you from say making a strategic jump the night before and then being forced to make the long haul if you happen to log in the afternoon for some reason or another.
Red Raider Airbourne Demons DeMoN's N AnGeL's	Posted - 2009.08.11 18:01:00 - [40] I would love to see it lowered to about 18 hours for the exact reason listed in the OP. A happy gamer isnt on the forums, they are playing the game unless they have an idea that they honestly think is helping out.

ADFES II	Posted - 2009.08.11 19:33:00 - [41] I support the idea to reduce the cooldown, not the 2 jumps within 48hrs. The cleaning staff must take their time to wash the cloning machine... OP idea supported
Nnamuachs Caldari Kiith Paktu Veneratio Venator Alliance	Posted - 2009.08.11 20:19:00 - [42] I support raising the time from 24 to 48 hours for a single jump and having the jump clone skill reduce it by 10% per level
Varus Riaz Gallente Fatalix Inc.	Posted - 2009.08.11 20:33:00 - [43] This is a bad idea. The OP's hypothetical situation is exactly what should happen. An alliance should not be able to ramble across the galaxy with no consequences. Unfortunately, with the advent of jumpclones and jumpbridges, this is exactly what happens. The current situation is such that an alliance can assault a distant region with little consequences. For example: Alliance A's home region is Period Basis. One day they decide to assault Alliance B in Tribute. Upstart Alliance C sees that Alliance A has left their region undefended and make a grab for it. Alliance A simply jumpclones everyone back to Period Basis and fights off Alliance C. Alliance B barely gets breathing space before Alliance A has clonejumped back up. Alliance A barely needed to consider the consequences of galloping across the map. Jumpclones allow giant coalitions and the ability to attack distant regions at a whim. If anything, the timer needs to be lengthened or jumpclones need to be eliminated entirely. Shortening the timer will just exacerbate the current issues.
SuiJuris	Posted - 2009.08.11 20:59:00 - [44] Originally by: Varus Riaz Edited by: Varus Riaz on 11/08/2009 20:43:57 This is a bad idea. The OP's hypothetical situation is exactly what should happen. An alliance should not be able to ramble across the galaxy with no consequences. Unfortunately, with the advent of jumpclones and jumpbridges, this is exactly what happens. The current situation is such that an alliance can assault a distant region with little consequences. For example: Alliance A's home region is Period Basis. One day they decide to assault Alliance B in Tribute. Upstart Alliance C sees that Alliance A has left their region undefended and make a grab for it. Alliance A simply jumpclones everyone back to Period Basis and fights off Alliance C. Alliance B barely gets breathing space before Alliance A has clonejumped back up. Alliance A barely needed to consider the consequences of galloping across the map. Jumpclones allow giant empires, map spanning coalitions and the ability to attack distant regions at a whim. If anything, the timer needs to be lengthened or jumpclones need to be eliminated entirely. Shortening the timer will just exacerbate the current issues. Currently, if Alliance C attacks Alliance A might be able to jumpclone back, and if they do, they cannot start attacking Alliance B again for 24 hours. If this timer was shortened to say 12 hours, Hell, if Alliance B can't put a attack together in 12 hours they fail, because even without a jumpclone in that amount of time Alliance A could of traveled back normally anyways. --- It's like my mom always said... "I knew I should of drowned that one."
Varus Riaz Gallente Fatalix Inc.	Posted - 2009.08.11 21:20:00 - [45] 24 hours is a pitifully short amount of time. If Alliance A is on the ball with stronting they aren't even going to lose a tower before they can show up to defend. If an alliance actually had to manually travel it would be much more of a PITA. If they were trying to come home in the ships they took out there they'd have to deal with other hostile alliances, roaming gangs, and opportunistic people like PL or Cry Havoc coming for them. If whoever was attacking them was on the ball they might have to deal with empire mercs to get back. Even if you stick everyone in Ceptors you still have to make around 50 jumps instead of clicking a button that allows you to bypass all potential threats. More risk means less map spanning adventures, means less map spanning coalitions, means less huge empires, means more chance for somebody new to break onto the scene. Shortening the jumpclone timer just makes space even smaller and exacerbates all of the above issues.
Red Raider Caldari Airbourne Demons DeMoN's N AnGeL's	Posted - 2009.08.11 21:47:00 - [46] Originally by: Varus Riaz Edited by: Varus Riaz on 11/08/2009 20:43:57 This is a bad idea. The OP's hypothetical situation is exactly what should happen. An alliance should not be able to ramble across the galaxy with no consequences. Unfortunately, with the advent of jumpclones and jumpbridges, this is exactly what happens. The current situation is such that an alliance can assault a distant region with little consequences. For example: Alliance A's home region is Period Basis. One day they decide to assault Alliance B in Tribute. Upstart Alliance C sees that Alliance A has left their region undefended and make a grab for it. Alliance A simply jumpclones everyone back to Period Basis and fights off Alliance C. Alliance B barely gets breathing space before Alliance A has clonejumped back up. Alliance A barely needed to consider the consequences of galloping across the map. Jumpclones allow giant empires, map spanning coalitions and the ability to attack distant regions at a whim. If anything, the timer needs to be lengthened or jumpclones need to be eliminated entirely. Shortening the timer will just exacerbate the current issues. Everyone has the same advantage. Whats the problem? A happy gamer isnt on the forums, they are playing the game unless they have an idea that they honestly think is helping out.
Santiago Fahahrri Galactic Geographic	Posted - 2009.08.11 22:21:00 - [47] Jump clone use should come with the risk of skill loss, like losing a pod with your clone not updated. ~ Santiago Fahahrri Galactic Geographic
Varus Riaz Gallente Fatalix Inc.	Posted - 2009.08.12 00:07:00 - [48] Originally by: Red Raider Everyone has the same advantage. Whats the problem? The problem is that mechanics like these encourage larger and larger space holding alliances to exist. You get alliances holding entire regions without living in them. Despite this, a smaller alliance can't move in because jump clones, jumpbridges and the like mean that the larger alliance can be on them before the first tower comes out of reinforced. They can do this even when they are currently fighting someone else on the other side of the map. It's also easier to have distant allies. There's no reason to not travel across the whole map when you can jumpclone back if any trouble comes up. This allows giant coalitions to intervene at will with little danger. Jump bridges, jumpfreighters and jumpclones were all made to make fighting and holding space less tedious, which is great, but they have had side effects. I personally don't want to see it get any easier to move across space due to this.
RedSplat Heretic Army	Posted - 2009.08.12 01:21:00 - [49] isk ISNT a drawback anymore. Make them lose SP when they JC for a second time in 24 hours equivalent to 0.5 m SP per 4 hours earlier than the timer they JC. SP lost is lost in the same fashion and according to same priorities as losing a cloen that isnt up to date. If its really that important to JC multiple times in 24 hours, suck it up carebears. Originally by: CCP Mitnal I don't sleep. I am always here. Watching. Waiting. Originally by: CCP Mitnal it does get progressively longer.
Lana Torrin Minmatar Republic Military Skool	Posted - 2009.08.12 01:54:00 - [50] Hell I'll agree with this even if it only takes 30 mins off per level.. So have I just been trolled?

SolarKnight Gallente ORIGIN SYSTEMS Shadows of Light	Posted - 2009.08.12 02:27:00 - [51] No, The universe is already too small, ccp should be focusing on making everything feel bigger, and more useful, not making it easier for people to teleport from one end of space to the other. The Light in the Darkness
ProHulaDancer	Posted - 2009.08.12 03:27:00 - [52] Originally by: Varus Riaz If an alliance actually had to manually travel it would be much more of a PITA. If they were trying to come home in the ships they took out there they'd have to deal with other hostile alliances, roaming gangs, and opportunistic people like PL or Cry Havoc coming for them. If whoever was attacking them was on the ball they might have to deal with empire mercs to get back. Even if you stick everyone in Ceptors you still have to make around 50 jumps instead of clicking a button that allows you to bypass all potential threats. More risk means less map spanning adventures, means less map spanning coalitions, means less huge empires, means more chance for somebody new to break onto the scene. Your counterpoints would be much more valid if Titans didnt exist. As it stands an entire fleet can be jump-bridged to a battle in minutes.
Matt Madness	Posted - 2009.08.12 04:47:00 - [53] YES PLEASE My other ship is a sig.
Valanan Merch Industrial GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.08.12 04:53:00 - [54] Originally by: Stil Harkonnen I like this idea. Even if it is changed to the twice in 48 hours, if you have to jump somewhere real fast, you can jump back right away and not waste 24 hours doing almost nothing in your other clone. the 48 hour times is there so you can't do this constantly. Either way works
159Pinky Trans-Solar Works Rooks and Kings	Posted - 2009.08.14 10:33:00 - [55] Originally by: RedSplat isk ISNT a drawback anymore. Make them lose SP when they JC for a second time in 24 hours equivalent to 0.5 m SP per 4 hours earlier than the timer they JC. SP lost is lost in the same fashion and according to same priorities as losing a cloen that isnt up to date. If its really that important to JC multiple times in 24 hours, suck it up carebears. This. You wanna CJ more thanb the average player? You pay for it with something valuable.
Cyberman Mastermind	Posted - 2009.08.14 12:27:00 - [56] Originally by: SolarKnight No, The universe is already too small, ccp should be focusing on making everything feel bigger, Like, reducing speed on all ships by half? And then perhaps remove WTZ and put the minimum distance at 100KM? Surely this would make the universe seem bigger. Or while at it, why not make it so you have to press keys to advance? Useless grind/time lost is good, isn't it? Let's make the boring parts of the game even more boring and annoying, everyone will be glad about this, I'm sure! Seriously, maybe I'm playing the wrong end of the game (possible, as I'm outside of alliances) but I don't think the universe is small at all. I'm bored enough when I have to travel a dozen jumps, even if I'm using a shuttle and don't fly with AP. No reason to make it worse than it is.
Abortion Engine GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.08.16 19:10:00 - [57] As it stands I simply pod jump from one side of the universe to another. I'd rather be able to clone jump now and then so I can keep multiple implant sets about.
minuseb	Posted - 2009.08.17 07:41:00 - [58] maybe a little change, not so drastic? keep timer to 24 hours as it is now, to any destination allow jump within same region after 12-18 hours lets say
Scoop EMP	Posted - 2009.08.17 08:58:00 - [59]
Verys Burning Technologies Circle-Of-Two	Posted - 2009.08.17 14:05:00 - [60] I support this thread, however it must not be a skill as this will then again become a mandatory for every alliance. A 18 hour delay is fine. Also I noticed that there are a lot of flawed arguments against this proposal 1. It will make alliance way to easy to move from one space to another This is false, have you ever thought about the fact that you need to jump ships, equipment, posses, ammo and what not to your next location. This is going to have to be done by capital ship as the last time I checked jump clones didn't take your stuff along with you. Also titans are a way better method to get your army across space (be it at a shorter range). Yes more players will now be able to participate because they had some business elsewhere but that is not a bad thing. For those saying that it will aid the alliances in defending they are also wrong as it doesn't matter if it's a 18 or 24 hour delay that pos won't be coming out of reinforced in that time, the jump clone issue is not the problem here but the sovereignty issue is which is going to be fixed. 2. Space will become smaller No it will not as I stated in my last argument your stuff is not taken with you along the ride. So what would be better getting your character without anything but a rookie ship at a new location or getting your toon and your stuff by flying/jumping to the new location and not being restricted by a timer delay. I know which one I would pick. The space in eve is already huge and travelling is not a fun thing to do in eve as it's a repetitive act of clicking buttons.

Nian Banks Berserkers of Aesir	Posted - 2009.08.17 14:20:00 - [61] I personally believe that when CCP created jump clones and set it to a 24 hour cooldown, they wernt thinking, honestly if you only want people to use jump clones once a day, it has to be less than 24 hours, otherwise if you use it each day, after a week or so you will find the cooldown will happen outside your playtime and instead of waiting 24 hours, it will be almost 48. It should be 23:30 hours so as to allow the user to jump once a day without fail. [Troll]For those who just say no, I cry a little inside every time I think that one day your stupid genes will be passed onto the next generation.[/Troll]
Kaito Haakkainen	Posted - 2009.08.17 21:21:00 - [62] Originally by: CommanderData211 I think a good solution might be to be able to jump twice within a 48 hour period. This allows people to conduct business and come back while still limiting clone jumping to the same number of overall jumps. Takers?
Gneeznow North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2009.08.17 21:44:00 - [63] agree
RansomList	Posted - 2009.08.17 21:44:00 - [64] no
ChinaWillGrowLarger Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2009.08.17 21:46:00 - [65] hell no
Mobius Fierce	Posted - 2009.08.24 21:55:00 - [66] I am Mobius Fierce and I support this proposal.
Uronksur Suth Sankkasen Mining Conglomerate	Posted - 2009.08.24 22:09:00 - [67] Why do people keep trying to get a reduction on the jump clone timer? No.
Mobius Fierce	Posted - 2009.08.24 22:19:00 - [68] Originally by: Uronksur Suth Why do people keep trying to get a reduction on the jump clone timer? No. Not all of us play 23/7. The time we do play is valuable. We can always fall back on pod jumping to get into the action, but that brings up the question "Why should character farmers get skills faster than those actually playing the game?"
Orakkus Minmatar m3 Corp	Posted - 2009.08.24 23:34:00 - [69] Hmm.. as much as I would like this.. and I really would, I can't support it. A change of that nature would disproportionally benefit two groups that already have significant advantages. Very active players and larger alliances. Bigger alliances in general benefit more from logistical changes than smaller ones do, and this is most definately a logistical change. The more active players will be able to operate between multiple locations, with less concern about having to worry about putting themselves in harm's way. This would make wardecs more difficult to prosecute, Bountied players easier to get away, defense fleets would be proportionally larger, but so would staging location attack fleets (both of which benefit larger alliances over smaller ones). As far as Verys second argument, if you are operating in 0.0 space, its generally easier just to fly a clone down in a cheap ship to a station, buy the ship you want there, even if it is more expensive,(dependent of course on how well stocked it is), then jump back and forth as the desire arises. Sorry, not supported.. though much desired. I only do diplomancy because I haven't found you.. yet.
Synseer Not Me Shoot It	Posted - 2009.08.25 06:37:00 - [70] supported, 2j in 48 hoours or just simply reduced jump clone timers. more paticipation = more pvp

Ishquar Teh'Sainte Evoke. Ev0ke	Posted - 2009.08.25 07:06:00 - [71] Originally by: Avalloc Case in point you normally log in at 8pm and play until Midnight. On Monday you log in with a fresh timer seeking something to do. At 10pm, in another Region a battle calls for your participation. You have a Jump Clone stored there and make the jump and have a merry good time until Midnight when you log off. Tuesday you log in at 8pm and discover there is action taking place in your home Region. Unfortunately you still have two hours to wait out the timer and have to miss out. NOT supported. bolded the reason. EVE doesn't need more "instant projection of power" over several regions. the ability of pilots to move on a whim makes "logistics"/their interception even less important. it's already bad as it is, it doesn't need to be worsened. just a thought: you have several regions under your control, your alliance is fighting a war against neighbour A, on monday you engage them on their turf. on tuesday neighbour B decides "hey, they aren't at home, now we could try to sneak in through the 'backdoor'" ... "suddenly" all your pilots are back home and killing off every attempt by B. the impossibilty to intercept such pilot movements makes controlling travelroutes less important and puts the emphasis of such a conflict on singular spots (like: station-systems, POSes) ... guerilla tactics are useless, large scale battles the only way to achieve anything. "time" & "space" are important factors as they limit the projection of power. if you have to fly for 2h, having to pass 60+ "chokepoints" (in- & outbound gate) controlling space has a different notion as when you just have to use a jumpclone. EVE definetly doesn't need the projection of power over several regions being easier than it already is. ___________________ ---[SAY NO TO CYNO-LOGISTICS]---
ElanMorin6 GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.08.25 07:08:00 - [72] Originally by: Nian Banks I personally believe that when CCP created jump clones and set it to a 24 hour cooldown, they wernt thinking, honestly if you only want people to use jump clones once a day, it has to be less than 24 hours, otherwise if you use it each day, after a week or so you will find the cooldown will happen outside your playtime and instead of waiting 24 hours, it will be almost 48. It should be 23:30 hours so as to allow the user to jump once a day without fail. ++ Especially given TQ's daily downtime I've never been able to understand why the cooldown wasn't 23 hours instead of 24.
Mobius Fierce	Posted - 2009.08.25 19:01:00 - [73] Originally by: Ishquar Teh'Sainte EVE doesn't need more "instant projection of power" over several regions. the ability of pilots to move on a whim makes "logistics"/their interception even less important. it's already bad as it is, it doesn't need to be worsened. just a thought: you have several regions under your control, your alliance is fighting a war against neighbour A, on monday you engage them on their turf. on tuesday neighbour B decides "hey, they aren't at home, now we could try to sneak in through the 'backdoor'" ... "suddenly" all your pilots are back home and killing off every attempt by B. the impossibilty to intercept such pilot movements makes controlling travelroutes less important and puts the emphasis of such a conflict on singular spots (like: station-systems, POSes) ... guerilla tactics are useless, large scale battles the only way to achieve anything. These reasons fail. If you don't realize that you can get back to your home region without using a jump clone you either fail at this game or have never been in a PvP corp that was willing to teach complete noobs like myself which end of the ship was the front. This proposal just makes life more convenient for those of us who have limited time to play and don't always know in advance which nights we'll have free. For what it's worth, this has more to do with implants than logistics. I personally think the whole attribute system should be scrapped (wtf? learning skills) and replaced with drugs to boost learning speed.
velocity7	Posted - 2009.08.25 19:13:00 - [74] /signed
Ms Leonora Leonora Corporation	Posted - 2009.08.25 20:32:00 - [75] /Supported
Ishquar Teh'Sainte Evoke. Ev0ke	Posted - 2009.08.25 22:15:00 - [76] Originally by: Mobius Fierce These reasons fail. If you don't realize that you can get back to your home region without using a jump clone you either fail at this game or have never been in a PvP corp that was willing to teach complete noobs like myself which end of the ship was the front. 1. flying back "manually" 2. "podexpress" 1. can be intercepted and takes time. it's not impossible to fly back to your homeregion, but you have to plan ahead if it's a.) worth to do 30jumps in one direction - especially if you have to move trough hostile territory b.) if it's actually a good idea for an alliance to operate over more than a few regions. 2. can be really expensive. atleast a good drawback for the instantanousness (sp?) of travel. ___________________ ---[SAY NO TO CYNO-LOGISTICS]---
shuckstar Gallente Hauling hogs	Posted - 2009.08.25 23:31:00 - [77] Not supported.
destinationunreachable Hello Kitty Fanclub	Posted - 2009.08.26 10:21:00 - [78] supported.
Zach 101	Posted - 2009.08.30 16:43:00 - [79] Full support!
Mirador	Posted - 2009.08.31 16:18:00 - [80] /support in the modified 2 in 48 hours max

CrestoftheStars Recreation Of The World	Posted - 2009.09.04 19:08:00 - [81] Edited by: CrestoftheStars on 04/09/2009 19:08:06 it should be 3 hours reduction per lvl making you have a 5 hours timer when maxed, long enough for you not too use it for forth/back quick combat, but short enough to use it to get out of your expensive implants and in a pvp clone and back after the pvp'ing, make you lose a lot less and thereby motivating players too pvp more ___________________________________________ Whoever appeals to the law against his fellow man is either a fool or a coward. Whoever cannot take care of himself without that law is both. For a wounded
Ninja Troll	Posted - 2009.09.04 19:43:00 - [82] Yes! 24hrs is tarded, mkay!
Dretzle Omega Caldari Global Economy Experts Stellar Economy Experts	Posted - 2009.09.04 20:26:00 - [83] This is an intentional drawback to the Jump Clone. Yes, you can fly across the entire span of the galaxy in an instant. No, you cannot jump right back. You'll have to take that into consideration before you jump. If that game mechanic does not work for your play style, then don't use jump clones. Or have something to do at the location of all your jump clones.
LordDerekSegan	Posted - 2009.09.05 01:55:00 - [84] This is a good idea.
Cam Renyolds	Posted - 2009.11.10 09:15:00 - [85] Supported
Nico Terces	Posted - 2009.11.10 11:41:00 - [86] I think it's a good idea.
TeaDaze Agony Unleashed Agony Empire	Posted - 2009.11.10 12:32:00 - [87] I support the idea of a skill to reduce the JC timer by up to 1 hour per level. Vote TeaDaze for CSM #4
Dave Meltdown Capital Construction Inc.	Posted - 2009.11.10 23:24:00 - [88] yes for some less hours waiting
Mynxee Hellcats The Bastards.	Posted - 2009.11.11 22:24:00 - [89] OMG, YES. I've groused about this in the past on my blog. It's a much needed change. My preference is a 2-hour reduction per level. Total reduction should never exceed 12 hours in any event. Some other ideas/options: Could require infomorph psychology to level V before you can train it. Could require a skill AND an implant to make it work...an implant that requires Cybernetics to V. I'm sure there are others (didn't read the whole thread yet). Anything that forces a choice would be fine. Whatever, but please give us a choice to be able to reduce the time between clone jumps. Bump It! \| My Blog: Life in Low Sec
Voddick	Posted - 2009.12.22 07:06:00 - [90] Originally by: Santiago Fahahrri Jump clone use should come with the risk of skill loss, like losing a pod with your clone not updated. I agree to both the original proposal AND ^^^^^. Think of it as mind shock. there should be some risk involved. Brain thermodynamics if you will. The body in the end has limits. If you push those limits via greed or boredom there should be some risk involved. Love the idea, but it would need a NERF out of the gate.

Aineko Macx	Posted - 2009.12.22 08:38:00 - [91] Originally by: TeaDaze I support the idea of a skill to reduce the JC timer by up to 1 hour per level. This.
Bernadictus Caldari Divine Retribution	Posted - 2009.12.22 09:45:00 - [92] I support this. For my limited play time I struggle between making isk pve'ing and pvp'ing in fountain. It's a real pain to time them.
Mantees The Greater Goon Clockwork Pineapple	Posted - 2009.12.22 10:00:00 - [93] I support the idea -- OGRank.com - EVE Online - MMORPG News
MoeJoe Green The Black Legionnares Sylph Alliance	Posted - 2009.12.22 12:18:00 - [94]
Brengholl	Posted - 2009.12.22 15:24:00 - [95] support both the OP and the first post, both solutions seem good
Hugo Lordmagnus Caldari Vexillari	Posted - 2009.12.22 17:29:00 - [96] While I'd very much enjoy the reduced time, I think jump clones are a powerful utility to begin with; simply having the ability to jump makes a massive difference in gameplay. I think the 24 hour timer is sensible, as it restricts abuse of the system but isn't overbearing. It does force the player to choose wisely and plan ahead--and it can definitely be a frustration. But, I don't think dropping it by an hour here or there will make that big of a difference in the mechanic. The order of magnitude (i.e. one day vs. half a day vs. six hours) is such that someone is still going to miss action somewhere because they jumped the night before. They'll feel slighted because they can't jump back, and then we're back here arguing whether it should be reduced to 12 hours. By planning ahead, I've been able to minimize the frustrations of the wait time, so I'm going to withhold support for now. Good idea in concept; I just don't think it's necessary.
Mara Rinn	Posted - 2009.12.22 23:35:00 - [97] Jumping twice in 48 hours just means you'll have a 1000 strong fleet of Goons on your door, then when they're done beating you up for three hours, they'll be on someone else's door across the other side of the galaxy. Extend the jump clone timer to 40 hours. [Aussie players: join channel ANZAC]
Captain Mung	Posted - 2009.12.27 08:02:00 - [98] Support for 1hour or less reduction per level. Having the time be 19 hours instead of 24 isn't going to create some huge migration of toons all the time.
Alexis Cato	Posted - 2009.12.27 16:47:00 - [99] 1 h/level sounds reasonable.
Omega Flames Last Resort Inn SYSTEM SHOCK INITIATIVE	Posted - 2009.12.28 08:09:00 - [100] Originally by: mynnna Originally by: CommanderData211 I think a good solution might be to be able to jump twice within a 48 hour period. This allows people to conduct business and come back while still limiting clone jumping to the same number of overall jumps. Takers? I support the general principle, although I think this is a better solution than a skill to reduce the cooldown. me too.....*curses himself for agreeing with goon...wth?!?!? :(

crimson fire	Posted - 2010.02.03 16:25:00 - [101] yup
Jin Nib Resplendent Knives	Posted - 2010.02.03 21:19:00 - [102] Originally by: Aineko Macx Originally by: TeaDaze I support the idea of a skill to reduce the JC timer by up to 1 hour per level. This. Something like this. -Jin Nib Trading on behalf of Opera Noir since: 2009.03.02 03:53:00
Jonah Pod Gallente	Posted - 2010.02.03 21:36:00 - [103] Not supported.
Yon Krum The Knights Templar R.A.G.E	Posted - 2010.02.04 04:32:00 - [104] Supported. Personally, I'd like to play in an EVE without jumpclones, jump freighters, and jump bridges. I'd like to play in an EVE where 0.0 entities could disable gates, build new ones, stabilize wormholes, and otherwise change the essential terrain in their space. But I doubt that CCP has that vision: the velocity of conflict and markets makes accessible fights and logistics a desirable thing, and now would be a good time for a skill to reduce jumpclone lag--perhaps by an hour per level, so you could jump back at the beginning of a play session the next day, rather than the end. I would add, however, a concurrent ISK-charge for clone jumping, of some amount related to the clone grade quality, and perhaps related to how much prior to 24h you are jumping. --Krum --Krum
Jin Nib Resplendent Knives	Posted - 2010.02.04 05:25:00 - [105] Originally by: Yon Krum Supported. Personally, I'd like to play in an EVE without jumpclones, jump freighters, and jump bridges. I'd like to play in an EVE where 0.0 entities could disable gates, build new ones, stabilize wormholes, and otherwise change the essential terrain in their space. But I doubt that CCP has that vision: the velocity of conflict and markets makes accessible fights and logistics a desirable thing, and now would be a good time for a skill to reduce jumpclone lag--perhaps by an hour per level, so you could jump back at the beginning of a play session the next day, rather than the end. I would add, however, a concurrent ISK-charge for clone jumping, of some amount related to the clone grade quality, and perhaps related to how much prior to 24h you are jumping. --Krum Or perhaps distance? -Jin Nib Trading on behalf of Opera Noir since: 2009.03.02 03:53:00
Vaal Erit Science and Trade Institute	Posted - 2010.02.04 09:57:00 - [106] Surprised at so many nay-sayers. We're talking about a few hours off of the 24 hr jump timer. That isn't going to create any universe breaking gameplay changes. Would also accept 1 jump clone per day. More time playing rather than waiting out my timer is a good thing. Originally by: Jim Raynor EVE needs danger, EVE needs risks, EVE needs combat, even piracy, without these things, the game stagnates to a trivial game centering around bloating your wallet with no purpose.
Titus Balls Minmatar Ship Construction Services Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2010.02.04 14:12:00 - [107] +1 from me, the amount of times I have missed a crucial fight because I had to jump to empire 20 hours before is annoying and some of the suggestions presented here are very valid. I don't agree that it needs to be a free-for-all, it does still need some kind of penalty (2 jumps in 48h, or a skill to reduce JC time)
Anna Lifera Imperial Legion of Amarr	Posted - 2010.02.04 15:59:00 - [108] Edited by: Anna Lifera on 04/02/2010 16:02:16 supported for the double jump within 48 hours. it's bad enough my old corp barely did any pvp ops at all because of inactivity and lack of numbers. even worse is when i jump clones, only to find out they cancelled it at the last second, leaving me stuck in a no-implant jump clone til the next day for no good reason. and i'm sure no one's gonna want to stay up 24 hours to maintain the focus, situational awareness, energy, and reflexes needed to pvp for that long or even close to it. and from the looks of it, most of the ppl who disapprove r just trolls just want to make the game less fun for everyone, including themselves.
Sokratesz	Posted - 2010.02.05 17:09:00 - [109] Supported! Want to test a supercap on SISI but don't have one?
Jonah Pod Gallente	Posted - 2010.02.05 22:24:00 - [110] May I draw your attention to this linkage? Wiki Entry "Rejected Issues" Category This proposal was rejected by CSM3 and wasn't updated since. So why give it another shot? Not supported.

Lucy Midnight	Posted - 2010.02.05 23:56:00 - [111] Originally by: Jonah Pod May I draw your attention to this linkage? Wiki Entry "Rejected Issues" Category This proposal was rejected by CSM3 and wasn't updated since. So why give it another shot? Not supported. You can draw attention all you want; that was the last CSM, there is now a new CSM. It was not proposed to CCP and therefore CCP did not reject it.
Sokratesz	Posted - 2010.02.06 09:23:00 - [112] Originally by: Jonah Pod May I draw your attention to this linkage? Wiki Entry "Rejected Issues" Category This proposal was rejected by CSM3 and wasn't updated since. So why give it another shot? Not supported. In that case, I don't think it can be re-raised. Want to test a supercap on SISI but don't have one?
Jin Nib Resplendent Knives	Posted - 2010.02.07 05:17:00 - [113] Originally by: Sokratesz Originally by: Jonah Pod May I draw your attention to this linkage? Wiki Entry "Rejected Issues" Category This proposal was rejected by CSM3 and wasn't updated since. So why give it another shot? Not supported. In that case, I don't think it can be re-raised. That is ridiculous, I hope you're wrong. What kind of moronic bureaucratic and pointless clause would that be if an idea could never be revisited, even in a different form, even if it has merit, simply because one CSM group with perhaps different priorities rejected it for who know what reasons. If that is so there is even less point in voting for the CSM then there is currently. (Please note I avoided using the language I would have enjoyed. Praise me ) -Jin Nib Trading on behalf of Opera Noir since: 2009.03.02 03:53:00
Jonah Pod Gallente	Posted - 2010.02.07 10:31:00 - [114] Praised you are, Jin Nib ;) Originally by: Jin Nib Originally by: Sokratesz Originally by: Jonah Pod May I draw your attention to this linkage? Wiki Entry "Rejected Issues" Category This proposal was rejected by CSM3 and wasn't updated since. So why give it another shot? Not supported. In that case, I don't think it can be re-raised. That is ridiculous, I hope you're wrong. What kind of moronic bureaucratic and pointless clause would that be if an idea could never be revisited, even in a different form, even if it has merit, simply because one CSM group with perhaps different priorities rejected it for who know what reasons. If that is so there is even less point in voting for the CSM then there is currently. (Please note I avoided using the language I would have enjoyed. Praise me ) I suppose, the point is that the proposal wasn't updated after it had been rejected. If all the cons that lead to the CSM 3 decision would have been addressed, I'd expect it to be legitimately raised against CSM 4. However, as pointed to in the Minutes, a similar issue had been brought to CCP already and was answered in September 2009: Quote: 6.54. Remove pause for Jump Clones and implants http://wiki.eveonline.com/wiki/Remove_pause_for_JC_and_implants The proposal as suggested is difficult to implement. However an alternative button for pausing/resuming placed in the jump clone interface is considered acceptable by both CCP and the CSM. Plugging in implants may, however, be fixable as proposed. While I take this as a clear "no" from CCP, feel free to get in touch with the OP and ask to have the proposal updated.
Jin Nib Resplendent Knives	Posted - 2010.02.07 16:25:00 - [115] I followed the wiki link but there was no info there. From what I can tell this is referring to a different matter entirely Jonah. Having to pause training in-order to jump is inconvenient but not a big deal, also it's not part of what we are discussing here. In addition the suggestion to jump 2 times in 48 hours is a pretty good option in my opinion and wasn't raised in the earlier minutes presented. As well as the fact that those minutes had quite a few references to the good old days which is not an acceptable reason. -Jin Nib Trading on behalf of Opera Noir since: 2009.03.02 03:53:00
Sokratesz	Posted - 2010.02.08 05:52:00 - [116] It would be silly if a proposal could be infinitely re-raised without any changes simply because one person wants it to. Want to test a supercap on SISI but don't have one?
Jonah Pod Gallente	Posted - 2010.02.08 08:03:00 - [117] Edited by: Jonah Pod on 08/02/2010 08:04:15 Originally by: Jin Nib I followed the wiki link but there was no info there. From what I can tell this is referring to a different matter entirely Jonah. Having to pause training in-order to jump is inconvenient but not a big deal, also it's not part of what we are discussing here. Unfortunately, the wiki pages do not contain any information regarding the progress of a proposal at all. One has to find and dig through the corresponding Minutes/Reports to gather additional information :( That's why I provided the additional linkage. Originally by: Jin Nib In addition the suggestion to jump 2 times in 48 hours is a pretty good option in my opinion and wasn't raised in the earlier minutes presented. As well as the fact that those minutes had quite a few references to the good old days which is not an acceptable reason. Don't get me wrong, I don't want to keep anyone to re-raise an issue formerly rejected by a CSM. However, I expect such proposals to be updated appropriately to reflect the reasons that led to its refusal, thus removing points like Sokratesz -below- above. That's my point I'm trying to draw your attention to.
Jin Nib Resplendent Knives	Posted - 2010.02.08 18:08:00 - [118] Originally by: Sokratesz infinitely re-raised A few things, first it would be in a different sitting of the CSM and a different person would be raising it. It's hardly one person doing so infinitely. Second given that the CSM is supposedly something supposed to represent the rest of the players they may want to take a bit more time and give a more in depth consideration of things which have a lot of player interest. Look at those minutes, those are weak unsupported arguments for the most part (it's hard to give a good argument in one line admittedly). As Jonah suggests all that need to be done is to refine the idea which one assumes these sorts of threads are well suited to doing. Part of the problem of course is those tiny one liners that may be invalid arguments entirely but in any case may be near impossible to address because theres nothing there to go on. Lets just have a closer look then shall we? Quote: Avalloc introduces the issue being the 24h delay for repeated clone jumping was unnecessarily inhibit daily play. A skill should be introduced to alleviate or jumping be allowed twice in 48h. Quote: Meissa thinks the restriction serves a good purpose. Um... ok. Any specifics? Anything at all? She might as well just have said no and be done with it. Quote: Avalloc claims that "pod jumping" was already possible, voiding tactical intelligence as to an opponent's travel restrictions. Voted for. Quote: Dierdra states that a similar request had already been raised and failed. Travelling through New Eden already was too easy in her opinion. Being raised and having failed is not a valid argument against an idea, unless appeal to authority is your thing. Travel time really is the purview of warping and gates, but for the sake of argument does eliminating a few hours off the clone jump really drastically reduce travel time? Indeed it might even be considered to be in keeping with the games direction. If using the second suggestion it doesn't change travel time at all objectively. Quote: This is seconded by Larkonis. The costs or pod jumping were justified. I don't understand what this is referring to. Quote: Erik suggests to increase the jump clone timer to two days, and allow a skill for its reduction. Avalloc thinks that this would impede new players too much. So Eric is really for it just not in this form. Either that or he has no idea whats going on. Quote: mazzilliu expresses her support saying that a reduction would improve the fitness of the feature to daily routine yet still serve the purpose of restricting its use to once per day. She voted for. Quote: This is later seconded by Erik. I'm of the opinion he has no clue what going on. Quote: Larkonis tends to agree with Dierdra in that travelling was way easy compared to the early days (no warp to 0 - figure that!) The game has moved on from those days, we need a reason that has to to with the game that exist now not the one that existed 5 years ago. Quote: but might support a slight skill decrease of 2h maximum. Again supported but without a vote. Quote: Meissa points out an inconsistency in the proposal where new players would not be helped if the skill was a very high rank. What has this got to do with new players? If it's a skill then so what? New players also can't fly battleships, who cares? If it was granted to everybody then they get it too, just because its not as useful for someone new as opposed to some long timer is weak reason. A frigate is also more useful to an old timer then a newbie. Quote: Also, she sees an unfavourable advantage for large alliances arising from a simplicifaction. Could happen depending on how it was implemented, could also make things more interesting, this is very vague speculation at best. 6-3 against 2 of those were unsure or would have voted yes in a different form and we don't have Zastrows reasons for saying yes. -Jin Nib Trading on behalf of Opera Noir since: 2009.03.02 03:53:00
Allan Sheperd	Posted - 2010.02.15 06:08:00 - [119]
Freezehunter Darkness Of Absolution Looney Toons.	Posted - 2010.02.15 12:34:00 - [120] Edited by: Freezehunter on 15/02/2010 12:36:01 Edited by: Freezehunter on 15/02/2010 12:34:31 2 jumps every 48 hours! Log in, you are in your +4 carebear learning clone > clone jump into PVP clone > do PVP op > come back home/die > jump back to +4 Clone... PERFECT! _________________________________________________ Be polite, be efficient, have a plan to kill everyone you meet.

Kandarus Lyonesse. RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2010.02.16 00:15:00 - [121] Just make the timer 23hrs. It sux jump cloning only to have to wait past the time you did so the next day. It follows suit with a 23/7 eve uptime. Either way, something needs to change. So supported for change.
Centurin Dark Star Industries Sturmgrenadier Syndicate	Posted - 2010.02.16 01:24:00 - [122] I also approve. However I believe 12 hours is a happy medium.
Damien Anders The Red Circle Inc.	Posted - 2010.02.16 14:24:00 - [123] Just a 5 hour reduction at lvl5 for a rank 10 skill would be enough. Supported in principle, numbers may need tweaking as suggested. "This wise man observed that wealth is a tool of freedom. But the pursuit of wealth is the way to slavery."
Garr Anders Thukk U	Posted - 2010.02.16 15:11:00 - [124] I think I supported an older version, but so supported ----- Garr Anders "The only winning move is not to play" is about the best damn advice anyone can get regarding arguing over the internet. - referring to the Movie WarGames 1983
Akira Yamasara	Posted - 2010.02.16 18:33:00 - [125] Edited by: Akira Yamasara on 16/02/2010 18:33:38 10% or even 15% reduction per skill level, would result in: lvl 0 - 24:00 10% reduction___15% reduction lvl 1 - 21:36___20:24 lvl 2 - 19:12___16:48 lvl 3 - 16:48___13:18 lvl 4 - 14:24___09:36 lvl 5 - 12:00___06:00 make it a high rank skill,.. something like 12 or 14 even.
Krystal Flores Sinister Elite	Posted - 2010.02.18 02:22:00 - [126] supported even if its a x12+ skill and 30min a level
Snypar Australis	Posted - 2010.02.18 11:21:00 - [127]
Viktor Villiance Caldari Astrosemites Unlimited	Posted - 2010.02.18 16:09:00 - [128] Edited by: Viktor Villiance on 18/02/2010 16:09:34 Just out question: Why was the original time not set to 23 hours? Or 20? Or something less than a full day? I know CCP doesn't think things through 100% (I cringe to read things on them being shocked that people would gate camp after jump gates were first introduced) but, honestly? Guys, this is a no brainer. You have 24 hours in a day. People log in during the same periods of time in a day. Having a restriction that keeps them from playing the same way, everyday, at the same time is not just game-dumb, it's business-dumb as well. And people wonder why CCP only has approx 250k (there's a lot of duplicate accounts) players instead of 500k already -- most people like to log on and off and do what they want during that time frame. Not play "wait to have fun". While a skill to reduce this time is up for debate, the very fact it is 24 hours and not 23 shows a serious lack of foresight and looks outright embarrassing upon the dev team -- especially given its simplistic, obvious nature. It was once thought that man could be trusted with the keys to his own destiny, but as it turns out, that destiny was to forever deny himself entry to that fate from the futile effort of ever-lasting
Dibsi Dei Genos Occidere Sev3rance	Posted - 2010.02.18 19:08:00 - [129] Supported
Iwannah Spankjoo Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2010.03.02 03:48:00 - [130] Supported in general, no comment on numbers.

Simokon Smegnet Incorporated Libertas Fidelitas	Posted - 2010.03.02 03:52:00 - [131] yes please!
Shoshinge Wolves of Fenrir	Posted - 2010.03.02 05:08:00 - [132] I Believe this is something worth doing an in depth research project. Pilot looking for a hope in 0.0 Gurista space.


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