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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Dariah Stardweller
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Posted - 2009.08.29 17:41:00 -
[481]
Originally by: Tamega As someone who has isk in eve bank my questions are this:
3) Are there any statements from ccp yet? forget the politics for a second, this is a game, all they have to do is get the account statements from eve bank and change some numbers on a server, as something that was advertised on the eve online site, they should step in, as happened in real life with governments bailing out the banks in the UK, US and many other country's.
Hell no, no bail outs in EVE plz, had enough of those IRL.
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Tamega
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Posted - 2009.08.29 17:58:00 -
[482]
Originally by: Dariah Stardweller
Originally by: Tamega As someone who has isk in eve bank my questions are this:
3) Are there any statements from ccp yet? forget the politics for a second, this is a game, all they have to do is get the account statements from eve bank and change some numbers on a server, as something that was advertised on the eve online site, they should step in, as happened in real life with governments bailing out the banks in the UK, US and many other country's.
Hell no, no bail outs in EVE plz, had enough of those IRL.
Can I ask why?
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Comrade Commizzar
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Posted - 2009.08.29 18:20:00 -
[483]
LOL... Having read thru this thread, I have only one questions to ask...
Why are any of you still talking to Ray??
The jig is up! The game is over! The Rats have stolen most of the cheese and the the only thing left is for the Roaches to run off with the crumbs!
So why are so many of you still wasting breath on Ray??
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Drab Cane
Killer Breeze Dread Carbon Initiative
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Posted - 2009.08.29 18:36:00 -
[484]
Originally by: Tamega As someone who has isk in eve bank my questions are this: 3) Are there any statements from ccp yet? forget the politics for a second, this is a game, all they have to do is get the account statements from eve bank and change some numbers on a server, as something that was advertised on the eve online site, they should step in, as happened in real life with governments bailing out the banks in the UK, US and many other country's.
Tamega, CCP won't step in for the following reason:
Originally by: LaVista Vista CCP isn't going to get involved in this at all.
CCP has a hands-off policy.
Besides, EBank is not an integral part of the EvE economy. In RL, the sudden credit freeze caused businesses to close and pushed people out of work and out of homes. EBank's freeze, or even total failure, will not have near the same effect on EvE.
A lot of people seem to have forgotten that EBank is run completely by volunteers, who are compensated for the real time they spend with a bit of play money. I expect that each person on the BoD is shamed by the state of the bank, and Ray is doing his best to move past the finger pointing and on to resuscitating the bank.
As a depositor, I'm only interested in how things got this way if that knowledge helps improve procedures going forward. My main concern is seeing EBank back on its feet and Ray seems determined to make that happen.
-----------------------------------------------
- Who Dares, Wins
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F90OEX
F9X Wildly Inappropriate.
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Posted - 2009.08.29 19:00:00 -
[485]
Originally by: Comrade Commizzar LOL... Having read thru this thread, I have only one questions to ask...
Why are any of you still talking to Ray??
The jig is up! The game is over! The Rats have stolen most of the cheese and the the only thing left is for the Roaches to run off with the crumbs!
So why are so many of you still wasting breath on Ray??
There hoping Ray can turn just water into wine
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Breaker77
Gallente Reclamation Industries New Eden Research
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Posted - 2009.08.29 19:22:00 -
[486]
Originally by: F90OEX There hoping Ray can turn just water into wine
He's already turned ISK into whine
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Tamega
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Posted - 2009.08.29 19:33:00 -
[487]
Originally by: Drab Cane
Originally by: Tamega As someone who has isk in eve bank my questions are this: 3) Are there any statements from ccp yet? forget the politics for a second, this is a game, all they have to do is get the account statements from eve bank and change some numbers on a server, as something that was advertised on the eve online site, they should step in, as happened in real life with governments bailing out the banks in the UK, US and many other country's.
Tamega, CCP won't step in for the following reason:
Originally by: LaVista Vista CCP isn't going to get involved in this at all.
CCP has a hands-off policy.
Besides, EBank is not an integral part of the EvE economy. In RL, the sudden credit freeze caused businesses to close and pushed people out of work and out of homes. EBank's freeze, or even total failure, will not have near the same effect on EvE.
I must say I disagree, many trillions of isk is going to have an effect on the economy, I would not be surprised if some people, faced with the concept of rebuilding what they have spent years on making, quit. I dread to think of how many weeks/months of time I have potentially lost, if all goes tit-up and I lose the lot. Not sure I could do that again
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Black Omne
Caldari House Of BlackStar Semper-Mortis
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Posted - 2009.08.29 20:08:00 -
[488]
I have a good amount of isk in EBANK, and I admire Ray for trying to get this all sorted out, I for one trust he will do the best he can to get things working again.
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Roquezir
Minmatar Opeibus Vis One Stop Research
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Posted - 2009.08.29 20:14:00 -
[489]
Edited by: Roquezir on 29/08/2009 20:14:14
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Clementina
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.08.29 20:14:00 -
[490]
Wow, maybe even WoW! I'm simply gobsmacked, and left relatively speechless.
However I feel that I must say something. I'm a member of an elite after all, albeit an absurd elite; People who didn't lose money in EBANK. It's absurd that this is an elite since everybody should be a member of it.
Here's what I see about Eve based banks in general. Don't but any money in them, don't put any stock in the segment of the Market Discussions 'Elite' who advocates them and mercilessly flames their critics until everybody is so bullied that they dare not say the truth; The truth that all banks in Eve are afflicted by rank incompetence, incestuous cronyism, and just plain old regular theft.
Even today, some of the same people are trying to set up another bank. I haven't read their business plan, However, it can't be too different than the normal bank business plan of Collect Lucrative Salaries for doing little work, let isk walk away without monitoring it, seize the remaining isk, then flee into the sunset. Tom, ****, and Harry depositors don't matter banks, and never will. It's about looking like a big shot and throwing money around. If the actual depositors are considered, they will be robbed, rogered, and ****ed of all of their cash.
Friends don't let friends put money in banks. Looking at that the spreadsheet the bank put out (Which filled me with mirth by the way, Thank You), I'm not sure that IPO's can even be recommended these days.
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Nightjester
Noir.
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Posted - 2009.08.29 20:14:00 -
[491]
I am happy to let Ray sort out the E-bank problem, but could he please give us a breakdown on how he intends to make 100b each month if e-bank is trying to get 1.2T isk back within 12 months.
From reading the board statement it says that they are currently losing 12B a month and they would save 36B a month from knocking of paying back interest. Does that mean that E-bank would make 24B isk a month, if so this means it will take 50 months to get back the 1.2T isk that is short.
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Shaun Klaroh
Caldari Universal Fleet Operations
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Posted - 2009.08.29 21:03:00 -
[492]
Edited by: Shaun Klaroh on 29/08/2009 21:05:13
Originally by: Tamega I must say I disagree, many trillions of isk is going to have an effect on the economy, I would not be surprised if some people, faced with the concept of rebuilding what they have spent years on making, quit. I dread to think of how many weeks/months of time I have potentially lost, if all goes tit-up and I lose the lot. Not sure I could do that again
Of course it's going to have an impact on the market (not that it was really good anyway with a 60% drop in Titanium values over three months after that 200% hike last year). But the problem would be that if CCP did step in, then CCP would have to step in elsewhere as well.
This means that money could be generated out of nowhere when someone says "Boo-hoo, lost a lot of money". Frankly, if it goes belly up, it goes belly up just like any other venture. CCP will just say simply that it was the risk you took in letting someone else manage your money. -----
Quote: "Are these people prisoners?" Arkhan asked.
"Not at all," Melak replied. "They're free to run and get shot any time they like."
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Kazuo Ishiguro
House of Marbles
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Posted - 2009.08.29 23:38:00 -
[493]
Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha
Quote:
In Eve, every single player already has access to a perfectly secure place to store unlimited funds.
They should change it to the Darkfall Online system: you carry money with you => you will drop it when you are destroyed. This would suddenly make banking look like something very needed.
It used to be possible to convert isk into an item in the manner you suggest, but apparently it made laundering too easy. --- 34.4:1 mineral compression ISRC Racing, Season 7 - schedule |
Cors
It's A Trap
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Posted - 2009.08.30 01:46:00 -
[494]
Lemme get this straight.
To join a 0.0 corp, I have to give my API key to most of the decent ones.
To be a dir of most 0.0 corps, I'd have to give my FULL API key.
But to be a teller in the EBank, and handle 10s, 100s of BILLIONS of isk, I don't have to give an API Key?
Sorry, but you guys should have been useing API keys from the start. Tracking EVERY isk that came in and was going out.
sigh..
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Triskele Inire
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Posted - 2009.08.30 02:03:00 -
[495]
You have a dog, and I have a cat. We agree that they are each worth a billion dollars. You sell me the dog for a billion, and I sell you the cat for a billion. Now we are no longer pet owners, but Icelandic banks, with a billion dollars in new assets.
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Rotnac
Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2009.08.30 03:55:00 -
[496]
Originally by: Cors Lemme get this straight.
To join a 0.0 corp, I have to give my API key to most of the decent ones.
To be a dir of most 0.0 corps, I'd have to give my FULL API key.
But to be a teller in the EBank, and handle 10s, 100s of BILLIONS of isk, I don't have to give an API Key?
Sorry, but you guys should have been useing API keys from the start. Tracking EVERY isk that came in and was going out.
sigh..
Haha, yeah. Not requiring full APIs from most/all of their staff and BoD is one of several stupendously ******ed things EBank has done over time.
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Hexxx
Minmatar
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Posted - 2009.08.30 04:45:00 -
[497]
Originally by: Proton Power
So your saying that the BOD is responsible for making sure that every isk gets paid that is in every account with the interest that they signed up for?
Then why is there talks of liquidating accounts for lower amounts and why is interest cut off by the BOD.
Now if your going ot cut interest off thats fine, but then people should be able to withdrawl isk.
The Board will do what the Board decides to do. This is not a public democracy. You should know enough by now that trying to engage me from this angle isn't going to go very far.
EBANK - Advisor | www.eve-bank.net
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BigBank Hank
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Posted - 2009.08.30 06:33:00 -
[498]
Originally by: Hexxx
Originally by: Proton Power
So your saying that the BOD is responsible for making sure that every isk gets paid that is in every account with the interest that they signed up for?
Then why is there talks of liquidating accounts for lower amounts and why is interest cut off by the BOD.
Now if your going ot cut interest off thats fine, but then people should be able to withdrawl isk.
The Board will do what the Board decides to do. This is not a public democracy. You should know enough by now that trying to engage me from this angle isn't going to go very far.
So seriously, how much of the missing 450B did you embezzle in the form of loans to your alts?
You might want to spend some of it on a new character you'd have more credibility here that way.
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Lecherito
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Posted - 2009.08.30 07:52:00 -
[499]
Originally by: Hexxx
Originally by: Proton Power
So your saying that the BOD is responsible for making sure that every isk gets paid that is in every account with the interest that they signed up for?
Then why is there talks of liquidating accounts for lower amounts and why is interest cut off by the BOD.
Now if your going ot cut interest off thats fine, but then people should be able to withdrawl isk.
The Board will do what the Board decides to do. This is not a public democracy. You should know enough by now that trying to engage me from this angle isn't going to go very far.
lol, over one trillion in debt and it's still "not a public democracy". Fascinating.
-L
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LaVista Vista
Conservative Shenanigans Party
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Posted - 2009.08.30 07:56:00 -
[500]
Originally by: Lecherito
lol, over one trillion in debt and it's still "not a public democracy". Fascinating.
-L
No democracy in the real world extends the power of the public just because they are in deficit.
Why? Because the public doesn't know what's best for them. And they don't know everything, making them unable to make the best possible decision.
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Lecherito
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Posted - 2009.08.30 08:00:00 -
[501]
Originally by: LaVista Vista
Originally by: Lecherito
lol, over one trillion in debt and it's still "not a public democracy". Fascinating.
-L
No democracy in the real world extends the power of the public just because they are in deficit.
Why? Because the public doesn't know what's best for them. And they don't know everything, making them unable to make the best possible decision.
Is it not more than clear by now that anyone affiliated with Ebank clearly doesn't know what's best for the investors? Yet the few still retain the right to decide what's best for the many? Yes, I see the logic in this.
-L
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar Dark-Rising
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Posted - 2009.08.30 08:20:00 -
[502]
/dons her Masonry hat
Quote:
Why? Because the public doesn't know what's best for them
This is a kind of thought I'd not expect off someone of your age. Perhaps Shar was right with the groupthink idea?
Anyway, while "the public" are indeed usually too imbecile to understand their own needs, it's quite "peculiar" (not to use other words) to pretend to keep such arcane knowledge for a restricted circle and it made for many history disasters doing so.
It does not sound like it did a lot of good in EvE as well, as the recent events show.
- Auditing and consulting
Before asking for investors, please read http://tinyurl.com/n5ys4h and http://tinyurl.com/lrg4oz
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LaVista Vista
Conservative Shenanigans Party
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Posted - 2009.08.30 08:32:00 -
[503]
Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha
This is a kind of thought I'd not expect off someone of your age. Perhaps Shar was right with the groupthink idea?
I'm sorry that you take a philosophical argument, intended for provocation, like you did.
My point was to suggest that people outside of EBANK might not have the perspective to make an informed call on what's right to do.
Lets take an example: Being able to get your isk back at a % loss.
In theory it's an extremely great idea. But if the projection at the % of the ISK being gone from EBANK isn't correct, they have ripped themself off from some %.
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MonwrathDisortium
Incarnation of Evil
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Posted - 2009.08.30 09:17:00 -
[504]
I dont know what my fascination with this thread is. I suppose watching the people who ganked the iskes try to explain it away over and over, while the poor morons who gave their money to a group of people for such a small return that it was laughable to begin with amuses me.
What posses someone who was adept enough at eve to acquire billions to hand said billions over willingly?
I really do want to know how these poor saps justified it to themselves.
I suppose it doesnt matter, all that is left to do is wait for the inevitable "all your bases are belong to us" announcement.
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Clurk Brodon
Yog-Sothoth Heavy Industries
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Posted - 2009.08.30 10:40:00 -
[505]
Ray, in december 2008 Ricdic was secretly buying capital BPO for Orca production. Are you aware of those transactions?
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The ChurchWarden
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Posted - 2009.08.30 10:59:00 -
[506]
So however many absurd amount of pages we are into the thread I'd like to point something out that may or may not have crossed peoples minds. Ricdic the former head of Ebank had atleast one account banned and stopped playing to my knowledge maybe not. I would assume that as the head of Ebank he had considerable Ebank assets on his characters for the purpose of generating profit. It is commonly known he has researchers / construction / trading alts. Perhaps a large portion of Ebank's wealth is locked up in assets it no longer has access to without Ricdic's accounts.
Thats not to say that I think Ebank was Ricdics private piggy bank but since it is the BoD's responsibility to generate income it wouldn't surprise me to find that several BoD members has BPO's, Mineral stores, whatever on their accounts to do this. Unless Ricdic returned all Ebank assets when he left that could account for a large chunk of debt.
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Proton Power
Amarr Relentless Construction
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Posted - 2009.08.30 11:01:00 -
[507]
Originally by: The ChurchWarden So however many absurd amount of pages we are into the thread I'd like to point something out that may or may not have crossed peoples minds. Ricdic the former head of Ebank had atleast one account banned and stopped playing to my knowledge maybe not. I would assume that as the head of Ebank he had considerable Ebank assets on his characters for the purpose of generating profit. It is commonly known he has researchers / construction / trading alts. Perhaps a large portion of Ebank's wealth is locked up in assets it no longer has access to without Ricdic's accounts.
Thats not to say that I think Ebank was Ricdics private piggy bank but since it is the BoD's responsibility to generate income it wouldn't surprise me to find that several BoD members has BPO's, Mineral stores, whatever on their accounts to do this. Unless Ricdic returned all Ebank assets when he left that could account for a large chunk of debt.
This ^^ the only thing that I know for sure though is that most assets ric played with when I was with EBANK, were in the corp hangers and delivery hangers so that either of us had access at all times. I can't say if he continued this after I left or not.
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LaVista Vista
Conservative Shenanigans Party
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Posted - 2009.08.30 11:10:00 -
[508]
Originally by: The ChurchWarden So however many absurd amount of pages we are into the thread I'd like to point something out that may or may not have crossed peoples minds. Ricdic the former head of Ebank had atleast one account banned and stopped playing to my knowledge maybe not. I would assume that as the head of Ebank he had considerable Ebank assets on his characters for the purpose of generating profit. It is commonly known he has researchers / construction / trading alts. Perhaps a large portion of Ebank's wealth is locked up in assets it no longer has access to without Ricdic's accounts.
Ricdic had all his accounts banned.
And the option that he might have had more assets than accounted for on his account is not unconsidered. But we can't tell.
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The ChurchWarden
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Posted - 2009.08.30 11:14:00 -
[509]
Has anyone tried asking him? Which brings up a curious point. Has Ricdic been contacted at all to attempt to piece together records despite his possible falling out with the entire staff? Can you share if this has been attempted?
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Scott Ryder
Amarr Ministry of War
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Posted - 2009.08.30 11:15:00 -
[510]
Did ebank give 380 billion isk in loans without having collateral cover?
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