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Super Carriers Killing Low Sec PVP

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Phil Throbber	Posted - 2010.04.27 19:19:00 - [181] i agree, moms shud get to use gates
HarrietMiers Republic Military School	Posted - 2010.04.27 19:52:00 - [182] Originally by: Liang Nuren Originally by: Bellum Eternus Liang- Would you be amicable to either of my two earlier suggestions? SCs being able to be ECMed/damped while in lowsec, or no SC able to fit remote reps while in lowsec? Viper said he thought those were reasonable ideas. Frankly I think that's as far as SC lowsec changes need to go. How about you? Like I said - the biggest problem is the lack of ways of interdicting them combined with their what the **** absurd DPS. Keep supercaps in 0.0 where they belong, IMO... but I will settle for them simply not being more powerful in lowsec than in 0.0. Neither of these two strike me as addressing the concern of them being more powerful. Maybe if you wanted to make them completely unable to RECEIVE RR in low sec... ? -Liang Once again, where is the problem you all are talking about? These things die all the friggin time as of right now. Ask Cry Havoc, they kill a good 3 or 4 a month. If they are getting popped by intelligent tactics, take years to train for and tens of billions of isk to produce and fit, and are clearly gankable - what problem is it you all are trying to solve? A lot of sound and fury for a ship class that gets popped 20 + times a month. - Liang
Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2010.04.27 20:02:00 - [183] Originally by: domitesting Edited by: domitesting on 26/04/2010 11:35:52 Originally by: Morgs44 Well yes you could fly away, but they are dropping them on anything. 2 super carriers for a t3? http://bl3h-united.com/kwfl/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=160470 look at the comments, seems to me he tried to kill the tempest even after the cyno was lit...should of gone as soon as cyno was lit..anyway you know for next time that they have super caps and the tempest obviously was waitin around to bait people..seems to me with respect the T3 guy agressed and tried to gank the tempest (4 BS on standby) and he got baited and killed - unlucky! you cant have it all your own way.. "had about 4 bs on standby. tempest warps to planet. i follow. tempest lights cyno and we call it off. got him to quarter armor before the supercarriers repped him" lol he doesnt learn does he..this was BEFORE the T3 kill- so he KNEW they had supercaps http://bl3h-united.com/kwfl/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=166296 Look at a person on the kill mail Viper Schizzle...ring any bells - ex PL....nuff said... The tempest is the best ship in the game, he wasnt bait he was waiting to kill the entire enemy fleet. This is clearly a signature.
Napro Caldari Buccaneers of New Eden death from above..	Posted - 2010.04.27 22:19:00 - [184] I have a solution. No PvP in low sec
Deja Thoris Invicta. Cry Havoc.	Posted - 2010.04.27 22:46:00 - [185] Originally by: Liang Nuren Like I said - the biggest problem is the lack of ways of interdicting them combined with their what the **** absurd DPS. Keep supercaps in 0.0 where they belong, IMO... but I will settle for them simply not being more powerful in lowsec than in 0.0. Neither of these two strike me as addressing the concern of them being more powerful. Maybe if you wanted to make them completely unable to RECEIVE RR in low sec... ? -Liang A ship class was designed to fill just the niche you mentioned, the hic. I've not had trouble getting my hic or those of my friends onto supercarriers whether its through a jump gate, titan portal, even in some cases cloaking the damn thing up all day waiting to pounce. Yes, it requires effort, something I alluded to when I mentioned that these are the biggest and baddest ships in eve and should be harder to catch than the average raven. I don't think they are more powerful in lowsec, true the methods of holding it down are reduced but then again, they can't hide under cyno jammers. It's give and take. I don't think lack of remote reps is a concern for supercarriers in lowsec either. If they get to the point where they need that rr then chances are they are toast. It would just be an inconvenice to refit em to self rep stupid amounts of armor or alternatively to jump em to 0.0 to get remote repped. All you are really proving to me is its easier to propose poorly thought out changes then to come up with a solid plan to kill one.
Bellum Eternus Gallente Death of Virtue MeatSausage EXPRESS	Posted - 2010.04.27 22:49:00 - [186] Originally by: HarrietMiers Once again, where is the problem you all are talking about? These things die all the friggin time as of right now. Ask Cry Havoc, they kill a good 3 or 4 a month. If they are getting popped by intelligent tactics, take years to train for and tens of billions of isk to produce and fit, and are clearly gankable - what problem is it you all are trying to solve? A lot of sound and fury for a ship class that gets popped 20 + times a month. - Liang <NOT white knighting Lian here btw > @ Harriet: 1) Post with your main you noob. 2) Let's not cite CH anymore where they're using large numbers of SCs/ other caps to kill other SCs, shall we? We're discussing the ability of fleets without SC resources having a chance of killing SCs etc. @ Liang- Yes, I'd have to agree and say not receive any RR as well, but the more I think about it, the worse this gets with the 'stupid special rules'. I hate stupid special rules. Maybe banning all SCs and Titans from lowsec is a good idea, or simply make them unable to lock anything while in lowsec so that they can travel through it but not fight. One way or another there needs to be an elegant solution that makes the gameplay fun while still making sense from an overall gameplay perspective. - Originally by: Bellum Eternus That is the beauty of Eve, it's a crucible in which great minds are formed and the rest are ground to dust. Bellum Eternus Inveniam viam aut faciam.
Bellum Eternus Gallente Death of Virtue MeatSausage EXPRESS	Posted - 2010.04.27 23:06:00 - [187] Originally by: Deja Thoris All you are really proving to me is its easier to propose poorly thought out changes then to come up with a solid plan to kill one. Deja- Just to clarify my position (and not speaking for Liang): I don't think killing one SC in lowsec is an issue. At least not for me personally. That's doable. Very much so. It's trying to complete a kill when there are 4-6 SCs on the field all spider tanking that it gets nearly impossible to do without a massive increase in numbers and an almost guaranteed requirement of your own SCs as well. - Originally by: Bellum Eternus That is the beauty of Eve, it's a crucible in which great minds are formed and the rest are ground to dust. Bellum Eternus Inveniam viam aut faciam.
Liang Nuren Parsec Flux	Posted - 2010.04.27 23:09:00 - [188] Originally by: Deja Thoris A ship class was designed to fill just the niche you mentioned, the hic. I've not had trouble getting my hic or those of my friends onto supercarriers whether its through a jump gate, titan portal, even in some cases cloaking the damn thing up all day waiting to pounce. Yes, it requires effort, something I alluded to when I mentioned that these are the biggest and baddest ships in eve and should be harder to catch than the average raven. I don't think they are more powerful in lowsec, true the methods of holding it down are reduced but then again, they can't hide under cyno jammers. It's give and take. I don't think lack of remote reps is a concern for supercarriers in lowsec either. If they get to the point where they need that rr then chances are they are toast. It would just be an inconvenice to refit em to self rep stupid amounts of armor or alternatively to jump em to 0.0 to get remote repped. All you are really proving to me is its easier to propose poorly thought out changes then to come up with a solid plan to kill one. You make it sound like I don't know about HICs or something. I'm a fully trained HIC pilot - hell man pick a HIC. The problem here is the smartest place to use motherships is in lowsec, because their power is multiplied by: - Many fewer tackle options - Lack of doomsdays - A political landscape that isn't as ::cough:: homogeneous I feel fairly confident to say that motherships and titans weren't introduced into Eve to be lowsec gank machines - but to be tools of 0.0 warfare. So how about they go back to doing that and there be some kind of disadvantage for using them in low sec that discourages their use? -Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire
Deja Thoris Invicta. Cry Havoc.	Posted - 2010.04.27 23:16:00 - [189] Originally by: Bellum Eternus Originally by: Deja Thoris All you are really proving to me is its easier to propose poorly thought out changes then to come up with a solid plan to kill one. Deja- Just to clarify my position (and not speaking for Liang): I don't think killing one SC in lowsec is an issue. At least not for me personally. That's doable. Very much so. It's trying to complete a kill when there are 4-6 SCs on the field all spider tanking that it gets nearly impossible to do without a massive increase in numbers and an almost guaranteed requirement of your own SCs as well. Supercarriers don't spider tank each other. Most fit maximum drone control units and a cloak. 20% extra damage from 4 drone controls. Theres no better way to make sure you don't need rr then to kill off the incoming damage. I agree more than 2 becomes a handful but CCP have set the bar by allowing such proliferation so I don't know what we can do but live within the rules they've set or ask for well considered changes, not knee jerk reactions. Personally I think the damage they put out is too high, it used to be too low. I'm sure theres a golden middle somewhere.
MADDOGzors Total Mayhem. Cry Havoc.	Posted - 2010.04.28 04:17:00 - [190] There's always someone that is bigger and kick your ass, get over it. The moment I saw suggestions to remove ewar immunity, not fit rr, and travel only in lowsec is when I realized how ignorant you people are. That's exactly what we need is someone perma-jamming supercaps that can't rr eachother or fight back because they're just traveling through. Why can't you people focus on real issues like reducing lag in big fights, then maybe supercaps won't stumble in your lowsec backyard as much because they're busy enjoying the full utilization of the ship they trained years for and dumped 20+bil into.

Cappin Walka	Posted - 2010.04.28 04:40:00 - [191] Neuts break spider tanks
Viper ShizzIe Habitual Euthanasia Dystopia Alliance	Posted - 2010.04.28 04:49:00 - [192] Originally by: Liang Nuren - Lack of doomsdays If they allowed DDs in lowsec again would you quit whining?
Zeba Minmatar Honourable East India Trading Company	Posted - 2010.04.28 05:01:00 - [193] Originally by: Viper **zIe Originally by: Liang Nuren - Lack of doomsdays If they allowed DDs in lowsec again would you quit whining? Tbh since its a single target weapon now I don't understand the logic behind banning it from lowsec. Titan jumps in and one shots that annoying as ** station camping dread/carrier only to realise too late that it was a trap. Everyone logs in and undocks in their cap ships and wtf pwns the titan during the immobile cooldown period. Or the titans backup jumps in and the node crashes. Originally by:** CCP Zymurgist Get off the forums and go kill someone! Originally by: Amarr Supremacist Yeah, it(Jaguar) almost has cruiser level tank and gank!
Spurty Caldari D00M. RED.OverLord	Posted - 2010.04.28 05:03:00 - [194] Originally by: Cappin Walka Neuts break spider tanks good luck neuting a spider tank. You'll DIAF to it long before you nuet anyone out. Low sec needs something added to it, not taken away. Originally by: Hurley I WAS NOT QUITTING SoT AND WAS NOT THINKING ABOUT JOINING IT. PL/SoT MADE A MISTAKE AND ARE NOT MAN ENOUGH TO ADMIT IT OR FIX IT.
Cappin Walka	Posted - 2010.04.28 05:06:00 - [195] Not sure of the numbers game on this but... If the SC cyno's in , its already lost a lot of its cap If it warped in, it used some cap not sure if its as much as cynoing in though P.S. Stop making excuses for being bad at pvp You can neut out a SC with correct set ups and ships that are available already in game I have seen it done Also by keeping its cap low you keep it form cynoing out, though you dont prevent it from warping it still helps
Morgs44 Kangaroos With Frickin Lazerbeams	Posted - 2010.04.28 05:10:00 - [196] So why ain't DD, Bombs, Bubbles (all types) allowed in low sec? Before the massive dps and hp boost you had to have some ballz to drop one, now any kid could drop one without any worries (or very little). I dont think there needs to be some big massive nerf to them, cause the tears would fill to many pools. like someone said before there needs to be a middle ground. CCP did fix the falcon problem pretty well maybe there is a small and simple way. Ive got no idea myself but iam sure there is an answer out there.
Spurty Caldari D00M. RED.OverLord	Posted - 2010.04.28 05:15:00 - [197] Originally by: Cappin Walka P.S. Stop making excuses for being bad at pvp You can neut out a SC with correct set ups and ships that are available already in game I have seen it done Not to anyone competent. RRBS in 2010 have an effective range a lot further than anyone can neut. Your neut ships = primary, bye! Unless you are bringing a blob, then well, its blob verses blob. Originally by: Hurley I WAS NOT QUITTING SoT AND WAS NOT THINKING ABOUT JOINING IT. PL/SoT MADE A MISTAKE AND ARE NOT MAN ENOUGH TO ADMIT IT OR FIX IT.
ctttttttt Total Mayhem. Cry Havoc.	Posted - 2010.04.28 17:56:00 - [198] If your paying 20 billion isk for a ship you should be able to roll multiple people with it. It is diss-hearting to see how many caps are being used as such though.
Kou Rien Einherjar Rising	Posted - 2010.04.28 18:16:00 - [199] Edited by: Kou Rien on 28/04/2010 18:18:55 Originally by: Bellum Eternus Maybe banning all SCs and Titans from lowsec is a good idea, or simply make them unable to lock anything while in lowsec so that they can travel through it but not fight. No. That just makes Super Carriers and Titans HILARIOUSLY vulnerable while in low sec. There's no reason a ship that expensive and skill intensive should be unable to fight in low sec. This also forces all super cap pilots -not- part of the 0.0 scene to either give up their "endgame" or head into 0.0 against their will. Not receiving RR is again too much, because of the very nature of the super cap buff. Most agree that fitting reps to supercaps is suboptimal, but it seems like Supercaps have become the capitals of old. You can't simply make them unable to lock in low sec because that seems like a punishment for SC pilots...that invest a lot of time and isk to be able to fly them.
Mag's the united Negative Ten.	Posted - 2010.04.28 18:36:00 - [200] What a chuffing joke some of you whiny pirates are ffs. I don't want low-sec to be made any safer by banning SC, or making them 'lol' unable to lock. (good god man wtf) If anything, I'd like to see the DD back in low-sec too, let have some real omg moments. SC's have only just been made usable, leave them be and adapt ffs.

HarrietMiers Republic Military School	Posted - 2010.04.28 18:40:00 - [201] An awful lot of whining over a non existent problem ITT.
Misanth Reaper Industries Cry Havoc.	Posted - 2010.04.28 18:54:00 - [202] * Spending months trading and shooting npcs to buy a mothership hull - 16b * Dedicating over a years skilltraining with +5's plugged (the very least 12x300m + implants) - 4b+ * HG Slaves, Akemon and 5%'s - 4b * Officer, deadspace and faction fittings - xx bils * Re-rigging 3x Trimark II + 20x FB's at Dominion - 1b+ * 9 months POS park + PLEX to keep account active while ship is useless - 4.5b (conservative numbers, it's probably alot more) Finally getting some kills and fun out of it, to be greeted by whining by random dude X who could've ran but stayed on field to be mowed down like a sheep - priceless Keep your tears coming please, finally this ship is paying off! - I'd tell you why but then I'll have to kill you. And to kill you I'd have to log in. And to log in I'd have to stop browsing these forums. Both you and me knows that'll never happen.
Ephemeron Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2010.04.28 19:00:00 - [203] Originally by: Misanth * Spending months trading and shooting npcs to buy a mothership hull - 16b * Dedicating over a years skilltraining with +5's plugged (the very least 12x300m + implants) - 4b+ * HG Slaves, Akemon and 5%'s - 4b * Officer, deadspace and faction fittings - xx bils * Re-rigging 3x Trimark II + 20x FB's at Dominion - 1b+ * 9 months POS park + PLEX to keep account active while ship is useless - 4.5b (conservative numbers, it's probably alot more) Finally getting some kills and fun out of it, to be greeted by whining by random dude X who could've ran but stayed on field to be mowed down like a sheep - priceless Keep your tears coming please, finally this ship is paying off! If you are trying to solo it, you are doing it wrong. This ship isn't for a single user. And any decent alliance can absorb these costs like they are nothing special within 1 month, if not 1 week.
Misanth Reaper Industries Cry Havoc.	Posted - 2010.04.28 19:05:00 - [204] Edited by: Misanth on 28/04/2010 19:11:27 Originally by: Ephemeron If you are trying to solo it, you are doing it wrong. This ship isn't for a single user. And any decent alliance can absorb these costs like they are nothing special within 1 month, if not 1 week. See the humour in my post. I don't drop my mothership alone. And it did sit in a POS for a long time being useless. Now it's not useless, but it's still vulnerable, so I move it around with a proper support fleet. If whoever wants to kill me, they'll take apropriate measures to counter my support. Just like all PvP, from station games and can flipping in 1.0, to megablobs in 0.0. Edit; Oh and to respond to your 'alliance/cost'-comment: I did work the isk for mine myself. I don't use my ship alone, no, but rhethoric question would be; what makes a ship 0.0 or megablob only? I am personally not interested in owning space, and I chose a corp/alliance that is of apropriate size for the stuff I want to do. So, chosing to live in highsec but fighting in low-/nullsec should ban me from owning a supercap? Then what would be the endgame ship for non-spaceholding 0.0 alliances? Officer fitted pirate battleships with alt support? (yes, that's a hint). Rhethoric question 2: what would happen to the political landscape and the ability of poor/young alliances to move to 0.0, if supercaps was only for spaceholding alliances, and the old, fat and rich would have hundreds of them? - I'd tell you why but then I'll have to kill you. And to kill you I'd have to log in. And to log in I'd have to stop browsing these forums. Both you and me knows that'll never happen.
Liang Nuren Parsec Flux	Posted - 2010.04.28 19:38:00 - [205] Originally by: Misanth Rhethoric question 2: what would happen to the political landscape and the ability of poor/young alliances to move to 0.0, if supercaps was only for spaceholding alliances, and the old, fat and rich would have hundreds of them? And what happens to those young/small alliances that want to try living out in lowsec - only to be greeted by dozen supercarrier hotdrops on phantasms and 30 man titan bridges every time they undock? -Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire
TheLordofAllandNothing Caldari NailorTech Industries RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2010.04.28 19:52:00 - [206] The answer is simple my friends. Remove low sec. Then everyone can enjoy the bubble and bomb(and dd) goodness. _______________________ Fix rockets in '09 =(
MADDOGzors Total Mayhem. Cry Havoc.	Posted - 2010.04.28 20:04:00 - [207] Originally by: Liang Nuren And what happens to those young/small alliances that want to try living out in lowsec - only to be greeted by dozen supercarrier hotdrops on phantasms and 30 man titan bridges every time they undock? -Liang News flash: Life isn't fair and neither is eve stfu already you stupid obama loving socialist ******. Go protest at veterans funerals, get off to the Hugo Chavez poster on the ceiling above your bed, and cry for equality without working for anything yourself like the rest of your kind. You make me sick.
Liang Nuren Parsec Flux	Posted - 2010.04.28 20:33:00 - [208] Originally by: MADDOGzors News flash: Life isn't fair and neither is eve stfu already you stupid obama loving socialist ****. Go protest at veterans funerals, get off to the Hugo Chavez poster on the ceiling above your bed, and cry for equality without working for anything yourself like the rest of your kind. You make me sick. NICE! Man, I totally got burned! Can I assume you're also a huge fan of this "Papers, please" business in Arizona? -Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum *** Extraordinaire
Ninetails o'Cat League of Super Evil	Posted - 2010.04.28 20:40:00 - [209] Originally by: MADDOGzors News flash: Life isn't fair and neither is eve stfu already you stupid obama loving socialist ******. Go protest at veterans funerals, get off to the Hugo Chavez poster on the ceiling above your bed, and cry for equality without working for anything yourself like the rest of your kind. You make me sick. Of course, by over-reacting massively to what someone says, you both prove them wrong and make yourself look intelligent.
Slade Trillgon Endless Possibilities Inc. Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2010.04.28 20:57:00 - [210] I do not believe there is a problem here. Originally by: MADDOGzors News flash: Life isn't fair and neither is eve stfu already you stupid obama loving socialist ******. Go protest at veterans funerals, get off to the Hugo Chavez poster on the ceiling above your bed, and cry for equality without working for anything yourself like the rest of your kind. You make me sick. I would report your post, but I would like to have this nice example of how not to post on forums, stay alive Slade :Signature Temporarily Disabled:



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