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Allen Deckard
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Posted - 2004.12.15 05:15:00 -
[61]
Well what I have read here is
1. Don't trust any char sales no matter who is selling.
2. Never deal with Big.
Thanks for the info guys.
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Allen Deckard
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Posted - 2004.12.15 05:15:00 -
[62]
Well what I have read here is
1. Don't trust any char sales no matter who is selling.
2. Never deal with Big.
Thanks for the info guys.
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xOm3gAx
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Posted - 2004.12.15 08:31:00 -
[63]
heh this really looks bad for you BIG and just think big even makes the actual eve-insider news... i see this changing in the future...
-----------------
*Decloaks and starts blasting your sig* Applesauce Biotch
~~~My Banner got nerfed~~~
But I still love the mods anyway
Succumb to your nightmares
Darkness shall embrace you |
xOm3gAx
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Posted - 2004.12.15 08:31:00 -
[64]
heh this really looks bad for you BIG and just think big even makes the actual eve-insider news... i see this changing in the future...
-----------------
*Decloaks and starts blasting your sig* Applesauce Biotch
~~~My Banner got nerfed~~~
But I still love the mods anyway
Succumb to your nightmares
Darkness shall embrace you |
Fret
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Posted - 2004.12.15 09:25:00 -
[65]
Edited by: Fret on 15/12/2004 09:28:59
Well almost a week and still no character....I am pretty sure that ive been had. I have spoken with Tornsoul and they are investigating the matter. Axee or Tion have yet to log on or respond to any of my attempts at communication.
All i wanted was to get a new character, not go through this horrible situation. The only reason i even took a look at this auction was because of the BIG name, I didnt even verify my bid until Tornsoul blessed the auction in this thread.
I have tremendous respect for the integrity BIG has shown in the past with its dealings, I hope it will continue here with this unfortunate situation. 750 million was most of my isk, took nearly a year and a half to save, im growing gray hairs just thinking about this...grrrr.
"A milliary operation has no standard form - it goes by way of deception."
Cao Cao, Sun Tzu's Art of War
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Fret
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Posted - 2004.12.15 09:25:00 -
[66]
Edited by: Fret on 15/12/2004 09:28:59
Well almost a week and still no character....I am pretty sure that ive been had. I have spoken with Tornsoul and they are investigating the matter. Axee or Tion have yet to log on or respond to any of my attempts at communication.
All i wanted was to get a new character, not go through this horrible situation. The only reason i even took a look at this auction was because of the BIG name, I didnt even verify my bid until Tornsoul blessed the auction in this thread.
I have tremendous respect for the integrity BIG has shown in the past with its dealings, I hope it will continue here with this unfortunate situation. 750 million was most of my isk, took nearly a year and a half to save, im growing gray hairs just thinking about this...grrrr.
"A milliary operation has no standard form - it goes by way of deception."
Cao Cao, Sun Tzu's Art of War
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Ground Beef
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Posted - 2004.12.15 09:27:00 -
[67]
 Originally by: Allen Deckard
1. Don't trust any char sales no matter who is selling.
This may very well be true. And it really is too bad that it has to be so. 
Originally by: Allen Deckard
2. Never deal with Big.
LOL, aparently some people are far too quick to judge.
Anyway, as stated previously it would be *insane* for a corp such as BIG to throw away its reputation on a measly 750 million isk. There is obviously something going on here that we just happen to be ignorant of. Hopefully soon those who DO know whats going on will reveal the truth to us. And when they do it, hopefully they do it with some real facts. (and a shred of proof even?)
My point is simply dont be so quick to jump to conclusions.
(there's a saying somewhere about "assuming" making you an A$$, it certainly looks true in this case...I mean no offense there however; simply aiding my point) 
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Ground Beef
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Posted - 2004.12.15 09:27:00 -
[68]
Originally by: Allen Deckard
1. Don't trust any char sales no matter who is selling.
This may very well be true. And it really is too bad that it has to be so.
Originally by: Allen Deckard
2. Never deal with Big.
LOL, aparently some people are far too quick to judge.
Anyway, as stated previously it would be *insane* for a corp such as BIG to throw away its reputation on a measly 750 million isk. There is obviously something going on here that we just happen to be ignorant of. Hopefully soon those who DO know whats going on will reveal the truth to us. And when they do it, hopefully they do it with some real facts. (and a shred of proof even?)
My point is simply dont be so quick to jump to conclusions.
(there's a saying somewhere about "assuming" making you an A$$, it certainly looks true in this case...I mean no offense there however; simply aiding my point)
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Kipkruide
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Posted - 2004.12.15 11:07:00 -
[69]
hmm will have to ask big about this, see if they kicked the member out at least
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Kipkruide
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Posted - 2004.12.15 11:07:00 -
[70]
hmm will have to ask big about this, see if they kicked the member out at least
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Wodgah
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Posted - 2004.12.15 13:30:00 -
[71]
I recently won an auction for a character for isk , we went through NAGA and more specifically freewheeling , took a day or 2 for everything to be sorted out but all went smoothly. I'd reccomend NAGA as middlemen to anyone wanting to do this kind of thing. BIG does have a good reputation but NAGA only has but a few members and a lot of people in eve know or have heard of freewheeling.
Good luck in retriving your character or isk
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Wodgah
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Posted - 2004.12.15 13:30:00 -
[72]
I recently won an auction for a character for isk , we went through NAGA and more specifically freewheeling , took a day or 2 for everything to be sorted out but all went smoothly. I'd reccomend NAGA as middlemen to anyone wanting to do this kind of thing. BIG does have a good reputation but NAGA only has but a few members and a lot of people in eve know or have heard of freewheeling.
Good luck in retriving your character or isk
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Allen Deckard
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Posted - 2004.12.15 14:34:00 -
[73]
"LOL, aparently some people are far too quick to judge. "
Quite possibly you may be correct maybe my judgment is in haste.
BUT
How long does something need to go on before a judgment is made?
Where is a comment from BIG here? What is their stance? Looks to me as if they have abandoned the situation.
If you become a 3rd party moderator in any situation (especially rl) you are responsible for that situation.
You ever hire a general contractor to work on your house? You realize that contractor rarely does the work on your house they get a third party? The contractor is the middle man. Who do you go to if the work is shabby? The contractor.
Sorry but without a comment from BIG my first statements hold. A week is a very long time for no comment.
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Allen Deckard
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Posted - 2004.12.15 14:34:00 -
[74]
"LOL, aparently some people are far too quick to judge. "
Quite possibly you may be correct maybe my judgment is in haste.
BUT
How long does something need to go on before a judgment is made?
Where is a comment from BIG here? What is their stance? Looks to me as if they have abandoned the situation.
If you become a 3rd party moderator in any situation (especially rl) you are responsible for that situation.
You ever hire a general contractor to work on your house? You realize that contractor rarely does the work on your house they get a third party? The contractor is the middle man. Who do you go to if the work is shabby? The contractor.
Sorry but without a comment from BIG my first statements hold. A week is a very long time for no comment.
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Fret
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Posted - 2004.12.15 15:22:00 -
[75]
Edited by: Fret on 15/12/2004 15:25:07
UPDATE ON BIG "INVESTIGATION":
I spoke with TornSoul again today, I must admit that after all of the cooperation I have shown I am being kept in the dark about the status of thier investigation.
I have allowed TornSoul herself log into my account two separate times to investigate the isk transfer for the character and any other info that may be pertanant to thier investigation. I have emailed TornSoul all of the chat logs containing all conversations and even the actual deal taking place in the BIG channel. I have been as forthcoming with BIG as possible about this and I feel as if im being treated as the scammer in all of this.
Evidently TornSoul has spoken with Tion since this deal.... My first question to TornSoul was that if she spoke with him...where is my 750 million isk? Her responce was that she is still gathering the facts. I understand that to a point...but what more does one need to see that I have been robed. There is no 12.9 million sp character, TornSoul knows exactly what took place in the transaction...she has seen my financial records in my account, she has seen the chat logs.
I still give BIG the bennefit of the doubt in all of this for now, that is until the final report is released my BIG in the forums tonight.
Personaly it seems to me as if BIG is more worried about preserving thier reputation in all of this than helping the true victim in all of this, though 750 million may not be much to the BIG empire, it sure is to me. I challenge all who care to please keep an eye on the outcome to all of this... Let us all see how big BIG really is.
"A milliary operation has no standard form - it goes by way of deception."
Cao Cao, Sun Tzu's Art of War
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Fret
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Posted - 2004.12.15 15:22:00 -
[76]
Edited by: Fret on 15/12/2004 15:25:07
UPDATE ON BIG "INVESTIGATION":
I spoke with TornSoul again today, I must admit that after all of the cooperation I have shown I am being kept in the dark about the status of thier investigation.
I have allowed TornSoul herself log into my account two separate times to investigate the isk transfer for the character and any other info that may be pertanant to thier investigation. I have emailed TornSoul all of the chat logs containing all conversations and even the actual deal taking place in the BIG channel. I have been as forthcoming with BIG as possible about this and I feel as if im being treated as the scammer in all of this.
Evidently TornSoul has spoken with Tion since this deal.... My first question to TornSoul was that if she spoke with him...where is my 750 million isk? Her responce was that she is still gathering the facts. I understand that to a point...but what more does one need to see that I have been robed. There is no 12.9 million sp character, TornSoul knows exactly what took place in the transaction...she has seen my financial records in my account, she has seen the chat logs.
I still give BIG the bennefit of the doubt in all of this for now, that is until the final report is released my BIG in the forums tonight.
Personaly it seems to me as if BIG is more worried about preserving thier reputation in all of this than helping the true victim in all of this, though 750 million may not be much to the BIG empire, it sure is to me. I challenge all who care to please keep an eye on the outcome to all of this... Let us all see how big BIG really is.
"A milliary operation has no standard form - it goes by way of deception."
Cao Cao, Sun Tzu's Art of War
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Pandora Panda
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Posted - 2004.12.15 16:30:00 -
[77]
Originally by: Fret
I have allowed TornSoul herself log into my account two separate times to investigate the isk transfer for the character and any other info that may be pertanant to thier investigation.
Change your password. Immeditely.
--------------------------------------------
CONCORD: Kneecapping Pilots for Misdemeanors Since 2003 |
Pandora Panda
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Posted - 2004.12.15 16:30:00 -
[78]
Originally by: Fret
I have allowed TornSoul herself log into my account two separate times to investigate the isk transfer for the character and any other info that may be pertanant to thier investigation.
Change your password. Immeditely.
--------------------------------------------
CONCORD: Kneecapping Pilots for Misdemeanors Since 2003 |
XeroBeagle
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Posted - 2004.12.15 16:41:00 -
[79]
Edited by: XeroBeagle on 15/12/2004 16:41:19
seems wierd how he always blanked out the name of the Character, Gd luck to getting you isk back tho
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XeroBeagle
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Posted - 2004.12.15 16:41:00 -
[80]
Edited by: XeroBeagle on 15/12/2004 16:41:19
seems wierd how he always blanked out the name of the Character, Gd luck to getting you isk back tho
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ddss
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Posted - 2004.12.15 18:09:00 -
[81]
BIG, the scammer corp....nice work guys, u really did all that work (getting that reputation) for louzy 750m ?
Gl on your next "big" lottery, I guess it wount be that big.
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ddss
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Posted - 2004.12.15 18:09:00 -
[82]
BIG, the scammer corp....nice work guys, u really did all that work (getting that reputation) for louzy 750m ?
Gl on your next "big" lottery, I guess it wount be that big.
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Setrak
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Posted - 2004.12.15 18:39:00 -
[83]
LMAO, now thats an UBER scam, lets hear it for BIG, the BIG SCAMMERS. LMAO
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Setrak
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Posted - 2004.12.15 18:39:00 -
[84]
LMAO, now thats an UBER scam, lets hear it for BIG, the BIG SCAMMERS. LMAO
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psychonaut
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Posted - 2004.12.15 18:43:00 -
[85]
Should I mention the BIG lottery mess a while back?
oops just did doh!
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psychonaut
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Posted - 2004.12.15 18:43:00 -
[86]
Should I mention the BIG lottery mess a while back?
oops just did doh!
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Icomeinpeace
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Posted - 2004.12.15 19:36:00 -
[87]
Hmmm wierd.
Just reading this thread and it seems to me that Axee and Tion type VERY SIMILAR.
Note the bad English.The same person maybe?
Either way scamming sucks and if this person scams this forward I would not doubt they are doing many other dubious things.
CCP should definately protect their honest customers by investigating these matters...
It's bs.
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Icomeinpeace
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Posted - 2004.12.15 19:36:00 -
[88]
Hmmm wierd.
Just reading this thread and it seems to me that Axee and Tion type VERY SIMILAR.
Note the bad English.The same person maybe?
Either way scamming sucks and if this person scams this forward I would not doubt they are doing many other dubious things.
CCP should definately protect their honest customers by investigating these matters...
It's bs.
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TornSoul
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Posted - 2004.12.15 19:43:00 -
[89]
Edited by: TornSoul on 15/12/2004 19:42:59
Lean back - Break out the popcorns, this is going to be one long read, but I guarantee it will be entertaining.
As posted earlier in this thread BIG as a corp do not want to have anything to do with char transfers for various reasons (Someone else posted that NAGA seems very keen on it - So please, *do* contact *them* instead of BIG if that rocks their boat)
Prior to this incident we did not have a 'rule' in BIG about this as such - We do now however.
Quote:
Tion > Well He's a friend of my friend. (RL)
Tion > Other wise I'd never have agreed to this
Tion > I got into a LOT of trouble
Tion > for agreeing to do it in the first place.
(We did give Tion a bit of a hard time I'm afraid - Raised fingers, and lessons lectured. You get the picture)
Unfortunatly Tion had already promised his friend (of a friend) that he would do him a favor and act as a neutral 3rd party to help him transfer his char. Relying on the good name and rep of BIG to instill confidence in the buyer that he would not get scammed.
In BIG we are BIG on sticking to our word - Always.
So I allowed Tion to go ahead with the deal, so he could make good on his word to his friend (of a friend)
----
The day of the transfer
All the actors are in place
Tion : Neutral 3rd party
Fret : The buyer
Axee : The seller
Location:
The ingame BIG channel.
Scene:
Character transfer
All the actors performs their roles - Except, theres a slight hitch.
Theres apparently a 4th player, who hasnt read the script : CCP
Quote:
Axee > Alright, sent. it says. may take up to 24 hours.
Whats this! A delay!!
That was not in the script...
Quote:
Fret > i have transfered characters many times....i have never recieved a wait, it is usualy instant
The actors have to improvise
Quote:
Tion > I'll hold the isk for 24 Hours would that be ok?
Fret > sure
The waiting game begins
Patience grows thin
Quote:
Posted - 2004.12.12 13:11:00
After paying the 750 million isk I still have not recieved the character. Axee told me that upon the transfer he was notified there would be a 24 hour wait.... well 38 hours latter and 2 server re-boots latter I am a bit worried.
But nerves are still in order
Quote:
Posted - 2004.12.12 13:11:00
Being that this auction was sanctioned by a BIG member, and verified by the BIG CEO herself, i rest assured that this will all fall into place.
<snip>
I am grateful that at least this time BIG has played the middle man in my transaction. With millions of isk at stake here the only comfort I have is that BIG is the medium.
The waiting games continues
Still no news....
Quote:
Posted - 2004.12.13 12:59:00
I appeal to Axee and Tion to reply to this thread, it seems after the isk was transfered all has gone quiet.
Time to break out the BIG guns
Quote:
Posted - 2004.12.13 12:59:00
I have mailed TornSoul the CEO of BIG and appealed for her help and support in the matter.
Nerves still in order!
Quote:
Posted - 2004.12.13 12:59:00
I have all confidence that BIG will make this right.
And theres even some re-assuring words from the audience
Quote:
Posted - 2004.12.15 02:41:00
I find it hard to believe that a corporation as large as BIG (no pun intended) would risk their reputation on a measly 750 mil. I know 750 mil is a LOT to individual players, but to a large corporation, it's peanuts. BIG would have to be insane not to pay Fret back the isk if this was indeed an inside scam where a BIG member (ex-BIG member after this I would assume) pulled the wool over their eyes.
And some not so re-assuring ones
Quote:
Posted - 2004.12.15 05:15:00 - Quote
Well what I have read here is
1. Don't trust any char sales no matter who is selling.
2. Never deal with Big.
Thanks for the info guys.
The waiting game starts to take it's toll - And even distorts time
Quote:
Posted - 2004.12.15 09:25:00
Well almost a week and still no character....I am pretty sure that ive been had.
(Editors note : It's been 4 days)
Even the audience now demands that the play comes to and end!
TornSoul
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Posted - 2004.12.15 19:43:00 -
[90]
Edited by: TornSoul on 15/12/2004 19:49:05
Interlude
As with all plays, what goes on on the stage, is but a fraction of all the work that truly goes on.
Back stage is often (if not more) as frantic as out in the spotlight.
BIG has been quiet for several days - Are they doing nothing? Have they 'left the building'?
No - BIG has been busy back stage, trying to get the play back on course (remember that pesky improvisation at the beginning)
Far far too busy to also take center stage in the spotlight - The supporting characters are doing the job so wonderfully anyhow.
So what *has* BIG been doing?
BIG has been busy collecting info, conducting interviews, reviewing the play as performed so far, working it all - To try and get the script to match with what has been performed on the stage.
----------------------------------------
The end game - The investigation
Firstly I would like to thank Fret for beeing *most* forthcomming in the investigation of this whole thing.
It would have been impossible to come to the bottom of this without her gracious help (and yes we did come to the bottom of it).
As I personally have not been on centerstage, trying to piece together what really happened has only been possible through the recordings of the events as they took place - Kindly forwarded to me by Fret.
Let's play back some of these events.
Recording #1
Quote:
---------------------------------------------------------------
Channel ID: 2100001042
Channel Name: big
Listener: Fret
Session started: 2004.12.11 03:54:05
---------------------------------------------------------------
<snip>
Fret > ok i will transfer the isk to you...have u already verified the character?
Tion > yup
Fret > sent
Tion > ok Axee send the char :)
Axee > Alright, can you tell me the account anme again? thanks.
Fret > <accountname removed>
Axee > Alright, sent. it says. may take up to 24 hours.
Fret > hmmm i wonder why
Axee > i dunno its not me working it. i gtg now sorry. hopefully it will not take 24 hours.
Fret > lol
Tion > I'll hold the isk for 24 Hours would that be ok?
Fret > sure
Fret > ill log and check
Tion > ok thanks
---------------------------------------------------------------
Channel ID: 2100001042
Channel Name: big
Listener: Fret
Session started: 2004.12.11 04:08:35
---------------------------------------------------------------
Tion > sorry crashed
Tion > Just eve mail me if it doesn't come I'll send your ISK back. I'm working nights right now and Someimes I'm to tired to get on.
Fret > no i didnt recieve it yet
Fret > i dont like the way he loged either
Fret > thats not good business
Fret > even if he is genuine it still looks bad
Tion > yes it does.
Tion > We'll wait and see
Fret > indeed
Fret > do u know him?
Tion > Well He's a friend of my friend. (RL)
Tion > Other wise I'd never have agreed to this
Tion > I got into a LOT of trouble
Tion > for agreeing to do it in the first place.
Fret > well i trust you only because u are a member of BIG, i hope your friend would not try to cheat me
Tion > I hope so too Or I'm going to get one hell of a spanking from TornSoul
Fret > well he is your rl friend so lets hope not
Fret > if i dont have the character by next server reboot, ill be contacting tornsoul
Tion > eve mail me and I'll send you your ISK back :)
Fret > i have transfered characters many times....i have never recieved a wait, it is usualy instant
Tion > I do not know because I've never done it that is starnge for sure
Fret > but hopefuly i get the char...after all thts what i want the most
Fret > ty for your help sir, i have to go to lunch
Fret > ill be in touch
Tion > yes it's a nice char
Tion > ok enjoy your lunch
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