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Dave stark
Bombardier Inc
239
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 16:09:00 -
[91] - Quote
Sentamon wrote:Is a rig being added to help collect precious ganker tears?
space is cold, so do the new ice harvester rigs count? Reading my posts is like panning for gold; most it will be useless, but occasionally you'll find a nugget of gold. |

Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
4056
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 16:11:00 -
[92] - Quote
Richard Desturned wrote:why would you subscribe to a game just to mine imaginary minerals Minecraft?
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Lin-Young Borovskova
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
539
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 16:17:00 -
[93] - Quote
Ginseng Jita wrote:Might as well hand them golden tickets because the new barges are exactly the kind of ships AFK miners and botters will appreciate. My question is...
Why are you promoting AFK mining and botting CCP?
I don't know where's the problem. People afk mining at low yeld while doing some work are not any longer easy prey, that's not a problem for you if you just put the effort to gank them and if it's not worthy just move on and gank something else.
Bots? -it's CCP job to clean them up and decide who is or who isn't, not some frustrated kids because they can't gank mining barges with a single 3M destroyer....do what you should witch means report and play the game, with new aggression stuff you guys can play space GI's and gank as much as you want but maybe, I really mean maybe, those are a little bit harder to kill with 3M destroyers.
Seriously, what are you complaining about? brb |

Fuujin
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
175
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 16:21:00 -
[94] - Quote
On the one hand, I'm against these changes since hisec mining with these ridiculous tanks now redefines "risk-free activity," which to me is antithetical to the design of eve (a risk-filled universe).
Now the balm to this is that with the return of the mining bot (they never really left) to full strength the cost of low ends will plummet. Enjoy your 10-15M per hour grinding existence. |

Dave stark
Bombardier Inc
239
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 16:25:00 -
[95] - Quote
Fuujin wrote:On the one hand, I'm against these changes since hisec mining with these ridiculous tanks now redefines "risk-free activity," which to me is antithetical to the design of eve (a risk-filled universe).
Now the balm to this is that with the return of the mining bot (they never really left) to full strength the cost of low ends will plummet. Enjoy your 10-15M per hour grinding existence.
it's not risk free, we can still get suicide ganks. it just won't happen as much as the goons want it to unless you offer bigger rewards to make it worth people's time. we're getting more ehp not an undestroyable ship. we've only been made safer because gankers are going to be lazier.
let's face it goons stopped paying out bounties on exhumers people would stop bothering to gank them as much and prices would go down again even without the new mining barge changes. Reading my posts is like panning for gold; most it will be useless, but occasionally you'll find a nugget of gold. |

Lin-Young Borovskova
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
539
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 16:39:00 -
[96] - Quote
Fuujin wrote:On the one hand, I'm against these changes since hisec mining with these ridiculous tanks now redefines "risk-free activity," which to me is antithetical to the design of eve (a risk-filled universe).
Now the balm to this is that with the return of the mining bot (they never really left) to full strength the cost of low ends will plummet. Enjoy your 10-15M per hour grinding existence.
Once again I don't see where's the problem.
Do you guys make crapthreads about multiboxing making bot activity the best way to go and make isk? -no
Are those mining barges ungankable? -no Just fit better ships and go gank them, if it's boring or unprofitable just move along and do something else, why not afk mining? brb |

Fuujin
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
175
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 16:43:00 -
[97] - Quote
Dave stark wrote:Fuujin wrote:On the one hand, I'm against these changes since hisec mining with these ridiculous tanks now redefines "risk-free activity," which to me is antithetical to the design of eve (a risk-filled universe).
Now the balm to this is that with the return of the mining bot (they never really left) to full strength the cost of low ends will plummet. Enjoy your 10-15M per hour grinding existence. it's not risk free, we can still get suicide ganks. it just won't happen as much as the goons want it to unless you offer bigger rewards to make it worth people's time. we're getting more ehp not an undestroyable ship. we've only been made safer because gankers are going to be lazier. let's face it goons stopped paying out bounties on exhumers people would stop bothering to gank them as much and prices would go down again even without the new mining barge changes.
You don't have to be undestroyable, you just have to be tough enough to last until the invincible NPC comes and pops your attacker.
Barges are getting over 5x their current level of EHP. To suicide one now would require an uninsurable tier3 BC (or multiples), which is vastly unprofitable economically. If you are in an NPC corp (or corp-hop after a wardec) you're utterly safe from being ganked unless you're fitting pricey modules.
So, yeah. Untouchable fleets of bots will blot out the belts. Guess I'll just have to take solace in the cheap ships I'll be able to buy once lowends crack the floor.
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Dave stark
Bombardier Inc
239
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 16:46:00 -
[98] - Quote
Fuujin wrote:Dave stark wrote:Fuujin wrote:On the one hand, I'm against these changes since hisec mining with these ridiculous tanks now redefines "risk-free activity," which to me is antithetical to the design of eve (a risk-filled universe).
Now the balm to this is that with the return of the mining bot (they never really left) to full strength the cost of low ends will plummet. Enjoy your 10-15M per hour grinding existence. it's not risk free, we can still get suicide ganks. it just won't happen as much as the goons want it to unless you offer bigger rewards to make it worth people's time. we're getting more ehp not an undestroyable ship. we've only been made safer because gankers are going to be lazier. let's face it goons stopped paying out bounties on exhumers people would stop bothering to gank them as much and prices would go down again even without the new mining barge changes. You don't have to be undestroyable, you just have to be tough enough to last until the invincible NPC comes and pops your attacker. Barges are getting over 5x their current level of EHP. To suicide one now would require an uninsurable tier3 BC (or multiples), which is vastly unprofitable economically. If you are in an NPC corp (or corp-hop after a wardec) you're utterly safe from being ganked unless you're fitting pricey modules. So, yeah. Untouchable fleets of bots will blot out the belts. Guess I'll just have to take solace in the cheap ships I'll be able to buy once lowends crack the floor.
i'm sure you can find a ship that can gank the new hulk before concord arrives, i'll wager a naga/nado/whatever will suffice. those that you can't gank as easily will have lower yield anyway; like a currently tanked hulk.
between now and then nothing will change except that you need to be less lazy about ganking hulks. really no big changes from now.
Reading my posts is like panning for gold; most it will be useless, but occasionally you'll find a nugget of gold. |

Fuujin
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
175
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 16:52:00 -
[99] - Quote
Dave stark wrote:
i'm sure you can find a ship that can gank the new hulk before concord arrives, i'll wager a naga/nado/whatever will suffice. those that you can't gank as easily will have lower yield anyway; like a currently tanked hulk.
between now and then nothing will change except that you need to be less lazy about ganking hulks. really no big changes from now.
The difference is cost. A fit tier3 will run about 65M, uninsurable, and you'll lose some/all of the fitting. (assuming lowend price collapse).
Right now, a tier3 can crack most exhumer tanks. Most. With the buffs, the same tank will likely result in multiple ships being required. Now you need two characters with good skills and 130M+ in ships to kill a single exhumer.
Barge Ganking won't go away, but it'll become akin to unicorn sightings. |

Werst Dendenahzees
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
82
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 16:55:00 -
[100] - Quote
You will need like three T2 talos to kill one of the new hulks in a 0.7 system. Skiffs mining ice in a 0.9 system are basically free money forever, unless someone assembles a 20 tornado team to kill them, which is hilarious unprofitable. |
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Werst Dendenahzees
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
82
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 16:58:00 -
[101] - Quote
A pr0 tanked hulk RIGHT NOW can reach 30-40k EHP even without dumb faction mods. After the buff, it's easily double that. The other ships are going to be even better. I am fitting a battle skiff as we speak. |

Lin-Young Borovskova
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
539
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 17:02:00 -
[102] - Quote
Werst Dendenahzees wrote:A pr0 tanked hulk RIGHT NOW can reach 30-40k EHP even without dumb faction mods. After the buff, it's easily double that. The other ships are going to be even better. I am fitting a battle skiff as we speak.
So there's no problem but a well deserved balance. If you feel someone is botting you can use report button or just decide to gank them witch will FINALLY require some effort and not the pathetic mindless mongoloid activity that is atm. brb |

Werst Dendenahzees
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
82
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 17:08:00 -
[103] - Quote
It always required efforts, now it's going to cost two billion isk in t3 battlecruisers to gank a tanked mining ship in a 0.9 system. Low ends are going to plummet and you'll be back to mining for 10 million ISK an hour. I'd rather have 30m/h veldspar and risk being ganked than 10m/h while safe forever. |

Fuujin
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
175
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 17:08:00 -
[104] - Quote
Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:Werst Dendenahzees wrote:A pr0 tanked hulk RIGHT NOW can reach 30-40k EHP even without dumb faction mods. After the buff, it's easily double that. The other ships are going to be even better. I am fitting a battle skiff as we speak. So there's no problem but a well deserved balance. If you feel someone is botting you can use report button or just decide to gank them witch will FINALLY require some effort and not the pathetic mindless mongoloid activity that is atm.
You fail to see motivations. Destroying mindless bots is fun and profitable now. Post-ganknerf, it will be too much of a hassle.
Reporting them would be :effort: and actually counter to our best interests--indeed, letting them run is quite good for us! Bots reduce the price of minerals and ships. They hurt miners, but not PVPers; so it's actually all up to you to report them. We'll just shake our heads and move on to find some nice fool hauling his life around in a badger. |

Corina Jarr
Spazzoid Enterprises Purpose Built
1112
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 17:11:00 -
[105] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:Dave stark wrote:oh look; another person who has never mined in their life or is just plain clueless about how mining works.
37km3 ore bay means nothing when asteroids only contain about 5km3 of ore. -.- Ice Roids have pop quick, do they? You're right, the Mack's not gonna be particularly AFK when mining Ore in HS (due to the small roids you mentioned), but it's gonna be able to work for like an hour totally hands off when chewing on Ice. The problem with this is not the mining ships. its mining Ice.
The most cruel punishment on the face of this Earth is actively mining ice. It is the most boring activity known to man. There is no way to do it without being somewhat afk, or you go insane.
CCP fix ice mining... make it less mind numbing.
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Suqq Madiq
Amarr Empire
154
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 17:13:00 -
[106] - Quote
The Goon tears in this thread are ridiculous. And I'm only on Page 2. Can Richard or somebody else who is crying all over this thread please explain why Goons are so mad about these mining changes? |

Fuujin
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
175
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 17:13:00 -
[107] - Quote
Corina Jarr wrote:CCP fix ice mining... make it less mind numbing. 
And this is why I pity human hisec miners. Their entire existence is grinding paltry sums and begging CCP for constant nerfs and buffs, which are never enough. |

Bunnie Hop
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
297
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 17:24:00 -
[108] - Quote
Suqq Madiq wrote:The Goon tears in this thread are ridiculous. And I'm only on Page 2. Can Richard or somebody else who is crying all over this thread please explain why Goons are so mad about these mining changes?
Because it may infringe upon their monopolies. They want to control all the tech and minerals, aside from the huge profits they make from selling new barges to replace the ones they sponser to be destroyed, and since it may become more difficult they turn to whining, which is ironic considering all of fingers they point towards others they accuse of whining. |

Werst Dendenahzees
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
82
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 17:24:00 -
[109] - Quote
Suqq Madiq wrote:The Goon tears in this thread are ridiculous. And I'm only on Page 2. Can Richard or somebody else who is crying all over this thread please explain why Goons are so mad about these mining changes?
Because CCP is undermining all of our attemps at making highsec mining profitable for the carebears and the carebears are cheering.
Stockholm syndrome. |

Suqq Madiq
Amarr Empire
156
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 17:24:00 -
[110] - Quote
Fuujin wrote:Corina Jarr wrote:CCP fix ice mining... make it less mind numbing.  And this is why I pity human hisec miners. Their entire existence is grinding paltry sums and begging CCP for constant nerfs and buffs, which are never enough.
And this is why I pity human nullsec whiners. Their entire existence is doing what they're told, when they're told to do it. Rolling their face on their F1 key whenever they are told to in massive TiDi lagfests. |
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Lin-Young Borovskova
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
539
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 17:26:00 -
[111] - Quote
Fuujin wrote:Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:Werst Dendenahzees wrote:A pr0 tanked hulk RIGHT NOW can reach 30-40k EHP even without dumb faction mods. After the buff, it's easily double that. The other ships are going to be even better. I am fitting a battle skiff as we speak. So there's no problem but a well deserved balance. If you feel someone is botting you can use report button or just decide to gank them witch will FINALLY require some effort and not the pathetic mindless mongoloid activity that is atm. You fail to see motivations. Destroying mindless bots is fun and profitable now. Post-gank, it will be too much of a hassle. Reporting them would be :effort: and actually counter to our best interests--indeed, letting them run is quite good for us! Bots reduce the price of minerals and ships. They hurt miners, but not PVPers; so it's actually all up to you to report them. We'll just shake our heads and move on to find some nice fool hauling his life around in a badger.
Thing is that "bot" argument is a very bad argument, I'd like CCP to actually post how many bots are gone after a couple ganks in witch case I'll applause your gaming, and how many players just left because they're tired of this mindless mongoloid activity harassing their gaming time to the point nothing they do is profitable or enjoyable, like it or not some people might just like to mine and there's nothing wrong with this, what's wrong is people assuming every one mining is a bot and should just be "holly punished for this internet space injury"...
I guess you can live with the fact you need to put some effort to gank mining barges, on the other hand CCP has nothing to win loosing customers because of some mindless gameplay and bad design (mining) Again, it's not players job to play space Gi's or whatever ridiculous laddie tights avenger, report and let them do their job, because it's their job not yours. I don't like bots, I hate what that crap stuff does to the game in general but I just can't think about it seriously without having an IRL laugh if I start putting aside several points this game promotes openly: multiboxing, alts, massive destruction (requiring massive base materials)
It's just the easy way out to assume new mining barges = bots just to cry some oceans because :effort: now is needed.
PS: I don't mine any more, there are more/less interesting activities that make me a lot more isk/h for the time I can afford to play. brb |

Richard Desturned
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1421
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 17:26:00 -
[112] - Quote
Suqq Madiq wrote:Fuujin wrote:Corina Jarr wrote:CCP fix ice mining... make it less mind numbing.  And this is why I pity human hisec miners. Their entire existence is grinding paltry sums and begging CCP for constant nerfs and buffs, which are never enough. And this is why I pity human nullsec whiners. Their entire existence is doing what they're told, when they're told to do it. Rolling their face on their F1 key whenever they are told to in massive TiDi lagfests.
as opposed to being a peasant chiseling away at rocks a rogue goon |

Bunnie Hop
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
297
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 17:29:00 -
[113] - Quote
Werst Dendenahzees wrote:Suqq Madiq wrote:The Goon tears in this thread are ridiculous. And I'm only on Page 2. Can Richard or somebody else who is crying all over this thread please explain why Goons are so mad about these mining changes? Because CCP is undermining all of our attemps at making highsec mining profitable for the carebears and the carebears are cheering. Stockholm syndrome.
LOL Yes, the goons care about you, kumbaya! |

Suqq Madiq
Amarr Empire
156
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 17:30:00 -
[114] - Quote
Werst Dendenahzees wrote: CCP is undermining all of our attemps at making highsec mining profitable
I'm not sure which part of this is full of more dumb. That you would suggest this as a possibility, or that you actually buy this little turd of propaganda. Goons do what is best for Goons. Unless you're somehow suggesting that Highsec miners are actually Goon alts and your jihad on Exhumers wasn't fueled by your Tech greed, but by your desire to make mining more profitable and afkable for your Highsec mining alts... In which case... MIND BLOWN!
|

Richard Desturned
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1421
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 17:30:00 -
[115] - Quote
Suqq Madiq wrote:The Goon tears in this thread are ridiculous. And I'm only on Page 2. Can Richard or somebody else who is crying all over this thread please explain why Goons are so mad about these mining changes?
it's going to be more hilarious watching you cry out loud over veldspar mining being down to 5m isk/hr as opposed to being literally more profitable than crokite, thanks to us paying dudes to gank hulks
i mean this change literally benefits me because i have isk invested in high-ends which will actually be used in manufacturing when lowends drop back down, but i dislike the idea of risk-free hisec mining a rogue goon |

Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
121
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 17:31:00 -
[116] - Quote
Fuujin wrote:On the one hand, I'm against these changes since hisec mining with these ridiculous tanks now redefines "risk-free activity," which to me is antithetical to the design of eve (a risk-filled universe).
Now the balm to this is that with the return of the mining bot (they never really left) to full strength the cost of low ends will plummet. Enjoy your 10-15M per hour grinding existence.
Risk vs. reward.
Low risk = low reward. |

Suqq Madiq
Amarr Empire
156
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 17:32:00 -
[117] - Quote
Richard Desturned wrote:Suqq Madiq wrote:Fuujin wrote:
And this is why I pity human hisec miners. Their entire existence is grinding paltry sums and begging CCP for constant nerfs and buffs, which are never enough.
And this is why I pity human nullsec whiners. Their entire existence is doing what they're told, when they're told to do it. Rolling their face on their F1 key whenever they are told to in massive TiDi lagfests. as opposed to being a peasant chiseling away at rocks
Suggesting that the pixels you roll your face on your keyboard to eliminate are more important than the pixels somebody else rolls their face on their keyboard to eliminate.
Protip: They're not. |

Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
239
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 17:34:00 -
[118] - Quote
Werst Dendenahzees wrote:It always required efforts, now it's going to cost two billion isk in t3 battlecruisers to gank a tanked mining ship in a 0.9 system. Low ends are going to plummet and you'll be back to mining for 10 million ISK an hour. I'd rather have 30m/h veldspar and risk being ganked than 10m/h while safe forever.
Please provide numbers for your claims, or you are a liar like the rest of the propaganda team. |

Werst Dendenahzees
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
82
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 17:34:00 -
[119] - Quote
Suqq Madiq wrote:Werst Dendenahzees wrote: CCP is undermining all of our attemps at making highsec mining profitable I'm not sure which part of this is full of more dumb. That you would suggest this as a possibility, or that you actually buy this little turd of propaganda. Goons do what is best for Goons. Unless you're somehow suggesting that Highsec miners are actually Goon alts and your jihad on Exhumers wasn't fueled by your Tech greed, but by your desire to make mining more profitable and afkable for your Highsec mining alts... In which case... MIND BLOWN!
Well how do you explain the fact that mining veldspar and scordite in highsec is currently comparable to mining high end crokite in nullsec in isk/h. Just pick a nice spot in Solitude and JF your minerals to Jita. It's all going to drop to 10m and hour once ganking is no longer a thing.
The lowends rose because hulkageddon culled the herd at a critical time. The smart miners who evade ganks are getting rich. |

Suqq Madiq
Amarr Empire
156
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 17:36:00 -
[120] - Quote
Richard Desturned wrote:i mean this change literally benefits me because i have isk invested in high-ends which will actually be used in manufacturing when lowends drop back down, but i dislike the idea of risk-free hisec mining
If this change really benefited you as much as you claim, you wouldn't be depositing vast quantities of your tears all over every thread involving Barge and Exhumer buffs. And nobody actually believes mining is risk-free. Every ship in the game is gankable if you use the right tools and have enough friends to pull it off. The upcoming changes do nothing to alter that, except maybe forcing people to make more friends. Which is just madness in an MMO.  |
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