To be fair, the much-feared Gǣmax DPSGǥ Cat does indeed set you back roughly 15M at Jita pricesGǪ

GǪbut if you can settle for a little less damage, the price sure drops veeery quickly.

Yes, that is it's role, more yield. That is it's stated purpose, more yield. What's the problem, here? You admitted yourself it has more yield, Hulk working as intended.

Mining Ice as I post this thread now. I check local like I am in null, and watch every warp in like its a combat op gone wrong.
But, hey I am paranoid

Ice is easy mining, no work involved and can be done afk. I am not mining for any profit right now myself, got a tower to feed in the near future

The thing i don't see being talking about is, belt respawn times either need to be upped or something done about the rocks.
I check three systems in Genesis, belts stripped clean. And some of those belts were massive pre-patch.

There's one main reason for this. 35k m3 ore hold, not far below that of an ORCA. Does anyone else think that the devs didn't think this through too well? I can't see many miners not taking a Mackinkaw over a Hulk even with Orca support, because 35k m3 ore hold allows them to do other things while your Mackinkaw pulls in what is basically an afk income for at least half an hour at a time.

Since you don't seem to understand - the mackinaw is a solo ship. As such the only reasonable fit is to go full tank since you'll be a prime target for gankers. The hulk's role is a fleet ship and as such it should go full yield since it has the protection of the fleet. When you compare the yield of the two in their respective optimal situations the difference in yield is huge.

"Protection of the fleet"?

I'm curious to know what this protection of the fleet is ....

I'm guessing:
Scouts on the gates (1+ systems out)
People ATK
Station-less system
Possibly lowsec
Fleet boosts for shields

Go to lowsec, those belts are rich in rocks.

Mackinkaw: 287m sell/263m buy
Hulk: 224m sell/170m buy
Skiff: 190m sell/164m buy

I thought the intention of the barge buff was to remove one barge being best. That being the Hulk. The Mackinkaw has taken the Hulks old roll as king of the barges, the yield is almost as good as the Hulk, it has better tank, and it has a massive ore hold which is the primary thing that's making it so overpowered. Able to mine on ice roids for over half an hour as a semi afk income, it can't be beaten, it has taken the role of the Hulk as the primary choice of barge. Failing that, the retriever, which is almost as good.

There's one main reason for this. 35k m3 ore hold, not far below that of an ORCA. Does anyone else think that the devs didn't think this through too well? I can't see many miners not taking a Mackinkaw over a Hulk even with Orca support, because 35k m3 ore hold allows them to do other things while your Mackinkaw pulls in what is basically an afk income for at least half an hour at a time.

It's already apparent what effect this is having on the ice market. If the trend continues, soon the only people mining ice will be bots and afk alts.

Someone pointed out below that the Mackinkaw hauls ore better than an actual hauler does now. It takes the primary role of a hauler and does it better. You may aswell have just taken the Iteron MK5/Occator and given it mining lasers and hulk like yield. That's what we have now, a super industrial all in one miner and hauler

All it did was make the Mack the choice of high sec solo miners. Hulks still mine more, they just need the support of a corp.

These changes made sure every type of miner had a ship that catered to their mining style of choice, that's all.

You look around the highsec belts and see the extinction of the hulk in favor of the mackinaw. Check the market and note the price changes, too.

Didn't I just say it's now the ship of choice for high-sec solo miners...


Well, "The Market" is high sec and....of course that's going to happen, people want to make money off these changes.

Out in 0.0 I'm sure the Hulk will live on, where it has the support of raquals etc.

Even in High sec, with the support of a orca, hulk is still preferable for yield.

650 DPS is only with all skills at V, void and heat on an all-neutron catalyst, which you can't fit a scram+web on with 3 magstabs. It's more reasonable to assume 460 dps with heat and named blasters with faction ammo or 580 dps on a 5 neutron/2 ion catalyst with CPU rigs.

You can get 47k EHP against blasters if you brick it and keep hardeners preheated FYI

Mackinkaw: 287m sell/263m buy
Hulk: 224m sell/170m buy
Skiff: 190m sell/164m buy

I thought the intention of the barge buff was to remove one barge being best. That being the Hulk. The Mackinkaw has taken the Hulks old roll as king of the barges, the yield is almost as good as the Hulk, it has better tank, and it has a massive ore hold which is the primary thing that's making it so overpowered.

When I said it before the patch, like here and here was welcome with denial if not utter derision.

Glad to see once again I was right and they wrong.

And the denial doesn't end here either ;) even though belt statistics paint a clear picture of just how popular the mac is and how unpopular the hulk has become.

One could also draw the conclusion that solo mining is far more popular in highsec than fleet mining... nawww that makes sense and doesn't jibe with the whole OMG MACK IS THE BESTES TTHING EVA NO ONE FLIES HULKS!!!111

And the denial doesn't end here either ;) even though the screenshots i posted on the previous page paint a clear picture of just how popular the mac is and how unpopular the hulk has become. I think someone pointed out that market price reflects this too?

Mackinkaw: 287m sell/263m buy
Hulk: 224m sell/170m buy
Skiff: 190m sell/164m buy

I thought the intention of the barge buff was to remove one barge being best. That being the Hulk. The Mackinkaw has taken the Hulks old roll as king of the barges, the yield is almost as good as the Hulk, it has better tank, and it has a massive ore hold which is the primary thing that's making it so overpowered. Able to mine on ice roids for over half an hour as a semi afk income, it can't be beaten, it has taken the role of the Hulk as the primary choice of barge. Failing that, the retriever, which is almost as good.

There's one main reason for this. 35k m3 ore hold, not far below that of an ORCA. Does anyone else think that the devs didn't think this through too well? I can't see many miners not taking a Mackinkaw over a Hulk even with Orca support, because 35k m3 ore hold allows them to do other things while your Mackinkaw pulls in what is basically an afk income for at least half an hour at a time.

It's already apparent what effect this is having on the ice market. If the trend continues, soon the only people mining ice will be bots and afk alts.

Someone pointed out below that the Mackinkaw hauls ore better than an actual hauler does now. It takes the primary role of a hauler and does it better. You may aswell have just taken the Iteron MK5/Occator and given it mining lasers and hulk like yield. That's what we have now, a super industrial all in one miner and hauler

Some of the belts I screenshotted had over a dozen orcas yet no hulks, so much for orca support groups using hulks.

New Mack is awesome, great change for the downtrodden hisec miners, Goon stranglehold on Eve economy is loosening

[quote=Peter Raptor]it is impossible to die in HS if you pay attention.

It is impossible to die in HS if you pay attention.

That is not even remotely true..