There's actually some good articles out there on how to live in someone else's backyard, even moon mining under their noses----but I'm too lazy to link them. Basically, just go out there with some stealth bombers/recons. After a while they'll just assume you're "those goddamn AFK cloakers ruining my 0.0" and leave you alone.

Some of the counters suggested

- Making moon mining arrays raidable (which would be great imo)

- Making the cost of sov inversely proportional

true, there is too much unused ships in eve.
ppl rushing to the best ships and some ships are forgotten after first and last usage (if any).

Blobs are here because large power blocks, and large power blocks are here because 0.0 space is large compact space where all systems are too even distributed and connected well together... 0.0 should be not that known space to us where wars are common thing and all its connection grid and infrastructure cant be that well organised and connected... so... what do you think about that some space-gates (making tree like 0.0 structure) are removed to make that you need to travel more (to junction of that branch where you are and then to next branch) making that you must travel throught not your own space
and/or,
maybe better,
space-gates can malfunction and there is some time needed for their repair? that way some parts of 0.0 space could get disconnected from the rest and only way to get in and out are jump-drives...

1) That would maybe help to limit one alliance to control to large space...
2) Black Ops BSs could get new function... they can jump to systems where no sub-cap cant in this moment...
3) it would make 0.0 more dynamic space...

just one idea...



And about drone regions...yes please... remove mineral drops...



And i am all for increasing sov cost with quantity of space you own...

quoting by far and away the most liked answer in the thread so you can add something to the OP about it, in case you forget or accidently ignore it.

Edit: I also suspect there is a lack of organisation. Surely they have fleets with PVPers and ratters, who could warp to the rescue quickly? Systems don't have hundreds of ways in and why not bait those cloakers out, have some people just a gate away.

you forgot we speak about game here....

almost noone will spend their time like in RL job to protect you... We play for fun. this means:
1. Noone will stay for hours on gates or in belt just to make you mining safer
2. People will try to rescue you if you are attacked
3. You can die before anyone even will notice you were attacked

you forgot we speak about game here....

almost noone will spend their time like in RL job to protect you... We play for fun. this means:
1. Noone will stay for hours on gates or in belt just to make you mining safer
2. People will try to rescue you if you are attacked
3. You can die before anyone even will notice you were attacked

Problem is: mining barge dies very fast.... Let's say i have no chance to rescue it if i need to come from system 2 jumps away. Only i can to try is to engage attackers AFTER they killed you. But why should i spend my time to every neutral? I'd better spend this time chatting with people instead of jumping around and trying to catch somebody.....

People usually think: if i come to 0.0 everybody and their dog will come in supercarrier with blob of subcapitals to kill me.
Truth is: noone will care about you unless you will make a real damage to people there. When we see incoming neutral most of a people just dock and go afk for some time. Carebears You can die faster got caught by roamers from other alliances

Rather than another whine thread about nerfing highsec I thought I'd post something with the aim of being constructive and take a look at what can be done to return nullsec to its glory days. I posted a similar comment recently, but thought it would be good to start a new thread to gather ideas of new features to entice people to null.

As a solo/small gang pvper I've noticed that nullsec has become rather stagnant over the past year or so, a lot of the old sov skirmishes are diminishing as people are seemingly content with what they have, and the footholds in 0.0 are too deeply entrenched to allow newer corps/alliances to establish themselves. People looking beyond empire are seemingly choosing to reside in WH space rather than null due to the low barriers to entry, unique gameplay and profitability so the landscape of null is not changing.

It's my opinion that currently the majority of eve stay in highsec because it is convenient, more sociable and easier to get into than nullsec with enough the features to keep people occupied and having fun. ItGÇÖs possible for the average player to make enough isk in highsec to buy all the ships required relatively easily, so even the more expensive ships are easily accessible. I'm definitely not in the camp of "nerfing" highsec - this will just **** off existing residents and will not bring anything new to the game, but there needs to be a reason to explore other areas of the sandbox GÇô currently CCP does not offer enough of a reason.

To entice players [back] into null there needs to be a big carrot and not a stick. This carrot should be unique, easy to get into and most importantly it should be fun. The problem is I have no idea what that carrot should be because I still happy out in null .

So my question to non-null sec players - What keeps you out of null, and what features would you like to see which might entice you to venture out here?




Edit - Some really good discussion so far of what's keeping people out of null.

The major frustrations seem to be:

- Lack of things for the casual gamer to participate in
- Lack of accessibility outside of major alliances
- Failure to give industrial's a meaningful task
- Too much unused, yet claimed, space
- Lack of objectives for small gang pvp
- Hard for people to actually enter nullsec due to pipe camps and bubbles

Some of the counters suggested

- CCP Soundwave - Considering swapping drone drops for bounties
- Making moon mining arrays raidable (which would be great imo)
- Limiting alliance size
- Making the cost of sov indirectly related to activity within a system
- Changing gate mechanics from appearing 15km from a gate to 150km.
- Making the cost of sov inversely proportional

CCP - It would be great if you could give your opinion on some of the counters and how implementable they are in reality (and whether you think they would be good for the game).

It's also fair to say that a number of people don't want to come to null... don't worry I don't propose we force you!

This mechanic is OK. That your friends can't be arsed is just fine, CCP cannot fix your friends. The thing that is not fine, is the fact that mining is uncompetitive with other stuff to the point that you cannot cover a) ship losses or b) pay a protection force. The economy is thus unbalanced, and the reasons have already been stated.

- non mining mineral sources in the game
- botting

remove those and the economics of mining self balance, because its a supply/demand economy.

Adding a slightly more robust barge would be a nice tweak, but it isn't the structural problem. Mining needs love, but I do not think CCP are brave enough to make the changes that would place economics in the hands of (actual human) miners, worse than that I don't think the player base is either - they are happy with the current price of ships.

Update your "suggestions" tree with links to the OP's you are refering to. I would love to read the reasoning behind making people appear 150km from a gate...

This mechanic is OK. That your friends can't be arsed is just fine, CCP cannot fix your friends. The thing that is not fine, is the fact that mining is uncompetitive with other stuff to the point that you cannot cover a) ship losses or b) pay a protection force.

Real problem of 0.0: too low risk for rewards you get there. That's why goons plag in empire (too much money and too low fun in 0.0), that's why bots, that's why shiny ships with deadspace modules even for ratting.....

[quote=betoli]
The only thing duller than mining (imo) is watching people mine - so it will be dificult to motivate people to do that without significant rewards, which with the current state of null mining will just never happen.

An expensive HULK has around what 22K EHP? So it only has around 45 seconds survivability against anything cruiser class. Is that enough for the most expensive tankable option? Whats a realistic time for a corpmate pissing about somewhere in the system to arrive??

So there are two ways of achieving that. Either mineral prices are good enough to pay for 2 players time including compensation for the boredom, or barges are survivable to allow a corpmate in the same system doing something else, to arrive and get points on an attacker before the barge goes pop (I don't care if the barge survives, so long as the aggressor takes a risk). We do want to avoid the situation where miners dock up because a single unknown player (or AFK cloaker) pops up in local, because thats a seriously unfun mechanic. I think that should be the goal of any survivable barge tweak or new barge ship.

An expensive HULK has around what 22K EHP? So it only has around 45 seconds survivability against anything cruiser class. Is that enough for the most expensive tankable option? Whats a realistic time for a corpmate pissing about somewhere in the system to arrive??

gen we get some more CCP responce here?

You can get a Hulk above the 30k EHP mark with nothing more than ordinary meta and T2.

You can get a Hulk above the 30k EHP mark with nothing more than ordinary meta and T2.

YES. mechanic is OK.
and NO. Problems with covering your losses or paying for protection are very rare in 0.0 space.

YES. mechanic is OK.
and NO. Problems with covering your losses or paying for protection are very rare in 0.0 space.

Real problem of 0.0: too low risk for rewards you get there. That's why goons plag in empire (too much money and too low fun in 0.0), that's why bots, that's why shiny ships with deadspace modules even for ratting.....

effing forums, ccp please fix this bullshit "no html" code i get for using youre own "bold" function.


REMOVE STATISTIC REPORTING FROM 0.0

Not all of it, but the following:

Rats killed per system
The ability to remotely view soveregnity upgrade levels (force people to physically visit the system to see if its got it - only allow the corp that owns the tcu/ihub to remotely view)
Jumps per system

remove mineral drops from drones!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

remove meta-0 loot drops and scrap metal from rats