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Carceret Rinah
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
9
   |
Posted - 2011.11.06 21:57:00 -
[571] - Quote
Barbelo Valentinian wrote:
Everyone keeps talking as if null sec should have more "reward", but (thinking on the sim side of things for a moment), that's really quite unrealistic. "High Sec" in real life is usually where the richest rewards are - it's where stuff is made, because there are lots of people who co-operate, and that space is made relatively safe by policing, so stuff can be built. That's where the riches are at.
You might say "well, but new resources come in from the frontier" - yeah, but unless it's something like gold, high value per volume, then resources are the cheapest things, precisely because they haven't been worked over by the hand of man to be made useful in any way yet.
So I say, nerf null sec, nerf it in the sense of making it not possible to have industry there, but make it where all the resources are. Don't have any more mining resources in High Sec. It's mined out, it's just where the industry is.
Have the resources all in null sec. but have no possibility of industry in null sec. That means you'd have to have an actual flow of resources from null to high, to be manufactured in High, and flow out to null again.
****
Anyway, personally I don't go to null sec because I'm a casual solo player, and even if I were more of a corp-player type, I still wouldn't go out to null sec because I can't stand the idea of being a slave to someone else's empire-building dreams and money-making schemes.
I have enough of that in real life.
This makes too much sense. There'd be excitement and profit for miners, regular trade routes to rob and disrupt, safety for the quiet industrialists, and reasons for everyone to spread out and explore.
It would never happen, though, because the established powers in nullsec wouldn't give up their haunted empires for all the ISK in the world (ISK they already have). |
Jenshae Chiroptera
119
|
Posted - 2011.11.07 03:59:00 -
[572] - Quote
Carceret Rinah wrote:... There'd be ...
... a whole load of mining barges going on sale. Then the high sec miners would swop over to other high sec activities, such as missions and PI.
You are talking about a mentality of play here. There are those that will always chose the safest and or casual options. It does not matter what you do with high sec or null sec, they will never move to null sec.
CSM do you think?
No matter the changes, high sec people chose the safests. Lots of stick and they will leave. Half the problem is the players in null sec; we do not want to be there with you. |
myFORUMalt alts
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
7
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 15:12:00 -
[573] - Quote
CCP Soundwave wrote:This thread is pretty awesome. You guys will get a few 0.0 changes this winter, smaller ones that should improve quality of life.
One thing I'm thinking about, but not entirely sure about is this: Putting bounties on drones instead of minerals. Mining used to be a viable way of making money in nullsec, but the increase in available minerals has driven the price down. I'm wondering if putting bounties on drones won't give mining a bit of a revival and put some life back in 0.0.
been seeing a lot of chatter lately about the winter expansion "crucible" but no follow up mention bounties on drones. any follow up, has the plan been denied. has it evolved?
Yes, I complain about things I don't like. |
Metal Icarus
xHELLonEARTHx
Rookie Empire
16
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 16:54:00 -
[574] - Quote
"So make it safer"
"Less blob and I'll come."
Null sec is NOT highsec. Those 20 or so corporations in one system don't have to talk to each other and basically ignore each other is because they don't need to interact at all. In null, it is a MUST.
Highsec = NO POLITICS
Nullsec = MUCH POLITICS
its important to understand that "One does not simply walk into nullsec" (lol LOTR ref that works) You talk to people who can get you in. I am tired of seeing pubbies complain about how hard it is when they completly ignore the political side of Null. That was makes Null fun for me. Actual politics that matter on a day to day basis. If you just play in highsec, you don't know where everyone stands in a given system because they are all neutral.
In Null you NEED to know who EVERYONE IS and what they are capable of. Because that one time you let one guy slide in and out without looking is that one guy who logged off in your system to be brought on again later to hot drop your carrier with super carriers.
Null is what it is because of poltics between large alliances. It is possible to go in, but you have to establish communication with someone before you go in.
Maybe a tutorial on large corp/alliance interaction video on how to forge alliances and permission to go into null would be in order.
Null is hard because politics is an often ignored aspect of it.
Null is fine the way it is. If anything it needs to be BUFFED so it is INDEPENDENT of highsec besides LOW GRADE industry. All T2 manufacturing and faction drops should only happen in Null. Ice should only be in Null, ABC ores should only be in Null and WH space.
The reason those large alliance are so powerful is because YOU LET THEM GET THAT BIG. Stop complaining and get in contact with some of your buddies and join a nullsec corp/alliance. You dont like the DRF, Test, Goons, Raiden? Don't join them. Simple as that. |
Jenn Makanen
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
44
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 17:11:00 -
[575] - Quote
Metal Icarus wrote:
Highsec = NO POLITICS
Nullsec = MUCH POLITICS
And politics means casual players don't do well.
I'll stay in high-sec, thanks. And if it's nerfed too far, I'll walk.
And as for me letting those alliances get too big? I wasn't around. So I'm stuck with what other people allowed to happen. Like every other new player. |
pussnheels
Vintage heavy industries
156
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 17:32:00 -
[576] - Quote
[quote=Metal Icarus]"So make it safer"
Null is fine the way it is. If anything it needs to be BUFFED so it is INDEPENDENT of highsec besides LOW GRADE industry. All T2 manufacturing and faction drops should only happen in Null. Ice should only be in Null, ABC ores should only be in Null and WH space.
quote]
thats the fastest way to kill eve
Null sec alliances have no interest in industry beyond moongoo and abc ores
Like so many people already stated in this thread it is the politics and the sometimes so arrogant PVP only mentallity or the join us or keep out policy, that keeps people away from null sec
You can buff nul sec and nerf high sec to death if you want it will not do a thing, only result is that alot of people will simply walk away from this game
I do not agree with what you are saying , but i will defend to the death your right to say it...... Voltaire |
Strike Severasse
Red Dead Redemption
6
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 18:20:00 -
[577] - Quote
Adelphie wrote:Rather than another whine thread about nerfing highsec I thought I'd post something with the aim of being constructive and take a look at what can be done to return nullsec to its glory days. I posted a similar comment recently, but thought it would be good to start a new thread to gather ideas of new features to entice people to null.
...
Simple, make access to get "into" Null relatively safe.
Then make someplace they can stop at, besides the log-off in space stupid option.
...now find the method, and there are so many ways to do this
Note: WH are generally safe to enter and they are Null too, 1. scan, 2. enter, 3. save location, 4. warp away from random entrance
and more time consuming to exit after a day since the original exit to k-space is now closed.
so...
? more direct hi to null entrances
? pop in like WHs so bypass gatecamps by doing the time and effort to find another way
? make other side of gate proximity alerts
? small holdings safe simple POSs
lots of way, and each one will have some players screaming ;)
.... gates are like roids, dont give in to beer camping
now lets welcome the high sec in with open arms, err open gates, then slowly close the doors behind them... hooked on excitement again...... while the old carebear and camper doze zzzzzzzz ! |
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
104
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 18:39:00 -
[578] - Quote
I still hope for one game-changing thing:
A module or any ability for any ship to warp from one system to the next "Star Trek style".
Gates are killing nullsec because gates represent a mechanic for gank/blob as the only recourse. The bubble reigns because of gates, and so we have camps and blobs.
Warp-to-system means the Combat Probe will reign, and patrolling will replace blobbing, scouting will replace camping. For the politics and implications of gaining or holding SOV, I don't know, but for PVP and "having a chance to get in" I am sure a good time would be had by all.
|
Jenshae Chiroptera
152
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 18:55:00 -
[579] - Quote
Jenn Makanen wrote:Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Barbelo Valentinian wrote:
So I say, ....
They also need a way to protect their miners. Maybe some sort of structure that protects them? Gives them time for help to respond? Dead space generators and keyed gates? Destroyable gates, of course. which would take the generator offline.
I did suggest player created gates but that was more aimed at breaking up the big alliances and them being able to make new routes, cut pieces off each other, et cetera.
Ideas & stuff
No matter the changes, high sec people chose the safests. Lots of stick and they will leave. Half the problem is the players in null sec; we do not want to be there with you. |
Ein Spiegel
Fly-by-Night Industries LLC PTY LTD
Drama Flakes
6
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 19:14:00 -
[580] - Quote
Why don't I reside in Null-sec (anymore)?
A couple simple reasons:
1. The people. Null sec is either feast (a few good systems, during the right time frame, or during a fleet fight) or famine (anywhere else, 99% of the time - if you do see someone, it's likely a botter or someone AFKing in a POS/SS/cloaked, or both). There's a myth about "ooo, dangerous" - in my first week of the trial, I put a pod on autopilot on a long course through 0.0. And I found no one. Not even a camp on the pipe in or out. Things these days have improved, especially in terms of camps on the pipes, but once in the deep, you are usually the only shark in the waters. Further, the people that do exist out there are either elitist PvP'ers demanding incredible dedication (more to follow), renters that barely inhabit systems, or lone wolfs looking for a kill. The atmosphere in 0.0 is deadly to any form of industry beyond moon mining and supercap construction (maybe PI), and the attitudes of many alliance leaders is just as toxic towards non-PvP activities. Thus, you find incredible boredom, snide condescension, or immediate demands to join fleet and go go go. Solo living is difficult; you have to be with the people or you'll find yourself eventually bored to death unless you get mobbed - in which you take the clone express.
2) Territorial demands, rights, and responsibilities. I have a full time job. It pays me enough to keep my Eve account current, and even for a time to have a second account, even though I'm not playing much until (hopefully) the winter expansion gives me nerd chills. I don't want another one. Being part of a Sov-holding entity in 0.0 demands a high level of activity (even if it's just bouncing through 30 systems refueling POS towers or making 20 jumpfreighter / carrier runs to Empire and back), and then of course there's CTAs, alarm clock ops, and things you MUST do if you don't want to find out you've been flagged red and just lost all your possessions in a station you won't be able to dock into again. (Never happened to me, fortunately - although almost lost stuff during outpost ping-pongs.) The infrastructure is severely lacking - lose a ship and you might as well go all the way back to Empire to replace it (odds are you won't find the ship, or modules, you need in your region - and if you do, they might not be someplace you can pick them up). This adds more time required just running logistics and trying to get ready to try and live out there. Tack on to this that if you are a member of a populous alliance, odds are you cannot make decent money running rats in belts or anomalies to afford the amount of metal you are about to consign to the fires of interstellar combat at the behest of your charming, vaguely accented lord and master. If you don't live, breathe, and sleep Eve, along with your 150-2000 friends, 0.0 just isn't worth the time. I can do anything I need to do gamewise faster, cheaper, and with considerably more fun in Empire and the fringes of null sec. Which is important, as I don't want to be chained to my computer desk in case the Goons decide to rush in. 0.0 induces burnout - much like a job - which is one of the reasons I think 0.0 is relatively stable right now... the big rush of wars just kindof wears you down, y'know? |
Ladie Harlot
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
772
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 19:28:00 -
[581] - Quote
Ein Spiegel wrote:Why don't I reside in Null-sec (anymore)?
Paragraphs and line breaks. Learn to love them.
The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
152
|
Posted - 2011.11.09 19:39:00 -
[582] - Quote
Ladie Harlot wrote:Ein Spiegel wrote:Why don't I reside in Null-sec (anymore)? Paragraphs and line breaks. Learn to love them.
That was just two paragraphs with a break at the end of the first. Why is it a problem?
Ideas & stuff
No matter the changes, high sec people chose the safests. Lots of stick and they will leave. Half the problem is the players in null sec; we do not want to be there with you. |
pussnheels
Vintage heavy industries
157
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 08:26:00 -
[583] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Ladie Harlot wrote:Ein Spiegel wrote:Why don't I reside in Null-sec (anymore)? Paragraphs and line breaks. Learn to love them. That was just two paragraphs with a break at the end of the first. Why is it a problem?
because he is a goon what else to expect, they so bored out there they spam the forums
I do not agree with what you are saying , but i will defend to the death your right to say it...... Voltaire |
Delirious Grib
Solaroids
Another Really Stupid Enterprise
3
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 09:29:00 -
[584] - Quote
I think increasing sov costs the more sov space you hold is a great idea (e.g. own 1 system 100 mill per month, 2 systems 400 mill, 3 systems 1200 mill, etc) |
Ladie Harlot
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
882
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 09:30:00 -
[585] - Quote
Delirious Grib wrote:I think increasing sov costs the more sov space you hold is a great idea (e.g. own 1 system 100 mill per month, 2 systems 400 mill, 3 systems 1200 mill, etc)
Yes this course of action would repopulate nullsec.
The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet. |
Avila Cracko
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
86
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 11:05:00 -
[586] - Quote
Ladie Harlot wrote:Delirious Grib wrote:I think increasing sov costs the more sov space you hold is a great idea (e.g. own 1 system 100 mill per month, 2 systems 400 mill, 3 systems 1200 mill, etc) Yes this course of action would repopulate nullsec.
It would...
because small players could get some crumbles of 0.0... and now all 0.0 (and all crumbles) belongs only to big fishes...
EVEs 0.0 cant be owned by one/two/three groups of ppl... we need to see many many more names on 0.0 map. |
Ladie Harlot
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
899
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 11:11:00 -
[587] - Quote
Avila Cracko wrote:Ladie Harlot wrote:Delirious Grib wrote:I think increasing sov costs the more sov space you hold is a great idea (e.g. own 1 system 100 mill per month, 2 systems 400 mill, 3 systems 1200 mill, etc) Yes this course of action would repopulate nullsec. It would... because small players could get some crumbles of 0.0... and now all 0.0 (and all crumbles) belongs only to big fishes... EVEs 0.0 cant be owned by one/two/three groups of ppl... we need to see many many more names on 0.0 map.
There is nothing stopping them.
The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet. |
Avila Cracko
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
86
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 11:14:00 -
[588] - Quote
Ladie Harlot wrote:Avila Cracko wrote:Ladie Harlot wrote:Delirious Grib wrote:I think increasing sov costs the more sov space you hold is a great idea (e.g. own 1 system 100 mill per month, 2 systems 400 mill, 3 systems 1200 mill, etc) Yes this course of action would repopulate nullsec. It would... because small players could get some crumbles of 0.0... and now all 0.0 (and all crumbles) belongs only to big fishes... EVEs 0.0 cant be owned by one/two/three groups of ppl... we need to see many many more names on 0.0 map. There is nothing stopping them.
LOL... yea... right...
only few groups of ppl that own 100% of 0.0 and 90% of EVEs money and military power... and they want more...
|
Luh Windan
Ancient Motorboats
6
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 11:17:00 -
[589] - Quote
Avila Cracko wrote:Ladie Harlot wrote:Avila Cracko wrote:Ladie Harlot wrote:Delirious Grib wrote:I think increasing sov costs the more sov space you hold is a great idea (e.g. own 1 system 100 mill per month, 2 systems 400 mill, 3 systems 1200 mill, etc) Yes this course of action would repopulate nullsec. It would... because small players could get some crumbles of 0.0... and now all 0.0 (and all crumbles) belongs only to big fishes... EVEs 0.0 cant be owned by one/two/three groups of ppl... we need to see many many more names on 0.0 map. There is nothing stopping them. LOL... yea... right... only few groups of ppl that own 100% of 0.0 and 90% of EVEs money and military power... and they want more...
we are the 99%!!!!
*gets coat* |
betoli
Morior Invictus.
Velocitas Eradico
11
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 11:17:00 -
[590] - Quote
Avila Cracko wrote:Ladie Harlot wrote:Avila Cracko wrote:Ladie Harlot wrote:Delirious Grib wrote:I think increasing sov costs the more sov space you hold is a great idea (e.g. own 1 system 100 mill per month, 2 systems 400 mill, 3 systems 1200 mill, etc) Yes this course of action would repopulate nullsec. It would... because small players could get some crumbles of 0.0... and now all 0.0 (and all crumbles) belongs only to big fishes... EVEs 0.0 cant be owned by one/two/three groups of ppl... we need to see many many more names on 0.0 map. There is nothing stopping them. LOL... yea... right... only few groups of ppl that own 100% of 0.0 and 90% of EVEs money and military power... and they want more...
#occupy nullsec. We are the 99%  |
Ladie Harlot
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
899
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 11:18:00 -
[591] - Quote
Avila Cracko wrote:LOL... yea... right...
only few groups of ppl that own 100% of 0.0 and 90% of EVEs money and military power... and they want more...
Wow...who are these amazing people who own 100% of nullsec?
The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
154
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 11:36:00 -
[592] - Quote
Ladie Harlot wrote:Avila Cracko wrote:LOL... yea... right...
only few groups of ppl that own 100% of 0.0 and 90% of EVEs money and military power... and they want more...
Wow...who are these amazing people who own 100% of nullsec?
Big allianceS not one alliance. 
Ideas & stuff
No matter the changes, high sec people chose the safests. Lots of stick and they will leave. Half the problem is the players in null sec; we do not want to be there with you. |
pussnheels
Vintage heavy industries
157
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 11:38:00 -
[593] - Quote
Avila Cracko wrote:Ladie Harlot wrote:Avila Cracko wrote:Ladie Harlot wrote:Delirious Grib wrote:I think increasing sov costs the more sov space you hold is a great idea (e.g. own 1 system 100 mill per month, 2 systems 400 mill, 3 systems 1200 mill, etc) Yes this course of action would repopulate nullsec. It would... because small players could get some crumbles of 0.0... and now all 0.0 (and all crumbles) belongs only to big fishes... EVEs 0.0 cant be owned by one/two/three groups of ppl... we need to see many many more names on 0.0 map. There is nothing stopping them. LOL... yea... right... only few groups of ppl that own 100% of 0.0 and 90% of EVEs money and military power... and they want more...
but have no idea on how to use it
Goons Delenda Est
I do not agree with what you are saying , but i will defend to the death your right to say it...... Voltaire |
Niko Takahashi
Perkone
Caldari State
7
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 12:02:00 -
[594] - Quote
Deucalion Ex Mortis wrote:Why I dont go to 0.0?
I think Mittani says it best.
"Nullsec is a small and insular group of players. Most of us have been killing each other for years and changed sides so many times we can't keep track of who we're angry at. Podding happens so often that it isn't even discussed."
I dare any of these 0.0 alliance leaders to make an alt, dont tell anyone who you are, dont use your resources, play like an actual noob and try and join your own alliance. Then you will see why alot of people have given up hope in 0.0.
Nice post I like the last part.
My Opinion on the matter is this.
In its current state I don't care for null at all. Unless it is NPC null that is that can actually be fun times.
To fix this I propose.
1 Get rid of the gate guns and make all Low sec NPC null with the only difference of Emipre factions being the sov holder. This will make a lot of more fun fights in small ships all over. It will increase the number of access routes.
2 Mission's and belt NPC's ugraded accordingly. Change it so the complexes in these new empire NPC null will spawn the appropriate pirate enemy faction ships [aka angels in Minmatar space] And the Pirate regions spawn the enemy navy faction / concord NPC's.
So you can do plexes and build standings for missions at same time. Makes much more sense this way.
3 The default state of the Sov Null sec is this
It is like wormholes with the difference that all the wormholes are static. They are allays there but have mass restrictions.
Alliances can build gates that they have to construct them fuel and link with gate on the other side. Thes gates are destructible with large fleet but small gang of bombers can attack specific parts of it and disable the link until fixed.
Consumption of fuel depends on the usage tied to mass transported.
[both small and big fleets have something to do]
The Null sec folks have to pay upkeep and develop infrastructure. Multiple outposts per system will be allowed tied to some system development coeficient which does include industry as well.
Local is delayed in all of the SOV NUll just unlike WH you can upgrade to get it.
and Last point
4 More Sov space is Added make the frontiers bigger lot more folks online these days
|
Jenshae Chiroptera
154
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 14:28:00 -
[595] - Quote
Niko Takahashi wrote:Deucalion Ex Mortis wrote:Why I dont go to 0.0? 1 Get rid of the gate guns and make all Low sec NPC null with the only difference of Emipre factions being the sov holder. This will make a lot of more fun fights in small ships all over. It will increase the number of access routes.
Maybe a modification on that?
Let NPC pirates take over low sec space.
You grind up faction with those factions.
You can join them as an NPC corp.
They then protect you if you are attacked by non-alliance members, like Concord.
When there are X number of members they get some systems to vote on invading.
Then those stations can be attacked and taken over.
The system under attack will automatically start shooting you from the gate guns and station guns.
For everyone else, it will be like normal NPC null sec.
Ideas and CSM stuff
No matter the changes, high sec people chose the safests. Lots of stick and they will leave. Half the problem is the players in null sec; we do not want to be there with you. |
Via Shivon
Kriegsmarinewerft
Goonswarm Federation
19
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 15:22:00 -
[596] - Quote
Everything in eve is arround ISK - Easy solution
High sec 25m/h max income
Low sec 75m/h max income
0.0 100+m/h income
and you will see how fast the wars will beginn
its a joke earning 100+m/h in high sec, why should a highsecpussy fight and defend for minor more money in 0.0? |
Jenshae Chiroptera
156
|
Posted - 2011.11.11 03:51:00 -
[597] - Quote
CCP Jenshae wrote:We can not program better null security personalities.
Ideas and CSM stuff
No matter the changes, high sec people chose the safests. Lots of stick and they will leave. Half the problem is the players in null sec; we do not want to be there with you. |
Headerman
Quovis
Shadow of xXDEATHXx
332
|
Posted - 2011.11.21 11:14:00 -
[598] - Quote
IMO the best way to get more people into 0.0 space is to make it more attractive to people, not disenfranchise them with major nerfs to high sec.
Seriously, if i was having fun at a place somewhere for a while, and the owner came along and told me to move to another area of theirs that was ****, and he was poking me with a stick to go, i would simple get up and leave.
The Apostle : I want a kangeroo
Captain Kirk : Silly Austrians
Sarmatiko : Let me guess: you're from US?
Captain Kirk : Yeah Riverside IA - why? |
Jenshae Chiroptera
201
|
Posted - 2011.11.21 11:22:00 -
[599] - Quote
Mostly it is personality and play style. If they have 10M SP and haven't move to low, null or WH then they probably never will, not matter what changes you make.
You can't change people and they are simply not interested in those play styles.
Change null sec to make it better for those already there or add the guerilla mechanics that I have listed in my sig.
Ideas and stuff
EVE - the game of sand castles, either building them or kicking them down. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
201
|
Posted - 2011.11.21 11:24:00 -
[600] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Mostly it is personality and play style. If they have 10M SP and haven't move to low, null or WH then they probably never will, not matter what changes you make.
You can't change people and they are simply not interested in those play styles.
Change null sec to make it better for those already there or add the guerilla mechanics that I have listed in my sig.
Covert POS
Remove local
Remove NPC kill reports.
Player owned and destructible gates
Covert gates.
Ideas and stuff
EVE - the game of sand castles, either building them or kicking them down. |
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