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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 4 post(s) |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
33
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Posted - 2011.10.19 19:39:00 -
[271] - Quote
Anyone that sees this as a good thing is not seeing what this really is.
- CCP is having financial issues.
- They also realized that the technology they bet the vampire farm on, that they couldn't deliver WiS with can't scale to an actual MMO game at this point in time. It was too resource intensive at a minimum, maybe other issues as well.
- They still believe consoles are a cash cow that will save them and DUST 514 is based on known technology, so they can deliver that.
- CCP did not ADD resources to EVE, they cut resources overall. This wasn't a "we will move 80% of our vampire wranglers to deliver WiS for example, or teach them how to makes FiS stuff". This is we are chopping up decks on our steamship to throw into the fire to keep the pumps running.
So, glad they are cutting their losses on a project that exceeded their ability to grasp and they are trying to win our "hearts and minds" with some PR spinnage but this is not time to celebrate.
This is time to ask if the sudden listing of the decks towards the bow might be something other than the ship surfing on some knarly waves like the captain just announced. Does the listing and the water up to our ankles have something to do with the second announcment that we have a new supply of fresh ice for our blender drinks?!
Issler |
Barakkus
851
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Posted - 2011.10.19 19:39:00 -
[272] - Quote
Honestly guys, I can pretty much guarantee no one is keeping their salaries if they're laying people off. I would venture a guess they probably fretted over the numbers for a good long time the last couple months to try to avoid laying anyone off, in the end I'm sure they cut pay as well as let people go...and I'm pretty sure no one, absolutely no one is happy about it over there....if you actually pay attention to all the stupid little videos and stuff they put out, it's a pretty close family, I'm sure it's pretty heart breaking, all the way to the top to have to do any of this. |
Thomas Abernathy
Viziam Amarr Empire
4
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Posted - 2011.10.19 19:40:00 -
[273] - Quote
So, after all the "We look at more what people say that do" You actually lost enough business to force layoffs?
Why is CCP the only one that seems surprised?
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Florestan Bronstein
The Waterworks
112
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Posted - 2011.10.19 19:40:00 -
[274] - Quote
Renan Ruivo wrote: Last thing CCP needs right now is for the CEO to step down. If he does, CCP stock will plummet, and the company will die. Regardless if Jesus Christ himself fills the position of new CEO.
CCP stock is not publicly traded. |
Hakaru Ishiwara
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
28
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Posted - 2011.10.19 19:40:00 -
[275] - Quote
Barakkus wrote:Blood Fart wrote:so the idiots who came up with the bullshit can get the same size pay checks? I would venture a guess quite a few people if not all of them took sizeable paycuts. This makes me chuckle. Since when has it been typical or standard for CEOs or their executive team to take pay cuts?
Very rare is the CEO or other executive that takes a pay cut. Their egos will not let it happen.
In the case that still-employed CCP personnel did take pay cuts, then that is something that would truly impress me. Austerity measures to ensure viability are a much more intelligent way of meeting budgets (rather than layoffs).
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Hrug
Lutinari Syndicate Electus Matari
4
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Posted - 2011.10.19 19:40:00 -
[276] - Quote
Loosing a job you love doing is the worst thing that can happen to someone, especially when it happens in a friendly environment such as CCP's.
For curiosity's sake, what do people think about the idea that CCP does the the following:
- increases our subs (temporarily perhaps?) by $1,
- doesn't fire anyone,
- reallocates the to-be-fired staff to EVE features that are in development.
I'd go for it... |
Azelor Delaria
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
49
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Posted - 2011.10.19 19:41:00 -
[277] - Quote
Barakkus wrote:Honestly guys, I can pretty much guarantee no one is keeping their salaries if they're laying people off. I would venture a guess they probably fretted over the numbers for a good long time the last couple months to try to avoid laying anyone off, in the end I'm sure they cut pay as well as let people go...and I'm pretty sure no one, absolutely no one is happy about it over there....if you actually pay attention to all the stupid little videos and stuff they put out, it's a pretty close family, I'm sure it's pretty heart breaking, all the way to the top to have to do any of this.
In many instances like this, you fire peons so the higher-ups can keep their paychecks at the amount they are right now, as well as the annual "bonuses" they sneak into their contracts. |
Poloturion
Lead Farmers Kill It With Fire
0
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Posted - 2011.10.19 19:41:00 -
[278] - Quote
Job security and the games industry tend not to mix very often.
My condolences to those who lost their jobs and wishing you luck finding a job in the industry you love. |
Barakkus
851
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Posted - 2011.10.19 19:43:00 -
[279] - Quote
Azelor Delaria wrote:Barakkus wrote:Honestly guys, I can pretty much guarantee no one is keeping their salaries if they're laying people off. I would venture a guess they probably fretted over the numbers for a good long time the last couple months to try to avoid laying anyone off, in the end I'm sure they cut pay as well as let people go...and I'm pretty sure no one, absolutely no one is happy about it over there....if you actually pay attention to all the stupid little videos and stuff they put out, it's a pretty close family, I'm sure it's pretty heart breaking, all the way to the top to have to do any of this. In many instances like this, you fire peons so the higher-ups can keep their paychecks at the amount they are right now, as well as the annual "bonuses" they sneak into their contracts.
Actually that has not been my experience. I'm pretty sure all of upper management has taken their lumps in all of this as well.
Now if it were a bank or some mult-national investment firm maybe...CCP is still a small shop in comparison to most companies out there...
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Sam Bowein
Sense Amid Madness
8
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Posted - 2011.10.19 19:43:00 -
[280] - Quote
I don't get it, you say resources are stretched too thin, so you lay people off ??? |
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Yakumo Smith
Domination. Legion of The Damned.
0
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Posted - 2011.10.19 19:44:00 -
[281] - Quote
Nearly 5 years since the merger.
Wonder if WW employees had protecting written into the merger deal???
Something similar happened at my company, we took over a smaller outfit and all of their staff got 3 years protection from being made redundant etc. This had a side effect of protcting current employee's as well as just firing the old guard could have came across as discrimination. Year 3 saw my company downsize 20%.
I applaud the decision CCP. The last series of DEV blogs has given me hope that you can actually pull it together. A someone in a company that went through the process you are now going through, I can see the benefits we gained from trimming ourselves down. It's a tough pill to swallow, but once you have it down your neck, the benefits start to become clear.
+1 resubscribing |
Barakkus
851
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Posted - 2011.10.19 19:44:00 -
[282] - Quote
Hakaru Ishiwara wrote:Barakkus wrote:Blood Fart wrote:so the idiots who came up with the bullshit can get the same size pay checks? I would venture a guess quite a few people if not all of them took sizeable paycuts. This makes me chuckle. Since when has it been typical or standard for CEOs or their executive team to take pay cuts? Very rare is the CEO or other executive that takes a pay cut. Their egos will not let it happen. In the case that still-employed CCP personnel did take pay cuts, then that is something that would truly impress me. Austerity measures to ensure viability are a much more intelligent way of meeting budgets (rather than layoffs).
The CEO and VP of the company I work at right now took a 10% paycut right along with the rest of us when we went through this very same thing in February. |
RougeOperator
Autocannons Anonymous
43
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:49:00 -
[283] - Quote
CCP Manifest wrote: We stand behind our decisions and trust that it will ultimately bring you, the EVE community, a better game.
Yeah can you maybe get someone new to make the decisions you stand behind? I think it will do CCP a world of good.
I cant see why you trust decisions that drive you off cliff into the Atlantic in winter? |
Mithfindel
Zenko Incorporated
3
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Posted - 2011.10.19 19:50:00 -
[284] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:- CCP did not ADD resources to EVE, they cut resources overall. This wasn't a "we will move 80% of our vampire wranglers to deliver WiS for example, or teach them how to makes FiS stuff". This is we are chopping up decks on our steamship to throw into the fire to keep the pumps running.
Adding resources to a late project will make it more late. As in, beyond a certain level, overhead will eat all gains of additional manpower. Specially if the frameworks differ (hopefully not much due to CARBON, though) since a dev teaching new people on how things work is a dev not working on the project. I understand that CCP will be after these layoffs about as large as they were around the launch of Apocrypha and the development of Dominion. With possibly some extra load put by getting DUST out.
My condolences to everyone who lost their jobs today. Hopefully you can find new work soon. As for the rest, hopefully in the reorganization CCP can shorten the lines between Management and People Who Do Actual Work as well as Management and the community. Playing broken telephone belongs to somewhere else than game industry. |
Grady Eltoren
Aviation Professionals for EVE Fusion Alliance
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:53:00 -
[285] - Quote
Shaera Taam wrote:Xiaodown wrote: CCP ATL EMPLOYEES
The software shop I work for is looking for developers, and we have positions open in Atlanta (Duluth / Suwanee area), as well as Southwestern Virginia (about 5-6 hours from ATL).
We're primarily interested in .NET, Java, Python, and PHP devs. I think it's possible we may have some design positions, but not in any 3d space (no animation, motion capture, etc). We compete in the cloud industry.
now THAT is cool! i may not be a fan of test or dreddit in-game, but this game community is awesome! heywatiaminit! this may sound silly, but what about a PLEX for Pinkslips? i donate IRL to help those in need... why not in my favorite game too?
Wow - two great posts! Cheers to Xiaodown! Also - I love Shaera's idea - Count me in!
Also - if anyone at the CCP ATL office is looking for something completely different....like in AVIATION in Atlanta, let me know in game. I may be able to help with employment at Airlines in Atlanta.
All my best to the employees who may get cut. I would like to think CCP doesn't have to cut ANYONE in order to retrench though, but the letter release was VERY succinct and I agree with the logic of refocusing on EVE/DUST. One thing at a time - slow and steady - will get you there.
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Grady Eltoren
Aviation Professionals for EVE Fusion Alliance
3
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Posted - 2011.10.19 20:04:00 -
[286] - Quote
Ilkahn wrote: I readily admit that i want to see DUST, i'd like to see it in a PC version as well. Imagine Capsuleers and Dust marines in stations... bar fights, oh BOY!
This is the stuff dreams are made of and i fully believe CCP can bring them to us!
That's what I am talking about. Maybe CCP will refocus and bring us a PC version. : ) Bar fights between pilots and marines commence!
::Some seedy bar in Amake::
"You said you would back me up with Air support!" - Marine
"I did, just a little later than planned - you're alive aren't you!?" - Pilot
"Half my men had to re-clone and lost all there stuff; months worth of work because of you! You SOFAB arrogant pilot!" - Marine as he lunges forward with fist's drawn.
Incarna can have some great benefits! : ) |
Cailais
Nasty Pope Holding Corp Talocan United
57
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Posted - 2011.10.19 20:06:00 -
[287] - Quote
Overstretched so cutting staff?
It sounds to me as if something is inherently wrong within CCP; structurally, strategically and culturally. I would also question why such a move is being announced here on the forums? Is this some form of guilt trip against the player base? "Look what you've made us do!"
I feel bitterly sorry for those staff who are loosing their careers. It will be scant comfort to them that they too are now the very real (as opposed to virtual) victims of CCPs management team. It was this team who decided to treat EVEs customer base as a 'golden goose', this team that decided to turn a deaf ear to the players requests for a perfectly achievable process of gradual iteration and this team who thought introducing the most expensive micro transactions in the pantheon of MMOs right in the middle of a global depression.
I hope, for the sake of those about to loose their jobs that CCP reconsiders its strategy with a bit more thought, patience and a lot less fear.
Greed is Good eh?
C.
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Melissa Blick
Silver Aria Important Internet Spaceship League
0
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Posted - 2011.10.19 20:07:00 -
[288] - Quote
My annual subscription ended in August. I did not resub. For the past few months, I have been liquidating assets into PLEX to slowly let the account die a natural death. I curtailed my play time to mostly updating the queue.
After reading about the , I realised that CCP was seriously hurt in the past two months. While I am still upset, I want CCP to continue to develop eve. I feel like they are making a honest effort to turn things around. I plan to buy another annual subscription next month. |
Miraqu
Marquie-X Corp
10
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Posted - 2011.10.19 20:09:00 -
[289] - Quote
I feel for the employees who lost their job.
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Azelor Delaria
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
49
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Posted - 2011.10.19 20:11:00 -
[290] - Quote
Melissa Blick wrote:My annual subscription ended in August. I did not resub. For the past few months, I have been liquidating assets into PLEX to slowly let the account die a natural death. I curtailed my play time to mostly updating the queue.
After reading about the , I realised that CCP was seriously hurt in the past two months. While I am still upset, I want CCP to continue to develop eve. I feel like they are making a honest effort to turn things around. I plan to buy another annual subscription next month.
Interesting time to claim you're going to resub. As well as your first post on the forums. |
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Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
93
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Posted - 2011.10.19 20:13:00 -
[291] - Quote
STAY THE COURSE!
Show's that CCP has poor FUNDAMENTALS, and is living too much on shakey financials.
STAY THE COURSE PEOPLE!
If all it took was 3 months of stopped subscriptions to fire 20%, imagine what another 3 months or 6 months cancellations can do.
Shakey financials are shakey, fundamentals are king on ANY financial investment :)
Desperate montlty PLEX bulk offers, shows the desperate situation.
Keep the pressure on.
Ship spinning won't save Eve, again FUNDAMENTALS are king, not some bread and circuses visual eye candy. |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
34
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Posted - 2011.10.19 20:14:00 -
[292] - Quote
Mithfindel wrote:Issler Dainze wrote:- CCP did not ADD resources to EVE, they cut resources overall. This wasn't a "we will move 80% of our vampire wranglers to deliver WiS for example, or teach them how to makes FiS stuff". This is we are chopping up decks on our steamship to throw into the fire to keep the pumps running. Adding resources to a late project will make it more late. As in, beyond a certain level, overhead will eat all gains of additional manpower. Specially if the frameworks differ (hopefully not much due to CARBON, though) since a dev teaching new people on how things work is a dev not working on the project. I understand that CCP will be after these layoffs about as large as they were around the launch of Apocrypha and the development of Dominion. With possibly some extra load put by getting DUST out. My condolences to everyone who lost their jobs today. Hopefully you can find new work soon. As for the rest, hopefully in the reorganization CCP can shorten the lines between Management and People Who Do Actual Work as well as Management and the community. Playing broken telephone belongs to somewhere else than game industry.
I manage software projects for a living and have for 33 years. So I get the whole "mythical man month" concept of adding folks to a project not making it come together any sooner. That said, the vampire folks would be totally up to speed on the technology that was promised to devliver WiS. If CCP was serious about ever delivering that they could have moved folks to that effort. This is more proof we will never see WiS. That CCP has abandoned it. I am sure the art pipeline for Eve and WoD is similar enough the the art assets would also directly improve the ability to deliver FiS content, especially since we have been told things like POS improvements are blocked by the ability to deliver the art.
Also CCP let several folks directly related to Eve go, including some community devs. This is not a refocus on Eve, this is a "we are going down, we are out of ballast so we need to throw some crew out of the dirrigible to survive!" moment. And oh, "don't touch our favorite part of our anvil collection! That stays in the blimp!"
To the folks that lost your jobs, I wish you the best of luck, I've already seen at least one post where a potential employer solicited resumes. Hang in there and hopefully soon you'll be back at delivering stuff to entertain and ammuse us, even if it isn't in the Eve 'verse.
Issler |
ArmyOfMe
TEDDYBEARS. Excuses.
30
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Posted - 2011.10.19 20:14:00 -
[293] - Quote
Verone wrote: I'm astonished at some of the names that have come up that are being released from the Company.
It's a real shock, because most of these names have been people who've lived, breathed and slept Eve for over half a decade and have always had Eve's core values in their hearts and the best for Eve and CCP at the forefront of their minds.
While downsizing a little is good, whoever decided who was to go, needs a serious reality check.
This is an immense mistake, CCP. In the long run it's probably a bigger mistake than the early release of Incarna.
Have to agree with you on this one. Some of those people have been the symbol of the real ccp dev for years
CCP, for the love of god boost the deimos..... |
Magnus Orin
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
39
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Posted - 2011.10.19 20:17:00 -
[294] - Quote
Gilentajsa wrote:I hope all you FiS crybabys are happy now, you've lost real people their jobs, you know, real people with parents and children and siblings. People with bills to pay and mouths to feed and you weren't content to let things move forward, you just had to whine and cry until you forced CCP's hand.
Sad thing is I'm betting most of you don't even really care, you're just offering your condolences for show.
I am a social democrat. I believe everyone should be paid a fair wage, and enjoy job security.
But I don't pay CCP (3 accounts) to subsidize someone else's life. I pay my taxes to do that.
I pay CCP to enjoy a video game about flying space ships in space.
If CCP stops providing me enjoyment for my money, I stop giving them my money.
Fuck off with your bullshit about me costing real people real jobs because I cancelled 2 of my 3 accounts. |
DJ Xaphod
Eve Radio Corporation
1
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Posted - 2011.10.19 20:17:00 -
[295] - Quote
I don't understand how laying off people who are in the EVE community team* is sharpening your focus on EVE. If that truly were your goal then you would not be laying off anyone who is working on either EVE or Dust 514 and would only be laying off WoD related staff.
How is laying off extremely well respected EVE community staff members working towards your stated goal, which is to "enrich the vast EVE Universe by strengthening the continuous development of EVE Online"?
So basically CCP, I don't believe that your motives behind your laying off of staff are what you claim they are, and in the face of the evidence I have strong doubts that this will represent a focus on the EVE Universe.
I would strongly recommend a public statement explaining why when claiming you are "strengthening the continuous development of EVE Online" you have actively reduced the size of the EVE Online team. I would also recommend stating clearly why trusted and respected community staff members are part of the layoffs when doing so is so heavily contrary to the statments within CCP Hellmar's letter:
Quote:Red flags raised by very smart people both at CCP and in the community went unheeded because of my stubborn refusal to allow adversity to gain purchase on our plans. Mistakes, even when they were acknowledged, often went unanalyzed, leaving the door open for them to be repeated. Surely laying off possibly the most active and trusted member of the community team will lead to more such mistakes?
Quote:Part of what led us down this path is the fact we have not communicated well. And laying off members of the community team will help with that? I struggle to see how. |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
93
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:19:00 -
[296] - Quote
PAY TO WIN is coming still, via Dust :)
But please continue spinning your ships as a visual distraction :)
STAY THE COURSE!
Stop pumping NEW money into Eve, use the OLD money. |
Flamewave
Crimson Moon Society
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:21:00 -
[297] - Quote
Quote:Developing EVE expansions, DUST 514 and World of Darkness has stretched our resources too thin. You didn't stretch your resources thin. You stretched your money thin. There's a difference. I can't see how a 20% reduction in staff - your actual resource for development - will improve the rate of development on any of your projects, seeing how $50 bills can't code spaceship games. Reallocating those developers to work on Eve content could, in theory.
Quote:This will enable us to accelerate timeframes for new features and increase our ability to respond to community needs. Not only will this "acceleration" be marginal at best, but you'll be able to respond to our community needs by laying off community reps, especially ones who actually had dedication to the community and were there with us even when the rest of CCP had their fingers in their ears, shouting, "LALALA CAN'T HEAR YOU 18 MONTHS DEAL WITH IT HTFU." Makes sense to me. Oh, wait, no it doesn't.
You're bailing water out of a sinking ship, CCP, but the reason it's sinking is your lack of preventative maintenance to begin with. Anyone who thinks the players are to blame is a fool; this would have happened eventually. Some things ISK can't buy. For everything else, there's Jita. |
Barakkus
851
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:22:00 -
[298] - Quote
Miilla wrote:PLAY TO WIN is coming still, via Dust :)
But please continue spinning your ships as a visual distraction :)
STAY THE COURSE!
Stop pumping NEW money into Eve, use the OLD money..
I always play to win, sorry if you play to lose all the time.
...damn you for editing before I quoted..., |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
93
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:23:00 -
[299] - Quote
20% of overweight overpaid people fired.
My pet rock's heart is bleeding.
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Myxx
Atropos Group
84
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:24:00 -
[300] - Quote
WTF CCP. You got rid of people that worked on EVE while refocusing on EVE?
WTF!
Hammerhead, Wrangler, Fallout, Zymurgist and Gnauton to name a few.
WTF! |
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