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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 4 post(s) |
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CCP Manifest
C C P C C P Alliance
120
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Posted - 2011.10.19 13:24:00 -
[1] - Quote
Today it was my solemn duty to post an announcement from CCP. You can read that announcement here.
Please keep your discussion of the announcement to this thread if possible, and understand that this and the days in the future are going to be very difficult for those at CCP. We stand behind our decisions and trust that it will ultimately bring you, the EVE community, a better game. ======== o7 CCP Manifest | Public Relations and Social Media | @ccp_manifest |
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Citizen Smif
Incursion Runners inc.
9
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Posted - 2011.10.19 13:25:00 -
[2] - Quote
"Here" link not working |
DeBingJos
T.R.I.A.D
110
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Posted - 2011.10.19 13:25:00 -
[3] - Quote
CCP Manifest wrote:Today it was my solemn duty to post an announcement from CCP. You can read that announcement here.
Please keep your discussion of the announcement to this thread if possible, and understand that this and the days in the future are going to be very difficult for those at CCP. We stand behind our decisions and trust that it will ultimately bring you, the EVE community, a better game.
No content? Troll???
Edit: After reading the link in the updated post, I wish everybody at CCP the best. Your management should have seen this comming, but still, unemployment is the last thing I wish for anyone. Fix FW ! |
BoneEater
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
5
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Posted - 2011.10.19 13:25:00 -
[4] - Quote
Broken Link. |
Rodj Blake
PIE Inc.
319
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Posted - 2011.10.19 13:26:00 -
[5] - Quote
Reporting thread for lack of content... Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori. |
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CCP Manifest
C C P C C P Alliance
120
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Posted - 2011.10.19 13:28:00 -
[6] - Quote
The link should now be working
======== o7 CCP Manifest | Public Relations and Social Media | @ccp_manifest |
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Youwai
State War Academy Caldari State
1
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Posted - 2011.10.19 13:29:00 -
[7] - Quote
WoD and Dust development stopped?
/cumfirmed |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
645
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 13:31:00 -
[8] - Quote
CCP Manifest wrote:Today it was my solemn duty to post an announcement from CCP. You can read that announcement here. Please keep your discussion of the announcement to this thread if possible, and understand that this and the days in the future are going to be very difficult for those at CCP. We stand behind our decisions and trust that it will ultimately bring you, the EVE community, a better game.
My sympathies to the staff you are losing in Atlanta. However, I believe that you have taken the right decision for the longer term. Hard choices are best made before they get even harder. Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
BoneEater
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
5
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 13:32:00 -
[9] - Quote
I didnt see this coming at all |
Alexzandros
Black Aces Against ALL Authorities
0
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Posted - 2011.10.19 13:33:00 -
[10] - Quote
Youwai wrote:WoD and Dust development stopped?
/cumfirmed
wrong answer... Dust 514 moves forward... WoD moves forward with a smaller staff.
Good move CCP, focus on the game that made your company!
My condolences to those who are receiving pink slips as part of this. |
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Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
31
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Posted - 2011.10.19 13:33:00 -
[11] - Quote
HOLY MOTHER OF GOD!!
They are pushing WoD into the backburner, wil be firing people hired for WoD and refocusing the remaining teams on EVE and Dust 514.
Somebody pinch me.
I should had never left X3: Reunion |
Sarmatiko
113
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Posted - 2011.10.19 13:34:00 -
[12] - Quote
Youwai wrote:WoD and Dust development stopped? /cumfirmed WoD is still in pre-production stage so you cant even call it "stopped". Well I hope someday at leas my children will play WoD because I will be more like old fart in 2015+ Besides companies like Lizzard and Bethesda will totally ruin MMO market and genre untill that moment.
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Rodj Blake
PIE Inc.
319
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 13:34:00 -
[13] - Quote
My sympathies go out to those affected by the job losses - I hope that you all get things sorted out quickly. Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori. |
Jashmyne
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
15
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Posted - 2011.10.19 13:35:00 -
[14] - Quote
The reasons are valid I think. A bit sad that it will take WoD even longer to get out but atleast it will still get worked on and that's much better then it being cancelled. And sad to hear about the people being fired. Hopefully they will be picked up by another studio. |
Youwai
State War Academy Caldari State
1
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Posted - 2011.10.19 13:35:00 -
[15] - Quote
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:HOLY MOTHER OF GOD!! They are pushing WoD into the backburner, wil be firing people hired for WoD and refocusing the remaining teams on EVE and Dust 514. Somebody pinch me.
Best decission ever.
But Dust and WoD are failures from the beginning anyway, so just stop the crap. |
Alaura Aquila
Caldari Elite Force Apocalypse Now.
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 13:43:00 -
[16] - Quote
Hope you guys get things worked out. I know it's a tough time, but me and my three accounts will do the best they can :) |
Sir HappyPants
Phantom Squad Atlas.
22
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Posted - 2011.10.19 13:45:00 -
[17] - Quote
Here's hoping that any and all employment challenged CCPers find a job quickly and without too much hardship on themselves and their family.
Good luck.
::raises a pint:: Member of the #TweetFleet@thisurlnotfound |
Raquel Smith
Freedom-Technologies The Jagged Alliance
12
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Posted - 2011.10.19 13:46:00 -
[18] - Quote
Condolences to the folks getting sacked. Best of luck to you guys. I hope CCP hires you back once things get better. |
Asuri Kinnes
Adhocracy Incorporated Adhocracy
12
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Posted - 2011.10.19 13:46:00 -
[19] - Quote
I'm waiting on the winter expansion to re-sub my other two accounts, but to me, this is good news/bad news.
Good news for Eve, bad news for those affected. I wish *all* CCP employees the best.
No matter how grumpy I've been.
Wormholes: The *NEW* end game of Eve - Online: No Local. No Lag. No Blues (No Intell Channesl). No Blobs.
NEW FEATURE: NO INCARNA! |
Brunaburh
Aurora Security Transstellar Operations
8
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 13:51:00 -
[20] - Quote
I hope that the people losing their jobs in this difficult economic climate are able to rebound quickly.
Although as an EVE player I am happy to see CCP focus, it is still a difficult thing to see people lose their jobs. |
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Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
549
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 13:51:00 -
[21] - Quote
Sorry to the employees laid off from the WOD team in the states (particularly in this economic climate) but I do believe its a neccessary step and vital to ensure CCP has the resources to concentrate on and renew Eve Online as its core game. This announcement is almost more significant than the Hilmar apology to signalling a full return to priority focus on Eve Online.
Follow it up by announcing plans to ditch the NeX store and provide all In Space AND Incarna content through traditional sandbox economics rather than MT money-grubbing and I will be fully satisfied and celebrate by resubbing for a year on my account.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Two step
Aperture Harmonics K162
292
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Posted - 2011.10.19 13:51:00 -
[22] - Quote
My sympathies to the CCPers that were laid off. I have been there in the past, and it sucks. CSM 6 Alternate Delegate @two_step_eve on Twitter My Blog What does CSM 6 do? |
Jowen Datloran
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
57
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 13:56:00 -
[23] - Quote
Wise decision. It was getting pretty clear that you were streched too thin but it is of course a shame you have to lay off people.
Do not worry too much about losing subscribers; EVE was not bad at all when there where only 20000 peeps around. Mr. Science & Trade Institute, EVE Online Lorebook-á |
Jowen Datloran
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
57
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Posted - 2011.10.19 13:56:00 -
[24] - Quote
Doubble up! It's happy hour. Mr. Science & Trade Institute, EVE Online Lorebook-á |
Dors Venabily
Percone Outcasts
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 13:58:00 -
[25] - Quote
I must say I am pleased.
Something that makes sense perfectly for a management point of view. Leave the part the integrated with you money making machine which is EVE put crap that is in concept stage on the back burner and try to finish DUST / EVE integration.
Only if they would see the light and release the DUST as PC version as well [I know not going to happen].
I am still under the impression that consoles are not a good vehicle for steady games.
But good choice for the company and for EVE grats.
To the folks that worked on WOD well tough luck sorry but that happens in game industry all the time. |
IceGuerilla
Poseidon's Wingmen Out of Sight.
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 13:59:00 -
[26] - Quote
Thank you, Jita protests. I'm glad that firing torpedoes at a statue got some real people with real livelihoods fired... |
Simvastatin Montelukast
SACHEN. Mean Coalition
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:01:00 -
[27] - Quote
Excellent,
Eve online lives. |
Night Epoch
Stimulus Rote Kapelle
11
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:02:00 -
[28] - Quote
First off, I hope this thread can retain a reasonable amount of civility. These cuts mean that real people are losing their jobs, and this is not something to joke about or make light of.
I'm sure it's a very sad day at CCP, and I feel bad for that.
Of course, one's immediate reaction upon reading the article is that (1) CCP is in financial trouble and that (2) WOD is dead, but the last paragraph diligently attempts to mitigate those worries.
Nevertheless, the worries remain.
Selfishly, as an EVE player, I'm happy to hear about the re-commitment to core EVE development (for obvious reasons).
But I do seriously feel bad for those many people losing their jobs today. |
Grath Telkin
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
128
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:03:00 -
[29] - Quote
Hoping this means more expansions that felt like Apocrypha felt.
You guys should take note, as that was literally the best content you have ever added to this game, and we miss you doing things like that.
Sorry to the guys in the US that lost their jobs, I know it'll be hardest for those to find new work. |
COJOi
Snitches get stiches
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:03:00 -
[30] - Quote
I feel bad for the people that lost their jobs, but this should've happened a couple years ago. Just because you're good at one thing doesn't mean you will be at another thing. The best bet is to perfect what you're good at and the rest will take care of itself.
Stick to making eve great. You're good at that. Making fps's and vampire games.... not so much. |
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Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
549
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:04:00 -
[31] - Quote
IceGuerilla wrote:Thank you, Jita protests. I'm glad that firing torpedoes at a statue got some real people with real livelihoods fired...
Or maybe it meant that 500 eve developers kept their livelihoods because it reminded the company about its priorities and how this game came to be a success.
Having been an employee, and employer, a contractor, freelancer and general economic ronin in the wonderful world of IT I know how painful these things can be - but hardworking and talented people will get other jobs and perhaps as a result of this the dream of Eve Online will live on and begin to flourish again.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
549
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:04:00 -
[32] - Quote
*
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
549
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:05:00 -
[33] - Quote
*
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Officer Spawn
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
20
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:05:00 -
[34] - Quote
IceGuerilla wrote:Thank you, Jita protests. I'm glad that firing torpedoes at a statue got some real people with real livelihoods fired...
The outcry in all its forms saved the other 80% from a similar fate. CCP turned the ship around in time it seems, plenty of other companies have stubbornly kept throwing money into a doomed product and persished with it rather then admit failure. |
RaTTuS
BIG Gentlemen's Agreement
125
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:06:00 -
[35] - Quote
eve is good - keep it coming , do what you need for WOD heart goes out for those in the loss :(
http://eveboard.com/ub/419190933-134.png
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Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
549
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:08:00 -
[36] - Quote
holy Quadpost batman ... sorry about that
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Kelduum Revaan
EVE University Ivy League
781
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:08:00 -
[37] - Quote
My thoughts go out to those who are looking for other work, and hope you all find something soon, as well all CCP employees who are probably having a pretty uncertain time at the moment.
EVE was looking pretty shaky a few months ago, but with the recent refocussing on FiS, I'm confident things are getting better. I'm glad that DUST is still going forward - there's an incredible potential there for it to become something great. WoD has always been intriguing too, but I was a little concerned that CCP had bitten off a little too much with two projects in progress, but I will look forward to more information on that in the future. Kelduum Revaan CEO, EVE University |
Zoe Alarhun
The Proactive Reappropriation Corporation
31
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:11:00 -
[38] - Quote
Even though this sucks for the dudes who are gonna lose their jobs (been there, done that). I applaud CCP for the open way with which they deal with their community now. Thumbs up from me for the post CCP - you guys are doing it right and I hope your subscriber base doubles. |
Phil MacMannon
Fantastic Gymnastics
6
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:11:00 -
[39] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote: Sorry to the employees laid off from the WOD team in the states (particularly in this economic climate) but I do believe its a neccessary step and vital to ensure CCP has the resources to concentrate on and renew Eve Online as its core game. This announcement is almost more significant than the Hilmar apology to signalling a full return to priority focus on Eve Online.
Follow it up by announcing plans to ditch the NeX store and provide all In Space AND Incarna content through traditional sandbox economics rather than MT money-grubbing and I will be fully satisfied and celebrate by resubbing for a year on my account.
This.
As long as the sandbox is fully restored i will seriously consider keeping my 10 accounts running come pay-time in january. Nothing less will do for me, and i suspect, nothing less will do for a great many others.
|
Benilopax
The Ashen Lion Syndicate
9
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:12:00 -
[40] - Quote
When I joined the Jita protests and all, I never expected it to indirectly lead to job cuts at CCP, maybe I should. As someone who has been unemployed in the past, I feel for those about to lose their jobs.
However, the refocus on EVE is a good step, and we must hope now that CCP can get players back to their primary game and save the company. |
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Rodj Blake
PIE Inc.
321
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:13:00 -
[41] - Quote
It seems to me that the decision has nothing to do with Eve.
Rather, WoD development has been cut because they couldn't get it to work properly. Remember - it uses the same engine as Eve's WiS feature which is a horrible resource hog even with just one player. Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori. |
Jack Paladin
StarFleet Enterprises BricK sQuAD.
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:14:00 -
[42] - Quote
The needs of the many outway the needs of the few.
Jobs are lost now but the long term benefits to CCP could see many more jobs created in the future ..... if they play their cards right.
Time will tell. |
Lipbite
Express Hauler
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:14:00 -
[43] - Quote
I don't get it how cutting 20% of company may change "soon" attitude of CCP developers.
Example: there are tons of clothing available within the game engine right now (try to link items in chat to word "shirt") but 3 months after Incarna deployment they are still hidden. What are you waiting for? Bankruptcy? |
Anvil44
Independent Traders and Builders MPA
16
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:18:00 -
[44] - Quote
Most Importantly: Good luck to all those that will be leaving CCP. This type of journey is never easy. I sincerely hope that at some point in the future you can look back and say "I wish it hadn't happened but on the flip side, I am happy with what I am doing now."
Glad to hear of the continuing refocus to make Eve work better. When it is both improving and evolving, then I am confident you will have 90-98% of your customer base happy. Maybe not with every single change, but with most of them. I still look forward to WIS someday, but only when I know that FIS is continuing to be awesome and continually being refined and developed. |
Dalton Vanadis
Miranda United F0RCEFUL ENTRY
409
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:19:00 -
[45] - Quote
Hey CCP'ers, like many other players, I wish you all the best in your future endeavors. I think all of us hate to see the company that makes such great games as EVE lose out on something. And losing talented people is the biggest loss of all.
It's a day where Hilmar and the rest of the CCP leadership team have truly spoken with their actions and not their words. I don't think many EVE players realized the gravity of what that call would mean. I can only hope that this refocusing will allow CCP to come back fighting on WoD in a year or two without compromising EVE and Dust.
It's a happy day for the future of EVE and a sad day for many of those who care about CCP. |
Mekhana
Spiritus Draconis
202
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:19:00 -
[46] - Quote
Smart move. Now with new priorities we'll be having more content added to the game. So much effort could've been spent on improving on EVE instead it's not even funny. Don't get me wrong, I will play WoD at launch I'm a huge VtM fan since I was a teenager but I can't play something that is not released yet.
Sadly my relief and good hopes for the future are someone's else misfortune but I would have done the same. The customer must always be top priority in a business or soon the business will find itself without any customers at all. |
Morganta
Peripheral Madness The Midget Mafia
94
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:20:00 -
[47] - Quote
Welp...
As a person I feel bad for those getting cut. As an eve player I'm glad focus will be returning where it belongs
as an American I'm somewhat disappointed with the statement that workers in Atlanta will feel the biggest cuts while CCP plans on "redeploying" personnel to this location for launch.
yeah, that kind of rubs me wrong...
Am I reading correctly that American CCP employees will be the bulk of the cuts and that they will be replaced by an icelandic team in Atlanta?
I'm trying to be understanding here, but WTF?
PS WHY TEH FORUMS LAGGING SO BAD? DID YOU FIRE THE HAMPSTERS TOO???? The American public's reaction to the change was poor and the new cola was a major marketing failure. The subsequent reintroduction of Coke's original formula, re-branded as "Coca-Cola Classic", resulted in a significant gain in sales, leading to speculation that the introduction of the New Coke formula was just a marketing ploy |
Aqriue
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
11
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:21:00 -
[48] - Quote
/me point HAHAH! /melvin
Nerf This, Buff That, Fix it, I am quitting! And CCP has a change of heart...from dead space cold to sub artic...since Hilmar game back from the darkside of the force but walks a gray area. 20% of CCP is getting fired cause you were not happy; Subs drops, CCP makes changes, Subs increase slightly, CCP staff drops. No one ever wins, everyone ends up being loosers. WoD might of been a bad choice for CCP to expand on cause Goth/Emo/Tweeny vampire genre is more niche then sci-fi, but it still sucks to be fired and we all had a helping hand it it. |
Mallak Azaria
Three 6 MaFiA Dark Phoenix Rising.
7
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:21:00 -
[49] - Quote
My condolences to the staff that are getting the sack.
This leads me to ask CCP an important question. Are you doing this to actually refocus, or are you just using this as an excuse to increase your profit margin? |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:21:00 -
[50] - Quote
GL to those who lost jobs, and more importantly, thanks for working for giving us EVE. Wish you could continue.
EDITed to add: Oh, and GL to CCP too in continuing the same. :) |
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Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
28
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:23:00 -
[51] - Quote
In many cases such as this, where upper management made hugely expensive strategic errors, said management is replaced. Other times, they get to continue and run a company into the ground.
Not that CCP will discuss internal stuff like this openly, but I am wondering who, if any, CCP management are being walked out the door. |
DaDutchDude
Agony Unleashed Agony Empire
11
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:24:00 -
[52] - Quote
Wow ... this is so brutally honest and direct and correct and a lot of more stuff, it really fills me with a mix of emotions.
Where other statements could have been dismissed as PR, this clearly and undeniably indicates CCP 'got it' ... at the same time, I think it also forces us, the players, to realize we actually effect people's livelihood with our subscriptions, and we shouldn't take that lightly either. After all, the RL side of Internet spaceships really is serious business.
I'm sorry to the people who will loose their job over this, and hope they land on their feet. Of all the harsh words uttered by many EVE players, I don't think any of them were actually trying to personally hurt you, and seeing you personally being effected this way is (and should be) quite sobering to many of us.
|
Aineko Macx
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
9
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:24:00 -
[53] - Quote
I am Jacks complete lack of surprise. And it didn't have to be this way, like Hilmar finally noticed, there were plenty of warnings from all sides. I can't claim to be free of Schadenfreude for stubbornness and arrogance finally reaping the results. Too bad once more the little guy is punished by being fired for mistakes not committed by him.
Ofc the big question remaining is whether CCP will be able to reverse the negative trend in customer satisfaction and resulting declining subscriber numbers or not. |
Grey Stormshadow
Starwreck Industries
295
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:25:00 -
[54] - Quote
Sad news and good news in same package are always hard to comment anything on... This is great day for EvE, good day for Dust and miserable day for the employees who need to head towards new challenges.
I believe that there is always work for diligent and smart individuals, so for those who need to go - don't lose your faith. Believe in yourselves and turn the next page in your life without worrying about the past too much. Who knows what goodies new tomorrow has prepared for you. I wish you coping and luck with future plans.
These decisions are never easy, but unfortunately they are sometimes inevitable.
|
Jamie Banks
Quantum Horizons
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:28:00 -
[55] - Quote
Mallak Azaria wrote:My condolences to the staff that are getting the sack.
This leads me to ask CCP an important question. Are you doing this to actually refocus, or are you just using this as an excuse to increase your profit margin?
CCP is a company with a bottom line, of course it is to increase their profit margin, it is just now they realize how important that EVE was to their bottom line and losing this many subscribers was in fact not the best financial nor moral decision they have made. |
Benilopax
The Ashen Lion Syndicate
9
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:28:00 -
[56] - Quote
Mallak Azaria wrote:My condolences to the staff that are getting the sack.
This leads me to ask CCP an important question. Are you doing this to actually refocus, or are you just using this as an excuse to increase your profit margin?
More likely to stop them going under, finances at CCP aren't great at the moment. |
Letrange
Red Horizon Inc
23
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:31:00 -
[57] - Quote
Morganta wrote: as an American I'm somewhat disappointed with the statement that workers in Atlanta will feel the biggest cuts while CCP plans on "redeploying" personnel to this location for launch.
yeah, that kind of rubs me wrong...
Am I reading correctly that American CCP employees will be the bulk of the cuts and that they will be replaced by an icelandic team in Atlanta?
Um, hello, all that bitching and un-subbing is the cause of the cuts - and lets face it with DUST having an EVE link an d being further along, it was inevitable that it would be the one to be less affected. The vampires were much less further along and too far in the future, so it was inevitable that they would see the most reduction. The fact that WW is in Atlanta and that most of the WoD development team was there as well means that yes they'll be seeing most of the cuts. And no they are not being replaced by icelanders moving to Atlanta (insert appropriate snide comment regarding typical american wold views here). What that meant was that some of the Atlanta crew will be re-tasked to work on EVE stuff instead of WoD stuff instead of also loosing their jobs.
Please put some of your SP into reading comprehension. |
Aryndel Vyst
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
112
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:31:00 -
[58] - Quote
Does this mean we're going to see new faces at Occupy Wall Street? |
Aidan Brooder
Dynasphere Ltd.
61
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:32:00 -
[59] - Quote
All my best wishes to those who will lose their jobs and also to the CCP staff as a whole, who will now have to live with this terrible uncertainty.
I will not even cheer as an EVE player. EVE has always been a great game and the future will show if it will become an even better one. |
Ciar Meara
Virtus Vindice
168
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:35:00 -
[60] - Quote
Good news for us, not so good for those who are leaving. But like so many others said allready, this doesn't come as a surprise. The (very) good result of this is that EVE and DUST development will be proceding at a much faster pace as before.
And frankly it shows that CCP can make the hard decisions that where needed after the hubris filled speeches of earlier.
Humble and courageous decisions like this are making me want to resub. I hope many of the Atlanta team can be re tasked to Dust and all the art teams can acclimatise to the frigid Reykjavik climate.
Will this mean that Reynir and TomB (or is he back allready) will return to EVE? - [img]http://go-dl1.eve-files.com/media/corp/janus/ceosig.jpg[/img] [yellow]English only please. Zymurgist[/yellow] |
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ACY GTMI
Veerhouven Group The Veerhouven Group
17
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:36:00 -
[61] - Quote
I remember the quote about gamers being more attracted to flawed games with cool features rather than games that work predictably and only deploy new features when they have been fully developed and tested.
It appears that you still believe this. Oh well.
My suggestion? Forget the Winter expansion and fix the problems that the last few updates have caused. |
Jonas Glim
Alien Ship Builders Caedite Eos
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:37:00 -
[62] - Quote
My sympathys go out to those losing their jobs, it's a great shame that the man largely responsible for causing this "refocusing" won't be doing the honourable thing and resigning. |
Jada Maroo
Mysterium Astrometrics BRABODEN
280
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:37:00 -
[63] - Quote
Unexpectedly great news on the future of Eve by CCP. But it's hard to celebrate when people lose jobs. When Eve's success grows from the renewed focus, maybe you can rehire them - to work on Eve. |
Riflin' Betty
Perfunctory
17
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:41:00 -
[64] - Quote
I think CCP just learned the hard way what the price of disrespecting your customers can be.
I'd have wished for all of you guys to have come to your sense on your own, but your overwhelming arrogance in the face of dedicated customers blinded you to the obvious.
We are not your cash cow.
We will do what we do rather than say.
And we will not be used.
I hope this lesson learned in the most painful way, will carry you on to better future as a more healthy company. Though you have a long way to go still. Let's just hope it's for the best, and that you didn't slice your own bellies with the sword of customer contempt.
-Helicity Boson. |
Jada Maroo
Mysterium Astrometrics BRABODEN
280
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:43:00 -
[65] - Quote
By the way, I still can't shake the nibbling notion that the Incarna establishments delay and WoD's indefinite postponement has a lot to do with Carbon running like a snail's turd when there's five other characters in the room - let alone dozens or hundreds. |
Jolteon Taylor
The Scope Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:43:00 -
[66] - Quote
Great news for EVEs future, although such a shame it had to happen like this.
I do hope CCP_FallOut gets to keep her job. I do enjoy following her tweets \o/ |
Jimtom
Council Of Internal War The Paganism Alliance
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:44:00 -
[67] - Quote
Sad news about job loses hope all who are affected find employment speedily, CCPers are the greatest |
Barakkus
848
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:45:00 -
[68] - Quote
Sir HappyPants wrote:Here's hoping that any and all employment challenged CCPers find a job quickly and without too much hardship on themselves and their family.
Good luck.
::raises a pint::
It won't take too much effort to find SOMETHING, only problem is most programming jobs out there are contract only right now. I've been looking and the only crap I get is calls from recruiters looking for people for contract work. Fortunately, I have seniority and job security at the place I work now, so I can sit back and wait until I find a permanent full time position.
I would venture a guess those laid off with programming skills will probably find work within a few weeks, even though it's probably going to be temporary work. |
Whyumadtho
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:45:00 -
[69] - Quote
Quote:This will enable us to accelerate timeframes for new features and increase our ability to respond to community needs.
Explain to me how cutting 20% of your staff will accelerate anything. |
Sir HappyPants
Phantom Squad Atlas.
25
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:45:00 -
[70] - Quote
Jolteon Taylor wrote:Great news for EVEs future, although such a shame it had to happen like this.
I do hope CCP_FallOut gets to keep his job. I do enjoy following his tweets \o/
pssst... Fallout is of the female stock. Member of the #TweetFleet@thisurlnotfound |
|
Jolteon Taylor
The Scope Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:47:00 -
[71] - Quote
Sir HappyPants wrote:Jolteon Taylor wrote:Great news for EVEs future, although such a shame it had to happen like this.
I do hope CCP_FallOut gets to keep his job. I do enjoy following his tweets \o/ pssst... Fallout is of the female stock. oh twitsticks, I failed. I had noticed that, but for some reason i by impulse typed 'his' D:
but I fixed it now :D |
Mors Magne
Astral Adventure
4
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:47:00 -
[72] - Quote
I think CCP has made the right decision. My heart goes out to those who will lose their jobs though. |
Smoking Blunts
Zebra Corp BricK sQuAD.
109
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:48:00 -
[73] - Quote
oh well shouldnt have ****** off so many players by putting your heads up yours arses hoping your own ill found reasons were right, even though they were pointed out to you as wrong time and time again.
explains the change in gm stance on war dec's at least, less staff = less time for customer service
CCP-áare full of words and no action. We watch what they do and its nothing but false statements and lies.
|
Kabaos
Capital Group Shadow of xXDEATHXx
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:50:00 -
[74] - Quote
OMG u really stupid's?
When to you say it's hard to do everything at once (Dust ,WOD ) you continue to develop the project..
You need to concentrate your work on Dust ..When dust will completed after that start WOD..
You haven't enough money to support Dust,EVE and fuc..ng WOD |
Chris Stormrider
IDEON ANDRON HELL4S
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:50:00 -
[75] - Quote
Whyumadtho wrote:Explain to me how cutting 20% of your staff will accelerate anything.
^^ this
Also, to all the people saying they understand, it may be that the refocus to EVE and Fis is good but the ends do not justify the means. I'm still not convinced they know what they're doing...
|
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
646
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:54:00 -
[76] - Quote
ACY GTMI wrote:I remember the quote about gamers being more attracted to flawed games with cool features rather than games that work predictably and only deploy new features when they have been fully developed and tested.
It appears that you still believe this. Oh well.
My suggestion? Forget the Winter expansion and fix the problems that the last few updates have caused.
Er, the Winter expansion is exactly about fixing problems. Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Bloodpetal
Mimidae Risk Solutions
102
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:54:00 -
[77] - Quote
Tough decisions and consequences.
EVE isn't a "Golden Goose". We're players, consumers and people. At the end of the day, this comes back to decisions made months and months ago.
I was really excited to see what would happen in WOD after the news article written up. It sounded freaking awesome for an MMO. I hope this doesn't get pushed back too far - and I hope DUST's knock out success will find CCP looking to re-establish getting WOD out there sooner than later and maybe getting some of those great designers back on deck.
I wish CCP the best on getting these next projects successfully launched and back on track for everyone.
NOSTRO AURUM NON EST AURUM VULGI |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
646
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:55:00 -
[78] - Quote
Whyumadtho wrote:Quote:This will enable us to accelerate timeframes for new features and increase our ability to respond to community needs. Explain to me how cutting 20% of your staff will accelerate anything.
Because some of the 80% who remain are being re-purposed from WoD to EVE
(reading is hard :( ) Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Barakkus
848
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:57:00 -
[79] - Quote
Chris Stormrider wrote:Whyumadtho wrote:Explain to me how cutting 20% of your staff will accelerate anything. ^^ this Also, to all the people saying they understand, it may be that the refocus to EVE and Fis is good but the ends do not justify the means. I'm still not convinced they know what they're doing...
It's called "we don't have enough money to pay everyone anymore"
We got the exact same speech at work last February when a number of our largest clients walked. Everyone had to take a "temporary" 10% pay cut and they laid off 20 people. Now we're "refocusing" on our core business as opposed to all the stupid little development projects that had nothing to do with our main business products. They realized they ****** up for the most part and let all the wrong people make all the decisions about the direction of the company and ****** the rest of us.
Unfortunately, now most of the people that can really do anything to pull us out of the mess are finding new jobs, myself included...hopefully it won't take me much longer to find another permanent position elsewhere. Having 10+ years experience in windows application programming is getting me lots of calls, unfortunately it's all contract work at the moment... |
Kabaos
Capital Group Shadow of xXDEATHXx
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:57:00 -
[80] - Quote
CCP want's more money ..
"A Jack of all trades is master of none" |
|
Lady Vici
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 14:59:00 -
[81] - Quote
well at the end its a statement that trys to avoid to say "we are running out of money". It was no secret that the balance was not really well and cutting down the non positiv parts is the first way during a restructuring. According to the statement WoD is bs and only a time and money sink (well they say - what every developer would say of his "babies" - its to early to understand...) On the other side they also say that the impact of loosing subscribers is much higher than expected and they fear to loose even more when they not focus on EvE. Looks like they finally found out that EvE is a nice project but needs continuos REAL development to keep people attracted - especially in the state the universe is actually. And finally they state that DUST is nice but also still far away of earning money but they cannot get rid of it because of their contract to Sony....
Well lets see if CCP can manage to restructure the company and get on the winning track again. I hope it because I like EvE :)
Just a tiny 4 account subscriber |
Chevalleis
The Legendary Conquest THE D0MINION
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:00:00 -
[82] - Quote
Or you could just drop WoD and make everyone happy. But that's not an option, is it? Also, if you fire Dropbear, I will unsub. |
Raivi
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
14
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:00:00 -
[83] - Quote
If done right this refocusing is going to be the best thing for CCP in the long run, but it sucks for those staff getting laid off. Hopefully as many talented people as possible can be moved from WoD predevelopment to eve content.
My prayers and best wishes are with the people who will be laid off. |
ACY GTMI
Veerhouven Group The Veerhouven Group
17
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:00:00 -
[84] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:ACY GTMI wrote:I remember the quote about gamers being more attracted to flawed games with cool features rather than games that work predictably and only deploy new features when they have been fully developed and tested.
It appears that you still believe this. Oh well.
My suggestion? Forget the Winter expansion and fix the problems that the last few updates have caused. Er, the Winter expansion is exactly about fixing problems.
If it's an 'expansion', it isn't about fixing anything. It's kind of in the definition of the term.
|
Barakkus
848
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:02:00 -
[85] - Quote
Lady Vici wrote: Well lets see if CCP can manage to restructure the company and get on the winning track again. I hope it because I like EvE :)
They will, EVE is still a very viable product, I don't think EVE itself is in any danger at the moment, or CCP as a whole. |
Akiras Demon
Selective Pressure Rote Kapelle
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:02:00 -
[86] - Quote
This makes me sad for those about to lose their job. However I think its good for eve, in space content seems to be the main concern that the players look forward too. Trying to get the other games off the ground has made EVE a more solid game with the deployment of CARBON and other tweaks. So I applaud CCP for trying to improve the gaming world. |
Shaera Taam
Minmatar Death Squad Broken Chains Alliance
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:03:00 -
[87] - Quote
CCP Manifest wrote: Sadly, this means reducing our staff. We estimate that around twenty percent of global positions will be affected by this process.
i try hard not to bash CCP, preferring instead to offer constructive criticism; at the same time, i'm only a silly internet spaceship pilot posting on a game forum, so i dont expect too much in the way of a solid response, tbh...
those points aside, however...
correct me if i'm wrong, but everything seemed to be humming along nicely for CCP just prior to the CQ "misstep," when they were developing three major MMOs simultaneously. what changed? where was the money hemorrhage? or was the loss of revenue from the CQ-rage-unsubs more than CCP let on?
while i'm glad to hear that "eve is healty," i always exercise a bit of healthy skepticism when it comes to the reasons behind corporate layoffs. twenty percent is a huge slice of the office pool. please, CCP, do everything you can to get those people on other teams within eve or dust. your recently-found focus on those games could use all the help it could get, right?
/rant
my apologies... i wish nothing but the best for CCP and employees, current and outgoing.
fly safe out there.
ST |
Inficant
Serenity Smuggling
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:04:00 -
[88] - Quote
ACY GTMI wrote:If it's an 'expansion', it isn't about fixing anything. It's kind of in the definition of the term.
When you have quarterly expansions the lines for what goes in an expansion and what doesn't are blurred. Eve's expansions have always had features *and* fixes. Sometimes more of one than the other.
|
Raid'En
Apprentice Innovations
77
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:05:00 -
[89] - Quote
not really what i wanted :/ hope the guys will find a new job quickly |
Xiaodown
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:06:00 -
[90] - Quote
CCP ATL EMPLOYEES
The software shop I work for is looking for developers, and we have positions open in Atlanta (Duluth / Suwanee area), as well as Southwestern Virginia (about 5-6 hours from ATL).
We're primarily interested in .NET, Java, Python, and PHP devs. I think it's possible we may have some design positions, but not in any 3d space (no animation, motion capture, etc). We compete in the cloud industry.
Message me with inquiries; I'll make a point to check gate.eve throughout the day. |
|
Zakua Corbin
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:06:00 -
[91] - Quote
YAY we WON!!
Kidding....
Well I am stoked to read about them taking the steps and this latest bit realy puts that effort in stone from my point of view. I am however NOT happy about job loss in anyway.
Good job CCP for making the hard choice, sad it had to come to this but your ability to adapt is a strong one and a valuable asset.
Truely sad that some people whom had a job are now filled with that nasty uncertain....GL to you guys and I hope you find some kickbutt jobs =)
Fly it like you stole it! |
Svennig
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
15
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:08:00 -
[92] - Quote
Love to all those at CCP. I'm glad to see this refocus, and I'm looking forward to seeing Incarna and WoD when the time is right.
To all those who lost their jobs, I'm sorry for the hardship you may have to go through, and I wish you all the best. |
Ana Vyr
79
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:12:00 -
[93] - Quote
Sorry about the lost jobs, CCP.
It's clear that CCP wanted to exapand their horizons, and that's always something that should be aimed for in life and business, as long as it doesn't ruin what came before it. |
Nyio
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
165
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:12:00 -
[94] - Quote
It's too easy jump in here and say something witty or mean, so instead I'm gonna say that it's sad for those who will be unemployed. But on the other hand sounds like a good idea for CCP and the EVE universe. Features & Ideas Discussion: Agent Finder, Black Holes Needs a banner here.. |
Alina Wize
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
32
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:13:00 -
[95] - Quote
A very sad day indeed for CCP. As a fan of your company for many years and watching it grow I hope things will work out for the best. |
Thorn Galen
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse Sanctuary Pact
99
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:14:00 -
[96] - Quote
CCP,
It is never an easy decision to have to retrench people, I hope those directly affected find themselves new employment before their notice period is done.
Peace out.
The universe is an ancient desert, a vast wasteland with only occasional habitable planets as oases. We Fremen, comfortable with deserts, shall now venture into another. - STILGAR, From the Sietch to the Stars. |
temporary altitude
East Forge Trading Co
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:14:00 -
[97] - Quote
Quote:select positions in our Reykjavik, Iceland office will be affected
There's hoping that some of the management 'gurus' that brought the ship near a wreck situation get what they deserve, and not only poor employees!!! |
Smoking Blunts
Zebra Corp BricK sQuAD.
109
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:15:00 -
[98] - Quote
can you publish teh sub numbers now, so we can at least see how ****** you actually are? CCP-áare full of words and no action. We watch what they do and its nothing but false statements and lies.
|
Shaera Taam
Minmatar Death Squad Broken Chains Alliance
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:16:00 -
[99] - Quote
Xiaodown wrote: CCP ATL EMPLOYEES
The software shop I work for is looking for developers, and we have positions open in Atlanta (Duluth / Suwanee area), as well as Southwestern Virginia (about 5-6 hours from ATL).
We're primarily interested in .NET, Java, Python, and PHP devs. I think it's possible we may have some design positions, but not in any 3d space (no animation, motion capture, etc). We compete in the cloud industry.
now THAT is cool!
i may not be a fan of test or dreddit in-game, but this game community is awesome!
heywatiaminit!
this may sound silly, but what about a PLEX for Pinkslips?
i donate IRL to help those in need... why not in my favorite game too? |
Shadowsword
The Rough Riders Ares Protectiva
29
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:19:00 -
[100] - Quote
Those that were laid off have my sympathies, as well as those remaining in CCP that had to see friends go. Still, it makes sense when you have three big projects and not enough ressources, to put one aside in order to accelerate the gestation of the second one. Once that's done, you can restart the third with a vengeance. |
|
tinman44
Fist of Eargon The Jagged Alliance
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:21:00 -
[101] - Quote
Frown! |
Asuri Kinnes
Adhocracy Incorporated Adhocracy
15
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:21:00 -
[102] - Quote
Xiaodown wrote:~~~ CCP ATL EMPLOYEES: ~~~The software shop I work for is looking for developers, and we have positions open in Atlanta (Duluth / Suwanee area), as well as Southwestern Virginia (about 5-6 hours from ATL). We're primarily interested in .NET, Java, Python, and PHP devs. I think it's possible we may have some design positions, but not in any 3d space (no animation, motion capture, etc). We compete in the cloud industry. Message me with inquiries; I'll make a point to check gate.eve throughout the day. On second thought, I set up an email alias: [email protected] so that you don't have to use work resources to inquire about employment. Heh. Quoting the TEST guy for best post so far...
GL to all involved!
Wormholes: The *NEW* end game of Eve - Online: No Local. No Lag. No Blues (No Intell Channesl). No Blobs.
NEW FEATURE: NO INCARNA! |
Adam Reed
Seniors Clan Get Off My Lawn
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:21:00 -
[103] - Quote
Good luck to any CCP employees laid off, but a word to the wise: if you're going to make an announcement like that to the player base, try not to make it sound like you're blaming the player base, even if you are. |
Zombatar
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
5
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:26:00 -
[104] - Quote
"GREED IS GOOD!!!"
Not that good now... looks like CCP finally realized it was walking on a dream. Wake up! |
Trainwreck McGee
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
69
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:27:00 -
[105] - Quote
aww man im sad they are cutting WOD development but are keeping the clusterfuk that is going to be DUST 514. Shows that CCP hasnt really snapped out of it. CCP Trainwreck - Weekend Custodial Engineer / CCP Necrogoats foot stool |
Hakaru Ishiwara
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
28
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:29:00 -
[106] - Quote
First, and most importantly, I hope that those losing their job are treated with respect and provided with a reasonable severance package. Good luck to those folks and remember: companies are still hiring despite all of the doom and gloom in the news.
Next: CCP better address the mental well-being of its own employees after such a large layoff. ~125 people removed from an organization takes its toll on the remaining "survivors." This is critical to maintaining good morale and momentum on current projects.
Lastly, this was one of a handful of obvious moves by CCP. It was clear towards the end of the summer that CCP was having problems executing and possibly with subscription numbers. That 13-PLEX "deal" cash grab was icing on the cake. 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284286 |
mazzilliu
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:29:00 -
[107] - Quote
attn: laid off ccp people.
if you want to get an entry level network security job we are hiring and i can train you. deals mostly with malware and attacks. if you are good at it i can probably get you a job within a few months and i can get a sweet ass referral bonus. no experience needed but passion about security a must.
not joking btw. PM me.
*circles in the sky slowly above ccp's head* |
Oberine Noriepa
132
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:30:00 -
[108] - Quote
EDIT: ^ You, too!
Xiaodown wrote:~~~ CCP ATL EMPLOYEES: ~~~The software shop I work for is looking for developers, and we have positions open in Atlanta (Duluth / Suwanee area), as well as Southwestern Virginia (about 5-6 hours from ATL). We're primarily interested in .NET, Java, Python, and PHP devs. I think it's possible we may have some design positions, but not in any 3d space (no animation, motion capture, etc). We compete in the cloud industry. Message me with inquiries; I'll make a point to check gate.eve throughout the day. On second thought, I set up an email alias: [email protected] so that you don't have to use work resources to inquire about employment. Heh. You rock! |
Snape Dieboldmotor
Imperial Outlaws
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:33:00 -
[109] - Quote
I love this game (Eve online). This is the only game I play, and I will continue to play it until they turn off the lights.
I support CCP and their efforts to re-focus. My sympathies go out to those who will lose their jobs.
Sincerely, Snape
|
Asuri Kinnes
Adhocracy Incorporated Adhocracy
17
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:34:00 -
[110] - Quote
Oberine Noriepa wrote:EDIT: ^ You, too! Xiaodown wrote:~~~ CCP ATL EMPLOYEES: ~~~The software shop I work for is looking for developers, and we have positions open in Atlanta (Duluth / Suwanee area), as well as Southwestern Virginia (about 5-6 hours from ATL). We're primarily interested in .NET, Java, Python, and PHP devs. I think it's possible we may have some design positions, but not in any 3d space (no animation, motion capture, etc). We compete in the cloud industry. Message me with inquiries; I'll make a point to check gate.eve throughout the day. On second thought, I set up an email alias: [email protected] so that you don't have to use work resources to inquire about employment. Heh. You rock! heheheheh...
keep posting this, keep it on top. :)
Wormholes: The *NEW* end game of Eve - Online: No Local. No Lag. No Blues (No Intell Channesl). No Blobs.
NEW FEATURE: NO INCARNA! |
|
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
647
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:35:00 -
[111] - Quote
ACY GTMI wrote:Malcanis wrote:ACY GTMI wrote:I remember the quote about gamers being more attracted to flawed games with cool features rather than games that work predictably and only deploy new features when they have been fully developed and tested.
It appears that you still believe this. Oh well.
My suggestion? Forget the Winter expansion and fix the problems that the last few updates have caused. Er, the Winter expansion is exactly about fixing problems. If it's an 'expansion', it isn't about fixing anything. It's kind of in the definition of the term.
OK, the Winter "expansion" is exactly about fixing problems.
I don't care what they call it as long as those problems are fixed. Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Legendary Teeth
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:36:00 -
[112] - Quote
CCP, I just want to say that I appreciate the honesty and willingness to not only admit your mistakes but work to correct them. Makes me feel a lot better about subscribing when you will listen to your players and publically change your course to give us what we want. |
Bagehi
Association of Commonwealth Enterprises Important Internet Spaceship League
10
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:37:00 -
[113] - Quote
Though I am looking forward to WoD and Dust, I'm glad to see CCP focusing their efforts. I'm especially happy to see CCP no longer killing their golden goose, as I'm particularly fond of it. Layoffs are always unpleasant and I wish all those involved (from management, to those losing jobs, to those having increased work load) the best. |
ArmyOfMe
TEDDYBEARS. Excuses.
30
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:38:00 -
[114] - Quote
Good move
CCP, for the love of god boost the deimos..... |
Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous
202
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:40:00 -
[115] - Quote
I just wanted to take a moment like other have done, to send my sympathy and regards to those who are being laid off as a result of these changes. I'm also sorry that other players have reacted to this with more gross disrespect - "Is this a troll?" "lack of content" and other shameful comments. There's a time to be silly, and a time to be mature.
I think we all agree EvE is a game, and its here for everyone to have fun with, and there's a certain amount of flaming back and forth that's normal for forum banter. But when something solemn like this that will no doubt impact the lives of many people, and bring hardship for their families, I think the EvE community could do itself a favor and respond with some grace and recognition that THIS is the serious bizness, not the spaceships themselves.
Much of the "WoD sux, can it" feedback is rooted in nothing more than simple nerd bigotry, where spaceship > vampires>orcs in some kind or arbitrary coolness scale. Same with Dust 514, where the PC nerds seem to think they are somehow superior over gamers who enjoy shooting each other in the face on consoles. Its all the same to me in the end, whether you enjoy playing a starship captain, or playing a sexy vampire.
I hope CCP hears and understands that there are many of us who still believe strongly in the company, its vision, and its commitment to developing experimental games, and embracing the risk of failure. It takes balls to go against the grain, and try something new, especially with a rabid fan base ready to rip you in pieces if you don't deliver exactly what they demand or expect. You have earned my respect BECAUSE you fail sometimes, instead of delivering "safe bets" that compete on the market but do nothing to push the boundaries of what is possible in a gaming world.
Remember CCP - you are a team of creative artists and designers, not just a company. And just as any talented artist, architect, or musician succeeds the most when they pursue their own gut instinct over popular opinion, I encourage you to stick to your long-term vision as well. You've earned the right to develop other projects, pursue new ideas, and deliver content on more platforms, even if its not as economically viable during these hard times. Dont let us, the EvE community, put you in a corner. Gamers of EVERY variety will be well served by the ideas, concepts, and technologies CCP has envisioned and produced, and I look forward to the days ahead.
|
Caellach Marellus
Nephtys Ventures inc
86
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:41:00 -
[116] - Quote
Good luck to those who are finding themselves in an unenviable position at this moment in time, I hope your passion for the gaming industry remains strong and your talents get you noticed and picked up elsewhere quickly. Thank you all for your contributions to my gaming experience.
On a positive note, I'm glad CCP is taking a more focused direction in the future, while I wish this could have come about without members of staff losing their jobs, the fact that the company is willing to make tough decisions to improve the quality of it's product is assuring as a customer. |
Herping yourDerp
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
168
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:42:00 -
[117] - Quote
i thought the shanghi location worked on WOD
also just make those people you are going to fire work on different eve stuff if possible... i mean, what if..... just maybe.... 3 expansions per year? |
St Mio
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
112
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:43:00 -
[118] - Quote
Good luck and best wishes to all the CCP people affected o/ |
SHAMESHAME
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:43:00 -
[119] - Quote
To each and every person who whined their way through the last few months, congratulations. You got your pixels, database entries and pretend warfare. Real people lost jobs. There was nothing so wrong with the game that it should have meant taking real food off the real tables of real people. It is my sincere hope that you too find yourself in the unemployment line. |
Xiaodown
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
14
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:45:00 -
[120] - Quote
Oberine Noriepa wrote:EDIT: ^ You, too! Xiaodown wrote:~~~ CCP ATL EMPLOYEES: ~~~The software shop I work for is looking for developers, and we have positions open in Atlanta (Duluth / Suwanee area), as well as Southwestern Virginia (about 5-6 hours from ATL). We're primarily interested in .NET, Java, Python, and PHP devs. I think it's possible we may have some design positions, but not in any 3d space (no animation, motion capture, etc). We compete in the cloud industry. Message me with inquiries; I'll make a point to check gate.eve throughout the day. On second thought, I set up an email alias: [email protected] so that you don't have to use work resources to inquire about employment. Heh. You rock!
Obviously no guarantees, and there's still a rigorous interview process and a development test. And to be honest, Development and high-level System Administration are a couple of areas that are still economically strong. But, I figured if I can at least help get someone an interview, it's something I want to do.
Edit: damnit, missed my chance to snipe the top of the page =(.
I also tweeted about it. Pass the word on #tweetfleet if you can. |
|
Shaera Taam
Minmatar Death Squad Broken Chains Alliance
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:49:00 -
[121] - Quote
Herping yourDerp wrote:i thought the shanghi location worked on WOD
also just make those people you are going to fire work on different eve stuff if possible... i mean, what if..... just maybe.... 3 expansions per year?
or maybe, just maybe, the normal two expansions and a whole metric butt ton of *fixes?*
a gal can hope, eh? |
Andrea Roche
State War Academy Caldari State
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:49:00 -
[122] - Quote
i want to say alot more but i am refraining myself from it cos at the end, everyone is at loss here, some lose more than others thought.
I love this game and i love the community here.
I wish the very best to all the employees and their families in this hard time. |
Barakkus
849
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:51:00 -
[123] - Quote
Herping yourDerp wrote:i thought the shanghi location worked on WOD
also just make those people you are going to fire work on different eve stuff if possible... i mean, what if..... just maybe.... 3 expansions per year?
No it was Atlanta, Shanghai works on DUST mostly. White Wolf (which merged with CCP) was based in Atlanta, and was the developers of Vampire the Masquerade, which is what WOD is based on. |
Rakshasa Taisab
Sane Industries Inc.
373
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:53:00 -
[124] - Quote
Ahh... well... this does explain why my thread in GD a couple weeks ago got locked so quickly... You guys already knew layoffs were on the way.
Also, I'm glad my thoughts on refocusing the Atlanta team was also put into effect, as WoD is not as time-critical as getting DUST out. 84,000 AUR ($420) spent on NeX store for Troll and Profit. |
Marlakh
24th Imperial Crusade Amarr Empire
8
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:54:00 -
[125] - Quote
My best wishes to those employees laid off. May they find good jobs and hopefully we can enjoy the fruits of their labours one day.
I'm glad to see a re-affirmation from CCP on their commitment to their core game, including Dust. I'm sure this decision was not easy to make but it will ultimately be the correct one and the sacrifices will not be in vain.
|
mazzilliu
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:57:00 -
[126] - Quote
mazzilliu wrote:attn: laid off ccp people.
if you want to get an entry level network security job we are hiring and i can train you. deals mostly with malware and attacks. if you are good at it i can probably get you a job within a few months and i can get a sweet ass referral bonus. no experience needed but passion about security a must.
not joking btw. PM me.
*circles in the sky slowly above ccp's head* i am going to elaborate on this so people who don't fit do not waste their time mailing me
VVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV
the job mostly involves analysis. You will be looking at traffic from literally every type of application and determining if it is good or evil. EXTREMELY detail oriented and you must be highly competent or you will crash and burn and take down expensive boxes with you. you also need excellent written english skills.
very little development involved, but you must be able to read and comprehend code, especially obfuscated code. needs very strong critical thinking skills.
there is a small amount of administration involved when you update network security devices, as well as fetch event information from them
networking, linux, and security. you must be knowledgable on those three areas.
must have 0 criminal background and be able to work in the us, also i must test you before i pass your resume along. you don't necessarily need amazing degrees or even be from ccp. we need competent people who know how things work. |
Sofia Bellard
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
68
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 15:57:00 -
[127] - Quote
Now that the Atlanta employees are no longer having to work on WoD, can they be re-tasked for Incarna?
Poor sad little pirates, -áwhy you so mad? |
Asuri Kinnes
Adhocracy Incorporated Adhocracy
17
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:00:00 -
[128] - Quote
SHAMESHAME wrote:To each and every person who whined their way through the last few months, congratulations. You got your pixels, database entries and pretend warfare. Real people lost jobs. There was nothing so wrong with the game that it should have meant taking real food off the real tables of real people. It is my sincere hope that you too find yourself in the unemployment line. A product that people payed money for was in decline. So... continue to pay for an inferior product, or ***** about what we were getting? The fact that CCP has made this decision at this time is a reflection of the business practice of the real world.
The fact that people (real people) are losing work is terri-bad. Do not ever mistake me for saying otherwise.
Consumers, however, do have a right to complain about what they're getting for their money.
For that I *will not* apologize.
Wormholes: The *NEW* end game of Eve - Online: No Local. No Lag. No Blues (No Intell Channesl). No Blobs.
NEW FEATURE: NO INCARNA! |
Insane Randomness
Perkone Caldari State
4
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:00:00 -
[129] - Quote
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:Somebody pinch me.
Thats what I thought! Holy hell CCP, what happened!? First you focus on the stuff we've been asking for for years, and now your focusing on EVE! BRA-VO!
On anothe rnote, I hope the former WoD teams the best with this tough market, however, I'm sure that after working with CCP, other MMO developers would be more than happy to have you. |
backtrace
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:01:00 -
[130] - Quote
CCP Manifest wrote:Today it was my solemn duty to post an announcement from CCP. You can read that announcement here. Please keep your discussion of the announcement to this thread if possible, and understand that this and the days in the future are going to be very difficult for those at CCP. We stand behind our decisions and trust that it will ultimately bring you, the EVE community, a better game. tl;dr Monocles failed so we're firing people because our wallets are thin. We're doing ~things~ for spaceships again, because if we lose more subscribers we'll die.
Good news everyone! Bad news for vampires though. |
|
Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous
205
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:01:00 -
[131] - Quote
I also wanted to say that while I cringe when players use moments like these to further troll the company, my hat is off to all of those in this thread that have offered jobs or helped post references for CCP employees looking for new work.
THIS is the kind of classy attitude that exemplifies the best the EvE community has to offer. I have deep respect for those players in here sensitive to the fact that there are real people behind the avatars, and that they are hurting right now.
Keep the suggestions coming, I hope our community can reach out and reward CCP for their refocusing efforts by helping to provide opportunities for displaced CCP talent, so no one is hurt in the long run by this. Its the least we can do to support them, for all they're doing to support us and our passion.
|
Azahni Vah'nos
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
43
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:03:00 -
[132] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote: Sorry to the employees laid off from the WOD team in the states (particularly in this economic climate) but I do believe its a neccessary step and vital to ensure CCP has the resources to concentrate on and renew Eve Online as its core game. This announcement is almost more significant than the Hilmar apology to signalling a full return to priority focus on Eve Online.
Follow it up by announcing plans to ditch the NeX store and provide all In Space AND Incarna content through traditional sandbox economics rather than MT money-grubbing and I will be fully satisfied and celebrate by resubbing for a year on my account.
To CCP employees: My sincere condolences to those about to lose their jobs, the work environment is never a particulary happy one for anyone when job losses are occuring. I hope that all that are let go find work in the shortest time possible and best wishes to both you and your families.
Like Jade, I believe that the Nex store should be removed from the game, it's a blight on the sandbox that is EVE. I also have held off on getting a 12 month subsription until I see what is happening with the Nex store. Whilst that Nex store remains I don't want anything to do with it, or anything it touches and that includes the EVE is Real site.
Nex (Cash Shop)-á/ Aurum - removing sand from the sandbox since Incarna |
Jashmyne
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
15
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:03:00 -
[133] - Quote
Sofia Bellard wrote:Now that the Atlanta employees are no longer having to work on WoD, can they be re-tasked for Incarna? Read again, they are still working on WoD. |
Florestan Bronstein
The Waterworks
112
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:05:00 -
[134] - Quote
/tinfoilhat
I have the awful feeling that the main rationale for not putting WoD completely on ice might very well be to avoid depreciating the WoD-related code assets too fast.
When so much of your assets are just frozen man-hours (which hopefully exist in the form of code, art, ...) having to give up on a large project could result in some pretty devastating corrections to equity. |
Rakshasa Taisab
Sane Industries Inc.
373
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:09:00 -
[135] - Quote
backtrace wrote:tl;dr Monocles failed so we're firing people because our wallets are thin. We're doing ~things~ for spaceships again, because if we lose more subscribers we'll die.
Good news everyone! Bad news for vampires though. It is clearly not just about monocles failing... CCP went through a huge growth spurt, and had never laid off anyone.
And that is just not healthy for a company, as not every person you hire turns out to be a good fit. In the same way that a garden needs constant tending, so does your company's workforce. So you lay off some people (and possibly hire new promising new people).
Sure it's sad for the individual, but spaceships is serious business. 84,000 AUR ($420) spent on NeX store for Troll and Profit. |
Excelenta
Federal Defence Union Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:11:00 -
[136] - Quote
maybe they should make some reasearch / pool
about who is interested in dust 514
i even didnt have playstation 3 and i wont buy it to play dust 514
there are too many FPP games on market
its bad idea making another one
EVE is UNIQUE
|
Tenebrae Delucescere
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
4
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:13:00 -
[137] - Quote
SHAMESHAME wrote:To each and every person who whined their way through the last few months, congratulations. You got your pixels, database entries and pretend warfare. Real people lost jobs. There was nothing so wrong with the game that it should have meant taking real food off the real tables of real people. It is my sincere hope that you too find yourself in the unemployment line.
At the risk of attracting fiery bullets, this wasn't the gamers' fault. The outrage on the forums and in the game was valuable information to CCP that their product was not succeeding. It wasn't idle threats either, subs plummeted. The reason these people are losing their jobs is that someone on top decided to continue to neglect their core bread winner. The head in the sand approach is what cost these people their jobs. Most of the outcry on the forums is from people who genuinely want to see this game succeed for a very long time. Ignoring your customers, making big financial risks while hemoragging income, and continuing down courses of no gain are the mistakes here, not feedback from your playerbase.
To all of CCP, former, current, and soon to be former, I wish you nothing but the best. I hope that this move leads to the success of CCP in all of it's current and future endeavors, as well as those who have contributed to that success along the way. Fly safe!
|
Mechanoid Kryten
N0VA 5
10
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:14:00 -
[138] - Quote
Wow. A better sacrifice would have been dust. But at least it is not eve! I used to be afraid of WoD because I thought it would be the only game that would make me quit eve. I like vampires more than space ships. There I said it. But knowing about the pay to win nature of WoD (pay for item space etc) and the nex store example here made me change my mind about even trying wod tho, so I don't mind the sacrifice...
Great ship spinning btw! I was expecting some hack up ... not to see the old beautiful hanger back! What rocks are the most isk per hour to mine? Which of your mission loot is worth more refined than sold? What blue prints make the most proffit? Answers: https://eve-industrialist.com/ Never sell an item for less than its mineral costs again! |
Katarina Reid
Katarina Reid Corp
29
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:14:00 -
[139] - Quote
R.I.P WOD now more EVE fis content |
diabel
Spiritus Draconis
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:14:00 -
[140] - Quote
I am also not interested in DUST 514 or WoD |
|
Rakshasa Taisab
Sane Industries Inc.
373
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:16:00 -
[141] - Quote
Excelenta wrote:maybe they should make some reasearch / pool
about who is interested in dust 514
i even didnt have playstation 3 and i wont buy it to play dust 514 DUST is one of the better ideas CCP has had, and it seems that the execution will also be good. It really makes me feel more confident in the future of EVE that they've decided to postpone WoD, as that we clearly too much at once. 84,000 AUR ($420) spent on NeX store for Troll and Profit. |
Aidan Brooder
Dynasphere Ltd.
61
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:16:00 -
[142] - Quote
Florestan Bronstein wrote:/tinfoilhat
I have the awful feeling that the main rationale for not putting WoD completely on ice might very well be to avoid depreciating the WoD-related code assets faster than CCP's balance sheet could bear.
When so much of your assets are just frozen man-hours (which hopefully exist in the form of code, art, ...) having to give up on a large project could result in some pretty bad corrections to equity.
Yes. Happened to one of the projects I worked on. Too many millions spent already so they let us go on with the cooking, but on reduced flame. Writing it off was impossible. The good thing about it was, that in that time we were able to work far more focused. Not six sub-projects at the same time. Product got better.
More budget was poured into it again and more people hired, many re-hired. That is what I hope will happen to CCP.
Aside from selfishly hoping that WiS will see more development... |
Magnus Orin
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
38
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:23:00 -
[143] - Quote
While I sympathize with those who will lose their jobs, I applaud CCP for making the right decision.
I'd suggest taking it a bit further, and cancelling WoD, as I think CCP should focus 100% on the Eve Universe, but I can accept this realignment.
Still, CCP has been mostly talk and ass kissing so far. The return of ship spinning is a nice treat, but hopefully it is but a hint of good things to come.
The winter expansion will be make or break for CCP. |
WisdomLikeSilence
The Cursed Navy Important Internet Spaceship League
58
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:25:00 -
[144] - Quote
Dude, your subscriber numbers are down because of the anom nerf. It was a MASSIVE kick in the balls to thousands who had struggled to take space and then upgrade it.
It spat in the face of those people. And they left. THey wont be back.
Also it reduced the income of thousands more, and where they had multiple accounts they cancelled those accounts they copuld no longer afford.
They might be back, who knows.
While you are concentrating REALLY HARD on space, try concentrating on the anom nerf you suddenly and without warning imposed, while ignoring the huge outcry.
Look at THAT decision again, mate. |
Jussa Tetas
Terminal Innervations
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:28:00 -
[145] - Quote
I'm very sad for the folks that are losing their positions. I do hope that it will be quite short lived.
I'm also a bit concerned that the actions taken by the upper management are "too little too late". It would certainly not be the first time I have seen CEO's, CFO's, etc. sugar coat the position of a company with one hand while doing CPR with the other.
I hope that the person or persons that blindly led the company into a bad state are shipped out the door along with the poor SOB's that are going to be searching for work tomorrow through no fault of their own.
Good luck all! |
Bratwurst0r
Austrian Industrial Corporation Universal Constant Alliance
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:29:00 -
[146] - Quote
What a bitter pill to swallow.
Not that i will shed a tear because of WOD (MT Model) or would because of Dust (full MT model...linked to EVE even), but its sad for the 20% of course.
Lets wait and see. Such a big change can work of course, but it's not set in stone that EVE will regain customers, the dmg has been done, repairing it is way harder.
EVE had some vision and good content, but by no means was it consistent over the years, and i'm not just talking 2008 till now, but already back in 2006 the big failure of the rampant capital issues where consequently ignored by CCP till the big Titan nerf was inevitable years later when the dmg was done.
I won't cheer just yet, lets see what comes of this. |
Ilkahn
United Aerospace Co-op
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:32:00 -
[147] - Quote
Alexzandros wrote:Youwai wrote:WoD and Dust development stopped?
/cumfirmed wrong answer... Dust 514 moves forward... WoD moves forward with a smaller staff. Good move CCP, focus on the game that made your company! My condolences to those who are receiving pink slips as part of this.
Personally, i think the whole WoD idea is a failure in the making and should be kept on simmer for the future. I'm not saying the game wouldn't rule all other Vampire games, imo CCP does their game correctly.
What i am saying is that vampires and such are a hollywood cyclical series of products. Seems every 10 - 15 years we have a resurgence of the "Vampire, Mummy or Undead" scene as new writers come in and attempt to out plagerize their predecessors. IMO, Darkness would debut on the scene right about the time all the potential players would say "Vampires are so yesteryear, happen to have mummies in that game?? NO?? Ah, not interested then."
I do wish those affected the best, maybe we can all grab another account and rehire them to put MOAR EVEs STUFZZ for us. |
Phantom Slave
Cryogenic Creations
16
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:33:00 -
[148] - Quote
Best of luck to all those affected. This solemn news has affected my demeanor. I shall now take it out on my coworkers. |
Sophie Starsparrow
Damnation Angels Naraka.
79
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:34:00 -
[149] - Quote
Jussa Tetas wrote:I hope that the person or persons that blindly led the company into a bad state are shipped out the door along with the poor SOB's that are going to be searching for work tomorrow through no fault of their own.
I also hope PR realizes their hand in this. The comments and statements made in the wake of monocle-gate went a long way to costing people their jobs.
Those of you let go, best of luck.
|
Hiram Alexander
Capital Enrichment Services
33
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:34:00 -
[150] - Quote
This is very bitter-sweet news.
A sad day, for many.
And like many here, I feel a great deal of sympathy for those about to lose their livelihoods, and hope that the transition between employers will be a short and smooth one.
That CCP is prepared to take such a bold stance, and make such real changes, bodes well for its future. This goes far beyond the well intentioned, yet rhetorical words of recent weeks. Personally, I look forward to becoming less cynical.
Now, I guess, my main hope is that the emotional balance of 'decision makers' is a steady one - the last thing that's needed now, is for people to get defensive and hesitant. "Someone" saw the writing on the wall, and 'leaked' things they shouldn't have... I'm neither condemning or condoning it --- I just want to voice my hope that, in light of this change, I would ask the remaining Dev's to be more vocal with their bosses... And, bosses... please listen.
Am I ready to start paying cash for all my accounts again? Will I change back to the subscription model? To be honest, it depends on what you do next... My faith in CCP is far stronger than it's been for a very long time, yet the Nex store and more particularly --- everything it represents, still holds me back. |
|
Shamefuldirty
MaxxxCorp
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:35:00 -
[151] - Quote
Sorry that people are losing jobs. I have been there and especially in this climate it will be hard to get employed. Ever so sorry.
Why CCP are reducing their Atlanta team (White Wolf is in Atlanta! No surprise there) and basically slowing production of WoD MMO, (CCP are good at MMO's) in favour of a PS3 only FPS (CCP have no experience in FPS's at all) is beyond me. Call me Mr Picky. This type of decision making seems bizare to me. As does the statement that to "concentrate better on Eve, we're gonna fire some staff" seems strange. |
Evelgrivion
Gunpoint Diplomacy
69
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:36:00 -
[152] - Quote
The layoffs are not unexpected, but none the less unwelcome. There's nothing that can be done with just words, but my condolences to all you folks who are now looking for work.
While I and many others have said something like this will be necessary, I'm not happy about being right. |
Hormus
Veria Ltd.
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:37:00 -
[153] - Quote
So, after some disastrous moves that cut on the CCP income, its directors decide to cut on the staff to make even, instead of admitting their mistakes and using that staff for repairing their mistakes. I'm disgusted. I had not unsubscribed on the incarna issues, but I'm seriously thinking it now. For sure, I will not read any of your pitiful dev blogs anymore. You are just saying whatever they pay you to. And you're blaming us, your customers, for the layoffs! That's infuriating! My sincerest regards to the ppl about to be layed off because of their superiors lack of competence. |
Jack Carrigan
Order of the Shadow The Revenant Order
59
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:40:00 -
[154] - Quote
I am glad to see CCP is focusing on EVE and the primary focus of FiS. I'm sorry to see people losing their jobs over this, but hopefully CCP will be able to assist them in finding new ones.
I will be inviting moar people to play EVE now. "War is not measured in terms of who wins or loses, who is right or wrong.-á It is measured in terms of who survives." |
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
388
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:41:00 -
[155] - Quote
What a perfect example of what happens when a game company starts pandering to the whiny demands of the vocal minority.
I hope they learned a lesson from this.
Mr Epeen If you can read this, you haven't blocked me yet. |
Ilkahn
United Aerospace Co-op
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:43:00 -
[156] - Quote
Aryndel Vyst wrote:Does this mean we're going to see new faces at Occupy Wall Street?
ObamaPay time. If they were in Arkansas they would be getting like almost 400-500 per week i think... i should move there our state is a measly 255. |
DaiTengu
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
23
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:44:00 -
[157] - Quote
I'd love to know if it's just the WoD MMO developers that are being laid off, or if it's the White Wolf Pen & Paper staff that's being cut as well.
|
Bratwurst0r
Austrian Industrial Corporation Universal Constant Alliance
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:48:00 -
[158] - Quote
Mr Epeen wrote:What a perfect example of what happens when a game company starts pandering to the whiny demands of the vocal minority. I hope they learned a lesson from this. Mr Epeen
You hope they learned a lesson from what? What they do now is the lesson they learned, and its because of what you call a "vocal minority".
And you, the "vocal troll" who always said the "vocal minority" can't change anything, should be rather quiet now, because you don't look that good in the light of things. Maybe YOU should learn your lesson for a change. |
Htrag
The Carebear Stare Hydroponic Zone
10
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:51:00 -
[159] - Quote
My condolences to the employees that are a victim of CCPs hubris.
Hopefully Zulu gets the boot as well. Things have really gone downhill since he's been around.
Oh and please prioritize getting the pod squish sound back in. |
rabidslug
Serenity Prime Cascade Imminent
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:51:00 -
[160] - Quote
A case of too far too soon.
My thoughts are with those who are being forced to 'move on' but after this appeared http://www.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&nbid=2672 i thought....hello....??...gonna down-size are they?..
EvE is the mother. EvE is the beginning, EvE is the core, EvE is the heart.
Remember that FIRST and FOREMOST |
|
Ooooh Papi
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:52:00 -
[161] - Quote
My sincere condolences to those being affected by the downsizing. For those affected in the Atlanta area, please contact one of our local offices for opportunities - http://www.advantageresourcing.com
Best of luck and fly safe |
Andreus Ixiris
Mixed Metaphor
88
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:53:00 -
[162] - Quote
This is a mistake, CCP. Andreus Anthony LeHane Ixiris CEO, Mixed Metaphor Media Consultant, Voyeur Studios |
Greygal
Sephray Industries Serenitas Solutus
47
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:55:00 -
[163] - Quote
My sympathies to all those who are losing their jobs at CCP.
I know how scary it is, I lost my job of 16 years three years ago, after a year with no luck finding new employment in my field (I'm a writer/editor ... the typos in many of the Chronicles drive me nuts) I took a minimum wage job as a Customer Service Representative (i.e., GM!) which I lost ten months ago due to downsizing. I've been without a job ever since. Every now and then I get lucky and sell an article or two for $50 or $75 but damn it's a tough tough job market out there... I've not even had luck getting a minimum wage job at Walmart! (if I hear "over-qualified" one more time I swear I'm going to get in my Myrmidon and overheat my weapons
I cannot imagine how difficult a decision this must have been for everyone involved. However, I have no doubt it is the right decision. Two truisms come to mind:
1. Don't put all your eggs in one basket. 2. Don't spread yourself too thin.
With the decision to focus on Eve and Dust, you are honoring both truisms at the same time. I cannot help but feel that this decision, as heart-rending as it is, can only result in a stronger company, improved product offerings, a more streamlined and focused development process and a greater ability to be more responsive to changing technologies and markets. Look what CCP accomplished when it was just a handful of employees - with this painful change, a small step back towards the heart of your corporate soul, so to speak, you just may be able to accomplish more than if you tripled your staff.
I pray that each and every one of you in Atlanta find new positions with minimal interruption to your lives. I've no doubt the great abilities and skills each of you have will serve you well in all your future endeavors. What you do for yourself dies with you, what you do for others is immortal. |
Xervish Krin
UNFRL Fleet Operations CONSORTIUM UNIVERSALIS
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:57:00 -
[164] - Quote
Hormus wrote:So, after some disastrous moves that cut on the CCP income, its directors decide to cut on the staff to make even, instead of admitting their mistakes and using that staff for repairing their mistakes. I'm disgusted. I had not unsubscribed on the incarna issues, but I'm seriously thinking it now. For sure, I will not read any of your pitiful dev blogs anymore. You are just saying whatever they pay you to. And you're blaming us, your customers, for the layoffs! That's infuriating! My sincerest regards to the ppl about to be layed off because of their superiors lack of competence.
Nobody in the blog blamed the customers for the lay-offs. That's solely from people reading the posts and commenting 'hey, maybe the mass wave of discontent that I was a part of contributed".
As for your business advice, well, it's flawed. When you don't have enough money, you can't just keep all your staff and immediately reassign them. CCP is cutting staff because it has little choice but to do so.
And 'instead of admitting their mistakes'? Really? You might want to re read the blog, because it's essentially doing just that, as is Hilmar's letter and the subtext of several recent devblogs. I spy someone determined revel in righteous indignation no matter the situation. |
Khamal Jolstien
THORN Syndicate BricK sQuAD.
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:58:00 -
[165] - Quote
Sound decision. Sucks people are losing jobs, but there are better jobs in the industry than at CCP. Plenty that pay more with a better environment. If they're talented, they won't have any problems finding work and will likely be better off. |
Verone
Veto Corp
72
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 16:59:00 -
[166] - Quote
I'm astonished at some of the names that have come up that are being released from the Company.
It's a real shock, because most of these names have been people who've lived, breathed and slept Eve for over half a decade and have always had Eve's core values in their hearts and the best for Eve and CCP at the forefront of their minds.
While downsizing a little is good, whoever decided who was to go, needs a serious reality check.
This is an immense mistake, CCP. In the long run it's probably a bigger mistake than the early release of Incarna.
Verone CEO & Executor Veto Corp WWW.VETO-CORP.COM |
Ilkahn
United Aerospace Co-op
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:00:00 -
[167] - Quote
Hormus wrote:So, after some disastrous moves that cut on the CCP income, its directors decide to cut on the staff to make even, instead of admitting their mistakes and using that staff for repairing their mistakes. I'm disgusted. I had not unsubscribed on the incarna issues, but I'm seriously thinking it now. For sure, I will not read any of your pitiful dev blogs anymore. You are just saying whatever they pay you to. And you're blaming us, your customers, for the layoffs! That's infuriating! My sincerest regards to the ppl about to be layed off because of their superiors lack of competence.
Sadly, it is our fault. Folks voted with their subscriptions to say they weren't getting out of the game the things they felt they were paying for. CCP has basically admitted that EVE has been neglected with lots of broken and/or unfinished content and has now recognized that they should give what they feel was promised before moving deeper into future products.
Nobody says they shouldn't make other games, but they do say fix the one i'm playing and in your free time when EVE works right then make us new things to enjoy.
I readily admit that i want to see DUST, i'd like to see it in a PC version as well. Imagine Capsuleers and Dust marines in stations... bar fights, oh BOY!
This is the stuff dreams are made of and i fully believe CCP can bring them to us! |
TornSoul
BIG Gentlemen's Agreement
7
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:00:00 -
[168] - Quote
Two important facts about that blog post
1: CCP are doing "the right thing" (*) - Even when it hurts (**)
(*) Bettering EVE, their foundation for everything else (**) Losing people, and stalling (not cancelling) development on "other stuff"
2: CCP is *communicating* again. Honestly and direct (very slight PR spin/buzzwordy, but that kind of post has to be) It's very refreshing - It's nearly like CCP of old.
Fingers crossed they'll keep it up. (both 1 and 2)
|
Andreus Ixiris
Mixed Metaphor
88
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:04:00 -
[169] - Quote
TornSoul wrote:Two important facts about that blog post
1: CCP are doing "the right thing" (*) - Even when it hurts (**)
(*) Bettering EVE, their foundation for everything else (**) Losing people, and stalling (not cancelling) development on "other stuff"
What they're doing is not the right thing. You should wait to see exactly who it is that they're laying off before you make such an assertion. Andreus Anthony LeHane Ixiris CEO, Mixed Metaphor Media Consultant, Voyeur Studios |
jonnykefka
Adhocracy Incorporated Adhocracy
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:10:00 -
[170] - Quote
This is a message I would like to direct to CCP and its employees.
First, we are grateful for the commitment you are showing to EVE. Yes, actions not words, believe it when I see it on TQ etc. etc., but you are showing real commitment to making EVE the best game it can be with this reorganization, and I look forward to seeing the fruits of this over the next several months if not years.
Of course, as has been expressed many times throughout the thread, we feel for the people losing their jobs, whether or not it's a result of the refocusing and whatever responsibility can be applied to the demands of the playerbase.
We recognize that, to those of you that are still working on EVE, these are friends and co-workers that you don't want to see gone, and that this will have an impact on you, not just on the people losing their jobs.
But we are grateful, and this gratitude seems to be manifesting in postings of relevant jobs from those few members of the community that have relevant jobs to post about. Posting it in a forum thread...well, it's the only way to respond at the moment.
This demonstrates that you have constructed a truly remarkable, well-educated (mostly), well-connected (some) community, and right now that community wants to soften the blow. Is there some mechanism by which people who have these opportunities that laid off employees could potentially apply to make them available to those employees more directly? Some sort of contact that people could advertise to, that could be put into an internal document and circulated, to help them on their way?
I know that within my corp, people have connected others to useful opportunities, even done business together. The EVE player base is a genuinely remarkable community. The community you as a corporation have created can be a resource for your employees, if you would like us to be.
TL;DR: Help us help you help us all. |
|
Obsidian Hawk
RONA Corporation RONA Directorate
186
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:11:00 -
[171] - Quote
To those of you who lost their jobs, Sorry to see you guys go, you will all be missed, but fear not.
Winter is coming, if the expansion goes off without a hitch and the massive balancing happens. People will come back, people will resubscribe and you will be able to come back to work. I hope you can find something to tide you over temporarily while ccp reorganizes and re-expands.
Many of you are great devs, and I for one welcome world of darkness and dust 514 when they are released. |
Dudley Manlove
BloodBrotherz
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:13:00 -
[172] - Quote
FIrst, let me begin by expressing my sympathies for those who will soon find themselves out of a job. I know that this will be a hard time for them, considering the current global economic climate.
That said, I fail to understand how laying off 20% of thier staff will help CCP, "accelerate timeframes for new features and increase [thier] ability to respond to community needs." Unless CCP plans on eliminating one or more non-EVE projects, I do not see how this scenario will come to fruition. It sounds far more like PR spin for the sake of shareholders and customers than an honest evaluation of facts-on-the-ground. |
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
388
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:16:00 -
[173] - Quote
Bratwurst0r wrote:Mr Epeen wrote:What a perfect example of what happens when a game company starts pandering to the whiny demands of the vocal minority. I hope they learned a lesson from this. Mr Epeen You hope they learned a lesson from what? What they do now is the lesson they learned, and its because of what you call a "vocal minority".
Right. Having to downsize because they started moving backwards instead of continuing development due to you people is a good thing
Quote:And you, the "vocal troll" who always said the "vocal minority" can't change anything, should be rather quiet now, because you don't look that good in the light of things. Maybe YOU should learn your lesson for a change.
Oh, they changed something alright. Delaying development, causing layoffs, postponing planned updates.
You see this as a good thing?
Mr Epeen
If you can read this, you haven't blocked me yet. |
Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous
209
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:18:00 -
[174] - Quote
Excelenta wrote:maybe they should make some reasearch / pool
about who is interested in dust 514
i even didnt have playstation 3 and i wont buy it to play dust 514
there are too many FPP games on market
its bad idea making another one
EVE is UNIQUE
The mistake here is thinking that Dust 514 will be "just another shooter". If it was, it would surely fail based on lack of widespread branding and familiarity. But Dust 514 is not giving you another short single player campaign and a dozen multiplayer maps to frag endlessly on, they are building something far different than shooter fans have played before. Its not even a simple shooter - on large maps its more vehicular combat combined with real-time strategy.
I think there are a lot of console gamers out there who are quite frankly bored to tears by the 14th Call of Duty release, or 6th Halo, and will be excited to be a part of something much bigger, where there is meaning to their actions, and an opportunity to participate in story campaigns that go way deeper and far longer than the typical 15 hour arc.
Market research tells you what people have done, and what people are interested in THAT MOMENT. Market research tells you what has been sold in the past. I'm sure when EvE was first released, you could have easily looked at the "space flight sim" market and said big deal, we have wing commander, and freespace, and freelancer, but who really plays those anymore. Eve will flop.
EvE is successful because CCP imagined gameplay and a world that didn't exist at the time, market research could never have "proved" to them EvE would succeed before they took the time to develop it. Dust 514 will be no different. There are plenty of console gamers thirsty for a more immersive experience than the casual games offer currently, they will come out of the woodwork just like all the EvE converts have over the years.
|
Gilentajsa
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
5
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:21:00 -
[175] - Quote
I hope all you FiS crybabys are happy now, you've lost real people their jobs, you know, real people with parents and children and siblings. People with bills to pay and mouths to feed and you weren't content to let things move forward, you just had to whine and cry until you forced CCP's hand.
Sad thing is I'm betting most of you don't even really care, you're just offering your condolences for show. <3 you |
Dierdra Vaal
Veto. Veto Corp
22
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:24:00 -
[176] - Quote
The downsizing, however unfortunate for those involved, seemed to be an unavoidable reality CCP had to deal with at some point.
What is sad to see however, is exactly which devs are getting the sack (and which ones don't). Instead of firing the ones that caused these problems to begin with (the ones that pushed for certain development directions), the company is - among others - firing people on the community team. The last few people who to my knowledge still had an ear to the ground and the ones who were aware of the issues the community was most concerned about.
It's too late to do anything about it now, but I'm far from certain this will turn CCP into a healthier company.
Veto #205 * * * Director Emeritus at EVE University * * * CSM1 delegate, CSM3 chairman and CSM5 vice-chairman |
Florestan Bronstein
The Waterworks
112
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:25:00 -
[177] - Quote
Shamefuldirty wrote:Sorry that people are losing jobs. I have been there and especially in this climate it will be hard to get employed. Ever so sorry.
Why CCP are reducing their Atlanta team (White Wolf is in Atlanta! No surprise there) and basically slowing production of WoD MMO, (CCP are good at MMO's) in favour of a PS3 only FPS (CCP have no experience in FPS's at all) is beyond me. Call me Mr Picky. This type of decision making seems bizare to me. As does the statement that to "concentrate better on Eve, we're gonna fire some staff" seems strange. You realize that as a company you are spread thin. You either need to cut back on the number of projects or you need more money.
CCP had already raised extra equity in 2009 - probably to finance WoD & DUST. Back then one investment fund bought basically all newly issued shares - all other significant investors did allow for their share of CCP to be diluted. CCP's largest investor has been bankrupt ever since the financial crisis and had to pledge to use all dividends or proceeds from his CCP shares to repay his debts. So the guy who owns 30% of CCP is effectively controlled by a consortium of very conservative banks.
So now it is Summer 2011, about 1.5 years since the last batch of money from the 2009 equity sale has come in, and the CCP management asks for more.
It's a difficult situation - the economic prospects still look uncertain, the EVE subscriber-base is in turmoil, WoD is stuck in preproduction, ...
2010 profit was 5.4 - 5.5m of that 1.7m were an income tax refund (no taxable income in 2010) and 16.9m are due to capitalized salaries (55% of total salaries were capitalized).
Now you can either go in balls-deep, buy additional CCP shares and hope that you are not throwing good money after bad money.
Or you say "work with what you have" and accept that a large part of the capitalized salaries/R&D of the last years might become worthless.
You can safely assume that this was no easy decision for CCP's shareholders - but they decided to go with the more conservative option. |
Arboc Digambara
Aquilia Cohors Praetoria Curatores Veritatis Alliance
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:29:00 -
[178] - Quote
I personally don`t see CCP focusing on eve universe. U`re doing bullshit guys. Most of eve players are adult and instead of making game interesting ure adding grinding\stupid npc killing and other FAIL expansions to the game. In 21st century of automatic ure making players to do stupid&boring things that cant be scripted (haha). Im personally not interested in DUST at all and wont ever buy it or your another mmorpg. What in thinking to do is stop paying u 45$ per month which i have been doing for 4 years. The game is unbalanced and boring and u are so damn slow to admit it and seems like ure more interesting to make other games, not eve. Well do u need money? Ofc u do so cancelling subscription will be my answer to ur politics. |
Immortal DeathKnight
The Shadow Plague Gentlemen's Agreement
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:30:00 -
[179] - Quote
please pass to Hilmar: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect Thanks :) |
DaiTengu
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
24
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:31:00 -
[180] - Quote
Verone wrote: I'm astonished at some of the names that have come up that are being released from the Company.
It's a real shock, because most of these names have been people who've lived, breathed and slept Eve for over half a decade and have always had Eve's core values in their hearts and the best for Eve and CCP at the forefront of their minds.
While downsizing a little is good, whoever decided who was to go, needs a serious reality check.
This is an immense mistake, CCP. In the long run it's probably a bigger mistake than the early release of Incarna.
What names? did I miss something? I didn't know they released names. |
|
Hakaru Ishiwara
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
28
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:34:00 -
[181] - Quote
Rakshasa Taisab wrote:Excelenta wrote:maybe they should make some reasearch / pool
about who is interested in dust 514
i even didnt have playstation 3 and i wont buy it to play dust 514 DUST is one of the better ideas CCP has had... ... Until they announced PS3 exclusivity.
Was completely stoked at the potential to play an EVE-related FPS title on either X-Box or [even better] PC when DUST was first announced 2 years ago.
Now? No thank you.
284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284286 |
Riflin' Betty
Perfunctory
18
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:34:00 -
[182] - Quote
DaiTengu wrote:Verone wrote: I'm astonished at some of the names that have come up that are being released from the Company.
It's a real shock, because most of these names have been people who've lived, breathed and slept Eve for over half a decade and have always had Eve's core values in their hearts and the best for Eve and CCP at the forefront of their minds.
While downsizing a little is good, whoever decided who was to go, needs a serious reality check.
This is an immense mistake, CCP. In the long run it's probably a bigger mistake than the early release of Incarna.
What names? did I miss something? I didn't know they released names.
They didn't. But a lot of us know people in CCP.
Some of my friends lost their jobs today, and it's a goddamned shame.
-Helicity |
DaiTengu
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
24
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:36:00 -
[183] - Quote
Riflin' Betty wrote:DaiTengu wrote:Verone wrote: I'm astonished at some of the names that have come up that are being released from the Company.
It's a real shock, because most of these names have been people who've lived, breathed and slept Eve for over half a decade and have always had Eve's core values in their hearts and the best for Eve and CCP at the forefront of their minds.
While downsizing a little is good, whoever decided who was to go, needs a serious reality check.
This is an immense mistake, CCP. In the long run it's probably a bigger mistake than the early release of Incarna.
What names? did I miss something? I didn't know they released names. They didn't. But a lot of us know people in CCP. Some of my friends lost their jobs today, and it's a goddamned shame. -Helicity
Didn't Hilmar's recent devblog state they just hired a bunch of people too in order to re-focus?
Also, I still want to know if they're downsizing White Wolf. |
Hentes Zsemle
EVE Corporation 21123151
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:36:00 -
[184] - Quote
CCP is a company, not a charity, and the players are their custumers. Losing your job must be terrible, but i don't see why should i as a customer care, as its none of my damn business. I don't like it at all that by posting this information ccp is basicly telling us that okay, we get the product we all like, but it comes with people losing their jobs, who were hired under wrong assumptions in the first place.
If such a blog has a place on the frontpage, you should also post that im also spending 20$ or so a month on a video game, which could also help starving children in africa, so im responsible for their suffering aswell. |
Captain Carius
Deathshead Inc.
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:37:00 -
[185] - Quote
To the moderator that banned my brothers forum posts because he was "being too negative toward Eve and insulting to the Goons" I say: I hope you are on the severance list.
To Hilmar for his arrogance which he seems to have recently somewhat recanted I say: My brother thinks you are going to turn this thing around, but I think you should be on the severance list.
To the players that are all broken up and weeping over the results of CCP's bad management decisions I say just what they have said to me : The Tears are delicious ! Cry moar ! HTFU or GTFO ! |
DJ Hijak
New Eden Radio
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:43:00 -
[186] - Quote
I feel bad that so many have to loose thier jobs on this decisison
Best of luck to you all, and to my friends that used to work at CCP, I wish you the best |
T-Jay Charante
The Scope Gallente Federation
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:43:00 -
[187] - Quote
DaiTengu wrote:Riflin' Betty wrote:DaiTengu wrote:Verone wrote: I'm astonished at some of the names that have come up that are being released from the Company.
It's a real shock, because most of these names have been people who've lived, breathed and slept Eve for over half a decade and have always had Eve's core values in their hearts and the best for Eve and CCP at the forefront of their minds.
While downsizing a little is good, whoever decided who was to go, needs a serious reality check.
This is an immense mistake, CCP. In the long run it's probably a bigger mistake than the early release of Incarna.
What names? did I miss something? I didn't know they released names. They didn't. But a lot of us know people in CCP. Some of my friends lost their jobs today, and it's a goddamned shame. -Helicity Didn't Hilmar's recent devblog state they just hired a bunch of people too in order to re-focus? Also, I still want to know if they're downsizing White Wolf.
On Thursday, 19 October 2011, after years of scaling back RPG output, CCP laid off nearly all remaining White Wolf employees, effectively rendering White Wolf Game Studios defunct, although CCP continues to own the trademarks.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Wolf
|
DaiTengu
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
24
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:47:00 -
[188] - Quote
T-Jay Charante wrote:On Thursday, 19 October 2011, after years of scaling back RPG output, CCP laid off nearly all remaining White Wolf employees, effectively rendering White Wolf Game Studios defunct, although CCP continues to own the trademarks. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Wolf
I'm not saying it's wrong, but it points back to the press release which mentions absolutely nothing specific about White Wolf or the Pen & Paper division. |
Needa3
BURN EDEN Northern Coalition.
19
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:48:00 -
[189] - Quote
Quote:First, EVE Online is in good health. Our subscriber numbers are higher today than they were a year ago. Unlike many other MMO's on the market, we have continued to grow year-on-year since launch in 2003. However, over the past two months, our subscribers have gone down from their peak this summer. We attribute this to our own mistakes and poor communications with our players. We are correcting that now.
Where can we check this? What period did you take into account?
Checking Eve Offline still give me a steady decrease in numbers of logged in players.
Also, unless you bring back the sandbox you will not fix anything. You are still focusing on useless crap and have yet not given any thoughts to small gang warfare and their survivability.
Ohh guess what, logistics ships are not the answer.
and
A sandbox consists out of more than drake/ hurricane/ maelstrom blobs or zealot/ abaddon with guardian blobs.
The fix for your sandbox is there ... i wonder how hard it is to make the decision to undo some of the worst patches.
Right now it's WoT > STOR> Eve where as it used to be Eve.
Shame really CCP still doesn't care about their veteran players, even a bigger shame people need to get fired cause you lost all direction even though your player base warned you loads and loads |
Rakshasa Taisab
Sane Industries Inc.
373
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:51:00 -
[190] - Quote
Hakaru Ishiwara wrote:Rakshasa Taisab wrote:DUST is one of the better ideas CCP has had... ... Until they announced PS3 exclusivity. Was completely stoked at the potential to play an EVE-related FPS title on either X-Box or [even better] PC when DUST was first announced 2 years ago. Now? No thank you. Go cry in a river of bitter, the PS3 platform is more than good enough. XBox was never an option, and PC FPS does not mix with console.
As a game to satisfy _YOUR_ personal preferences, it might suck ass. For a game that gets lots of players, it might suck a lot of ****. 84,000 AUR ($420) spent on NeX store for Troll and Profit. |
|
Dessau
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:51:00 -
[191] - Quote
While I believe the focus may be placed back where it belongs, I must with sadness salute those hard-working folk who, through no fault or their own, are now faced with swimming through an irradiated landfill of a job market. I hear Montreal has come up in a big way, Vancouver and Seattle may also have some prospects.
I've been through the exact same thing; pretty sleazy that the execs who cause the mess don't take a pay cut.
Hopefully EVE will stay on track going forward, and the subsequent growth will enable some of the WoD crew to return if they so desire.
o7 |
Rakshasa Taisab
Sane Industries Inc.
373
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:52:00 -
[192] - Quote
Hakaru Ishiwara wrote:Rakshasa Taisab wrote:DUST is one of the better ideas CCP has had... ... Until they announced PS3 exclusivity. Was completely stoked at the potential to play an EVE-related FPS title on either X-Box or [even better] PC when DUST was first announced 2 years ago. Now? No thank you. Go cry in a river of bitter, the PS3 platform is more than good enough. XBox was never an option, and PC FPS does not mix with console.
As a game to satisfy _YOUR_ personal preferences, it might suck ass. For a game that gets lots of players, it might suck a lot of ****. 84,000 AUR ($420) spent on NeX store for Troll and Profit. |
DaiTengu
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
25
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:53:00 -
[193] - Quote
DaiTengu wrote:T-Jay Charante wrote:On Thursday, 19 October 2011, after years of scaling back RPG output, CCP laid off nearly all remaining White Wolf employees, effectively rendering White Wolf Game Studios defunct, although CCP continues to own the trademarks. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Wolf I'm not saying it's wrong, but it points back to the press release which mentions absolutely nothing specific about White Wolf or the Pen & Paper division.
Quoting my own post. CCP Transmedia said the following over at the white-wolf forums:
CCP Transmedia wrote: Sorry to have not responded earlier, but I have a lot of old friends that need to talk. Y'all saw the press release, and while I can't comment on the WoDMMO decisions and how CCP needs to refocus on EVE, I can tell you that the products Eddy and I have been announcing these last few months with WW2.0 and the Onyx Path are all rolling ahead. nWoD, cWoD, Exalted: all still going to have releases as we've announced. Werewolf 20th Anniversary is still being worked on.
It's a bad time for our friends- both from CCP and the oldWW crew- and Eddy and I would like to focus on them right now, so our outward communication with you folks might be spotty for a day or two.
Thanks- --richt Creative Director CCP Transmedia | White Wolf
http://forums.white-wolf.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1195521#post1195521
This is a sort of a Good Thing |
Danny John-Peter
PCG Enterprises
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:57:00 -
[194] - Quote
Good to see focus being put back into EVE, but job losses are never good, condolences :( |
ArchenTheGreat
Pulsar Nebulah Army of Lovers.
5
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 17:59:00 -
[195] - Quote
Good luck to all people leaving CCP. I know how hard is to get good job. I hope you will succeed.
I hope it will also be a lesson for CCP management. You are responsible not only for company income but also for your employees. |
Dbars Grinding
Garoun Investment Bank Gallente Federation
4
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:05:00 -
[196] - Quote
I would cut the CSM and its members next imo. |
Kengutsi Akira
55
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:05:00 -
[197] - Quote
T-Jay Charante wrote:On Thursday, 19 October 2011, after years of scaling back RPG output, CCP laid off nearly all remaining White Wolf employees, effectively rendering White Wolf Game Studios defunct, although CCP continues to own the trademarks. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Wolf
lol Requiem really was for them then. That game blew an Im glad it destroyed them. Now fourth edition D&D should do that to WoTC What Mittani wants, Mittani gets, Mittani help us all
|
Apollo Gabriel
Mercatoris Etherium Cartel
70
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:06:00 -
[198] - Quote
CCP I think you've identified the problem, you're stretched too thin.
However, you've taken the wrong message from it. You are INSULATING YOURSELVES MORE, as an American it amuses me to say this, you're too isolated and don't pay enough attention to the rest of the world around you.
Keeping other offices open and well staffed will HELP YOU, if you LISTEN to them.
Sadly, I've known a few of your employees and they weren't Icelandic, so well, we know how that goes.
You bought a good company, White Wolf, you trashed it, I mean truly ruined it, not that Justin Achilli was doing you any favors.
You took only what you wanted, letting the rest fall to pieces, and now you're putting it on a shelf ...
too bad |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
677
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:07:00 -
[199] - Quote
Well, this is certainly sad new.
First of all, like so many others have done, I wish to extend my condolences to those being laid off. It's certainly a bad time for it, but you have skill sets that are in reasonably high demand, so my sincere hope is that this will be but a bump in the road for you.
Secondly, while I'm saddened by the delay this will cause in a game that I was very much looking forward to, I also understand the reasoning, and I'm unfortunately not all that surprised that it came to this. As a player, I noticed that things were getting a bit thin around here, and bad decisions were being made GÇö the summer d+¬b+ócle was just the ripples of all of those decisions combining into a huge wave of wtfitude. This is made even more sad by the fact (in my eyes) that such a large part of all of that came down to simple poor communication.
Somewhere along the line, someone became unconvinced about the value of feedback and explanation, and at that point, the ability to bring people along on these crazy adventures was kind of lostGǪ Had you been able to communicate and instil confidence in the chosen path, and made the small concessions needed to make people follow it, those numbers would probably look a lot different.
ThirdlyGǪSHAMESHAME wrote:To each and every person who whined their way through the last few months, congratulations. You got your pixels, database entries and pretend warfare. Real people lost jobs. There was nothing so wrong with the game that it should have meant taking real food off the real tables of real people. It is my sincere hope that you too find yourself in the unemployment line. GǪyou're an idiot. The reason those people lost their jobs was because CCP made the horribly bad decision of not feeding its golden goose. There were (and still are) plenty of things wrong with the game, but had they've been attended to, people would have felt far more compelled to keep giving CCP money, which might have kept those people in their jobs. We are not a welfare agency GÇö we are customers, and if we do not get the product we pay for, then it is right to not give the producer any money, and it is right for them to have to adjust their production to fix the issues they caused. GÇöGÇöGÇö GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥ GÇö Karath Piki-á |
Alpheias
Euphoria Released HYDRA RELOADED
94
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:08:00 -
[200] - Quote
It boggles one's mind that CCP are sacking developers & community when it is the MANAGEMENT that should be let go.
GÖœ When your ship gets blown to bits GÖœ And you lose your Faction fits \Gÿ+/ Don't worry GÖ¬ GÖœ GÖ¬ GÖœ GÖœ GÖ¬ GÖœ GÖ¬ Be Happy \Gÿ+/ |
|
Cpt Arareb
Ideal Machine THE R0NIN
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:11:00 -
[201] - Quote
Aineko Macx wrote:I am Jacks complete lack of surprise. And it didn't have to be this way, like Hilmar finally noticed, there were plenty of warnings from all sides. I can't claim to be free of Schadenfreude for stubbornness and arrogance finally reaping the results. Too bad once more the little guy is punished by being fired for mistakes not committed by him.
Ofc the big question remaining is whether CCP will be able to reverse the negative trend in customer satisfaction and resulting declining subscriber numbers or not.
this ^
and I will like to quote Mr. Donald Trump
"is nothing personal is just business"
I sincerely hope the best for the ones leaving
|
Vincent Gaines
Macabre Votum Morsus Mihi
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:11:00 -
[202] - Quote
Rakshasa Taisab wrote:Hakaru Ishiwara wrote:Rakshasa Taisab wrote:DUST is one of the better ideas CCP has had... ... Until they announced PS3 exclusivity. Was completely stoked at the potential to play an EVE-related FPS title on either X-Box or [even better] PC when DUST was first announced 2 years ago. Now? No thank you. Go cry in a river of bitter, the PS3 platform is more than good enough. XBox was never an option, and PC FPS does not mix with console. As a game to satisfy _YOUR_ personal preferences, it might suck ass. For a game that gets lots of players, it might suck a lot of ****.
No, the difference between a console and PC platform is persistence.
Sure, you get a nice FPS market. For a couple years. Then the console becomes obsolete- i.e. a PS4. Suddenly isn't on a new platform requiring a new overhaul to update the game. Dusties will have to purchase another iteration of DUST. Then again. And each time will lose players.
Compare it to a PC game which can last years if not longer because the underlying components can be upgraded without needing a complete hardware change on the consumer side.
The console can handle the game, but it'll be a flash in a pan, and then gone. I give it about a year after release before it's abondoned.
|
Jokerface666
Ever Flow Northern Coalition.
57
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:16:00 -
[203] - Quote
I'm actually glad to hear that,
a company need to get fresh blood and get rid of all the hot air, sometimes. with the rate CCP grew, i am sure there were people employed who were just good at talking and making promises.
Yeah it is bad for the affected people, but i am also sure it is worth it. ------------------------------w00t w00t rapetrain------------------------------ |
Omega Tron
Amarr Mining Inc Technical Exploration Conglomerate of Hemera
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:16:00 -
[204] - Quote
To those CCP folks that will now have to leave I would like to wish you the very best of luck. You are without a dought the very best of the gaming development world.
To CCP Management you better do better in the future and never have to do this sort of action again. Otherwise, I will be joining the 5000+ that have left this game and you. |
Solhild
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
27
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:16:00 -
[205] - Quote
Resubbing accounts and adding another soon |
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
388
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:17:00 -
[206] - Quote
Vincent Gaines wrote:
Sure, you get a nice FPS market. For a couple years.
Compare it to a PC game which can last years
Doh!
LOL
Mr Epeen
If you can read this, you haven't blocked me yet. |
Kengutsi Akira
55
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:19:00 -
[207] - Quote
Alpheias wrote:It boggles one's mind that CCP are sacking developers & community when it is the MANAGEMENT that should be let go.
gotta agree here. It wasnt the ppl's faults who are getting the axe that caused Hilmar to be all "See what they do not what they say" What Mittani wants, Mittani gets, Mittani help us all
|
Kengutsi Akira
55
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:20:00 -
[208] - Quote
Solhild wrote:Resubbing accounts and adding another soon
no troll meant but how does this have to do with the topic? Theyre firing 20% of their staff and thats good enough for you to resub? What Mittani wants, Mittani gets, Mittani help us all
|
Kinroi Alari
Pan Galactic Gargle Blasters Important Internet Spaceship League
8
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:21:00 -
[209] - Quote
Best of luck to both those now looking elsewhere and to those at CCP working on making their goals a reality.
|
Dasola
Rookies Empire Rookie Empire
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:23:00 -
[210] - Quote
Just wondering how many developers from WoD will be assigned to eve from now on?
Glad to see that ccp management finally see the light, that player base has been trying to point out on them for so long.
Now 20% reduction on developer force? Does that also reflect equal 20% reduction on management staff as well? As in useless bosses that dont even know EvE we players love?
Hopeing thay by next summer we also get reworked corporate management with much more leaner access management, etc... [Insert something funny or smart here] |
|
Alpheias
Euphoria Released HYDRA RELOADED
94
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:24:00 -
[211] - Quote
Kengutsi Akira wrote:Solhild wrote:Resubbing accounts and adding another soon no troll meant but how does this have to do with the topic? Theyre firing 20% of their staff and thats good enough for you to resub?
If CCP made a statement that if X amount of people resubbed their accounts, people's jobs would be saved. I would resub several of mine.
GÖœ When your ship gets blown to bits GÖœ And you lose your Faction fits \Gÿ+/ Don't worry GÖ¬ GÖœ GÖ¬ GÖœ GÖœ GÖ¬ GÖœ GÖ¬ Be Happy \Gÿ+/ |
Jolteon Taylor
The Scope Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:25:00 -
[212] - Quote
Does anyone know which current CCP staff came from White Wolf, and thus, are likely the ones facing the chop?
Alpheias wrote: If CCP made a statement that if X amount of people resubbed their accounts, people's jobs would be saved. I would resub several of mine.
Sure thing, me too. In these times, no one should be loosing their job. |
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
388
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:30:00 -
[213] - Quote
Alpheias wrote:It boggles one's mind that CCP are sacking developers & community when it is the MANAGEMENT that should be let go.
Agreed
CCP needs management that doesn't cower in fear of a few whiners threatening to quit.
Management that won't change direction every two weeks to try and suck up to a few entitled forum brats.
Mr Epeen If you can read this, you haven't blocked me yet. |
Midge Mo'yb
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
31
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:31:00 -
[214] - Quote
Jolteon Taylor wrote:Great news for EVEs future, although such a shame it had to happen like this.
I do hope CCP_FallOut gets to keep her job. I do enjoy following her tweets \o/
http://www.almaroc.com/?p=1896
:(
|
Ugleb
Sarz'na Khumatari Ushra'Khan
51
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:33:00 -
[215] - Quote
My best wishes to anyone I've ever met out there affected by this, and good luck to you if you are still waiting to hear news. I'm very much saddened to hear that things have come to this and hope that you all come back from this quickly and strongly.
To all those remaining at CCP, know that the community does hope that good things emerge from all this and that you will soon be joined by new or even returning colleagues as CCP and EVE returns to a stronger and surer footing. http://uglebsjournal.wordpress.com/ |
Jolteon Taylor
The Scope Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:34:00 -
[216] - Quote
Midge Mo'yb wrote:Jolteon Taylor wrote:Great news for EVEs future, although such a shame it had to happen like this.
I do hope CCP_FallOut gets to keep her job. I do enjoy following her tweets \o/ http://www.almaroc.com/?p=1896:( O HELL NO. Fallout was totally the best community person. Totally gutted, she shouldn't be the one paying the price of CCPs runins with the community, not at all. |
Endeavour Starfleet
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
17
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:35:00 -
[217] - Quote
I am very sorry to hear of job losses. That is not fun in the least.
However, I do have to say that sadly this is what happens when employees flat out ignore issues that effect the player base.
You ignored the players on Incarna and as a result thousands of paying accounts lapsed.
You continue to ignore AFK Cloaking and more than a few accounts have given up over that. Same with other issues that drive people out of nullsec and allow the big alliances to accumulate and hold great power allowing them to be very picky on who they allow into the club.
I would personally like to run 3-4 accounts. However, I am not going to do it when concerns don't even get a dev response even after topic after topic.
Show me what you will DO about these issues or atleast what the view of the DEV team is. And then ACT on them. And maybe JUST maybe the playerbase will be happy to increase sub count and allow you to do the rehires to make your World of Darkness game. |
Demetri Slavic
Veto. Veto Corp
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:35:00 -
[218] - Quote
This is ********.
The people that are being let go are the ones that were holding the community together, the ones that actually had the right idea.
Well done CCP, just as you were turning it arround you manage to shoot both your feet off. |
Covert Kitty
SRS Industries SRS.
14
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:37:00 -
[219] - Quote
While it's important to feel solidarity with those who loose their jobs, it's vastly more important to get Eve back on the right track. Eve is after all the only real product CCP has. Unless your blizzard, and have vast sums of money, or are willing to leverage yourself into a potentially compromising position (which CCP may have already done), a serious shift in focus will mean cuts and re-purposing. So hearing that that is specifically what CCP plans on doing is in my opinion very good to hear.
|
Renan Ruivo
Hipernova Vera Cruz Alliance
186
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:38:00 -
[220] - Quote
Midge Mo'yb wrote:Jolteon Taylor wrote:Great news for EVEs future, although such a shame it had to happen like this.
I do hope CCP_FallOut gets to keep her job. I do enjoy following her tweets \o/ http://www.almaroc.com/?p=1896:(
So.
Obvioulsy Hillmar wishes to pass blame on all those who were involved on the forefront of the community management during the summer monoclegate, and poor Fallout was to blame as well? How is firing one of the most well known and respected community staff members going to help things?
And let me guess, CCP Pann kept her job?
Ridiculous. Sometimes the only difference between a budding genius and a blooming idiot is where they chose to take a stand. |
|
Bio Fade
United Aerospace Co-op
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:38:00 -
[221] - Quote
I dont get DUST 514 and how you are going to make money on it. World of Darkness I get and I see how it will make money. I think you made the wrong choice. But Eve has been neglected and I suppose this was overdue. We the community feel your heartbreak and are very sad people will be let go. Although this is good news for Eve players its hard to be excited about it. But at least come winter I wont be pissed off again. |
Verone
Veto Corp
73
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:40:00 -
[222] - Quote
Renan Ruivo wrote:And let me guess, CCP Pann kept her job?
Ridiculous.
Actually no, she didn't.
This is insane.
Verone CEO & Executor Veto Corp WWW.VETO-CORP.COM |
Jolteon Taylor
The Scope Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:41:00 -
[223] - Quote
Renan Ruivo wrote:Midge Mo'yb wrote:Jolteon Taylor wrote:Great news for EVEs future, although such a shame it had to happen like this.
I do hope CCP_FallOut gets to keep her job. I do enjoy following her tweets \o/ http://www.almaroc.com/?p=1896:( So. Obvioulsy Hillmar wishes to pass blame on all those who were involved on the forefront of the community management during the summer monoclegate, and poor Fallout was to blame as well? How is firing one of the most well known and respected community staff members going to help things? And let me guess, CCP Pann kept her job? Ridiculous. This. It seems the totally wrong people are paying the price for CCPs runins with the community. |
Alpheias
Euphoria Released HYDRA RELOADED
95
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:43:00 -
[224] - Quote
Verone wrote:
This is insane.
Insane doesn't come even close. 10/19 2011 - never forget the 20%
|
|
CCP Manifest
C C P C C P Alliance
134
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:43:00 -
[225] - Quote
My good friend CCP Fallout wrote a heartfelt message that she shared with #tweetfleet. You may remember her from such things as deleting your post or promoting your awesome player creation. I asked her if I could also share it here.
She will be dearly missed at CCP.
An Open Letter to the Players of EVE Online
Heya guys,
Many of you know me as CCP Fallout, but to most people IGÇÖm just plain old Mist. If you are reading this, there is a good chance you already know that CCP has laid off approximately 20% of its workforce. I am one of the 20%.
For the last three years, I have been the associate community manager for EVE Online. I have had both the honor and the privilege to not only work with an absolutely amazing team, but extremely talented and passionate designers, programmers, QA, customer support and others who have brought, and continue to bring, EVE Online to life. My co-workers have, and I hope will continue to, inspire, educate, amuse, and drive me bat **** crazy. These people are extremely passionate about their work, and each of them is tremendously talented. It has always bugged me that players never truly got to see this side of EVE OnlineGÇÖs devs unless they went to Fanfest. When you speak face-to-face with someone at CCP about EVE Online, thatGÇÖs not just some mask they are wearing for three daysGǪ EVE Online is something we love, something we want to grow, and something we are proud of. In this respect, EVE OnlineGÇÖs devs really are not that much different from players, even if I know you might not believe me when I say it.
And of course, none of this would happen without you, the players, the most amazingly insane bunch of space assholes (1, 2) ever to play an MMO ever. I have been so incredibly blessed to have had the privilege and honor of working for you all these years, and thank you for allowing me into your universe. Not a day has gone by where I wasnGÇÖt either amused or shocked by some of the crazy things you guys would come up with. Every day was an adventure; every day was an experience that I canGÇÖt ever forget. I am indebted to the EVE community teaching me both passion and humility, and for reminding me how important the voice of a community is during both the good and bad times.
So, what does the future bring for me? IGÇÖm not entirely sure. To be honest, I am a bit scared and concerned, but I am hopeful. I do realize that I am probably going to have to stop wearing pajamas all day, and introduce myself to some soap, but I am confident that things will be okay. And I wish the same thing for all of my friends who currently are on the same boat as I.
Please do fly safely. IGÇÖm going to go now, because I am starting to cry.
P.S. Yes, I know whatGÇÖs coming into the game next. No, I will not tell you
1. You know I only mean this with love! 2. Also: haha, no blackfilter on my site! ======== o7 CCP Manifest | Public Relations and Social Media | @ccp_manifest |
|
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CCP Manifest
C C P C C P Alliance
134
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:44:00 -
[226] - Quote
I see above that a couple people posted this already. Thank you. ======== o7 CCP Manifest | Public Relations and Social Media | @ccp_manifest |
|
DaiTengu
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
25
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:44:00 -
[227] - Quote
Renan Ruivo wrote:Midge Mo'yb wrote:Jolteon Taylor wrote:Great news for EVEs future, although such a shame it had to happen like this.
I do hope CCP_FallOut gets to keep her job. I do enjoy following her tweets \o/ http://www.almaroc.com/?p=1896:( So. Obvioulsy Hillmar wishes to pass blame on all those who were involved on the forefront of the community management during the summer monoclegate, and poor Fallout was to blame as well? How is firing one of the most well known and respected community staff members going to help things? And let me guess, CCP Pann kept her job? Ridiculous.
There's no blame being thrown around it all here. People that are losing their jobs are just not considered as vital as the people who are keeping them. |
Zeomebuch Nova
Metalworks
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:45:00 -
[228] - Quote
Tippia wrote:ThirdlyGǪ SHAMESHAME wrote:To each and every person who whined their way through the last few months, congratulations. You got your pixels, database entries and pretend warfare. Real people lost jobs. There was nothing so wrong with the game that it should have meant taking real food off the real tables of real people. It is my sincere hope that you too find yourself in the unemployment line. GǪyou're an idiot. The reason those people lost their jobs was because CCP made the horribly bad decision of not feeding its golden goose. There were (and still are) plenty of things wrong with the game, but had they've been attended to, people would have felt far more compelled to keep giving CCP money, which might have kept those people in their jobs. We are not a welfare agency GÇö we are customers, and if we do not get the product we pay for, then it is right to not give the producer any money, and it is right for them to have to adjust their production to fix the issues they caused.
In fact, blame the CEO, not the customers.
shameshame needs the same intensity of reality check as Hilmar did year ago.
|
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
649
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:46:00 -
[229] - Quote
Midge Mo'yb wrote:Jolteon Taylor wrote:Great news for EVEs future, although such a shame it had to happen like this.
I do hope CCP_FallOut gets to keep her job. I do enjoy following her tweets \o/ http://www.almaroc.com/?p=1896:(
Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Azelor Delaria
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
44
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:47:00 -
[230] - Quote
I said what I wanted to in the "unofficial" thread. However, I feel like I should say the following.
Hilmar's job, as CEO of CCP, is to make the company money. To do so, he should have been following the core tenets of basic entrepreneurship:
1.) Never stray from your source material. 2.) Never grow beyond your means. 3.) Create a product and maintain it until you can branch off. 4.) Keep your customers happy.
Do all of this, and nine-times-out-of-ten you will have a solid business. I've pointed to Blizzard many times in the past, and the reason for this is simple: they provide a quality set of products (I refuse to group World of Warcraft and Starcraft as the same "product", even though I play both) and continue to support them.
EVE Online is a niche game. It is not going to be as mainstream as World of Warcraft or Rift, because those games cater to people who simply want to come home, do a dungeon, and otherwise not spend too much time worrying about stuff they may lose. EVE is purely about destruction. We lose ships and modules, which means we lose money. Whether we destroy other ships before this happens is inconsequential - you are still risking your own in-game currency. And it's not like you can toggle a flag to prevent. In one way or another, you'll be engaged and the chance of losing every ship you have is real.
I remember not too long ago CCP releasing a "promotional" video titled "The Butterfly Effect". The gist was simple: every action a person takes in EVE Online has a real and somewhat-lasting impact on the game for others. The same can be said for any company, not just CCP: the actions taken by a person has an impact on everyone else. We are seeing that here.
Hilmar has no reason to fear for his job. Until such time as there is some cataclysmic incident where money is lost at a rate the company can not make back in a foreseeable future, everyone under him is expendable. That is the problem.
The entire source for the original post was an attempt by CCP to try to guilt trip us. They wanted us to look at it and go, "Wow, we caused this to happen". Undoubtedly, many CCP "fanbois" (or alternatively, CCP employees masquerading as "players") will post (or have, I haven't read through the entire thread yet) saying we are wrong, and because we were selfish people lost their jobs.
**** that.
The reason these people lost their jobs is because of Hilmar. I know that a reduction of a workforce by 20%, no matter how large a company, is something that is not decided upon lightly, and is not something a company is willing to do unless it is absolutely required to save money. Hilmar's greed, Hilmar's selfishness cost these people their jobs.
The developers for these games should have been in control. Because they weren't, people are losing their jobs. CCP can say they're "helping" to find them alternative employment, but I highly doubt that's happening. Where would these people go? The competition? Would you give your competitors employees you were terminating?
Hilmar says he's sorry and humbled because of recent events. He refused to talk to us when Monoclegate happened. The PR department threw CCP Pann to the hungry masses of players as the sacrificial lamb, and since she didn't want to be that lamb, she did what any good person does and threw the idiots in charge under the bus. "Mutually Assured Destruction" wasn't just the name of the game in the Cold War. What's to bet that had things turned out worse, CCP Pann would have been terminated way back when?
What's to say she isn't one of the people being terminated right now?
Hilmar et al. made their bed, and now they're being forced to sleep in it. And to try to deflect attention away from their idiocy, they're trying to tell us we're bad people for wanting the game we pay to play looked at more than once in a blue moon.
Taking bets now that at the next quarterly fiscal report, when CCP's finances are down, Hilmar blames the players for not meeting quota. |
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Kumq uat
Mercurialis Inc. RAZOR Alliance
21
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:48:00 -
[231] - Quote
I was worried about something like this. We knew that loan renegotiation was coming up and I believe this is a direct result of that. It makes sense from a business stand point but I know personally at least one of the people directly hit by this. Sad panda I am. |
Endeavour Starfleet
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
17
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:48:00 -
[232] - Quote
Alpheias wrote:Kengutsi Akira wrote:Solhild wrote:Resubbing accounts and adding another soon no troll meant but how does this have to do with the topic? Theyre firing 20% of their staff and thats good enough for you to resub? If CCP made a statement that if X amount of people resubbed their accounts, people's jobs would be saved. I would resub several of mine.
Yet you wont hold them online. Atleast not long enough for WoD.
I also want them to keep their jobs. Yet I need more than WoD to convince me having a third account or more is worth it. And for that to happen I need to know that they are going to fix these issues they have ignored. And that they are not going to pull something crazy to change the very nature of nullsec such as removing local or another mass change in risk vs reward.
I will admit that TiDi has me tempted. TiDi is going to mean more ships lost. And better battles. This will improve the markets for industry significantly and maybe even allow basic drops to be profitable again. That and other ideas mentioned so far have the potential to make eve something to look forward to logging into again.
So CCP I would happily accept 500M plex prices if I see you are also willing to open further up to the community and do the changes needed that might not be the new shiny thing. Fix AFK cloaking so I am not someone's free hotdrop lunch. Fix the issues with POS and Corp operations and I will buy those 3+ plex with a smile on my face and drool leaking out over the next CTA. |
Josefius
Caldari Elite Force Apocalypse Now.
16
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:48:00 -
[233] - Quote
Oh no, not CCP Fallout :( what a loss to the community. |
Sarinat Talen
Celestial Arms Manufacturing and Operations New Eden Research.
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:50:00 -
[234] - Quote
This is disgusting. CCP management is responsible for the events of the last few months. Now you are "stretched too thin" so you are firing people? I am glad I don't work for CCP. |
Jags
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:50:00 -
[235] - Quote
So which one of the senior management is gonna go then ?
I bet its the same bullshit that happens in every company , the normal employees pay for the ******** mistakes of senior management with thier jobs while those people sitting in the iviory towers **** each other off coz they have saved x million whatevers by making people redundant.,
Proof that CCP are just a company and are as big a pile of cunts as any other company. |
|
Chribba
Otherworld Enterprises Otherworld Empire
584
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:51:00 -
[236] - Quote
This kinda sucks and I feel for all CCP employees affected by this decision. I thank you for all you've done for EVE and us in the community, you will be missed!
Best regards, Chribba
|
|
Euphonus
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:51:00 -
[237] - Quote
Why are people like Fallout being fired over WoD people? honestly? You're just going to drive players to another mass-unsub protest if we keep finding out the good hardworking and friendly CCP employees who have always had EVE (the game, not yours, though they should be aligning)'s best interests at hard are being fired. |
Renan Ruivo
Hipernova Vera Cruz Alliance
186
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:53:00 -
[238] - Quote
DaiTengu wrote:Renan Ruivo wrote:Midge Mo'yb wrote:Jolteon Taylor wrote:Great news for EVEs future, although such a shame it had to happen like this.
I do hope CCP_FallOut gets to keep her job. I do enjoy following her tweets \o/ http://www.almaroc.com/?p=1896:( So. Obvioulsy Hillmar wishes to pass blame on all those who were involved on the forefront of the community management during the summer monoclegate, and poor Fallout was to blame as well? How is firing one of the most well known and respected community staff members going to help things? And let me guess, CCP Pann kept her job? Ridiculous. There's no blame being thrown around it all here. People that are losing their jobs are just not considered as vital as the people who are keeping them.
So i guess that the kind of trust and respect we had in CCP Fallout as a community manager ("assistant" my ass.. what sort of "community manager" was CCP Pann if i never ever seen one post from her if not for damage control during the monoclegate. Fallout was the one that worked with us) was non essential for someone on that role? Sometimes the only difference between a budding genius and a blooming idiot is where they chose to take a stand. |
Renan Ruivo
Hipernova Vera Cruz Alliance
186
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:55:00 -
[239] - Quote
And by the way i'm not saying that anyone who got fired had it coming, but there are those to blame about the whole thing that happened during summer, and that did not get what was coming to them. As much as i blame CCP Pann for the miscomunication during the start of the whole drame at least she had the courage to post and admit she was to blame on that specific issue.
To this day though some people still pretend they had nothing to do with it. Sometimes the only difference between a budding genius and a blooming idiot is where they chose to take a stand. |
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
388
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:55:00 -
[240] - Quote
Whew...
Lot of alt posting going on in the last few pages. By alt, I mean the only posts in their history are in this thread.
Odd thing. Anyone have a reason for this ?
Mr Epeen If you can read this, you haven't blocked me yet. |
|
Smoking Blunts
Zebra Corp BricK sQuAD.
115
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:56:00 -
[241] - Quote
hilmar was and is the problem. he should have been top of the redundancy list.
posted from another topic CCP-áare full of words and no action. We watch what they do and its nothing but false statements and lies.
|
Jolteon Taylor
The Scope Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:56:00 -
[242] - Quote
Renan Ruivo wrote:
So i guess that the kind of trust and respect we had in CCP Fallout as a community manager ("assistant" my ass.. what sort of "community manager" was CCP Pann if i never ever seen one post from her if not for damage control during the monoclegate. Fallout was the one that worked with us) was non essential for someone on that role?
Apparently having a community that actually trusts you, unlike most of your co-workers, doesn't mean anything for CCP. |
Barakkus
851
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 18:57:00 -
[243] - Quote
Midge Mo'yb wrote:Jolteon Taylor wrote:Great news for EVEs future, although such a shame it had to happen like this.
I do hope CCP_FallOut gets to keep her job. I do enjoy following her tweets \o/ http://www.almaroc.com/?p=1896:(
OMG NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO |
Yblarbo Janks
Veto. Veto Corp
6
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:00:00 -
[244] - Quote
Game industry workers are a close knit bunch, xxxxxx and I had dinner two months ago and he/she said "Everyoen in this industry knows everyone else". I don't work in the industry, but I have gotten to know several that do over the years. And it seems nothing has changed since when I was more involved of the days of Ultima Online. Companies quickly earned reputation and their reputation spread quickly due to this tight knit industry.
Look at some other games in this industry, and you can see when they shift from the passionate focus into the managerial/business focus....things decline. It's not just that they made bad decisions, but they can no longer attract the really good talent because those people do not feel like they will have a secure employment after joining.
I personally know some people that were just let go, and they had one thing in common -- Passion. I don't care how much you know about a product -- if you lack passion, you will not have much to add to the improvement, promotion, and support of said product.
CCP is now tarnished with a reputation that if you are in the market for a job that they just cleared out, you are first to go. It doesn't matter if these positions open up sooner or later, those applying will know. And tThe people that will fill those jobs if they come back open will often not be the same caliber as the ones we lost. Worse is if these positions are gone for good, I'm seeing drastic cuts to what I consider important areas.
In summary, I honestly feel for the first time this is the confirmation that Eve Online is on a downward track - and it's one that not many actually will see right now, but down the road will be able to look back and think "you know, it all started then" |
Renan Ruivo
Hipernova Vera Cruz Alliance
186
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:00:00 -
[245] - Quote
Smoking Blunts wrote:hilmar was and is the problem. he should have been top of the redundancy list.
posted from another topic
I disagree. Like him or not Hillmar has a lot of good things he did to and with EVE, and probably a lot more still. He just need to get his priorities straight.
And get rid of the bunch of Yes-Men he surely haves around him that added to the problem. I'm sure that there were those who told him that all the wrong decisions he made over the past two years were good decisions only to please the boss even though they knew better.
Stop listening to the ones who agree with everything you say, and listen to all those close to you who flash the red light. Sometimes the only difference between a budding genius and a blooming idiot is where they chose to take a stand. |
XIRUSPHERE
Deadly Intent.
7
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:01:00 -
[246] - Quote
No fault lays with the customers for this it's a problem that has been festering for years. I find it rather repugnant that some valuable people who are part of this community are getting the axe when the blame lies with the upper echelon of CCP. The people that truly need to go are the individuals who are responsible for bringing in so called market experts and professional shills and hacks who thought they could bring their master crafted bullshit and corporatist new speak here of all places.
The fault lies with those who envisioned reinventing the wheel as a prudent choice for development which has led to stagnation and failure on all fronts for CCP when they could have just licensed the unreal engine and had WIS, and WOD released and highly functional by now and could have done a PC based dust on the same premise that would have had true integration with EVE.
This is what happens when greed is good and innovation and efficiency are allowed to be poisoned by hubris. If CCP can make these sacrifices now and be forthcoming it's time for the CSM to go as well. It has never been more evident that the individuals are not representative of this community and it's needs and are simply a mouthpiece and element of distraction and a bad PR tool all around.
If you want to cut the fat and bullshit cut them too and keep talking openly with the community. Good people have lost their jobs because arrogance, greed, and disinformation have been your mantra for far too long CCP it's your time to make it right or face driving your company fully into the ground. |
Blood Fart
Republic University Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:01:00 -
[247] - Quote
Anyone else hear a toilet flushing?
The employees who couldn't sell a load of bullshit get "let go" so the idiots who came up with the bullshit can get the same size pay checks?
Ah well at least the people working in the US studio can get extensions on unemployment checks for like 3 years now..... |
Zeomebuch Nova
Metalworks
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:01:00 -
[248] - Quote
Smoking Blunts wrote:hilmar was and is the problem. he should have been top of the redundancy list.
posted from another topic
a decent CEO would leave by himself, before everyone else, after such a failure. Guess what... |
Cyprus Black
82nd Assault Fleet
44
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:04:00 -
[249] - Quote
I am upset with CCP.
Generic insults at CCPs competence. References to incomplete and broken content. Astonishment at CCPs inability to see this coming when everyone else did. Loud noises!
I am neither fanboy nor flamer. I am logic, dispassionate and cruel. |
Renan Ruivo
Hipernova Vera Cruz Alliance
186
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:05:00 -
[250] - Quote
Zeomebuch Nova wrote:Smoking Blunts wrote:hilmar was and is the problem. he should have been top of the redundancy list.
posted from another topic a decent CEO would leave by himself, before everyone else, after such a failure. Guess what...
Last thing CCP needs right now is for the CEO to step down. If he does, CCP stock will plummet, and the company will die. Regardless if Jesus Christ himself fills the position of new CEO. Sometimes the only difference between a budding genius and a blooming idiot is where they chose to take a stand. |
|
Schnoo
EC Riders Mech Alliance
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:07:00 -
[251] - Quote
Changing where the funding goes is one thing, and I do thing focusing on the eve franchise (eve online & dust) is the right thing to do at the moment, but firing people seems to indicate giving up. I would've wished if you could've just reassigned fired people to eve online itself. |
Barakkus
851
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:07:00 -
[252] - Quote
Blood Fart wrote:so the idiots who came up with the bullshit can get the same size pay checks?
I would venture a guess quite a few people if not all of them took sizeable paycuts. |
MG Dubbs
Viziam Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:07:00 -
[253] - Quote
Wait, you have too many projects going on simultaneously for a company your size, so your answer is to fire people? I dont get it. Why dont you just drop "world of darkness" or whatever that game is called. |
Covert Kitty
SRS Industries SRS.
14
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:09:00 -
[254] - Quote
Some of the replies here are just silly
Quote:Hilmar has no reason to fear for his job ...... everyone under him is expendable. That is the problem. So some people in PR loose their jobs and suddenly you think everyone under the ceo is expendable? The best PR is a good game, a good game is made by programmers and artists. Don't get me wrong, PR is important, but don't inflate their role just because you hear from them more often than others.
Quote:The entire source for the original post was an attempt by CCP to try to guilt trip us. ..... and because we were selfish people lost their jobs. Funny, I was there shooting the statue in jita for a day and a half with the rest because I was pissed off about all the problems in Eve that were being ignored and the introduction of half finished, stupid features nobody cared about.
So CCP finally starts to come to terms with the fact they were spending too many resources on projects that were not going to give a return any time soon. That they were probably over staffed and misdirected at projects other than Eve, their core business. So yes I am quite happy with this announcement, it shows that they are taking this seriously, provided that out of this comes real results, then I'm happy.
|
Myrhial Arkenath
Ghost Festival Naraka.
20
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:09:00 -
[255] - Quote
Today truly is a black day for the EVE community. Yes, I know you had to do this, but look at the costs. I hope you are aware that you are losing people who are one of a kind. I hope, for the sake of those who get to stay, and for the time that both those staying and leaving have put into the game, that EVE will pull through. Please, never ever waste good things like this again, I beg of you. CEO of Ghost Festival :: Co-Executor of Naraka. Blog: Diary of a Pod Pilot |
Reverand Pastor
Dynasty Ink.
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:10:00 -
[256] - Quote
The anger and sadness I feel right now is overwhelming. There isnt a sub-section for the last year that has been screaming about the 100's of things that dont work properly or entirely broken (Faction Warfare) and now due to the failures of upper management people are losing there jobs. The player base has been given the shaft and now employees who have NOTHING to do with the mistakes are getting the brunt end of incompitence. To say CCP is not in trouble is disinginuis(sp) and miseading. "Butterfly Effect" is right CCP. Youve managed to neglect 100k plus subscribers and pit peoples livleyhood and families in peril not because of unforseen events BUT OF YOUR OWN DOING!! |
AlleyKat
The Unwanted.
27
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:10:00 -
[257] - Quote
Dear CCP upper management,
Firstly, and I say this with a wry smile on my face, welcome back from The Ivory Tower!
For too long now you have resided at armGÇÖs length from the realities of one of the greatest creations in gaming history; New Eden.
Internally IGÇÖm confident you refer to New Eden as EVE and for the sake of typing I too have called New Eden EVE, but EVE is New Eden and New Eden is your creation.
It may be our sand, but it is your box. A box that you built with your bare hands and itGÇÖs something to be proud of.
Secondly, this return to the box hopefully has made you realise what your company is, what it means and what defines it.
CCP = New Eden, and New Eden = CCP.
What affects one, affects the other.
My advice to you on Dust:
1)Understand your audience better 2)Aggressively market to that audience cheaply 3)Stop over-intellectualising your intellectual property whilst marketing it 4)Create a force of antagonism in the game GÇô racial, technological or psychological, or all three 5)Turn everything Up To Eleven. From the gun recoil, to the music, to the marketing GÇô even the intro login screen should feel like this
My advice to you on New Eden:
IGÇÖm going to give you your own advice, or rather, something Reynir Hardarson said in an interview in 2002:
GÇ£ItGÇÖs a Dark World; a cold, harsh world. Not just one with good or evil GÇô theyGÇÖre all sort of dark and decadent. You go into combat, and itGÇÖs NOT going to be WagnerGǪindustrial techno or really hard drum and bassGÇ¥
GÇ£Friends are enemies that are more profitable to keep aliveGÇ¥
IGÇÖll leave it thereGǪ
AK "Combat in New Eden is either a blob or a work of art...let me paint you a picture" |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
680
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:13:00 -
[258] - Quote
MG Dubbs wrote:Wait, you have too many projects going on simultaneously for a company your size, so your answer is to fire people? I dont get it. Why dont you just drop "world of darkness" or whatever that game is called. Because in spite of all this, they need to diversify, or the company will not last.
WoD is an IP they have at hand and that hey have already put some work into. It's just that it will not crate any near-future income, so it gets to sit on the bench until they can make that happen. In the mean-time, Dust has a change of creating an influx of cash (even if it doesn't go so far as to generate profit) that lets them keep moving forward.
If they can't release WoD at some point in the future, they're screwed. At the same time, they can't release it now, because then they're screwed too. GÇöGÇöGÇö GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥ GÇö Karath Piki-á |
Barakkus
851
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:14:00 -
[259] - Quote
Yblarbo Janks wrote: In summary, I honestly feel for the first time this is the confirmation that Eve Online is on a downward track - and it's one that not many actually will see right now, but down the road will be able to look back and think "you know, it all started then"
It's not. This happens all the time in the gaming industry. SOE has done it a few times, but not publicly, I'm sure Blizzard has, Bioware, etc.
As long as the product is still solid, then the problems that caused this will be overcome. As I see it right now, EVE is still a solid product and can pull CCP as a whole out of whatever difficulties they are experiencing right now.
EVE is far from dead, and I think a bit of restructuring and re-prioritizing as they are doing now will keep it solid for a good long while still. |
Covert Kitty
SRS Industries SRS.
14
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:15:00 -
[260] - Quote
MG Dubbs wrote:Wait, you have too many projects going on simultaneously for a company your size, so your answer is to fire people? I dont get it. Why dont you just drop "world of darkness" or whatever that game is called.
..... right, more or less that's what they did, it turns out that "canceling/delaying" world of darkness means laying people off, who would have thought? lol
Listen, some tech for WoD is applicable to EvE, so you keep devs working on that common tech, perhaps some artists are valuable assets so you re-purpose those for awhile. You let go redundant people, and repurpose others. Focus on getting Dust out the door to increase revenue and focus on making the Eve community happy and continuing to grow.
CCP is not Bliz, they likely over leveraged themselves with these two other projects and need to refocus things to actually get stuff done. |
|
Illwill Bill
Svea Rike Controlled Chaos
19
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:15:00 -
[261] - Quote
It's sad that things went this far.
Best wishes to all those affected by this. |
Yblarbo Janks
Veto. Veto Corp
6
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:17:00 -
[262] - Quote
Barakkus wrote:Yblarbo Janks wrote: In summary, I honestly feel for the first time this is the confirmation that Eve Online is on a downward track - and it's one that not many actually will see right now, but down the road will be able to look back and think "you know, it all started then"
It's not. This happens all the time in the gaming industry. SOE has done it a few times, but not publicly, I'm sure Blizzard has, Bioware, etc. As long as the product is still solid, then the problems that caused this will be overcome. As I see it right now, EVE is still a solid product and can pull CCP as a whole out of whatever difficulties they are experiencing right now. EVE is far from dead, and I think a bit of restructuring and re-prioritizing as they are doing now will keep it solid for a good long while still.
Thinking more on it, there is one big difference here. They have a direction that we collectively think is good (the updates from past two weeks).
|
La Merovingian
Veto. Veto Corp
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:22:00 -
[263] - Quote
I'm guessing that since they've fired the CCP'ers who were in charge of organizing Fan Fest, that there will be no Fan Fest?
Even if there is still a Fan Fest, I have no desire to spend money on a community event when CCP clearly has no concept of the EVE community. The dismissal of so many of our friends who fought to keep the relationship between the community and the company alive is unforgivable. I haven't decided if I'm going to cancel my accounts just yet, but I will not be spending thousands of dollars to attend a "Fan Fest" that has lost all of it's meaning for me.
Restructuring. Reorganizing. Call it what you want. I understand that some people had to be let go. I understand the shift in priorities. What I cannot understand is how you can justify dismissing EVE Staff (not WoD or DUST), when you're supposed to be refocusing on EVE. How can you let Community Management and Content be whittled down to nothing, when these pillars of your company were the ones who did their damnedest to stem the tide of fleeing accounts? They lived, breathed, and bled EVE Online for you, and you repay them by showing them the door. They weren't just talking heads for CCP. They were people who related to players, and players related to them. The majority of them had earned the trust and respect of the community when so many within CCP had blackened and tarnished themselves in our eyes.
As I sit in my chair and stair at my computer screen in disbelief, I struggle to read and type through tears. I know that those who were let go are all talented in their own right, and that they will eventually pick themselves back up. But that doesn't make it any easier for me to see my friends suffer. None of them deserved this.
|
Barakkus
851
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:25:00 -
[264] - Quote
Yblarbo Janks wrote:Barakkus wrote:Yblarbo Janks wrote: In summary, I honestly feel for the first time this is the confirmation that Eve Online is on a downward track - and it's one that not many actually will see right now, but down the road will be able to look back and think "you know, it all started then"
It's not. This happens all the time in the gaming industry. SOE has done it a few times, but not publicly, I'm sure Blizzard has, Bioware, etc. As long as the product is still solid, then the problems that caused this will be overcome. As I see it right now, EVE is still a solid product and can pull CCP as a whole out of whatever difficulties they are experiencing right now. EVE is far from dead, and I think a bit of restructuring and re-prioritizing as they are doing now will keep it solid for a good long while still. Thinking more on it, there is one big difference here. They have a direction that we collectively think is good (the updates from past two weeks).
Yeah, if they hadn't made the decisions they have just made in terms of their core product, then I would say they're in pretty deep ****, but I do think they are going to be just fine, this is just a bump in the road...or a giant pot-hole at least... |
Master Akira
Shiva Morsus Mihi
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:26:00 -
[265] - Quote
So, in order to save the game you fire Fallout and Valar and keep... t0rtifrans? Really??
GOOD JOB! |
Kozmic
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
8
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:28:00 -
[266] - Quote
CCP Manifest wrote:My good friend CCP Fallout wrote a heartfelt message that she shared with #tweetfleet. You may remember her from such things as deleting your post or promoting your awesome player creation. I asked her if I could also share it here.
She will be dearly missed at CCP.
An Open Letter to the Players of EVE Online
Heya guys,
Many of you know me as CCP Fallout, but to most people IGÇÖm just plain old Mist. If you are reading this, there is a good chance you already know that CCP has laid off approximately 20% of its workforce. I am one of the 20%.
For the last three years, I have been the associate community manager for EVE Online. I have had both the honor and the privilege to not only work with an absolutely amazing team, but extremely talented and passionate designers, programmers, QA, customer support and others who have brought, and continue to bring, EVE Online to life. My co-workers have, and I hope will continue to, inspire, educate, amuse, and drive me bat **** crazy. These people are extremely passionate about their work, and each of them is tremendously talented. It has always bugged me that players never truly got to see this side of EVE OnlineGÇÖs devs unless they went to Fanfest. When you speak face-to-face with someone at CCP about EVE Online, thatGÇÖs not just some mask they are wearing for three daysGǪ EVE Online is something we love, something we want to grow, and something we are proud of. In this respect, EVE OnlineGÇÖs devs really are not that much different from players, even if I know you might not believe me when I say it.
And of course, none of this would happen without you, the players, the most amazingly insane bunch of space assholes (1, 2) ever to play an MMO ever. I have been so incredibly blessed to have had the privilege and honor of working for you all these years, and thank you for allowing me into your universe. Not a day has gone by where I wasnGÇÖt either amused or shocked by some of the crazy things you guys would come up with. Every day was an adventure; every day was an experience that I canGÇÖt ever forget. I am indebted to the EVE community teaching me both passion and humility, and for reminding me how important the voice of a community is during both the good and bad times.
So, what does the future bring for me? IGÇÖm not entirely sure. To be honest, I am a bit scared and concerned, but I am hopeful. I do realize that I am probably going to have to stop wearing pajamas all day, and introduce myself to some soap, but I am confident that things will be okay. And I wish the same thing for all of my friends who currently are on the same boat as I.
Please do fly safely. IGÇÖm going to go now, because I am starting to cry.
P.S. Yes, I know whatGÇÖs coming into the game next. No, I will not tell you
1. You know I only mean this with love! 2. Also: haha, no blackfilter on my site!
Nice going, CCP. "The community is upset - best fire all the community managers, then we won't hear how upset they are!"
How about the art team that has produced one ship per year for several years? Cut them all and just keep the guy that did the Scorpion during his breaks - with a hefty raise of course. Or how about the guy that needs 6 months to change the Logi warp speed or dramiel base speed in the database? Or - huh! - how about the inept CEO or the genius who decided that one solo room was good enough for an expansion and justifies years of development and that 70 USD is the perfect price for an in-game monocle? |
Tallianna Avenkarde
Beasts of Burden
83
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:30:00 -
[267] - Quote
Here's hoping that all that have been laid off find their next project fairly quickly. Special thoughts go out to fallout, and if the rumours are true zyrmgist, who have both been done exemploray jobs dealing with us retards.
And a sudden plunge in the sullen swell. Ten fathoms deep on the road to hell. |
James Razor
Fallen Angel's White Noise.
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:30:00 -
[268] - Quote
Well, i once said CCP always finds new ways to disapoint me. And now they prove it again.
As far as i can see it, CCPs attitude didnt change at all. In fact, they try to hide their mistakes even more behind nice words, but silently they keep doing the wrong things.
The last patch was underwhelming again. This Window Bug is annoying as hell.
As someone who was unemployed as well, i can only say that i did not want this to happen when i participated in those protests. We as customers wanted the management at CCP to realize that they where going down the wrong path.
It seems the managemet is not listening and now puting the blame on the community contacts, because they failed at selling us the crap the management wanted us to swallow.
Also, i realy doubt someone that plays eve would give a even a fart about what CCP is developing, as long as all these annoying bugs in Eve would get fixed over time. A lot of people have asked countless times for CCP to stop pushing out new stuff and entirely focus getting things to work properly.
The Monoclegate was caused not only because there was no new content for the Spaceship game, but also because the Spaceship game has issues that have not been addresed since years.
We didnt want people to lose their jobs. Especially not those people at CCP who helped to try to show those high up why we where upset and what was wrong. The sad part is that the people to blame for this are the same ones that make these decissions and for me it looks like CCP Management wants to clean up their house and get rid of those people that did not follow their road into failure.
For me this game is dying. I worked hard over years to get where i stand now, kept paying my sub in the hope that one day Eve will be as awesome as those videos always make us belive. I feel sorry that my decisions in this are affecting people, because it is my money that also contributes into securing these jobs.
But as a paying customer i have to make a decision. And tbh. i am also tired of Soon (TM).
The recent changes to Eve and the things they promised are just eyecandy. The bugs are still there, QA before patch release is still not exsisting (no matter what u claim, some things u cant miss, not if they happen EVERY time) and the changes to capital ships is a slap in the face to those you did spend money, time and countless workhours to get to fly them.
This action is just prove to the fact that the CCP of once is gone and replaced by an company as their are many others. Greedy, selfish, with a management living in an Ivory Tower and without the balls to actually take the blame for the crap they are doing.
PS: I onced said i would never post on the new forums, good work at getting me upset enough to break my word on this @Hilmar.
Old Bitter Veteran, SuperCap Owner, EX-GBC / EX-IT Member.
And as it looks, soon to be (again) EX - Eve Player. |
Zowie Powers
Hole in the wall
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:35:00 -
[269] - Quote
I hope that Hilmar isn't paying any price at all for this failure and misery he's caused, in the same way that no other CEO or Chairman ever has to feel the burn of their too little too late corrections. I hope he's still getting a big fat shiney car that he thinks he deserves. |
Azelor Delaria
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
49
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:35:00 -
[270] - Quote
Covert Kitty wrote:Some of the replies here are just silly Quote:Hilmar has no reason to fear for his job ...... everyone under him is expendable. That is the problem. So some people in PR loose their jobs and suddenly you think everyone under the ceo is expendable? The best PR is a good game, a good game is made by programmers and artists. Don't get me wrong, PR is important, but don't inflate their role just because you hear from them more often than others.
I would appreciate it if you would quote the entire sentence before trying to put words in my mouth. For those just tuning in, the entire portion of that reads:
Quote:Hilmar has no reason to fear for his job. Until such time as there is some cataclysmic incident where money is lost at a rate the company can not make back in a foreseeable future, everyone under him is expendable. That is the problem.
I bolded the entire portion that was conveniently left out. Please re-read it. :)
Quote:The entire source for the original post was an attempt by CCP to try to guilt trip us. ..... and because we were selfish people lost their jobs. Funny, I was there shooting the statue in jita for a day and a half with the rest because I was pissed off about all the problems in Eve that were being ignored and the introduction of half finished, stupid features nobody cared about.[/quote]
Once again, please quote the entire portion...
Quote:The entire source for the original post was an attempt by CCP to try to guilt trip us. They wanted us to look at it and go, "Wow, we caused this to happen". Undoubtedly, many CCP "fanbois" (or alternatively, CCP employees masquerading as "players") will post (or have, I haven't read through the entire thread yet) saying we are wrong, and because we were selfish people lost their jobs.
Please don't act like a moron and try to project your idiocy onto others. Thank you. |
|
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
33
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:39:00 -
[271] - Quote
Anyone that sees this as a good thing is not seeing what this really is.
- CCP is having financial issues.
- They also realized that the technology they bet the vampire farm on, that they couldn't deliver WiS with can't scale to an actual MMO game at this point in time. It was too resource intensive at a minimum, maybe other issues as well.
- They still believe consoles are a cash cow that will save them and DUST 514 is based on known technology, so they can deliver that.
- CCP did not ADD resources to EVE, they cut resources overall. This wasn't a "we will move 80% of our vampire wranglers to deliver WiS for example, or teach them how to makes FiS stuff". This is we are chopping up decks on our steamship to throw into the fire to keep the pumps running.
So, glad they are cutting their losses on a project that exceeded their ability to grasp and they are trying to win our "hearts and minds" with some PR spinnage but this is not time to celebrate.
This is time to ask if the sudden listing of the decks towards the bow might be something other than the ship surfing on some knarly waves like the captain just announced. Does the listing and the water up to our ankles have something to do with the second announcment that we have a new supply of fresh ice for our blender drinks?!
Issler |
Barakkus
851
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:39:00 -
[272] - Quote
Honestly guys, I can pretty much guarantee no one is keeping their salaries if they're laying people off. I would venture a guess they probably fretted over the numbers for a good long time the last couple months to try to avoid laying anyone off, in the end I'm sure they cut pay as well as let people go...and I'm pretty sure no one, absolutely no one is happy about it over there....if you actually pay attention to all the stupid little videos and stuff they put out, it's a pretty close family, I'm sure it's pretty heart breaking, all the way to the top to have to do any of this. |
Thomas Abernathy
Viziam Amarr Empire
4
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:40:00 -
[273] - Quote
So, after all the "We look at more what people say that do" You actually lost enough business to force layoffs?
Why is CCP the only one that seems surprised?
|
Florestan Bronstein
The Waterworks
112
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:40:00 -
[274] - Quote
Renan Ruivo wrote: Last thing CCP needs right now is for the CEO to step down. If he does, CCP stock will plummet, and the company will die. Regardless if Jesus Christ himself fills the position of new CEO.
CCP stock is not publicly traded. |
Hakaru Ishiwara
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
28
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:40:00 -
[275] - Quote
Barakkus wrote:Blood Fart wrote:so the idiots who came up with the bullshit can get the same size pay checks? I would venture a guess quite a few people if not all of them took sizeable paycuts. This makes me chuckle. Since when has it been typical or standard for CEOs or their executive team to take pay cuts?
Very rare is the CEO or other executive that takes a pay cut. Their egos will not let it happen.
In the case that still-employed CCP personnel did take pay cuts, then that is something that would truly impress me. Austerity measures to ensure viability are a much more intelligent way of meeting budgets (rather than layoffs).
284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284286 |
Hrug
Lutinari Syndicate Electus Matari
4
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:40:00 -
[276] - Quote
Loosing a job you love doing is the worst thing that can happen to someone, especially when it happens in a friendly environment such as CCP's.
For curiosity's sake, what do people think about the idea that CCP does the the following:
- increases our subs (temporarily perhaps?) by $1,
- doesn't fire anyone,
- reallocates the to-be-fired staff to EVE features that are in development.
I'd go for it... |
Azelor Delaria
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
49
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:41:00 -
[277] - Quote
Barakkus wrote:Honestly guys, I can pretty much guarantee no one is keeping their salaries if they're laying people off. I would venture a guess they probably fretted over the numbers for a good long time the last couple months to try to avoid laying anyone off, in the end I'm sure they cut pay as well as let people go...and I'm pretty sure no one, absolutely no one is happy about it over there....if you actually pay attention to all the stupid little videos and stuff they put out, it's a pretty close family, I'm sure it's pretty heart breaking, all the way to the top to have to do any of this.
In many instances like this, you fire peons so the higher-ups can keep their paychecks at the amount they are right now, as well as the annual "bonuses" they sneak into their contracts. |
Poloturion
Lead Farmers Kill It With Fire
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:41:00 -
[278] - Quote
Job security and the games industry tend not to mix very often.
My condolences to those who lost their jobs and wishing you luck finding a job in the industry you love. |
Barakkus
851
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:43:00 -
[279] - Quote
Azelor Delaria wrote:Barakkus wrote:Honestly guys, I can pretty much guarantee no one is keeping their salaries if they're laying people off. I would venture a guess they probably fretted over the numbers for a good long time the last couple months to try to avoid laying anyone off, in the end I'm sure they cut pay as well as let people go...and I'm pretty sure no one, absolutely no one is happy about it over there....if you actually pay attention to all the stupid little videos and stuff they put out, it's a pretty close family, I'm sure it's pretty heart breaking, all the way to the top to have to do any of this. In many instances like this, you fire peons so the higher-ups can keep their paychecks at the amount they are right now, as well as the annual "bonuses" they sneak into their contracts.
Actually that has not been my experience. I'm pretty sure all of upper management has taken their lumps in all of this as well.
Now if it were a bank or some mult-national investment firm maybe...CCP is still a small shop in comparison to most companies out there...
|
Sam Bowein
Sense Amid Madness
8
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:43:00 -
[280] - Quote
I don't get it, you say resources are stretched too thin, so you lay people off ??? |
|
Yakumo Smith
Domination. Legion of The Damned.
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:44:00 -
[281] - Quote
Nearly 5 years since the merger.
Wonder if WW employees had protecting written into the merger deal???
Something similar happened at my company, we took over a smaller outfit and all of their staff got 3 years protection from being made redundant etc. This had a side effect of protcting current employee's as well as just firing the old guard could have came across as discrimination. Year 3 saw my company downsize 20%.
I applaud the decision CCP. The last series of DEV blogs has given me hope that you can actually pull it together. A someone in a company that went through the process you are now going through, I can see the benefits we gained from trimming ourselves down. It's a tough pill to swallow, but once you have it down your neck, the benefits start to become clear.
+1 resubscribing |
Barakkus
851
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:44:00 -
[282] - Quote
Hakaru Ishiwara wrote:Barakkus wrote:Blood Fart wrote:so the idiots who came up with the bullshit can get the same size pay checks? I would venture a guess quite a few people if not all of them took sizeable paycuts. This makes me chuckle. Since when has it been typical or standard for CEOs or their executive team to take pay cuts? Very rare is the CEO or other executive that takes a pay cut. Their egos will not let it happen. In the case that still-employed CCP personnel did take pay cuts, then that is something that would truly impress me. Austerity measures to ensure viability are a much more intelligent way of meeting budgets (rather than layoffs).
The CEO and VP of the company I work at right now took a 10% paycut right along with the rest of us when we went through this very same thing in February. |
RougeOperator
Autocannons Anonymous
43
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:49:00 -
[283] - Quote
CCP Manifest wrote: We stand behind our decisions and trust that it will ultimately bring you, the EVE community, a better game.
Yeah can you maybe get someone new to make the decisions you stand behind? I think it will do CCP a world of good.
I cant see why you trust decisions that drive you off cliff into the Atlantic in winter? |
Mithfindel
Zenko Incorporated
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:50:00 -
[284] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:- CCP did not ADD resources to EVE, they cut resources overall. This wasn't a "we will move 80% of our vampire wranglers to deliver WiS for example, or teach them how to makes FiS stuff". This is we are chopping up decks on our steamship to throw into the fire to keep the pumps running.
Adding resources to a late project will make it more late. As in, beyond a certain level, overhead will eat all gains of additional manpower. Specially if the frameworks differ (hopefully not much due to CARBON, though) since a dev teaching new people on how things work is a dev not working on the project. I understand that CCP will be after these layoffs about as large as they were around the launch of Apocrypha and the development of Dominion. With possibly some extra load put by getting DUST out.
My condolences to everyone who lost their jobs today. Hopefully you can find new work soon. As for the rest, hopefully in the reorganization CCP can shorten the lines between Management and People Who Do Actual Work as well as Management and the community. Playing broken telephone belongs to somewhere else than game industry. |
Grady Eltoren
Aviation Professionals for EVE Fusion Alliance
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 19:53:00 -
[285] - Quote
Shaera Taam wrote:Xiaodown wrote: CCP ATL EMPLOYEES
The software shop I work for is looking for developers, and we have positions open in Atlanta (Duluth / Suwanee area), as well as Southwestern Virginia (about 5-6 hours from ATL).
We're primarily interested in .NET, Java, Python, and PHP devs. I think it's possible we may have some design positions, but not in any 3d space (no animation, motion capture, etc). We compete in the cloud industry.
now THAT is cool! i may not be a fan of test or dreddit in-game, but this game community is awesome! heywatiaminit! this may sound silly, but what about a PLEX for Pinkslips? i donate IRL to help those in need... why not in my favorite game too?
Wow - two great posts! Cheers to Xiaodown! Also - I love Shaera's idea - Count me in!
Also - if anyone at the CCP ATL office is looking for something completely different....like in AVIATION in Atlanta, let me know in game. I may be able to help with employment at Airlines in Atlanta.
All my best to the employees who may get cut. I would like to think CCP doesn't have to cut ANYONE in order to retrench though, but the letter release was VERY succinct and I agree with the logic of refocusing on EVE/DUST. One thing at a time - slow and steady - will get you there.
|
Grady Eltoren
Aviation Professionals for EVE Fusion Alliance
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:04:00 -
[286] - Quote
Ilkahn wrote: I readily admit that i want to see DUST, i'd like to see it in a PC version as well. Imagine Capsuleers and Dust marines in stations... bar fights, oh BOY!
This is the stuff dreams are made of and i fully believe CCP can bring them to us!
That's what I am talking about. Maybe CCP will refocus and bring us a PC version. : ) Bar fights between pilots and marines commence!
::Some seedy bar in Amake::
"You said you would back me up with Air support!" - Marine
"I did, just a little later than planned - you're alive aren't you!?" - Pilot
"Half my men had to re-clone and lost all there stuff; months worth of work because of you! You SOFAB arrogant pilot!" - Marine as he lunges forward with fist's drawn.
Incarna can have some great benefits! : ) |
Cailais
Nasty Pope Holding Corp Talocan United
57
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:06:00 -
[287] - Quote
Overstretched so cutting staff?
It sounds to me as if something is inherently wrong within CCP; structurally, strategically and culturally. I would also question why such a move is being announced here on the forums? Is this some form of guilt trip against the player base? "Look what you've made us do!"
I feel bitterly sorry for those staff who are loosing their careers. It will be scant comfort to them that they too are now the very real (as opposed to virtual) victims of CCPs management team. It was this team who decided to treat EVEs customer base as a 'golden goose', this team that decided to turn a deaf ear to the players requests for a perfectly achievable process of gradual iteration and this team who thought introducing the most expensive micro transactions in the pantheon of MMOs right in the middle of a global depression.
I hope, for the sake of those about to loose their jobs that CCP reconsiders its strategy with a bit more thought, patience and a lot less fear.
Greed is Good eh?
C.
|
Melissa Blick
Silver Aria Important Internet Spaceship League
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:07:00 -
[288] - Quote
My annual subscription ended in August. I did not resub. For the past few months, I have been liquidating assets into PLEX to slowly let the account die a natural death. I curtailed my play time to mostly updating the queue.
After reading about the , I realised that CCP was seriously hurt in the past two months. While I am still upset, I want CCP to continue to develop eve. I feel like they are making a honest effort to turn things around. I plan to buy another annual subscription next month. |
Miraqu
Marquie-X Corp
10
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:09:00 -
[289] - Quote
I feel for the employees who lost their job.
|
Azelor Delaria
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
49
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:11:00 -
[290] - Quote
Melissa Blick wrote:My annual subscription ended in August. I did not resub. For the past few months, I have been liquidating assets into PLEX to slowly let the account die a natural death. I curtailed my play time to mostly updating the queue.
After reading about the , I realised that CCP was seriously hurt in the past two months. While I am still upset, I want CCP to continue to develop eve. I feel like they are making a honest effort to turn things around. I plan to buy another annual subscription next month.
Interesting time to claim you're going to resub. As well as your first post on the forums. |
|
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
93
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:13:00 -
[291] - Quote
STAY THE COURSE!
Show's that CCP has poor FUNDAMENTALS, and is living too much on shakey financials.
STAY THE COURSE PEOPLE!
If all it took was 3 months of stopped subscriptions to fire 20%, imagine what another 3 months or 6 months cancellations can do.
Shakey financials are shakey, fundamentals are king on ANY financial investment :)
Desperate montlty PLEX bulk offers, shows the desperate situation.
Keep the pressure on.
Ship spinning won't save Eve, again FUNDAMENTALS are king, not some bread and circuses visual eye candy. |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
34
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:14:00 -
[292] - Quote
Mithfindel wrote:Issler Dainze wrote:- CCP did not ADD resources to EVE, they cut resources overall. This wasn't a "we will move 80% of our vampire wranglers to deliver WiS for example, or teach them how to makes FiS stuff". This is we are chopping up decks on our steamship to throw into the fire to keep the pumps running. Adding resources to a late project will make it more late. As in, beyond a certain level, overhead will eat all gains of additional manpower. Specially if the frameworks differ (hopefully not much due to CARBON, though) since a dev teaching new people on how things work is a dev not working on the project. I understand that CCP will be after these layoffs about as large as they were around the launch of Apocrypha and the development of Dominion. With possibly some extra load put by getting DUST out. My condolences to everyone who lost their jobs today. Hopefully you can find new work soon. As for the rest, hopefully in the reorganization CCP can shorten the lines between Management and People Who Do Actual Work as well as Management and the community. Playing broken telephone belongs to somewhere else than game industry.
I manage software projects for a living and have for 33 years. So I get the whole "mythical man month" concept of adding folks to a project not making it come together any sooner. That said, the vampire folks would be totally up to speed on the technology that was promised to devliver WiS. If CCP was serious about ever delivering that they could have moved folks to that effort. This is more proof we will never see WiS. That CCP has abandoned it. I am sure the art pipeline for Eve and WoD is similar enough the the art assets would also directly improve the ability to deliver FiS content, especially since we have been told things like POS improvements are blocked by the ability to deliver the art.
Also CCP let several folks directly related to Eve go, including some community devs. This is not a refocus on Eve, this is a "we are going down, we are out of ballast so we need to throw some crew out of the dirrigible to survive!" moment. And oh, "don't touch our favorite part of our anvil collection! That stays in the blimp!"
To the folks that lost your jobs, I wish you the best of luck, I've already seen at least one post where a potential employer solicited resumes. Hang in there and hopefully soon you'll be back at delivering stuff to entertain and ammuse us, even if it isn't in the Eve 'verse.
Issler |
ArmyOfMe
TEDDYBEARS. Excuses.
30
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:14:00 -
[293] - Quote
Verone wrote: I'm astonished at some of the names that have come up that are being released from the Company.
It's a real shock, because most of these names have been people who've lived, breathed and slept Eve for over half a decade and have always had Eve's core values in their hearts and the best for Eve and CCP at the forefront of their minds.
While downsizing a little is good, whoever decided who was to go, needs a serious reality check.
This is an immense mistake, CCP. In the long run it's probably a bigger mistake than the early release of Incarna.
Have to agree with you on this one. Some of those people have been the symbol of the real ccp dev for years
CCP, for the love of god boost the deimos..... |
Magnus Orin
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
39
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:17:00 -
[294] - Quote
Gilentajsa wrote:I hope all you FiS crybabys are happy now, you've lost real people their jobs, you know, real people with parents and children and siblings. People with bills to pay and mouths to feed and you weren't content to let things move forward, you just had to whine and cry until you forced CCP's hand.
Sad thing is I'm betting most of you don't even really care, you're just offering your condolences for show.
I am a social democrat. I believe everyone should be paid a fair wage, and enjoy job security.
But I don't pay CCP (3 accounts) to subsidize someone else's life. I pay my taxes to do that.
I pay CCP to enjoy a video game about flying space ships in space.
If CCP stops providing me enjoyment for my money, I stop giving them my money.
Fuck off with your bullshit about me costing real people real jobs because I cancelled 2 of my 3 accounts. |
DJ Xaphod
Eve Radio Corporation
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:17:00 -
[295] - Quote
I don't understand how laying off people who are in the EVE community team* is sharpening your focus on EVE. If that truly were your goal then you would not be laying off anyone who is working on either EVE or Dust 514 and would only be laying off WoD related staff.
How is laying off extremely well respected EVE community staff members working towards your stated goal, which is to "enrich the vast EVE Universe by strengthening the continuous development of EVE Online"?
So basically CCP, I don't believe that your motives behind your laying off of staff are what you claim they are, and in the face of the evidence I have strong doubts that this will represent a focus on the EVE Universe.
I would strongly recommend a public statement explaining why when claiming you are "strengthening the continuous development of EVE Online" you have actively reduced the size of the EVE Online team. I would also recommend stating clearly why trusted and respected community staff members are part of the layoffs when doing so is so heavily contrary to the statments within CCP Hellmar's letter:
Quote:Red flags raised by very smart people both at CCP and in the community went unheeded because of my stubborn refusal to allow adversity to gain purchase on our plans. Mistakes, even when they were acknowledged, often went unanalyzed, leaving the door open for them to be repeated. Surely laying off possibly the most active and trusted member of the community team will lead to more such mistakes?
Quote:Part of what led us down this path is the fact we have not communicated well. And laying off members of the community team will help with that? I struggle to see how. |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
93
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:19:00 -
[296] - Quote
PAY TO WIN is coming still, via Dust :)
But please continue spinning your ships as a visual distraction :)
STAY THE COURSE!
Stop pumping NEW money into Eve, use the OLD money. |
Flamewave
Crimson Moon Society
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:21:00 -
[297] - Quote
Quote:Developing EVE expansions, DUST 514 and World of Darkness has stretched our resources too thin. You didn't stretch your resources thin. You stretched your money thin. There's a difference. I can't see how a 20% reduction in staff - your actual resource for development - will improve the rate of development on any of your projects, seeing how $50 bills can't code spaceship games. Reallocating those developers to work on Eve content could, in theory.
Quote:This will enable us to accelerate timeframes for new features and increase our ability to respond to community needs. Not only will this "acceleration" be marginal at best, but you'll be able to respond to our community needs by laying off community reps, especially ones who actually had dedication to the community and were there with us even when the rest of CCP had their fingers in their ears, shouting, "LALALA CAN'T HEAR YOU 18 MONTHS DEAL WITH IT HTFU." Makes sense to me. Oh, wait, no it doesn't.
You're bailing water out of a sinking ship, CCP, but the reason it's sinking is your lack of preventative maintenance to begin with. Anyone who thinks the players are to blame is a fool; this would have happened eventually. Some things ISK can't buy. For everything else, there's Jita. |
Barakkus
851
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:22:00 -
[298] - Quote
Miilla wrote:PLAY TO WIN is coming still, via Dust :)
But please continue spinning your ships as a visual distraction :)
STAY THE COURSE!
Stop pumping NEW money into Eve, use the OLD money..
I always play to win, sorry if you play to lose all the time.
...damn you for editing before I quoted..., |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
93
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:23:00 -
[299] - Quote
20% of overweight overpaid people fired.
My pet rock's heart is bleeding.
|
Myxx
Atropos Group
84
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:24:00 -
[300] - Quote
WTF CCP. You got rid of people that worked on EVE while refocusing on EVE?
WTF!
Hammerhead, Wrangler, Fallout, Zymurgist and Gnauton to name a few.
WTF! |
|
Magnus Orin
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
40
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:26:00 -
[301] - Quote
Flamewave wrote:Quote:Developing EVE expansions, DUST 514 and World of Darkness has stretched our resources too thin. You didn't stretch your resources thin. You stretched your money thin. There's a difference.
No there is not.
Money = Resources. Resources = Money.
People and employees can be considered resources yes, but it requires money (salary/benefits) to keep them on a project.
Resources always equals money.
How do people in the thread not get that?
|
Josefius
Caldari Elite Force Apocalypse Now.
17
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:28:00 -
[302] - Quote
Miilla wrote:20% of overweight overpaid people fired.
My pet rock's heart is bleeding.
Why are you such a big meanie butt? |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
95
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:29:00 -
[303] - Quote
Perhaps those fired can apply for jobs here...
http://www.ccpgames.com/en/jobs
Proof yanks eat too much and cost too much .
What was breaking CCP's financials was the cafeteria costs in the Atlanta office. |
Josefius
Caldari Elite Force Apocalypse Now.
17
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:31:00 -
[304] - Quote
Myxx wrote:WTF CCP. You got rid of people that worked on EVE while refocusing on EVE?
WTF!
Hammerhead, Wrangler, Fallout, Zymurgist and Gnauton to name a few.
WTF!
Zymurgist and Wrangler? Ugh :( |
Barakkus
851
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:31:00 -
[305] - Quote
Josefius wrote:Miilla wrote:20% of overweight overpaid people fired.
My pet rock's heart is bleeding.
Why are you such a big meanie butt?
Because he's one of those ******** no life internet nerds that thinks it's funny to be an ass when he can't get his personal ass kicked hiding safely beind his little computer screen. |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
95
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:32:00 -
[306] - Quote
Barakkus wrote:Josefius wrote:Miilla wrote:20% of overweight overpaid people fired.
My pet rock's heart is bleeding.
Why are you such a big meanie butt? Because he's one of those ******** no life internet nerds that thinks it's funny to be an ass when he can't get his personal ass kicked hiding safely beind his little computer screen.
real life physical threat's are against the rules. |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
95
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:34:00 -
[307] - Quote
Perhap's CCP's China office can get setup in one of those special free trade Chinese zones the US gets more off daily :)
|
Barakkus
851
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:34:00 -
[308] - Quote
Miilla wrote:Barakkus wrote:Josefius wrote:Miilla wrote:20% of overweight overpaid people fired.
My pet rock's heart is bleeding.
Why are you such a big meanie butt? Because he's one of those ******** no life internet nerds that thinks it's funny to be an ass when he can't get his personal ass kicked hiding safely beind his little computer screen. real life physical threat's are against the rules.
Blah blah blah troll, no one made any threats. God you're such a nuisance. You must be like 15 years old aren't you? I've know 5 year olds that are more mature... |
seany1212
Mind Games. 0ccupational Hazzard
17
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:35:00 -
[309] - Quote
I am one of those that doesnt really care, i hope that the ones fired were the ones that openly neglected the community when we were calling for change rather than those unaware. For months if not years the community has outlined problems within the game and while usually its a small minority crying about a tiny detail within the game, when its the whole community in uproar then someone within CCP should be rallying around saying clearly theres a problem with the game rather than waiting until subs start dropping and they have to end up firing people due to cash flow. As i said before i hope its those who refused initially to listen than the ones just caught in the crossfire. CCP reaps what it sows |
Flamewave
Crimson Moon Society
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:35:00 -
[310] - Quote
Magnus Orin wrote:Flamewave wrote:Quote:Developing EVE expansions, DUST 514 and World of Darkness has stretched our resources too thin. You didn't stretch your resources thin. You stretched your money thin. There's a difference. No there is not. Money = Resources. Resources = Money. People and employees can be considered resources yes, but it requires money (salary/benefits) to keep them on a project. Resources always equals money. How do people in the thread not get that? Money is a resource. People another. The only resource they're freeing up is the money. Some things ISK can't buy. For everything else, there's Jita. |
|
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
95
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:36:00 -
[311] - Quote
What do you expect if you work at a financially shakey company (with Russian Maffia connections and bankers on the board).
Really, quit acting suprised.
Remember when at the CSM Emergency meeting the CSM where showed metrics that showed NO IMPACT of cancellations.
Guess they lied :) |
DJ Xaphod
Eve Radio Corporation
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:36:00 -
[312] - Quote
Quote:For the immediate future, our mission is to enrich the vast EVE Universe by strengthening the continuous development of EVE Online
By sacking several EVE Online staff members.
In short, I don't believe you, because I'm less likely to believe what you say, rather than what you do. |
Rall Mekin
Suppression Inc. Redneck Rage
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:36:00 -
[313] - Quote
DJ Xaphod wrote:I don't understand how laying off people who are in the EVE community team* is sharpening your focus on EVE. If that truly were your goal then you would not be laying off anyone who is working on either EVE or Dust 514 and would only be laying off WoD related staff. How is laying off extremely well respected EVE community staff members working towards your stated goal, which is to "enrich the vast EVE Universe by strengthening the continuous development of EVE Online"? So basically CCP, I don't believe that your motives behind your laying off of staff are what you claim they are, and in the face of the evidence I have strong doubts that this will represent a focus on the EVE Universe. I would strongly recommend a public statement explaining why when claiming you are "strengthening the continuous development of EVE Online" you have actively reduced the size of the EVE Online team. I would also recommend stating clearly why trusted and respected community staff members are part of the layoffs when doing so is so heavily contrary to the statments within CCP Hellmar's letter: Quote:Red flags raised by very smart people both at CCP and in the community went unheeded because of my stubborn refusal to allow adversity to gain purchase on our plans. Mistakes, even when they were acknowledged, often went unanalyzed, leaving the door open for them to be repeated. Surely laying off possibly the most active and trusted member of the community team will lead to more such mistakes? Quote:Part of what led us down this path is the fact we have not communicated well. And laying off members of the community team will help with that? I struggle to see how.
DJ, I may have missed something, but I do not believe they specifically said they are laying off EVE online team members. Rather, they said they were laying off members of CCP and reorganizing/refocusing.
Based off their public statement, I take it that they are cutting members company wide (one would assume from the World of Darkness/Dust team primarily) and also doing a lot of reassignments to focus more on the EVE Universe (Dust is part of Eve Online in the long run, its just deployed on a different platform).
Honestly, EVE is a really good game as it is and I am excited to see the developmental changes taking place, such as the reassignment of Custom's Offices to player control. It is so good, in fact, that I have unsubscribed to XBox live, my consoles have been collecting dust for nearly a year, and I usually dedicate 1-2 hours a night to ventures of some kind in this strange, beautiful, wild, and exotic space-scape land.
Now, with this announcement, I may even buy a third account and try to fund it by recruitment drives in my local area through the invite-a-buddy program. |
Josefius
Caldari Elite Force Apocalypse Now.
17
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:37:00 -
[314] - Quote
Flamewave wrote:Magnus Orin wrote:Flamewave wrote:Quote:Developing EVE expansions, DUST 514 and World of Darkness has stretched our resources too thin. You didn't stretch your resources thin. You stretched your money thin. There's a difference. No there is not. Money = Resources. Resources = Money. People and employees can be considered resources yes, but it requires money (salary/benefits) to keep them on a project. Resources always equals money. How do people in the thread not get that? Money is a resource. People another. The only resource they're freeing up is the money.
Why do they call it "Human Resources"? |
Asuri Kinnes
Adhocracy Incorporated Adhocracy
24
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:38:00 -
[315] - Quote
Xiaodown wrote:Oberine Noriepa wrote:EDIT: ^ You, too! Xiaodown wrote:~~~ CCP ATL EMPLOYEES: ~~~The software shop I work for is looking for developers, and we have positions open in Atlanta (Duluth / Suwanee area), as well as Southwestern Virginia (about 5-6 hours from ATL). We're primarily interested in .NET, Java, Python, and PHP devs. I think it's possible we may have some design positions, but not in any 3d space (no animation, motion capture, etc). We compete in the cloud industry. Message me with inquiries; I'll make a point to check gate.eve throughout the day. On second thought, I set up an email alias: [email protected] so that you don't have to use work resources to inquire about employment. Heh. You rock! Obviously no guarantees, and there's still a rigorous interview process and a development test. And to be honest, Development and high-level System Administration are a couple of areas that are still economically strong. But, I figured if I can at least help get someone an interview, it's something I want to do. Edit: damnit, missed my chance to snipe the top of the page =(. I also tweeted about it. Pass the word on #tweetfleet if you can. Bumping this again. Redundant, I know.
vOv
Wormholes: The *NEW* end game of Eve - Online: No Local. No Lag. No Blues (No Intell Channesl). No Blobs.
NEW FEATURE: NO INCARNA! |
Peregrinus Falco
Falco Industries Coalition of Free Stars
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:38:00 -
[316] - Quote
To those who will no longer be with CCP, all the best and we'll pray for you to land on your feet fast.
To CCP: thank you for making the though call. Focus is something I've been hoping for and I'm glad to see that you don't shy away (too much) from making the right decision, no matter how tough. I've felt for a while now that CCP was growing the employee base too quickly. |
Kumq uat
Mercurialis Inc. RAZOR Alliance
21
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:39:00 -
[317] - Quote
seany1212 wrote:I am one of those that doesnt really care, i hope that the ones fired were the ones that openly neglected the community when we were calling for change rather than those unaware. For months if not years the community has outlined problems within the game and while usually its a small minority crying about a tiny detail within the game, when its the whole community in uproar then someone within CCP should be rallying around saying clearly theres a problem with the game rather than waiting until subs start dropping and they have to end up firing people due to cash flow. As i said before i hope its those who refused initially to listen than the ones just caught in the crossfire. CCP reaps what it sows
I know some of them personally and you know nothing of what you are talking about. |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
95
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:40:00 -
[318] - Quote
Josefius wrote:Flamewave wrote:Magnus Orin wrote:Flamewave wrote:Quote:Developing EVE expansions, DUST 514 and World of Darkness has stretched our resources too thin. You didn't stretch your resources thin. You stretched your money thin. There's a difference. No there is not. Money = Resources. Resources = Money. People and employees can be considered resources yes, but it requires money (salary/benefits) to keep them on a project. Resources always equals money. How do people in the thread not get that? Money is a resource. People another. The only resource they're freeing up is the money. Why do they call it "Human Resources"?
HR is not there for the staff, it is there for the company. A human meat shield.
If I was setting up a company each operating unit would be seperate legal entities, especially STAFFING, each business unit and location would be seperate legal entities, especially staffing, nobody would ever work for the main corporate body or the local unit, All offices would be rented out from a location and rental legal entity, all staffing in its own legal entity (as a employment services legal entitty) and so on.
That way each legal entitty is very isolated and protected.
Not a single lawsuit can take out the entire company, each employee would work for the arm, and internally all work is "contracted" out and each one self managed.
Very protective and isolated legally and financially.
That is infact how one should run retail stores, each one SEPERATE legal entities and self funding.
So in that context you would have CCP corporate, CCP "location", CCP Assets (buildings etc), CCP staffing.. all seperate legal entities, employees wold only work for "CCP Employment" legal entitty.
That is how you protect your assets, your businesses. |
Captain Carius
Deathshead Inc.
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:41:00 -
[319] - Quote
Myxx wrote:WTF CCP. You got rid of people that worked on EVE while refocusing on EVE?
WTF!
Hammerhead, Wrangler, Fallout, Zymurgist and Gnauton to name a few.
WTF!
Zymurgist?? YESS ! Victory ! That schlub needed flushing. Goon luvin little bastid.
Good choice CCP. Damn.. I may have to resub.. |
Brit Green
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:42:00 -
[320] - Quote
I'm not without sympathy for these folks, but part of their job was to keep the rabble under control. They failed at this. When you don't perform your job, you lose it. That's the way these things work. |
|
Marcus Triarius
MInistry of Mining PURgE Alliance
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:45:00 -
[321] - Quote
collecting isk for out of work ccp employees please send all donations to me :)
this is not a scam |
Mechanoid Kryten
N0VA 5
11
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:46:00 -
[322] - Quote
Myxx wrote:WTF CCP. You got rid of people that worked on EVE while refocusing on EVE?
WTF!
Hammerhead, Wrangler, Fallout, Zymurgist and Gnauton to name a few.
WTF!
Wait... this is what ccp meant by wod devs in the usa???
I take back my other post on this thread.
I know I said stuff about fallout in general discussion when she was closing protest threads but only because I thought more highly of her than that whole incident.
Ah well.
What rocks are the most isk per hour to mine? Which of your mission loot is worth more refined than sold? What blue prints make the most proffit? Answers: https://eve-industrialist.com/ Never sell an item for less than its mineral costs again! |
Helena Russell Makanen
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
7
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:47:00 -
[323] - Quote
Peregrinus Falco wrote:To those who will no longer be with CCP, all the best and we'll pray for you to land on your feet fast.
To CCP: thank you for making the though call. Focus is something I've been hoping for and I'm glad to see that you don't shy away (too much) from making the right decision, no matter how tough. I've felt for a while now that CCP was growing the employee base too quickly.
Anyone else notice how very often the 'I support CCP in this!!!' posters are making their first post ever? CCP Alt damage control again? |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
95
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:49:00 -
[324] - Quote
Welcome to the world.. of the real.
|
Flamewave
Crimson Moon Society
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:50:00 -
[325] - Quote
Josefius wrote:Why do they call it "Human Resources"? Because they clearly are. However, the human resource is being reduced in this case, which is my whole point. By reducing the human resource you're not actually freeing up the resource that directly does work for the company, just the monetary resource. There's no sign in CCP's news post that the money they save in doing this will go to development - the money itself can't develop, it's used to hire people, human resources, who can.
The whole point of my original post is that the allocation of human resource wasn't stretched thin - the money was - so "resources" being plural was, in a way, silly. However reducing the workforce thusly would stretch it thin, and the only solution for that is reduced workload. So I can see where I would be misinterpreted, and I'm sorry if I have been. Some things ISK can't buy. For everything else, there's Jita. |
Josefius
Caldari Elite Force Apocalypse Now.
18
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:50:00 -
[326] - Quote
Is John Turbefield and CCP Soundwave still around? What's their status? |
Magnus Orin
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
40
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:50:00 -
[327] - Quote
Helena Russell Makanen wrote:Peregrinus Falco wrote:To those who will no longer be with CCP, all the best and we'll pray for you to land on your feet fast.
To CCP: thank you for making the though call. Focus is something I've been hoping for and I'm glad to see that you don't shy away (too much) from making the right decision, no matter how tough. I've felt for a while now that CCP was growing the employee base too quickly. Anyone else notice how very often the 'I support CCP in this!!!' posters are making their first post ever? CCP Alt damage control again?
I support CCP in this. I don't see why anyone who cares a shred about this game doesn't.
Would you rather we go back to CCP paying more people to develop WoD and DUST than Eve? |
Renan Ruivo
Hipernova Vera Cruz Alliance
187
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:51:00 -
[328] - Quote
Kumq uat wrote:seany1212 wrote:I am one of those that doesnt really care, i hope that the ones fired were the ones that openly neglected the community when we were calling for change rather than those unaware. For months if not years the community has outlined problems within the game and while usually its a small minority crying about a tiny detail within the game, when its the whole community in uproar then someone within CCP should be rallying around saying clearly theres a problem with the game rather than waiting until subs start dropping and they have to end up firing people due to cash flow. As i said before i hope its those who refused initially to listen than the ones just caught in the crossfire. CCP reaps what it sows I know some of them personally and you know nothing of what you are talking about.
Actually those that have been fired have been outlining the problems we speak of for the years you mentioned. Problem is that Hillmar wouldn't listen, and he himself has admited as much. Sometimes the only difference between a budding genius and a blooming idiot is where they chose to take a stand. |
Grey Stormshadow
Starwreck Industries
299
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:52:00 -
[329] - Quote
I'll quote myself and post this to this thread also as I strongly believe that the increasing "hostile" comments are not helping anyone atm...
myself wrote:When you take 1 guy out of every 5 guys, you can not pick "only" the ones who no one will never miss.
What comes to selection procedure and reasoning... We may not agree, but honestly - who can say they posses enough information to make this kind of difficult decisions better than people who work in the actual company.
This is sad day for many, blame games or finger pointing will not change that. When people are laid off, people who we know and like will vanish. That is what cutbacks are about. They are not pretty.
When people get laid off, they easily start to blame themselves, even in situations like this, they are just victims of some bad corporate decisions and global recession. Showing support to the people who are leaving and thanking them about past years is something they surely appreciate.
This is not end of world for anyone. There is always tomorrow. It may be better than this day, even today it can be hard to imagine. ...and yes - I will miss the community devs and their posts also. I have hard time understanding why Penn got sacked. However I'm not the right guy to judge about the reasoning why they were "on the list". I can only thank them about the years and hope that they find new work sooner rather than later. Remaining stuff can be only sorted out inside the company and is part of their private lives.
|
MotherMoon
Huang Yinglong
116
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:52:00 -
[330] - Quote
Magnus Orin wrote:Helena Russell Makanen wrote:Peregrinus Falco wrote:To those who will no longer be with CCP, all the best and we'll pray for you to land on your feet fast.
To CCP: thank you for making the though call. Focus is something I've been hoping for and I'm glad to see that you don't shy away (too much) from making the right decision, no matter how tough. I've felt for a while now that CCP was growing the employee base too quickly. Anyone else notice how very often the 'I support CCP in this!!!' posters are making their first post ever? CCP Alt damage control again? I support CCP in this. I don't see why anyone who cares a shred about this game doesn't. Would you rather we go back to CCP paying more people to develop WoD and DUST than Eve?
no we want CCP to have a community team for EVE ONLINE. beause as of right now they seem to be getting rid of the community team. |
|
Josefius
Caldari Elite Force Apocalypse Now.
18
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:52:00 -
[331] - Quote
Flamewave wrote:Josefius wrote:Why do they call it "Human Resources"? Because they clearly are. However, the human resource is being reduced in this case, which is my whole point. By reducing the human resource you're not actually freeing up the resource that directly does work for the company, just the monetary resource. There's no sign in CCP's news post that the money they save in doing this will go to development - the money itself can't develop, it's used to hire people, human resources, who can. The whole point of my original post is that the allocation of human resource wasn't stretched thin - the money was - so "resources" being plural was, in a way, silly. However reducing the workforce thusly would stretch it thin, and the only solution for that is reduced workload. So I can see where I would be misinterpreted, and I'm sorry if I have been.
Thank you for enlightening me, I appreciate your point of view. |
Kengutsi Akira
58
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:53:00 -
[332] - Quote
Hey check it out; they fired the ppl that were actually... you know... communicating with us.
brilliant guys What Mittani wants, Mittani gets, Mittani help us all
|
Renan Ruivo
Hipernova Vera Cruz Alliance
187
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:54:00 -
[333] - Quote
Grey Stormshadow wrote:I'll quote myself and post this to this thread also as I strongly believe that the increasing "hostile" comments are not helping anyone atm... myself wrote:When you take 1 guy out of every 5 guys, you can not pick "only" the ones who no one will never miss.
What comes to selection procedure and reasoning... We may not agree, but honestly - who can say they posses enough information to make this kind of difficult decisions better than people who work in the actual company.
This is sad day for many, blame games or finger pointing will not change that. When people are laid off, people who we know and like will vanish. That is what cutbacks are about. They are not pretty.
When people get laid off, they easily start to blame themselves, even in situations like this, they are just victims of some bad corporate decisions and global recession. Showing support to the people who are leaving and thanking them about past years is something they surely appreciate.
This is not end of world for anyone. There is always tomorrow. It may be better than this day, even today it can be hard to imagine. ...and yes - I will miss the community devs and their posts also. I have hard time understanding why Penn got sacked. However I'm not the right guy to judge about the reasoning why they were "on the list". I can only thank them about the years and hope that they find new work sooner rather than later. Remaining stuff can be only sorted out inside the company and is part of their private lives.
Got sacked because she worked from the branch office. Sometimes the only difference between a budding genius and a blooming idiot is where they chose to take a stand. |
Myxx
Atropos Group
84
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:55:00 -
[334] - Quote
Confirmed list of 20%ers:
Community: Wrangler/ Christian Danhill Pann/ Valerie Massey Fallout/ Misty Matonis Zymurgist/ Kevin Dudenbostel Mike Read
Content: Pall Ivarsson Hilmir +P+Šr Einarsson CCP Maiden Steel Gnauton/ Gauti Fridriksson
Other: Valar/ Emil Fridrikson Finnz/ Finnur K+íri Gu+Šnason Hammerhead/ Noah Ward Kristleifur +Porsteinsson
Unconfirmed: Dropbear
Edit: WTF CCP!!!!! |
Magnus Orin
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
40
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:55:00 -
[335] - Quote
Flamewave wrote:Josefius wrote:Why do they call it "Human Resources"? Because they clearly are. However, the human resource is being reduced in this case, which is my whole point. By reducing the human resource you're not actually freeing up the resource that directly does work for the company, just the monetary resource.
Are you daft?
You lay people off. As you can see they are laying off people not directly involved with FiS (community staff, and WoD staff).
Use the reduced expenses to balance your budget. CCP needs to sort its **** to maintain profitability (or regain it).
You refocus on your key direction with the resources you have left, put out good **** (Winter Expansion).
If your customers are happy, and subs grow, you hire more staff to iterate on your ****.
SO YES THEY ARE FREEING UP THE RESOURCES THAT MATTER.
|
Laechyd Eldgorn
draketrain
9
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:56:00 -
[336] - Quote
http://www.shacknews.com/article/56827/report-world-of-darkness-mmo
mmm... wod, still in development. doesn't require einstein to figure out something went wrong with finances i guess.
also dust, fps shooter on console platform, what could go wrong. hehe.
anyhow pleased to see real working game aka eve getting more attention, at least on paper. because that's what i am paying for.
|
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
388
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:57:00 -
[337] - Quote
Helena Russell Makanen wrote:Peregrinus Falco wrote:To those who will no longer be with CCP, all the best and we'll pray for you to land on your feet fast.
To CCP: thank you for making the though call. Focus is something I've been hoping for and I'm glad to see that you don't shy away (too much) from making the right decision, no matter how tough. I've felt for a while now that CCP was growing the employee base too quickly. Anyone else notice how very often the 'I support CCP in this!!!' posters are making their first post ever? CCP Alt damage control again?
Funny that you picked up on that and completely missed all the ranters blasting CCP posting for the first time in this thread.
FUD, anyone?
Mr Epeen If you can read this, you haven't blocked me yet. |
Renan Ruivo
Hipernova Vera Cruz Alliance
187
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 20:58:00 -
[338] - Quote
Myxx wrote:Confirmed list of 20%ers:
Community: Wrangler/ Christian Danhill Pann/ Valerie Massey Fallout/ Misty Matonis Zymurgist/ Kevin Dudenbostel Mike Read
Content: Pall Ivarsson Hilmir +P+Šr Einarsson CCP Maiden Steel Gnauton/ Gauti Fridriksson
Other: Valar/ Emil Fridrikson Finnz/ Finnur K+íri Gu+Šnason Hammerhead/ Noah Ward Kristleifur +Porsteinsson
Unconfirmed: Dropbear
Edit: WTF CCP!!!!!
Can someone outline the roles each of these now former employees had? In what content the "content" ones worked on? Sometimes the only difference between a budding genius and a blooming idiot is where they chose to take a stand. |
Ten Bulls
Sons of Olsagard
5
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:00:00 -
[339] - Quote
Kabaos wrote: "A Jack of all trades is master of none"
But what do you think that statement means... is it better to be a specialist or not ?
I think society is like a cricket team, all-rounders arent the best batters, or bowlers, but without them the team is vulnerable.
All-rounders (generalists) are like glue that bind the specialists together.
The normals really deserve more respect than they get.
|
Covert Kitty
SRS Industries SRS.
17
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:00:00 -
[340] - Quote
Quote:I hope all you FiS crybabys are happy now, you've lost real people their jobs Hopefully a good first step, though I'm not going to be happy until I see some results. I don't pay CCP to develop WoD or Dust, I pay them to develop EvE.
So either this is the right move by CCP, and Eve is improved. Or it's not and I'll be back shooting the statues this January and canceling accounts. As far as I care this cycle can continue until either Eve is saved, or dies completely.
|
|
Magnus Orin
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
40
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:01:00 -
[341] - Quote
MotherMoon wrote:Magnus Orin wrote:Helena Russell Makanen wrote:Peregrinus Falco wrote:To those who will no longer be with CCP, all the best and we'll pray for you to land on your feet fast.
To CCP: thank you for making the though call. Focus is something I've been hoping for and I'm glad to see that you don't shy away (too much) from making the right decision, no matter how tough. I've felt for a while now that CCP was growing the employee base too quickly. Anyone else notice how very often the 'I support CCP in this!!!' posters are making their first post ever? CCP Alt damage control again? I support CCP in this. I don't see why anyone who cares a shred about this game doesn't. Would you rather we go back to CCP paying more people to develop WoD and DUST than Eve? no we want CCP to have a community team for EVE ONLINE. beause as of right now they seem to be getting rid of the community team.
Only a minority of players use the forums. You'd rather CCP allocate resources to the minority of players rather than spend it on actual gameplay. GTFO. |
Zeomebuch Nova
Metalworks
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:03:00 -
[342] - Quote
Brit Green wrote:I'm not without sympathy for these folks, but part of their job was to keep the rabble under control. They failed at this. When you don't perform your job, you lose it. That's the way these things work.
I will contract you to keep a white, rich, 15 years old nerdy intact in his way through a 5km long ghetto. This all will happen once it's enough dark, just because i enjoy making cretinous decisions. Your hands are your only tools. Don't blame me if you fail doing your job, which I, as your employer, know pretty well you will. |
Midge Mo'yb
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
31
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:04:00 -
[343] - Quote
Magnus Orin wrote:MotherMoon wrote:Magnus Orin wrote:Helena Russell Makanen wrote:Peregrinus Falco wrote:To those who will no longer be with CCP, all the best and we'll pray for you to land on your feet fast.
To CCP: thank you for making the though call. Focus is something I've been hoping for and I'm glad to see that you don't shy away (too much) from making the right decision, no matter how tough. I've felt for a while now that CCP was growing the employee base too quickly. Anyone else notice how very often the 'I support CCP in this!!!' posters are making their first post ever? CCP Alt damage control again? I support CCP in this. I don't see why anyone who cares a shred about this game doesn't. Would you rather we go back to CCP paying more people to develop WoD and DUST than Eve? no we want CCP to have a community team for EVE ONLINE. beause as of right now they seem to be getting rid of the community team. Only a minority of players use the forums. You'd rather CCP allocate resources to the minority of players rather than spend it on actual gameplay. GTFO.
whie i will miss the community team for just keeping us in the loop.
i do hope this is the resurgence of the devs freely posting, and throwing ideas and stuff around like YE OLDE DAYS |
ACY GTMI
Veerhouven Group The Veerhouven Group
17
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:04:00 -
[344] - Quote
Inficant wrote:ACY GTMI wrote:If it's an 'expansion', it isn't about fixing anything. It's kind of in the definition of the term. When you have quarterly expansions the lines for what goes in an expansion and what doesn't are blurred. Eve's expansions have always had features *and* fixes. Sometimes more of one than the other.
I didn't think there was any possibility of a misunderstanding. More fool me.
How about this? "For the Winter Whatever, I suggest you use your resources to fix what is already broken rather than adding more broken stuff."
Case in point, the Forum Post button.
|
Reverand Pastor
Dynasty Ink.
5
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:06:00 -
[345] - Quote
Magnus Orin wrote:Helena Russell Makanen wrote:Peregrinus Falco wrote:To those who will no longer be with CCP, all the best and we'll pray for you to land on your feet fast.
To CCP: thank you for making the though call. Focus is something I've been hoping for and I'm glad to see that you don't shy away (too much) from making the right decision, no matter how tough. I've felt for a while now that CCP was growing the employee base too quickly. Anyone else notice how very often the 'I support CCP in this!!!' posters are making their first post ever? CCP Alt damage control again? I support CCP in this. I don't see why anyone who cares a shred about this game doesn't. Would you rather we go back to CCP paying more people to develop WoD and DUST than Eve?
You are completely missing the point. The neglect shown to subscribers to your primary cash flow and lack of community interaction has put them in serious trouble. Lets be honest here no one fires 20% of there work force if everything is ok. If they do just because then its greed. I think you are also missing the face that the eve community is a very small and passionate one. There are things from PLEX drives to trivial gifts like a new caracal to a noob. When RL is damaged due to incompitence of others its a sad and frustrating thing. CCP has issues EVE, DUST, have issues therefore we have issues. get it? |
Flamewave
Crimson Moon Society
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:07:00 -
[346] - Quote
Magnus Orin wrote:Flamewave wrote:Josefius wrote:Why do they call it "Human Resources"? Because they clearly are. However, the human resource is being reduced in this case, which is my whole point. By reducing the human resource you're not actually freeing up the resource that directly does work for the company, just the monetary resource. Are you daft? You lay people off. As you can see they are laying off people not directly involved with FiS (community staff, and WoD staff). Use the reduced expenses to balance your budget. CCP needs to sort its **** to maintain profitability (or regain it). You refocus on your key direction with the resources you have left, put out good **** (Winter Expansion). If your customers are happy, and subs grow, you hire more staff to iterate on your ****. SO YES THEY ARE FREEING UP THE RESOURCES THAT MATTER. None of what you say is explicitly false, however the fact is that CCP is trying to play it off like it will accelerate development in the here and now, not at an indeterminate time in the future, if at all. The question is when, because it certainly won't be right now.
As a sidenote, you're a bit hostile, you know? It's possible to hold a conversation without questioning the other's intellectual acuity, just an FYI. Some things ISK can't buy. For everything else, there's Jita. |
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
388
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:07:00 -
[347] - Quote
MotherMoon wrote: some stuff
Holy smokes!
First I see Helicity in here and now you?
What a strange world. When did you decide to unquit?
Just need Liang to pop in and all will back to normal.
Mr Epeen
If you can read this, you haven't blocked me yet. |
EVE Stig
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
23
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:08:00 -
[348] - Quote
Magnus Orin wrote:
Only a minority of players use the forums. You'd rather CCP allocate resources to the minority of players rather than spend it on actual gameplay. GTFO.
liiiiike I dunno, how major 0.0 players want all the game designed around them and **** the ppl in highsec?
lol be MORE of a hypocrite. I dare you "Some say that he is actually dead, but the Grim Reaper is too afraid to tell him." "Some say he is the 3rd member of Daft Punk and he did the vocals of "Technologic" song. All we know is,he's called EVE Stig"! |
DJ Xaphod
Eve Radio Corporation
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:08:00 -
[349] - Quote
Rall Mekin wrote: DJ, I may have missed something, but I do not believe they specifically said they are laying off EVE online team members. Rather, they said they were laying off members of CCP and reorganizing/refocusing.
Based off their public statement, I take it that they are cutting members company wide (one would assume from the World of Darkness/Dust team primarily) and also doing a lot of reassignments to focus more on the EVE Universe (Dust is part of Eve Online in the long run, its just deployed on a different platform).
If you read the thread you'll see that a lot of EVE online team members are going. |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
95
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:09:00 -
[350] - Quote
Since CCP pay for bandwidth..
Perhaps if they remove the background image on these forums (or revert to the old non Javascript heavy forums) they could save money on bandwidth costs.
|
|
RougeOperator
Autocannons Anonymous
49
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:13:00 -
[351] - Quote
RougeOperator wrote:Eternum Praetorian wrote:
It is the fault of those who decided to make EVE into their cash cow for other projects, and now others will get fired because of their stupid decisions. It has nothing to do with the eve community.
This sums it up. The idiots blaming the community seem to be the typical neurologically challenged CCP sycophants that seem to materialize every time CCP does something really stupid. We understand layoffs. But we question the methodology in what and who. And fairly so.
Now someone tell me WHY hilmar still has a job? |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
95
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:14:00 -
[352] - Quote
I think we still have a message to send to the MMO Industry as a whole.
STAY THE COURSE.
|
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
389
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:17:00 -
[353] - Quote
Zeomebuch Nova wrote:Brit Green wrote:I'm not without sympathy for these folks, but part of their job was to keep the rabble under control. They failed at this. When you don't perform your job, you lose it. That's the way these things work. I will contract you to keep a white, rich, 15 years old nerdy intact in his way through a 5km long ghetto. This all will happen once it's enough dark, just because i enjoy making cretinous decisions. Your hands are your only tools. Don't blame me if you fail doing your job, which I, as your employer, know pretty well you will.
So, if I'm reading this right, you are saying they hired the wrong people for the job. Either that or they hired people for a job that they knew couldn't be done.
Either way, the only solution to that is to remove the forum.
Is that what you are after?
Mr Epeen
If you can read this, you haven't blocked me yet. |
Kyoko Sakoda
Veto. Veto Corp
4
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:18:00 -
[354] - Quote
Today I'm reminded of why I'm a democratic socialist. My heart goes out to those who've lost their jobs and their families. |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
95
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:19:00 -
[355] - Quote
Hey you 20% that quit CCP.
Can I haz your stuffz? |
Riflin' Betty
Perfunctory
22
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:19:00 -
[356] - Quote
So after firing your entire community team, who will mod your fancy new forums?
|
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
95
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:20:00 -
[357] - Quote
Riflin' Betty wrote:So after firing your entire community team, who will mod your fancy new forums?
That shows how much CCP care about the community, YOU the CUSTOMER, and you still want to pay them money?
CCP sent a very clear message, the Community of CUSTOMERS means diddly squat to them. Just their short term financials. |
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
389
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:21:00 -
[358] - Quote
Riflin' Betty wrote:So after firing your entire community team, who will mod your fancy new forums?
TBH, I hope it's someone that makes sure people with permabans stay banned.
Mr Epeen If you can read this, you haven't blocked me yet. |
Barakkus
851
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:22:00 -
[359] - Quote
Mr Epeen wrote:Zeomebuch Nova wrote:Brit Green wrote:I'm not without sympathy for these folks, but part of their job was to keep the rabble under control. They failed at this. When you don't perform your job, you lose it. That's the way these things work. I will contract you to keep a white, rich, 15 years old nerdy intact in his way through a 5km long ghetto. This all will happen once it's enough dark, just because i enjoy making cretinous decisions. Your hands are your only tools. Don't blame me if you fail doing your job, which I, as your employer, know pretty well you will. So, if I'm reading this right, you are saying they hired the wrong people for the job. Either that or they hired people for a job that they knew couldn't be done. Either way, the only solution to that is to remove the forum. Is that what you are after? Mr Epeen
No, I think the idea is the retards on this forum are not controllable, even by the hand of god himself. |
Dorian Wylde
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
41
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:22:00 -
[360] - Quote
So you're stretched too thin, and you respond to that by reducing staff?
Yeah, that makes perfect sense.
If you fired people over the incarna/nex/greed debacle that's one thing. But come out and say it. Don't try to paint it in some sort of positive light. And if that is the case, I sincerely hope you fired the right people, not scapegoats. |
|
Flamewave
Crimson Moon Society
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:23:00 -
[361] - Quote
Barakkus wrote:No, I think the idea is the retards on this forum are not controllable, even by the hand of god himself.
Some things ISK can't buy. For everything else, there's Jita. |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
95
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:24:00 -
[362] - Quote
Eve is Dying
CCP is Dying
|
Zeomebuch Nova
Metalworks
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:25:00 -
[363] - Quote
Mr Epeen wrote:Zeomebuch Nova wrote:Brit Green wrote:I'm not without sympathy for these folks, but part of their job was to keep the rabble under control. They failed at this. When you don't perform your job, you lose it. That's the way these things work. I will contract you to keep a white, rich, 15 years old nerdy intact in his way through a 5km long ghetto. This all will happen once it's enough dark, just because i enjoy making cretinous decisions. Your hands are your only tools. Don't blame me if you fail doing your job, which I, as your employer, know pretty well you will. So, if I'm reading this right, you are saying they hired the wrong people for the job. Either that or they hired people for a job that they knew couldn't be done. Either way, the only solution to that is to remove the forum. Is that what you are after? Mr Epeen
ewww... yes, you nailed it. |
Black Dranzer
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:27:00 -
[364] - Quote
Over recent months, my mood has been annoyed.
Now I'm simply concerned. |
Kengutsi Akira
58
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:30:00 -
[365] - Quote
Riflin' Betty wrote:So after firing your entire community team, who will mod your fancy new forums?
funny thing there, I posted the names of the ppl that got canned but I cut the real names out for fear of getting banned like they seem to do to other ppl that use real names of CCP ppl but it might not matter anymore now that there are no mods
What Mittani wants, Mittani gets, Mittani help us all
|
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
95
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:31:00 -
[366] - Quote
Where is this list?
Let's get SLASHDOT Coverage... get the message across tho the MMO industry, WE DONT WANT THIS CRAP. |
Smertrios
Veto. Veto Corp
4
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:31:00 -
[367] - Quote
Wow... Just wow.
I understand the downsizing and refocusing. Thats good.
But the people let go! content and community down to skeleton teams! some of the most loyal and dedicated devs let go! most of the devs responsible for the direction and failures of the last few years remain!
WTF are the people in charge doing!
Seriously pull your heads out of your own and each others asses! You wont improve the game by getting rid of the people that care and connect with the community!! hell thats been what caused all the issues recently and now you get rid of the people who keep CCP and us close.
Total fail! It's honestly like you are trying to fail as a company and have been doing a pretty damn good job of it recently.
CCP was heading in the right direction then does a u-turn and drives off a cliff.
I am seeing pages and pages of shock from the community across many many websites and forums and disbelief at the people let go. That will turn to anger soon and the **** storm of the last few months will feel like a tickle.
Honestly WTF!
Sad sad day, many of my corp are in tears at this news. Good job again CCP management! Idiots! |
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
392
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:32:00 -
[368] - Quote
Barakkus wrote:
No, I think the idea is the retards on this forum are not controllable, even by the hand of god himself.
Can you imagine if they actually got someone in here that had the balls to enforce the rules?
I'd have to roll a new kinder, gentler me.
What a loss for the community.
Mr Epeen
If you can read this, you haven't blocked me yet. |
Iron Mayden
Casa da Mae Joana Vera Cruz Alliance
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:32:00 -
[369] - Quote
How does reducing staff streamlines the development process?
Sounds like my current job, reduce staff... double work?
|
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
95
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:33:00 -
[370] - Quote
Eve has a high learning curve, even for CCP :)
|
|
Barakkus
852
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:35:00 -
[371] - Quote
Mr Epeen wrote:Barakkus wrote:
No, I think the idea is the retards on this forum are not controllable, even by the hand of god himself.
Can you imagine if they actually got someone in here that had the balls to enforce the rules? I'd have to roll a new kinder, gentler me. What a loss for the community. Mr Epeen
Actually, they could hire me to regulate these idiots...I did a couple years as a SOE forum moderator for EQ2 lol.
I have a short list of immediate perma-bans already lined up
I'm not sure I'd want to go back to doing that again though... |
Klandi
Consortium of stella Technologies
9
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:35:00 -
[372] - Quote
Wow... I am stunned
Knowing about redundancy (more times than I care to count) I am aware of the mental state of those affected. You will pull through this and you must look for the positive.
Things like this mean that the blame game is played out and someone in a position of authority takes it for getting it wrong. Whether it was internal error or a mixture of external and internal errors we will never know, but it will be interesting to see how it plays out. With the focus restored and the track firmly on the core product - I hope that we will see marked improvement of vision and communication.
|
Rada Ionesco
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:35:00 -
[373] - Quote
Dorian Wylde wrote:So you're stretched too thin, and you respond to that by reducing staff?
Yeah, that makes perfect sense.
If you fired people over the incarna/nex/greed debacle that's one thing. But come out and say it. Don't try to paint it in some sort of positive light. And if that is the case, I sincerely hope you fired the right people, not scapegoats.
I agree with exactly everything that was said above.
In doing so, we have come to the conclusion that we are attempting too many things for a company our size CCP Manifest
I do not agree that the next (above) statement makes any sense however when paired with the decision to fire staff. But what ever, it's your company, make as little sense as you want to.
I know one other thing for certain, if they tank this World of Darkness MMO, the only thing this company has been working on for the last year or two that actually looks like it will be somehting I would spend more money on (considering I have not cancelled my eve accounts yet, but soon don't worry), I would most likely never give them or White Wolf any money again. So keep that in mind CCP, some people here truly do vote with their dollar.
|
Kengutsi Akira
58
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:37:00 -
[374] - Quote
Miilla wrote:Where is this list?
Let's get SLASHDOT Coverage... get the message across tho the MMO industry, WE DONT WANT THIS CRAP.
page 17 post 335 I think
Its cool, theyll just hire replacements from Goonsquad. theyll fix it What Mittani wants, Mittani gets, Mittani help us all
|
Mashie Saldana
Veto. Veto Corp
32
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:37:00 -
[375] - Quote
CCP can't even reduce the staff without failing on an epic scale. Anastasia -á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á Dominique-á-á Mashie -á-á Monica |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
95
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:38:00 -
[376] - Quote
CCP care so much about the Customers (community) they lay off their customer interface team :)
That is a very clear message right there.
Don't you get it? |
Kengutsi Akira
58
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:41:00 -
[377] - Quote
Miilla wrote:CCP care so much about the Customers (community) they lay off their customer interface team :)
That is a very clear message right there.
Don't you get it?
and they care so much about refocussing to the game they get rid of content designers
I think I get the message and it sounds like "stay the course" What Mittani wants, Mittani gets, Mittani help us all
|
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
95
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:42:00 -
[378] - Quote
So WE the customers STAY THE COURSE too.
Keep the pressure on.
Don't you all get it, the ship spinning is just Bread and Circuses to keep you actively paying to keep Dust coming and that will be more Bread and Circuses as both Eve and Dust will fund WoD.
Stop falling for the Bread and Circuses.
Imagine what another 3 months cancellations and non paying will do.
Watch for more weekend PLEX rip off offers... |
Skunk Gracklaw
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
181
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:44:00 -
[379] - Quote
Kengutsi Akira wrote:Its cool, theyll just hire replacements from Goonsquad. theyll fix it Who is Goonsquad?
|
Angeliq
Soimii Patriei Vera Cruz Alliance
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:44:00 -
[380] - Quote
I don't care about those 20% soon to be ex-CCP employees. I pay CCP to play EVE Online, not WoD or Dust514 and I expect CCP to use my money in order to develop and improve EVE Online. It's not my fault those ppl are being fired, CCP went money hungry and got involved in other projects thinking they could use EVE money in order to develop more milking cows. Now don't get me wrong, I don't have a problem with those ppl, I don't hate them or anything, I just DON'T CARE about them, I never wanted any of them in the first place, CCP should feel sorry for them, not me. Yes, those 20% might have no fault, but I just (yes, you guessed) don't care :)
It's actually good to see CCP finally coming back to EVE Online tho I don't really believe anything CCP says, cos you know... the truth is out there... behind all this smoke and PR stunts that surrounds the forums. |
|
Kengutsi Akira
58
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:48:00 -
[381] - Quote
Skunk Gracklaw wrote:Kengutsi Akira wrote:Its cool, theyll just hire replacements from Goonsquad. theyll fix it Who is Goonsquad?
te name of your corp from another game lol What Mittani wants, Mittani gets, Mittani help us all
|
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
95
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:50:00 -
[382] - Quote
Maybe the 20% fired can go work for Perpetuum or Guild Wars 2 or SWTOR :)
Because that is where WE are all going :) |
Renan Ruivo
Hipernova Vera Cruz Alliance
188
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:50:00 -
[383] - Quote
We are seeing some of EVE's community names going, but i dare to ask... does anyone who follows WoD and/or DUST development care to comment on the current state of the names over there that are going away as well? Sometimes the only difference between a budding genius and a blooming idiot is where they chose to take a stand. |
Tairon Usaro
The X-Trading Company RAZOR Alliance
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:52:00 -
[384] - Quote
Quote: However, over the past two months, our subscribers have gone down from their peak this summer. We attribute this to our own mistakes and poor communications with our players. We are correcting that now.
you guys, are aware, that we monitor the "concurrent users" statistics ?!? The statement above is not consistent with the existing data ! Nor is the analysis complete. Something went wrong with EVE, but not for the last 2 month, but for at least the last 9 Month. The concurrent user peak dates 23rd of January 2011. Form there on, anybody sees the clear and steady trend downwards. A peak in summer is a marketing myth ! There is a clear trend line from January on and its pointing downwards.
OK, this is "just" concurrent users data, but the impact on the subscribers number should be even more dramatic, since most multi account players do not log in all their accounts concurrently, but cancel them concurrently, when they loose interrest in the game.
Therefore good to read, that CCP acknowledges the problem, but finally, only a good expansion patch can break the trend |
Jita Alt666
358
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:52:00 -
[385] - Quote
Firstly, this is an unexpected and interesting development. My comments here are merely from an addicted Eve Online player point of view:
Reducing excess staff to allow CCP to concentrate on the development of Eve Online is a sacrifice I am intellectually happy with. This decision process should have been made before it got to the point that real life individuals have lost their employment. For those individuals I feel sorry.
There has a been a "list of staff laid off" circulating on other forums (probably linked here earlier in thread - but I'm not reading all of this). I am worried that the individuals who feature on this list are individuals who have been strong advocates in the importance of communicating with the player base and largely have helped keep the keel on a very unsteady ship aligned.
To those individuals who (may) have lost their jobs and with whom I have sparred, debated, been warned for personally insulting etc etc; I wish you the best in whatever direction life takes you. I have thoroughly enjoyed the said sparring, debating and the excesses of my debates (even when escalated numerous times on numerous petitions ). Good luck and to quote a phrase from my upbringing:
Ake! Ake! Kia Kaha E! |
Midge Mo'yb
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
31
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:52:00 -
[386] - Quote
Renan Ruivo wrote:We are seeing some of EVE's community names going, but i dare to ask... does anyone who follows WoD and/or DUST development care to comment on the current state of the names over there that are going away as well?
it would be more prudent to ask Who isnt |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
95
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:54:00 -
[387] - Quote
Not wanting to seem I'm helping with CCP's welcome demise.
START TYPING THOSE RESUME'S EMPLOYEES :)
That is the start of it, but it won't be the last.
They didn't go DEEP enough in their layoffs, so there WILL be another round.
Rule 1 of Layoffs and moral, GO DEEP , ONE ROUND and make that very clear internally.
|
Raid'En
Apprentice Innovations
77
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:55:00 -
[388] - Quote
if the staff going out is the one linked to WoD, why do we see names we know since a long time being part of it ? >_< |
Myxx
Atropos Group
84
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:57:00 -
[389] - Quote
Raid'En wrote:if the staff going out is the one linked to WoD, why do we see names we know since a long time being part of it ? >_< Thats the fallacy of it. The cancers aren't being removed, just the people who gave a damn. |
DJ Xaphod
Eve Radio Corporation
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:57:00 -
[390] - Quote
Angeliq wrote:I don't care about those 20% soon to be ex-CCP employees. I pay CCP to play EVE Online, not WoD or Dust514 and I expect CCP to use my money in order to develop and improve EVE Online. It's not my fault those ppl are being fired, CCP went money hungry and got involved in other projects thinking they could use EVE money in order to develop more milking cows. Now don't get me wrong, I don't have a problem with those ppl, I don't hate them or anything, I just DON'T CARE about them, I never wanted any of them in the first place, CCP should feel sorry for them, not me. Yes, those 20% might have no fault, but I just (yes, you guessed) don't care :)
It's actually good to see CCP finally coming back to EVE Online tho I don't really believe anything CCP says, cos you know... the truth is out there... behind all this smoke and PR stunts that surrounds the forums. I'd agree, however at least a fair few of the people being layed off are EVE Online staff, so I don't believe CCP are coming back to EVE Online.
I'll believe what they do, not what they say, after all. |
|
Grog Barrel
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 21:59:00 -
[391] - Quote
Angeliq wrote:I don't care about those 20% soon to be ex-CCP employees. I pay CCP to play EVE Online, not WoD or Dust514 and I expect CCP to use my money in order to develop and improve EVE Online. It's not my fault those ppl are being fired, CCP went money hungry and got involved in other projects thinking they could use EVE money in order to develop more milking cows. Now don't get me wrong, I don't have a problem with those ppl, I don't hate them or anything, I just DON'T CARE about them, I never wanted any of them in the first place, CCP should feel sorry for them, not me. Yes, those 20% might have no fault, but I just (yes, you guessed) don't care :)
It's actually good to see CCP finally coming back to EVE Online tho I don't really believe anything CCP says, cos you know... the truth is out there... behind all this smoke and PR stunts that surrounds the forums.
The point of this thread was to make customers feel bad and responsible for those getting fired. This way, the customers would have to think twice before expressing their disappointments by canceling their Subs. Basically the easiest way: Blame the others for your own faults, have a clean conscience. Keep dreaming of your greatness. |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
59
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:02:00 -
[392] - Quote
I'm not happy with this turn of events, not at all.
I understand the need to refocus.
I understand the need to downsize the staff directly involved in departments directly working on projects that are being scaled back.
I understand the fact that we do not know the particulars of why each individual was on that list.
I have a hard time understanding why 20% of the employees will be let go, many of whom seemingly have little (if anything) to do with the bad decisions that led to this situation... or with WOD specific development that is being curtailed.
We all know there were many bad strategic decisions made concerning the development and PR processes over the last year and 1/2.
Lack of planning the why instead of just the how to for Incarna. Lack of expectation management. Lack of perspective in formulating the pricing structure and destructability of NeX store items. Lack of properly iterating on existing content due to improperly considered development priorities. And many more.
If these people were at least in part responsible for those mistakes, I feel for them but I understand the necessity.
If these people are paying the price for other peoples mistakes, I'm not fine with it... and I would strongly suggest taking your period of reassessment to a whole new level. Otherwise, this situation will inevitably arise again.
And if I ever... ever... find out that some of these people were let go due to internal political reasons or because they stepped on someones toes/embarrased them pointing out things that have proven to be correct, I'm out. Period.
I have never threatened to leave before, but rest assured, that would do it.
I'll bow out of the thread now and let the forum maggots that have suddenly reappeared just in time to infect this wound to revel in CCP's misery.
To kill the enemy and break their toys!
It's not so much a mission statement,-áit's more like a family motto. |
Kengutsi Akira
58
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:08:00 -
[393] - Quote
Miilla wrote:Maybe the 20% fired can go work for Perpetuum or Guild Wars 2 or SWTOR :)
Because that is where WE are all going :)
Im not going to SWTOR thats just talking WoW
What Mittani wants, Mittani gets, Mittani help us all
|
Astrid Stjerna
Teraa Matar
26
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:10:00 -
[394] - Quote
CCP Manifest wrote:Today it was my solemn duty to post an announcement from CCP. You can read that announcement here. Please keep your discussion of the announcement to this thread if possible, and understand that this and the days in the future are going to be very difficult for those at CCP. We stand behind our decisions and trust that it will ultimately bring you, the EVE community, a better game.
First of all, my condolences to those that lost their jobs. In an uncertain economy, that's a scary and dicey situation to be in, and I hope you can survive what is quite probably going to be a very rough few weeks.
CCP: I I'm glad to see you stick by your guns. You're obviously confident that you're on the right track; I've never been in your shoes, so I can't comment one way or the other. I do, however, couch this praise in a word of caution:
Your players are watching you.
Your players are also very cautious. You've been through some rough patches of late -- the Hilmar debacle, the only semi-successful launch of Incarna, and this unexpected round of layoffs. We've stuck with you, for the most part. We've shared your pain, and cheered at your successes.
The recent shakeups, both in public and those undoubtably going on behind-the-scenes, have us extremely worried. Most of us are crossing our fingers that this isn't a forewarning of something worse coming down the pipe.
We want to see CCP succeed, because that means that EvE itself will succeed. We're scared, though, that EvE and CCP are going in a direction where we can't follow. You've done a lot to restore confidence -- Hilmar's apology, the more open communication that's come out of it, and the new, more tightly-focused game-plan for EvE's future were all good things to happen.
But we are watching you, CCP, and we hope you're watching us in return. These next few months may just tell the tale: EvE will either continue to become the most immersive online experience ever created, or it will stumble into obscurity when one too many mistakes are finally made.
I pray for the former -- and in fear, I prepare for the latter.
Fly safe.
Astrid. |
Elhazzared
Cruor Angelus Divortium
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:10:00 -
[395] - Quote
If CCP really wants to focus on EVE and actually do something right to make up for everything they have been doing wrong it's rather simple. Stop making players play the way you want!
First about 0.0, it's time to clean up the mess you've done with the in the matter of havens and sanctums. As CCP clearly saw, it does not promote wars for good places, it only makes space bellow 0.5 worthless which is the great majority of 0.0
Second, don't go ahead with the plans for the new interaction. Handing control of the customs office to the players is only going to ever do one thing, put them in control of large alliances giving more money to those who already have a lot and less to those who don't. it will also make PI in high sec worse.
Third about PI as well. Stop the depletion on planets and effectivily imput a restriction to were players can suck resources from so they don't do on top of eachother. it's about time that PI is actually worth a thing like it was in the beggining.
Fourth, Don't even dream about going foward with the plans for building T2 stuff only in 0.0 and so on. With this you're only getting people to give up, not moving them to 0.0, in fact we pay this game to have fun and if a player doesn't wants to go to 0.0, CCP has no right to tell them to.
That is a good begging for CCP to make amends and start focusing on what's important. CCP should not promote only 0.0 and PVP, CCP should promote a game with various aspects and each and everyone of them should be as profitable and as fun as the rest of them, not make people just do what you want which is lose ships and ISK in hopes people will be buying more plexs to make you more money. It's only CCPs delusion that makes them think like that, it never happened and it never will. So stop this trend or you'll just keep losing players like you have. |
RIP Wash
FISKL GUARDS The Kadeshi
11
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:10:00 -
[396] - Quote
My sympathies to all the White Wolf alumni who are now looking for work. I have been a fan for a long time.
That said It looks like all the complains for "vampires sucking the life from eve" were on to something. WoD MMO seems to be in more of a back of the napkin design /tech demo/skunkworx project stage from what I have seen. To force EVE players to beta test the tech was a terrible decision, and I am glad CCP reversed it. |
Michael Turate
The Bembridge Mining Company
7
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:15:00 -
[397] - Quote
My profound sympathies go out to those who will lose their jobs and my thoughts are with the families of those who will be made redundant. I lost my job as a result of the UK recession and unemployment at this time will be a hard road to tread for all concerned.
The company should be applauded for coming back from the brink, everything could have been lost but now there is genuine hope for the future. Eve can be great again, CCP can be a strong company again, the partnerships between the players and the business can be rebuilt. Future sucess for the company and the playerbase will be doubly sweet in view of how close things came to disaster.
BUT, all we (the players) would have lost is a computer game. The facts are now apparent that real people will lose their jobs and their livelihoods. I sincerly hope the lessons have been learnt because they have come at some considerable cost.
|
Klingon Admiral
Black Hole Cluster
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:18:00 -
[398] - Quote
Well I wonder how CCP wants to regain contact with the community after pretty much nuking the comunity-team ... |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
96
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:18:00 -
[399] - Quote
you don't get replaced by a very small shell script anymore
You get replaced by a very small chinaman... cheaper than a script. (Since behind that small shell script is an overweight underskilled psuedo-engineer developer that eats too many bananas). |
Grog Barrel
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:20:00 -
[400] - Quote
Michael Turate wrote: BUT, all we (the players) would have lost is a computer game. The facts are now apparent that real people will lose their jobs and their livelihoods. I sincerly hope the lessons have been learnt because they have come at some considerable cost.
Yes, let us all hope their ex-CEO has learned the lesson. |
|
Reilly Duvolle
Hydra Squadron
59
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:20:00 -
[401] - Quote
Personally I think it very odd for a company that previoulsy have shown that their management suck balls in communicating with their players, to fire off virtually their entire community team.....The same departement i might add, that also includes CSM.
Zymurgist and Fallout have allready posted their farewells. In the current climate, I certainly dont think this is the brightest move in the world. |
Angeliq
Soimii Patriei Vera Cruz Alliance
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:20:00 -
[402] - Quote
Maybe Hilmar wants to get rid of all those ppl that disagreed with him in the past so he can stay the course. I keep getting the feeling I'm being buIIsh!ted... I still find a lot of PR work and public speech schemes and patterns in those threads and I can't help thinking that I'm being manipulated. I would appreciate the naked truth, but meh, I know you (as a company) can't do that so if EVE turns into the game experience I want, I'll just go with it, but if some day I'll wake up and realize that EVE is no longer EVE, I'll just say Fawk You CCP for the last time and be done with it. |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
96
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:22:00 -
[403] - Quote
We were ganked
Ironic really that that web page came up :) |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
96
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:22:00 -
[404] - Quote
Is the CSM fired yet? :)
|
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
96
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:24:00 -
[405] - Quote
So, can we buy their EX CCP characters on the character bazzaar?
Then again who would trust that employment history :) |
ACY GTMI
Veerhouven Group The Veerhouven Group
17
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:25:00 -
[406] - Quote
Several months ago, even before the Incarna debacle, I trotted out one of the oldest known precepts of successful software project management.
"Do not encourage failure."
If a programmer is assigned a particular black box to program, and fails, you have two options.
Option 1, Assign something simpler and give him/her another chance, but only one.
Option 2, if you are on a budget, get rid of that programmer.
Same goes for project managers. If they can't do the job, you can't afford them.
Based on recent issues, I see Eve as a very large bucket of spaghetti code, loosely held together by emergency repairs.
Competent management would never have let it happen in the first place.
Sure, I'm sorry that some people have lost their jobs, but it appears to me that there are probably quite a few who should have lost their jobs a long time ago.
For the programmers, and project managers, if there were any, if you can't even meet CCP's low standards, you should really consider another line of work.
I like this game. It's the only one I play, and I will continue to play it as long as I can stand to. But the parts of it that I play haven't improved a bit in two years. During that time I've paid enough in monthly fees to buy a car.
What I really wish? No changes at all, except fixes, for at least a year. A year isn't long enough to fix all the things that are screwed up already, but it might get CCP back to a good starting point for other necessary fixes. |
Kengutsi Akira
58
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:26:00 -
[407] - Quote
Myxx wrote:Raid'En wrote:if the staff going out is the one linked to WoD, why do we see names we know since a long time being part of it ? >_< Thats the fallacy of it. The cancers aren't being removed, just the people who gave a damn.
yes, hilmar being that cancer What Mittani wants, Mittani gets, Mittani help us all
|
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
96
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:28:00 -
[408] - Quote
"Our metrics do not show that cancellations are significant"
Ring a bell?
It should... CSM Emergency Meeting...
|
Azelor Delaria
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
50
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:29:00 -
[409] - Quote
Miilla wrote:Maybe the 20% fired can go work for Perpetuum or Guild Wars 2 or SWTOR :)
Because that is where WE are all going :)
Don't forget: World of Warcraft: Mists of Panderia is coming out soon! C'mon guys! Pandas!
|
Cailais
Nasty Pope Holding Corp Talocan United
61
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:31:00 -
[410] - Quote
Stunned they fired Noah Ward, he was a pretty cool guy imho.
CCP you're such a bunch of cash grabbing wankers.
C.
|
|
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
97
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:32:00 -
[411] - Quote
So are we still getting bloodline changes?
|
Kengutsi Akira
58
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:34:00 -
[412] - Quote
DJ Xaphod wrote:Angeliq wrote:I don't care about those 20% soon to be ex-CCP employees. I pay CCP to play EVE Online, not WoD or Dust514 and I expect CCP to use my money in order to develop and improve EVE Online. It's not my fault those ppl are being fired, CCP went money hungry and got involved in other projects thinking they could use EVE money in order to develop more milking cows. Now don't get me wrong, I don't have a problem with those ppl, I don't hate them or anything, I just DON'T CARE about them, I never wanted any of them in the first place, CCP should feel sorry for them, not me. Yes, those 20% might have no fault, but I just (yes, you guessed) don't care :)
It's actually good to see CCP finally coming back to EVE Online tho I don't really believe anything CCP says, cos you know... the truth is out there... behind all this smoke and PR stunts that surrounds the forums. I'd agree, however at least a fair few of the people being layed off are EVE Online staff, so I don't believe CCP are coming back to EVE Online. I'll believe what they do, not what they say, after all.
not just staff, content designers
Grog Barrel wrote:Angeliq wrote:I don't care about those 20% soon to be ex-CCP employees. I pay CCP to play EVE Online, not WoD or Dust514 and I expect CCP to use my money in order to develop and improve EVE Online. It's not my fault those ppl are being fired, CCP went money hungry and got involved in other projects thinking they could use EVE money in order to develop more milking cows. Now don't get me wrong, I don't have a problem with those ppl, I don't hate them or anything, I just DON'T CARE about them, I never wanted any of them in the first place, CCP should feel sorry for them, not me. Yes, those 20% might have no fault, but I just (yes, you guessed) don't care :)
It's actually good to see CCP finally coming back to EVE Online tho I don't really believe anything CCP says, cos you know... the truth is out there... behind all this smoke and PR stunts that surrounds the forums. The point of this thread was to make customers feel bad and responsible for those getting fired. This way, the customers would have to think twice before expressing their disappointments by canceling their Subs. Basically the easiest way: Blame the others for your own faults, have a clean conscience. Keep dreaming of your greatness.
reads that way to me and quite a few others as well What Mittani wants, Mittani gets, Mittani help us all
|
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
97
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:35:00 -
[413] - Quote
So are we still getting bloodline changes?
Is now a bad time to ask when we get REMAPS in the NEX store? |
Jolteon Taylor
The Scope Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:35:00 -
[414] - Quote
Klingon Admiral wrote:Well I wonder how CCP wants to regain contact with the community after pretty much nuking the comunity-team ... Especially the well liked and actually trusted members of the community team. |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
97
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:39:00 -
[415] - Quote
I WANT MY YELLOW FONT BACK
Or I cancel all 10 accounts. |
Kengutsi Akira
58
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:42:00 -
[416] - Quote
kinda curious to why our lauded CSM that talk to these guys daily arent jumping all over this saying it was their idea like the dev blog about the winter expansion.
but seriously, youd think theyd have given the rest of us a clue (unless this was one of those last second decisions) What Mittani wants, Mittani gets, Mittani help us all
|
Cailais
Nasty Pope Holding Corp Talocan United
61
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:43:00 -
[417] - Quote
Miilla wrote:I WANT MY YELLOW FONT BACK
Or I cancel all 10 accounts.
Didnt you get the memo? You're our new community rep. You can post in whatever colour you like :D
C.
|
Nak hak
23
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:44:00 -
[418] - Quote
"We made some missteps on that journey," this would be CCP current management.
Layoff. Only the investors would see this as good news. Company spins it as good news. Some customers buy into it. Not me.
"Our mission is to enrich the vast EVE Universe by...., bring DUST 514 to market on the PS3. "
DUST 514 is an important part of the EVE Universe. Same message. Same plan. CCP continues on its path to become a PS3 FPS gaming company. Seems to be a model they are locked into. Maybe it well work for CCP.
"Realignment will be seen as early as this winter with the upcoming EVE Online expansions and the launch of DUST 514 private trials."
A winter expansion, and DUST 514 private trials. Hopefully the expansion will be a good one. Have faith.
"Wow... subscription based + micro transactions.. talk about greed."-á LOL!
Best Regards, Nak hak |
Joe D'Trader
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
29
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:46:00 -
[419] - Quote
Miilla wrote:I WANT MY YELLOW FONT BACK
Or I cancel all 10 accounts.
I still like you :D, but damn you are correct, I guess we can't ask a big yellow question again if there are no colors... |
Lykouleon
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
197
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:49:00 -
[420] - Quote
I can't say I see the logic in firing some of the core back-bone of the community development team, especially in a time when the community has reacted in a way where we've lost significant faith in CCP as a company.
In the long-run, this will probably be a good move for CCP financially. However, that's only if the community doesn't collapse at this point since too few people are talking directly with us.
The community development team does a lot more than just forum moderation and shiny posts and duly deserves the credit for their hard work promoting our overall EVE community to the outside world. Guard, Phantom, Navigator, Manifest, and Spitfire are going to have a lot of work on their hands now.
At this point, all I can do is wish the best to those that, unfortunately, will be leaving CCP and hope that they stay active in our community (if not the direct one, at least the extended one). Sympathies to the guys and gals at CCP who had to see their friends and co-workers receive this bad news.
Lets just hope this horrid turn of events wasn't a waste and something "passably" decent will come from it. Lykouleon > CYNO ME CLOSER SO I CAN HIT THEM WITH MY SWORD |
|
Caval Akemi
Nuts and Vindictive Remix Technologies
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:50:00 -
[421] - Quote
Lesson learned CCP?
Dont **** with your cash cow!
|
Arydanika
Angelitos Negros
16
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:51:00 -
[422] - Quote
My deepest and heart felt condolences to the CCP 20%. You will be sincerely missed.
Thank you for everything you have done for the game and this community.
I can't fathom how this is good for the game. I can't imagine how you must be feeling or what's going though your heads. I can't begin to express how I feel about the entire heaping pile of manure of a business decision. Then again, what good is expressing myself in type in venue be since the majority of people that cared enough to hear and shouldered the burden of being front line soldiers have been deemed unnecessary.
May your contributions and passion, the things that helped make this game great, live on. GÖÑ The Podcast | The Blog | The Videos | The Woman |
Smoking Blunts
Zebra Corp BricK sQuAD.
118
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:51:00 -
[423] - Quote
Cailais wrote:Stunned they fired Noah Ward, he was a pretty cool guy imho.
CCP you're such a bunch of cash grabbing wankers.
C.
ty for showing me that you can say wankers on these forums.
hilmar your the one that needs to get ****** in the arse and tossed out like garbage, unlike the ones you have fired due to you retardedness. you have single handedly ****** eve and your company, i do hope your happy now
try milking teh cow as it dies to yoru own hand, dumb arsed fuckface CCP-áare full of words and no action. We watch what they do and its nothing but false statements and lies.
|
Jace Errata
Cobalt Valkyrie Industries The Ambivalent
12
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:53:00 -
[424] - Quote
I...think I'll just drop this in here. http://bit.ly/p86wWa That is all. :| Let's...just assume there's some kind of signature here, 'k? ... ... OH WAIT. |
Taedrin
Kushan Industrial
112
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:57:00 -
[425] - Quote
I suspect that the firing of CCP staff has more to do with a loan restructuring agreement instead of "refocusing" on EVE Online. CCP had (has?) a sizable loan which is due this month. I suspect that CCP was not able to pay it off (as their balance sheet indicated a few months ago) so they restructured their loan. Downsizing may have been a part of their agreement with their creditors.
This new effort to "refocus on EVE" is their way of making the best of a bad situation. |
Angeliq
Soimii Patriei Vera Cruz Alliance
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 22:59:00 -
[426] - Quote
I do remember a few months back when the entire forum was complaining about bad communication between CCP and community. Now when the ppl responsible for that are getting fired, we are still complaining. We will never be happy no matter what.
It's like: CCP: I do this. Community: OMG don't do that, it's BAD!!!11 You suck and ruin the game!! You don't care and you don't LISTEN to us!! CCP: Fawk you community! You have no idea! Community: efasdfskjopfsdYOU SUCK!!11oneonesfadfjzfgb Talk to us, listen to us! Your communication skills suck! We quit! CCP: Ok, ok, I will make things better. Let's see... the community complains about redirecting money from EVE to WoD and Dust514 and about bad communication between us. OK! We'll stop giving money to WoD and Dust514, cut the personnel and fire the ppl responsible for communication. Community: OMG don't do that, it's BAD!!!11 You suck and ruin the game!! You don't care and you don't LISTEN to us!! |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
98
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:00:00 -
[427] - Quote
DO NOT RESUB ... yet.
Use a FREE TRIAL to check out the Winter Expansion if you unsubbed.. and whatever you do don't use real money to resub. Spend the OLD money.
Let them suffer more financials woes a while longer. |
Kengutsi Akira
58
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:01:00 -
[428] - Quote
Michael Turate wrote: The company should be applauded for coming back from the brink,
um they have? please show me that graph... surprise layoffs doesnt scream "back from the brink" to me What Mittani wants, Mittani gets, Mittani help us all
|
Grey Stormshadow
Starwreck Industries
300
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:03:00 -
[429] - Quote
More solidarity, less hateragespam.
|
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
98
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:04:00 -
[430] - Quote
If you can't afford it, you can't buy it. Don't spend what you don't have Don't count your chickens (golden goose?) before they hatch.
I think CCP violated all the above 3 principles of saying in business :) |
|
Josefius
Caldari Elite Force Apocalypse Now.
18
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:05:00 -
[431] - Quote
I will carefully craft my Veve, sprinkling the flour in my specific pattern, anoint my special place with chicken blood from my recently sacrificed chickens and.... **** it, I'm just going to get drunk. |
Muestereate
Two Geezers in Space
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:08:00 -
[432] - Quote
Crushed, so sorry. One door close and another one opens. Life goes on. Live it :) well. |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
98
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:10:00 -
[433] - Quote
Muestereate wrote:Crushed, so sorry. One door close and another one opens. Life goes on. Live it :) well.
Your face... Your face... Can't stop starring at it... it is like watching a trainwreck in slow motion. |
Quartex
Roving Guns Inc. RAZOR Alliance
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:14:00 -
[434] - Quote
Having been through a similar experience this year to those who have been "let go" I would like to pass on my sincere thanks for all they have done to try and move Eve online forwards and my best wishes that whatever comes next for them and their families is good and ends up being a step forward in life. Good Luck guys.
Anyone who has seen the Eve accounts will know that this period was always going to be key in the eyes of those who invest in the business and that any decline in subscribers (frankly for whatever reason ~ it doesn't matter) would put the next round of funding in a different light. Failure to effectively monetize RMT at the first attempt has possibly left CCP facing the need to cut back costs significantly in the short term. In a business like this (check the staff cost ratios) the quickest way to bleed cost is to lay off salaried employees.
Like many subscribers I am excited by the opportunity ahead for CCP to focus on the core game play and in equal measure am encouraged by the new openness in communication we are seeing. There isn't enough room here to cover the detail of what (in my opinion) needs to be done but somehow the changes which are made need to capture the original spirit of the game;
> Anything is possible ~ Alliance blocks and game balance do not prevent a subscribers freedom to explore the game, albeit with risk. > There is a level playing field ~ If subscribers believe that other subscribers are cheating for advantage, then they will leave. > We help build the game ~ Subscribers should meet CCP in space sometimes and chew the fat, yep in a belt. Don't solely rely on the player forum.
I don't play as much as I once did but I really don't want this game to die, no that's wrong, I want this game to succeed and for the dreams of its founders to be fulfilled.
Good Luck CCP and in your journey Hilmar, for steel is forged in great heat. |
Sgt Napalm
Veto. Veto Corp
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:17:00 -
[435] - Quote
Absolutely disgusting that CCP has let content developers and community staff go for EvE. This is not about slowing down WoD development, it is about reducing out bound expenditures and that stinks of a company going into survival mode. You fired the face of your company, the ones who dealt with the Incarna crisis and communicated closely with the CSM. I feel for all of those now facing unemployment, especially those in Iceland. |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
98
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:18:00 -
[436] - Quote
I actually read a job advert today... it had every programming language under the sun listed, plus art packages, and customer relations all rolled up into one... the only thing that was missing was musical instruments... drums and maybe the pan pipes and a clown suit with cymbals.
Maybe they could apply for that one :) I mean, with job requirements like that, its sure a winner!
Perhaps they had the wrong job title, it meant to read "Entertainer" |
Simbellah
A-Fission Industries
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:19:00 -
[437] - Quote
ha, CCP hands an amusing FU to whining players. crying has consequences... real consequences. That's pure EVE right there. |
Kengutsi Akira
61
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:21:00 -
[438] - Quote
Hey, where are the CSM in all this? I havent seen them post today What Mittani wants, Mittani gets, Mittani help us all
|
Kurj Valdoria
Guiding Hand Social Club Dystopia Alliance
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:22:00 -
[439] - Quote
Cancelled my last sub. Hilmer needs to go. |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
98
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:25:00 -
[440] - Quote
Yet another CCP PR... Yet another crash dive in the online player count :)
Nothing a few more blog's won't fix!
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Miklas Laces
A.N.A.R.C.H.I.C.A
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:29:00 -
[441] - Quote
A corporation losing 20% of its members and dropping 1/3 of its space, hmmm fail-cascade imminent.
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Largo LaGrande
R E D E M P T I O N Black Star Alliance
5
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:31:00 -
[442] - Quote
I have heard some Disturbing news from someone inside CCP that they are planning to change the game to a F2P and multi tier premium Accounts
I would like to get some insight on this as a GM in game refused to answer on that matter and asked me to post it on the forums
CCP is it true that this are your plans or are you just again "just talking about it"
what i have heard is this
F2P can train T1 Ships up to a BS no T2 From there on you have to purchase a premium tier to continue to train to a certain point All old chars will keep the SP they have but have to subscribe to one of the premium tiers to keep training.
this is part of what came to my attention from the inside but i will address other parts at a later time .
I would appreciate i response from you guys in this matter (a honest one)
thnx |
Siigari Kitawa
Ironclad Forge
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:35:00 -
[443] - Quote
Running a fansite, and seeing the list of people you let go, CCP you have got to get your act together. I have been kind, patient and nice to you guys. But you guys are getting rid of the people I have been trying to build relationships with for the past however long. What is wrong with you?
Dump Dust. Dump WoD. Eve is here to make you money. You do not have 10 million subscribers. You do not have 5 million subscribers. You do not have ONE million subscribers. You have about half of that, and you are actively cannibalizing your own staff just so you can keep your fancy projects running. DROP EVERYTHING THAT IS NOT EVE-ONLINE. IT IS CAUSING YOU OBVIOUS BUSINESS PAINS AND MUST BE CORRECTED.
Seriously. CCP, you are running on a thin wire. You got rid of Wrangler and Pann and others who I care about, for the love of God. Why would you do such a thing? |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
98
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:36:00 -
[444] - Quote
http://bighugelabs.com/output/motivatorb6e69c9e3e3333ad65e7926e0278ca8c7fa525ff.jpg |
Kengutsi Akira
61
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:36:00 -
[445] - Quote
eh Ive never talked to a GM in game and then was told to post anything on the forums lol What Mittani wants, Mittani gets, Mittani help us all
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Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
98
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:37:00 -
[446] - Quote
Largo LaGrande wrote:I have heard some Disturbing news from someone inside CCP that they are planning to change the game to a F2P and multi tier premium Accounts
I would like to get some insight on this as a GM in game refused to answer on that matter and asked me to post it on the forums
CCP is it true that this are your plans or are you just again "just talking about it"
what i have heard is this
F2P can train T1 Ships up to a BS no T2 From there on you have to purchase a premium tier to continue to train to a certain point All old chars will keep the SP they have but have to subscribe to one of the premium tiers to keep training.
this is part of what came to my attention from the inside but i will address other parts at a later time .
I would appreciate i response from you guys in this matter (a honest one)
thnx
This is very likely to happen especially as subscriber numbers PLUMMET.
In fact I would expect this to happen if not by this Christmas, early next year at the latest.
Now, do PLEX subscribers get classed as premium or free to play? :) |
Simetraz
State War Academy Caldari State
103
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:37:00 -
[447] - Quote
I noticed on a web search CCP has/had about 600 employee's 20 % loss means 120 CCP's where given there walking papers.
Not the short list posted above. Think about that for a minute if you can.
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Largo LaGrande
R E D E M P T I O N Black Star Alliance
5
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:40:00 -
[448] - Quote
Kengutsi Akira wrote:eh Ive never talked to a GM in game and then was told to post anything on the forums lol
if needed i can provide proof of answer from gm
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Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
98
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:42:00 -
[449] - Quote
Largo LaGrande wrote:Kengutsi Akira wrote:eh Ive never talked to a GM in game and then was told to post anything on the forums lol if needed i can provide proof of answer from gm
I can confirm that they do this from time to time on questions they don't want to answer... the best question is a DIRECT question... whether they answer it or not, you get your answer pretty quickly..
There is no future for Eve unless CCP can get subscriber numbers up... F2P it is.
It IS coming... don't deny it to yourself. |
DJ Xaphod
Eve Radio Corporation
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:45:00 -
[450] - Quote
And still no CCP response in this thread.
Hellmar, did you honestly think you could hide the sacking of key EVE Online community team and other staff members with a release that tried to imply that this was nothing to do with $$$ and was all about focusing on EVE?
Did you think we wouldn't notice when you started to sack all the people we'd built up a relationship with?
This flies in the face of previous communication; after your open letter I was willing to give you the benefit of the doubt; you seemed genuinely apologetic, you seemed to genuinely want to be more open in your communication with us.. and yes, at first glance that is what this particular announcement looked like, but right now it seems very much like you're telling us we're important on one hand while sacking the people we communicate with directly on the other.
If CCP is genuinely in financial trouble and needs to majorly restructure its staff, including the community team, then I at least will understand, but that's definitely not what you're saying. If this is what you're having to do, we'd appreciate transparency and some sort of information about what the future holds for the communication between CCP and the EVE Online community.
I can't help but think that either you're lying to us, and EVE Online is NOT in good health, or you're lying to us, and you have no intention of strengthening the continuous development of EVE Online. Or both.
Maybe that's a communication problem, perhaps one of your community team can correct me.. oh wait..
So again CCP: I'll watch what you do, rather than listen to what you say.. and right now you're demonstrating a severe lack of caring for the EVE Online community. EVE Radio, bringing music to the masses
Purple Sabbath, with Xaphod; Sunday 12:00 game time. |
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Nak hak
23
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:46:00 -
[451] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote: I manage software projects for a living and have for 33 years. So I get the whole "mythical man month" concept of adding folks to a project not making it come together any sooner.....,
This is not a refocus on Eve, this is a "we are going down, we are out of ballast so we need to throw some crew out of the dirrigible to survive!" moment. And oh, "don't touch our favorite part of our anvil collection! That stays in the blimp!" Issler
~ This
"Wow... subscription based + micro transactions.. talk about greed."-á LOL!
Best Regards, Nak hak |
Largo LaGrande
R E D E M P T I O N Black Star Alliance
5
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:47:00 -
[452] - Quote
Miilla wrote:Largo LaGrande wrote:Kengutsi Akira wrote:eh Ive never talked to a GM in game and then was told to post anything on the forums lol if needed i can provide proof of answer from gm I can confirm that they do this from time to time on questions they don't want to answer... the best question is a DIRECT question... whether they answer it or not, you get your answer pretty quickly.. There is no future for Eve unless CCP can get subscriber numbers up... F2P it is. It IS coming... don't deny it to yourself.
Well there is a couple more things i would like to ask on the forums after they answered this one and i m sure CCP is not gonna be happy about it when i do..
but hey i tried it to do directly with em they refused and send me to the forums. |
Shu Jia
House of Nim-Lhach
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:49:00 -
[453] - Quote
walking in station is a must without jeopardize the real value of gameplay in eve. |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
100
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:52:00 -
[454] - Quote
Shu Jia wrote:walking in station is a must without jeopardize the real value of gameplay in eve.
REMAPS in the NEX store is a MUST!
Bloodline changes are a MUST!
Customised ships in NEX store is a MUST! |
Largo LaGrande
R E D E M P T I O N Black Star Alliance
5
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:52:00 -
[455] - Quote
Shu Jia wrote:walking in station is a must without jeopardize the real value of gameplay in eve.
Walking in stations was just implemented here so eve can test it as guinea pigs for dust and WOD to get all the kinks out
Btw Hillmars open letter is a bunch of bull just to dampen the rage ppl still have until the next expansion comes out
READ BETWEEN THE LINES
I know whats coming ...Do you? |
Jean Leaner
Kickass inc Controlled Chaos
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:58:00 -
[456] - Quote
Our subs are up! So we're firing 20% of our staff and refocusing the rest!
Riiiiiight. |
Taedrin
Kushan Industrial
116
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 23:59:00 -
[457] - Quote
DJ Xaphod wrote:
If CCP is genuinely in financial trouble and needs to majorly restructure its staff, including the community team, then I at least will understand, but that's definitely not what you're saying. If this is what you're having to do, we'd appreciate transparency and some sort of information about what the future holds for the communication between CCP and the EVE Online community.
I already mentioned this just a page ago, but this is probably pretty close to the truth. A sizable loan was due in October, which CCP's liquid assets couldn't cover (as of a few months ago when the financial statements were leaked, at least). As such CCP likely had to enter into some sort of agreement with their creditors and this downsizing is part of it.
Creditors don't want to see money Soon(tm), they want to see money Now(tm). As such, CCP has to cut costs to appease their creditors. While they are at it, they are pulling resources away from projects which won't bear fruit for the foreseeable future and reallocate them to their flagship product in the hopes of increasing revenues Now(tm) so that they can pay off that loan easier.
Likely, the community team was seen as being less critical towards bringing in revenue than developers, as such CCP fired them in the hopes of being able to focus more on content which will appease players. |
Trebor Daehdoow
Dirt Nap Squad Dirt Nap Squad.
1002
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 00:00:00 -
[458] - Quote
Kengutsi Akira wrote:Hey, where are the CSM in all this? I havent seen them post today We are all deeply concerned about this announcement and its consequences for CCP and EVE.
CSM - because I have not yet plumbed the depths of my inherent masochism! CSM 6 Activities Summary | My CSM blog |
Largo LaGrande
R E D E M P T I O N Black Star Alliance
5
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 00:03:00 -
[459] - Quote
Trebor Daehdoow wrote:Kengutsi Akira wrote:Hey, where are the CSM in all this? I havent seen them post today We are all deeply concerned about this announcement and its consequences for CCP and EVE.
Well thats great
how about you guys let us in on the issue i posted earlyer . i am sure it has been discussed (i pretty much know)
It would be a token of good faith to adress this in here so we can finally see that CCP turned legit with their players |
The Offerer
Republic University Minmatar Republic
26
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 00:04:00 -
[460] - Quote
I hope that CCP picked the right team to stay and save the rest of the company. After all, if those 80% prove to be passionate about the core EVE content that brought this game multiple Game of the Year awards, I will have no fear about the future of CCP (and wouldn't be surprised if they start mass hiring again).
Just remember - the Apocrypha was CCP's best expansion to this day. Analyse what exactly was done there, reinvent yourself with getting back to the roots of what makes this game and you will be looking at much more brighter future.
Good luck. |
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Miklas Laces
A.N.A.R.C.H.I.C.A
4
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 00:04:00 -
[461] - Quote
Trebor Daehdoow wrote:Kengutsi Akira wrote:Hey, where are the CSM in all this? I havent seen them post today We are all deeply concerned about this announcement and its consequences for CCP and EVE. ROTFL |
Root'er
NeoCorteX Industry Shadow of xXDEATHXx
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 00:16:00 -
[462] - Quote
we dont have enough resources so wer firin' people
right. makes as much sense as cancel subscription butan wont renew my 3 accs, thanks for yesterday's devblog it finally make me post on corpforums "i'm leaving" |
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
393
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 00:20:00 -
[463] - Quote
Root'er wrote:we dont have enough resources so wer firin' people
right. makes as much sense as cancel subscription butan wont renew my 3 accs, thanks for yesterday's devblog it finally make me post on corpforums "i'm leaving"
Oh. This **** again.
Who's going to start the 'I quit" threadnaught this time?
Mr Epeen If you can read this, you haven't blocked me yet. |
Reverand Pastor
Dynasty Ink.
6
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 00:37:00 -
[464] - Quote
I think you underestimate the level of disgust. I have unsubbed 2 accounts unfortunately i paid yesterday so i gotta wait 28 days. If i will be back i do not know. but this isnt about me so my apologies.
P.S: Seriously you can have my stuff :( |
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
393
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 00:39:00 -
[465] - Quote
Reverand Pastor wrote:I think you underestimate the level of disgust. I have unsubbed 2 accounts unfortunately i paid yesterday so i gotta wait 28 days. If i will be back i do not know. but this isnt about me so my apologies.
P.S: Seriously you can have my stuff :(
Thanks.
I'll log in now and wait for the contract to come up :)
Mr Epeen If you can read this, you haven't blocked me yet. |
Hakaru Ishiwara
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
29
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 00:40:00 -
[466] - Quote
We can hope that the remaining survivors have a passion for their work, their livelihood and the resulting product(s).
But we also need to pray that very little knowledge of existing code was completely lost with the departure of CCP personnel. That could be very bad for revising existing content -- the very thing that will help bring CCP back in good-stead with its subscribers.
I wonder if CCP's share owners and debt holders are looking at sale options for CCP assets while the company 'refocuses' itself.
p.s. ***** you forum post eating monster. I copy and pasted my post to get around the auto-delete feature. 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284286 |
Ben Derindar
Dirty Deeds Corp.
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 00:41:00 -
[467] - Quote
Plenty of sympathy for those being given the flick today, none whatsoever for those doing the flicking.
CCP, are we learning yet?
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Largo Coronet
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
15
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 00:45:00 -
[468] - Quote
So lemme get this straight:
You want to focus on EVE, and you fired most of the community team making it possible for you to get proper feedback to do so. Meanwhile, you continue to give a paycheck to useless mouthpiece and general tool CCP Zulu.
I repeat a question I've asked elsewhere about Zulu:
Does he swallow? |
Rancyin
Bi'Atch Inc Dark Solar Empire
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 00:54:00 -
[469] - Quote
Back on track once again. |
Lors Dornick
Kallisti Industries
14
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 00:56:00 -
[470] - Quote
Largo LaGrande wrote:Shu Jia wrote:walking in station is a must without jeopardize the real value of gameplay in eve. Walking in stations was just implemented here so eve can test it as guinea pigs for dust and WOD to get all the kinks out The Wis engine is the same as they intended to use for WoD (part of the Carbon project).
As we (and CCP) noted the WiS/Carbon/WoD engine is not ready for serious deployment and needs more time, or maybe even a complete recode, before it can be used for anything but gimmicks.
Dust on the other hand is intended to run on a different platform using an established engine, so no connection to WiS.
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Asayanami Dei
Adhocracy Incorporated Adhocracy
30
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 00:59:00 -
[471] - Quote
Lykouleon wrote:I can't say I see the logic in firing some of the core back-bone of the community development team, especially in a time when the community has reacted in a way where we've lost significant faith in CCP as a company.
In the long-run, this will probably be a good move for CCP financially. However, that's only if the community doesn't collapse at this point since too few people are talking directly with us.
The community development team does a lot more than just forum moderation and shiny posts and duly deserves the credit for their hard work promoting our overall EVE community to the outside world. Guard, Phantom, Navigator, Manifest, and Spitfire are going to have a lot of work on their hands now.
At this point, all I can do is wish the best to those that, unfortunately, will be leaving CCP and hope that they stay active in our community (if not the direct one, at least the extended one). Sympathies to the guys and gals at CCP who had to see their friends and co-workers receive this bad news.
Lets just hope this horrid turn of events wasn't a waste and something "passably" decent will come from it. +1
My youtube channel Video Thread |
Pr1ncess Alia
Perkone Caldari State
29
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 01:05:00 -
[472] - Quote
It's never good to hear people losing their jobs. But actions do have consequences.
One thing is for certain, if this was a traditionally run Japanese company I can tell you who's job would be the first to go. I guarantee you that man is in no risk of losing his.
Best of luck to those of you who are now job hunting.
I hope we all learned a valuable lesson from the last few months. That lesson being: the plebs aren't as dumb as you would like. We pay for a product with certain expectations and if those expectations aren't met we stop paying.
I like the direction you're going CCP, if this winter expansion meets my expectations I'll actually reactive my billing. |
David Grogan
The Motley Crew Reborn
79
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 01:20:00 -
[473] - Quote
maybe all the laid off people can band together and make a rival game to eve online Everytime you buy something that says "made in china" you are helping the rising unemployment in your own country unless your from china, Buy locally produced goods and help create more jobs. |
Pent'nor
Pent'nor Independent Gallente Partisan
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 01:22:00 -
[474] - Quote
I support this move. I love the future vision of dust/eve and want incarna to actually be finished. The only reason why I keep my subscription is because CCP has such a wonderful future vision and i'm willing to support them. There is so much that I expect incarna to be and the changes to the game play for coming expansions sound cool, but I also don't want it to take years to actually finish an expansion or even worse, only half way finish it. Focus on the eve universe and get these things done and done right. |
Jokerface666
Ever Flow Northern Coalition.
57
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 01:30:00 -
[475] - Quote
tbh i like the idea and i totally understand why this is happening, CCP was working on the cliff with money... now as the subs have droped... whooops ISK is missing....
As Hilmar has stated and i REALLY hope this has happend or will happen SOON, the management was changed for professionals, and not for people who are making the best jokes.
This is happening to a lot of companys where the income is raising constantly over the years, the feeling of unstopaple starts to grow, at some point the company starts to balance on the cliff of of profit to push stuff forward asap. when something goes bad, investors eject themselfe first, and then there is a huge financial gap which has to be closed. As employees are the biggest expense of a company, the final but sad result of such things is people getting fired.
tbth: 20 % is not that bad, i've seen companys reduce staff by 50 - 60 % to get back on the road.
i really feel sorry for all the good people liek fallout lossing theyr job, i do not know why people like fallout have lost they're job, and i am not going to judge, couse i do not know whats going on internaly. ------------------------------w00t w00t rapetrain------------------------------ |
Headerman
Quovis Shadow of xXDEATHXx
245
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 01:35:00 -
[476] - Quote
I just hope that CCP will continue to have World of Darkness as a goal. i think that game could be incredibly popular. Weather it is released sooner or later, i for one will be eagerly awaiting to play/pay it. [img]http://i53.tinypic.com/bebnf8.jpg[/img] |
Sylthi
Coreward Pan-Galactic Holy Empire of The Unshaven
4
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 01:36:00 -
[477] - Quote
So, the corporate dumbsizing has NOTHING at ALL to do with the major loan CCP has due in under 10 days that according to their own financials they CAN'T pay???? RIIIIIIGHT.........
Anyway, on a more somber note, to this announcement I say a gigantic: GOOD.
Maybe this will put the fear of the almighty CONSUMER in CCP's belly for ONCE. i.e. You don't give people what they want long enough, they eventually stop giving you their money. It really is THAT simple. Problem is, can you convince them to START giving you their money again? Something tells me that is going to be a harder sell.
My only regret and sympathy in all of this is that the guys in the trenches are the ones who are going to get the axe in the neck, not the fat cat's who's mistakes and arrogance is actually to blame for this mess. I mean, did the fat cat's ever think of taking a major PAY CUT rather than laying off dozens of the little guys? I mean, that could have spared at least a couple jobs, right? Nah. Didn't think THAT would have occurred to them. Or, how about making DEEP cuts in ADMINISTRATION rather than PRODUCTION staff? I mean Atlanta is primarily that, PRODUCTION, right?? Again, yeah, didn't think THAT would occur to them either.
I also love the "everything is fine" part of the announcement. I mean, this is such an oxymoron it's not even funny. After all, if "everything is fine" why are you laying off 1 in 5 workers?
I am starting to think CCP has a group pathological liar syndrome.... they can't help it.... they MUST lie to us or they feel their job isn't done. I wonder, is there a name for that? When a GROUP of people are pathological liars......?
Anyway, that's just my greatly devalued .02 isk.
Back to my hole.
Peace all.
|
Obsidian Hawk
RONA Corporation RONA Directorate
187
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 01:39:00 -
[478] - Quote
For all of those who are rage quitting. You are just making the situation worse. When money stops coming in, people are let go. By emo rage quitting more subs you are going to force them to make more cut backs and cut out more people we love.
Keep your subs going, get your friends into the game and bring life back to it. Once we get more people back into game, CCP can rehire many of the ones they let go.
BUT TO DO THIS they will need the support of the entire community, hell maybe even buy a plex and get something from the store. |
Jokerface666
Ever Flow Northern Coalition.
57
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 01:48:00 -
[479] - Quote
Obsidian Hawk wrote:For all of those who are rage quitting. You are just making the situation worse. When money stops coming in, people are let go. By emo rage quitting more subs you are going to force them to make more cut backs and cut out more people we love.
Keep your subs going, get your friends into the game and bring life back to it. Once we get more people back into game, CCP can rehire many of the ones they let go.
BUT TO DO THIS they will need the support of the entire community, hell maybe even buy a plex and get something from the store.
ehm no... even if 1 plex would save one job, i am not going to use this ****, that startet all this. sounds harsh, but thats life. good people will find jobs pretty easy, bad people won't and it's good eve got rid of them.. sounds harsh too, yeah but thats life. ------------------------------w00t w00t rapetrain------------------------------ |
Dawn Harbinger
Corp 54 Curatores Veritatis Alliance
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 01:52:00 -
[480] - Quote
Best wishes to those who are moving on, thanks for your hard work in helping to develop something we all love and enjoy.
Fly safe.
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Mike Azariah
Gallente Benevolence Association
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 02:01:00 -
[481] - Quote
I never like to see people lose their jobs and the tweets are beginning to show that not all of them are WoD.
To those who are going and have helped make the game the addictive thing it is, to those who are staying and wondering if this is the cuts or just the first wave . . .
thank you
m |
Princess Kaalar
Intergalactic Combined Technologies
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 02:26:00 -
[482] - Quote
To CCP, I extend my wishes to all of you who were laid off during one of the most difficult times in the world's history. With many countries suffering economic problems even here in the US, time will get better in the future. Godspeed to those we really loved and respected, even when we didn't agree on some things.
As far as refocusing on Eve is concerned I will wait till the winter release before I return to see what happens. I been following the forums recently and quite shocked at whats been going on, all I can say is best of luck to all for the future of Eve and CCP. |
John'eh
Asteroid Belt Protection Services
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 02:35:00 -
[483] - Quote
I'm reading this and laughing so hard my gf rushed into the room asking whats going on, because I said the exact same thing to CCP Sr leadership and warned them this would happen, to the peoples faces at the Atlanta office, about a year or so ago when I was brought in by very sr. people at CCP for some very frank and brutal discussions.
Why I was there is not important.... but now they are admitting publicly that I was right, that they were wrong, that they should have listened to me. Imagine what CCP would be like today if they had agreed to my terms so I would have let them hire me?
Maybe with this wake-up call, CCP leadership can be a little less out of touch. They still cant afford me tho.
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Andrea Griffin
41
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 02:39:00 -
[484] - Quote
I don't understand how firing people will make things better. Doesn't that mean less resources available for the important things? The art people from WoD could do art for Eve, any software guys could start working with the Carbon technology in a production environment, the sound guys could do some cool stuff, etc., etc. Really a shame to see anyone at all lose their jobs. Was the monetary blow from lost subs that severe? It's not you guys who need to repair what has been broken, it's us. CCP Wrangler |
John'eh
Asteroid Belt Protection Services
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 02:45:00 -
[485] - Quote
Andrea Griffin wrote:I don't understand how firing people will make things better. Doesn't that mean less resources available for the important things? The art people from WoD could do art for Eve, any software guys could start working with the Carbon technology in a production environment, the sound guys could do some cool stuff, etc., etc. Really a shame to see anyone at all lose their jobs. Was the monetary blow from lost subs that severe?
It means more money to work on things they they need to get done. Less employees means less expenses in the long term, and that's important because their budget and balance sheet looks like crap and they have some big debts they are trying to restructure. |
wicked cheese
Imperial Research Inovations
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 02:48:00 -
[486] - Quote
John'eh wrote:Why I was there is not important.... but now they are admitting publicly that I was right, that they were wrong, that they should have listened to me. Imagine what CCP would be like today if they had agreed to my terms so I would have let them hire me?
so you tried to join a company that you predicted was going to end up laying you off soon? and have the audacity to claim you were worth to much money? bravo |
Reiisha
Veto. Veto Corp
5
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 02:57:00 -
[487] - Quote
Firing the wrong people.
Nuff said. |
John'eh
Asteroid Belt Protection Services
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 02:57:00 -
[488] - Quote
wicked cheese wrote: so you tried to join a company that you predicted was going to end up laying you off soon? and have the audacity to claim you were worth to much money? bravo
Not at all. I was worth more., clearly, because I was right.
EDIT: And worth even more because I actually said something long enough in advance that they would have been able to do something about it.
EDIT: Just think.. all these people could have kept their jobs if somebody had listened to me at CCP. |
Jokerface666
Ever Flow Northern Coalition.
60
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 03:08:00 -
[489] - Quote
John'eh wrote:wicked cheese wrote: so you tried to join a company that you predicted was going to end up laying you off soon? and have the audacity to claim you were worth to much money? bravo
Not at all. I was worth more., clearly, because I was right. EDIT: And worth even more because I actually said something long enough in advance that they would have been able to do something about it. EDIT: Just think.. all these people could have kept their jobs if somebody had listened to me at CCP.
dude your so awesome you will save the world one day! ------------------------------w00t w00t rapetrain------------------------------ |
Mehrdad Kor-Azor
Iure Divino
68
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 03:32:00 -
[490] - Quote
Jokerface666 wrote:John'eh wrote:wicked cheese wrote: so you tried to join a company that you predicted was going to end up laying you off soon? and have the audacity to claim you were worth to much money? bravo
Not at all. I was worth more., clearly, because I was right. EDIT: And worth even more because I actually said something long enough in advance that they would have been able to do something about it. EDIT: Just think.. all these people could have kept their jobs if somebody had listened to me at CCP. dude your so awesome you will save the world one day!
But only if people listen.
|
|
Gevlin
SMANews.net SpaceMonkey's Alliance
11
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 03:44:00 -
[491] - Quote
well this shows the re focusing Blogs previously mention are not a simple media play
|
Nehmen Geld
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 03:50:00 -
[492] - Quote
IceGuerilla wrote:Thank you, Jita protests. I'm glad that firing torpedoes at a statue got some real people with real livelihoods fired...
IMO, the statue protests were an effect, not a cause. The cause was, fundamentally, the lack of continuity when docking (i.e. dropping the "I'm docked in my ship" view), and poor communication regarding pay to win (Fearless etc.).
Still a little way to go in my opinion. I'm currently sat in my Slicer while docked in Empire and I can't for the life of me find the way out of my ship and into my quarters. It seems that in order to leave my ship I have to escape this reality, enable an alternative timeline, undock and then redock. Way better than before but still lacking integrity. Perhaps a simple fix would be to provide two docking options "Dock to loading bay", and "dock to accommodation". Or something like that. |
Miss AnnThrope
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 03:58:00 -
[493] - Quote
Tried posting but the message body keeps disappearing, seriously?
Don't fire them, re-assign them! I've worked for companies like yours and been on the receiving end of this kinda nonsense, corporate greed!
Well congrats, your greed and stupidy just cost 200 people their jobs.
Fire Hilmar for being such an incompetent CEO!!! |
Pr1ncess Alia
Perkone Caldari State
29
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 04:01:00 -
[494] - Quote
Miss AnnThrope wrote:Tried posting but the message body keeps disappearing, seriously?
Don't fire them, re-assign them! I've worked for companies like yours and been on the receiving end of this kinda nonsense, corporate greed!
Well congrats, your greed and stupidy just cost 200 people their jobs.
Fire Hilmar for being such an incompetent CEO!!!
John Tuberfields for ceo
or however you spell that crazy name |
John'eh
Asteroid Belt Protection Services
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 04:08:00 -
[495] - Quote
Pr1ncess Alia wrote:John Tuberfields for ceo or however you spell that crazy name
He probably was one of the ones who got fired.
John'eh for CEO?
|
Apollo Gabriel
Mercatoris Etherium Cartel
70
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 04:11:00 -
[496] - Quote
CCP Manifest wrote:Today it was my solemn duty to post an announcement from CCP. You can read that announcement here. Please keep your discussion of the announcement to this thread if possible, and understand that this and the days in the future are going to be very difficult for those at CCP. We stand behind our decisions and trust that it will ultimately bring you, the EVE community, a better game.
Goodbye Manifest |
Obsidian Hawk
RONA Corporation RONA Directorate
188
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 04:25:00 -
[497] - Quote
Jokerface666 wrote:Obsidian Hawk wrote:For all of those who are rage quitting. You are just making the situation worse. When money stops coming in, people are let go. By emo rage quitting more subs you are going to force them to make more cut backs and cut out more people we love.
Keep your subs going, get your friends into the game and bring life back to it. Once we get more people back into game, CCP can rehire many of the ones they let go.
BUT TO DO THIS they will need the support of the entire community, hell maybe even buy a plex and get something from the store. ehm no... even if 1 plex would save one job, i am not going to use this ****, that startet all this. sounds harsh, but thats life. good people will find jobs pretty easy, bad people won't and it's good eve got rid of them.. sounds harsh too, yeah but thats life.
I know a lot of good people without jobs.
|
Helena Russell Makanen
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
8
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 04:36:00 -
[498] - Quote
Mr Epeen wrote:Root'er wrote:we dont have enough resources so wer firin' people
right. makes as much sense as cancel subscription butan wont renew my 3 accs, thanks for yesterday's devblog it finally make me post on corpforums "i'm leaving" Oh. This **** again. Who's going to start the 'I quit" threadnaught this time? Mr Epeen
There are several already you one-dimensional dunce.
|
Astrid Stjerna
Teraa Matar
28
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 04:52:00 -
[499] - Quote
John'eh wrote:wicked cheese wrote: so you tried to join a company that you predicted was going to end up laying you off soon? and have the audacity to claim you were worth to much money? bravo
Not at all. I was worth more., clearly, because I was right. EDIT: And worth even more because I actually said something long enough in advance that they would have been able to do something about it. EDIT: Just think.. all these people could have kept their jobs if somebody had listened to me at CCP.
How....
what's the word....?
Arrogant? |
Written Word
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
50
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 05:17:00 -
[500] - Quote
How are you going to communicate better now that you've fired your community team?
|
|
Mike 793450
Milenk0 Corp
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 05:21:00 -
[501] - Quote
Farewell CCP
It's been an interesting time but this is where we part ways. I subscribed to EVE Online when I heard you were developing an MMO for WoD, both to play in your sandbox and support VtM. What I've seen, I've enjoyed. Even monoclegate. If losing subscribers is the only thing you will listen to, I am closing my accounts.
Sincerely, Mulengro Regent - Lloydminster Chantry House & Clan Tremere
P.S. - See you "soon" - when work on WoD is complete |
Sofia Bellard
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
68
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 05:27:00 -
[502] - Quote
At least the lay offs were mostly isolated to the Americans. Let us be honest; when it comes to lazy and ungrateful about their jobs, no one else comes close to the Americans.
Poor sad little pirates, -áwhy you so mad? |
Tobias Sjodin
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
38
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 05:27:00 -
[503] - Quote
Grath Telkin wrote:Hoping this means more expansions that felt like Apocrypha felt.
You guys should take note, as that was literally the best content you have ever added to this game, and we miss you doing things like that.
Sorry to the guys in the US that lost their jobs, I know it'll be hardest for those to find new work.
This, tbqfh.
You set a standard with that, that has since been unsurpassed, which (in my opinion) is something to always strive for. |
Tobias Sjodin
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
38
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 05:31:00 -
[504] - Quote
John'eh wrote:wicked cheese wrote: so you tried to join a company that you predicted was going to end up laying you off soon? and have the audacity to claim you were worth to much money? bravo
Not at all. I was worth more., clearly, because I was right. EDIT: And worth even more because I actually said something long enough in advance that they would have been able to do something about it. EDIT: Just think.. all these people could have kept their jobs if somebody had listened to me at CCP.
Just what CCP needed, another self-obsessed know-it-all. |
Brooks Puuntai
Nomadic Asylum KUGUTSUMEN.
193
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 05:32:00 -
[505] - Quote
Sofia Bellard wrote:At least the lay offs were mostly isolated to the Americans. Let us be honest; when it comes to lazy and ungrateful about their jobs, no one else comes close to the Americans.
Not everyone who worked at the Atlanta office where American. You know CCP being a global company and all, they do relocate staff.
|
Reverand Pastor
Dynasty Ink.
7
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 05:38:00 -
[506] - Quote
Sofia Bellard wrote:At least the lay offs were mostly isolated to the Americans. Let us be honest; when it comes to lazy and ungrateful about their jobs, no one else comes close to the Americans.
Really bad troll. I feel solidarity with my fellow man as tough times are mounting in all corners of the globe. US or Italy it is a shame when arogance on a pandemic level is allowed to go unchecked like it is in todays climate. |
Tobias Sjodin
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
38
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 05:39:00 -
[507] - Quote
Could you not have at least waited with laying people off AFTER the holidays? |
draconothese
Independant Celestial Enterprises Pink Fluffy Pussycats
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 05:44:00 -
[508] - Quote
its sad they had to let people go but its good they are getting there prioritys straight and focusing on there core games and not wasting resources that they may need in the future |
Dbars Grinding
Garoun Investment Bank Gallente Federation
6
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 05:46:00 -
[509] - Quote
Tobias Sjodin wrote:Could you not have at least waited with laying people off AFTER the holidays?
I can see it now, kids ask their parents why didn't santa bring them any gifts and why it is so cold and their house. |
draconothese
Independant Celestial Enterprises Pink Fluffy Pussycats
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 05:49:00 -
[510] - Quote
they said they were going to try and help them get placed in another job so thats a nice thing not just shoving them out the door |
|
Obsidian Hawk
RONA Corporation RONA Directorate
189
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 05:53:00 -
[511] - Quote
CCP has a lot of good people, and they need to sit up and say, these lay offs are temporary. We are going to rebuild eve, get it back to 50k online all the time and hire back everyone we had to let go!
Like many of the staff in my corp / alliance we are family, we hate to see each other leave and we work hard to get them back. |
McSnarf
EVE University Ivy League
4
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 05:56:00 -
[512] - Quote
First of all, sympathies for those who lost their jobs. You KNOW it wasn't your fault.
Shame on CCP management. Laying off 20% is something you do when you seriously, seriously ****** up. I would not go on the street without a paper bag over my head for a year if I had to take this decision. A saying here goes: "The fish starts stinking from the head."
Will one of the top five people in CCP go as well? Or are you just cutting costs quick and dirty, while still working on projects of dubious value?
Tell you what. You cut costs, I cut costs. Time to consolidate alts!
Disclaimer: I in no way represent or speak for EVE University or Ivy League. I use this character as a way to post on this forum. |
Pj Harvey
Ship spinners inc
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 06:05:00 -
[513] - Quote
I've browsed the forums for years and never seen much from any of these 'community representatives' except for dumb smiley face spam from CCP fallout and the bungled handling of most crisis that CCP has had in the last few years from the rest of them so it seems like a good business to me, as heartless as that might sound. |
Mahadiva
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 06:06:00 -
[514] - Quote
Not a surprising move really. Even before the recent monoclegate disaster and the resulting consequences it was highly suspect that CCP could continue to expand and work on three projects simultaneously while garnering revenue from only one. Was EVE really that profitable to justify the delusions of grandeur?
In that light, it would be more interesting to know how what constitutes a subscription in EVE anymore, seeing as these days you can play without spending any RL money. Do you just count any active account? Is a trial account that bought a PLEX with ISK already a subscription? Saying that "subs are up" is quite useless and potentially misleading imo. |
John Frohike
Militant Mermen LEGIO ASTARTES ARCANUM
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 06:06:00 -
[515] - Quote
Sorry to hear that some people are getting the boot. Here's to hoping they land on their feet. |
knobber Jobbler
Holding Inc.
5
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 06:10:00 -
[516] - Quote
Not sure how letting go community team members helps. If there ever was a problem with ccp communication it was with the official messages the community team got to pass from higher management. It's almost like you're looking for a fall guy.
It's the senior producers, CTO and business strategists that need to be got rid off. They're the ones who hindered community management. All you've done ccp is get rid of the fire fighters, the people the players respect. Poor move but then we've come to expect that from you. |
Dalton Vanadis
Miranda United F0RCEFUL ENTRY
410
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 06:19:00 -
[517] - Quote
Look, I know a lot of hard decisions have to be made for the betterment of the company.
But I really must protest to laying off Fallout. She has done more for the community than any software patch from the coding teams could hope to accomplish. This fine lady has been both friend and colleague to many. She has bridged the gap between player and dev on many levels.
She has been on the front lines calming players, and distilling our message into a comprehensible format for CCP since I started playing this game and before.
For me, Fallout has been an integral part of the EVE experience, she has represented the community of players and devs, she has been the face and voice of a company in many ways. I strongly urge you to reconsider your decision about her employment.
It would seem she has done far more for EVE online, CCP, and players than you give her credit for and I believe it would hurt your efforts in focusing on EVE to fire her than the meager gain you would make by removing her salary from the payroll. So again, I urge you to keep this amazing dev on staff to continue the vital job she has held for years that will aid you in your quest to focus on EVE.
|
bilingi
Ghosts of the Storm
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 06:23:00 -
[518] - Quote
Fallout was also a pain in the ...... I remeber the statement everyone in NPC corps is an RMTer ... then tried damage conrol for 4 days before hiding it all as much as possiable. |
Naran Eto
Kut-n-Run
24
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 07:01:00 -
[519] - Quote
Regardless of whether people liked them or not the comunity teams are some of the most important teams in any MMO, "we'll communicate more blah blah blah" says the Hil, yet here he goes and decimates the comunity relations team, well i say Hil is fiull of bullshit and has no intention of comunicating, he's shown this by reducing the comunity team, you know.. the GUYS WHO TALK TO US.
I say we start another Jita protest until they reverse the decision and sack that stupid janitor who that keeps tripping over the network cables instead! |
Pyrasol
Universal Explorations
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 07:03:00 -
[520] - Quote
First of all my sincere regret to thoughts who have received the brunt of this so called GÇ£Re focusingGÇ¥ I wish you all the best of luck in the coming months and hope you will find success in your endeavours. But its times like these when you are forced to adapt and through that process you find potentials in yourself you would never have uncovered.
To CCP After seeing the financials and following the comments a few months ago I knew this would happen if CCP became cash strapped due to the cash burden they face this month. I would assume they reduced salaries and froze increases this year as well.
I do believe CCP had hoped to BS their way through everything to retain subscriptions but GÇ£Pride comes before a fallGÇ¥. The letter which HELMAR addressed raving about the success of the NEX expansion is a harsh contrast to what we see in this thread. It really showed how out of touch his management was with EVE. In corporate environments the people who make these mistakes get the boot. But CCP is still to a fair degree owner driven.
I feel that allot of what has been said in this blog has its roots in the financial mismanagement that ccp has been subject to in this past two years.
And that it has nothing to do with refocusing on EVE, that is just the GÇ£PR SPINGÇ¥ put on all this to in some way draw additional compassion from the community and repair there public image. However the result is this exercise has lead to more attention being placed on their primary source of income which is EVE-Online and this is a good thing for us as players GÇ£FOR NOWGÇ¥.
But itGÇÖs very hard for a Leopard to change its stripes!
So to all thoughs who support Hilmar in Upper management, have a backbone because as we can see here. Swimming against the current is not a bad thing because inevitably there is a rapid or waterfall further down stream that will hurt you. You may not always win against the current but it will buy you some time to come up with a solution... or die trying! |
|
Celery Man
Talocan Mining And Industrial Talocan United
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 07:08:00 -
[521] - Quote
Ah cool so this is the appropriate place to post this
Himlar quit you deuche. You screwed some of your best people out of a job.
Nice work *******
I'd use better arguments but others already have, and to be honest you dont deserve them. |
Naran Eto
Kut-n-Run
24
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 07:11:00 -
[522] - Quote
Celery Man wrote:Ah cool so this is the appropriate place to post this
Himlar quit you deuche. You screwed some of your best people out of a job.
Nice work *******
I'd use better arguments but others already have, and to be honest you dont deserve them.
THIS ^ |
Ralinastrife
Wormhole Exploration Crew Transmission Lost
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 07:14:00 -
[523] - Quote
really i think developers are bored with eve and wanna do something more exciting...thats why they have other projects....but then the angry trolls of eve outraged and threaten to quit...ccp laughed and said yeah right what game u gonna play?? people quit...they like ohh no we dont have enough money to pay people and fund our new game...we were depending on people to play for a little while longer to cover all the other cost of development and to pay for our drugs and whores...what can we do???? then they say ohh i got it
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wz7zo1BvvA4
so after that they say...we have a winter expansion...its gonna be so cool...stick around and see...and now we wait.. |
The Illuminist
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 07:16:00 -
[524] - Quote
CCP:
This is a huge decision to make. While I've not always been a supporter of your recent decisions, I think that you've made the correct choice in how to proceed. This community is fractured, and I think you're finally willing to acknowledge that and work toward a common goal. My heart goes out to those who will suffer in the layoffs. However, from the tone of this blog post, it's clear you as a company are now clear headed in your objectives. I look forward to a bright future for Eve! |
Sorran Tor
The Graduates Morsus Mihi
5
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 07:23:00 -
[525] - Quote
So wait...
CCP, you announce that you're changing direction and starting to actually listen to what the community is saying to you.
Then within a week you fire your team of Community Managers.
The ****.
Hilmar, did you forget that we're watching what you do, not what you say? |
Constantinee
Nex Exercitus Raiden.
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 07:26:00 -
[526] - Quote
CCp has failed on so many levels this year, and they continue.
Some good people are no longer there due to several issues with the company and its notorious CEO, Hilmar should not be in control of such a company tbqh. There were better devs (now elsewhere) who could have done a better job instead of him.
Bring back Kieron,Abathur, id say tomb and oveur (even though they never read the forums anymore and hit us with smart ass comments) Fire hilmar Abandon dust 514 focus on eve. dust will fail, im sorry but it will, you struggle with keeping a spaceship MMO game alive because the horrid content that was last introduced and the greed of a lackluster ceo and lack of care for the player base, what in your right minds makes you believe you can do a better job with a FPS and compete with games like CoD, Battlefield, and the new Halos planning to come out, let alone making it a PS3 only console shooter ( no ones going to buy a ps3 just for dust). You need to focus on your primary money maker and its community before branching the hell off.
TLDR
Bring back old devs who made game fun Fire Hilmar Abandon Dust
Thats all for me.
I wish those no longer with CCP the best and beg you not to go to wow! Constantinee video archive. http://www.youtube.com/user/Constvids?feature=mhee
|
The Apostle
The Black Priests
592
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 07:28:00 -
[527] - Quote
John'eh wrote:I'm reading this and laughing so hard my gf rushed into the room asking whats going on, because I said the exact same thing to CCP Sr leadership and warned them this would happen, to the peoples faces at the Atlanta office, about a year or so ago when I was brought in by very sr. people at CCP.
Why I was there is not important.... but now they are admitting publicly that I was right, that they were wrong, that they should have listened to me. Imagine what CCP would be like today if they had?
Maybe with this wake-up call, CCP leadership can be a little less out of touch.
Just think of this Helmar, your people knew this would happen, because I told them it would happen about a year ago, and I was ignored. All this pain, all that soul searching, and the fact that you just had to look bad in public, was because of these people and you who didn't listen. You could have saved yourself some trouble if you had listened to the people who had cared about eve enough to be honest with you in the first place, but you didn't. Now you lost a lot of subscribers, you have massive debts and the balance sheet looks terrible.
I was right. You were wrong.. and at least your admitting it now. So what else are you going to do? Could only think on this line dude sorry.....
"when I was brought in by very sr. people at CCP.... Why I was there is not important...."
Plumber? Electrician?
Said it before and I'll say it again. Why are all those with the best business acumen working for an employer? Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest. WTB: An Austrian kangaroo!
|
SirWOLFE
Versatech Co. Raiden.
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 07:31:00 -
[528] - Quote
It is a great shame to see people lose there jobs in any climite let alone this one.
But CCP has made some bad decisions this year that has effected greatly the player base and now the company itself. I for one earlier this year had 5 accounts. Now i am on 4 and planning to sell another toon on the forums soon to cut down to 3 accounts.
I used to be on all the time people used to text if i was not online (sad really) but that was till the middle of this year when i have seen friends cancel there subscriptions and not play anymore i will always play eve where there is an EVE i enjoy the game the community but CCP forgot that it is us that make them. Yes it nice to have projects but never forget your core.
The release of the winter expansion has got me excited some of the changes are good some not so good.
Im even looking forward to the super changes if it actuallys stops people of crying about them and actually comming to a fight. This could be ccp's last change to really save the game that has slowly deteriated since the launch of dominion with the final deteration with the walking in a room and aur thingy.
But good luck and please save this game... |
Florestan Bronstein
The Waterworks
117
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 07:33:00 -
[529] - Quote
Anyone who thinks the main function of a community team is to communicate with the players is an idiot.
The main function of a community team is to provide management with actionable information on the state of the community, forecasts about the development of trends within the community, ...
They are the only ones that can provide an educated answer to questions such as "Will these protests go away or will people really leave the game?" or "Will a statement of Zulu or Hilmar help to calm people down or will it just make the protests look like a bigger thing than they really are?"
By the time the accounting department reports a loss of subs the damage is already done. |
The Apostle
The Black Priests
592
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 07:35:00 -
[530] - Quote
A long time ago, I worked on a cattle station as a 17 year old jackeroo. My overseer didn't know his job, my manager didn't know his job and the owner was bloody hopeless.
At 20 I became the overseer. My jackeroos thought they could do my job better than me and I still believed I could do the job better than my manager and my owner.
At 24 I became the manager. My jackeroos and overseer still thought they could do my job. My boss was still an idiot.
I saved and saved and by the time I was 46 I owned the whole damned cattle station. Times were good. We employed men, their families and prospered.
Then we had a big drought, times got hard and I knew I had to let go some staff but couldn't. Well, you know, they had kids and you know, a mortgage down in the city.
The drought continued. I perservered. I used all my savings. I sold my cattle. I sold my house. I did everything I could.
One day the bank called and took it all away. My place got sold at 1/10 the value to some conservation group and they turned the whole bloody joint into a National Park.
Only thing left there now are emus and bloody kangaroos!
Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest. WTB: An Austrian kangaroo!
|
|
dreamsequencer
Freelancer Union Unaffiliated
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 08:02:00 -
[531] - Quote
Part of being a leader is making the tough decisions. All the best to the future of CCP and it's staff, present and past. |
Theodoric Darkwind
PonyWaffe Test Alliance Please Ignore
34
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 08:13:00 -
[532] - Quote
Ok so directing more resources to EVE development = good thing.
Firing your community team (e.g. CCP Fallout) = bad thing
Thought the entire point of the winter expansion was the fix many of the recent mistakes, firing the very people who did your damage control during the Incarna/Monaclegate debacle is a pretty ****** move. |
DragonHelm III
Order of Lost Malice
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 08:31:00 -
[533] - Quote
My deepest sympaties to those losing their jobs.
CCP in financial difficulties or just needing to cut back. God it's not like there the only ones, isn't everyone at the moment.
If you need a real cash injection into the company, short of a stock market floatation, a simple small but regular flow could be achieved by this
Once a character is transferred to a new account allow a one-off name change for say 20(Euros) NOT ISK Euros
A simple and asked for feature that will provide you with some much needed REAL income.
And has the added benefit of not affecting the ingame economy at all. |
Pak Narhoo
Knights of Kador
26
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 08:54:00 -
[534] - Quote
Myxx wrote:Confirmed list of 20%ers:
Community: Wrangler/ Christian Danhill Pann/ Valerie Massey Fallout/ Misty Matonis Zymurgist/ Kevin Dudenbostel Mike Read
Content: Pall Ivarsson Hilmir +P+Šr Einarsson CCP Maiden Steel Gnauton/ Gauti Fridriksson
Other: Valar/ Emil Fridrikson Finnz/ Finnur K+íri Gu+Šnason Hammerhead/ Noah Ward Kristleifur +Porsteinsson
Unconfirmed: Dropbear
Edit: WTF CCP!!!!!
Good god. And all this could have so easily been avoided.
So why is the guy responsible for this not axed too?
My condolences too all involved. Sad to see that you have to pay with your job for the bad management decisions higher up the chain. You didn't deserve this. Hate to see you go. :3
All the best luck to you and your loved ones.
-- Pak
|
Galies
JJ Express
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 08:56:00 -
[535] - Quote
Great job CCP... no, really... I've been playing since early '08, and Eve has been the most fascinating and frustrating game i have ever played. It is the most immersive, wonderful place to spend my time. I've also kept my mouth shut through exttremely long (i.e. 2day) downtimes (fortunatley a thing of the past) massively buggy updates, and installs, and largely worthless content. My first issue is with the QA, the most recent patch introduced a major, some say game breaking, bug where certain windows resized and moved every time a pilot undocked. The QA team responded on the forums that they had seen this problem, but they couldnt get it to reproduce so they didnt do anything about it. Well over 100 pilots reported this bug within the first few hours after the patch was released... This isnt even the worst bug that has managed to work it's way onto Tranquility, only one of the most recent. My second issue is content, first faction warfare, which seems to be defunct. As i understand it FW was released against the wishes of CCP Lead Game Designer Noah Ward. Then you introduced PI and Incursions, both of which fell like "things to do". Since early '08 the only "real" new ships you have introduced are the orca and the strategic cruisers, which seems odd considering Eve was always supposed to be about FLYING SHIPS. CQ... I dont even want to beat the dead horse on that debacle. I will say good job on all the hard work on the turrets and turret effects, though i wish you could have given missile launchers the same kind of love. My final issue is CCP's continuing stance concerning certain "events" being organized by corps/alliances that target one playstyle group for systematic destruction. Please CCP, either violate the sanbox, and step in to stop these so called "events", or retain the sandbox, and give us a better ship to handle these "events". If any CSM, GM, DEV, would like clarification as to what im talking about, feel freel to convo me or send me an eve mail. My final 2 cents and i'll shut up, I empathize for the hardworking good people that have recently lost their jobs, but i refuse to feel guilty. I was not a part of the Jita protest, nor was I attepting to roast people in the forums for mistakes that were made, I have quietly waited/prayed for the best. Hilmar, i know this will probably never reach your ears, but i have to say it anyway, I understand the neep to downsize a company occasionally, to make it grow in the future, but please also realize that some of the people that were recently terminated were respected and even loved by many many people. You have apologized for the recent lack of focus and communication,and i know that ours, the customers, and yours, the CEO's, visions of what Eve should be will always have differences. Its time to show us you meant it, please, Hilmar, restore our faith in Eve, assure us that the dark skies will be ours to fly for years to come.
In best hopes
|
Lukas Rox
Torchwood Archive
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 08:58:00 -
[536] - Quote
My deepest sympathies for all those who lost their job.
Good luck to all CCP employees, both present and past. I keep my fingers crossed for all of you.
Dear Mr Hilmar, I'm sorry that you had to make such a decision. Running a corporation the size of CCP is a very big responsibility and might be a huge burden sometimes. Unfortunately this is how corporations work: companies HAVE TO react quickly or they end up bankrupt. |
MissingNo1
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 09:02:00 -
[537] - Quote
It has been said many times before, DUST 514 and Twilight Online will flop shortly after launch.
Look at the current games market for:
- MMOs - FPS console games
MMOs
They require light, easy and fluent engines to run on as engaging in combat or an action using Carbon, or what ever CQ is currently, will be the worst playing experience of any game anyone has ever played. The engine will not support any being able to engage in a fast paced, or even a 'medium' paced combat or action 'move' as they will just end up frying components of their computer. Besides the coding/software behind the game, the content will suck. YES, everyone loves vampires, YES Underworld had huge success with their releases but that's because THERE WAS A FILM IT FOLLOWED which was a huge success, solely because Kate Beckinsale was a star actor. Linky [url]http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0320691/[/url]
FPS Console Market
3 words ...................... Call Of Duty, another word ................. Battlefield.
These Games are so fast to be designed, coded, published, brought, played, completed that people just couldn't CARE about if the game has been in production for years, if the game is involved in an MMO that has space with l4z0rz. The CONSOLE market is far too fast paced to release a game that requires alot attention from someone who has just brought Battlefield 4 or 5 lol.
Call Of Duty has a release EVERY YEAR, this means, the involvement that CCP desires out of players will not be obtained because, the DUST player will; buy the game, play it, get bored, Activision will release Call Of Duty 40392 and they will be sidetracked and leave the world of DUST.
TL:DR
Both developments WILL FAIL, no 2 ways about it. Putting them off and eventually deleting them will be the best move an MMO company could possibly do. |
Attila Hellsfury
Pangalactic Punks n' Playboys HUN Reloaded
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 09:15:00 -
[538] - Quote
"This is the end Beautiful friend This is the end My only friend, the end "
So , CCP management made again a planning mistake and so the employ's must pay for it.
"Can you picture what will be So limitless and free Desperately in need...of some...stranger's hand In a...desperate land "
Maybe some Asian investor will buy CCP ( and will make all CCP games in present or in futer to pay to win game) I HOPE THIS WILL NOT HAPPEN.
(song text from Doors) |
Shamefuldirty
MaxxxCorp
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 09:24:00 -
[539] - Quote
I'm sorry but the idea that a CCP will concentrate on dust 514 and exclude WoD MMO sounds so strange. CCP have experience with MMO's and a lot of people have played WoD. As many people have said before, Dust is a PS3 only game! It's going to go down the pan within months! Console gamers don't do the long term thing. They simply don't. You should of made it pc only if anything. YOUR GOING TO BANKRUPT YOURSELVES CCP! DO YOU HEAR ME? Seriously, it's the worst business decision on the face of the planet. |
Florestan Bronstein
The Waterworks
118
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 09:30:00 -
[540] - Quote
Shamefuldirty wrote:I'm sorry but the idea that a CCP will concentrate on dust 514 and exclude WoD MMO sounds so strange. CCP have experience with MMO's and a lot of people have played WoD. As many people have said before, Dust is a PS3 only game! It's going to go down the pan within months! Console gamers don't do the long term thing. They simply don't. You should of made it pc only if anything. YOUR GOING TO BANKRUPT YOURSELVES CCP! DO YOU HEAR ME? Seriously, it's the worst business decision on the face of the planet. DUST is probably way past the point of no return. WoD is still in preproduction.
Why would you scrap a game that is almost ready to go into beta-testing in favor of a game that only exists on whiteboards?
DUST would have to fail spectacularly to bring in less than the remaining 6-8 months of development are going to cost.
If you want to kill off DUST you probably have to set your time machine to 2008/2009. |
|
Ender Sai
Foetus Mart
4
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 09:59:00 -
[541] - Quote
I'm really sad to hear that it had to come to this. My thoughts and sympathies go out to those who have lost their jobs.
On the bright side, you'll probably be able to get another job soon due to your experience at CCP. :)
Also, waiting for CSM response. :P |
Riflin' Betty
Perfunctory
23
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 10:00:00 -
[542] - Quote
Florestan Bronstein wrote:Shamefuldirty wrote:I'm sorry but the idea that a CCP will concentrate on dust 514 and exclude WoD MMO sounds so strange. CCP have experience with MMO's and a lot of people have played WoD. As many people have said before, Dust is a PS3 only game! It's going to go down the pan within months! Console gamers don't do the long term thing. They simply don't. You should of made it pc only if anything. YOUR GOING TO BANKRUPT YOURSELVES CCP! DO YOU HEAR ME? Seriously, it's the worst business decision on the face of the planet. DUST is probably way past the point of no return. WoD is still in preproduction. Why would you scrap a game that is almost ready to go into beta-testing in favor of a game that only exists on whiteboards? DUST would have to fail spectacularly to bring in less than the remaining 6-8 months of development are going to cost. If you want to kill off DUST you probably have to set your time machine to 2008/2009.
They can't kill off DUST because SONY is picking up the bill for it's development, hence the PS3 exclusive. Unfortunately this leaves CCP under contractual obligations and deadlines that carry sanctions if/when they are not met.
Basically, SONY owns CCP.
|
Misanth
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE Limitless Inc.
173
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 10:34:00 -
[543] - Quote
Not very surprising at all, was a necessary decision from a business point of view.
Now let's hope CCP learned something from this, and let's hope the focus on FiS actually start to show ingame too. It'll take alot of efforts from CCP to win back trust, especially after lying to their customerbase, and the poor communication that's gone on now for years. But there's at least a sliver of hope that CCP will get their focus right, which is step one. We know we can't trust their words, but maybe we can trust their actions. That is, when/if they deliver, so far they havn't.
Best of luck to the staff that is losing their jobs, this is upper management issues, you guys did nothing wrong. this is a signature |
Thea Yulivee
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 10:55:00 -
[544] - Quote
During the Jita Protest, Fallout was like the only one, willing to listen to the players and respond and talk to them - and now you fire her in an atempt to get back on track with your playerbase?
Are you really that mad?
Quote:This will enable us to accelerate timeframes for new features and increase our ability to respond to community needs.
Firing the people that listened to the players and were the best at communicating with them, helpts to respond to our needs? Whose idea was that ****? |
Vicar2008
Royal Black Watch Highlanders
36
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 11:02:00 -
[545] - Quote
Still thinks that Dust 514 is the Rabbit Hole for CCP, I really really think its whats going to trounce CCP's finances into the ground. Will Eve Follow, I still think people are still hovering over the "Told you so" button. |
Alex Sinai
Mining And Probing Specialists
47
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 11:24:00 -
[546] - Quote
Congratulations to CCP for finally making right decisions. I hope that now EVE Online will receive more resources for development and support to improve it's current state and finally release an expansion instead of patches that somehow had been named expansions.
I'm sorry for all these people who going to lose their jobs and wish them all the best in finding a good job as soon as possible. |
Tommy Laughingface
Shoestring Operations
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 11:26:00 -
[547] - Quote
I support this decision.
However, please put don't forget to update Incarna experience. I don't know how DUST will turn out so I won't comment, but I want more avatar experience in EVE...
Afterall, don't just listen to "the community". Steve Jobs said "A lot of times, people don't know what they want until you show it to them."
My trust to you all. |
DaiTengu
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
28
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 11:38:00 -
[548] - Quote
Tommy Laughingface wrote: Afterall, don't just listen to "the community". Steve Jobs said "A lot of times, people don't know what they want until you show it to them."
CCP tried this. It gave us Incarna and the NeX store. CCP is not Apple.
Tommy Laughingface wrote:My trust to you all.
You're far more trusting than the vast majority of the rest of the playerbase, then. Most of us have been burned one too many times. |
RougeOperator
Autocannons Anonymous
84
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 12:03:00 -
[549] - Quote
#1Posted: 2011.10.20 00:57 | Report 6
I'm at a loss to understand how you could back-stab the very people that kept your main cash source going all the years you were allocating resources to OTHER projects and neglecting EvE.
The community team Kept you rolling in cash all the years you ignored many issues in the game. And gave use nothing substantial content wise.
The PR damn that they built was broken not by them but by the atrocity that was the nex store and INCARCERATIONS one room. And Hilmars fat ego put on parade for all to see like the emperor with new cloths that it was.
And even then they were slowly rebuilding CCPs REP. Only for CCP to take them out back and shoot them for their efforts.
Im just at a loss for how you can make so many bad decisions one after another and take it out on the very people that kept those bad decisions from causing major damage.
Incarceration was just too big a flop for them to be able to manage. But that's not their fault. It was like asking them to stop a tidal wave with an umbrella.
We can understand the layoff of devs on WOD. But the very communication team we depend on? When you just said you would try to communicate with us more? Take the people we have built a relationship with over years and **** can them? Are you now going to try to replace them with someone we have no relationship with?
Its like the world is upside down and inside out on Iceland.
Bad form CCP. Bad form indeed. |
Cedar Locus
Superfission
13
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 12:10:00 -
[550] - Quote
the one named helmar, fire him |
|
Smertrios
Veto. Veto Corp
7
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 12:11:00 -
[551] - Quote
BULLSHIT
That whole announcement reeks of it.
You don't fire 1/5 of your staff unless there is a serious problem, we are not dumb and you are lying to us again.
Have we not been through this already? Honesty breeds trust and support. Blatant lying breed rage and failure.
However this time you have really screwed up bad! The people that gave a crap and worked their asses of to damage control the constant stream of bullshit you feed us... you just fired!
Hell you even fired the guy organizing Fanfest! Maybe we will do our own now for all the people who have bought plane tickets already but don't want to go now because you just fired all the people that they cared about!
Face Palm!
Failure on this level is hard to comprehend! |
RougeOperator
Autocannons Anonymous
84
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 12:19:00 -
[552] - Quote
And they LOCKED the threads voicing discontent saying they all should be in one thread. Fascism seems too be the new way of communication with the players.
Some of those threads were talking about very different aspects of this.
They are forcing discussion into one thread to keep people from talking about what just happened.
Baloney CCP. |
Bratwurst0r
Austrian Industrial Corporation Universal Constant Alliance
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 12:21:00 -
[553] - Quote
So, do we have the names of the unlucky 20% already?
I know a few where named, but 10 of 106 is not the full picture. |
Subrahmaya Chandrasekhar
J0urneys End Journeys End Alliance
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 12:26:00 -
[554] - Quote
1) Not sure how the statement that the company is stretched to thin equates to stretching things thinner with layoffs.
2) Why not sell the WOD part of the business. A far better move IMO.
3) Dust should NOT be developed for the playstation, period. If you want DUST, build it for the PC and add it to EVE.
4) FOCUS FOCUS FOCUS.
- ONE GAME with ALL your dreams incorporated into it. It can be done, and you are the ones who can do it.
OS Name Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium 64bit **** Motherboard EVGA__132-YW-E180-FTW 790i Digital PWM **** 2 x EVGA 8800 GTX in 2-way SLI Resolution 2560 x 1440 x 59 hertz-á**** Corsair Dominator GT 8GB Kit 2X4GB 2000MHZ DDR3 **** Processor Intel(R) Core2 Extreme CPU X9650 @ 3.00GHz, currently not overclocked |
meatsaw
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 12:52:00 -
[555] - Quote
Miilla wrote:20% of overweight overpaid people fired.
My pet rock's heart is bleeding.
How long did it take you to think up this brain damage post?
You need to go back to Rens and keep working on those "fitted" Hulk contracts. |
Galies
JJ Express
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 12:52:00 -
[556] - Quote
Yes, lock all other threads, and the dont say anything to us in more than 10 pages. I can understand CCP doesnt want to read a lot of rage posts, but some of are trying to remain calm and be civil hoping for a response. Come on CCP, please dont let us down, keep us in the loop. |
Vai Tanis
Hedion University Amarr Empire
6
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 12:57:00 -
[557] - Quote
Very sad for those who've lost their jobs, but this was as inevitable as the dawn. A small company trying to develop three MMO games with only the revenue from a relatively small niche game like Eve to keep them afloat was always going to fail, as the lack of investment in Eve led to a lack of the subscriber growth numbers necessary to keep the whole thing afloat.
Hopefully this reorganisation will save the company in the long term and keep everyone elses jobs secure. If Sony soaks any losses from Dust and Eve returns to strength, maybe WoD can start up again in the future with a stable foundation. |
RougeOperator
Autocannons Anonymous
86
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 13:04:00 -
[558] - Quote
Galies wrote:Yes, lock all other threads, and the dont say anything to us in more than 10 pages. I can understand CCP doesnt want to read a lot of rage posts, but some of are trying to remain calm and be civil hoping for a response. Come on CCP, please dont let us down, keep us in the loop.
This just makes CCP seem even MORE out of touch with the players.
Many of the threads that were locked should not have been. They are just trying to crush the players complaints.
The putting it all in one thread is done to water down discussion and make it possible to drown out good points. Forcing them into a thread-naught makes it easier to ignore them since people wont want to read 40 pages to find the good points that might have been topic starters.
We arnt stupid CCP. trollish at times yes. but not actually stupid as a player base. |
T'Laar Bok
33
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 13:10:00 -
[559] - Quote
Not enough cynicism in this thread.
I'd say the refocusing was 99% driven by investors and 1% by customers.
Amphetimines are your friend. |
Malena
Shiva Morsus Mihi
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 13:17:00 -
[560] - Quote
Asinine.
Utterly asinine.
You admit that the leadership is the problem, you admit that you alienated your player base and your community. Then you fire 2/3 of the community team that are one of the main reasons people stayed in it this long? INCLUDING YOUR COMMUNITY DIRECTOR?!?! The oldsters amongst us know and love the Pann, and then..poof...gone. Just as bad as a wall street a-hole making a fortune off a company going under.
I was loyal to a fault. Even through all the bs, then you started to get me back to rabid fan with your acknowledgment of the issues..but now I am seriously considering cutting off all my accounts. Why should I stay with a company that says it is going to start doing the right things and re-engage the player base, then cuts off 2/3 of the ability to do so? (community team went from 14 to 5)
Helmar, what that says to me is that you don't really think you are the problem, you think the people on the community team-WHO HAD NO CONTROL OVER THE ACTUAL GAME CONTENT-are the problem.
Wow. Just wow. |
|
Aynen
SI Radio Split Infinity.
6
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 13:18:00 -
[561] - Quote
When the innitial statement came from the CEO that he was apologising, for me it came a bit out of the blue. And now with this follow-up I'm wondering how deep that rabbit hole goes. My sympathies go out to CCP, regardless of what mistakes where made, this is a very bitter pill to swallow for everyone, and I respect that fact.
The article mentions that subcriptions have been going down due to 'our own mistakes and poor communication with our players'. While I can certainly see that CCP is now being exeptionally transparent about what goes on internally, I do feel that it's positive perspectives that'll turn the tide, not so much talk of mistakes that where made, although I do apreciate such honesty. With positive perspectives I mean plenty of talk about upcoming features and changes, which is essentially what keeps us dreaming and playing and plotting and scheming. Too much confessing and talking of what went wrong might actually have the opposite effect. Positive feedback is key, not just to the players, but to CCP staff just the same.
So I look forward to what CCP thinks of next, and how they seek to implement it, because that keeps me coming back. I hope the joy of game making isn't lost under much bad news and hardships, so make spaceships :)
-Aynen |
Ayita
Aliastra Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 13:22:00 -
[562] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote: Sorry to the employees laid off from the WOD team in the states (particularly in this economic climate) but I do believe its a neccessary step and vital to ensure CCP has the resources to concentrate on and renew Eve Online as its core game. This announcement is almost more significant than the Hilmar apology to signalling a full return to priority focus on Eve Online.
Follow it up by announcing plans to ditch the NeX store and provide all In Space AND Incarna content through traditional sandbox economics rather than MT money-grubbing and I will be fully satisfied and celebrate by resubbing for a year on my account.
"Sandbox Economics" well put! I'm sure the Plex is giving CCP plenty of extra income. Hell the $199 bulk plex sale proves that.
CCP Refocus on the Goal and we all will be here. Our account sub's will show you our votes.
|
RougeOperator
Autocannons Anonymous
86
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 13:35:00 -
[563] - Quote
My accounts time will run out.
The only way to get me to put my money back into EvE is if they let go of Hilmar. There are more they a few that think this way now. His apology felt like a PR stunt to me. This latest gambit shows that it was just that in my opinion. Empty words.
They are focusing on EvE after crapping all over it for years. Not because its the right thing to do, but because it became necessity.
If they hadn't paid the core product lip service they would not be in this position to begin with. Its clear they have a bad leader. To get the company on the right track said person needs to go.
Honestly he should have stepped down when you put the letter out. |
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University Minmatar Republic
54
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 13:44:00 -
[564] - Quote
Well, I can't believe what I've seen here today. This is surely a day of infamy, a dark period of uncertainty in the otherwise bright life of Eve-Online.
I read the original post containing the new Dev Blog from CCP pertaining to the severe cut backs of CCP's work force while also reassuring us that Eve is healthy and gaining more attention to fixes and expansion developments. I also read every posted reply in this thread. Almost 550 different posts in 28 pages. This 'Good news and bad news all rolled into one' Dev Blog is a very hard pill to swallow..
Bitter sweet to say the least.
Most of the posted replies in this thread are filled with sincere dismay and sad disbelief due to the contents of the Dev Blog. Some replies were filled with joy and righteous indignation. Others posted offers of help and sympathy. A lot of the replies expressed grave concern and fear for the future of Eve. As I read through the different posted replies, I could see that the majority of the Eve Community was trying to express feelings of concern, outrage, joy and sorrow. I felt my heart being tugged on more than once, each time almost bringing a tear to my eye.
I now find myself worrying and wondering if this wonderful game I love so much will soon be nothing more than a fond memory.
I wanted to quote so many replies that I decided to just link the main ones I feel conveyed the overall feelings of the Eve Community. Sorry for the wall of links. I'd add more but have reached the text limit.
DMC
#9
#17 and #18
#28 and #29
#46
#53, #54 and #55
#60
#65
#78
#88
#108 and #109
#116
#122 and #123
#131 and #132
#138
#145, #146 and #147
#151, #152, #153 and #154
#162, #163 and #164
#171, #172 and #173
#187
#191
#198, #199 and #200
#203 and #204
#215, #216, #217, #218 and #219
#223
#231
|
Slade Trillgon
Endless Possibilities Inc.
37
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 13:49:00 -
[565] - Quote
I said in the other thread on this topic that there are usually more creative options then having to lay people off.
Someone mentioned a flat cut across the board for all employees.
Someone responded that upper management may have already done that. Unfortunately there is no confirmation from CCP on this assumption.
I will not go into other said hypothetical areas of reduction but I am sure they are there and I will also ASSUME at this point that they have not been targeted and looked at as it would have been smart to list those as areas that have been cut so as to avert bad PR back lash.......... oh wait
Slade |
Bratwurst0r
Austrian Industrial Corporation Universal Constant Alliance
4
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 13:52:00 -
[566] - Quote
Malena wrote: You admit that the leadership is the problem, you admit that you alienated your player base and your community. Then you fire 2/3 of the community team that are one of the main reasons people stayed in it this long? INCLUDING YOUR COMMUNITY DIRECTOR?!?! The oldsters amongst us know and love the Pann, and then..poof...gone. Just as bad as a wall street a-hole making a fortune off a company going under.
Sry buddy but you DO KNOW that Pann made the call NOT TO ANSWER the first threadnought and thus started if off badly, did the hilarious presentation about community management 1 day before hell broke loose and showed how NOT do to it right after.
If anyone should have expected consequences, its her. Not that i wish unemployment for anyone, really. But she failed pretty damn hard in containing the riots, it was more like pouring gasoline in it.
P.S. and lets not forget, her first apology post, where she failed AGAIN to even notice the MAIN ISSUE. If the community manager is so far out of contact, its time for a change. |
RougeOperator
Autocannons Anonymous
87
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 13:56:00 -
[567] - Quote
Slade Trillgon wrote:I said in the other thread on this topic that there are usually more creative options then having to lay people off. Someone mentioned a flat cut across the board for all employees. Someone responded that upper management may have already done that. Unfortunately there is no confirmation from CCP on this assumption. I will not go into other said hypothetical areas of reduction but I am sure they are there and I will also ASSUME at this point that they have not been targeted and looked at as it would have been smart to list those as areas that have been cut so as to avert bad PR back lash.......... oh wait Slade
What I want to know is why a man, Hilmar, that the community finds polarizing and many dislike so much is still at the helm. They cannot be this deaf to the players in CCP upper management. Unless those claims of them being tight and downright incestuous that nepotism trumps what is best for the company is true.
The again the past examples of how they handle employee scandalous situations speaks volumes. |
Caiden Baxter
The Dirty Rejects Scelus Sceleris.
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 13:56:00 -
[568] - Quote
Great just ******* great, as usual the common man gets cut when managment screws up. SoonGäó |
Halaxi
Veto. Veto Corp
4
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 13:59:00 -
[569] - Quote
The entire point of restructuring is to end up with the talent that you need in order to move forward.
Exactly how you (CCP suits) think you are doing this by removing, amongst others, those members of the community team that would be vital in informing you of what your customers approve of, desire, or flat out do not want, at a time when customer satisfaction is at an all time low and you desperatly need to reconnect with your customers, is beyond me.
I wonder - have any of those responsible for forcing the Incarna expansion out way before it was ready been 'dealt with', or are those who have gotten the shaft fallen foul of the 'crap always falls downhill' method of taking responsability?
I dearly hope that in one years time, I am not looking back, playing another mmo, and saying 'yeah, this was the announcement that marked the end'.
Fatalistic? Cynical? Perhaps. If only there wasn't any signs that peoples concerns were justified.
I also want to take this opportunity to thank those who are leaving for their positive contribution to the world of EvE. You have helped to create something epic, for which you should be proud. I hope that this creation isn't driven into the ground.
Hal.
Why yes, yes I am going to shoot you. |
Galies
JJ Express
4
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 14:18:00 -
[570] - Quote
RougeOperator wrote:My accounts time will run out.
The only way to get me to put my money back into EvE is if they let go of Hilmar. There are more then a few that think this way now. His apology felt like a PR stunt to me. This latest gambit shows that it was just that in my opinion. Empty words.
They are focusing on EvE after crapping all over it for years. Not because its the right thing to do, but because it became necessity.
If they hadn't paid the core product lip service they would not be in this position to begin with. Its clear they have a bad leader. To get the company on the right track said person needs to go.
Honestly he should have stepped down when you put the letter out.
I wouldnt reccomend this as the first course of action for anybody. Eve is a phenominal game, but lets also remember that Hilmar has been running things for quite some time, and has actually done a decent enough job for the most part. What i would believe is, that we, as customers, do deserve answers. DO we need the HR records for CCP? No. Do we need to have every item, ship, and game mechanic that is planned for the next 2 years, given to us on a timetable? No. What we need are answers that assure us that CCP management, AS A WHOLE, have the game, and us customers, in mind in every decision they make. This is Hilmars baby as much as ours. To quote someone else, "we bring the sand, Hilmar brought the box". I would not say that i am leaving if he doesnt step down. What i would suggest is that if we havent recieved the answers that assure us the game is alive and well, and have SEEN management taking steps to deliver on their promises, a date is set where a major portion of people simply unsub. |
|
Mr Management
Anger Management
5
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 14:18:00 -
[571] - Quote
You would have been better to:-
Scrap Dust and fix PI.
Keep WoD and go back to not taking the Eve players for granted.
Its silly to put all your eggs into one basket (Eve) and since playing this game from beta 3 WoD was my next move. |
Forum Bug
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
8
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 14:35:00 -
[572] - Quote
One other big question for CCP now is how do you hold on to the brains behind a lot of the unique things aorund eve. There is a lot of good projects that require coders like those eve has such as those that come up with concepts like TD etc etc.
This is a sinking ship, all over the sides those first get the best rewards, and who can blame them..
|
RougeOperator
Autocannons Anonymous
89
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 14:38:00 -
[573] - Quote
Galies wrote:RougeOperator wrote:My accounts time will run out.
The only way to get me to put my money back into EvE is if they let go of Hilmar. There are more then a few that think this way now. His apology felt like a PR stunt to me. This latest gambit shows that it was just that in my opinion. Empty words.
They are focusing on EvE after crapping all over it for years. Not because its the right thing to do, but because it became necessity.
If they hadn't paid the core product lip service they would not be in this position to begin with. Its clear they have a bad leader. To get the company on the right track said person needs to go.
Honestly he should have stepped down when you put the letter out. I wouldnt reccomend this as the first course of action for anybody. Eve is a phenominal game, but lets also remember that Hilmar has been running things for quite some time, and has actually done a decent enough job for the most part. What i would believe is, that we, as customers, do deserve answers. DO we need the HR records for CCP? No. Do we need to have every item, ship, and game mechanic that is planned for the next 2 years, given to us on a timetable? No. What we need are answers that assure us that CCP management, AS A WHOLE, have the game, and us customers, in mind in every decision they make. This is Hilmars baby as much as ours. To quote someone else, "we bring the sand, Hilmar brought the box". I would not say that i am leaving if he doesnt step down. What i would suggest is that if we havent recieved the answers that assure us the game is alive and well, and have SEEN management taking steps to deliver on their promises, a date is set where a major portion of people simply unsub.
upon reflection I dont think you can call half assing your way along and ignoring 6 years of bugs, abandoning content left and right and other glaring issues a good job. The game was kept going by the community not Hilmar. Then he as a course of action decided he new better then the community as was clear in his EMAIL he thinks little of the players. That was more honest then his hallow apology.
I think you might be giving him credit he does not actually deserve. I honestly think it was the players that kept eve going. The subs growing was due to people like me telling all my buddies to play.
|
Inficant
Serenity Smuggling
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 15:24:00 -
[574] - Quote
RougeOperator wrote:I think you might be giving him credit he does not actually deserve. I honestly think it was the players that kept eve going. The subs growing was due to people like me telling all my buddies to play.
The Game, IS THE COMMUNITY.
You got your buddies to play because CCP created a great game. Hilmar and his team created that game that you thought was worthy of you and your friends to play. Your friends played it, the community evolved, the game evolved, they got better hand in hand. IMO You cannot remove one from the other.
CCP made some mistakes. They are trying to fix them with some very bitter tasting medicine. The next 6 months will tell us if the patient is responding to the medicine. This is a tough time for everyone at CCP and no one looks forward to reducing staff. It makes it harder for Hilmar to ask for funding later, it makes them look bad in the industry, they have to admit their failings, broadcast them and then ask people to show their friends the door. These are all signs that CCP is trying to improve, realign and refocus. We can second guess them all day, but we won't know whether it was right or wrong based on reading into a couple of blog posts. We won't know today or tomorrow whether it was appropriate, but we'll know in the next 6 months to 1 yr.
I've been playing Eve for a long while and I want to play it in the future. |
RougeOperator
Autocannons Anonymous
90
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 15:32:00 -
[575] - Quote
Inficant wrote:RougeOperator wrote:I think you might be giving him credit he does not actually deserve. I honestly think it was the players that kept eve going. The subs growing was due to people like me telling all my buddies to play.
The Game, IS THE COMMUNITY. You got your buddies to play because CCP created a great game. Hilmar and his team created that game that you thought was worthy of you and your friends to play. Your friends played it, the community evolved, the game evolved, they got better hand in hand. IMO You cannot remove one from the other. CCP made some mistakes. They are trying to fix them with some very bitter tasting medicine. The next 6 months will tell us if the patient is responding to the medicine. This is a tough time for everyone at CCP and no one looks forward to reducing staff. It makes it harder for Hilmar to ask for funding later, it makes them look bad in the industry, they have to admit their failings, broadcast them and then ask people to show their friends the door. These are all signs that CCP is trying to improve, realign and refocus. We can second guess them all day, but we won't know whether it was right or wrong based on reading into a couple of blog posts. We won't know today or tomorrow whether it was appropriate, but we'll know in the next 6 months to 1 yr. I've been playing Eve for a long while and I want to play it in the future.
Dont ignore the first part of my post the leads into the second part. Trying to take it out of context is low.
Upon reflection I dont think you can call half assing your way along and ignoring 6 years of bugs, abandoning content left and right and other glaring issues a good job. The game was kept going by the community not Hilmar. Then he as a course of action decided he new better then the community as was clear in his EMAIL he thinks little of the players. That was more honest then his hollow apology.
|
Abrazzar
211
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 15:38:00 -
[576] - Quote
The winter expansion cannot be awesome enough to even attempt at balancing this **** out. No more reason to save up for PLEXes I guess. Please visit your user settings to re-enable images. |
Cuchulain Spartan
Cryogenic Creations
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 15:39:00 -
[577] - Quote
As per what I said during the apology letter last month.
Sorry to hear that people are loosing their jobs.
Quote:
#565 Posted: 2011.10.06 15:55 | Report 1
Generally the man at top only apologises when,
A) The company is hemorrhaging/about to hemorrhage money due to his stubbornness
B) The company is hemorrhaging/about to hemorrhage his top staff due to his stubbornness
I donGÇÖt think he woke up one morning and found religion and realised the errors of his ways, I think its adapt or die time which makes the apology worthless imo.
Spart o/
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Vrykolakasis
Trinity Operations Aurora Irae
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 15:55:00 -
[578] - Quote
Well I have to say, I know how hard it is to get a good job as an educated talented person, and I am extremely disappointed to hear that people are being dropped. |
Mealka
Farmers SRL AAA Citizens
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 16:31:00 -
[579] - Quote
Hmm... Bring Jove race in EVE ! And you`ll get more players ! Open jove space also.
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Aldous Durant
Solace of Open Space
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 17:20:00 -
[580] - Quote
Watch out for Hilmar's article in the next issue of the CCP's internal newsletter "How to keep your kids fed for a month on one pair of $1000 jeans." |
|
Hailey Sunweaver
MAFIA PLAYGROUND Tri Sol Syndicate
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 17:45:00 -
[581] - Quote
For those losing thier jobs I wish you the best in finding new employment. I've been laied off before and I know how bad it sucks. It's a shame it all had to come down to this from the riots to the unsubbs that got CCP to put resources back into EVE. |
Kengutsi Akira
65
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 18:00:00 -
[582] - Quote
Mr Management wrote:You would have been better to:-
Scrap Dust and fix PI.
Keep WoD and go back to not taking the Eve players for granted.
Its silly to put all your eggs into one basket (Eve) and since playing this game from beta 3 WoD was my next move.
Great example of youll never please everyone
He's actually upset theyre focussing on EVE What Mittani wants, Mittani gets, Mittani help us all
|
Almethea
Trans Stellar Express
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 18:04:00 -
[583] - Quote
does the wanker who managed to break the link between players and CCP keep his job?
does he wear again a 1000$ pant?
most important : good luck for those who lose their jobs |
Azelor Delaria
Error-404
56
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 18:15:00 -
[584] - Quote
Bratwurst0r wrote:Malena wrote: You admit that the leadership is the problem, you admit that you alienated your player base and your community. Then you fire 2/3 of the community team that are one of the main reasons people stayed in it this long? INCLUDING YOUR COMMUNITY DIRECTOR?!?! The oldsters amongst us know and love the Pann, and then..poof...gone. Just as bad as a wall street a-hole making a fortune off a company going under.
Sry buddy but you DO KNOW that Pann made the call NOT TO ANSWER the first threadnought and thus started if off badly, did the hilarious presentation about community management 1 day before hell broke loose and showed how NOT do to it right after. If anyone should have expected consequences, its her. Not that i wish unemployment for anyone, really. But she failed pretty damn hard in containing the riots, it was more like pouring gasoline in it. P.S. and lets not forget, her first apology post, where she failed AGAIN to even notice the MAIN ISSUE. If the community manager is so far out of contact, its time for a change.
I honestly felt throughout that whole debacle that CCP Pann really didn't want to be the face of that thread. The entire time I read the responses, and she never once popped in. Even after being told there was a family emergency and she had left, I felt like that excuse was bull as well.
The issue here is, and has been, Hilmar. No matter what they do, when it comes right down to it Hilmar put us - and his employees - in the sorry predicament that we are all in. His clear and obvious lack of true understanding of business models makes me believe he graduated with an associate's degree from some third-rate community college in Bangladesh.
When I first saw the "apology" to us, I was like, "Well damn, maybe you can teach an old dog new tricks!" I was ecstatic. But at the same time, it seemed...random, for me. Then this happens, and it came into focus. I want people to think: how far back do you think they realized they were not going to "make quota" for the loan realignment or whatever-the-hell it is? To me, it seems like one of two things:
1.) They knew they had screwed the proverbial pooch long ago, but continued on this track because they wanted to shove WoD and DUST down our throats faster, and try to recoup losses. They were fighting against the clock. Bad business practice, as someone mentioned this game is niche, and the proceeds from a niche game do not compare to a game like World of Warcraft. They couldn't fund three projects off of just this game alone.
2.) They didn't realize it until a week or two ago, and by then it was far too late. Once again, bad business practice, because someone should have had the balls to say, "You knwo what? This isn't working!" long ago.
In all, it's bad business. Hilmar allowed his ego to inflate, and because of that 100 more people are looking for jobs in this ****** economy. Does a CCP employee want to get the **** off their "CCP IS AWESOME!!!!!" alt and actually answer, or should we expect another "emergency CSM summit" to deal with this, where we won't find out what actually happened for months, after CCP gets to redact everything and put words in their mouths? |
RougeOperator
Autocannons Anonymous
91
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 18:28:00 -
[585] - Quote
Azelor Delaria wrote: In all, it's bad business. Hilmar allowed his ego to inflate, and because of that 100 more people are looking for jobs in this ****** economy. Does a CCP employee want to get the **** off their "CCP IS AWESOME!!!!!" alt and actually answer, or should we expect another "emergency CSM summit" to deal with this, where we won't find out what actually happened for months, after CCP gets to redact everything and put words in their mouths?
I am surprised we have not seen another tidal wave of alts already. That was very hilarious last time. Or did they fire all the people they had alt post last time?
|
Pak Narhoo
Knights of Kador
26
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 18:30:00 -
[586] - Quote
RougeOperator wrote:And they LOCKED the threads voicing discontent saying they all should be in one thread. Fascism seems too be the new way of communication with the players.
Some of those threads were talking about very different aspects of this.
They are forcing discussion into one thread to keep people from talking about what just happened.
Baloney CCP.
You need to realize that as of now there are only a few moderators around. Those who survived this round do have other functions to tend to then just monitoring, way too many forum topics. Putting all related stuff into one thread is the logical thing to do.
Having had modern forum software all they had to do was check some checkboxes and *merge* one topic into another would had been even better. But hey, no need to talk here about how great these new forums are not.
|
Kengutsi Akira
65
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 18:34:00 -
[587] - Quote
Pak Narhoo wrote:RougeOperator wrote:And they LOCKED the threads voicing discontent saying they all should be in one thread. Fascism seems too be the new way of communication with the players.
Some of those threads were talking about very different aspects of this.
They are forcing discussion into one thread to keep people from talking about what just happened.
Baloney CCP. You need to realize that as of now there are only a few moderators around. Those who survived this round do have other functions to tend to then just monitoring, way too many forum topics. Putting all related stuff into one thread is the logical thing to do. Having had modern forum software all they had to do was check some checkboxes and *merge* one topic into another would had been even better. But hey, no need to talk here about how great these new forums are not.
an dude, not the above but rogueoperator are you being serious that "this new wave of thread closings pointing to one thread" is the FIRST time youve seen this come from CCP? These guys are pretty much renowned for draconian forum tactics lol What Mittani wants, Mittani gets, Mittani help us all
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Blastfizzle
Quondam Souls of the Universe corporation THE R0NIN
10
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 18:40:00 -
[588] - Quote
ThAnK yOu CcP! |
RougeOperator
Autocannons Anonymous
91
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 18:51:00 -
[589] - Quote
Kengutsi Akira wrote:Pak Narhoo wrote:RougeOperator wrote:And they LOCKED the threads voicing discontent saying they all should be in one thread. Fascism seems too be the new way of communication with the players.
Some of those threads were talking about very different aspects of this.
They are forcing discussion into one thread to keep people from talking about what just happened.
Baloney CCP. You need to realize that as of now there are only a few moderators around. Those who survived this round do have other functions to tend to then just monitoring, way too many forum topics. Putting all related stuff into one thread is the logical thing to do. Having had modern forum software all they had to do was check some checkboxes and *merge* one topic into another would had been even better. But hey, no need to talk here about how great these new forums are not. an dude, not the above but rogueoperator are you being serious that "this new wave of thread closings pointing to one thread" is the FIRST time youve seen this come from CCP? These guys are pretty much renowned for draconian forum tactics lol
This may be the first time some players have run into it. But I'm also highlighting its stupidity right after we were promised more open communication.
And pointing out that they did not mean a thing they said. And that hilmars apology is just more lip service and he never meant it.
|
Luckdragon82
The Dominion of Light BLACK-MARK
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 19:12:00 -
[590] - Quote
If CCP wishes to move forward with DUST, then they need to understand that not everybody has a PS3. True vision would have them build for the 360 and maybe even develop a way to play EVE as we know it on the consoles. Also, stop being so proprietary with the ships. Gallente ships always seem to be one-up'ed by everything else, especially the weapons. And make the TITANs bad-@$$ again. Firing people may actually hurt the game. It would also be nice if MORE epic campaigns were made. I thought when I finished the Gallente epic mission, there'd be more, but there wasn't. |
|
Schmacos tryne
Norsk Testosteron
6
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 19:40:00 -
[591] - Quote
I have not read this thread and I am not going to either.
Just to throw my 5 cents:
Tactics went wrong (leeching resources from the one paying pool of customers to fond other ambitios projects).
Things get set straight (From a business perspective) where the original river og milk and honney gets strengthened out and continued to be developed further while some other ambitious project gets put on hold.
Some people got layed off and the echonomy isn't all that great for the time being.... The people left should be thankfull for the fact that CCP actually takes responsibility and tries to survive by reverting to know successfull tactics instead of pushing it further and face certain doom where all loose their jobs and we loose this game.
To the whining part of the community: G.T.F.O. (Socialism and whining bastards will be the end of us all!)
To the sad part of CCP staff: H.T.F.U. (Those departed: U got skills, no problem. U got no skills, you didn't belong in CCP in the first place / Those remaining: Thank god you management have the balls to save your company and this game by making hard and unpopular desicions.)
TLDR: I am glad we are still going to have a game called Eve. Screw the rest. |
Slippery Duke
F.A.R.T
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 19:57:00 -
[592] - Quote
It's a shame to hear that people are being fired, but it happens everywhere. Imho DOW and Dust really need to be put well onto the back burner, and ccp should refocus on EvE. A year of in-attention has proven this to detrimental effects i would say back burner dust(and also make it pc compatible for us eve jiunkies) to and re-focus wholly on EvE and make it the greatest game again. |
Z'Pax
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 20:13:00 -
[593] - Quote
Multiple angled statement ahead
I don't understand why people are so shocked and surprised about staff from the community relations team being on the chopping block.
It was after all a community backlash that caused all this. Something that is there job to see and help/influence/interpret, that they failed right?
And the backlash was over the NeX content and CQ, both of which are predominantly from the carbon WoD teams.. and what a shock they have been chopped too.
That at least is my hope, that those who ARE responsible for the whole thing are the ones being axed, but my brain tells me that's probably not the case.
But another perspective.
Me and my accounts left EVE long before all the NeX protests, a year and a half ago. And after coming back to try it all again (yup would of been sooner but NeX had an impact on me returning), I have been utterly underwhelmed by the changes. This game is principally one of flying ships around, and in that 18 months whats new on that front? A few salvaging ships woopy f'in doo. Seriously I think CCP should look at that reason for why it all went **** up. In that time you haven't done anything of significance to improve the basic content of the game, that of flying spaceships. Of course people will eventually be up in arms about something.
For those fired, good luck. If you were good at your job and lost it anyway deep sympathy. If not.. well meh.
tl/dr Good people loosing jobs bad, bad people loosing jobs great. Now get on with some more spaceship content CCP its what your cash cow is all about. |
Kengutsi Akira
66
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 20:15:00 -
[594] - Quote
RougeOperator wrote:
This may be the first time some players have run into it. But I'm also highlighting its stupidity right after we were promised more open communication.
And pointing out that they did not mean a thing they said. And that hilmars apology is just more lip service and he never meant it.
Yeah cause I (and others) havent been saying that in damn near EVERY THREAD where ppl were like "OMG YAY HILMAR IS GOD WE LOVE CCP"
and telling them "I can tell you that this is one of the moments where we look at what our players do and less of what they say".
Yet we got the "they apologized what more do you want" or "some people cant be satisfied and will never be happy"
lol
This is my "I told you so"
What Mittani wants, Mittani gets, Mittani help us all
|
Kazini Jax
Starlight Operations Starlight Network
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 20:28:00 -
[595] - Quote
How typical. Upper managent screws up and the lowers have to pay. Hey, Hilmar. Where is your loss? What are you giving up? Disgusting!
And what's-yer-face above that commented on Socialism = bad. STFU. Every single society, by definition, is a form of Socialism. It's not a question of "Do we want socialism?" it is a question of "How much Socialism do we want?" I am so sick of The Stupid. |
Slippery Duke
F.A.R.T
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 20:35:00 -
[596] - Quote
Kazini Jax wrote:How typical. Upper managent screws up and the lowers have to pay. Hey, Hilmar. Where is your loss? What are you giving up? Disgusting!
This is a bad case of the underlings and us the paying players pay for the mis-deeds of the few. A most unfortunate circumstance but this was on the cards maybe as far back as the end of 2009 many saw it coming myself amongst them.
|
Trebor Daehdoow
Dirt Nap Squad Dirt Nap Squad.
1003
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 20:38:00 -
[597] - Quote
Reprinted from my blog, which I would link to, except the forums generate a BBCODE parse error if you have a url tag + a percent sign anywhere in the post.
The 20%, the 79%, and the 1%
By now everyone will have heard the news that CCP is slashing their staff by about 20%.
First of all, I want to express my condolences to the 20%, many of whom are going through the roughest time in their professional careers. Some of them I knew personally, and they will be missed.
Second, I want to express my sympathies towards the 79%, the remaining staff who, in the coming months, either implicitly or explicitly, are going to be pressured to work longer and harder to help CCP recover from the consequences of disastrous strategic decisions that they had little or no voice in.
And finally, I have a few questions for the 1%, the top staff at CCP who made those decisions.
* Have you really accepted that this is your fault, or do you still cling to the illusion that this is the fault of "pesky" players who just don't understand your awesome vision, and who should feel honored to be permitted to pay you to implement it?
* Are you really sincere about this change of direction by CCP, or do you consider the refocusing on EVE just a temporary bump in the road?
* Have any of you accepted responsibility, either by resigning, accepting demotion, or taking a pay cut?
I wonder what the chances are that any of the above questions can be answered by a "yes"?
20%...? 79%...? or 1%...? CSM - because I have not yet plumbed the depths of my inherent masochism! CSM 6 Activities Summary | My CSM blog |
Slippery Duke
F.A.R.T
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 20:42:00 -
[598] - Quote
Trebor if you get a straight answer to those great set of questions, i wil leat my minmatar teddy bear. On a serious note do the DEvs and CEO have the Balls to give us a straight answer! Good to see a member of the CSM saying there piece. |
Kengutsi Akira
69
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 20:42:00 -
[599] - Quote
lol I cant link to the forums here cause "posts cannot contain html" even though its a copy/pasted link to another thread in General.... good job web team.
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=220213#post220213
this thread annoys me because its more of those people that swallow what CCP is saying to us when its their actions we should be watching not our words. One thing I damn sure learned from Hilmar.
Holy ****, it only took me 4 tries to get that link to post What Mittani wants, Mittani gets, Mittani help us all
|
Slippery Duke
F.A.R.T
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 20:55:00 -
[600] - Quote
What we need is a honest and open thread from Hilmar, basically for people to ask him questions regarding the changes and whats went wrong. Him and the various other senior management can answer these questions in a honest open fashion. I know its asking a lot but at this point the community need to see that the guy(s) in charge know there arse from his elbow so to speak. We as a community at this point are beyond disgruntled in fact i dont think even gruntled covers it |
|
Tanya Powers
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
44
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 20:57:00 -
[601] - Quote
Rodj Blake wrote:My sympathies go out to those affected by the job losses - I hope that you all get things sorted out quickly.
+1
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Kengutsi Akira
69
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 20:57:00 -
[602] - Quote
Slippery Duke wrote:What we need is a honest and open thread from Hilmar, basically for people to ask him questions regarding the changes and whats went wrong. Him and the various other senior management can answer these questions in a honest open fashion. I know its asking a lot but at this point he community need to see that the guy(s) in charge know there arse from his elbow so to speak. We as a community at this point are beyond disgruntled in fact i dont think even gruntled covers it
I dont think at this point we need more words. They just need to stop with the sunshine blowing up our collective asses and start putting that time into rolling things out.
Actions. Not words. Ive seen enough words from these guys to last me a lifetime
What Mittani wants, Mittani gets, Mittani help us all
|
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
67
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 20:58:00 -
[603] - Quote
Kengutsi Akira wrote:lol I cant link to the forums here cause "posts cannot contain html" even though its a copy/pasted link to another thread in General.... good job web team. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=220213#post220213this thread annoys me because its more of those people that swallow what CCP is saying to us when its their actions we should be watching not our words. One thing I damn sure learned from Hilmar. Holy ****, it only took me 4 tries to get that link to post
Yeah, there seems to be a lot of forum issues today.
We don't always see eye to eye, but I generally agree with your point in that thread.
However, I also understand that there isn't a whole lot they can actually "do" (as in give to us) until the next expansion... other than the silly ship spinning thing so many people got worked up about.
As to the rest, you know where I stand.
I think CCP did a horrible job with this whole situatiion... including their selections for termination.
On the other hand, I think the EVE community handled their reaction to things pretty poorly as well. The phrases "over reaction", "immaturity", and "easily manipulated" come to mind.
Still, it is what it is. We'll see what gets followed through on in this next release, if I can stomach the "back patting" from the community... the chopping of heads at CCP to keep their heads above water... and the victory rolls from the forum trolls long enough to get there. To kill the enemy and break their toys!
It's not so much a mission statement,-áit's more like a family motto. |
Slippery Duke
F.A.R.T
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 21:00:00 -
[604] - Quote
][/quote]
I dont think at this point we need more words. They just need to stop with the sunshine blowing up our collective asses and start putting that time into rolling things out.
Actions. Not words. Ive seen enough words from these guys to last me a lifetime [/quote]
I agree with you 100% on this time for to ccp to put up or nut up. |
Vipieris
Blackwater Syndicate Shadow of xXDEATHXx
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 23:06:00 -
[605] - Quote
I only have one question, and maybe someone else asked it already (but 30 pages - come on... I have a job after all!)
If your resources are stretched too thin, then why did you just let 20% of them go while not reducing the number of active projects?
As a Project Controls Analyst for an EPC firm, this not only doesn't make any sense, but doesn't bode well for ANY of those ongoing projects.
When project demand has exceeded the maximum available output from your productive resources, you either reduce demand, or increase resources. You've decreased resources, while basically saying, "We're still going to keep working on everything" and "we'll be able to do things quicker."
How do ya figure?? I'd tend to suggest at this point that you, as well as your customers, are screwed. And I get big bucks to reach those kinds of conclusions...
If you need some professional project management assistance, let me know - though I'm not exactly sure you're a viable company to work for at this point...
Don't worry - I'll keep paying my memberships as long as there's still a game to play. :)
Vipieris |
Kengutsi Akira
70
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 23:09:00 -
[606] - Quote
they effectively killed not only White Wolf but the WoD project. What Mittani wants, Mittani gets, Mittani help us all
|
zcar300
SERCO Group
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 23:09:00 -
[607] - Quote
So your cutting people and continuing all development because you"re stretched too thin? I realize you're slowing development on one front but how does that even make sense? Is this a Jita scam?
What you need to do is reduce your expansion schedule to one a year. Instead of releasing content that isn't finished and that breaks the continuity of the game. Like having Minmatar CQs in Amarr, caldari, and Gallente stations. |
Slippery Duke
F.A.R.T
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 23:19:00 -
[608] - Quote
zcar300 wrote:So your cutting people and continuing all development because you"re stretched too thin? I realize you're slowing development on one front but how does that even make sense? Is this a Jita scam? What you need to do is reduce your expansion schedule to one a year. Instead of releasing content that isn't finished and that breaks the continuity of the game. Like having Minmatar CQs in Amarr, caldari, and Gallente stations.
To me feels liek ultimate damage control or oh frak we screwed up, the thing is they need to focus on one project get it sorted and then take it from there bad case of over extending yourself by a wide margin.
|
RougeOperator
Autocannons Anonymous
93
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 23:26:00 -
[609] - Quote
Do the devs even remember how to code for EvE FiS anymore after 4 years of.....making one room? |
Vai Tanis
Hedion University Amarr Empire
6
|
Posted - 2011.10.20 23:54:00 -
[610] - Quote
Vipieris wrote:I only have one question, and maybe someone else asked it already (but 30 pages - come on... I have a job after all!)
If your resources are stretched too thin, then why did you just let 20% of them go while not reducing the number of active projects?
As a Project Controls Analyst for an EPC firm, this not only doesn't make any sense, but doesn't bode well for ANY of those ongoing projects.
I got the impression that instead of actively developing WoD, Dust and supporting Eve they've effectively mothballed WoD.
WoD is still an active project only in the sense that it's not been completely cancelled. The money that went towards it's active development and the salaries of most of the 20% is now being put into supporting Eve while a skeleton crew continues to work on it's core concepts.
Then when Dust is released and hopefully Eve is back in shape and growing nicely, they'll direct money back towards WoD and restart active development.
That's what I get from this anyway, that they've finally realised they were hugely overextended and relying on extremely over-optimistic growth projections for Eve to fund it all. Mothballing WoD, finishing Dust and concentrating on Eve seems like an attempt to stabilise their finances and then work on WoD later, rather than carry on and lose all three as they go bankrupt. |
|
Steve Crusher
Jackalopes
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 01:36:00 -
[611] - Quote
I understand the concerns that other players may have with the recent changes and trends in CCP's focus, but I wanted to throw it out there that I am as excited about the direction of the game as ever. I hope this opinion is shared out there, because lets face it, this universe is an incredible feat. While I am a little bummed to have to wait longer for WODs release, and certainly feel for the Atlanta team's, for lack of a better word, downsizing, I'm not stressed about the long term success of EVE.
Hopefully this refocusing brings us some new content . . . maybe some more T3? |
Tcar
Dirt Nap Squad Dirt Nap Squad.
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 01:39:00 -
[612] - Quote
I really hate to hear that people are getting laid off. I know that song by heart. My EVE time is non existent due to underemployment right now.
I always did wonder just what they were doing down in ATL. Now I know. OTOH, the White Wolf IP is not going anywhere. If the success of Ann Rice, Twilight, Sookie Stackhouse et al is any indication of the market, it'll do just fine in a few years if and when they get it out.
All the nay-saying-bittervet forum warriors better hope DUST hits and hits big. If I were you, I'd do what I've been doing and sell all my little thumber buddies on it and say it's the greatest thing since sliced bread.
Hopefully CCP will deliver on DUST and it will make money. More money means increased resources for internet spaceships. Hopefully Hilmar & pals have gotten the message and realized that EVE still needs more work on the spaceship flying parts and the flying spaceships is why we play.
It was a bit over optimistic, to say the least, on CCP's part to try and float two games in development off the back of one moderately successful one. Diverting resources from EVE to fund two simultaneous dev projects was like eating your seed corn. Ain't gonna have much of a crop next year if you keep that up. |
Naradius
DEATHFUNK
5
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 01:43:00 -
[613] - Quote
Even though I welcome and rejoice at the news that CCP are going to re-focus efforts towards EVE Online, my sympathies go to those that will lose their employment.
I have doubts that DUST will be a long term success (being a PS3 exclusive), and if the Captains Closet is anything to go by, WOD had a good chance of being vaporware, while trying to overcome the technical difficulties.
One of the "rabble brigade".
Rabble of the World UNITE! |
The Marketer
Secure IT
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 02:45:00 -
[614] - Quote
Sorry to hear about the job cuts. After reading this, I now want to resub one of my account but I receives this message:
We were unable to authorize your payment at this time. Please ensure you have sufficient funds and/or contact your bank/card issuer for further information.
I called my credit card bank and they say there was no transaction attempt and I have enough funds. Looks like a problem on CCP side.
CCP fix this if the problem is on your side so we can resub and help.
|
Reverand Pastor
Dynasty Ink.
16
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 05:30:00 -
[615] - Quote
Vipieris wrote:I only have one question, and maybe someone else asked it already (but 30 pages - come on... I have a job after all!)
If your resources are stretched too thin, then why did you just let 20% of them go while not reducing the number of active projects?
As a Project Controls Analyst for an EPC firm, this not only doesn't make any sense, but doesn't bode well for ANY of those ongoing projects.
When project demand has exceeded the maximum available output from your productive resources, you either reduce demand, or increase resources. You've decreased resources, while basically saying, "We're still going to keep working on everything" and "we'll be able to do things quicker."
How do ya figure?? I'd tend to suggest at this point that you, as well as your customers, are screwed. And I get big bucks to reach those kinds of conclusions...
If you need some professional project management assistance, let me know - though I'm not exactly sure you're a viable company to work for at this point...
Don't worry - I'll keep paying my memberships as long as there's still a game to play. :)
Vipieris
To save you some time there have been tons of people whit knighting for ccp that it boggles the mind. The concept of being "stretched to thin" with layoffs is completely loss on some people. The people with level heads know that the whole ting smells fo trouble from corpprate all the way down to consumer. |
Dray
Euphoria Released HYDRA RELOADED
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 07:26:00 -
[616] - Quote
SHAMESHAME wrote:To each and every person who whined their way through the last few months, congratulations. You got your pixels, database entries and pretend warfare. Real people lost jobs. There was nothing so wrong with the game that it should have meant taking real food off the real tables of real people. It is my sincere hope that you too find yourself in the unemployment line.
I refuse to believe anyone is this backward, seriously you have to be trolling, that or you have a glass stomach, because with your head that far up your own arse it's the only way you can see where you're going....
|
David Xavier
The Scope Gallente Federation
6
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 08:58:00 -
[617] - Quote
Refocusing on the EVE Universe is good news. I may be wrong here, but it bugs me why don't you just assign people from WoD to EvE if everything is fine? My HRM teacher taught me that firing people is the last resort. |
Babau
Die rot-weiss-roten Piloten Bruderschaft der Pilger
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 09:51:00 -
[618] - Quote
this will be bitter for some ppl, but i think for CCP its the right decision. and regarding subscription you have to count the ALT's. i have 3 accounts, and probably have to let 1 go next year, not becaus of CCP, but because the 3 accs have a huge blow on my (real life) wallet. :) i think ppl wont stop playing eve if they got "hooked", sometime there is a longer break, but stop subscription for main-char wont happened so oftern.
personally i cant understand the decision to build DUST exclusively for PS3. i would love to play it, but not on a console...
after all, you souldnt stop/reduce development for eve. its the greatest space-sim out there. only thing is, you need time to do anything, and ppl. i would love to see some more fast paced action in the future, like a instanced dog-fight arena, freelance-style, like a FPS-minigame. |
Slippery Duke
F.A.R.T
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 10:17:00 -
[619] - Quote
RougeOperator wrote:Do the devs even remember how to code for EvE FiS anymore after 4 years of.....making one room?
Simple answer - No ;) |
Dodecapod
Open University of Celestial Hardship Art of War Alliance
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 10:19:00 -
[620] - Quote
Ye, best of luck to the people loosing their jobs, hope you guys all land on your feet.
I don't know what happened there CCP... You clearly had the right idea at one point. The whole thing about players not being to identify with a ship is the right track... Ever since I started playing EVE, I kept hoping to have an actual character ingame and when all that talk about INCARNA started, I thought "yesssss, they finally got it". Yes, having an actual character, walking on stations, etc. I thought it was the right move and that it would bring a huge number of new players to EVE and was excited about getting more targets on my overview.
Somehow, it all slowed way the f*** down and all we've seen of INCARNA is what I sincerely consider a BETA. Don't get me wrong, I'm happy to go along with this as long as it helps the devs iron out CARBON. I understood that it was a huge undertaking but apparently CCP didn't.
( T O C C P: ) So I'd like to reinforce this slowboat that is called carbon or walking on station or future vision. CCP, put on your mwd on and overheat if for god's sake; and when you get CARBON to work smoothly and load faster and reduce it's strain on our graphics cards, continue and give us the racial captain's quarters; and when you get all this sorted, don't stop. It's not enough to just see your character in a room. The point of having a character is to be in a crowd and to build on this social aspect of the game. Wouldn't have NEX worked better if you could show off your new coat or pair of boots to the other players? What good does it do now? You buy boots, you take a twirl in your lonely room and that's it... nothin' left to do then undock!
Sorry to get negative at the end there, but that's just how it is. Now focus on getting this stuff done and you will get a throng of new accounts. You know you will. |
|
Jint Hikaru
OffWorld Exploration Inc
14
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 10:25:00 -
[621] - Quote
Difficult times,
While pleased that CCP are continuing to focus on Eve, its always upsetting to hear that so many people will be loosing their jobs.
I wish all those affected the very best and I hope that they are able to recover quickly.
Fly safe everyone....
Jint Hikaru - Miner / Salvager / Explorer / SpaceBum In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move. |
CircleSquare
Trask Industries
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 11:02:00 -
[622] - Quote
Eurogamer Interview with Hilmar:-
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-10-21-eurogamer-interviews-ccps-hilmar-petursson-interview
Pretty honest stuff...."I absolutely considered [resigning] but I think that frankly it would have been an easy way out."
|
Dr Zuma
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 11:32:00 -
[623] - Quote
CCP facing reality, things must be really ******* bad :/
|
Helicity Boson
Immortalis Inc. Shadow Cartel
4
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 14:29:00 -
[624] - Quote
At least the winter expansion plans seem good to me.
It's just a damned shame we had to twist their arm so hard that good people lost their jobs to just get these things done... things that should have been done years ago |
Jacob Menard
Pure Evil Warriors The Devil's Warrior Alliance
7
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 15:03:00 -
[625] - Quote
A toast to fallen CCP capsuleers, who's re-incarnation chambers have been damaged beyond repair. |
Azelor Delaria
Error-404
56
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 15:31:00 -
[626] - Quote
Helicity Boson wrote:At least the winter expansion plans seem good to me.
It's just a damned shame we had to twist their arm so hard that good people lost their jobs to just get these things done... things that should have been done years ago
I don't see us having twisted their arms "hard enough" that people lost their jobs.
Look at what the business model had been. "Ignore the EVE Online customers, our cash source, while simultaneously working on two new games, and still having a loan to repay with-in the coming months." How can anyone sit there and say it's because of the players that these people lost their jobs?
I made it clear: the bad business practices and the lack of clear thought processes led to Hilmar canning 100 people. Had he thought a little and realized all that was going on, this may not have happened, or maybe only a few people lost their jobs.
Then again, I don't think he anticipated his idiocy getting out to the "unwashed masses" in the form of the leaked e-mail. |
Dunbar Hulan
The Flaming Sideburn's Art of War Alliance
17
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 15:34:00 -
[627] - Quote
For any CCP guys who lost their jobs. My two cents, I need an IT guy, duties would be running the network for a Multi- State company, I am implementing an open source CRM solution across all divisions, so someone familiar with this would be good, also needs to be able to integrate our own modules into the CRM system. The CRM will be tied into a social media system that is going to be heavily automated. So basically, you would be running the IT for the Company, implementing and configuring various systems and servers. Would have to move to any of the following areas- CA, Tucson, Phoenix, or NM. As usual there would be a drug test and background check, we do a lot of work with the Feds, so that part is important. Cheers. There it is. |
DJ Xaphod
Eve Radio Corporation
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 15:39:00 -
[628] - Quote
A CCP Hilmar quote on the layoffs:
"How it relates to the community - that is part of the restructuring, our community division has been spread around the globe and has had a lot of good contact with the community. But we've not been as effective. By centralising customer support and community, we have more people doing community work than we did before. Being co-located with the developers allows the information within the community groups to have a much more direct effect on the development process."
from http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-10-21-eurogamer-interviews-ccps-hilmar-petursson-interview
Thoughts? EVE Radio, bringing music to the masses
Purple Sabbath, with Xaphod; Sunday 12:00 game time. |
Cyniac
Twilight Star Rangers Black Thorne Alliance
27
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 16:08:00 -
[629] - Quote
I don't particularly find this reassuring.
As a fan of EVE I am holding any judgement on the future until I see the winter expansion. Words are not what I base my opinions on and so far I'm hearing nice words but I'd waiting for results.
However before coming to EVE I was (and still am) a die-hard fan of white-wolf in particular of the Masquerade. In this respect what has happened bites very very deep. From my point of view, you took something precious, filled it with your bloated ambitions and have left it lying by the roadside. Along the way you have terribly wounded, if not killed, something which was great. This is hugely frustrating.
However, I don't blame you. You tried to dream big and gave it a shot. You flew the flight of Icarus and fell back down to earth and are now feeling the pain. Odds are pretty good the pain is not over yet. I firmly believe though that if you have the option between trying to reach for the moon, and not doing anything at all, reaching for the moon is always the best option. Consequences can be brutal though.
Make EVE work. Learn to love EVE again. Then all will be better. |
Slippery Duke
F.A.R.T
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 16:15:00 -
[630] - Quote
Hilmar P+¬tursson: I feel very accountable for the situation and it's really hard to go through these steps in this way. We took on too many things as a company and our focus was spread too thin. These were very much the decisions that I as CEO made and supported, and I think everyone now agrees that we need to do these adjustments. That's a hard thing to realise, especially because people are hurt in the process. That's the reality.
This is a understatement of gross proportions maybe time to let some one else have the centre seat old chap.
Quote taken from http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-10-21-eurogamer-interviews-ccps-hilmar-petursson-interview |
|
Azelor Delaria
Error-404
57
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 16:16:00 -
[631] - Quote
Quote:Eurogamer: The statement you issued on October 5th was extremely candid. Since the release of Incarna we've seen two very different personae - that of the leaked e-mail, and then this statement. Can you talk a bit about your mindset and how it's changed between June and October?
Hilmar P+¬tursson: It's a danger of having gone from success to success for such a long time. We've consistently bucked the trend with Eve now for eight years. Eve as an initial creation was an almost impossible feat and we've carried that through the years, growing each year. It frankly made me arrogant and making a change to the game as we did over the summer - in the way that we did - led to taking a look at the whole company as a result. We've done a lot of retrospectives leading up to this moment and it's been an ongoing process ever since August/September.
I just realised that I needed to look more closely at myself and go back to a different time when we were closer to our products, making decisions more in line with their benefits - and not for the benefit of our very ambitious strategic plan.
Why did it take so long for him to realize he was the problem? Why did it take so long for the man who claims to be the CEO of the company so long to understand that his decisions are what led to this?
Quote:Eurogamer: The statement was so frank that it read as though you were about to announce your resignation. Did you ever consider that option?
Hilmar P+¬tursson: I absolutely considered that but I think that frankly it would have been an easy way out. Being accountable for this type of situation, leading the company into this position, it's also my responsibility to lead us out of it. I've had support from employees in doing that. I've now learned a life lesson from going through this and I hope that will make me a better CEO in the future.
Translation: I had no intention of leaving the company, since my incompetence ensured I would never find a job as a high-paid CEO in another company. Might as well cut other people off from our teat so I can keep my $1,000 Japanese designer jeans a week!
Quote:Eurogamer: What was your own reaction to the leaks when they began?
Hilmar P+¬tursson: CCP has always been run as a company where all information is available to everyone. Fearless [CCP's internal newsletter] is an example of that where we have public discussions about really hard questions. To see that turned on the company was very disappointing. But we can't make one incident completely change us.
Obviously the company was not on a great course at the time and we needed to do something about it - but this was not a good way to point that out. To use that as a tool against the company was really disappointing to see, especially for the people who make and participate in the discussions. It was sad to see that being turned on people. A strength of our culture is to be open about things and I don't think there's a lot of information at CCP that people don't have access to. It was sad to see that being turned around and used to damage the company.
Cool, cool. So, Hilmar, since we're on an "open and transparent company" binge right now, mind forking over your e-mails from the time this started to, oh...today? And don't leave out the ones demanding internal affairs "find and dispose of" the leak to save face. It won't work!
Quote:Eurogamer: Did you ever identify the people who were leaking?
Hilmar P+¬tursson: That's a very complicated question to answer because there are a lot of legal matters involved - so I would choose not to comment on that.
Translation: Yes. Do you think we're firing only the competent people who did nothing wrong? We're also firing competent people who give a damn about the players.
Quote:Eurogamer: Back in June, I wrote about the challenges of resolving these issues while having to assume that any discussions will enter the public domain. How did you manage the situation?
Hilmar P+¬tursson: A lot of the realigning has happened a few months after, in the middle of summer. I think everyone saw how much the information had been taken out of context, and everyone realised how damaging it can be, trying to fix the company in the public spotlight. Since then we have done a lot of introspective work where we have teams working on various development initiatives, talking about our challenges and what needs to improve.
That frankly has been a very inspirational process to see how people love the company and want to make it stronger by really being frank and open about their mistakes and where they see the company needing to restructure - because the communication is not flowing and teams are not being productive. That was a really inspiring moment where we saw a lot of people really applying themselves and getting to the bottom of everything that had been going on.
I found the underlined portion to be the most relevant in this entire article. We made it clear during out protests that we weren't going to take being lied to, and that we expected some form of transparency. We wanted Hilmar to answer to us, because like it or not, we, the players, are the equivalent to shareholders. We pay for the development. We pay the salaries. At the end of the day, we want a great product that we can be proud to say we use and show off to our friends.
However, we accepted that Fearless was an internal newsletter that did not speak for CCP's intentions. That's fine. What we accepted at the same time was that Hilmar's leaked memo was genuine and real, and he has come out since then and said, "Yes, that was me, and it's real." To come out and say the information presented - all of it was taken out of context is disingenuous and insulting the the intelligence of the players.
[cont.] |
Azelor Delaria
Error-404
57
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 16:25:00 -
[632] - Quote
[cont.]
It is clear that though Hilmar says "Yeah, I f*cked up", he has not truly come to understand this. This is a PR ploy, and it is clear the only reason he is doing this is because subscriptions did take a substantial hit. The loan had to be paid off, I understand that. But if the status quo in terms of subscriptions remained constant, then he shouldn't have been too worried. This mea culpa is simply a ploy, and nothing more.
As I have said from Day 1, this entire thing can be handled badly, or well. The CCP management has opted for lip service, thus taking the "bad" route. When it failed for them, they passed the blame to CCP Pann and her crew. They bit the bullet when they didn't want to, and try as they might they couldn't stop the angry masses. We wanted answers, we wanted the truth. Well, the truth is Hilmar screwed the pooch royally, and his employees have to pay for it in the end.
This is a classic example of the idiocy that is Hilmar. We have been taken along for a ride and told things we want to hear. They are "refocusing" on EVE they say, and at the same time they are laying off people who have, since the opening stages of this game, been with us to do it. How does this make sense?
If CCP Pann was incompetent, I'm sure she would have been gone long ago; the same with Fallout and crew. However, because the crap Hilmar et al. tried to shove down our throats through them didn't work, they are now seen as "obsolete". They were "fat that needed to be trimmed".
And because of this, we were made to look like the reason for the layoffs a few days ago. Hilmar's take on this hasn't changed, even in this: the players called him on his BS, they cancelled subscriptions, and so they had to stop development on another game to placate us. "It's because of them that people lost their jobs. I hope you're happy, players."
You know what? I'm not happy. You can put all the fixes you want into the next expansion. But will it matter in seven or eight months? Who knows. I'm not going to be happy until this wrong is righted, and you find yourself on the end of a pink slip.
Quote:Eurogamer: At the time of the Icelandic economic crisis in 2008, CCP issued a statement that Eve was protected and in good financial health. Is the game still profitable as a standalone investment?
Hilmar P+¬tursson: Absolutely, very much so. The business model of subscriptions in a thriving MMO like Eve is a very robust one so this was never the problem. How we handled Eve as a result of having very ambitious plans as a company is really what the failure was, and we're now addressing that by focusing our attention on Eve. The game itself is a robust entity.
The facts, and your recent actions, categorically deny what you're saying, and furthermore call you a liar to your face. |
Kengutsi Akira
73
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 16:42:00 -
[633] - Quote
Dodecapod wrote: Somehow, it all slowed way the f*** down and all we've seen of INCARNA is what I sincerely consider a BETA.
THEY considered it a BETA or "prototype" too
http://www.wodnews.net/Home/tabid/41/ctl/ArticleView/mid/401/articleId/69/New-WoD-MMO-info-from-The-Grand-Masquerade-UPDATED.aspx
Quote:Incarna is actually considered a prototype, the rendering engine that will ship with the MMO will be much more advanced.
(before the WoD/White Wolf dismantling)
What Mittani wants, Mittani gets, Mittani help us all
|
Slippery Duke
F.A.R.T
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 16:44:00 -
[634] - Quote
So essentially people were paying to beta test...... excusse me while i hit myself about the head with my keyboard |
Kengutsi Akira
74
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 16:49:00 -
[635] - Quote
Slippery Duke wrote:So essentially people were paying to beta test...... excusse me while i hit myself about the head with my keyboard
yessir, love the ppl that were supporting CCP and how they were saying it WASNT a Beta etc.
Hows that Kool Aid taste now?
What Mittani wants, Mittani gets, Mittani help us all
|
Abrazzar
218
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 17:11:00 -
[636] - Quote
Kengutsi Akira wrote:Slippery Duke wrote:So essentially people were paying to beta test...... excusse me while i hit myself about the head with my keyboard yessir, love the ppl that were supporting CCP and how they were saying it WASNT a Beta etc. Hows that Kool Aid taste now? It tastes a bit heavy of bitter almond.... Please visit your user settings to re-enable images. |
Markus Reese
Debitum Naturae RED.Legion
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 17:32:00 -
[637] - Quote
CCP, it is really good to see the reorganization. But of course horrible at the thought of people losing jobs. 20% is less than 100% though, and the statement about being commited to helping those that are being laid off to find new work I think really speaks alot about why people like me have stayed in eve for years. CCP represented a people company who cares about their work.
Of course like Hilmar said, this got lost over the past year or two, grand ideas that were just to big, and they are great. There are so many huge concepts that are more like betas in Eve. These last two months have started to show again that eve is once again about the player base drive over just the in house developments. In the past year and a half, the most enjoyment I had was with the live events, story and action molded by player interaction with the developers. There was no reward, no substancial goal, just all about the fun.
New Tier 3 battlecruisers, everything directed towards optimizing the player experience that already exists is quite the 180. Time dialation to make gameplay smooth and manageable is awesome. In my opinion, the TD offers more to eve than incarna. There are so many awesome things in eve, the optimization and progression back to sandbox will do more than any feature ever has.
Look forward to seeing what the next 3 years will bring, just remember, nobody knows what will make the game great than the people who play it! |
Asuri Kinnes
Adhocracy Incorporated Adhocracy
29
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 17:34:00 -
[638] - Quote
Cyniac wrote:a die-hard fan of white-wolf in particular of the Masquerade. In this respect what has happened bites very very deep. From my point of view, you took something precious, filled it with your bloated ambitions and have left it lying by the roadside. Along the way you have terribly wounded, if not killed, something which was great. This is hugely frustrating. Talk to anyone who was a fan of Ars Magica before WW got a-hold of it... Or the Ellison book re-issues... WW has been full of fail for 20 years (as far as I'm concerned...)
If you like 'em, more power to you, I was just worried they would come into CCP and change eve... Into WoD.... oh wait...
Wormholes: The *NEW* end game of Eve - Online: No Local. No Lag. No Blues (No Intell Channesl). No Blobs.
NEW FEATURE: NO INCARNA! |
Slippery Duke
F.A.R.T
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 18:01:00 -
[639] - Quote
Markus Reese wrote:
Look forward to seeing what the next 3 years will bring, just remember, Nobody knows what will make the game great than the people who play it!
I hope some one from CCP read this particular statement as its very very true
|
Azelor Delaria
Error-404
57
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 18:10:00 -
[640] - Quote
Asuri Kinnes wrote:Cyniac wrote:a die-hard fan of white-wolf in particular of the Masquerade. In this respect what has happened bites very very deep. From my point of view, you took something precious, filled it with your bloated ambitions and have left it lying by the roadside. Along the way you have terribly wounded, if not killed, something which was great. This is hugely frustrating. Talk to anyone who was a fan of Ars Magica before WW got a-hold of it... Or the Ellison book re-issues... WW has been full of fail for 20 years (as far as I'm concerned...) If you like 'em, more power to you, I was just worried they would come into CCP and change eve... Into WoD.... oh wait...
WoD was just tabletop Twilight and nothing more. It's why I never encouraged anyone who played it. People always told me, "World of Darkness is far superior to Dungeons and Dragons in every way!" When I asked for specifics, they'd of course not give me any.
You go play Sparkly Tabletop Vampires. I'll be over here being more nerdy and kicking ass with my Warmage. |
|
Jacob Menard
Pure Evil Warriors The Devil's Warrior Alliance
7
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 18:13:00 -
[641] - Quote
I think instead of releasing those people, they should have redirected their efforts toward the team that is working on "the little things" and various bugs that have plagued EVE for years. That many people could have brought about some significant improvements to the entire EVE game. Imagine what the server/network team could do with an extra dozen helping, or the ones working on that huge list of acknowledged bugs/improvements in the CSM thread. If they truly want to get back to the roots of the game, they need to keep all of those people and focus their efforts on the things that are wrong with the game and how to incorporate them into the future expansions. |
The Old Chap
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
20
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 19:02:00 -
[642] - Quote
I think CCP made a good call here. Let's hope it's enough to keep the investors happy.
I lost my job in the last year too, as part of the UK public sector cuts. So I understand something of what you guys in Atlanta must be going through. Look forward, and don't look back. If you do look back, remember the good times.
Those ****** greedy investment bankers have a lot to answer for. Look into my eyes...-á-á and tighten that sphincter, kid. |
Radix Salvilines
Massive PVPness EntroPraetorian Aegis
15
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 20:59:00 -
[643] - Quote
"We will look at what they do, not what they say" (something like that)......
I so much laugh at that now
WAHWAHWAHWAHWAHWAHWAHWAH!!!!
Ive quit and am back now. I will quit again if you guys CCP mess up again. This is not WOW, EVE players are big intelligent boys so play nice from now on. You now know the consequences :)
Oh and... microtransactions (nex store) - this one is still what you need to fix... |
Amun Khonsu
Royal Order of Security Specialists
6
|
Posted - 2011.10.21 22:05:00 -
[644] - Quote
Quote:Our subscriber numbers are higher today than they were a year ago. Unlike many other MMO's on the market, we have continued to grow year-on-year since launch in 2003. However, over the past two months, our subscribers have gone down from their peak this summer. We attribute this to our own mistakes and poor communications with our players. We are correcting that now. - CCP Announcement
Once you lose consumer trust, it is nearly impossible to regain that back.
I hope that CCP will not just look at people as players, but consumers. A player, you can kick, ban, suspend, tell off, troll, IGNORE, etc. Consumers pay the bills and make this product called EVE what it is and a success.
CCP consumer relations from bottom up, from communication to compaints (petitions) and feedback, needs a revamp and CCP should aadopt more of a consumerism mindset over a gaming mindset since it is after all selling us a product. Otherwise the consumers will speak by cancelling subscriptions as has been noticed recently and mentioned above.
You can have a great product, but if that product has substandard support, or the company takes its consumers for granted, or fails to hear the voice of consumer feedback, people will move on to something else.
I see CCP addressing some of these issues and look forward to the new changes.
Fight them until turmoil is no more and strike terror into their hearts. |
Sassums
Wormhole Exploration Crew Transmission Lost
15
|
Posted - 2011.10.22 00:07:00 -
[645] - Quote
"As we reexamine our outward relations, we are also taking time to reevaluate our internal goals. In doing so, we have come to the conclusion that we are attempting too many things for a company our size. Developing EVE expansions, DUST 514 and World of Darkness has stretched our resources too thin.
Rather than allowing this to persist, we have made the decision to sharpen our focus. Sadly, this means reducing our staff. We estimate that around twenty percent of global positions will be affected by this process. These will be predominantly in our Atlanta, GA office, although select positions in our Reykjavik, Iceland office will be affected."
How the heck does that make any sense at all? If you are biting off more than you can handle, you either normally reduce what you are up to, or hire more staff. But firing them seems entirely counter productive.
Whats going on here? |
Ranzabar
Ranzabar's Salvage and Protection Services Inc.
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.22 02:04:00 -
[646] - Quote
Unemployment sucks |
Kengutsi Akira
77
|
Posted - 2011.10.22 05:01:00 -
[647] - Quote
Azelor Delaria wrote:
WoD was just tabletop Twilight and nothing more. It's why I never encouraged anyone who played it. People always told me, "World of Darkness is far superior to Dungeons and Dragons in every way!" When I asked for specifics, they'd of course not give me any.
You go play Sparkly Tabletop Vampires. I'll be over here being more nerdy and kicking ass with my Warmage.
Nice revisionist history you got there...
Quote:release of the first novel, Twilight, in 2005
Quote:In 1992, Vampire: The Masquerade won the Origins Award for Best Roleplaying Rules of 1991
Dude for Vampire the masquerade to be tabletop twilight, thered have to be a time machine involved What Mittani wants, Mittani gets, Mittani help us all
|
Florestan Bronstein
The Waterworks
123
|
Posted - 2011.10.22 15:01:00 -
[648] - Quote
reposting my comment from the "fire Hilmar naow" thread:
The Method Man wrote:How is that an answer? Guys I messed up and TWENTY PERCENT OF MY COMPANY HAD TO GO but I want to clean up my own mess. Seriously?
Guys I messed up and TWENTY PERCENT OF MY COMPANY HAD TO GO but don't worry, here is some ex-Cryptic/Sony/Turbine/... manager to replace me.
I am sure you would be delighted with that answer.
We have no idea how much of that layoff is really due to failure by CCP's executives and how much is due to external circumstances changing. All we know is that the shareholders are still happy enough with Hilmar to keep him as CEO. Why don't you blame the investors/shareholders for being unwilling to inject additional cash to fund WoD development?
(if you threaten to fire a CEO every time he has to lay off people, you won't see any hiring sprees either - keep in mind that during 2010 CCP's employee count increased by 155 heads (which is a crazy +38%); if laying people off is unacceptable, you will either have to settle for much less dynamic growth or you have to increase out-sourcing/contracting during good times) |
Kengutsi Akira
80
|
Posted - 2011.10.22 15:11:00 -
[649] - Quote
Ex-Cryptic? Oh god tell me its not Bill Roper O.o Ex-Sony too? Well, he/she'll do well here, they have experience in destroying popular games What Mittani wants, Mittani gets, Mittani help us all
|
John'eh
Asteroid Belt Protection Services
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.22 17:24:00 -
[650] - Quote
Astrid Stjerna wrote:[quote=John'eh]
How....
what's the word....?
Arrogant?
Its not arrogance if you are correct.
And no, i don't think I know everything; But I sure as hell know more than Hilmar at this point, and I think I could be of value to the company and to Eve.
|
|
C4LYP50
Solarwind Interstellar Mining and Production Ltd
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.23 10:02:00 -
[651] - Quote
Bratwurst0r wrote:Mr Epeen wrote:What a perfect example of what happens when a game company starts pandering to the whiny demands of the vocal minority. I hope they learned a lesson from this. Mr Epeen You hope they learned a lesson from what? What they do now is the lesson they learned, and its because of what you call a "vocal minority". And you, the "vocal troll" who always said the "vocal minority" can't change anything, should be rather quiet now, because you don't look that good in the light of things. Maybe YOU should learn your lesson for a change.
This. 100% correct, and THEN some. Fanboi should know when to stay quiet.
OT: I was saddened to hear about the redundancies, and my heart goes out to you guys. Sadly, I have to say, I still feel that if a 200+ page threadnaught didn't convince you that you were onto a bad course......you can't blame the players who spoke with their wallets. Someone practically DARED them to leave, There was fair warning. |
Slippery Duke
F.A.R.T
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.23 12:11:00 -
[652] - Quote
Hopefully this is not a bad case of, to little to late |
Kengutsi Akira
83
|
Posted - 2011.10.23 14:15:00 -
[653] - Quote
C4LYP50 wrote:
OT: I was saddened to hear about the redundancies, and my heart goes out to you guys. Sadly, I have to say, I still feel that if a 200+ page threadnaught didn't convince you that you were onto a bad course......you can't blame the players who spoke with their wallets. Someone practically DARED them to leave, There was fair warning.
Quote:Having the perspective of having done this for a decade, I can tell you that this is one of the moments where we look at what our players do and less of what they say. Innovation takes time to set in and the predictable reaction is always to resist change.
Hilmar's arrogance washes my hands clean of any wrongdoing imo
We should really stop calling it FiS
Dammit there is no FiS its Called EVE. Especially now that WiS is "back burnere"ed |
Sylthi
Coreward Pan-Galactic Holy Empire of The Unshaven
5
|
Posted - 2011.10.24 01:15:00 -
[654] - Quote
Has everyone gone over and read the EUROgamer interview by now? If you haven't you should.
The interview.
It clearly shows a completely unchanged and unrepentant Hilmar. I mean sure, he says a lot of pretty things, and says he's learned his lesson, and then turns around in the same breath and it's the same old Hillmar.
Case in point: In his "appology blog", he says "just wait, we have great things comeing for you this winter." Now, in his interview its "Well, don't get your expectationts too high for this winter, its just all the leftover stuff we had in the pipes anyway, because the good stuff is coming at or after fan-fest! Hmmmm, maybe next summer since I don't know if we could actually get to any meaningful work by the spring..... Our schedules are pretty tight with all the corporate sponsored vacations and all..... But, all you guys have to do is give us ANOTHER 6 months AFTER the 6 months you've already given us after the debacle! You know, just keep giving us the fair market purchase price of a new game or two every 6 months, and we might everntually get around to giving you a working one 10 years after launch. We PROMISE, we'll change! You'll see!"
Pathetic.
I honestly don't know why I'm still here. No this isn't a emo-rage quit post, so don't bother jumping on my ass about it trolls, I won't read your posts anyway. I am just saying..... as a 8 or more year vet, I seriously look around, and see no reason to stay with the exception of the friends I've made in Eve. But, most of them have already moved on to other games with me, or I with them. So, again, why am I still here? Why are ANY of you still here? Blind optomism I suppose......
Back to my hole.
Peace all. |
Kengutsi Akira
89
|
Posted - 2011.10.24 03:47:00 -
[655] - Quote
Quote:"Even now, higher-ups still talk down on players," the insider told me, "and say we have just hit a bump because some bad players refuse to see the awesomeness of our vision. We're told that it is not our fault."
"Even now, higher-ups still talk down on players," the insider told me, "and say we have just hit a bump because some bad players refuse to see the awesomeness of our vision. We're told that it is not our fault." Guess they DONT learn |
Roldanus
Black Anvil Industries Deadly Unknown
6
|
Posted - 2011.10.24 06:01:00 -
[656] - Quote
There are LOT OF CORPS AND ALLIANCES supporting DUST514 and other smart and profitable ideas from CCP.
CSM will not answer this. Please CCP engage the right people on this, we will make your game more profitable and FUN at the same time. Spoiled kids from rogue alliances will not complain anymore. FOR SURE.
Roldanus |
Paxamarria
Pi Omega Omega
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.24 14:35:00 -
[657] - Quote
Just to set the stage. CCP employs 600+ staff. See press kit information. 20% of 600 is 120.
I don't understand how letting 120 people go will help CCP focus on Eve. According to their press kit brochure page 7 they had a 100,000 subscriber increase from 2008 to 2009. However the latest announcement indicates a drop in numbers over the summer. Did the numbers drop that significantly? I would suggest the reason is simply people are probably out enjoying the weather, but I still can't imagine that many are leaving. Nevertheless, I cannot see any other reasons to let 120 people go unless CCP needs to make budget cuts, otherwise why wouldn't you just redirect their efforts elsewhere? I see CCP still advertises job openings. I don't see a hiring freeze. What's up CCP?
|
jason hill
Clan Shadow Wolf Fatal Ascension
16
|
Posted - 2011.10.26 19:30:00 -
[658] - Quote
for those getting the chop the company i work for is recruiting for devs & testers ..and others ... heres the link logica |
Le Verde
Aion LLC
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.27 18:10:00 -
[659] - Quote
no mention of the off-line skill training malarky, no mention that they wont stop changing game mechanics to suit newer players no mention that they would try to retain their elder player base just some rubbish about new players numbers up and some whining about firing people... no mention of any fixes but lots of propaganda on change, yawn yawn yawn,
hilmar p+¬tursson blow me !!! |
Le Verde
Aion LLC
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.27 18:17:00 -
[660] - Quote
p.s no subscriber for less than 5 years should be allowed anywhere near csm ..... |
|
Kengutsi Akira
Ministry of War Amarr Empire
133
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 02:35:00 -
[661] - Quote
Le Verde wrote:p.s no subscriber for less than 5 years should be allowed anywhere near csm .....
True, we dont want to know what new players think
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=255722#post255722
My well known stance on WiS |
Mekela
Vinyl Roid
23
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 03:17:00 -
[662] - Quote
You should take a break your trolling is getting boring.
PS just to troll the troll - I demand the WiS be the only thing CCP works on. |
Tanaka Sekigahara
United Space Marine Corp
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 08:23:00 -
[663] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:Anyone that sees this as a good thing is not seeing what this really is. - CCP is having financial issues. - They also realized that the technology they bet the vampire farm on, that they couldn't deliver WiS with can't scale to an actual MMO game at this point in time. It was too resource intensive at a minimum, maybe other issues as well. - They still believe consoles are a cash cow that will save them and DUST 514 is based on known technology, so they can deliver that. - CCP did not ADD resources to EVE, they cut resources overall. This wasn't a "we will move 80% of our vampire wranglers to deliver WiS for example, or teach them how to makes FiS stuff". This is we are chopping up decks on our steamship to throw into the fire to keep the pumps running. So, glad they are cutting their losses on a project that exceeded their ability to grasp and they are trying to win our "hearts and minds" with some PR spinnage but this is not time to celebrate. This is time to ask if the sudden listing of the decks towards the bow might be something other than the ship surfing on some knarly waves like the captain just announced. Does the listing and the water up to our ankles have something to do with the second announcment that we have a new supply of fresh ice for our blender drinks?! Issler This
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yG5e1oaen-M
|
vagy
Shadows Of The Federation
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 18:50:00 -
[664] - Quote
Hilmaaaar!!! I want INCARNAAAA!!! I dont care about the different captain quarters. I want stations with all the people inside them!! and all that other **** that was promised AND shown |
Chi Ftele
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2011.11.03 14:47:00 -
[665] - Quote
don't go devs! you got a lot more work to do!
|
HELIC0N ONE
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
13
|
Posted - 2011.11.05 16:41:00 -
[666] - Quote
vagy wrote:Hilmaaaar!!! I want INCARNAAAA!!! I dont care about the different captain quarters. I want stations with all the people inside them!! and all that other **** that was promised AND shown
Incarna demonstrated that the Carbon engine was barely capable of displaying a single avatar sitting on a couch and scratching its ass without causing your PC to burst into flames. Even if CCP went full speed ahead with avatar development, you'd be waiting a long time, and CCP can't afford to keep their playerbase waiting that long for content.
|
Soulpirate
State War Academy Caldari State
22
|
Posted - 2011.11.07 21:59:00 -
[667] - Quote
HELIC0N ONE wrote:vagy wrote:Hilmaaaar!!! I want INCARNAAAA!!! I dont care about the different captain quarters. I want stations with all the people inside them!! and all that other **** that was promised AND shown Incarna demonstrated that the Carbon engine was barely capable of displaying a single avatar sitting on a couch and scratching its ass without causing your PC to burst into flames. Even if CCP went full speed ahead with avatar development, you'd be waiting a long time, and CCP can't afford to keep their playerbase waiting that long for content. WTH are you people trying to run EVE on?
My system is 5 years old and the CQ didn't challenge it one bit.
Advice,
A - Open up your box and blow the cat hair-balls out.
or..
B - Stop trying to run 5 pilots on one computer and then blame the CQ.
|
Mrs Sooperdudespaceman
Loud On The Forums Silent In Game
7
|
Posted - 2011.11.15 11:54:00 -
[668] - Quote
I misread the title of the thread as 'CCP Focuses On Eve University'. Damn my eyes. |
Ka P'lah
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2011.11.23 01:48:00 -
[669] - Quote
Brunaburh wrote:I hope that the people losing their jobs in this difficult economic climate are able to rebound quickly.
Although as an EVE player I am happy to see CCP focus, it is still a difficult thing to see people lose their jobs.
^^ hear hear |
Ka P'lah
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2011.11.23 04:10:00 -
[670] - Quote
Asuri Kinnes wrote:Oberine Noriepa wrote:EDIT: ^ You, too! Xiaodown wrote:~~~ CCP ATL EMPLOYEES: ~~~The software shop I work for is looking for developers, and we have positions open in Atlanta (Duluth / Suwanee area), as well as Southwestern Virginia (about 5-6 hours from ATL). We're primarily interested in .NET, Java, Python, and PHP devs. I think it's possible we may have some design positions, but not in any 3d space (no animation, motion capture, etc). We compete in the cloud industry. Message me with inquiries; I'll make a point to check gate.eve throughout the day. On second thought, I set up an email alias: [email protected] so that you don't have to use work resources to inquire about employment. Heh. You rock! heheheheh... keep posting this, keep it on top. :)
Good idea |
|
Rek Seven
Probe Patrol Project Wildfire
48
|
Posted - 2011.11.24 16:28:00 -
[671] - Quote
I've seen a few people say that EVE is having financial problems. I this true?
If so i find it strange that their solution to this would be to focus on old content. Don't get me wrong, i all for improvements to the existing game but i also want to see the game move forward.
I tried to get three friends in total but they all say pretty much the same thing; the UI is horrible, missions are boring, everyone is way better than me, i don't want a second job, when is this door in my CQ going to open? etc.
I'm glad that resources are being reallocated to improve the game i'm playing for but that will not see a significant increase in revenue. I very much doubt that Dust 514 will be the savior of EVE either.
The one thing that had real potential to inject some life into the game was Incarna and now that's being shelved?! The idea that there would be some new content in the game that would allow me to operate on the same level as the vets of the game is what made me decide to subscribe. Now the only future for me in this game involves doing the same old stuff i've been doing for the past year and a half but oh look, we now have new nebula and turrets.
How lnog do you think it will be before another developer comes along and improves on EVE's formula? You know that a Mass Effect MMO is already in the works right?
Your focus should be:
Improve/fix all the little things people have been complaining about for years (e.g. FW, bounties, POS mechanics, UI overhaul etc.) Redesign Incarna to be a game within eve.
|
Nathan'Scope' McAllen
m3 Corp
0
|
Posted - 2011.11.28 23:51:00 -
[672] - Quote
(Posting as the last alt that is still awaiting sub expiration)
Losing 20% of your employees hurts. Best wishes to those out to find new jobs. Perhaps you folks should bring a good alternative to EVE Online? (It could probably be programmed in flash and be competition.)
The CCP hilmar interview looks like any CEO interview. Stick to his actions, not his words is all I say.
Firing well known personell that in my opinion did a fairly good job for the community is another step to the end of New Eden. Until I am confident the content has been fixed and gameplay is again as entertaining as when i started playing a couple years ago, I won't return.
Good luck CCP, I don't think you are quite on the right track yet. |
Wot I Think
State War Academy Caldari State
97
|
Posted - 2011.12.06 04:16:00 -
[673] - Quote
Nathan'Scope' McAllen wrote:(Posting as the last alt that is still awaiting sub expiration)
Losing 20% of your employees hurts. Best wishes to those out to find new jobs. Perhaps you folks should bring a good alternative to EVE Online? (It could probably be programmed in flash and be competition.)
The CCP hilmar interview looks like any CEO interview. Stick to his actions, not his words is all I say.
Firing well known personell that in my opinion did a fairly good job for the community is another step to the end of New Eden. Until I am confident the content has been fixed and gameplay is again as entertaining as when i started playing a couple years ago, I won't return.
Good luck CCP, I don't think you are quite on the right track yet.
Old Jimmy says stop cryin' baby. or else he'll give you a proper spanking, |
Sieges
University of Caille Gallente Federation
3
|
Posted - 2011.12.07 16:31:00 -
[674] - Quote
This is the best news I read all year. Thank you for keeping EVE going and investing in our future. I've been here nearly 6 years and EVE is the only game I play (other than DragonVale on my iPhone ). Spaceships + Persistent Universe = MMORPG awesomeness.
I hope to be able to stay here the rest of my gaming life |
leavwiz
Firestorm Tactical Research and Development
33
|
Posted - 2011.12.20 15:39:00 -
[675] - Quote
perhaps the almost daily client updates and patches since the release of crucible should be sending the message that either you let the wrong people go, or you are still spread too thin to do quality work in eve online. |
Seewong
PILGRIMS Insane Asylum
0
|
Posted - 2011.12.21 05:28:00 -
[676] - Quote
leavwiz wrote:perhaps the almost daily client updates and patches since the release of crucible should be sending the message that either you let the wrong people go, or you are still spread too thin to do quality work in eve online.
Perhaps you should get a better life, since you're whining about a simple hour and half update that sometimes happens each day to make the game better for YOU!! Been with Eve a long time and its the only truly great game that makes it self better and better. Good work guys. The new nebulas are blowin my mind!!!!
|
ClusterFook
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
10
|
Posted - 2011.12.28 01:35:00 -
[677] - Quote
Seewong wrote:leavwiz wrote:perhaps the almost daily client updates and patches since the release of crucible should be sending the message that either you let the wrong people go, or you are still spread too thin to do quality work in eve online. Perhaps you should get a better life, since you're whining about a simple hour and half update that sometimes happens each day to make the game better for YOU!! Been with Eve a long time and its the only truly great game that makes it self better and better. Good work guys. The new nebulas are blowin my mind!!!!
Wow Seewong, Leawiz's comment went right over your head didn't it? Reading comp fail. Perhaps Seewong you should "get a better life" since you seem to not be able to handle criticism of a game you enjoy. But i cannot lie the fact you missed the point of his comment completely then proceed to flame on a faulty premise there by revealing how you can not understand simple concepts is well... quite enjoyable, almost as good as tearz. Thank you. |
Tommy Laughingface
Sumo Udon Soba
12
|
Posted - 2011.12.29 03:53:00 -
[678] - Quote
CCP is probebly the best MMO developer and manager out there. And yet people desire for the better and better... |
Seewong
PILGRIMS Insane Asylum
2
|
Posted - 2011.12.31 03:22:00 -
[679] - Quote
ClusterFook you have no idea what your talking about. Yes please please dont talk bad about EVE to me on forums for i get MADDD!!!. I understood leavwiz comment completely, I just disagree wholeheartedly, its short-sighted and naive. Some simple updates is not a valid criticism that CCP doesnt have their cajones together. Any time you do a big update for a software program your going to have issues, especially one as complex as EVE. So someone whinning about some patches and then another person defending he/she with nothing but mindless banter baffles me. |
Doc Fury
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
79
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Posted - 2011.12.31 03:37:00 -
[680] - Quote
What!!?
CCP why you unsticky this thread?
Good stuffs here.
The accumulated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the ho's and politicians will look up and shout 'Save us!' and I'll look down, and whisper 'no.' |
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vagy
Shadows Of The Federation Drunk 'n' Disorderly
1
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Posted - 2012.02.19 09:08:00 -
[681] - Quote
HELIC0N ONE wrote:vagy wrote:Hilmaaaar!!! I want INCARNAAAA!!! I dont care about the different captain quarters. I want stations with all the people inside them!! and all that other **** that was promised AND shown Incarna demonstrated that the Carbon engine was barely capable of displaying a single avatar sitting on a couch and scratching its ass without causing your PC to burst into flames. Even if CCP went full speed ahead with avatar development, you'd be waiting a long time, and CCP can't afford to keep their playerbase waiting that long for content.
I know it's probably impossible to do. But do you think I care? IT WAS PROMISSED. It should be possible to do in some way - maybe limiting the number of players walking around in one station or place. I dont know. It's not my job. |
Degren
The Scope Gallente Federation
32
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Posted - 2012.02.19 10:53:00 -
[682] - Quote
Decent necro |
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