| Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 .. 17 :: one page |
| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 3 post(s) |
Zippy Pinno
   |
Posted - 2005.12.12 23:53:00 -
[91]
Yes Please for a AF mkII project.
The poor Wolf needs CPU and PG to plug the gaping double hole in its armor (or a resist bonus).
The Jag needs a mid.
Yeah i know its been said allready - i just wanted to vote.
|
Red Horseman
|
Posted - 2005.12.13 00:13:00 -
[92]
Vengeance would benefit more from a midslot than a lowslot. Right now my low configuraton on my vengeance is rep/thermal passive hardener/heat sink (or cpr, depending on what mood im in). It could definitely benefit from another midslot, so you could fit ab/web/scramble/tracking disruptor or other gizmo. It would give the vengeance a niche and make at least one khanid ship not suck.
|
Kai Lae
|
Posted - 2005.12.13 00:32:00 -
[93]
If the vengeance got the 5% per resist per armor level, and a additional low slot, it could tank quite well. Three mids are enough to have a scrambler, speed module, and jammer/something else, especially on a armor tanked ship.
|
Damien Vox
|
Posted - 2005.12.13 00:33:00 -
[94]
As a specializing AF pilot I beg CCP to fix the AF's with a 4th bonus and please, please give the Jag and Wolf more grid/cpu.
|
Weirda
|
Posted - 2005.12.13 01:23:00 -
[95]
Edited by: Weirda on 13/12/2005 01:26:33
 Originally by: Kai Lae
If the vengeance got the 5% per resist per armor level, and a additional low slot, it could tank quite well. Three mids are enough to have a scrambler, speed module, and jammer/something else, especially on a armor tanked ship.
If it got the resist bonus - it could armor tank extremely well without another low. 
as someone who (trys) to fly vengeance regularly... it could benefit WAY more from a mid. for the love of God! 
an armor tanking ship with some extra mids? hello! a few have seen the light. 
Originally by: Vox
As a specializing AF pilot I beg CCP to fix the AF's with a 4th bonus and please, please give the Jag and Wolf more grid/cpu.
Agree with the Jag - Wolf is way short on cpu too - but have done well with faction plates (they're cheap)... and am hoping with the new passive armor resist skills in RMR, the faction plate will be enough (training kin/ex first... for my wolf). 
TBH though - Weirda really like the Jag/Vengeance better then the Wolf/Retribution. That may change with the new passive skills (at least with the Wolf - that is the least of the Retri's problem)... 
_____________
Thread Killer
Give Assault Ship Missing Bonus in RMR!
OMG Tux/Ouveur/TomB hate Weirda! EGO Nerfed!!! |
keepiru
|
Posted - 2005.12.13 02:30:00 -
[96]
Originally by: Weirda
an armor tanking ship with some extra mids? hello! a few have seen the light.
Only if it got a big cap boost. Otherwise I'd much rather have another low. In fact, I'd much rather have 4 lows than 4 mids *anyway*, but 4 mids would make it unique id guess... still good > unique and unique != good.
Guess I havent quite completely seen the light yet... 
-------------
Where is the gistii a-type armor equivalent?
|
Walok
|
Posted - 2005.12.13 06:03:00 -
[97]
/signed for de-gimping of AFs (especially Amarr, come on)
Quote:
I kill people. (and make signatures for 10mil ISK, EVE-Mail me.)
|
Necrologic
|
Posted - 2005.12.13 06:11:00 -
[98]
the vengeance should have a 4th med because giving it another low or any sort of tanking bonus will make it WAY to much like the retrib. Med, dmg bonus, and mass reduction is what we need.
|
Liet Traep
|
Posted - 2005.12.13 11:28:00 -
[99]
Originally by: Weirda
Originally by: LUKEC
Since the day that i'm using enyo with mwd & blasters... i think jaguar & ACs should perform excellent as a heavy tackler... But i cannot fly them(although i know where to get em for almost 0isk)...
Vengeance with current resists cannot be shieldtanked, so it doesn't really need medslots as 3 is enough. Another low and a bit pg, so it could fit med. beamsII, missile launcher and small repper... and it could actually be useful :)
But in the end all AFs should get ~20% more hp and 20% more cap.
the extra mid request on the vengeance is for more toys - not a shield tank...
it would just really sadden weirda to see the vengeance get another low... with 3 lows for tanking - it is great with its current resists. it lacks cpu to fit it as currently, and grid to fit the beams that you should be fitting on it (since it only carry three). again... weirdas opinion flying them... that extra mid would really give it a role - the khanid can pretend that the mid is there for shield tanking, but we all know better... 
I fit my vengeance as a heavy tackler. 3 dual light beam 2's, small nos. mwd, webber, scrambler and some sort of tank in the lows. I fiddle with that bit.
It's damage is so low though that I just use it in fleet ops as a tackler. It's tough enough to take a pounding from most inties. With a damage bonus it'd be a great all around ship.
Best solution I can see for it is maybe give it another low slot for added tanking or damage mod. Still won't be as tough or hard hitting as a retribution but it'd give it a little more flexibility and make it more survivable and useful. Sort of like an eensy-weensy, baby apoc. But green. 
|
Blackest Sheep
|
Posted - 2005.12.13 12:55:00 -
[100]
Originally by: Necrologic
the vengeance should have a 4th med because giving it another low or any sort of tanking bonus will make it WAY to much like the retrib. Med, dmg bonus, and mass reduction is what we need.
Yep. And the bonus to lasers, please.
|
Weirda
|
Posted - 2005.12.13 20:11:00 -
[101]
Originally by: Blackest Sheep
Originally by: Necrologic
the vengeance should have a 4th med because giving it another low or any sort of tanking bonus will make it WAY to much like the retrib. Med, dmg bonus, and mass reduction is what we need.
Yep. And the bonus to lasers, please.
still think resistance bonus would be ****, but either will do... as long as we get another mid on there...
_____________
Thread Killer
Give Assault Ship Missing Bonus in RMR!
OMG Tux/Ouveur/TomB hate Weirda! EGO Nerfed!!! |
keepiru
|
Posted - 2005.12.13 20:16:00 -
[102]
A vengeance with 4 mids and no dmg bonus will be just as **** as it is now.
-------------
Where are the missile damage implants? ;)
|
Kaylana Syi
|
Posted - 2005.12.13 21:28:00 -
[103]
Originally by: keepiru
A vengeance with 4 mids and no dmg bonus will be just as **** as it is now.
i like 4 mids on armor tanks because i like : ab(mwd)/web/scram/cap charger for pvp or ab/web/2xcap rechargers on npc
Originally by: "Oveur"
I don't react to threats any better than you do
|
Phelan Lore
|
Posted - 2005.12.13 22:58:00 -
[104]
Keep the thread going! Can we get a dev reply?!
I'll throw my bonuses in (many probably suggested before in this and other threads)...
All: 20% reduction in mass
Minmatar
-Wolf: 5% damage changed to 10%
-Jaguar: +1 midslot, +30 CPU, 5% velocity per level
Gallente
-Ishkur: 5% MWD cap bonus
-Enyo: 7.5% rep bonus
Caldari
-Harpy: 5% tracking
-Hawk: +1 mid, +2 launcher HPs, +20 CPU, 5% shield resist per level, optimal changed to missile velocity
Amarr
-Retribution: 5% armor resists per level
-Vengeance: +1 mid, +10 grid and +20 CPU, 5% damage
|
Kai Lae
|
Posted - 2005.12.14 00:28:00 -
[105]
Edited by: Kai Lae on 14/12/2005 00:30:30
On a different but related topic, what about looking at medium beams. The amount of grid to use these is ludicrous. I see these more on battleships for anti-frig defense than actually on frigates. This not being a really viable weapons choice is an indirect nerf to amarr AF.
I still say low slot to the vengeance. If the bonuses were changed to replace optimal with 5% damage, and armor resists, I'd guess this would be a quite interesting setup:
3x Pulse II, 1x Rocket II
Web, MWD II, scram
2x HS II, energized thermic membrane, SAR II
I haven't checked to see if that would fit, so maybe you'd need a MAPC. At any rate I suspect it would be quite good.
Edit: Also, if CCP actually listens to us (gasp!) these ships will need more CPU/grid (depending on what slot is added) to ensure that it can be filled.
|
Ante
|
Posted - 2005.12.14 03:56:00 -
[106]
For the Vengeance what about an increase in both grid + cpu, an extra mid and a 10% optimal range per level bonus? Would be nice if it could use 3x Medium Beam Laser IIs yes?
|
Blackest Sheep
|
Posted - 2005.12.14 09:06:00 -
[107]
Edited by: Blackest Sheep on 14/12/2005 09:07:34
Originally by: Ante
For the Vengeance what about an increase in both grid + cpu, an extra mid and a 10% optimal range per level bonus? Would be nice if it could use 3x Medium Beam Laser IIs yes?
Without a damage bonus it will still not deal a lot of damage. You mean raising the bonus to 20% overall, since it has 10% from the AF skill already?
I fail to see why CCP did not do the armor resistances like those of HACs. AFs are the first step for many beginning players into the wonderful t2 world. Make this step more worthwhile, please.
Keepiru, is there still space left in your sig?
|
Ante
|
Posted - 2005.12.14 11:39:00 -
[108]
Originally by: Blackest Sheep
Without a damage bonus it will still not deal a lot of damage. You mean raising the bonus to 20% overall, since it has 10% from the AF skill already?
I realise having two optimal range bonuses would still leave it lacking damage. However if it were able to mount 3 med beam IIs it would have an optimal range of ~15km with multifreq crystals.
On second thought if you were to give the Vengeance a second optimal range bonus it might make more sense to give it a fouth low slot instead of a fourth mid. I was thinking it would be nice to give medium beam IIs a 5% rof bonus but you would either have to apply the bonus specifically to beam lasers or nerf the ship in some other aspect to accommodate the extra damage.
Also I realise the devs are against rof bonuses for frigs but given the slow rof of beams it might be deemed ok.
|
Ghoest
|
Posted - 2005.12.14 14:36:00 -
[109]
Most of you just ask for too much.
Hawks should have 2 more missle slots - mainly so we have at least 1 missle AF.
The rest of the changes you want are balance changes and I think you want to much.
|
Kai Lae
|
Posted - 2005.12.14 14:39:00 -
[110]
No T2 ship has more than 4 bonuses. Hell AF only have 3 real ones. So that's a non starter. Frankly, IMO, CCP needs to look at the grid fitting for medium beams (as they said that they would). If that was done with a 4th low slot you could go with a MAPC, and likely fairly easily fit 3 of them. I however think that in general the "damage" AF work better as long range boats, and the "utility" (in general) work better as the short range type. That's why I'd investigate removing the optimal bonus totally and replacing it with damage, and then adding in 5% armor resists (mini sac, which tanks pretty well).
|
Kai Lae
|
Posted - 2005.12.14 14:41:00 -
[111]
Originally by: Ghoest
The rest of the changes you want are balance changes and I think you want to much.
Changing the missile slots is a balance change. On another note, could you care to explain why you don't think that AF are underpowered, especially with regards to the ships with only 11 slots, and therefore why they're fine as is.
|
Jon Xylur
|
Posted - 2005.12.14 14:43:00 -
[112]
Why would Ishkur get an MWD bonus? It's a drone ship and doesn't work that well with blasters (optimal bonus=for rails, falloff bonus=blasters). More drone range woudl eb far better for it. Uberkur FTW!
|
Kaylana Syi
|
Posted - 2005.12.14 15:10:00 -
[113]
Originally by: Kai Lae
Edited by: Kai Lae on 14/12/2005 00:30:30
On a different but related topic, what about looking at medium beams. The amount of grid to use these is ludicrous. I see these more on battleships for anti-frig defense than actually on frigates. This not being a really viable weapons choice is an indirect nerf to amarr AF.
Considering that the 720mm howie is a better battleship gun than a cruiser/battlecruiser I don't sympathize. Infact, Beams might be small guns but they output like lowerend cruiser guns more than they do frigate guns. And they work well on cruisers.
As it stands it is more balanced than you realized. Medium Beam Laser IIs are almost as good as Dual 180mm II autocannons and hit pretty much the same range point. Why do you think a lot of minmatar use them on ruptures and stabbers? An AF with a full rack of beams would just be plain sick DoT.
Originally by: "Oveur"
I don't react to threats any better than you do
|
Mesasone
|
Posted - 2005.12.14 15:15:00 -
[114]
Edited by: Mesasone on 14/12/2005 15:15:45
Originally by: Jon Xylur
Why would Ishkur get an MWD bonus? It's a drone ship and doesn't work that well with blasters (optimal bonus=for rails, falloff bonus=blasters). More drone range woudl eb far better for it. Uberkur FTW!
Have you tried the Ishkur with blasters? It's amazing. Because it is a bit heavier and can not keep as close of an orbit as say an interceptor, the optimal bonus actually works quite well to keep it with in blaster range, although I would agree that a fall off bonus would give more effective range. I personally dont like sending my drones out 40km to the target, as one or more may perish en route - and its a ship that relies pretty heavily on it's drones. I like to keep my drones at my side, so I can scoop them up and warp out when things get hairy.
|
Jagaroth
|
Posted - 2005.12.14 15:17:00 -
[115]
Originally by: Alex Harumichi
At the moment, Harpy does everything it does, but better.
No. Hawk tanks better and looks cooler (blue-tint with hawk-wings design across the front).
I'd object to the idea of changing it to a kestrel hull. I like the Merlin hull, but if you were going to change it then perhaps a blue-tint Hookbill with similar patterning would look just as good. 
1 or 2 more missile hardpoints (NB not slots) would work if the bonus was reconfigured to match. I would prefer an extra mid slot to a high. The description says Lai Dai make balanced ships... well that's where the mid-slots come in and allow you to vary your configuration and do all sorts of interesting things. Or not - cos there's not enough of them.
------
|
TheMoog
|
Posted - 2005.12.14 16:33:00 -
[116]
Originally by: Phelan Lore
Gallente
-Ishkur: 5% MWD cap bonus
-Enyo: 7.5% rep bonus
I'd do very silly things to get those bonus on my Gallente AF.
The MWD bonus on the Ishkur would be great, since the best role I found for it is an anti-ceptor AF: fast, drones and rails.
The rep bonus on the Enyo would make me wet 
|
Trelennen
|
Posted - 2005.12.14 17:22:00 -
[117]
Originally by: Kai Lae
No T2 ship has more than 4 bonuses. Hell AF only have 3 real ones. So that's a non starter. Frankly, IMO, CCP needs to look at the grid fitting for medium beams (as they said that they would). If that was done with a 4th low slot you could go with a MAPC, and likely fairly easily fit 3 of them. I however think that in general the "damage" AF work better as long range boats, and the "utility" (in general) work better as the short range type. That's why I'd investigate removing the optimal bonus totally and replacing it with damage, and then adding in 5% armor resists (mini sac, which tanks pretty well).
Well, Jaguar works better at long range and heavy tackler, due to range bonus and shield tank, and it does pitiful damage at close range anyway (as much as vengeance). There's not much to do to give it decent damage except turning it into wold, an additional med slots would give it a better shield tank / heavy tackling abilities at least. Wolf does decent damage with AC at close range, and with nerf on alpha strike, I don't see how 280 wolf could be better after RMR than with AC. Anyway, even with AC it lacks really some damage compared to a blaster harpy (200 DPS with 1 damage mod and max skills, 140 for AC wolf with 1 damage mod and max skills). (PS: by looking at cargo bay sizes, it's pretty clear that wolf is more supposed to use AC with high ammo consumption, and jag artys with lower ammo consumption (165 vs 130)).
And jag definitely need some look at to its cap, it's the only AF that has the same cap than its T1 hull. Wolf is not that much better though. Jag, as well as vengeance and hawk, need another slot to be on par with the 11 slots AF and the ishkur with its 10 slots and massive drone bay. And all AFs need their 4th bonus in place of the fake bonus.
Originally by: DarK
The cluetrain obviously doesn't stop at this station anymore...
|
|
CCP Hammer
|
Posted - 2005.12.14 19:25:00 -
[118]
Weirda no love Hammer?
|
|
xenorx
|
Posted - 2005.12.14 20:19:00 -
[119]
Originally by: CCP Hammer
Weirda no love Hammer?
We all love you Hammer.
I would love you long time if you would change my Retributions to a 4/2/5 layout. Drop the useless utility high slot into a mid slot.
Oh and before everyone starts screaming that it would be overpowered notice that I didnt ask for 40 more cpu. Although it would be nice.
|
Sarmaul
|
Posted - 2005.12.14 20:25:00 -
[120]
Originally by: CCP Hammer
Weirda no love Hammer?
stop trolling and fix the assault frigates
Originally by: Testy McTest
Artillery Extreme Ammo - fires typhoons that launch claws with autocannons that launch guys in space suits that have machine guns that fire ninjas
|
| |
|
| Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 .. 17 :: one page |
| First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |