If they could solve the latency issues, they should just blatantly steal Galaxy of Fire's mining minigame.

Improvement to mining? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA..... let me breathe.. Ya right. *clicks button, waits 10 minutes, clicks again*. I don't know why pubbies would want to mine other than downloading bots to do the job for them.

Can you find a youtube vid for me? I don't even know what I'm looking for and feeling lazy.

I agree that mining needs more human interaction. The CSM has lobbed about ideas with regard to the subject but we have a hard time overcoming the idea of not making it some sort of quick-time event. But yeah, Mining needs to be looked at.

ccp has heard the cries of the highsec miner for help against suicide ganking, and has introduced the tornado

you can send flowers and thanks to their hq, i know I will be

I agree that mining needs more human interaction. The CSM has lobbed about ideas with regard to the subject but we have a hard time overcoming the idea of not making it some sort of quick-time event. But yeah, Mining needs to be looked at.

I am curious is we'll see any improvements in the mining system? Is CCP even thinking about how to improve/change mining? Adding some human element seems a good way to help with bots in addition to making a popular aspect of the game more fun.

Best,
AG

Oh there will improvements. The new BC with better Large blasters on it..

Can you find a youtube vid for me? I don't even know what I'm looking for and feeling lazy.

This. Basically, it's a game of GÇ£keep the reticle within the circleGÇ¥ where the circle keeps shrinking as you suck up more ore, and the reticle keeps bouncing around, trying to get away from the centre of the circle.

Better mining drills gives you more control (by slowing the slippage down and/or by increasing your ability to push back). More valuable ores can be had by first stripping away the outer layers and then drill at the core, when the circle is at its absolute smallest.

This. Basically, it's a game of GÇ£keep the reticle within the circleGÇ¥ where the circle keeps shrinking as you suck up more ore, and the reticle keeps bouncing around, trying to get away from the centre of the circle.

Better mining drills gives you more control (by slowing the slippage down and/or by increasing your ability to push back). More valuable ores can be had by first stripping away the outer layers and then drill at the core, when the circle is at its absolute smallest.

A goon already beat you to this comment, how's it feel being sloppy seconds to a goon?

Adding a mini game to mining will only serve as a distraction, so miners are even easier to gank.

And I doubt it could keep people from botting either.

I don't mine, but I don't see how a human element works in regards to the context of Eve. Even ratting or running missions is pretty much target, auto fire... rince, wash and repeat... Yes, you need to keep distance on harder rats, but if your a drone boat, you can just sit there and not even target if you don't want to direct the drones...

Well don't wanna sound rude, how about showing actually the CSM intention regarding the mining boredom situation?
Start a brainstorm thread, get opinions, get devs, programmers to check if that idea is possible to attach to the game etc etc.

So far I just see hey lets try to do something with mining, a few suggestions are given then after 20 posts it dies.
Sometimes a Blue post saying that they are going to look at it "soon" .But no serious engagement over the subject.

Seriously I would like to have a programmer to answer the questions in the thread.

Actually yes, since it will move the cursor to a random direction that a bot cannot prevent.It would fumble the bottter mining.
As for the ganking a + for merc corps , guard services etc.

How about give miners a chance against scumbag gankers..

Now If I were a rich miner in the time of EvE,I would 1..Make sure I built the biggest mining boat I could,with shields and armor for the needs..2.. pay off Concord to make sure that second shot from the scumbags never come..

But would make me feel really good when ganked?? If concord just disabled your guns and held you in a tractor beam for me to come back in a pew-pew ship and ass gank you ..

Just fair right??

Actually yes, since it will move the cursor to a random direction that a bot cannot prevent.It would fumble the bottter mining.
As for the ganking a + for merc corps , guard services etc.

How about give miners a chance against scumbag gankers..

Now If I were a rich miner in the time of EvE,I would 1..Make sure I built the biggest mining boat I could,with shields and armor for the needs..2.. pay off Concord to make sure that second shot from the scumbags never come..

But would make me feel really good when ganked?? If concord just disabled your guns and held you in a tractor beam for me to come back in a pew-pew ship and ass gank you ..

Just fair right??

You could try dropping mining yeilds slightly across the board and then add a small interactive feature that boosts yeilds slightly higher than they are now. That way you can still please semi afk miners and also reward people who choose to interact while mining.

We are not talking about political and "social" problems in game.
We are trying to improve the miner fun experience, so like I suggested in this topic.Get into a mining corp with serious ops in high sec and hire some muscle to protect your miners.You guys are just being greedy, want to keep all the profit.Sometimes if you want to make some profit you need to pay to reduce the risk.
Its not bloody rocket science this sort of logic.

Well what we mine never hits the market,it ends up building crap down the road for my friends to waste..The problem is social..look what every Goon has been railing about for the last month..CCP has a mechanic in place to help the helpless,but every goon and his mother tries to work arounded what CCP intended..

Mining offenseave defensence or defence and yet all you hear are cries to even make them more helpless..CCP could do this..But you retards think all those statue shooter sub cancels were allot..The amout of production players that will bail will stagger this game..

- make belts so that you must scan them... i dont think botts can do scanning very well... (maybe add some more statics on scans too so that you must have brain to see its only static)
- static belts have only very small roids for new players... (strips dont have use if it)
- when you left scanned belt its gone... you must scan again...
- make roid stealing criminal act so you can shoot that person - botts dont see what roid you mine...
- make fleeting with other players and making real ops more rewarding then solo mining (orca boost better) - botts dont fleet

This.

some ok ideas here, but still mining is zzzzz

two things That need to be done together..

1. make it impossible to bot..

2 make it impossible to gank high sec miners..

This. Basically, it's a game of GÇ£keep the reticle within the circleGÇ¥ where the circle keeps shrinking as you suck up more ore, and the reticle keeps bouncing around, trying to get away from the centre of the circle.

Better mining drills gives you more control (by slowing the slippage down and/or by increasing your ability to push back). More valuable ores can be had by first stripping away the outer layers and then drill at the core, when the circle is at its absolute smallest.

If you're too slow/hamfisted to control the drill, it slips outside the drill zone and starts overheating. Overheat too much, and the whole asteroid explodes, making you lose all the ore from it. At any time, you can simply stop and collect however much you've extracted so far (so if you're about to explode, it's better to just take what little you have, rather than try to fight for control and lose it all). Once you've stopped drilling GÇö either by overheating, by interrupting the process, or by finishing up with the core drilling, the asteroid is no longer available for further attempts until it respawns. Of course, a lot of these details are matched to how GoF handles respawns and availability in general (it's an SP game so you have no real competition, and no-one gets upset if you just blow every last rock to pieces), so all of it isn't exactly directly transferrable to EVEGǪ but some of the basic ideas might work.

We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX!

You guys are just being greedy, want to keep all the profit.Sometimes if you want to make some profit you need to pay to reduce the risk.
Its not bloody rocket science this sort of logic.

Boost rats!!!

Actually yes, since it will move the cursor to a random direction that a bot cannot prevent.It would fumble the bottter mining.
As for the ganking a + for merc corps , guard services etc.

That's a horrible mechanic in that game. And I'm not entirely convinced that it wouldn't kill the afk miner populace making way for bot programs being extremely successful at it.

No, I think the thing to do about mining is remove simplistic repetitiveness from mining altogether. Mineable roids need to be extremely hard to find, extremely dangerous to mine. Eve should have a "badlands" of sort, current space not withstanding, that's really only attractive to miners and explorers, having certain properties, like w-space, that dampens the efficacy of PVP but that doesn't make it impossible. It should be something that the barges can at least have a fighting chance in groups of defending themselves. This space needs to take time to get to, be difficult to get in and out of and only support mining outposts incapable of supporting PVP ships in any way and having limited lifespans. PVP'ers can go in there, at reduced efficacy, but they got to bring everything they need with them. Miners too. Gotta bring in everything they need and ship out all their ore. The amount of ore coming out should be small, but profitable. Anyone going in there should realize that they just can't come and go as they please as to discourage all but the most determined roving gangs. They should realize they're going to be there for a while. This space should have no sov, no racial bias, nothing. It's just empty explorable space. It's resources, whatever they might be, should be far and few between but extremely profitable.

Galaxy On Fire 2 - An App Store game that looks a ton better than eve... Shame its not MMO..or CCP would be losing a ton more subs

you mean it's an iphone game?

How would the badlands play out in-game? Would they be a shifting maze of warpable beacons in a solar system, or would they be something like w-space, or a cross of both?

make belts so that you must scan them... i dont think botts can do scanning very well... (maybe add some more statics on scans too so that you must have brain to see its only static)

- make roid stealing criminal act so you can shoot that person - botts dont see what roid you mine...

- make fleeting with other players and making real ops more rewarding then solo mining (orca boost better) - botts dont fleet

- Boost rats - botts have more problems with defending themself then real people, and it would be more involving.

A bot is world chess champion.
A bot is world Jeopardy champion.
A bot can drive a rover on Mars.

2 make it impossible to gank high sec miners..

to update list of that guy before:

- make belts so that you must scan them... i dont think botts can do scanning very well... (maybe add some more statics on scans too so that you must have brain to see its only static)
- static belts have only very small roids for new players... (strips dont have use if it)
- when you left scanned belt its gone... you must scan again...
- make roid stealing criminal act so you can shoot that person - botts dont see what roid you mine...
- make fleeting with other players and making real ops more rewarding then solo mining (orca boost better) - botts dont fleet
- Boost rats - botts have more problems with defending themself then real people, and it would be more involving.

i love when ppl are against everything and for nothing...






not bad... :)
+1

to update list of that guy before:

- make roid stealing criminal act so you can shoot that person - botts dont see what roid you mine...

Why not another ship from ORE with less mining yield but way more tank.

Or

Why not another ship from ORE with less mining yield but way more guns (minmatar style).

Or

Why not another ship from ORE with less mining yield but can escape quickly... (example blockaid runners)

If ORE was smart they would release ships to counter such pirate activity, such as the offensive vs defensive battle that always takes place in the weapons/armor race here in the real world.

Don't get me wrong bots and stupid miners should be ganked, but I feel ORE ships are so out classed that they need some love. This goes for all sections of mining ships from High->Low->Null.

Allow the Rorq, when commited put up a POS style shield around a small subset of mining roids/ice. Give the miners a chance to escape/reship to fight the attack? As it is now you see Rorq's sitting in POS shields.... just allows the Rorq's to be able to use those trackter beams.....

Mining is sucky, and needs some changes/love. Just saying.

this is a fantastic idea, I am serious,

make it able to claim asteroids belts, if someelse mines in your claimed area it is handled like thieving, giving you killing rights.

To make it a little bit more interesting put out three kinds of claim markers

personal marker - range 25 km, only personal killing rights

corp markers - range 50 km, gives killing rights to the whole corp

alliance markers - range 100 km, killing rights for the whole alliance


the ability to use these different markers is based on skills, maybe mining foreman. This could really shake things up, seriously shake it up....maybe so much that miners would actually go back to null, ah I am just dreaming, this is EVE and some people would find a way to abuse it :)

ok ppl... and where is, long time mentioned, comet mining???

this is a fantastic idea, I am serious,

make it able to claim asteroids belts, if someelse mines in your claimed area it is handled like thieving, giving you killing rights.

To make it a little bit more interesting put out three kinds of claim markers

personal marker - range 25 km, only personal killing rights

corp markers - range 50 km, gives killing rights to the whole corp

alliance markers - range 100 km, killing rights for the whole alliance


the ability to use these different markers is based on skills, maybe mining foreman. This could really shake things up, seriously shake it up....maybe so much that miners would actually go back to null, ah I am just dreaming, this is EVE and some people would find a way to abuse it :)

i love when ppl are against everything and for nothing...

I agree that mining needs more human interaction. The CSM has lobbed about ideas with regard to the subject but we have a hard time overcoming the idea of not making it some sort of quick-time event. But yeah, Mining needs to be looked at.

How so?

to update list of that guy before:

- make belts so that you must scan them... i dont think botts can do scanning very well... (maybe add some more statics on scans too so that you must have brain to see its only static)
- static belts have only very small roids for new players... (strips dont have use if it)
- when you left scanned belt its gone... you must scan again...
- make roid stealing criminal act so you can shoot that person - botts dont see what roid you mine...
- make fleeting with other players and making real ops more rewarding then solo mining (orca boost better) - botts dont fleet
- Boost rats - botts have more problems with defending themself then real people, and it would be more involving.

I agree that mining needs more human interaction. The CSM has lobbed about ideas with regard to the subject but we have a hard time overcoming the idea of not making it some sort of quick-time event. But yeah, Mining needs to be looked at.

Please do this so I can fit one civilian miner to any combat ship, sit in a belt with it mining a rock waiting for the miner to mine that rock and flag him to me for combat O the tears this will produce as miners cry out about being destroyed.

That's a horrible mechanic in that game. And I'm not entirely convinced that it wouldn't kill the afk miner populace making way for bot programs being extremely successful at it.

No, I think the thing to do about mining is remove simplistic repetitiveness from mining altogether. Mineable roids need to be extremely hard to find, extremely dangerous to mine. Eve should have a "badlands" of sort, current space not withstanding, that's really only attractive to miners and explorers, having certain properties, like w-space, that dampens the efficacy of PVP but that doesn't make it impossible. It should be something that the barges can at least have a fighting chance in groups of defending themselves. This space needs to take time to get to, be difficult to get in and out of and only support mining outposts incapable of supporting PVP ships in any way and having limited lifespans. PVP'ers can go in there, at reduced efficacy, but they got to bring everything they need with them. Miners too. Gotta bring in everything they need and ship out all their ore. The amount of ore coming out should be small, but profitable. Anyone going in there should realize that they just can't come and go as they please as to discourage all but the most determined roving gangs. They should realize they're going to be there for a while. This space should have no sov, no racial bias, nothing. It's just empty explorable space. It's resources, whatever they might be, should be far and few between but extremely profitable.

for 1, well I already do that, it's called grav sites. But more with basic ore would make it work.
for 2, good call,
for 3, no thanks, why would it just vanish when not mined out
for 4, would work better if you staked your claim on the field you scan down
for 5, ok, but remember the loan miners
for 6, escalation would be better. Those unthinking bots that sit and tank should find themselves being swarmed as the word goes out that the pirates have found somebody asleep. Couple of high sec rats easily tanked, but more and better as they swarm, and bye bye bot hulk.

For other comments about micro games etc., I already have that, it's called goon spotting and I don't need anything distracting me from that

you're describing Wormholes.

And no, CCP should NEVER nerf PVP in favor of a certain carebear group, be it miners, missioners, etc.

this coming from a carebear. the New Eden star cluster is a rough, dangerous place. if you don't like it you can stay in your CQ and watch MLP:FiM on your big screen all day.

This. Basically, it's a game of GÇ£keep the reticle within the circleGÇ¥ where the circle keeps shrinking as you suck up more ore, and the reticle keeps bouncing around, trying to get away from the centre of the circle.

Better mining drills gives you more control (by slowing the slippage down and/or by increasing your ability to push back). More valuable ores can be had by first stripping away the outer layers and then drill at the core, when the circle is at its absolute smallest.

If you're too slow/hamfisted to control the drill, it slips outside the drill zone and starts overheating. Overheat too much, and the whole asteroid explodes, making you lose all the ore from it. At any time, you can simply stop and collect however much you've extracted so far (so if you're about to explode, it's better to just take what little you have, rather than try to fight for control and lose it all). Once you've stopped drilling GÇö either by overheating, by interrupting the process, or by finishing up with the core drilling, the asteroid is no longer available for further attempts until it respawns. Of course, a lot of these details are matched to how GoF handles respawns and availability in general (it's an SP game so you have no real competition, and no-one gets upset if you just blow every last rock to pieces), so all of it isn't exactly directly transferrable to EVEGǪ but some of the basic ideas might work.

This. Basically, it's a game of GÇ£keep the reticle within the circleGÇ¥ where the circle keeps shrinking as you suck up more ore, and the reticle keeps bouncing around, trying to get away from the centre of the circle.

Better mining drills gives you more control (by slowing the slippage down and/or by increasing your ability to push back). More valuable ores can be had by first stripping away the outer layers and then drill at the core, when the circle is at its absolute smallest.

If you're too slow/hamfisted to control the drill, it slips outside the drill zone and starts overheating. Overheat too much, and the whole asteroid explodes, making you lose all the ore from it. At any time, you can simply stop and collect however much you've extracted so far (so if you're about to explode, it's better to just take what little you have, rather than try to fight for control and lose it all). Once you've stopped drilling GÇö either by overheating, by interrupting the process, or by finishing up with the core drilling, the asteroid is no longer available for further attempts until it respawns. Of course, a lot of these details are matched to how GoF handles respawns and availability in general (it's an SP game so you have no real competition, and no-one gets upset if you just blow every last rock to pieces), so all of it isn't exactly directly transferrable to EVEGǪ but some of the basic ideas might work.

Actually yes, since it will move the cursor to a random direction that a bot cannot prevent.It would fumble the bottter mining.
As for the ganking a + for merc corps , guard services etc.

I don't know but it doesn't sound too hard to make a bot that follows random movement on the screen. Might not be as efficient as a real human doing it but then again a real human can't work 24/7.

2 make it impossible to gank high sec miners..

Problem: What if I warp into the belt and render all the asteroids useless by doing a quick interruption on them as fast as I can.

I am curious is we'll see any improvements in the mining system? Is CCP even thinking about how to improve/change mining? Adding some human element seems a good way to help with bots in addition to making a popular aspect of the game more fun.

Best,
AG

to update list of that guy before:

- make belts so that you must scan them... i dont think botts can do scanning very well... (maybe add some more statics on scans too so that you must have brain to see its only static)
- static belts have only very small roids for new players... (strips dont have use if it)
- when you left scanned belt its gone... you must scan again...
- make roid stealing criminal act so you can shoot that person - botts dont see what roid you mine...
- make fleeting with other players and making real ops more rewarding then solo mining (orca boost better) - botts dont fleet
- Boost rats - botts have more problems with defending themself then real people, and it would be more involving.

thnx for responce...

about 1st.
that is the point... all larger roids (all ores that can be in that system) are in grav sites.

about 2nd.
Thnx.

about 3rd.
Thats because i was thinking about botters... bot user can scan down many belts in the morning and then make bot to mine in them all day... this way you need to scan... or mine with friend so that you can keep belt alive... (i dont think about dead as soon as you warp out... but dead some time (10 minutes or so) so that if you just want to unload and warp back... you can)

about 4th.
there need some work to be done on that sugestions so that ppl that want easy kills dont exploit that systems.

about 5th.
i dont think about making it that you can only mine in fleet but a little more boost would help and would show players the way to socialisation (this is MMO)

about 6th.
a little boost (maybe scram) and escalation would be the best... every mining ship can use drones that easily kill rats.

--All Low-Tier (Veldspar, Scordite, ec.) Asteroids are distributed Universally (all space, high-sec, low-sec, 0.0) and in Static, Permanent Asteroid Belts.

--Under the Revision, All Asteroids on the overview lose their type descriptions. All asteroids must be scanned to determine what ores they contain and in what quantities, and their location on the asteroid. Some asteroids will contain nothing of value. Most will contain a single ore-type. Some will contain multiple ore types.

GǪ triggered events GǪ

would moving belts around every couple hours do away with botters?? two things That need to be done together..

1. make it impossible to bot..

2 make it impossible to gank high sec miners..

I really like this thread.

Things I agree with strongly:

- make existing belts useful to only new players (civilian miner modules) and smaller
- make us scan for real belts
- make mining ships harder to gank. a 180m+ hulk should not be gankable by 4 alpha dessies in high sec
- put some higher level ores in mining missions
- i like the PI-like scanning mechanism. you could have a huge rock, but unless you scan it every once in awhile to see where you can extract stuff from it, you are extracting nothing and/or damaging your lasers
- put some small amounts of ABC into mining missions to make them more worthwhile. atm, they are painfully braindead

Well what we mine never hits the market,it ends up building crap down the road for my friends to waste..The problem is social..look what every Goon has been railing about for the last month..CCP has a mechanic in place to help the helpless,but every goon and his mother tries to work arounded what CCP intended..

Mining offenseave defensence or defence and yet all you hear are cries to even make them more helpless..CCP could do this..But you retards think all those statue shooter sub cancels were allot..The amout of production players that will bail will stagger this game..

- make belts so that you must scan them... i dont think botts can do scanning very well... (maybe add some more statics on scans too so that you must have brain to see its only static)
- static belts have only very small roids for new players... (strips dont have use if it)
- when you left scanned belt its gone... you must scan again...
- make roid stealing criminal act so you can shoot that person - botts dont see what roid you mine...
- make fleeting with other players and making real ops more rewarding then solo mining (orca boost better) - botts dont fleet

This. Basically, it's a game of GÇ£keep the reticle within the circleGÇ¥ where the circle keeps shrinking as you suck up more ore, and the reticle keeps bouncing around, trying to get away from the centre of the circle.

Better mining drills gives you more control (by slowing the slippage down and/or by increasing your ability to push back). More valuable ores can be had by first stripping away the outer layers and then drill at the core, when the circle is at its absolute smallest.

If you're too slow/hamfisted to control the drill, it slips outside the drill zone and starts overheating. Overheat too much, and the whole asteroid explodes, making you lose all the ore from it. At any time, you can simply stop and collect however much you've extracted so far (so if you're about to explode, it's better to just take what little you have, rather than try to fight for control and lose it all). Once you've stopped drilling GÇö either by overheating, by interrupting the process, or by finishing up with the core drilling, the asteroid is no longer available for further attempts until it respawns. Of course, a lot of these details are matched to how GoF handles respawns and availability in general (it's an SP game so you have no real competition, and no-one gets upset if you just blow every last rock to pieces), so all of it isn't exactly directly transferrable to EVEGǪ but some of the basic ideas might work.

No, I think the thing to do about mining is remove simplistic repetitiveness from mining altogether. Mineable roids need to be extremely hard to find, extremely dangerous to mine. Eve should have a "badlands" of sort, current space not withstanding, that's really only attractive to miners and explorers, having certain properties, like w-space, that dampens the efficacy of PVP but that doesn't make it impossible. It should be something that the barges can at least have a fighting chance in groups of defending themselves. This space needs to take time to get to, be difficult to get in and out of and only support mining outposts incapable of supporting PVP ships in any way and having limited lifespans. PVP'ers can go in there, at reduced efficacy, but they got to bring everything they need with them. Miners too. Gotta bring in everything they need and ship out all their ore. The amount of ore coming out should be small, but profitable. Anyone going in there should realize that they just can't come and go as they please as to discourage all but the most determined roving gangs. They should realize they're going to be there for a while. This space should have no sov, no racial bias, nothing. It's just empty explorable space. It's resources, whatever they might be, should be far and few between but extremely profitable.

What this game needs is logi support that can INCREASE your existing EHP. Not just repair damage, alpha strike makes that pointless. But if you had logistics that say would overload your shield or harden your armor with some sort of physics defying beam then this would indirectly make soft ships harder targets with the proper support. It would also help defend other things from alpha strikes since they would need to bring more and more, making it less cost effective. There would of course have to be tactics and counter-measures to it as well like ECMing the logi ship or killing it first but it would give the defenders an actual ability to defend, and not just retaliate which I believe is really pointless.

If you fly to protect a ship you should be able to actually protect it, so EHP increasing logi ships would be useful.

would moving belts around every couple hours do away with botters?? two things That need to be done together..

1. make it impossible to bot..

2 make it impossible to gank high sec miners..

It would also be nice to have asteroids appear as just "Asteroid" without the "Asteroid (Veldspar)" designation in the overview giving away what kind of ore the rock contains. In ice fields, this could be exploited to hide worthless ice amongst valuable ice (worthless ice could be 10% yield of normal ice, or simply produce useless ore that refines to water or nothing).

Command ships already do this.

thnx for responce...

about 1st.
that is the point... all larger roids (all ores that can be in that system) are in grav sites.

about 2nd.
Thnx.

about 3rd.
Thats because i was thinking about botters... bot user can scan down many belts in the morning and then make bot to mine in them all day... this way you need to scan... or mine with friend so that you can keep belt alive... (i dont think about dead as soon as you warp out... but dead some time (10 minutes or so) so that if you just want to unload and warp back... you can)

about 4th.
there need some work to be done on that sugestions so that ppl that want easy kills dont exploit that systems.

about 5th.
i dont think about making it that you can only mine in fleet but a little more boost would help and would show players the way to socialisation (this is MMO)

about 6th.
a little boost (maybe scram) and escalation would be the best... every mining ship can use drones that easily kill rats.

The mining problem is going to be fixed. ROF penalties are going to be removed from destroyers.

thnx for responce...

about 1st.
that is the point... all larger roids (all ores that can be in that system) are in grav sites.

about 2nd.
Thnx.

about 3rd.
Thats because i was thinking about botters... bot user can scan down many belts in the morning and then make bot to mine in them all day... this way you need to scan... or mine with friend so that you can keep belt alive... (i dont think about dead as soon as you warp out... but dead some time (10 minutes or so) so that if you just want to unload and warp back... you can)

about 4th.
there need some work to be done on that sugestions so that ppl that want easy kills dont exploit that systems.

about 5th.
i dont think about making it that you can only mine in fleet but a little more boost would help and would show players the way to socialisation (this is MMO)

about 6th.
a little boost (maybe scram) and escalation would be the best... every mining ship can use drones that easily kill rats.

The mining problem is going to be fixed. ROF penalties are going to be removed from destroyers.

CCP needs to be really careful about all the buffs they are doing to gank ships........ they might find subs will go down as people ditch unusable mining toon accounts

A lot of Exumer and mining barge manufacturers will eventually go out of business too

Some odd ideas:
1. Leave belts as they are in +0.7 to 1.0 systems as new players need to get their feet wet and learn the game some.
2. In all other systems, -1.0 all the way to +0.6 move all belts, including ICE to Grav sites that have to be scanned out daily.
3. in the +0.5 & 0.6 grav-belts, add cruiser sized rats, just to make it interesting.
4. Oh, and with the addition of the new Pocket Battleship class (Tier 3 BCs) add a significant buff to Exhumers HPs.

p.s.

one thought fell on my mind reading post few posts up...
why are there names of ores in overview???
why names of ores we can see at all???
make it so that we must visual distinguish which ore is which in space and mine them like this...
miners know what veldspar looks like in space, equip strip miner with proper mining crystal it...
botts cant see in 3D graphic (in space) which roid is which ore... and they could use only T1 miners that dont use crystals because that... less ore for botts... and we could easier distinguish botts...

and if you want afk mine
CCP can help ppl to afk (more or less) mine by one simple thing... make that mining ship can lock more roids... that way ppl can visualy see what ores they want to mine, lock it and then afk mine for a little till you dont kill that roids...

Getting there, few points to iron out but for bots, but we would need some ccp input there. Any timing would also help bots if they stay after initial scan down work, but needed or miners will spend more time scanning than mining, particularly solos.

It would take somebody with more technical knowledge than me to beat the bot AI without making that getting in the way of mining.

As long as we keep low yield fields for noobs in their frigs, and a lot less than are currently static, should create a good base for a change. Think we need ICE only in grav sites though to stop the major bot grinds there too

Reading through this thread it has struck me that there are many different suggestions for how to make mining more interactive, and even (god forbid) interesting.

I foresee two problems with this:

1. Miners don't actually want to interact with the game, they want to switch on their strip miners and then watch TV or read a book.
2. Mining ships are already easy targets for gankers, and if the player has to actually concentrate on the actual mining process they will be even easier targets.

I suggest that we need a bigger change if we want to eliminate bots and "fix" mining. I suggest that we get a new type of POS, a "Mining Platform". This structure would be broadly similar to a normal POS but can only be anchored in proximity to an asteroid belt. It can be fitted with a variety of different modules for mining, also for refining etc, and most importantly with shields and guns. Effectively, an all in one industrial platform for harvesting fixed belts. The player would just have to ensure it was regularly refueled and the finished products were regularly removed to keep it operational. It would be expensive to buy and fit, time consuming to keep it supplied, and there would only be one allowed per fixed belt, so competition would be fierce. War decs would be made to eliminate a competitors platform - mercs would be hired etc.

This would eliminate mining bots completely; it would allow the market to remain supplied with base minerals from a player driven source; and it would provide a reason for organised conflict throughout the EVE universe.

The guys who actually LIKE staring at rocks will be unhappy with this idea, but they will still be able to do their thing - just not in the static belts.

The guys who like suicide ganking miners will be unhappy with this idea, but they can still do their thing - they just have to look a bit harder for the targets. And who knows, they might see a mining POS as the ultimate suicide gank challenge.

About timing... yea it would help botts but they cant scan 6 belts and then mine 1st, then 2nd, 3rd... because all will be gone 10 minutes after scanned down... and 1 belt cant sustain hulk(s) so that they mine for very long time... so botter would have to be by the pc and scan every time their bot is changing the belt.... so no botting for hours and hours without human intervention...
and to player 10 minutes is ok for dock, unload, undock if he mines solo.

and there only is point 4 to do serious work on it...

i think this all would help mining A LOT!
and i think its easy to implement in the game.


Can we have Dev opinion please???

I'm not a miner... can't stand it... but things that would be interesting:

comets that yield ice, and move- you have to keep up with them

"veins" of different ore in one roid. requires more interaction to pick the vein and adjust the crystal. Sure a bot might be able to eventually use this but it's not as easy.

The market needs to be adjusted to encourage mining.. to HIGHLY encourage it.

The days of corporate mining ops are gone... removing mineral drops will help as well as modifying the refining tables for mission loot.

Sure, trit and other min prices will go up but maybe it'll slow down cap production.

higher min prices also encourage smaller ships, more T1 mods, more at stake in combat (less "disposable" ships)

i'd like to see comets that give all 4 types of isotopes not just the regional type.

i'd also like to see huge megaroids in deadspace where you can build and attach a mining colony to it......... it then stays attached for upto 30 days slowly mining away until the megaroid is depleted of all types of minerals.

It like the customs offices should be vunerable to attack from players and it would carry a reinforcement timer option too.

[quote=Vincent Gaines]i'd also like to see huge megaroids in deadspace where you can build and attach a mining colony to it......... it then stays attached for upto 30 days slowly mining away until the megaroid is depleted of all types of minerals.

the total yield and rate of extraction could be determined by skills of the guy that anchored it.

cue skill: Mining Colony Management (prerequisite is anchoring 5)

It like the customs offices should be vunerable to attack from players and it would carry a reinforcement timer option too.

Exhumers should have MUCH larger shields, period.

+10

also see my links, I really like the mining colony idea.

I don't see why they decided to give industrial ships weak ass tanks. If I'm paying 200 some million ISK for a lame mining ship it better have a decent tank.

Remove the reinforcement timer idea though. make the colonies cheap-ish (like 100mil) but production shouldn't get out of hand- it is, in a sense, afk mining and would still flood the market with minerals.

How frequent would these "megaroids" be? Where would the be located? Hisec? I see the tie-in with PI but I fear it might do more harm than good to the economy.

Someone stole my ideas
nice to see ppl like them and work on them.

i like them a lot and would like to see them in game.

I would like to see CCP response on this ideas and on this whole subject, so if any CCP Dev have some time to spare for miners, we would appreciate it.

Reading through this thread it has struck me that there are many different suggestions for how to make mining more interactive, and even (god forbid) interesting.

I foresee two problems with this:

1. Miners don't actually want to interact with the game, they want to switch on their strip miners and then watch TV or read a book.

2. Mining ships are already easy targets for gankers, and if the player has to actually concentrate on the actual mining process they will be even easier targets.

I suggest that we need a bigger change if we want to eliminate bots and "fix" mining. I suggest that we get a new type of POS, a "Mining Platform". This structure would be broadly similar to a normal POS but can only be anchored in proximity to an asteroid belt. It can be fitted with a variety of different modules for mining, also for refining etc, and most importantly with shields and guns. Effectively, an all in one industrial platform for harvesting fixed belts. The player would just have to ensure it was regularly refueled and the finished products were regularly removed to keep it operational. It would be expensive to buy and fit, time consuming to keep it supplied, and there would only be one allowed per fixed belt, so competition would be fierce. War decs would be made to eliminate a competitors platform - mercs would be hired etc.

This would eliminate mining bots completely; it would allow the market to remain supplied with base minerals from a player driven source; and it would provide a reason for organised conflict throughout the EVE universe.

The guys who actually LIKE staring at rocks will be unhappy with this idea, but they will still be able to do their thing - just not in the static belts.

Actually, a vast number of miners get together in groups and chat away in text or voice while they mine. I'm not saying there are not the semi-AFK types but, can't really paint them all with the same brush


Not with you on this one however, a major buff for Exhumer's shield HPs does seem in order, especially with the ease that they pop now and will when the new Tier 3 BCs arrive.

...

hehe... sorry...
or on other thought... i am not...

and... CCP... can we hear you???

- make belts so that you must scan them... i don't think botts can do scanning very well.
- static belts have only very small roids for new players... (strips dont have use if it)

- when you left scanned belt its gone... you must scan again...

- make roid stealing criminal act so you can shoot that person - botts dont see what roid you mine...
- make fleeting with other players and making real ops more rewarding then solo mining (orca boost better) - botts dont fleet

[quote=Vincent Gaines]

a single reinforcement timer would be necessary to allow owners a chance to defend their mining colonies

but that said all mining colony structures eggs (500,000m3) require a freighter to deploy (opportunity for pirates to gank more)

High sec megaroids

limited to 0.7 -> 0.5 sec max total yield over a 30 day period 5,000,000m3 per colony max number spawned per system 5

50% veldspar 25% scordite 10% plagioclase 7.5% omber, 7.5% pyroxeres

Corp Faction standing required 5.0 for 0.5 sec sytems 6.0 for 0.6 sec systems 7.0 for 0.7 sec systems

requires pos fuels & a group of miners (item exists - currently a mission item but they could become items to buy n sell on market) to maintain, requires strontium for reinforcement timer

high sec mining colony structure stats
10,000,000 Shield HP (all resist types @ 50%)
2,500,000 Armor HP (all resist types @ 40%)
2,000,000 Structure HP (all resist types @ 30%)

Low sec megaroids

limited to 0.4 -> 0.1 sec max total yield over a 30 day period 25,000,000m3 per colony max number spawned per system 10

28% veldspar 20% scordite 10% plagioclase, omber, & pyroxeres, 4% Jaspet, Gneiss, Spodmanium, Hemorphite & Hedbergite 1% Dark Ocher & Crokite

requires pos fuels & a group of miners (item exists - currently a mission item but they could become items to buy n sell on market) to maintain, requires strontium for reinforcement timer

low sec mining colony structure stats
40,000,000 Shield HP (all resist types @ 50%)
10,000,000 Armor HP (all resist types @ 40%)
10,000,000 Structure HP (all resist types @ 30%)

can have upto of 5 medium or 10 small pos guns anchored in range (no ewar mods though)

Null sec megaroids (NPC null sec)

limited to 0.0 sec or lower, max total yield over a 30 day period 50,000,000m3 per colony max number spawned per system 10

24% veldspar 15% scordite 10% plagioclase, omber, & pyroxeres, 5% Jaspet, Gneiss, Hemorphite & Hedbergite 2% Spodmanium, Dark Ocher, Crokite, Bistot, & Arkonor, 1% Mercoxit

requires pos fuels & a group of miners (item exists - currently a mission item but they could become items to buy n sell on market) to maintain, requires strontium for reinforcement timer

npc null sec mining colony structure stats
75,000,000 Shield HP (all resist types @ 50%)
25,000,000 Armor HP (all resist types @ 40%)
20,000,000 Structure HP (all resist types @ 40%)
A Corp Faction standing of 6.0 to the NPC faction that owns the region will give a 25% reduction in fuel costs)
can have upto of 5 medium or 10 small pos guns anchored in range (no ewar mods though)

Null sec megaroids (SOV Nullsec)

limited to 0.0 sec or lower, max total yield over a 30 day period 75,000,000m3 per colony max number spawned per system 5 per level of i-hub industry upgrade.

24% veldspar 15% scordite 10% plagioclase, omber, & pyroxeres, 5% Jaspet, Gneiss, Hemorphite & Hedbergite 2% Spodmanium, Dark Ocher, Crokite, Bistot, & Arkonor, 1% Mercoxit

requires pos fuels & a group of miners (item exists - currently a mission item but they could become items to buy n sell on market) to maintain, requires strontium for reinforcement timer

sov null sec mining colony structure stats
75,000,000 Shield HP (all resist types @ 50%)
25,000,000 Armor HP (all resist types @ 40%)
20,000,000 Structure HP (all resist types @ 40%)
bonus to sov holders = requires 50% less fuels to maintain
can have a upto 5 medium or 10 small pos guns anchored in range (no ewar mods though)

After the 30 days expire

if the mining colony survives 30 days the megaroid becomes barren and the colony structure & guns auto-unanchor and is vunerable to be 1. stolen (needs a freighter to scoop and move) or 2. be destroyed without having a reinforcement cycle.

mining colony eggs are made from PI & ore minerals much like the new customs offices will be. a mining colony should cost around the 200mil mark per egg

I'll read through the whole thread when I have time, but I thought I'd give my two cents briefly as the topic seems to have ended in a disucssion of how to get rid of mining bots.

I've always thought real players have something quite obvious that bots don't: eyes. Any improvements intended to get rid of bots would require the use of our eyes in a way that bots couldn't. At the moment, for instance, I can scroll over any asteroid or set my overview setting in such a way that it will tell me exactly what is in the asteroid. 90% of the time I don't even look at the roid i'm mining.

So perhaps change it so that on the overview and HUD all asteroids are merely labelled as 'Asteroids' with the only way to differentiate between them being looking at them - maybe colour or some aura could be used to differentiate between different types? Either way, has to be something that only humans can pick up on easily.

I'll read through the whole thread when I have time, but I thought I'd give my two cents briefly as the topic seems to have ended in a disucssion of how to get rid of mining bots.

I've always thought real players have something quite obvious that bots don't: eyes. Any improvements intended to get rid of bots would require the use of our eyes in a way that bots couldn't. At the moment, for instance, I can scroll over any asteroid or set my overview setting in such a way that it will tell me exactly what is in the asteroid. 90% of the time I don't even look at the roid i'm mining.

So perhaps change it so that on the overview and HUD all asteroids are merely labelled as 'Asteroids' with the only way to differentiate between them being looking at them - maybe colour or some aura could be used to differentiate between different types? Either way, has to be something that only humans can pick up on easily.

p.s.

one thought fell on my mind reading post few posts up...
why are there names of ores in overview???
why names of ores we can see at all???
make it so that we must visual distinguish which ore is which in space and mine them like this...
miners know what veldspar looks like in space, equip strip miner with proper mining crystal it...
botts cant see in 3D graphic (in space) which roid is which ore... and they could use only T1 miners that dont use crystals because that... less ore for botts... and we could easier distinguish botts...

and if you want afk mine
CCP can help ppl to afk (more or less) mine by one simple thing... make that mining ship can lock more roids... that way ppl can visualy see what ores they want to mine, lock it and then afk mine for a little till you dont kill that roids...

Why not make mining more like the PI system?

tier3 BC and destroyer buff is something that mining ships are not prepared for -> T1 ships that are not $$$ and yet get isk from insurance for illegal act and have a lot DPS -> and no changes to mining/miners -> a lot suicide ganks in Hi-sec

You're almost there. The new battlecruisers will hopefully lead to a huge increase in highsec ganking. That in turn will leave a lot of extra miners needing new ships, for which they'll have to pay a bit more money because the minerals they're mining just went up in value. Increased numbers of ships being destroyed (by whatever means) are good for miners.

Unless, of course, you're posting daily on the goonswarm forum to let them know where to come and find you.

You're almost there. The new battlecruisers will hopefully lead to a huge increase in highsec ganking. That in turn will leave a lot of extra miners needing new ships, for which they'll have to pay a bit more money because the minerals they're mining just went up in value. Increased numbers of ships being destroyed (by whatever means) are good for miners.

Unless, of course, you're posting daily on the goonswarm forum to let them know where to come and find you.

This. Basically, it's a game of GÇ£keep the reticle within the circleGÇ¥ where the circle keeps shrinking as you suck up more ore, and the reticle keeps bouncing around, trying to get away from the centre of the circle.

Better mining drills gives you more control (by slowing the slippage down and/or by increasing your ability to push back). More valuable ores can be had by first stripping away the outer layers and then drill at the core, when the circle is at its absolute smallest.

If you're too slow/hamfisted to control the drill, it slips outside the drill zone and starts overheating. Overheat too much, and the whole asteroid explodes, making you lose all the ore from it. At any time, you can simply stop and collect however much you've extracted so far (so if you're about to explode, it's better to just take what little you have, rather than try to fight for control and lose it all). Once you've stopped drilling GÇö either by overheating, by interrupting the process, or by finishing up with the core drilling, the asteroid is no longer available for further attempts until it respawns. Of course, a lot of these details are matched to how GoF handles respawns and availability in general (it's an SP game so you have no real competition, and no-one gets upset if you just blow every last rock to pieces), so all of it isn't exactly directly transferrable to EVEGǪ but some of the basic ideas might work.

You're almost there. The new battlecruisers will hopefully lead to a huge increase in highsec ganking. That in turn will leave a lot of extra miners needing new ships, for which they'll have to pay a bit more money because the minerals they're mining just went up in value. Increased numbers of ships being destroyed (by whatever means) are good for miners.

Unless, of course, you're posting daily on the goonswarm forum to let them know where to come and find you.

Make it so the asteroids deploy defenses and throw rocks at you.

Its time Asteroids took a rock hard stand against this aggression.

Something that has always bothered me with the mining system we have now is that it is too tree-huggery.
Mankind's methodology for extracting ore has always been: nuke everything and sift through the rubble. But Eve has surgical lasers gentle enticing rocks to hand over their valuables?

I propose we base it on one of the greatest games ever created: Asteroids!
Not only does it make more sense, but it will make militarized mining ops viable and mining in general more "fun".

Basic concept;
- All rocks break apart when subjected to brute force. Once they are gravel/dust they can be collected.
- Any force (DPS) will do. Strip Miners are attributed 1k DPS or there about. Gravel/dust clouds dissipate over time.
- [New module] Wide Tractor Field Array.
Exactly what it says on the tin, not strong enough to move larger solid objects (cans/wrecks), covers a conical area in target direction.
- WTFA are only usable on Rorqual/Orca and T1/T2 Mining Barge's. Rorqual/Orca are given bonuses to the size/speed of the field in place of or in addition to regular tractor bonuses.

Extra/Optional:
- [New Bomb] Gravitational Shear Bomb.
Designed to tear apart porous solid objects (refined metal = ships = denser). Honours the age-old tradition of throwing explosives at a problem.

And there it is, outline anyway. Protection details need never be bored to tears (probably still bored though), Rorqual's get a reason to join the belt parties and door is opened for hostile's to burn the fields.