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Enough is Enough: Nerf Minmatar

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Bomberlocks CTRL-Q 57	Posted - 2011.11.23 07:27:00 - [481] - Quote Vmir Gallahasen wrote: .... Vmir Gallahasen wrote: .... Winmatar .... Winmatar Winmatar Winmatar Angel Style Winmatar Winmater Angel Style Winmatar Winmatar Winmatar ..... Winmatar Winmatar ..... Winmatar ...... ...... 60% Winmatar ..... Yes, I do think we have a genuine Nerfmatard here.
Onictus Legendary Knights Vorpal's Edge 37	Posted - 2011.11.23 07:33:00 - [482] - Quote You are more optimistic that I am. Goofing around on the test server didn't blow me away particularly. My Myrms will likely still have their ACs, Ares will remain my favorite ceptor. My Mega, Brutix, and Hype....the Hype keeps up with a Tempsets now (YAY) the rest are a bit easier to fit....oh Enyo and Ishkur are still to slow for anything except dogfighting, Daredevil is pretty ********, but it always was. Basically nothing really changes.
ElCholo BURN EDEN Northern Coalition. 16	Posted - 2011.11.23 08:38:00 - [483] - Quote Naomi Knight wrote: It is funny how matar fanboys gathered into this thread , so many crybabies I cant count ... You could say the same about the nerfmatar crybabies...
ElCholo BURN EDEN Northern Coalition. 16	Posted - 2011.11.23 08:55:00 - [484] - Quote Zarnak Wulf wrote: This thread didn't reach page 24 because of a couple of troll suspects. There is a significant dissatisfaction with balance in the game. That disatisfaction is there despite CCP's current overtures. LetGÇÖs say that each person posting in this thread is a single, individual person who is supporting the nerf of the Minmatar (which isnGÇÖt the case). ThatGÇÖs roughly 480 people supporting the nerf of Minmatar. 480 people is rought .02% of the Eve community (estimating the community at around 30k people). Even if my numbers are grossly off, these numbers donGÇÖt indicate a GÇ£significantGÇ¥ amount of anything. It just means that there are a very few, very vocal, minority who can be bothered posting about it. IGÇÖm assuming the rest of Eve is actually enjoying the game.
DarkAegix Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic 372	Posted - 2011.11.23 10:55:00 - [485] - Quote ElCholo wrote: LetGÇÖs say that each person posting in this thread is a single, individual person who is supporting the nerf of the Minmatar (which isnGÇÖt the case). ThatGÇÖs roughly 480 people supporting the nerf of Minmatar. 480 people is rought .02% of the Eve community (estimating the community at around 30k people). Look at how stupid you are. Just look at how stupid you are. Please.
Mfume Apocal Origin. Black Legion. 105	Posted - 2011.11.23 11:14:00 - [486] - Quote DarkAegix wrote: No. There's been 'Nerf Drake!', 'Nerf Tengu!' and 'Nerf Falcon', but never 'Nerf Caldari!' By that standard, this isn't actually a "Nerf Minmatar" thread (despite the name) since he's only asking for nerfs to TEs and autocannons.
DarkAegix Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic 373	Posted - 2011.11.23 11:32:00 - [487] - Quote Mfume Apocal wrote: By that standard, this isn't actually a "Nerf Minmatar" thread (despite the name) since he's only asking for nerfs to TEs and autocannons. Quote: nerfs to TEs and autocannons. Quote: nerfs to autocannons. Quote: autocannons. Oh yeah, this is most certainly a Nerf Gallente thread. I mean, what other race uses autocannons?
Mfume Apocal Origin. Black Legion. 105	Posted - 2011.11.23 11:34:00 - [488] - Quote DarkAegix wrote: Oh yeah, this is most certainly a Nerf Gallente thread. I mean, what other race uses autocannons? What other race has a Drake, Tengu and Falcon?
DarkAegix Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic 374	Posted - 2011.11.23 12:00:00 - [489] - Quote Mfume Apocal wrote: DarkAegix wrote: Oh yeah, this is most certainly a Nerf Gallente thread. I mean, what other race uses autocannons? What other race has a Drake, Tengu and Falcon? Myrms are seen with ACs, because ACs are OP. Rokhs are seen with ACs, because ACs are OP. Punishers are seen with ACs, because ACs are OP. Feroxes are seen with ACs, because ACs are OP. Any ship without ROF/damage bonuses are seen with ACs, because ACs are OP. Also, Gallente aren't seen with Drakes, Amarr aren't seen with Tengus and Falcons aren't seen anywhere but Caldari. By your logic, because these Caldari ships aren't being used by other races, they mustn't be as overpowered as Minmatar.
Mfume Apocal Origin. Black Legion. 105	Posted - 2011.11.23 12:09:00 - [490] - Quote DarkAegix wrote: Myrms are seen with ACs, because ACs are OP. Rokhs are seen with ACs, because ACs are OP. Punishers are seen with ACs, because ACs are OP. Feroxes are seen with ACs, because ACs are OP. Any ship without ROF/damage bonuses are seen with ACs, because ACs are OP. Also, Gallente aren't seen with Drakes, Amarr aren't seen with Tengus and Falcons aren't seen anywhere but Caldari. By your logic, because these Caldari ships aren't being used by other races, they mustn't be as overpowered as Minmatar. Myrms are seen with pulse lasers. Feroxes are seen with pulse lasers. I've never seen a Punisher except as a cyno alt. And I've never seen a Rokh with autocannons. Arties, yeah, ACs, never. And if you'd like, I can dig up the old "nerf HML" threads we've all seen.

Liang Nuren Perkone Caldari State 102	Posted - 2011.11.23 12:18:00 - [491] - Quote DarkAegix wrote: Myrms are seen with ACs, because ACs are OP. Rokhs are seen with ACs, because ACs are OP. Punishers are seen with ACs, because ACs are OP. Feroxes are seen with ACs, because ACs are OP. Any ship without ROF/damage bonuses are seen with ACs, because ACs are OP. Also, Gallente aren't seen with Drakes, Amarr aren't seen with Tengus and Falcons aren't seen anywhere but Caldari. By your logic, because these Caldari ships aren't being used by other races, they mustn't be as overpowered as Minmatar. Comments: - I fit my Myrms with Pulse or ACs, depending on what I'm trying to do. Pulse Myrms are totally viable. I'll almost certainly move my AC fits over to Blaster fits after the boost, but I'm not touching my Pulse fits. - I wouldn't fit ACs to a Rokh - certainly not after the boost. - I've never actually seen one of these Punishers in the wild. - I see more Missile Feroxes than I do AC Feroxes. In fact, one might successfully argue that fitting ACs is just stupid given the fact you have missile slots. (I would make this argument, personally) -Liang Looking for WH PVP corp.-á Normally on 5:00 -> 9-10:00 Eve (Aus TZ?) Blog: http://liangnuren.wordpress.com Twitter: http://twitter.com/LiangNuren Recruit me: http://wp.me/p1WQ0O-R
Onictus Legendary Knights Vorpal's Edge 37	Posted - 2011.11.23 12:49:00 - [492] - Quote DarkAegix wrote: Myrms are seen with ACs, because ACs are OP. I put AC's on myrms because of fitting restraints (only medium that fits) or because there are three reppers and you don't want ANYTHING not a repper or hardener eating cap. Sans bonuses AC's aren't anything to scream about....and the myrm doesn't have a turret bonus.
Kingwood Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED 0	Posted - 2011.11.23 14:24:00 - [493] - Quote DarkAegix wrote: Hah, try again. Let's name all the great Caldari ships! -Drake -Falcon -Tengu -Manticore...? -... -crickets Let's name all of the Caldari ships which can simply be outclassed by Minmatar counterparts! -Moa -Eagle -Ferox -Rokh -Osprey -Raptor -Everything else What do Feroxes, Myrms, Rokhs and Punishers love to fit? Why, autocannons. Lasers? Sure, on the terrible fits. Minmatar have it insanely easy-mode. Easiest to fit guns, un-neutable, easiest to fit tank, 2nd highest (and even occasionally highest) fitting. They're also the fastest, most agile, have insanely ranged autocannons with obscene tracking for winmataring at close and long range, ship bonuses which are never useless (lol caldari optimal bonus. lol amarr capacitor. lol Gallente active armour). Did I forget to mention the often perfect slot layout for a full tank, and then a DCU and 3 damage mods? There's also the huge selection of damage types, insane alpha strike capability for arties, larger drone bays than Caldari and on average equal to Amarr, and large amounts of weapon tiers so any fit can be made in case you want to fit a massive tank AND correctly sized guns. Why, even their drones are the best for most PVP. More often than not, one of four things happens if you encounter a Minmatar ship: -He escapes, due to superior agility -He kites you, and you die slowly -He gets up close, and you can't track him -He bites of more than he can chew, has at least a web on him, and dies Typical racial engagements: Minmatar vs Caldari missiles - Switch to EMP, laugh at kinetic damage, melt face, escape at any time Minmatar vs Caldari rails - Switch to EMP, get under guns, melt face Minmatar vs Amarr - Switch to fusion, get close, 30% more tracking = ~30% more dps on top of the already large dps advantage Minmatar vs Gallente - Switch to barrage, kite to death Minmatar vs Blob - Escape. Or hilariously kite the tackle, and warp off after 4 kills or so All of this above? Just a typical Minmatar ship. Take your pick: Rifter, Stabber, Rupture, Cane, Loki, Vaga, Sleip. Any of these ships are capable of any job in the one fit. Is anyone calling Minmatar underpowered? Your post is wrong on so many parts that I'm not even going to bother picking apart all your points. It sounds like you haven't had much PvP experience as of yet. You should calm down a bit, try to actually PvP in solo/small-gang situations, and then come back in a year or so - at the moment you're just cluelessly ranting about aspects you don't understand very clearly. Just a few things for you to consider (talking about 0.0 solo/small-gang PvP where shield tanks are mostly used): - A nano'd HML Drake (2x Nano, 2x BCU) with a web destroys a Shield-Cane without any problems. It outtanks and outdamages (at the cost of a little bit of speed) a Shield-Cane at kiting range, has range control in web range and basically walks over a Shield-Cane. El-oh-el at shrugging off kinetic Damage in a Minmatar ship. - A Harbinger destroys or forces off a Cane easily. - 30% more tracking equals 30% more damage? Wat? - Deimos walks over a Cynabal or Vaga. It's easier getting someone into scram range than to stay out of it. Not gonna bother with any more of your points, just stop posting and actually learn how to PvP. Oh yeah, I fly all races max-skilled except for Caldari BS 5, so don't bother.
Kingwood Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED 0	Posted - 2011.11.23 14:26:00 - [494] - Quote posting fail
Naomi Knight Imperial Academy Amarr Empire 54	Posted - 2011.11.23 14:45:00 - [495] - Quote Kingwood wrote: posting fail indeed your posts fail ,deimos kills a cyna yeah sure ... in yar dreams maybe
Kingwood Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED 0	Posted - 2011.11.23 14:51:00 - [496] - Quote Naomi Knight wrote: Kingwood wrote: posting fail indeed your posts fail ,deimos kills a cyna yeah sure ... in yar dreams maybe http://genos.killmail.org/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=9554116 I stopped playing Eve a little bit after that and came back into Eve proper only a few days ago, but if you want I can link you more Vaga and Cyna kills with Myrms and Megas.
m0cking bird Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 14	Posted - 2011.11.23 15:59:00 - [497] - Quote Well, there's alot of Cynabal pilots that limit there overall hit-points. Be that a nanofiber, after-buner 10mn or 100mn (without a warp scrambler). Doing any of these things will bring your overall effective hit-points to that of a shield Deimos. So, that 's nothing new. I would not have posted that kill-mail, but I have similar kills in a dual propulsion-autocannon-armour-Vexor Navy. I always find it interesting that most pilots posting on the forums. Tend to say things like "good pilot" or "not fail". Everyone makes mistakes sooner or l8er. With that said! This game is also full of very terrible pilots and really bad set-ups. AND! Most things are probably in this game. It often requires balls to do something that would not be widely considered wise (which is often the difference between really good pilots and just good pilots (trying = ballz)). There are so many kill-mails of Angel ships being destroyed by most ships in game (solo). In anycase, this thread was never going anywhere. Also, yeah! Autocannons do have more range than pulse lasers. projectiles may not do much damage @ whatever range, but they do some, instead of none. I'm fine with a hit to tracking enhancers, which wont only effect projectiles. Who cares! Not a big deal, but CCP is not going to do anything like that in the foreseeable future. -proxyyyy
Naomi Knight Imperial Academy Amarr Empire 55	Posted - 2011.11.23 18:05:00 - [498] - Quote Kingwood wrote: Naomi Knight wrote: Kingwood wrote: posting fail indeed your posts fail ,deimos kills a cyna yeah sure ... in yar dreams maybe http://genos.killmail.org/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=9554116 I stopped playing Eve a little bit after that and came back into Eve proper only a few days ago, but if you want I can link you more Vaga and Cyna kills with Myrms and Megas. Oh that cyna has a speed 2700+ with mwd your deimos nearly reach that with overheat but much worse agility, so it was luck , or experience difference. nice kill thou , every dead matar is a small victory itself :P It still doesnt matter ,oh I killed a winmatar angle ship in a gall one , so thats enough proof that matar is completly balanced.
Kingwood Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED 0	Posted - 2011.11.23 18:46:00 - [499] - Quote edit: These forums are messed up. Naomi Knight wrote: I stopped playing Eve a little bit after that and came back into Eve proper only a few days ago, but if you want I can link you more Vaga and Cyna kills with Myrms and Megas. Oh that cyna has a speed 2700+ with mwd your deimos nearly reach that with overheat but much worse agility, so it was luck , or experience difference. nice kill thou , every dead matar is a small victory itself :P It still doesnt matter ,oh I killed a winmatar angle ship in a gall one , so thats enough proof that matar is completly balanced. No, Deimos speed is not even close to Cyna speed. That kill is nothing special and I only linked it because you specifically asked for it. My point is that this crying for a nerf is absolutely unjustified, and people like DarkAegix, who clearly have no clue what they're talking about should just take a chill pill, shut up, and learn to play before crying for balance changes. Regarding the Angel ships, for example, I've said the Dramiel needed a nerf since it was buffed and that Hybrids needed a buff, and CCP is finally doing it. Cynabal and Machariel are completely fine, on the other hand, and it's a good thing CCP are not touching them. If CCP wants to look some more into balancing, they should take a close, hard look at the tier system for T1 frigates and Cruisers, because most of them are not worth flying except for the last tier. I've thought about doing a balance write-up on that but haven't found the time yet.
Kingwood Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED 0	Posted - 2011.11.23 18:47:00 - [500] - Quote double post again

Zarnak Wulf Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic 107	Posted - 2011.11.23 19:44:00 - [501] - Quote CCP Tallest just updated the hybrid rebalance thread. After Crucible they will be pursuing further balancing that might include: Looking at scorch vs. Null vs. Barrage T1 ammo revision for hybrids and possibly lasers Something to get blaster boats in range. Armor vs. Shield and passive vs. Active tanking Light and medium webber drones Individual ship balancing. And that all makes this thread moot now. I would appreciate it being locked. Thank you.
Liang Nuren Perkone Caldari State 104	Posted - 2011.11.23 19:48:00 - [502] - Quote Zarnak Wulf wrote: CCP Tallest just updated the hybrid rebalance thread. After Crucible they will be pursuing further balancing that might include: Looking at scorch vs. Null vs. Barrage T1 ammo revision for hybrids and possibly lasers Something to get blaster boats in range. Armor vs. Shield and passive vs. Active tanking Light and medium webber drones Individual ship balancing. And that all makes this thread moot now. I would appreciate it being locked. Thank you. Looking for WH PVP corp.-á Normally on 5:00 -> 9-10:00 Eve (Aus TZ?) Blog: http://liangnuren.wordpress.com Twitter: http://twitter.com/LiangNuren Recruit me: http://wp.me/p1WQ0O-R
m0cking bird Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 14	Posted - 2011.11.23 20:03:00 - [503] - Quote Well, I hope CCP will is not going to limit scorch range. Scorch is the Amarr version of stasis webifier. Once it is gone or dramatically reduced. You'll quickly find that Amarr are not even on the same level as Gallente ships + Hybrid turrets and even less so compared to Minmatar or Caldari. Although, if they did do this. Then you would only assume barrage and Tracking enhancers range would be reduced too. Only the use of tracking computers or tracking enhancers could counter any reduction to scorch range. I can only see a more homogeneous landscape to come out of this. Something a part of the community says it does not want, but instead of increasing blaster range. CCP may just start reducing auto-cannon and laser range. Like I said. This will only show how SH!T Amarr ships and turrets truly are. Again! Kinda like how most believed blaster were good, but that was because of one module (stasis webifier). I know for a fact most solo pilots do not find Amarr ships to be good pvp ships solo. If they're not good in that niche and not in fleets. What use are they? Mining Abaddon, with guardians repping incoming rat damage?
Bomberlocks CTRL-Q 58	Posted - 2011.11.23 20:30:00 - [504] - Quote Naomi Knight wrote: Kingwood wrote: posting fail indeed your posts fail ,deimos kills a cyna yeah sure ... in yar dreams maybe You really don't know who kingwood is, do you?
m0cking bird Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 14	Posted - 2011.11.23 20:30:00 - [505] - Quote To anyone making arguments of "skill" and "experience". The forums lag behind the game in just about everything. By as much as 6 months (from my observations). Experience does not count for much when writing post or much in the way of fact, with regard to kill-mails. The forums are for words and numbers. Making any effort to show others killmails is a waste of time. Most pilots on the forums have little to no experience in-game. Numbers, words and hypothetical s. Replace "skill", experience and PROOF (killmails). You don't learn anything from those who are not willing to innovate or attempt to think outside of general knowledge ("Myrmidon is terrible" 6 months ago was a generally accepted). About the only thing you can do on the forums is limit the way CCP may effect your game-play in the future (changes = nerf or boost). So with that all said. Don't waste time posting kill-mails to validate anything, because many will quickly find ways to invalidate everything. Mainly for the sake of supporting their own argument without any interest in finding true facts. CCP does fallow most of these !diots (they read the forums) and are often the reason why, what most pilots see as imbalances, happen. The know it alls with no experience in-game, but great with numbers and rhetoric are the biggest dumb@sses and offenders. Who basically circle jerk among themselves to forward their ideologies and their version of logic or what should be. Best you can hope for. Is limiting extraordinary claims like: Minmatar are overpowered or this and that is terrible because it's not viable in fleet engagements. Or do what I enjoy most. Troll, come up with words, speak gibberish and laugh @ others expense (good times). Which is the only reason I've been on the forums of late. To limit these !diots and their views on whatever.
Bomberlocks CTRL-Q 58	Posted - 2011.11.23 20:51:00 - [506] - Quote Zarnak Wulf wrote: CCP Tallest just updated the hybrid rebalance thread. After Crucible they will be pursuing further balancing that might include: Looking at scorch vs. Null vs. Barrage T1 ammo revision for hybrids and possibly lasers Something to get blaster boats in range. Armor vs. Shield and passive vs. Active tanking Light and medium webber drones Individual ship balancing. And that all makes this thread moot now. I would appreciate it being locked. Thank you. I predict a new thread: BUFF AMARR!!!!!!!
Liang Nuren Perkone Caldari State 105	Posted - 2011.11.23 21:37:00 - [507] - Quote Bomberlocks wrote: Zarnak Wulf wrote: CCP Tallest just updated the hybrid rebalance thread. After Crucible they will be pursuing further balancing that might include: Looking at scorch vs. Null vs. Barrage T1 ammo revision for hybrids and possibly lasers Something to get blaster boats in range. Armor vs. Shield and passive vs. Active tanking Light and medium webber drones Individual ship balancing. And that all makes this thread moot now. I would appreciate it being locked. Thank you. I predict a new thread: BUFF AMARR!!!!!!! There's cases where I think that's a really good idea. The Prophecy, Omen, and all 1 mid slot ships come rather strongly come to mind. Even the Harbinger and Absolution could use some fitting love to make them comfortable like the Drake and Cane. -Liang Looking for WH PVP corp.-á Normally on 5:00 -> 9-10:00 Eve (Aus TZ?) Blog: http://liangnuren.wordpress.com Twitter: http://twitter.com/LiangNuren Recruit me: http://wp.me/p1WQ0O-R
Naomi Knight Imperial Academy Amarr Empire 55	Posted - 2011.11.23 21:44:00 - [508] - Quote Bomberlocks wrote: Naomi Knight wrote: Kingwood wrote: posting fail indeed your posts fail ,deimos kills a cyna yeah sure ... in yar dreams maybe You really don't know who kingwood is, do you? your fiance? or who?
Aamrr HnL Enterprise 162	Posted - 2011.11.23 23:21:00 - [509] - Quote Nerf scorch? Nerf tracking enhancers? I think that is a fantastic idea.
Liang Nuren Perkone Caldari State 105	Posted - 2011.11.23 23:24:00 - [510] - Quote Aamrr wrote: Nerf scorch? Nerf tracking enhancers? I think that is a fantastic idea. It sounds really, really, really dangerous on the heels of the Hybrid boost. -Liang Looking for WH PVP corp.-á Normally on 5:00 -> 9-10:00 Eve (Aus TZ?) Blog: http://liangnuren.wordpress.com Twitter: http://twitter.com/LiangNuren Recruit me: http://wp.me/p1WQ0O-R



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