| Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 .. 17 :: one page |
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| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 16 post(s) |
Batelle
Komm susser Tod
377
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Posted - 2013.11.19 16:05:00 -
[61] - Quote
Julius Priscus wrote:anyone able to confirm if all loot spewing is now gone???
No one ever said it would be gone in the first place. Ghost sites however have no loot spew, and the rubicon launch video quotes a dev acknowledging how much people hate loot spew.
Fighting is Magic |
Silmas Feanarius
iFly Holdings
Greater Western Co-Prosperity Sphere
6
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Posted - 2013.11.19 16:34:00 -
[62] - Quote
Infinity Ziona wrote:I have more issues with the hacking mini game, but that has his own thread.
I think it should be more random. Just eject the cans as generic cans. Then its pure pot luck whether you get good stuff or crap. Horrible idea you probably think, but I think it'd get rid of a lot of the whiners (they don't like non-consistent non-perfect un-reliable ticks) and leave exploration for the people who enjoy that score! feeling.. while increasing the value of the stuff you do loot as its availability would decrease dramatically.[/quote]
Well, for one, I know I would never explore again if the loot spew was also random. 
Also loot found in profession sites is not exclusive to those, so availability would not decrease. If the loot value was increased (by increasing quantity found in sites), however...
Cunnu 'e mamma tua bagassa limpia. |
rikki55
Battle With Halibut Swords
0
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Posted - 2013.11.19 16:55:00 -
[63] - Quote
Princess Bride wrote:Exploration GOOD.
Mini-game okay.
Loot spew BAD.
This |
Capt Amer'ca
Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers
Get Off My Lawn
1
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Posted - 2013.11.19 18:57:00 -
[64] - Quote
If this thread reaches 100 pages, do you think they will listen to us? |
Batelle
Komm susser Tod
384
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Posted - 2013.11.19 19:01:00 -
[65] - Quote
Capt Amer'ca wrote:If this thread reaches 100 pages, do you think they will listen to us?
they know we hate it already.
Fighting is Magic |
Zen Dad
Solitary Sad Bastard In Space
167
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Posted - 2013.11.19 20:17:00 -
[66] - Quote
Odyssey has artificially boosted my killboard with solo frigate kills. Apart from that, I hate the way exploration has changed. The loot spew being the final slap in the face. Tried it over 4 months and despite some nice ISK the 'atmosphere' of exploration has gone.
Mini-game + loot spew has soiled a very special place in Eve. |
Batelle
Komm susser Tod
388
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Posted - 2013.11.19 21:30:00 -
[67] - Quote
Zen Dad wrote:Odyssey has artificially boosted my killboard with solo frigate kills. Apart from that, I hate the way exploration has changed. The loot spew being the final slap in the face. Tried it over 4 months and despite some nice ISK the 'atmosphere' of exploration has gone.
Mini-game + loot spew has soiled a very special place in Eve.
minigame is fine. Way better than shooting rats with a data-analyzer ship or sitting and watching your modules cycle ad nauseum. That was pretty much the definition of no-content. Now we have something that requires attention, can be screwed up, and actually gives you a damn good reason to train level 5 hacking.
And I also seem to be one of the very few old-timey explorers who sees Odyssey as a massive quality of life improvement rather than saying something to the affect of "wahh the interface doesn't suck anymore and now other people are exploring too!"
Fighting is Magic |
Zen Dad
Solitary Sad Bastard In Space
167
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Posted - 2013.11.19 22:15:00 -
[68] - Quote
Batelle wrote: Now we have something that requires attention,
Sipping a whisky whilst the can was hacked fully held my attention. Sacrificed to satisfy the hyperactive. |
Kayak Attack
Spartan's DNA
Apex.
6
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Posted - 2013.11.19 23:51:00 -
[69] - Quote
adding my piece to the pile. everyone still hates it. |
Gosch Ti
Crazy Eddie Industries Incorporated
0
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Posted - 2013.11.20 12:11:00 -
[70] - Quote
Tried Exploration 2 weeks before Odyssey for the first time. I like the new scanning interface and I also like the minigame.
But why they want crazy with loot spew I can't even begin to understand.
If you no what containers to get it get's easier. But having all shiny parts containers spew out on the other side of the cache and winding up with carbon and data sheets is just ..... "not ok" |
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Silmas Feanarius
iFly Holdings
Greater Western Co-Prosperity Sphere
6
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Posted - 2013.11.20 12:34:00 -
[71] - Quote
Zen Dad wrote:Batelle wrote: Now we have something that requires attention, Sipping a whisky whilst the can was hacked fully held my attention. Sacrificed to satisfy the hyperactive.
This is also legit. Teaches not to explore with neutrals in local while in alliance space, nor alone in hisec, nor without backup or reconnaissance everywhere else.
Every mechanic should be like this, open to emergent gameplay.
Cunnu 'e mamma tua bagassa limpia. |
Ristlin Wakefield
Pentag Blade
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
365
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Posted - 2013.11.20 14:49:00 -
[72] - Quote
I don't mind the mini-game, I do hate the loot spew. If there's a petition to remove it then point me in that direction, because I'll sign it and get everyone I know to sign it too.
I have a lover, her name is EVE. I see her every night and all she asks in return is that I have a pilot's license. |
Caveat Emptoris
All Goats Must Die
0
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Posted - 2013.11.20 14:56:00 -
[73] - Quote
Loot spew is terrible. We already won the minigame, and at least that one is primarily skill-based. In order to guarantee I get every can from a successful hack now requires bringing an alt, or making corpmates sit around waiting for me to complete hacks. This isn't emergent gameplay-inducing. The only thing it induces is carpal tunnel and vertigo from having to zoom in, out, and around at the molecular scale in order to see the mini-containers.
CCP, please change this. Make hacking harder, or whatever you need to do to balance things. I didn't sign up and train for exploration so that I could play Hungry Hungry Hippo Online. |
XmonkTad
Spectrum Entertainment
Spectrum Alliance
8
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Posted - 2013.11.20 19:31:00 -
[74] - Quote
I suppose I'm going to be the odd man out, but here it is: I like the loot spew. I've said it before, and I stand by it. However, it still needs some work. Right now it is entirely based on pilot skill and ship agility. There is no skill book that gives you extra time to pick up the cans, and there is only one implant (a slot 10 prospector that costs 25 mil) that gives gives you an extra 5 seconds to the container decay time. The mechanic is heavily luck based, and hurts users who have lag during the spew event.
What needs to change is the way we interact with the spew. Tractor beams work on the container, but they don't actually collect the loot automatically, and even having the cans next to you doesn't help you collect them any faster. Fitting dedicated modules should help with the task. We need help with the spew. Maybe activating a tractor beam on the hacking container would automatically condense the loot into a regular can?
The spew takes the place of a really tired mechanic, which was essentially the same as mining but with rats that had to be killed. I'm not saying that any mechanic is better than the old one, just that the old sites felt more like combat or mining than exploration. Exploration without the rats would feel very passive if there was no loot spew. It would be really dull. It would be mining with minigames attached. Now, it's a slot machine with a minigame instead. Also, the coins run away after you've won them. And other people try and pick them up. Forget the slot machine analogy. |
Batelle
Komm susser Tod
414
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Posted - 2013.11.20 20:03:00 -
[75] - Quote
loot spew is a pain but so far it seems pretty hard to actually miss anything good if you have a cargo scanner.
Fighting is Magic |
Ghost Phius
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
146
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Posted - 2013.11.20 20:04:00 -
[76] - Quote
Oh my..... |
Caveat Emptoris
All Goats Must Die
1
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Posted - 2013.11.20 21:37:00 -
[77] - Quote
XmonkTad wrote:I suppose I'm going to be the odd man out, but here it is: I like the loot spew. I've said it before, and I stand by it. However, it still needs some work. Right now it is entirely based on pilot skill and ship agility. There is no skill book that gives you extra time to pick up the cans, and there is only one implant (a slot 10 prospector that costs 25 mil) that gives gives you an extra 5 seconds to the container decay time. The mechanic is heavily luck based, and hurts users who have lag during the spew event. What needs to change is the way we interact with the spew. Tractor beams work on the container, but they don't actually collect the loot automatically, and even having the cans next to you doesn't help you collect them any faster. Fitting dedicated modules should help with the task. We need help with the spew. Maybe activating a tractor beam on the hacking container would automatically condense the loot into a regular can? The spew takes the place of a really tired mechanic, which was essentially the same as mining but with rats that had to be killed. I'm not saying that any mechanic is better than the old one, just that the old sites felt more like combat or mining than exploration. Exploration without the rats would feel very passive if there was no loot spew. It would be really dull. It would be mining with minigames attached. Now, it's a slot machine with a minigame instead. Also, the coins run away after you've won them. And other people try and pick them up. Forget the slot machine analogy.
If loot spew were the only barrier to getting the loot out, then I think I'd not be bothered as much by it, although honestly it is a minigame designed to be terribly frustrating to anyone with a history of RSI. I don't have issues with this as much as I did years back, but it's a factor worth considering. The 4x4 pixel-sized cans spawn practically on top of each other, even zoomed in...I have a $100 mouse and I still feel as if it requires feats of serious agility to click here-but-not-there.
Pick a minigame to stand between us and loot, and stick with it. Hell, if they bolted some sort of 3-card monty "you've won" element into the minigame window itself, I'd be fine with that. But the EVE interface is particularly poorly suited to this sort of micro-selection mechanic. It's a game where we use an overview with all the sexiness of an Excel spreadsheet to control almost everything we do. There's a reason for that: in-space selection and execution are weaknesses of this UI. |
Destination SkillQueue
Are We There Yet
5632
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Posted - 2013.11.20 23:29:00 -
[78] - Quote
I don't hate the spew, but I think it was mistake to use it on all successful hacking attempts. It's largely a pointless mini-game after the hacking mini-game, so at the very least a successful hack on the first attempt should just allow you to directly access all the loot. Spew should happen only if your first attempt failed. This sort of granularity would also encourage people to invest money and time in getting the hacking done successfully on the first try and reward those who invested in it or are just good at it.
That said my actual problem with current exploration has little to do with the loot spew. It has to do with CCP taking exploration out of exploration in their supposedly exploration focused expansion. It truly is just treasure hunting now and CCP doesn't seem to have any intention to bring exploring back to exploration. The change wasn't earth shattering, but it was enough of a change to kill most of my interest in the profession and unsub my exploration alt. I don't mind treasure hunting as a profession, but I didn't want to sacrifice exploration to get more of it, since I just don't have the same level of interest in the activity.
You can argue that there is only minor differences between the two, so why does it matter, but they're still important differences for some. In the same vein there are only a few differences between doing some DED sites and mission sites, but some people can tolerate DED sites quite well, while they would rather quit playing then grind missions for a living. I don't want to derail the topic, but just wanted to point this out in case anyone in CCP ever reads this, since the removal of loot spew will have pretty much zero affect in my decision to resub the exploration alt. What matters is their willingness to bring exploring, as in putting in some proper effort to even detect the signatures, back to exploration. In my book the loot spew is just a minor detail in the grand scheme of things. |
Dato Koppla
Retribution Innovations
379
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Posted - 2013.11.21 01:15:00 -
[79] - Quote
Just dropping by to agree that loot spew is indeed terrible and needs to be removed. |
Meghel
SilfMeg Mining and Transportation Co
18
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Posted - 2013.11.21 12:32:00 -
[80] - Quote
Loot Spew +ánd the Hacking Minigame are terrible.
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The Hacking Minigame was at least interesting the first 20 times. After that, it got boring and repetitive.
Click-Click-Click-Click.... Pfft, BOOOORING.
After that, I longed back for the old idea; Container hacked/Analyzed -> its open. Have fun.
There is nothing interesting regarding the Hacking that would make including it in the game worthwhile... Unless spending more time at Hacking and Analyzing is the Grand Idea that CCP has for this game.
Sounds more like someone's Pet Project; "I WANT this so we WILL GET THIS" regardless of use and desirability.
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The Loot Spew is, quite frankly, horrible.
A Bad Idea with Bad Mechanics.
"Yeah, lets add many containers, containing somtimes usefull things and sometimes junk, let them spew around so people have to try and grab then." As If the Hacking/Analyzing is not bad enough....
Again, a Useless and Time Consuming Thing
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Jayne Tamm
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
1
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Posted - 2013.11.21 14:15:00 -
[81] - Quote
What CCP need to do is the following;
When you 'Complete' the hacking mini game....you should be able to access the container and loot it.
BUT
If you 'Fail' the hacking mini game...then the container should spew the loot. Maybe decrease the time the loot stays in space so that you can only grab 2 or 3 cans if you're quick.
This would make a lot more sense in my eyes. |
Meghel
SilfMeg Mining and Transportation Co
18
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Posted - 2013.11.21 15:50:00 -
[82] - Quote
Jayne Tamm wrote:What CCP need to do is the following;
When you 'Complete' the hacking mini game....you should be able to access the container and loot it.
BUT
If you 'Fail' the hacking mini game...then the container should spew the loot. Maybe decrease the time the loot stays in space so that you can only grab 2 or 3 cans if you're quick.
This would make a lot more sense in my eyes.
I must say, that would make a LOT more sense... |
Sexy Cakes
Have A Seat
559
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Posted - 2013.11.21 16:34:00 -
[83] - Quote
Why is loot spew still in the game?
Not today spaghetti. |
dexington
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
886
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Posted - 2013.11.21 18:37:00 -
[84] - Quote
The loot spray could be removed from hackable gas sites.
It's annoying having to bring both data analyzer and cargo scanner, when you still have to fit tank and weapons. And it's even more annoying having to grab the loot, when the white could background makes it almost impossible to read the text telling you which type the can is.
I'm a relatively respectable citizen. Multiple felon perhaps, but certainly not dangerous. |
Jeremiah Saken
State War Academy
Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2013.11.21 19:52:00 -
[85] - Quote
Loot thing was introduced to EvE to encourage players to explore in group. I don't think the goal was accomplised (not for most of exploring player base). It is reflex based and some luck. There are so many post since Odyssey complaing about how bad this new mechanism is but only few what to do with whole starting idea (group exploration). I don't think it will magicaly disappear in near future but i have some ideas how to improve it:
Add some new subsystems to hacking such as:
- airlock subsystem (after hack loot will not be sprayed or sprayed with slower speed)
- grid map subsystem (after hacking it will show whole grid with unclicked subsytems covered but shown as potentialy defense nodes or user soft, player will have more influance to plan whole hack)
- can register subsystem (after hack will show can content so players will have an option to refit hull with some other equipment than cargo scanner)
all above was mainly for solo, but:
in hack attempt done in group one person is hacking and others are waiting for candies to catch. Why not let second and more person help breaking the can airlock. They just start the hack from other corner of the grid (i don't know if this kind of interaction can be implemented in code).
I really like the hacking concept. This is where solo and group exploration should focus. It has great potential not only in exploration but needs to be polished. |
AnzacPaul
Capital Storm.
JIHADASQUAD
115
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Posted - 2013.11.22 11:14:00 -
[86] - Quote
Loot spew is awful and should be removed, but it won't be. |
Ristlin Wakefield
Pentag Blade
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
366
|
Posted - 2013.11.22 18:56:00 -
[87] - Quote
Jayne Tamm wrote:What CCP need to do is the following;
When you 'Complete' the hacking mini game....you should be able to access the container and loot it.
BUT
If you 'Fail' the hacking mini game...then the container should spew the loot. Maybe decrease the time the loot stays in space so that you can only grab 2 or 3 cans if you're quick.
This would make a lot more sense in my eyes.
You are a damned Genius! That would make more sense, they could even cut the loot-spew time so you have less time to click. That would balance out the fact that you "failed" while still giving the dude who programmed the loot spew something to be proud about.
I have a lover, her name is EVE. I see her every night and all she asks in return is that I have a pilot's license. |
Lady Ariona
Adhocracy Incorporated
Adhocracy
3
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Posted - 2013.11.22 19:44:00 -
[88] - Quote
On the Hacking: The hacking is a good concept. It helps take something that was equivalent to salvaging and differentiates it. That being said, it is a little disconcertingly random at times, which can be problematic. Furthermore, there is no differentiation between Relic Analyzer and Data Analyzer, other than the type of cans that you can hack. They should work on something to make these two distinct, rather than having them basically be the same function split to two skills.
On the Loot Spew: As said multiple times, only 1-2 types of cans are useful to grab, it's tedious, it's not particularly difficult, nor is it particularly fun. It penalizes players who haven't done hacking enough to know what is worth grabbing, and is generally a PITA.
Adhocrat
Former Morsus Mihi pilot / E-UNI Graduate
Researcher into Sleeper and Talocan Technology and History |
Jeremiah Saken
State War Academy
Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2013.11.22 23:04:00 -
[89] - Quote
Quote:On the Loot Spew: As said multiple times, only 1-2 types of cans are useful to grab, it's tedious, it's not particularly difficult, nor is it particularly fun.
If you spread the loot beetwen other types of can it will become more difficult and not fun at all (especially for solo explorers). Whole concept of loot exploding in your face, in game not based on reflex and agility, is really ill. Worst part of it, as i read feedback before odyssey, explorers were indicate it as bad design. Devs are really touchy when it comes to criticize their splendid ideas. Can't blame them really but five wheel car, no matter how good it looks, is a bad design.
Quote: Furthermore, there is no differentiation between Relic Analyzer and Data Analyzer, other than the type of cans that you can hack. They should work on something to make these two distinct, rather than having them basically be the same function split to two skills.
It had sense when there was cycle on analyzer. Archeo wreck was analyzed for few cycles and show what loot is worth to grab. Now its just second hacking device with different sound. It should be just one device for all. It still has cycle time on skill so it was not really thought over.
I hope they didn't switch loot fireworks with roullete exploding mechanism from ghost sites. I don't buy the concept of this new chimera sites (they're not exploration but they need exploration devices).
This game focus strongly on PvP so other aspects of it are underestimated by Devs. EvE hits 10 and they still balancing hulls and weapons.
Hacking must be more complex. Not just click, click, click, won. |
Vladimir Norkoff
Income Redistribution Service
291
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Posted - 2013.11.25 01:16:00 -
[90] - Quote
*shrug*... Does it really matter what we think? They asked what we thought when they were rolling it out on the Test Server. We were rather up-front that it was not a very engaging mechanic and that we did not particularly enjoy it. They ignored us, rubber stamped it as "tested", and just pushed it thru. So... yeah. They'll get around to it when they feel like it. You could probably use PI as a good measuring stick.
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