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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 11 post(s) |
Alara IonStorm
RvB - BLUE Republic
430
|
Posted - 2011.11.16 21:35:00 -
[901] - Quote
Mariner6 wrote: 1) May I ask where you get this info? Is there a general all EVE kill board?
2) If this is accurate then this is by far the best stat I've seen proving the case of not just Hybrids sucking but Gallente as a whole.
http://eve-kill.net/?a=top20
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Bubanni
SniggWaffe
14
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Posted - 2011.11.16 22:03:00 -
[902] - Quote
Dont know if you know this yet, but you guys sure have butterfingers... Currently on sisi the reload time on hybrids os 0.005 sec... or insant basicly |
thoth rothschild
First Aid Emergency Service
25
|
Posted - 2011.11.16 22:07:00 -
[903] - Quote
Bubanni wrote:Dont know if you know this yet, but you guys sure have butterfingers... Currently on sisi the reload time on hybrids os 0.005 sec... or insant basicly
That would make a difference ! It makes vindicators a little scary |
Sigras
Conglomo IMPERIAL LEGI0N
46
|
Posted - 2011.11.16 22:13:00 -
[904] - Quote
Magosian wrote:Honestly? I want hybrids to do something better than lasers and projectiles. Hybrids need appeal. THAT would be a good start. No doubt tweaking of stats would be needed after the fact. A fundamental change needs to happen first. Modifying stats on a fundamentally broken turret just means you're making the weapon further excel at being broken. I honestly don't see Crucible hybrid changes fixing anything.
It's one change, maybe two, and I doubt it would be sweeping. Something like omni-damage hybrid ammo and a slight boost to range would be a good start. CCP can keep all the Crucible stuff. honestly, I dont think your proposed changes do anything more than CCPs changes . . . now instead of doing a ton of kinetic thermal damage pretty much never, blasters would do a ton of all types of damage pretty much never. unless by "slight boost to range" you mean > 200% medium sized blaster ships never get closer than 15 km . . .
Hungry Eyes wrote:sure, let them do it incrementally. as long as people realize this thing will drag out for an entire year. theyre just not getting my money until balance is established, simple as that. to me, this "expansion" is really garbage, gameplay-wise, because im not getting anything that was on that original list. maybe in 6 months, there will be something to see here.
CCP:
- hybrid/Gallente balancing - FW - nullsec - AF's
do it. until then, please dont call graphical updates "expansions." jesus. move along people, just another CCP moment.
and i want my 4.95 back. seriously. wow . . . you really havent been playing this game very long have you? or really any game . . . balance is something that takes small tweaks over a long period of time. How long after the release of starcraft were they tweaking balance changes? and they only had 3 groups to deal with, in eve the possible combinations are an order of magnitude greater than starcraft at least.
Also, way to skip over the changes they did make rail balancing (not sure how this is going to go yet) customs offices BPCs as a buff to FW (I imagine this is going to be a large FW LP sink) Supercap balancing (a HUGE nullsec change) POS Fuel changes Tier 3 battlecruisers 0.0 anomalies rebalance (another nullsec change) etc |
Magosian
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
138
|
Posted - 2011.11.16 22:16:00 -
[905] - Quote
Bubanni wrote:Dont know if you know this yet, but you guys sure have butterfingers... Currently on sisi the reload time on hybrids os 0.005 sec... or insant basicly
Eh.
Ok, another step in the right direction, and probably the FIRST of steps to change hybrids at a fundamental level. So far so good....
BUT
My ammo options are faction antimatter, dog poop, cat poop, horse poop, and cow poop. Which one doesn't stink?
No point in swapping ammo instantly when I only have one ammo type worth using. More cowbell, please.
EDIT: Hrm, come to think of it, I was on test about 12 hours ago. Is there a new client download then? I'm curious if the change is server-side or client-side. Either way, it was definitely a 5 second reload about 12 hours ago. |
Magosian
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
138
|
Posted - 2011.11.16 22:20:00 -
[906] - Quote
Sigras wrote:Magosian wrote:Honestly? I want hybrids to do something better than lasers and projectiles. Hybrids need appeal. THAT would be a good start. No doubt tweaking of stats would be needed after the fact. A fundamental change needs to happen first. Modifying stats on a fundamentally broken turret just means you're making the weapon further excel at being broken. I honestly don't see Crucible hybrid changes fixing anything.
It's one change, maybe two, and I doubt it would be sweeping. Something like omni-damage hybrid ammo and a slight boost to range would be a good start. CCP can keep all the Crucible stuff. honestly, I dont think your proposed changes do anything more than CCPs changes . . . now instead of doing a ton of kinetic thermal damage pretty much never, blasters would do a ton of all types of damage pretty much never. unless by "slight boost to range" you mean > 200% medium sized blaster ships never get closer than 15 km . . .
START is the keyword. I think we're in full agreement that "slight" increases to blaster range isn't enough on its own.
Frankly, hybrids still need character. We can worry about range after that.
|
OT Smithers
Buccaneer's Den
3
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Posted - 2011.11.16 22:46:00 -
[907] - Quote
Sigras wrote:guys, seriously what do you want?
If they make wide sweeping changes everyone screams that theyre changing too much too fast if they change incrementally everyone screams that theyre doing nothing!
Personally I'd rather have this than them buffing blaster damage and range by 500% and giving gallente 90% webs back.
Ill be the first one upset if they dont continue to tweak blasters, but really, which would you rather have; a new FOTM or them slowly turn up the heat on blasters until theyre right?
People want this and the other issues important to them fixed. Whatever CCP might say, no matter their "promises," whatever goes live now -- no matter how poorly balanced it might be -- is what we will be looking at for the forseeable future, and likely until they pull the plug on the game.
Nor is there ANY reason to believe that CCP has any intention of following through on this new direction. Already they have failed to deliver a good number of their promised features in this winter expansion. |
OT Smithers
Buccaneer's Den
3
|
Posted - 2011.11.16 22:48:00 -
[908] - Quote
Hungry Eyes wrote:Sigras wrote:guys, seriously what do you want?
If they make wide sweeping changes everyone screams that theyre changing too much too fast if they change incrementally everyone screams that theyre doing nothing!
Personally I'd rather have this than them buffing blaster damage and range by 500% and giving gallente 90% webs back.
Ill be the first one upset if they dont continue to tweak blasters, but really, which would you rather have; a new FOTM or them slowly turn up the heat on blasters until theyre right? sure, let them do it incrementally. as long as people realize this thing will drag out for an entire year. theyre just not getting my money until balance is established, simple as that. to me, this "expansion" is really garbage, gameplay-wise, because im not getting anything that was on that original list. maybe in 6 months, there will be something to see here. CCP: - hybrid/Gallente balancing - FW - nullsec - AF's do it. until then, please dont call graphical updates "expansions." jesus. move along people, just another CCP moment. and i want my 4.95 back. seriously.
+ >9000 |
Archare
SKEET ELITE
2
|
Posted - 2011.11.16 23:09:00 -
[909] - Quote
Bubanni wrote:Dont know if you know this yet, but you guys sure have butterfingers... Currently on sisi the reload time on hybrids os 0.005 sec... or insant basicly
Currently on SIsi all weapons are bugged reloading instantly including missile launchers. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=372781#post372781 |
Nemesor
Stimulus Rote Kapelle
39
|
Posted - 2011.11.16 23:09:00 -
[910] - Quote
Really it comes down to this: Would you stay with a Girlfriend that broke as many promises to you as CCP has in the last 4 years? |
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Hamox
Global Economy Experts Stellar Economy Experts
6
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Posted - 2011.11.17 00:15:00 -
[911] - Quote
I like the idea that they are going to change things slowly to prevent the creation of the next FotM. But the changes need to be done constantly and on a regular basis. If we need to wait 6 month for the next little step and than again 6 month for the next step... ... well why should we wait so long and trust you to get the job done? And what if you need 4 or 5 steps? Will we have to wait 2.5 years then? That can't be serious! Where is the hidden camera?
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Zarak1 Kenpach1
Aperture Harmonics K162
8
|
Posted - 2011.11.17 00:20:00 -
[912] - Quote
Nemesor wrote:Really it comes down to this: Would you stay with a Girlfriend that broke as many promises to you as CCP has in the last 4 years?
lol, dont let the door hit you on the way out nemmy |
Aruken Marr
BSC LEGION Tactical Narcotics Team
9
|
Posted - 2011.11.17 00:25:00 -
[913] - Quote
thoth rothschild wrote:Bubanni wrote:Dont know if you know this yet, but you guys sure have butterfingers... Currently on sisi the reload time on hybrids os 0.005 sec... or insant basicly That would make a difference ! It makes vindicators a little scary
Its a bug. They had to change time in the code from s to ms, it just hasnt transferred over into the text. I believe its the same for missiles launchers aswell. They will update it and reload is still being changed to 5 s
edit
beat me to it. Links and all lol |
Pattern Clarc
Aperture Harmonics
310
|
Posted - 2011.11.17 00:26:00 -
[914] - Quote
FYI, gallente speed boost is about 5-8% MWD speed increase with the greatest speed increase on the megathron... Ex CSM member & Designer of the Tornado. Gallente - Pilot satisfaction |
Grimpak
Midnight Elites Echelon Rising
148
|
Posted - 2011.11.17 00:40:00 -
[915] - Quote
Pattern Clarc wrote:FYI, gallente speed boost is about 5-8% MWD speed increase with the greatest speed increase on the megathron...
soo... still going slow... [img]http://eve-files.com/sig/grimpak[/img]
[quote]The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.[/quote] ain't that right |
Aloe Cloveris
The Greater Goon Clockwork Pineapple
38
|
Posted - 2011.11.17 01:00:00 -
[916] - Quote
Bubanni wrote:Dont know if you know this yet, but you guys sure have butterfingers... Currently on sisi the reload time on hybrids os 0.005 sec... or insant basicly
Hush, you.
|
Mariner6
EVE University Ivy League
34
|
Posted - 2011.11.17 01:54:00 -
[917] - Quote
Alara IonStorm wrote:Mariner6 wrote: 1) May I ask where you get this info? Is there a general all EVE kill board?
2) If this is accurate then this is by far the best stat I've seen proving the case of not just Hybrids sucking but Gallente as a whole.
http://eve-kill.net/?a=top20
Thank you. |
Sigras
Conglomo IMPERIAL LEGI0N
46
|
Posted - 2011.11.17 02:09:00 -
[918] - Quote
OT Smithers wrote:Sigras wrote:guys, seriously what do you want?
If they make wide sweeping changes everyone screams that theyre changing too much too fast if they change incrementally everyone screams that theyre doing nothing!
Personally I'd rather have this than them buffing blaster damage and range by 500% and giving gallente 90% webs back.
Ill be the first one upset if they dont continue to tweak blasters, but really, which would you rather have; a new FOTM or them slowly turn up the heat on blasters until theyre right? People want this and the other issues important to them fixed. Whatever CCP might say, no matter their "promises," whatever goes live now -- no matter how poorly balanced it might be -- is what we will be looking at for the forseeable future, and likely until they pull the plug on the game. Nor is there ANY reason to believe that CCP has any intention of following through on this new direction. Already they have failed to deliver a good number of their promised features in this winter expansion. dude, if youre not willing to give them the benefit of the doubt on an MMO i dont know what to tell you . . . After seeing the complete 180 they've done in the last few weeks i think you should cut them some slack. |
Alara IonStorm
RvB - BLUE Republic
434
|
Posted - 2011.11.17 03:42:00 -
[919] - Quote
Sigras wrote: dude, if youre not willing to give them the benefit of the doubt on an MMO i dont know what to tell you . . . After seeing the complete 180 they've done in the last few weeks i think you should cut them some slack.
I know these Whiners just don't see the hard work CCP has done. They think it is a few token changes and back to ignoring old features for new shinnies. But they don't understand this is a new direction.
So sure Tyrannis is terrible but the upcoming Incursions expansion which is full of player requested Content, Fixes and Balance Changes is the new direction. CCP finally gets it. We never have to worry about another colossal failure like Tyrannis again.
It's Gonna be a Bright Future. |
draconothese
Independant Celestial Enterprises Pink Fluffy Pussycats
3
|
Posted - 2011.11.17 05:05:00 -
[920] - Quote
anyone have the updated hybride changes ? |
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Zarak1 Kenpach1
Aperture Harmonics K162
8
|
Posted - 2011.11.17 05:11:00 -
[921] - Quote
Hybrid Turrets
Reduce CPU usage:
XL Turrets: -5 CPU L Turrets: -3 CPU M Turrets: -2 CPU S Turrets: -1 CPU
** Exception: 75mm Railguns (they already have very low CPU requirements.)
Reduce Powergrid usage:
All hybrid turrets: -12% Powergrid usage. Rounded to nearest whole number.
** Exceptions: Light Electron Blasters, Light Ion Blasters, 125mm Railguns, 75mm Railguns (they already have very low Powergrid requirements.)
Reduced Capacitor usage:
All hybrid turrets: -30% capacitor use
Tracking Speed Increase:
All blaster turrets: +20% to Tracking speed
** Exception: XL turrets (they already have good tracking when compared to other XL turrets)
Railguns
Damage Increase:
All railgun turrets: +10% to Damage modifier
** Exception: XL turrets (they already have good damage when compared to other XL turrets)
Hybrid turret ships
While I am hesitant to boost individual ships right now, I do think that a small speed boost to hybrid turret ships in general is needed. You will notice that a few hybrid turret ships are not mentioned here. The ones that are not listed are either fast enough already or they have range bonuses to hybrid turrets, which means that they are meant for longer range combat and as such should not need a velocity boost as much as other hybrid turret ships.
Max Velocity +10 on the following ships:
Arazu, Astarte, Brutix, Catalyst, Deimos, Dominix, Dominix Navy Issue, Enyo, Eos, Falcon, Guardian-Vexor, Helios, Incursus, Ishtar, Lachesis, Maulus, Megathron, Megathron Federate Issue, Megathron Navy Issue, Thorax, Tristan, Utu, Vexor, Vexor Navy Issue, Vigilant
Max Velocity +5 on the following ships: Cormorant, Federation Navy Comet, Hyperion, Kronos, Sin, Vindicator
Inertia Modifier -5% on the following ships:
Adrestia, Arazu, Ares, Astarte, Atron, Brutix, Catalyst, Celestis, Cormorant, Daredevil, Deimos, Dominix, Dominix Navy Issue, Eagle, Enyo, Eos, Eris, Exequror Navy Issue, Falcon, Federation Navy Comet, Ferox, Guardian-Vexor, Harpy, Helios, Hyperion, Incursus, Ishkur, Ishtar, Kronos, Lachesis, Maulus, Megathron, Megathron Federate Issue, Megathron Navy Issue, Merlin, Moa, Phobos, Raptor, Rokh, Sin, Taranis, Thorax, Tristan, Utu, Vexor, Vexor Navy Issue, Vigilant, Vindicator, Vulture
Tech II Ammo
I did some comparison between the tech II ammo types and found that one hybrid ammo type did indeed need some work. I also found that the other turret types had some very underwhelming ammo. Rather than limit myself to only boosting the hybrid ammo, I will also be making some changes to other tech II ammo types. Javelin is quite obviously underpowered. The correlating laser and projectile ammo, Gleam and Quake, are equally underwhelming and they all need some change. Additionally, Hail sticks out as terribly underpowered.
Javelin (all sizes): Removed cap penalty Javelin, Gleam and Quake (all sizes): Removed tracking speed penalty, added 25% tracking speed bonus Hail (all sizes): -25% falloff from -50% Also added this in the OP of this thread recently
* Hybrid turret reload time will be 5 seconds. * Hybrid ammo will be 50% smaller (and turret capacity reduced to keep same number of charges) * Blaster damage +5% (except XL turrets) * Railgun tracking +5% (except XL turrets) |
erfta
State War Academy Caldari State
2
|
Posted - 2011.11.17 05:44:00 -
[922] - Quote
>.< just spent 20 minutes reading the last 5 pages twice, this thread is full of circular arguments no one reads the TOS not even the guy that writes it. this is sig worthy http://massively.joystiq.com/2011/11/09/mortal-online-plagiarizes-eve-onlines-terms-of-service/1#c35015206 |
Spugg Galdon
APOCALYPSE LEGION The Devil's Warrior Alliance
15
|
Posted - 2011.11.17 10:13:00 -
[923] - Quote
Although I agree with CCP's tentative approach to the rebalancing of the game I also at the same time feel they (only just) haven't done enough to make a difference. In a few months time I have a feeling CCP won't have any real data on what their changes to hybrids have achieved as still no one will be using them.
I few months ago Company of Heroes was getting a major rebalance update and one of the Devs made some comments on the balance process. They mentioned that it was far better, as in more efficient, to make something that was currently very underpowered completely overpowered. Then dial it back gradually until it was where they wanted it to be. This way they found that the balance process was incredibly quick to complete as something that is OMGWTFBBQPWNEDMYASSROFL is very clear and easy to gradually draw back until balance is achieved. Instead we have a buff that is very conservative and everyone on the most part feels that blasters and the hulls designed to fit them are still very "meh".
Now I'm not suggesting that CCP make blasters and their respective ships stupidly OP and FOTM on TQ or even SISI. However if they first made them OP on their internal test server, played with them, nerfed them back down near to balanced status but still a little OP for TQ. It would be far easier for us to test them and say that "A,B and C are too good but X,Y,Z are nearly spot on". This would get us to the Balanced solution far far quicker.
Also. CCP. PLEASE!!! Look at ammo and make it more gooderer. Projectiles have fantastic choice where as Energy and Hybrids have two choices (soon to be 4 but all T2 eurrrgh) I would love something like:
Multifrequency (short range EM) : Remains as is except high EM low Thermal Infra-red (Short rng Thermal) : As MF but with hi thermal damage Gamma (short range hi RoF) : +50% RoF -50% Damage -50% optimal X-Ray (Short Range hi tracking) : -50% optimal +10% tracking low dmg Ultraviolet (Mid range Mid dmg) : +25% optimal Standard (V.Low Cap Use Mid Rng) : +25% optimal -50% cap use -20% damage Microwave (Sniper/Alpha low RoF) : +50% dmg -50% Rof +40% optimal +15% Cap use Radio (Extreme long range) : +60% optimal
Antimatter (Short rng Thermal) : Remains as is with High Thermal low Kinetic damage (75% Therm 25% Kin) Lead (Short rng Kinetic) : As AM with hi kinetic low Thermal (75% Kin 25% Therm) Uranium (Short rng Hi RoF) : +50% Rof -50% dmg -25% optimal -25% falloff Plutonium (Short rng Hi tracking) : -25% optimal & falloff +10% tracking low dmg Thorium (Hi falloff low optimal) : +50% Falloff (Mid range ammo that is ship specific [Gallente]) Iridium (Hi optimal Low falloff) : +50% Optimal (Mid range ammo that is ship specific [Caldari]) Tungsten (Sniper/Alpha low RoF) : +50% dmg -50% Rof +40% optimal & falloff +15% Cap use Iron (Extreme long range) : +60% Optimal & fall off |
SMT008
Les chevaliers de l'ordre Goonswarm Federation
215
|
Posted - 2011.11.17 11:13:00 -
[924] - Quote
Spugg Galdon wrote: Multifrequency (short range EM) : Remains as is except high EM low Thermal Infra-red (Short rng Thermal) : As MF but with hi thermal damage Gamma (short range hi RoF) : +50% RoF -50% Damage -50% optimal X-Ray (Short Range hi tracking) : -50% optimal +10% tracking low dmg Ultraviolet (Mid range Mid dmg) : +25% optimal Standard (V.Low Cap Use Mid Rng) : +25% optimal -50% cap use -20% damage Microwave (Sniper/Alpha low RoF) : +50% dmg -50% Rof +40% optimal +15% Cap use Radio (Extreme long range) : +60% optimal
Antimatter (Short rng Thermal) : Remains as is with High Thermal low Kinetic damage (75% Therm 25% Kin) Lead (Short rng Kinetic) : As AM with hi kinetic low Thermal (75% Kin 25% Therm) Uranium (Short rng Hi RoF) : +50% Rof -50% dmg -25% optimal -25% falloff Plutonium (Short rng Hi tracking) : -25% optimal & falloff +10% tracking low dmg Thorium (Hi falloff low optimal) : +50% Falloff (Mid range ammo that is ship specific [Gallente]) Iridium (Hi optimal Low falloff) : +50% Optimal (Mid range ammo that is ship specific [Caldari]) Tungsten (Sniper/Alpha low RoF) : +50% dmg -50% Rof +40% optimal & falloff +15% Cap use Iron (Extreme long range) : +60% Optimal & fall off
/Signed ! It looks great. |
Morgan North
The Wild Bunch Electus Matari
6
|
Posted - 2011.11.17 12:00:00 -
[925] - Quote
What if Hybrid ammo gave different bonuses based on the weapon being loaded was either Blaster or Railguns?
I'm talking specifically about range bonuses, allowing -some- ammo types to increase the optimal of blasters by a scale of 200% to 500%, and thusly hit at the usual "kiting" ranges.
If we left Anti-matter as it is, and instead buffed Iron, Tungsten and Lead optimal ranges to the usual kiting ranges (Around 10, 15 and 20 Km), but applied that change only to Blasters, you could see that speed wasn't necessary, merely time to swap ammonition based on the engagement range. However, these bonuses would be tied to Blasters specifically, not to Railguns. |
Pinky Denmark
The Cursed Navy Important Internet Spaceship League
35
|
Posted - 2011.11.17 12:06:00 -
[926] - Quote
I fully agree - This will not buff hybrids statwise but it will give it some edge and it's a chance to straighten out the weird cap bonuses on the ammo.
Apart from that all we need is something to make the rails unique - the blasters has the massive dps and sweet tracking buff but look at long range weapons... Artillery : no cap, select damage type, 3-4x alpha Beams : best dps, tachyons, instant reload, best tracking Railguns : average/good dps, average reload time, not the worst tracking anymore, best range
Well it might be enough - but only if all the ships gets special attention.
Gallente mass/agility boosts to compensate for armor use and gets blasters into range? A look into why caldari railgun ships don't get used (bonus and for Rokh maybe a medslot)? Active tanking. Rarely used for anything but PvE. (make crystal implants for hitpoints and boost active reps 50%)?
Pinky |
Vincent Gaines
Macabre Votum Morsus Mihi
113
|
Posted - 2011.11.17 13:29:00 -
[927] - Quote
Pinky Denmark wrote:A look into why caldari railgun ships don't get used (bonus and for Rokh maybe a medslot)?
When I would use an Eagle or Rokh (usually out of boredom) my frustration would be simple. I'd get range, easily. I'd hit, and often hit well. But damage was crap. DPS is low and Alpha is low.
See, Arties have great Alpha but lower DPS. Beams have meh alpha but nice DPS. Either way I see the damage I'm doing because after I hit and all modifiers taken into account, there is still a net amount of damage.
I really wish I had EFT or pyfit (whatever it's called) so I can compare DPS/Alpha at range.. Eagle vs. Zealot vs. Muninn |
Zarak1 Kenpach1
Aperture Harmonics K162
8
|
Posted - 2011.11.17 13:56:00 -
[928] - Quote
eagle doesnt get used because it has a double optimal bonus instead of buff to both ROF and damage unlike all the other sniper platforms. that ship simply cannot perform comparably in sniper hac fleets |
Grimpak
Midnight Elites Echelon Rising
149
|
Posted - 2011.11.17 13:59:00 -
[929] - Quote
Zarak1 Kenpach1 wrote:eagle doesnt get used because it has a double optimal bonus instead of buff to both ROF and damage unlike all the other sniper platforms. that ship simply cannot perform comparably in sniper hac fleets
you also max out the fittings by just slamming 5 250mm rails in it.
altho this will be solved on this patch. [img]http://eve-files.com/sig/grimpak[/img]
[quote]The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.[/quote] ain't that right |
Zarak1 Kenpach1
Aperture Harmonics K162
8
|
Posted - 2011.11.17 14:02:00 -
[930] - Quote
i'll check it out when i'm not on my linux machine but, if the 250's do push it into mid 300's or higher then the problem is solved |
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