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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 42 post(s) |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space
The ROC
6573
   |
Posted - 2014.05.29 17:58:00 -
[4681] - Quote
Fabulous Rod wrote:Apparently many people are same people are talking about things they don't understand.
The npcs that neut/nos you are usually weak to EM and do EM damage.
These changes are somewhat thoughtless considering that the RS doesn't even have the proper type of damage bonus against the NPCs it is strongest against.
The pvp benefits of being nos/neut immune are obvious.
An entire ship is not going to be balanced around your microscopic niche use for it in Blood Raider missions.
And as for EM damage, you can still use sentry drones with EM damage. In fact they are getting rebalanced, and imo the Amarr drones have an excellent statline.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
KaDa en Bauldry
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
69
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 18:01:00 -
[4682] - Quote
Mike Voidstar wrote:I seriously doubt he never uses either sentries or heavies. His goalposts are far to mobile for that to be true. Unless he never uses the ship, or uses it in hisec exploration sites or such, like L3s.
Which one more likely?
Don't forget about ship insurance before undocking.
Don't forget about copy-paste saving before posting. |
Fabulous Rod
Darkfall Corp
57
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 18:01:00 -
[4683] - Quote
look at all these no-life re+ards in a fit. lol. I love it when people can't admit they are wrong.
H I L A R I O U S. 
see my sig.
In reference to the Rattlesnake:
If you passive tank, you're doing it wrong.-á - Kaarous Aldurald
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4650342#post4650342 |
baltec1
Bat Country
Goonswarm Federation
11746
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 18:04:00 -
[4684] - Quote
KaDa en Bauldry wrote:Mike Voidstar wrote:I seriously doubt he never uses either sentries or heavies. His goalposts are far to mobile for that to be true. Unless he never uses the ship, or uses it in hisec exploration sites or such, like L3s. Which one more likely?
He has never used it or any other battleships. This is simply him trolling an important feedback thread.
Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship |
KaDa en Bauldry
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
69
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 18:05:00 -
[4685] - Quote
Fabulous Rod wrote:look at all these no-life re+ards in a fit. lol. I love it when people can't admit they are wrong. H I L A R I O U S. see my sig.
Do I also get to see an editing of this?
*waits*
Don't forget about ship insurance before undocking.
Don't forget about copy-paste saving before posting. |
KaDa en Bauldry
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
69
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 18:06:00 -
[4686] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:KaDa en Bauldry wrote:Mike Voidstar wrote:I seriously doubt he never uses either sentries or heavies. His goalposts are far to mobile for that to be true. Unless he never uses the ship, or uses it in hisec exploration sites or such, like L3s. Which one more likely? He has never used it or any other battleships. This is simply him trolling an important feedback thread.
Any theory on why that is allowed?
Don't forget about ship insurance before undocking.
Don't forget about copy-paste saving before posting. |
Mike Voidstar
Voidstar Free Flight Foundation
663
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 18:07:00 -
[4687] - Quote
Fabulous Rod wrote:I would also like to point out that the npcs that neut/nos you are usually weak to EM and do EM damage.
These changes are somewhat thoughtless considering that the RS doesn't even have the proper type of damage bonus against the NPCs it is strongest against.
The pvp benefits of being nos/neut immune are obvious.
Passive shield tanking is what the RS does best and it makes much better use of that with missile velocity on its torpedoes for battleships and bonused light and medium drones to clean up everything else.
It doesn't need a specialize thermic and kinetic damage bonus. An additional low slot would serve what this ship does best far better.
Thermal works pretty well against Bloodraiders too.
There's this thing that happens, where one thing is the best but another thing is about 90% as good... That second thing does not become magically useless anywhere but in internet arguments. It still works fine in real life.
A universal damage bonus would be great. I have argued against the Caldari kinetic bonus (despite not flying Caldari ships) on more than one occasion because I feel missiles as a system are balanced around fully selectable damage. The Gurista bonus of Thermal and Kinetic alleviates almost all of that concern, as most things are at least disadvantaged to one of those two resists. |
baltec1
Bat Country
Goonswarm Federation
11746
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 18:09:00 -
[4688] - Quote
KaDa en Bauldry wrote:
Any theory on why that is allowed?
No idea, he should have been banned several hundred deleted pages ago according to the rules.
Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship |
Fabulous Rod
Darkfall Corp
57
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 18:13:00 -
[4689] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:KaDa en Bauldry wrote:
Any theory on why that is allowed?
No idea, he should have been banned several hundred deleted pages ago according to the rules.
that is the price of being a no-life forum clown. no credibility.
In reference to the Rattlesnake:
If you passive tank, you're doing it wrong.-á - Kaarous Aldurald
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4650342#post4650342 |
baltec1
Bat Country
Goonswarm Federation
11748
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 18:58:00 -
[4690] - Quote
Fabulous Rod wrote:Bottom line is the Rattlesnake is supposed to be the drone users pirate faction battleship but with these changes it has less than half the drone system as a domi with only 175m3 drone bay space and bonuses to only half its drones.
The Rattlesnakes role and strength is its versatility and its ability to passive shield-tank. There is no better battleship for passive shield tanking, an ability that is strongest against ships that Neut/NOS, which are weakest against EM damage when it comes to NPCs.
For a brawling, torpedo-using RS, sentries and heavy drones hardly get any use. Optimal play with this ship involves targeting torpedos onto battleships and using light and medium drones to clean up everything else.
The proposed changes are major nerfs to the way a Rattlesnake is uniquely optimized.
The rattle you just described is a terrible fit. The new rattle will outclass your old rattle in every way.
Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space
The ROC
6575
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 19:00:00 -
[4691] - Quote
Fabulous Rod wrote:Bottom line is the Rattlesnake is supposed to be the drone users pirate faction battleship but with these changes it has less than half the drone system as a domi with only 175m3 drone bay space and bonuses to only half its drones.
Wrong.
It's supposed to be whatever the developers say it is. They say it's a hybrid drone/missile ship.
The end.
Quote:
The Rattlesnakes role and strength is its versatility and its ability to passive shield-tank.
Wrong.
Quote:
There is no better battleship for passive shield tanking, an ability that is strongest against ships that Neut/NOS, which are weakest against EM damage when it comes to NPCs.
Lol. If you ever bother getting your Capacitor Management skill above 1, you will find out that a passive tank is pretty well pointless unless you only fly ships while afk.
Quote:
Optimal play with this ship involves targeting torpedos onto battleships and using light and medium drones to clean up everything else.
False.
Quote:
The proposed changes are major nerfs to the way a Rattlesnake is uniquely optimized.
The changes are major nerfs to everyone doing it as wrong as you. Those people don't matter.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
KaDa en Bauldry
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
70
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 19:01:00 -
[4692] - Quote
Fabulous Rod wrote: is supposed to be.
The Rattlesnake used to be a missile ship, while the Armageddon was a Laser ship.
Now both are droneships.
CCP changes roles all the time.
Don't forget about ship insurance before undocking.
Don't forget about copy-paste saving before posting. |
Fabulous Rod
Darkfall Corp
57
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 19:04:00 -
[4693] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:RABBLEDABBLE
HAHA!
I know, kid.
See my sig. 
In reference to the Rattlesnake:
If you passive tank, you're doing it wrong.-á - Kaarous Aldurald
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4650342#post4650342 |
Mike Voidstar
Voidstar Free Flight Foundation
663
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 19:08:00 -
[4694] - Quote
Fabulous Rod wrote:Bottom line is the Rattlesnake is supposed to be the drone users pirate faction battleship but with these changes it has less than half the drone system as a domi with only 175m3 drone bay space and bonuses to only half its drones.
Hyperbole. Large drones get the same bonus. It does lack the drone damage application bonus, but against large targets that's not an issue. It also lacks bonus to smaller drones, which is a significant yet still miniscule portion of a Dominix's ability---and which you can choose to replace with missiles.
Fabulous Rod wrote:The Rattlesnakes role and strength is its versatility and its ability to passive shield-tank. There is no better battleship for passive shield tanking, an ability that is strongest against ships that Neut/NOS, which are weakest against EM damage when it comes to NPCs.
It has more roles than just that particular pigeon hole. It's passive tank is impressive, and it's keeping it. It's also gaining huge benefits in other areas, and losing very little in functionality that isn't simply being shifted to another area that was previously simply an afterthought on the hull.
The EM hole argument is pointless. Therm is a secondary hole for those ships, and you can use EM drones. The ship may not have the absolute bestest possible bonus for that particular situation, but it's still getting massively improved from it's current state in that circumstance.
Fabulous Rod wrote:For a brawling, torpedo-using RS, sentries and heavy drones hardly get any use. Optimal play with this ship involves targeting torpedos onto battleships and using light and medium drones to clean up everything else.
Now you are doing it wrong. Heavies are for brawling. Brawling is short range combat where travel time is mitigated, which is where heavies shine. If you are in Torpedo range, you are also in a decent range for use of Heavy drones, even with the velocity bonus, which you won't have anymore. I'm not sure where you got your idea of Optimal play, but focusing all your fire on one ship at a time is always the most optimal as you negate the effects of any regeneration the enemy tank may have, unless you are at the point where your single volley is more than the EHP of the target. Sentries actually rule at that, as they automatically switch to the next target when it dies rather than wasting DPS shooting a dead ship.
Fabulous Rod wrote:The proposed changes are major nerfs to the way a Rattlesnake is uniquely optimized.
Not really. I suppose it's major for the insignificant niche you optimize it for.
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ISD Ezwal
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
1440
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 19:43:00 -
[4695] - Quote
Been there, seen that, done that. And doing it all again. Deja vu anyone?
I have removed some rule breaking posts and those quoting them (again). As always I let some edge cases stay. (again)
Please people, keep it on topic and above all civil!
I sincerely hope this aforementioned request is not as futile as it has proven to be when posted previously in this thread.
The Rules:
2. Be respectful toward others at all times.
The purpose of the EVE Online forums is to provide a platform for exchange of ideas, and a venue for the discussion of EVE Online. Occasionally there will be conflicts that arise when people voice opinions. Forum users are expected to be courteous when disagreeing with others.
4. Personal attacks are prohibited.
Commonly known as flaming, personal attacks are posts that are designed to personally berate or insult another forum user. Posts of this nature are not beneficial to the community spirit that CCP promote and as such they will not be tolerated.
5. Trolling is prohibited.
Trolling is a defined as a post that is deliberately designed for the purpose of angering and insulting other players in an attempt to incite retaliation or an emotional response. Posts of this nature are disruptive, often abusive and do not contribute to the sense of community that CCP promote.
10. Discussion of warnings and bans is prohibited.
Such matters shall remain private between CCP and the involved user. Questions or comments concerning warnings and bans will be conveyed through email or private messaging. CCP respect the right of our players to privacy and as such you are not permitted to publicize private correspondence (including petition responses and emails) received from any of the aforementioned parties.
26. Off-topic posting is prohibited.
Off-topic posting is permitted within reason, as sometimes a single comment may color or lighten the tone of discussion. However, excessive posting of off-topic remarks in an attempt to derail a thread may result in the thread being locked, or a forum warning being issued.
ISD Ezwal
Captain
Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)
Interstellar Services Department |
|
Sniper Smith
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
169
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 19:51:00 -
[4696] - Quote
ISD Ezwal wrote:Been there, seen that, done that. And doing it all again. Deja vu anyone?
I have removed some rule breaking posts and those quoting them (again). As always I let some edge cases stay. (again)
Please people, keep it on topic and above all civil!
I sincerely hope this aforementioned request is not as futile as it has proven to be when posted previously in this thread.
You deleted almost every post that has happened since your last time here.. Must have been what? 10 pages...
What's the saying? Definition of Insanity is doing the same thing over and over expecting different results :)
Still, it makes this thread readable.. for at least a little while.. well.. till the next time.. |
Fabulous Rod
Darkfall Corp
57
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 20:41:00 -
[4697] - Quote
I will compile a collection of all the complaints about the RS from posters in this thread about the RS so the devs get a clear picture of what people are saying without having to wade through all the nonsensical spam comming from a handful of the same individuals.
In reference to the Rattlesnake:
If you passive tank, you're doing it wrong.-á - Kaarous Aldurald
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4650342#post4650342 |
Tempban Darkfall
Darkfall Corp
35
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 20:49:00 -
[4698] - Quote
Because of the loss of bonuses on all its drones and change to missile specialization, decreasing the preferability of drone damage amps, the Rattlesnake will be forced to gimp its potential damage and range by equipping launchers that are capable of hitting smaller, faster targets. This makes the ship fairly weak when in combat with larger ships, especially when you consider how much easier it is to deal with 1 drone than 5.
When facing a Rattlesnake, enemies will know exactly what types of damage to tank for.
Instead of a 50% damage bonus to missiles, more slots are needed on the Rattlesnake to give strengthen to its versatility and passive tanking ability, not a specialized damage for both missiles and drones. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space
The ROC
6577
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 20:53:00 -
[4699] - Quote
Reported for alt posting.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Fabulous Rod
Darkfall Corp
57
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 20:58:00 -
[4700] - Quote
accidental post.
it would be nice if there was an option to delete your post. oh well, sorry ISD.
In reference to the Rattlesnake:
If you passive tank, you're doing it wrong.-á - Kaarous Aldurald
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4650342#post4650342 |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space
The ROC
6578
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 21:07:00 -
[4701] - Quote
That, or you thought you needed to dredge up some "valid complaints", decided to sock puppet, and got caught faster than you expected.
Since you cut and pasted the top post of this page right onto the one below it, that's the theory I am going for.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Fabulous Rod
Darkfall Corp
57
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 21:09:00 -
[4702] - Quote
Try to stay on topic, you obnoxious twit.
Haven't you embarrassed yourself enough in this thread?
In reference to the Rattlesnake:
If you passive tank, you're doing it wrong.-á - Kaarous Aldurald
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4650342#post4650342 |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space
The ROC
6578
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 21:21:00 -
[4703] - Quote
Fabulous Rod wrote:
I tried doing the Amarr epic arc mission in a Golem once and had to warp out 3-4 times on the final part because I kept getting NOSed dry. That doesn't happen on a Rattlesnake.
Lol. This explains a lot.
Quoting this so you can't edit it out.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
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ISD Ezwal
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
1442
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 21:35:00 -
[4704] - Quote
I'm temporarily locking this thread for a cool down period.
CCP will be informed about the state of this thread and the frequency of the rule infractions occurring in it.
I have also removed some off topic posts.
ISD Ezwal
Captain
Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)
Interstellar Services Department |
|
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ISD Ezwal
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
1442
|
Posted - 2014.05.30 02:06:00 -
[4705] - Quote
Sniper Smith wrote:What's the saying? Definition of Insanity is doing the same thing over and over expecting different results :) If trying to keep a Developer feedback thread as readable and constructive as possible defines me as insane, then so be it...
That said, I have further cleaned the thread and have come to the conclusion that the cool down period has brought the temperature down to an acceptable level. So the thread is reopened.
There are a few points I want to make absolutely clear at this point:
- Do not discuss forum moderation from this post onwards.
- Do not discuss possible warnings or bans.
- Keep the discussion constructive and refrain from repeating the same points of view over and over.
- Give your feedback in a clear, straightforward way and be to the point.
- Do NOT break any of the forum rules. This thread has cost CCL a lot of work and our patience is running low with it. Rule breakers therefore will get reported.
ISD Ezwal
Captain
Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)
Interstellar Services Department |
|
Sniper Smith
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
171
|
Posted - 2014.05.30 02:36:00 -
[4706] - Quote
You are a Hero and a Prince sir :)
Now that this thread is another 13 or so pages shorter.. lol..
Still not a fan of the lost utility with the lost drones.. But guess that's not gonna change lol.. CCP should buff the Logi and ECM strength of the large versions accordingly.. to make up for it.. ( not to the 7.5 that the DPS has, but just so they act as 5 like they should ).. that or treat it like a normal weapon system, and give us our implants! |
Rowells
Unknown Soldiers
Fidelas Constans
704
|
Posted - 2014.05.30 02:41:00 -
[4707] - Quote
ISD Ezwal wrote:If trying to keep a Developer feedback thread as readable and constructive as possible defines me as insane, then so be it... thats the spirit! |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
5683
|
Posted - 2014.05.30 03:18:00 -
[4708] - Quote
The phrase "First world problems" comes to mind.
Relative strengths and weaknesses change, this is an intended part of the re balancing process.
It keeps EVE from becoming stale.
If you don't like how one ship has changed you have plenty of options available, or change how you use the ship you're in now to compliment it's new strengths.
It's not rocket surgery... well, actually it IS... but you get my point. 
To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors.
If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
baltec1
Bat Country
Goonswarm Federation
11748
|
Posted - 2014.05.30 09:22:00 -
[4709] - Quote
After testing the Rattle with torp fits I think it can get away with the CPU it has although it would be nice to be able to fit torps and a large shield booster without needing a CPU mod. In PvE you also dont need to have flights of lights, the sentries will blap any frig at range and the Ogre IIs will crush them at close range fast enough for it not to be a problem. Personally I would use cruise missiles for pvp for their range, application and easier fitting.
PvP wise a torp rattle is rather effective at whacking cruisers when used in a small gang but becomes a monster vs BC.
Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship |
Egravant Alduin
republic fleet battle support
144
|
Posted - 2014.05.30 10:03:00 -
[4710] - Quote
After I tried gecko in current rattlesnake which i think they are great drones and with them the ship really shines I am a little worried about new rattlesnake which will be able to launch only one.The thing is that in pve they will draw so much aggro and they will die easily .
That's my real concern for new rattlesnake.I would prefer a smaller bonus and able to control more drones than this probably. |
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