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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 9 post(s) |
Sentient Blade
Crisis Atmosphere
1381
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Posted - 2014.10.16 15:14:00 -
[151] - Quote
Cloaked ships decloaking each other is a pain in the ass and it made for (and will again make for) *terrible* game play... If you could see where your fleets ships were that would be acceptable, but you can't, so no. |
Kraschyn Thek'athor
Die..Brut
32
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Posted - 2014.10.16 15:16:00 -
[152] - Quote
Analysis: This nerf favors the CFC and weakens N3. - The CFC is Subcapital heavy. - Bombers with Anti-Cap-Void Bomb can operate rather freely without need of tight formation like for bomb runs. - The Anti-Cap-Void Bomb is not good for a force that uses capitals, so N3. - The faster reload for the bomb launcher is not to much helpful, since it takes longer to put the bombers into position.
The signature increase is bad for Solo-Bombers hunting ratters.
We will see again either magic hand bomberwings or the rare, specialised groups.
Question to the Devs. Have you tried yourself these changes in organizing 50x Bombers with the developers? Or is it again ccp-theorycraft? |
King Fu Hostile
Imperial Collective Unsettled.
166
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Posted - 2014.10.16 15:17:00 -
[153] - Quote
CCP,
are you aware that there are other ships that use cloaks besides ISBotted bombers?
You need to ban it, and not buff it with these changes.
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Sbrodor
Oscura Simmetria Yulai Federation
21
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Posted - 2014.10.16 15:17:00 -
[154] - Quote
allowing to bomber to see each other in fleet is lore-oriented and may help real people to co-op. i still think deployin some smartbomb on dominix will make them invulnerable to bomb but at least we have some small chance aganist others.
i will remmeber the old shoold bomber bar NOT had the limit of 6 bomb per run because bomb dont apply damage each others so at moment we are at the edge of collapse. the "old" decloack + new limit to 6 bomb + smartbomb + 12 sec flight time + antibomber bubblers + more sign + more align time allow only the use of gokus. i can accept to redirect to goku style but it is absolutily different gameplay (target pew pew, bcast rep) and in some way is the "usual" gameplay killing the different-way to play of steath bomber.
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Lugh Crow-Slave
Guardians of the Morrigan
142
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 15:18:00 -
[155] - Quote
LUMINOUS SPIRIT wrote:1. Capital Void Bombs
A. For wormhole PvP, 4000 explosion radius is too much. Most capitals are 3000m long. As it stands you need about 10 hits to neut out an archon, which is more then 1 bombing run. And you cant target paint them. And you cant hit capitals while they are not triaged and moving. Seems you dont wish the bomb to be used in wormholes?
B. AoE 1 meter - most triaged capitals still drift a few meters per second for a minute, and can be bumped slightly all the time. Its not really nice to have to wait and wait for the capital to stop drifting. maybe AoE range of 500m is more appropriate, or make this thing not a bomb but some kind of super-torpedo that has no AoE but does not miss either. Actually super-neut torpedoes would be more interesting then capital void bombs :)
But anyways, I can allready see that as soon as these bombs come out, enemy fleet will bump their own archon a bit.
2. Decloaking
This is a massive nerf to all cloaked ships. I am not talking about bombers, I am talking about recons and T3s we use in wormholes. I would be fine with it if I could see cloaked fleet members nearby, but otherwise, no.
I would ask that you hold off on this nerf until you implement ability for fleet members to see each other cloaked first.
I think it is because the bombs were intended to be used on suppers more than caps but that's just what i got from it.
and yes this does feel like they couldn't work out or be bothered with a way to enforce a ban on isboxer so they tried to nerf it. all they did was make it so isboxer is almost required to pull off bombing runs even if they made it so you could see other fleet members organizing a human bombing run is going to be almost un doable.
as for how this affects WH space CCP rarely even considers it, the few changes we got seemed to be things a few devs were working on in their spare time |
Benito Arias
Angry Mustellid The Periphery
59
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 15:18:00 -
[156] - Quote
Yi Hyori wrote:Anyway, so the fact that the decloak change has been confirmed, please take a moment to remember what CCP said when they implemented that change. The patch note said something along the lines of, "oh hey yea its a bug and we're finally fixing. npnp bros." and covert ops rejoiced for their cloaked ships decloaking each other was fixed. Yup. Quoting patch notes for Crucible:
Quote:Patch Notes for Crucible 2011-11-29 00:00 Patch notes for EVE Online: Crucible
-snip- Fixes -snip-
Modules
-snip- Cloaked ships will no longer decloak other cloaked ships. -snip- So. Why do we have a global module change hiding under SB-only title? Was it a bug back then? It it was, are you reintroducing it, or has it stopped being a bug? It it wasn't, well... Commit, mkay? :) |
Domanique Altares
Rifterlings Point Blank Alliance
3395
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 15:20:00 -
[157] - Quote
Arsine Mayhem wrote:Fleet of 20 bombers warps into their target. 20 bombers land and decloak. Takes longer to align.
Epic game mechanics once again from fozzie.
You mean a bad fleet of bombers that didn't bother to plan their run even a couple of minutes ahead of time and have a warp-through point set up, alleviating most if not all align time?
Epic fail from bad bomber wings. "i advice you to go spit on the back of someone else because you are fall on the wrong horse." - Meio Rayliegh |
Anthar Thebess
772
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 15:20:00 -
[158] - Quote
After some thoughts - this will heavily impact dreads. While in siege they are just big sitting ducks. Two of them will be hit the most : - moros - revelation
NO CAP: - unable to jump out - unable to fire.
Can we get some boost to those dreads, especially revelation? Can we make all dreadnoughts similar? No cap usage for capital guns?
New Gate Connections in EVE! Support idea for new gates that will make some more places to thrive. |
Domanique Altares
Rifterlings Point Blank Alliance
3395
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 15:21:00 -
[159] - Quote
Benito Arias wrote: It it wasn't, well... Commit, mkay? :)
Fozzie just did. He committed to reverting a previous change.
You should commit to learning to operate in the new environment. "i advice you to go spit on the back of someone else because you are fall on the wrong horse." - Meio Rayliegh |
Nys Cron
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
38
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 15:23:00 -
[160] - Quote
Cloakies decloaking other cloakies: This means that only mutliboxers will be able to coordinate bombing correctly, you are buffing mutliboxers which are seen as a problem by many and nerfing fleets of mutliple people. Maybe this is intentional.
Capital void bombs: You are introducing a mechanic that has no viable counter, there is no way for a triaged Carrier or sieged Dread to do anything against this. Normal neuts can be dealt with by applying EWAR or damage to them but this has no counter. I don't think this is fun gameplay and such mechanics should be in the game. |
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Lugh Crow-Slave
Guardians of the Morrigan
142
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 15:23:00 -
[161] - Quote
Anthar Thebess wrote:After some thoughts - this will heavily impact dreads. While in siege they are just big sitting ducks. Two of them will be hit the most : - moros - revelation
NO CAP: - unable to jump out - unable to fire.
Can we get some boost to those dreads, especially revelation? Can we make all dreadnoughts similar? No cap usage for capital guns?
no to making dreads similar difference is what makes this game if you want capless guns use a dread that supports that |
MASSADEATH
MASS A DEATH Mordus Angels
58
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 15:24:00 -
[162] - Quote
Kraschyn Thek'athor wrote:
Question to the Devs. Have you tried yourself these changes in organizing 50x Bombers with the developers? Or is it again ccp-theorycraft?
EXACTLY!!!
have any of the devs ACTUALLY tried to get a few waves of bombing runs off in TIDI, with the battlefield littered with stuff, and 24+ pilots possibly DCing, and or running into crap, bubbles up everywhere and wrecks, and or being newbs...ITS LIKE HERDING CATS>>>like a vast herd of cats
its not easy to do at all.... its very hard as it is....
If the issue is ISOBOXERS(which always seem to get clean bomb runs off) then deal with that issue... but the organization to get 24+ individual players to get bombing runs off is a nightmare already
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Lugh Crow-Slave
Guardians of the Morrigan
142
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 15:24:00 -
[163] - Quote
Nys Cron wrote:Cloakies decloaking other cloakies: This means that only mutliboxers will be able to coordinate bombing correctly, you are buffing mutliboxers which are seen as a problem by many and nerfing fleets of mutliple people. Maybe this is intentional.
Capital void bombs: You are introducing a mechanic that has no viable counter, there is no way for a triaged Carrier or sieged Dread to do anything against this. Normal neuts can be dealt with by applying EWAR or damage to them but this has no counter. I don't think this is fun gameplay and such mechanics should be in the game.
with the changes to bomb speed a few smart bombs are your counter |
Domanique Altares
Rifterlings Point Blank Alliance
3395
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 15:25:00 -
[164] - Quote
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:all they did was make it so isboxer is almost required to pull off bombing runs even if they made it so you could see other fleet members organizing a human bombing run is going to be almost un doable.
ISBoxer was never required to pull off bombing runs prior to the change in 2012. It will not be required now. Learn to organize, learn to voice comms, learn to use the features of the game client, and learn to research and read. Everything you ever wanted to know about planning and executing a bombing run under these "new" circumstances is available to be absorbed, because it has all been done before. "i advice you to go spit on the back of someone else because you are fall on the wrong horse." - Meio Rayliegh |
Lugh Crow-Slave
Guardians of the Morrigan
142
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 15:26:00 -
[165] - Quote
Domanique Altares wrote:Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:all they did was make it so isboxer is almost required to pull off bombing runs even if they made it so you could see other fleet members organizing a human bombing run is going to be almost un doable.
ISBoxer was never required to pull off bombing runs prior to the change in 2012. It will not be required now. Learn to organize, learn to voice comms, learn to use the features of the game client, and learn to research and read. Everything you ever wanted to know about planning and executing a bombing run under these "new" circumstances is available to be absorbed, because it has all been done before.
b4 2012 we had a smaller sig so getting headshotted when some one messed up wasn't as big a problem |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
10081
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 15:26:00 -
[166] - Quote
Anthar Thebess wrote:After some thoughts - this will heavily impact dreads. While in siege they are just big sitting ducks. Two of them will be hit the most : - moros - revelation
NO CAP: - unable to jump out - unable to fire.
Can we get some boost to those dreads, especially revelation? Can we make all dreadnoughts similar? No cap usage for capital guns?
This is a pretty good point. The Revelation needs buffed anyways, and Siege as a concept needs redone pretty badly as well.
As for capless guns, I have to say no, the less of that we have in this game the better. But the Capital Energy Weapons are begging to be looked at. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs. |
FT Diomedes
The Graduates Forged of Fire
565
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 15:29:00 -
[167] - Quote
Some of these changes are just plain terrible and stupid. The rest are mediocre. This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine. |
Nys Cron
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
39
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 15:29:00 -
[168] - Quote
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:with the changes to bomb speed a few smart bombs are your counter
So you either sacrifice two highslots on the Carrier (why are you even bringing one then?) or you have to position ships around it in all directions (you don't know where the bombs will come from). This would require a lot of ships and is not really feasible, especially in wspace. |
Max Kolonko
High Voltage Industries Ash Alliance
460
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 15:31:00 -
[169] - Quote
Does the new bubbles take the same amount of space? Or to put it in another way: will we be able to get more of those in probe launcher than 3?
Also would like to rise the tactical overlay aspect of 1m bomb.
Also, while we are talking about cap warefare with those... CAN I HAZ CAPACITOR MAINTANANCE BOT DRONES PLOX? Read and support: Don't mess with OUR WH's What is Your stance on WH stuff? |
Domanique Altares
Rifterlings Point Blank Alliance
3396
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 15:33:00 -
[170] - Quote
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:Domanique Altares wrote:Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:all they did was make it so isboxer is almost required to pull off bombing runs even if they made it so you could see other fleet members organizing a human bombing run is going to be almost un doable.
ISBoxer was never required to pull off bombing runs prior to the change in 2012. It will not be required now. Learn to organize, learn to voice comms, learn to use the features of the game client, and learn to research and read. Everything you ever wanted to know about planning and executing a bombing run under these "new" circumstances is available to be absorbed, because it has all been done before. b4 2012 we had a smaller sig so getting headshotted when some one messed up wasn't as big a problem
Getting shot happens. That's part of EVE.
People in this thread are behaving as if ISBoxer is the only way these bombing runs happen, and that's a complete fabrication. Can it be more precise? Surely. Is it the only way? No. "i advice you to go spit on the back of someone else because you are fall on the wrong horse." - Meio Rayliegh |
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Arsine Mayhem
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
329
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 15:33:00 -
[171] - Quote
Domanique Altares wrote:Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:all they did was make it so isboxer is almost required to pull off bombing runs even if they made it so you could see other fleet members organizing a human bombing run is going to be almost un doable.
ISBoxer was never required to pull off bombing runs prior to the change in 2012. It will not be required now. Learn to organize, learn to voice comms, learn to use the features of the game client, and learn to research and read. Everything you ever wanted to know about planning and executing a bombing run under these "new" circumstances is available to be absorbed, because it has all been done before.
Show me on the ship where the bomber touched you. |
Obsidian Hawk
RONA Corporation RONA Directorate
1201
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 15:33:00 -
[172] - Quote
Dear haters! HAHAHA Learn to adapt. These are decent changes and wont kill bombing runs. Most bombing runs involve ships landing on a bubble anyway and going launch and warp out and since most people put nano's in the lows anyway... i dont see what the problem is. |
LUMINOUS SPIRIT
The Dark Space Initiative Scary Wormhole People
596
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 15:34:00 -
[173] - Quote
Nys Cron wrote:Cloakies decloaking other cloakies: This means that only mutliboxers will be able to coordinate bombing correctly, you are buffing mutliboxers which are seen as a problem by many and nerfing fleets of mutliple people. Maybe this is intentional.
Capital void bombs: You are introducing a mechanic that has no viable counter, there is no way for a triaged Carrier or sieged Dread to do anything against this. Normal neuts can be dealt with by applying EWAR or damage to them but this has no counter. I don't think this is fun gameplay and such mechanics should be in the game.
The void bombs seem fine against supers, maybe even make them stronger, but please don't introduce the ability for one multiboxer to alpha a carrier's cap without a possiblity to counter that.
You have 12 seconds to ask on comms to get bumped by 1 meter once these bombs come out. Not so hard, it takes 5 seconds to react and another 3-4 seconds for a cruiser to slam into your archon and nudge it by 1-5 meters. |
Lugh Crow-Slave
Guardians of the Morrigan
142
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 15:35:00 -
[174] - Quote
Nys Cron wrote:Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:with the changes to bomb speed a few smart bombs are your counter So you either sacrifice two highslots on the Carrier (why are you even bringing one then?) or you have to position ships around it in all directions (you don't know where the bombs will come from). This would require a lot of ships and is not really feasible, especially in wspace.
yes and you can give up 2 slots on a carrier you may not be able to cap trans or you may have weaker reps but it is do able and if you have a second carrier to refit off as situations change this is not unreasonable |
Domanique Altares
Rifterlings Point Blank Alliance
3396
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 15:36:00 -
[175] - Quote
Arsine Mayhem wrote:Domanique Altares wrote:Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:all they did was make it so isboxer is almost required to pull off bombing runs even if they made it so you could see other fleet members organizing a human bombing run is going to be almost un doable.
ISBoxer was never required to pull off bombing runs prior to the change in 2012. It will not be required now. Learn to organize, learn to voice comms, learn to use the features of the game client, and learn to research and read. Everything you ever wanted to know about planning and executing a bombing run under these "new" circumstances is available to be absorbed, because it has all been done before. Show me on the ship where the bomber touched you.
Do you even realize what the hell you just posted? Did you read what I posted? Obviously not. "i advice you to go spit on the back of someone else because you are fall on the wrong horse." - Meio Rayliegh |
Lugh Crow-Slave
Guardians of the Morrigan
142
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 15:37:00 -
[176] - Quote
Domanique Altares wrote:Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:Domanique Altares wrote:Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:all they did was make it so isboxer is almost required to pull off bombing runs even if they made it so you could see other fleet members organizing a human bombing run is going to be almost un doable.
ISBoxer was never required to pull off bombing runs prior to the change in 2012. It will not be required now. Learn to organize, learn to voice comms, learn to use the features of the game client, and learn to research and read. Everything you ever wanted to know about planning and executing a bombing run under these "new" circumstances is available to be absorbed, because it has all been done before. b4 2012 we had a smaller sig so getting headshotted when some one messed up wasn't as big a problem Getting shot happens. That's part of EVE. People in this thread are behaving as if ISBoxer is the only way these bombing runs happen, and that's a complete fabrication. Can it be more precise? Surely. Is it the only way? No.
but it is the best way with no down side and now they are making it even more attractive to use rather then organize |
Ammzi
Love Squad Pasta Syndicate
1859
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 15:38:00 -
[177] - Quote
LUMINOUS SPIRIT wrote: You have 12 seconds to ask on comms to get bumped by 1 meter once these bombs come out. Not so hard, it takes 5 seconds to react and another 3-4 seconds for a cruiser to slam into your archon and nudge it by 1-5 meters.
^people who have no idea how hitboxes work. |
Nys Cron
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
39
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 15:39:00 -
[178] - Quote
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:yes and you can give up 2 slots on a carrier you may not be able to cap trans or you may have weaker reps but it is do able and if you have a second carrier to refit off as situations change this is not unreasonable
With only two reps there is not much reason to bring a carrier, T2 Logi will be better in every way. You also won't refit quick enough when the bombs are already flying. And you only get one chance. Finally, bringing two carriers is not even an option most of the time in wspace, especially for smaller entities and after it is made much harder to extract after the jump drive changes. |
Domanique Altares
Rifterlings Point Blank Alliance
3396
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 15:40:00 -
[179] - Quote
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:Domanique Altares wrote:Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:Domanique Altares wrote:Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:all they did was make it so isboxer is almost required to pull off bombing runs even if they made it so you could see other fleet members organizing a human bombing run is going to be almost un doable.
ISBoxer was never required to pull off bombing runs prior to the change in 2012. It will not be required now. Learn to organize, learn to voice comms, learn to use the features of the game client, and learn to research and read. Everything you ever wanted to know about planning and executing a bombing run under these "new" circumstances is available to be absorbed, because it has all been done before. b4 2012 we had a smaller sig so getting headshotted when some one messed up wasn't as big a problem Getting shot happens. That's part of EVE. People in this thread are behaving as if ISBoxer is the only way these bombing runs happen, and that's a complete fabrication. Can it be more precise? Surely. Is it the only way? No. but it is the best way with no down side and now they are making it even more attractive to use rather then organize
Then use ISBoxer. Or get over it. "i advice you to go spit on the back of someone else because you are fall on the wrong horse." - Meio Rayliegh |
ulililillia
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
94
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Posted - 2014.10.16 15:41:00 -
[180] - Quote
Domanique Altares wrote:
Then use ISBoxer. Or get over it.
What a great way of thinking, you should work for CCP. |
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