Originally by: Harleigh

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Ok .. As an alliance leader .. I am truly saddened by the current state of affairs that CCP has put this game into.

I have played this game for years and yes I know what lag is .. and I expect lag .. but loosing synch is a whole other matter. Tonight we held a gate with about 80 - 100 people .. and 100 hostiles jumped in and local spiked to 516.. we saw 2 red targets the whole time. A couple of players tried to re-log .. over 15 minutes to do so. This is the same crap we ran into in UEJ. In fact at one point local channel was funny as people were reporting how many people they saw in local. The numbers ranged from 340 - 516 at the same time.

One pilot who came jumped in after the meele started then reported that the gate was covered in reds and we were getting shot .. one of my pilots sitting happily in his ship got a mail .. it was his killmail ..

This is not localized to the north either .. while waiting for my pilot to log on, I was in MSN chat with some guys in the south .. they had 500 in local .. and things were so bad that they could not employ capitals and were left just ganking ships that were stuck in space and unresponsive. That my fellow gamers is not fleet combat.

This is material I believe belongs in CAOD as none of the general EVE population in empire will experience it. They have introduced so much stuff to 0.0 warefare and the servers simply cannot take it. It is unplayable and time and a gain we have proved that the ships jumping into the system get load priority. Therefore it is impossible to effectively prevent a large hostile fleet from entering your system.

Yeah .. I will get flamed by the 12 year olds for this post .. but I am at the point that I really don't care anymore .. I have filed a petition on behalf of my alliance at GM request but after a week of no response I have notified my people that in 24 hours we will commnence individual petitions from all of the affected members of the alliances affected to get their attention. While it is fine that they can cut and paste a "It takes time to investigate" post, so many ships have been lost as to alter the course of the campaigns in the mean time. As for the "email ccp directly" .. been there .. done that .. no response in 4 days ..

I am so disconcerted with this that I am actively petitioning the GM's to the point that they will prob ban me .. and I am willing to get banned to make a point on behalf of the alliances that are completely fed up with the state of affairs.

When I have people that i have flown with for years throw up their hands and cancel their accounts en masse .. I feel I have to do something.

If I fail to respond to this thread it is prob because they have banned me to shut me up :)

I luv EVE .. I just want it fixed

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Originally by: Tyrrax Thorrk

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I think CCP need to hire a few dozen more gms ;P

That and fix it ofc

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Originally by: XxAngelxX

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Tip: Stop whining, teach your pilots how to deal with the lag, it is no different now to how it was a over a year ago when G + IRON tried to jump into ec- camped by ascn and bob.

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Originally by: Fate Decided

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All i see is a bunch of bob pets crying because noone is here to save them.

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Originally by: Fate Decided

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All i see is a bunch of bob pets crying because noone is here to save them.

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Originally by: Ggrimreaper

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Originally by: Fate Decided

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All i see is a bunch of bob pets crying because noone is here to save them.

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FFS HOW MANY TIMES DO WE HAVE TO SAY THIS BOB ARE RED
BOB WILL REMAIN RED TO SPARTA

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Quote:

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Oh yeah .. and we don't need saving m8 .. no go back to jacking off in your corner...

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Originally by: Tomcat

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Amazing, Shin's forum post are as intelligent as his television appearances

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Originally by: Fate Decided

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Quote:

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Oh yeah .. and we don't need saving m8 .. no go back to jacking off in your corner...

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Thats why you sided with MC right? Cuz u didnt need any saving

Give me a break

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Originally by: Shin Ra

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Originally by: Krall Amarr

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What i can say ?

an image value more than 1000 words...


this is what happen when fs jump inside v7 (82 on gang 30 got disconnect-30 desynch 22 shoot and load random enemy/capital/friend) plus 5 min of lag ...


http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/191/amazinglg1.jpg

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I dunno, these few words are worth more than your petty image:

24 Jul 2007 20:06:24
Tomcat > haha wtf this weeks alliance profile on eve tv is Tri
Tomcat > next weeks headline this just in *tri pwnd by sparta*

Also, you might want to check out this

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Originally by: XxAngelxX

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You know, TRI wouldn't be whining if you'd won that fight, we went in there knowing the lag would be massive.

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Originally by: KtB

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Reading this thread i really dont believe what some of you are saying.

Stuff like "Its been like that for ages, deal with it", "Yeh ccp lags, get over it and work around it" !?!?!

Are you lot that obsessed that your willing to PAY for a game that doesnt work how its intended?? :S

Or is it your mummies and daddies that pay for it?? *sigh*

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Originally by: XxAngelxX

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I agree in some ways, but, in many others I disagree. CCP even had a Dev post in our thread asking about it, they clearly are working on it. It might not be as simple as it sounds, after all they are only human and the game is a cumulative work.

So the point is, suck it up and deal with it. I'm sure they're fully aware of it and are trying their best to fix it. Tbh the reply was a little harsh because all I see is whine from you guys.

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Originally by: Harleigh

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Originally by: XxAngelxX

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I agree in some ways, but, in many others I disagree. CCP even had a Dev post in our thread asking about it, they clearly are working on it. It might not be as simple as it sounds, after all they are only human and the game is a cumulative work.

So the point is, suck it up and deal with it. I'm sure they're fully aware of it and are trying their best to fix it. Tbh the reply was a little harsh because all I see is whine from you guys.

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Don't you see this is not a Sparta / Tri discussion ? .. it happened today in V7-MID where Tri was not even involved ..

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Originally by: Kagura Nikon

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Well i must say game behave verywell in 49-u today with almost 600 in local. It crashed once, yes. But during fight i got no desync and only 3 second lag.

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Originally by: XxAngelxX

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Yeah, I see that, but then I know why you're whining and it's because you don't do PVP as a "career" in eve. What do you expect CCP to do? Miraculously patch next week and make the game perfectly playable after so many years where lag plays a huge factor in fleet battles? I've just learnt to deal with it, my main gripe is with these huge forum whines about it, if you don't like it, don't do it, and spare the rest of us from these threads

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Originally by: Tebis

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Originally by: Kagura Nikon

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Well i must say game behave verywell in 49-u today with almost 600 in local. It crashed once, yes. But during fight i got no desync and only 3 second lag.

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May I ask if y'all were the aggressors jumping into the system or how did the engagement play out? We have found that most of the problems come when you have a large fleet jumping into a large gate camp.. I mean yes there might be ways around it.. From what I understand of game mechanics.. when players jump into a system a good deal of the nodes power goes to letting the new comers load.. therefore they don't experience as much desync as the defenders would.. only thing I can figure out is to either go out and meet the aggressors or pull back the gate camps and just stay strictly to defending your station or pos's and let the aggressors load the node entirely before engaging so it will be on equal terms

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Originally by: XxAngelxX

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Originally by: Harleigh

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Originally by: XxAngelxX

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I agree in some ways, but, in many others I disagree. CCP even had a Dev post in our thread asking about it, they clearly are working on it. It might not be as simple as it sounds, after all they are only human and the game is a cumulative work.

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So the point is, suck it up and deal with it. I'm sure they're fully aware of it and are trying their best to fix it. Tbh the reply was a little harsh because all I see is whine from you guys.

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Don't you see this is not a Sparta / Tri discussion ? .. it happened today in V7-MID where Tri was not even involved ..


Yeah, I see that, but then I know why you're whining and it's because you don't do PVP as a "career" in eve. What do you expect CCP to do? Miraculously patch next week and make the game perfectly playable after so many years where lag plays a huge factor in fleet battles? I've just learnt to deal with it, my main gripe is with these huge forum whines about it, if you don't like it, don't do it, and spare the rest of us from these threads

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Originally by: Kagura Nikon

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both sides were on system. No camp trespassing here.

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Originally by: Martin Mckenna

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jump into them then. the way you are saying it its like the people jumping in have the advantage lol. try and test it. im sure you will lose alot more ships doing it and more lag. its sad to see that lag is that bad but thats eve tbh.

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Originally by: Shin Ra

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Lag happens, get used to it. Desyncs happened (till the recent patch?) for weeks if not months. If you had been fighting at all, instead of cowering in your little corner of space, meybe you would have realised that.

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Originally by: Martin Mckenna

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Originally by: Shin Ra

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Lag happens, get used to it. Desyncs happened (till the recent patch?) for weeks if not months. If you had been fighting at all, instead of cowering in your little corner of space, meybe you would have realised that.

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tbh there is no need for replys like that aswell. lags bad and i can understand why sparta are ****ed but they need to remember that we also get the same lag and desync

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Originally by: Kagura Nikon

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Well i must say game behave verywell in 49-u today with almost 600 in local. It crashed once, yes. But during fight i got no desync and only 3 second lag.

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Originally by: XxAngelxX

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You know, TRI wouldn't be whining if you'd won that fight, we went in there knowing the lag would be massive.

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Originally by: Draconian Arcane

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You must be a ten year old or a ******, since there was no reference to the battle against you guys.

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Originally by: Shin Ra

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Originally by: Martin Mckenna

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Originally by: Shin Ra

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Lag happens, get used to it. Desyncs happened (till the recent patch?) for weeks if not months. If you had been fighting at all, instead of cowering in your little corner of space, meybe you would have realised that.

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tbh there is no need for replys like that aswell. lags bad and i can understand why sparta are ****ed but they need to remember that we also get the same lag and desync

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salt AND sauce plz martin.,

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Originally by: Harleigh

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Ok .. As an alliance leader .. I am truly saddened by the current state of affairs that CCP has put this game into.

I have played this game for years and yes I know what lag is .. and I expect lag .. but loosing synch is a whole other matter. Tonight we held a gate with about 80 - 100 people .. and 100 hostiles jumped in and local spiked to 516.. we saw 2 red targets the whole time. A couple of players tried to re-log .. over 15 minutes to do so. This is the same crap we ran into in UEJ. In fact at one point local channel was funny as people were reporting how many people they saw in local. The numbers ranged from 340 - 516 at the same time.

One pilot who came jumped in after the meele started then reported that the gate was covered in reds and we were getting shot .. one of my pilots sitting happily in his ship got a mail .. it was his killmail ..

This is not localized to the north either .. while waiting for my pilot to log on, I was in MSN chat with some guys in the south .. they had 500 in local .. and things were so bad that they could not employ capitals and were left just ganking ships that were stuck in space and unresponsive. That my fellow gamers is not fleet combat.

This is material I believe belongs in CAOD as none of the general EVE population in empire will experience it. They have introduced so much stuff to 0.0 warefare and the servers simply cannot take it. It is unplayable and time and a gain we have proved that the ships jumping into the system get load priority. Therefore it is impossible to effectively prevent a large hostile fleet from entering your system.

Yeah .. I will get flamed by the 12 year olds for this post .. but I am at the point that I really don't care anymore .. I have filed a petition on behalf of my alliance at GM request but after a week of no response I have notified my people that in 24 hours we will commnence individual petitions from all of the affected members of the alliances affected to get their attention. While it is fine that they can cut and paste a "It takes time to investigate" post, so many ships have been lost as to alter the course of the campaigns in the mean time. As for the "email ccp directly" .. been there .. done that .. no response in 4 days ..

I am so disconcerted with this that I am actively petitioning the GM's to the point that they will prob ban me .. and I am willing to get banned to make a point on behalf of the alliances that are completely fed up with the state of affairs.

When I have people that i have flown with for years throw up their hands and cancel their accounts en masse .. I feel I have to do something.

If I fail to respond to this thread it is prob because they have banned me to shut me up :)

I luv EVE .. I just want it fixed

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Quote:

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You do have the option of ignoring this thread just like you can ignore the game problems apparently :)

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Originally by: Kharl Pax

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My experience of the battle in UEJ:

I was already in the system when the rest of TRI jumped in. I warped to a load point in the grid, waited a few minutes, everything loaded, usual amount of lag was experienced, I then warped in to our strike point and hung around until I started getting shot, I warped out, when it came to warping back in however, I did it exactly the same way as the first time, load point, then strike point, only this time I could only see about 8 friendlies, no hostiles, after hanging around for a few minutes hoping it would load, I warped out when someone noticed me, repeated the warp-in process and it eventually loaded ok, although by this time most of sparta+co had disappeared from the gate and it was pretty much just Tri+Razor+MM+co with some pretty bubbles on the gate.

There definitely was an issue with not all of the people loading up on my second warpin, but my third warpin seemed to load everything ok. Unfortunately until it gets fixed the only way to deal with it is to work around it, using load points to make sure everything loads before engaging+reducing chances of getting shot whilst loading.

I still think that if the server hadn't desync'd that Tri would still have won, but then people might call my biased

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Originally by: Zylatis

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Edited by: Zylatis on 29/07/2007 02:42:37

Quote:

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You do have the option of ignoring this thread just like you can ignore the game problems apparently :)

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Pwned.

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Originally by: Koi Yokuma

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http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=565278&page=1

Are ^these^ guys just whining too, or maybe there's an actual problem?

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Originally by: Benglada

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And whos going to tackle for them? Jesus?

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Originally by: Adeptus mecanicus

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me and my crew got d-synced in a dead end system while attacking a pos and local didnt pass 25+ (including the defending team) ended up frozen then scatterd around system, also we have those zombie pos's (kill the tower but the pos mods still fire) petitioned it and the gm said they heard about it but when i invited him to eyeball it himself he declined.

ccp did remove the mods on the moons we mentioned but there is something seriusly wrong considering the current state of gameplay. when ppl is reluctant to commit to battle due to the instabillety of the game then it's a flashing warning sign.

this coment might get snipped or more but as a paying customer since 2005 (yeah im a noob in some of you ol'fellas view) im not impressed with the way the d-sync and other issiues is being focused on

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Originally by: CardboardSword42

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Originally by: Zylatis

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Edited by: Zylatis on 29/07/2007 02:42:37

Quote:

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You do have the option of ignoring this thread just like you can ignore the game problems apparently :)

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Pwned.

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Someone in sparta quoting someone else in sparta and stupidly spelling owned does not make it so. This thread is more sparta circle jerking "yea, we totally lost because of desync" than anything else. Those claiming that this thread isn't about that must've missed the mention in the op about local hitting the 500s, which I gurantee only happens on special occassions like trying to kill a mothership.

This thread is stupid because the OP seems to have this attitude that CCP is doing nothing and that their specific *****ing will make CCP go "People are descyning? O Rly?". As has been pointed out, GMs posted in the thread about the specific Mom POS takedown and asking about lag and desync, they obviously care about the issue. In fact the last patch was an attempt to fix desyncing, which obviously is a complicated problem since I guarantee that multiple programmers were put on the issue in an attempt to patch it.

You *****ing about it does not give CCP the ability to pay for more programmers to try and fix the issue. You *****ing does not raise awareness about an already well known issue. All your *****ing does is try to justify your loss.

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Originally by: CardboardSword42

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Originally by: Zylatis

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Edited by: Zylatis on 29/07/2007 02:42:37

Quote:

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You do have the option of ignoring this thread just like you can ignore the game problems apparently :)

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Pwned.

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Someone in sparta quoting someone else in sparta and stupidly spelling owned does not make it so. This thread is more sparta circle jerking "yea, we totally lost because of desync" than anything else. Those claiming that this thread isn't about that must've missed the mention in the op about local hitting the 500s, which I gurantee only happens on special occassions like trying to kill a mothership.

This thread is stupid because the OP seems to have this attitude that CCP is doing nothing and that their specific *****ing will make CCP go "People are descyning? O Rly?". As has been pointed out, GMs posted in the thread about the specific Mom POS takedown and asking about lag and desync, they obviously care about the issue. In fact the last patch was an attempt to fix desyncing, which obviously is a complicated problem since I guarantee that multiple programmers were put on the issue in an attempt to patch it.

You *****ing about it does not give CCP the ability to pay for more programmers to try and fix the issue. You *****ing does not raise awareness about an already well known issue. All your *****ing does is try to justify your loss.

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Originally by: Zylatis

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Oh i'm sorry, i didnt expect the grammar inquisition. Let me rephrase by then saying "Oh i say old chap, what a frightfully good point, it really does put a pin***** through the heart of that silly fellows argument" Better?

Might i point out, once again, that this thread is not about UEJ, although yes obviously those events have some bearing on this case, but it is still nonetheless about a general problem, of which those problems were a subset. Our *****ing, whilst perhaps over zealous but hey it is CAOD, is warranted in the fact that we have identified something wrong and are annoyed about it. Saying that voicing opinions and getting rowdy doesn't make change is simply stupid. Guess Mandela was freed out of the goodness of the governments heart ey? Yeh CCP knows about it, but we all know that every organisation has a certain level of beurocracy and making a bru ha ha (sp) about it tends to speed things up.

Anyway its a game and so really its all a moot point. This might seem a hypocritical statement but i'm not getting all ansy about the actual lag/desync issue itself persay, but rather the vultures that circle the flamebait in these forums.

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Quote:

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You posting about lag does not give CCP the capital to hire more programmers.

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Quote:

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The point was that you saying "Pwned" without replying to any warrants that she was making does not make her warrants disappear.

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Originally by: Zylatis

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Edited by: Zylatis on 29/07/2007 05:05:24
Edited by: Zylatis on 29/07/2007 05:04:20
I never said lag was on the same level as denial of human rights, nor did i imply that CCP was purposefully making the game harder to play. If you read further you would see the point i was making about getting through red tape. A perfect example is the fact that there is a Gm que and a senior GM que. If a problem is bad enough, or enough stink is made about it, there is the possibility that it might be escalated. If 3 people complaining that they lost 20b isk during an engagement do you think a whole lot would really be done? Sure reimbursement might occur but theres not going to be the sort of rigmoral thats going on now. Why? Because this affects lots of people. How do we know that? Because lots of people are complaining. To deny that mass complaints have no effect on this sort of situation is, again, incorrect.

As for the PCs hacking 500 people in local, well i've been in situations where theres been that many and i can say the only thing not working properly was the EVE client, rest of my computer was fine. That means either the client can't hack it or the problems are server side, or both. This is not an attack on CCP but simply a retort.

Quote:

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The point was that you saying "Pwned" without replying to any warrants that she was making does not make her warrants disappear.

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Ok how about "I second that motion". Getting warmer?

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Originally by: Weatherman

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Originally by: Kagura Nikon

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Well i must say game behave verywell in 49-u today with almost 600 in local. It crashed once, yes. But during fight i got no desync and only 3 second lag.

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We had very different experiences then. I had over 60 second module lag and most in my gang/corp reported around 40s module lag. Warping also took a significant delay. This was all before the node crashed (or whatever that was, there was like 150 people who didn't d/c am I right?). After the crash it was significantly less laggy, at least for me.

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Originally by: nickycakes

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if you think you're getting 500 person battles in any game, you need to put down the cr4ck pipe

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Originally by: TZeer

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Random players: Laaaag,desynch, I cant see anything, who`s shooting me. ARGH!

CCP: We can`t seen anything in our logs, game is fine.

Random players: FFS, fix lag CCP. RABBLE RABBLE! Petition!

CCP: "insert random yadda yadda" ooh, look new shiny stuff.

Random players: we dont care about shiny stuff, fix whats broken damnit!

CCP: Quafe, weee, come join us on our voice thingy. Beer!!! fanfest!

Random Players: AARGGH, the lag/desynch gets worse, server went down, FIX LAG!!

CCP: Look, shiiiiiny stuff!!

Random players go suicidal....


The end

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Originally by: XxAngelxX

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Yeah, I see that, but then I know why you're whining and it's because you don't do PVP as a "career" in eve. What do you expect CCP to do? Miraculously patch next week and make the game perfectly playable after so many years where lag plays a huge factor in fleet battles? I've just learnt to deal with it, my main gripe is with these huge forum whines about it, if you don't like it, don't do it, and spare the rest of us from these threads

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Originally by: TZeer

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Random players: Laaaag,desynch, I cant see anything, who`s shooting me. ARGH!

CCP: We can`t seen anything in our logs, game is fine.

Random players: FFS, fix lag CCP. RABBLE RABBLE! Petition!

CCP: "insert random yadda yadda" ooh, look new shiny stuff.

Random players: we dont care about shiny stuff, fix whats broken damnit!

CCP: Quafe, weee, come join us on our voice thingy. Beer!!! fanfest!

Random Players: AARGGH, the lag/desynch gets worse, server went down, FIX LAG!!

CCP: Look, shiiiiiny stuff!!

Random players go suicidal....


The end

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Originally by: Minigin

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Edited by: Minigin on 29/07/2007 00:42:14
i for one am shocked and disgusted that when local gets to 590... fleet battles lag... i mean really... how dare ccp create a game that struggles with such huge numbers?

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Originally by: Vazkia

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Edited by: Vazkia on 29/07/2007 07:50:15
ok that was weird, hit reply to a different thread...

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Originally by: Harleigh

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Yeah .. I will get flamed by the 12 year olds for this post ..

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Originally by: Harleigh

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I WILL USE BIG LETTERS CAUSE APPAERENTLY YOU CAN'T READ ... DESYNCH ... NOT LAG IS THE ISSUE HERE MORON ..

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Originally by: Harleigh

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Oh yeah .. and we don't need saving m8 .. no go back to jacking off in your corner...

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Originally by: nickycakes

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if you think you're getting 500 person battles in any game, you need to put down the cr4ck pipe

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Originally by: Director Stoned

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Is this the sparta whine thread or is that on newb TV?

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Originally by: Coltaine ShadowStrider

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CCP CANNOT DELIVER. I dont care if it was always like that , i dont care if they have dx10 graphics or stations or heat or whatever the ******* else the MAIN thing should be being able to actually FIRE at someone

I myself(dont want to include everyone or even alot of people) play this game for its potentialy massive pvp(ha!) and i am not getting what i am paying for. No i dont want a build in voice feature.. no i dont want to watch tv about eve i want to actually .. you know .. play it and i am not getting what i am paying for. Yes i can leave (and i am alot less active that i was even play a couple of other mmo's like wow which yea SUCKS but i can actually press buttons and something happens and it even has MUSIC!!!!) but i do like this game and i think its a shame they cant fix it because the next similar mmo that will come out will draw most of the people from here to there and then ccp will join the long list of companies who had a great game but ****** it up.

I dont care what it takes (hire hordes of programers to make new clients or new ui or write new code or whatever) just fix it or i dont see how you can expect eve to last much longer.

There said my piece have fun flaming each other

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Originally by: Harleigh

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Originally by: XxAngelxX

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Tip: Stop whining, teach your pilots how to deal with the lag, it is no different now to how it was a over a year ago when G + IRON tried to jump into ec- camped by ascn and bob.

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LOL - typical .. cause the problem benifits the aggressor atm

I WILL USE BIG LETTERS CAUSE APPAERENTLY YOU CAN'T READ ... DESYNCH ... NOT LAG IS THE ISSUE HERE MORON ..

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Originally by: Sextus Licinius

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you backstab all the north, you hang on the gates in empire and steal loot from pvpers (like the eagle you stole from CELES etc)

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Originally by: Haka Aragon

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2. we are NOT the ones that sit with a MOTHERSHIP camping the Aunenen to Nonni gate every second day like total f@ggots.

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Originally by: Danzir Kasnov

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So of those who have signed, agreed and seen a dsync for sure. How many have bothered to post log server data as requested by CCP? As a software egineer myself, they cant do anything without them. The reports of omg desync it always happens when you go into systems etc. are USELESS to help fix these kind of bugs. You cant debug this kind of stuff with vague descriptions. The devs have asked for this for a while now and are still saying they aint getting anywhere enar enoguh people submitting data.

Everytime your about to go into a large fleet battle start log server and post it.

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Quote:

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Ok .. As an alliance leader .. I am truly saddened by the current state of affairs that CCP has put this game into.

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Originally by: Darknesss

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Edited by: Darknesss on 29/07/2007 11:19:40
I understand Sparta's anger at the issue but this really isnt something that just happens for you, its screwing everyone over, I know harleigh in his post said that, but alot of members of sparta seem to think TRI for example didnt have any lag in UEJ, it was taking our BS gang of 50+ with 60-70 support about 40-50 seconds to kill a target, that gives you an estimate of how laggy it was for us.

I do agree that it needs fixing but it will take time, i dont blame CCP for it, when you think about it over 500 people in one system, 500 different people doing different things at different times. Its like Jita (which is normally very laggy) residents all undocking and having a large battle.

In the mean time there are a number of measures you can take to assure as much client stability as humanly possible on your end. Some are obvious, some perhaps you dont know so i will give a quick list.

1. take all friends off overview (yes the obvious one)
2. when jumping into a major battle close overview
3. turn off all effects - ctrl alt shift e and t
4. go to generic tab on in game menu, turn off damage messages, turn off log chat to file, turn off sun is occluded by ship.
5. Turn off all color tags, friendly, enemy, all of them, make it so all ships are showing as a neutral white box, you can do this in overview settings - this is a major one, really really helps reduce problems.
6. Have an assortment of overview settings to load while progressing through the fight, personally when i jump into a fight if im in a BS i will only have BS and capital ships on my overview, as the BS's go down i load a second setting with all ships on - not sure if this helps reduce lag but it might.
7. If you know a large battle will occur in advance, send a stuck petition to the GM's informing them there is probably going to be a large battle happening in the said system and for them to reinforce the nodes. They will happily do it, and it does help.

Anyway, hope that helps for any newer players that didnt know.

Dark

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Originally by: Splagada

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Edited by: Splagada on 21/06/2007 13:51:39
in eve you can break their windows, take over the house, and throw the children in the fire.

Originally by: Velsharoon

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Dont have fleet fights :S

I understsnd your point but just tell CCP to **** off, get your **** out then go roaming and kill **** and have fun.

Its not gonna be fixed, deal with it.

---

Originally by: Darko1107

---

Quote:

---

Ok .. As an alliance leader .. I am truly saddened by the current state of affairs that CCP has put this game into.

---

What relevance does you being an alliance leader have on being "truely saddened" by the current state of affairs? Did you just chuck that line in to make yourself look big?

Ok .. As someone who never plays eve, and just posts on the forums, i am truely saddened by the ENDLESS AMOUNT OF THREADS MOANING ABOUT LAG.

What do you people think that if you make 50 million threads about desynchs/lag that it will suddenly, asif by magic, just disappear? CCP have known about these issues for years.

Sparta were all happy just sitting in northern dek napping alliances, then unnapping them and napping new ones so they could avoid fights. If you dont want fights, why does it matter if they have lag in them or not anyway.

And whats with the "truely saddened" stuff, bit dramatic it isnt it? If you are truely saddened then why are you still playing.

---

Originally by: Harleigh

---

This is material I believe belongs in CAOD as none of the general EVE population in empire will experience it.

---

Originally by: Cyriel Longinus

---

Edited by: Cyriel Longinus on 29/07/2007 08:23:49


I'm on summer vacation from EvE. I have no loyalties in game. I don't give a dam about Sparta or Tri. I've been keeping up with the eve universe thru the forums.

There is a serious issue with the current playability of EvE Online. This is a cluster wide problem that is not localized to the area that TRI & Sparta Players are in gaming in. The desync issues are a by product of EvEÆs growth. It is being experienced by gamers across the EvE Universe and documented on the forums.

The OP attmepted to share with the entire EvE Community his personal experience with the issue in what I suppose was part effort to create community awareness and part venting.

This is a problem that has nothing to do with skill or politics. It is a system failure that hopefully can be corrected in the near future. Community awareness has a tendency to spur changes.

EvE has undergone significant code changes in the recent months. This is not the same EvE Online as it was a year ago. New content has opened new styles of gameplay, which the universe cannot process at the moment. The challenges for the cluster are not the same as they were a year ago.

The OP had a choice to quietly accept his disappointment, leave the game and cancel his subscription. Any dirtbags out there that wants to encourage people leave our community is clearly a dumb***. This is our community. We share it and we should be concerned.

Building a player empire is a labor of love that takes many months. To lose it all to cluster issues just sucks.

Yea, the game is live and growing. To some degree we can expect some problems and disconnects. However if I canÆt play the game as intended IÆd be very concerned. Thinking about giving up two years invested into something I love would frustate me. It would especially frustate me if I was the head of an alliance and not some random Joe that can take an entire summer off or untill the fixes are made.

Hopefully CCP will act with their love for EvE to further stretch the limits of what the current technology and humans effort can achieve. I have faith that the breakthroughs and fixes are coming. They must or they risk losing community members.

---

Originally by: Harleigh

---

Originally by: Darko1107

---

Quote:

---

Ok .. As an alliance leader .. I am truly saddened by the current state of affairs that CCP has put this game into.

---

What relevance does you being an alliance leader have on being "truely saddened" by the current state of affairs? Did you just chuck that line in to make yourself look big?

Ok .. As someone who never plays eve, and just posts on the forums, i am truely saddened by the ENDLESS AMOUNT OF THREADS MOANING ABOUT LAG.

What do you people think that if you make 50 million threads about desynchs/lag that it will suddenly, asif by magic, just disappear? CCP have known about these issues for years.

Sparta were all happy just sitting in northern dek napping alliances, then unnapping them and napping new ones so they could avoid fights. If you dont want fights, why does it matter if they have lag in them or not anyway.

And whats with the "truely saddened" stuff, bit dramatic it isnt it? If you are truely saddened then why are you still playing.

---

Ok .. you got me there darko :).. As someone who put holds the record for loosing their entire space in 1 day then setting all their residents red within 48- 72 hrs .. I should bow before you and bask in your greatness and wisdom of opinion. Maybe if you had the nads to actually put up a fight for your homeland you would understand the fustration some of us are experiencing.

---

Originally by: Harleigh

---

I luv EVE .. I just want it fixed

---

Originally by: Darko1107

---

Originally by: Harleigh

---

Originally by: Darko1107

---

Quote:

---

Ok .. As an alliance leader .. I am truly saddened by the current state of affairs that CCP has put this game into.

---

What relevance does you being an alliance leader have on being "truely saddened" by the current state of affairs? Did you just chuck that line in to make yourself look big?

---

Ok .. you got me there darko :).. As someone who put holds the record for loosing their entire space in 1 day then setting all their residents red within 48- 72 hrs .. I should bow before you and bask in your greatness and wisdom of opinion. Maybe if you had the nads to actually put up a fight for your homeland you would understand the fustration some of us are experiencing.

---

Please tell me why i hold that record? And while your at it, let me know of the of the odds of Iron actually keeping its space in Dek?

---

Originally by: Darko1107

---

Originally by: Harleigh

---

Originally by: Darko1107

---

Quote:

---

Ok .. As an alliance leader .. I am truly saddened by the current state of affairs that CCP has put this game into.

---

What relevance does you being an alliance leader have on being "truely saddened" by the current state of affairs? Did you just chuck that line in to make yourself look big?

Ok .. As someone who never plays eve, and just posts on the forums, i am truely saddened by the ENDLESS AMOUNT OF THREADS MOANING ABOUT LAG.

What do you people think that if you make 50 million threads about desynchs/lag that it will suddenly, asif by magic, just disappear? CCP have known about these issues for years.

Sparta were all happy just sitting in northern dek napping alliances, then unnapping them and napping new ones so they could avoid fights. If you dont want fights, why does it matter if they have lag in them or not anyway.

And whats with the "truely saddened" stuff, bit dramatic it isnt it? If you are truely saddened then why are you still playing.

---

Ok .. you got me there darko :).. As someone who put holds the record for loosing their entire space in 1 day then setting all their residents red within 48- 72 hrs .. I should bow before you and bask in your greatness and wisdom of opinion. Maybe if you had the nads to actually put up a fight for your homeland you would understand the fustration some of us are experiencing.

---

Also, Lag has been here since eve started, i may not have played for 2 years but i THINK i might just be grasping the "frustration" SOME of your alliance may be experiencing. I just dont remember making threads about it and how i was "truely" saddened.

---

Originally by: Redon

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the best thing they can do to improve the lag in this game is to seperate empire and 0.0 onto different servers. this one universe **** just isnt working and hasnt worked since the release of the game. just my two cents.

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Originally by: Ejderdisi

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dont mess up with 1 universe.

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Originally by: Paddlefoot Aeon

---

RZR, MM, TRI...everyone... lets assume you guys succeed, and FATAL, M. Pire, Sparta, COW, Fallen Souls and ESA are all kicked out of the North. You will take stations, set up towers, invest time and effort into making the region home. Then another force will attack, and you will be in the exact same position as us.

It is in everyone's best interest to get this problem fixed... because sooner or later, it WILL become your problem too.

---

Originally by: Paddlefoot Aeon

---

Originally by: Darko1107

---

Originally by: Harleigh

---

Originally by: Darko1107

---

Quote:

---

Ok .. As an alliance leader .. I am truly saddened by the current state of affairs that CCP has put this game into.

---

What relevance does you being an alliance leader have on being "truely saddened" by the current state of affairs? Did you just chuck that line in to make yourself look big?

---

Ok .. you got me there darko :).. As someone who put holds the record for loosing their entire space in 1 day then setting all their residents red within 48- 72 hrs .. I should bow before you and bask in your greatness and wisdom of opinion. Maybe if you had the nads to actually put up a fight for your homeland you would understand the fustration some of us are experiencing.

---

Please tell me why i hold that record? And while your at it, let me know of the of the odds of Iron actually keeping its space in Dek?

---

Well... if IRON would actually put more than one tower in their station systems, and actually was present in the area while that tower was in reinforced, then yeah, you might have had a better chance of holding space.

And now you seem on the bandwagon with RZR and MM and friends, hoping you might get a system of two in Branch/Dek. Well... if you ever do claim space... Sparta will get in noob ships and take your space away, as that seems to be so easy to do.

---

Originally by: Darko1107

---

Yeh cos theres a whole lot of point of putting 4305630 towers in a system when you dont actually have the force to defended them against over 5 alliances, each bigger than your own. Its called a tactical retreat. Might have meant we stood NO chance of keeping dek, but its better than losing a **** load of resources, and having a remarkbly tiny chance of keeping it.

Btw, look at the map, maybe if you were a little more informed you would see iron is already claiming space. Not to bright are we?

---

Originally by: Paddlefoot Aeon

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Originally by: Darko1107

---

Yeh cos theres a whole lot of point of putting 4305630 towers in a system when you dont actually have the force to defended them against over 5 alliances, each bigger than your own. Its called a tactical retreat. Might have meant we stood NO chance of keeping dek, but its better than losing a **** load of resources, and having a remarkbly tiny chance of keeping it.

Btw, look at the map, maybe if you were a little more informed you would see iron is already claiming space. Not to bright are we?

---

So.... Sparta withdraws from the war, and we get blasted. IRON gives up without a fight and run away.... and they come up smelling like roses? You made a tactical retreat, and no longer committed your pilots to fighting. We tactically withdrew, and no longer committed our pilots to fighting.

The only difference is that all of the north seems upset with the fact that we retained our space... whereas you scurried all the way to the far side of the map.

Speaking of which... how are those drone bounties, hmmm??? Tired of jumping all those mins to empire to get paid? Perhaps you should have tried to hold on in DEK a bit harder... or did you simple realize, as we did, that D2 was only out for themselves, and you left because you KNEW they wouldn't life a finger to help you???

And now you come in on RZR's coattails, hoping for the scraps from their table.

Pathetic.

---

Originally by: Omeega

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diplomacy is f1, f2, f3, really...

---

Originally by: TZeer

---

Random players: Laaaag,desynch, I cant see anything, who`s shooting me. ARGH!

CCP: We can`t seen anything in our logs, game is fine.

Random players: FFS, fix lag CCP. RABBLE RABBLE! Petition!

CCP: "insert random yadda yadda" ooh, look new shiny stuff.

Random players: we dont care about shiny stuff, fix whats broken damnit!

CCP: Quafe, weee, come join us on our voice thingy. Beer!!! fanfest!

Random Players: AARGGH, the lag/desynch gets worse, server went down, FIX LAG!!

CCP: Look, shiiiiiny stuff!!

Random players go suicidal....


The end

---

Originally by: Omeega

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diplomacy is f1, f2, f3, really...

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Originally by: XxAngelxX

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Tip: Stop whining, teach your pilots how to deal with the lag, it is no different now to how it was a over a year ago when G + IRON tried to jump into ec- camped by ascn and bob.

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Originally by: Mr Neutron

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Ehm guys, I think that lag & desync are polite way of CCP to say to us: get back into small gang PVP without capitals. That way they don't have to say that capitals & large fleets was a mistake

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Originally by: Mistress Suffering

---

Unfortunately you will just be deleted for discussing GM responses in forum.

It is a well known fact that EVE really doesn't handle large fleets well at all despite the fact that grandiose battles seem to be the endgame content touted by EVE's developers. I very much wish they would spend more time working on solutions and optimizations for this instead of garbage like heat and walking in stations.

Continue to let CCP know what your priorities are as a player (better yet, as a great big group of players) but recognize that if you don't do it carefully, you will simply be discarded.

Oh and yes, Sparta's past politics were suicidal, but that's not really the issue here

---

Originally by: Harleigh

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LOL - typical .. cause the problem benifits the aggressor atm

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Originally by: Dr Nightmare

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Originally by: Harleigh

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LOL - typical .. cause the problem benifits the aggressor atm

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Try being the aggressors next time? or you guys just like dying to a problem you guys cause...

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Originally by: Montaire

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Originally by: Dr Nightmare

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Originally by: Harleigh

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LOL - typical .. cause the problem benifits the aggressor atm

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Try being the aggressors next time? or you guys just like dying to a problem you guys cause...

---

That sums up the problem reather neatly for me. The agressors have the clear advantage. The real question is SHOULD they.

Whats the point of setting up all the infrastructure of its disadvantagous to do so.

---

Originally by: Harleigh

---

Edited by: Harleigh on 01/08/2007 00:33:46
Ok .. As an alliance leader ..

---

Originally by: NATMav

---

Originally by: Montaire

---

Try being the aggressors next time? or you guys just like dying to a problem you guys cause...

---

That sums up the problem reather neatly for me. The agressors have the clear advantage. The real question is SHOULD they.

Whats the point of setting up all the infrastructure of its disadvantagous to do so.

---

Originally by: Chuck Dawg

---

Dont you guys realize yet that this an 'intended game feature' just like a bunch of other features we players feel are bugs but the lazy people at CCP feel compelled to call a feature? It's just simply to stop people from camping gates in mass and go on the offensive since, from what Ive read, it only effects people who were there first waiting for hostiles to jump in.

Just takes a little out of the box ******** thinking to understand the ways of the all mighty CCP!

---

Originally by: Harleigh

---

Edited by: Harleigh on 01/08/2007 00:33:46
Ok .. As an alliance leader .. I am truly saddened by the current state of affairs that CCP has put this game into.

I have played this game for years and yes I know what lag is .. and I expect lag .. but loosing synch is a whole other matter. Tonight we held a gate with about 80 - 100 people .. and 100 hostiles jumped in and local spiked to 516.. we saw 2 red targets the whole time. A couple of players tried to re-log .. over 15 minutes to do so. This is the same crap we ran into in UEJ. In fact at one point local channel was funny as people were reporting how many people they saw in local. The numbers ranged from 340 - 516 at the same time.

One pilot who came jumped in after the meele started then reported that the gate was covered in reds and we were getting shot .. one of my pilots sitting happily in his ship got a mail .. it was his killmail ..

This is not localized to the north either .. while waiting for my pilot to log on, I was in MSN chat with some guys in the south .. they had 500 in local .. and things were so bad that they could not employ capitals and were left just ganking ships that were stuck in space and unresponsive. That my fellow gamers is not fleet combat.

This is material I believe belongs in CAOD as none of the general EVE population in empire will experience it. They have introduced so much stuff to 0.0 warefare and the servers simply cannot take it. It is unplayable and time and a gain we have proved that the ships jumping into the system get load priority. Therefore it is impossible to effectively prevent a large hostile fleet from entering your system.

Yeah .. I will get flamed by the 12 year olds for this post .. but I am at the point that I really don't care anymore .. I have filed a petition on behalf of my alliance at GM request but after a week of no response I have notified my people that in 24 hours we will commnence individual petitions from all of the affected members of the alliances affected to get their attention. While it is fine that they can cut and paste a "It takes time to investigate" post, so many ships have been lost as to alter the course of the campaigns in the mean time. As for the "email ccp directly" .. been there .. done that .. no response in 4 days ..

I am so disconcerted with this that I am actively petitioning the GM's to the point that they will prob ban me .. and I am willing to get banned to make a point on behalf of the alliances that are completely fed up with the state of affairs.

When I have people that i have flown with for years throw up their hands and cancel their accounts en masse .. I feel I have to do something.

If I fail to respond to this thread it is prob because they have banned me to shut me up :)

I luv EVE .. I just want it fixed

---

Originally by: Montaire

---

Thats easier said than done when you have 20 billion isk tied up in a single POS.

If you dont stop them at the gate, when your advatage should be greatest, then you wont stop them at all. They will scatter throughout the system, where you cant chase them down.

As much derided as gate camping is, the fact is that it is a CRITICAL defensive dynamic. Its like saying that Midevil castles were cheap, and that enemies should have let their enemes in so they could fight them.

---

Originally by: Harleigh

---

Edited by: Harleigh on 01/08/2007 00:33:46
Ok .. As an alliance leader .. I am truly saddened by the current state of affairs that CCP has put this game into.

I have played this game for years and yes I know what lag is .. and I expect lag .. but loosing synch is a whole other matter. Tonight we held a gate with about 80 - 100 people .. and 100 hostiles jumped in and local spiked to 516.. we saw 2 red targets the whole time.

---

Originally by: Sam Archer

---

Originally by: Harleigh

---

Edited by: Harleigh on 01/08/2007 00:33:46
Ok .. As an alliance leader .. I am truly saddened by the current state of affairs that CCP has put this game into.

I have played this game for years and yes I know what lag is .. and I expect lag .. but loosing synch is a whole other matter. Tonight we held a gate with about 80 - 100 people .. and 100 hostiles jumped in and local spiked to 516.. we saw 2 red targets the whole time.

---

I think the problem lies in the players and not CCP. When eve was first designed I doubt that ccp thought there would be 500-600 people in 1 system fighting. CCP has as the game evolved tried to update code and hardware to allow these ZERGing/skillless tactics and has done a damn good job of it. Most other MMORPG's have trouble handling 1500-2000 players in a world and you are talking about 1/3 of that in 1 zone. Lastly, 500-600 people in 1 system is the fault of the player base and not CCP imo.

You have 5 people? We'll bring 10. You have 10 people? We will bring 15. You have 80 people? We'll bring 100. Ect. What happens when you bring 400 and they bring 550. Will you still complain about this problem? Of course you will. But the game was not made to handle 1000 people in 1 system.

Solution : Dont blame CCP for your problems when the game was never designed for it. With putting POS defenses on the outside of the shields is one of what I hope is many steps to start reducing gang sizes. In the end: Zerg less.

---

Originally by: Fornacis

---

Sorry guys but the technology doesn't exist (yet) for fleet battles to happen.

We have 30,000 ppl playing in the same shard.

I don't think its bandwidth, I believe its a scalibility problem.

Example: I always thought my lag in Eve was my internet connection which is ISDN (2x64k) connections. I moved in with a friend a while back that had 5mb DSL or something.

I still had the same lag....still had desynch...and my PC is running some of the latest hardware so its not that.

---

Originally by: dan drorgar

---

If you are trying to defend a POS, why fight them at the gate or elsewhere in the system? Your analogy (mediaeval castles) is wrong too, you should fight them at the POS ... If EVE wasn't so broken, your advantage at the gates (= bubbles, lag, desyncs, general randomness) would not be greater than your advantage at the POS (= guns, EW batteries, POS shields).

---

Originally by: XxAngelxX

---

Tip: Stop whining, teach your pilots how to deal with the lag, it is no different now to how it was a over a year ago when G + IRON tried to jump into ec- camped by ascn and bob.

---

Originally by: TZeer

---

Random players: Laaaag,desynch, I cant see anything, who`s shooting me. ARGH!

CCP: We can`t seen anything in our logs, game is fine.

Random players: FFS, fix lag CCP. RABBLE RABBLE! Petition!

CCP: "insert random yadda yadda" ooh, look new shiny stuff.

Random players: we dont care about shiny stuff, fix whats broken damnit!

CCP: Quafe, weee, come join us on our voice thingy. Beer!!! fanfest!

Random Players: AARGGH, the lag/desynch gets worse, server went down, FIX LAG!!

CCP: Look, shiiiiiny stuff!!

Random players go suicidal....


The end

---

Originally by: Charles Yeager

---

Originally by: XxAngelxX

---

Tip: Stop whining, teach your pilots how to deal with the lag, it is no different now to how it was a over a year ago when G + IRON tried to jump into ec- camped by ascn and bob.

---

More CCP fanboi-ism. Accounting for lag is easy and comes with experience. Desynch's are another matter because you client is simply not giving you correct information on the screen. With lag the information is delayed, with a desync you have no choice but to warp out or log out. Of course when this bug lets you shoot fish in a barrel, we see immature comments like the one above.

---

Originally by: Ramireza

---

Originally by: Harleigh

---

Edited by: Harleigh on 01/08/2007 00:33:46
Ok .. As an alliance leader .. I am truly saddened by the current state of affairs that CCP has put this game into.

I have played this game for years and yes I know what lag is .. and I expect lag .. but loosing synch is a whole other matter. Tonight we held a gate with about 80 - 100 people .. and 100 hostiles jumped in and local spiked to 516.. we saw 2 red targets the whole time. A couple of players tried to re-log .. over 15 minutes to do so. This is the same crap we ran into in UEJ. In fact at one point local channel was funny as people were reporting how many people they saw in local. The numbers ranged from 340 - 516 at the same time.

One pilot who came jumped in after the meele started then reported that the gate was covered in reds and we were getting shot .. one of my pilots sitting happily in his ship got a mail .. it was his killmail ..

This is not localized to the north either .. while waiting for my pilot to log on, I was in MSN chat with some guys in the south .. they had 500 in local .. and things were so bad that they could not employ capitals and were left just ganking ships that were stuck in space and unresponsive. That my fellow gamers is not fleet combat.

This is material I believe belongs in CAOD as none of the general EVE population in empire will experience it. They have introduced so much stuff to 0.0 warefare and the servers simply cannot take it. It is unplayable and time and a gain we have proved that the ships jumping into the system get load priority. Therefore it is impossible to effectively prevent a large hostile fleet from entering your system.

Yeah .. I will get flamed by the 12 year olds for this post .. but I am at the point that I really don't care anymore .. I have filed a petition on behalf of my alliance at GM request but after a week of no response I have notified my people that in 24 hours we will commnence individual petitions from all of the affected members of the alliances affected to get their attention. While it is fine that they can cut and paste a "It takes time to investigate" post, so many ships have been lost as to alter the course of the campaigns in the mean time. As for the "email ccp directly" .. been there .. done that .. no response in 4 days ..

I am so disconcerted with this that I am actively petitioning the GM's to the point that they will prob ban me .. and I am willing to get banned to make a point on behalf of the alliances that are completely fed up with the state of affairs.

When I have people that i have flown with for years throw up their hands and cancel their accounts en masse .. I feel I have to do something.

If I fail to respond to this thread it is prob because they have banned me to shut me up :)

I luv EVE .. I just want it fixed

---

You want (nearly) lagfree Fleetbattles with over 500 ppl in lokal? Dream on, thats not possible. CCP cant fix this.

But maybe we :

WY this "Oh we get attacked, lets call help to defend our systems!". Cause this leads to : "Damm, they called all their friends, we need MORE ppl to attack them, QUICK!".

This turns a possible 80 vs 80 to a 250 vs 250.

---

Originally by: Princess Jodi

---

Originally by: dan drorgar

---

If you are trying to defend a POS, why fight them at the gate or elsewhere in the system? Your analogy (mediaeval castles) is wrong too, you should fight them at the POS ... If EVE wasn't so broken, your advantage at the gates (= bubbles, lag, desyncs, general randomness) would not be greater than your advantage at the POS (= guns, EW batteries, POS shields).

---

I think this approach is the proper answer. They are comming to kill the POS. Any other type of incursions into space are just harrassment missions. So when big fights happen, fight at the POS, not the gates. When things are smaller in scale, hunt and snipe targets in system.

---