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Nihilion Saro
Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.03.14 14:54:00 -
[1]
I recently decided that an honest Eve living wasn't for me and thought I'd try my hand at being a pirate. So I got myself a snazzy cruiser and took to the belts of low-sec empire looking for some roid-lubbers to gank. Lo and behold, I can't find anybody. Nobody ratting or mining in low-sec these days. What happened? It seems like the only people in low-sec are other "pirates", which just end up fighting each other.
Can't something be done to give low-sec a boost? Give pilots more incentive to venture out there. I know it may some self-interested because I am just looking for chumps to deprive of their hard-earned assets, but think about it: Part of what makes MMOs what they are is that they are...well, a little bit real. The fear that pirates inspire in the hearts of noobs and carebears is real, and that is priceless. What other kind of game can inspire real emotion? The fear of a dread pirate, the sorrow of having lost your ship, or even on occasion that sweet sigh of relief after having gotten away (not likely). Do you know what I mean?
CCP, seriously. The recent upgrades have been great. The graphics engine is awesome. The Apoc sorely needed a purpose and I like what you did with it. But now its time to fix low-sec.
Thank you for your time.
Nihilion Saro
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Flaming sambuka
IDLE GUNS
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Posted - 2008.03.14 14:56:00 -
[2]
I agree.
I LIKE MY SIG |
Staggerr
Federal Navy Academy
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Posted - 2008.03.14 14:59:00 -
[3]
Signed
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ghosttr
ARK-CORP SATRAPY
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Posted - 2008.03.14 15:00:00 -
[4]
I think that GG needs to be boosted a little more so the bears will at least feel protected.
Either that or you can find yourself some 'pirates' that are just bears with bad sec Just leave the geddon in the belt and wait for them to 'gank' you My Blog |
gfldex
Kabelkopp
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Posted - 2008.03.14 15:00:00 -
[5]
You must have went into the wrong systems at the wrong time. My success rate in sec status lowering is about 30%. Given that ppl tend to make a run that's quite a good rate. --
There are countless games in the world. There are at least as many ppl that dont like one or more rules of said games. That never stopped smart game designers from creating good games.
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belzebub1
The Funkalistic SMASH Alliance
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Posted - 2008.03.14 15:00:00 -
[6]
Hmmm, this seems to be more down to the patch, prior to the patch we had loads of macor haulers in my area ( they are fun to kill ) Yesterday there were none, not a single one..... Rgds
Belz
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Cpt Fina
Mutually Assured Distraction
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Posted - 2008.03.14 15:01:00 -
[7]
signed.
I wouldn't be surprised if CCP "allready" have recognized this problem and are looking into it. Increased and enhanced ways to secure and shut down systems/belts would be pretty vital for a flourishing low-sec imo. Not to mention increased rewards.
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ArchenTheGreat
D00M. Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.03.14 15:03:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Nihilion Saro
CCP, seriously. The recent upgrades have been great. The graphics engine is awesome. The Apoc sorely needed a purpose and I like what you did with it. But now its time to fix low-sec.
Problem is to populate low-sec you would have to boost reward over 0.0 reward. Because risk to be in low-sec is often higher than that in 0.0.
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Arriana Echan
Transcendent Creations Inc.
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Posted - 2008.03.14 15:03:00 -
[9]
I am planning on having a foray into lower sec space next week. Just don't gank me :P
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Tarminic
Forsaken Resistance The Last Stand
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Posted - 2008.03.14 15:03:00 -
[10]
CCP knows there's a problem, but coming up with a solution that both encourages more people to enter low-sec and makes both pirates and carebears happy is a tough proposition. ---------------- Tarminic - 33 Million SP in Forum Warfare Play EVE: Downtime Madness v0.79.2 |
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Admai Sket
Federal Navy Academy
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Posted - 2008.03.14 15:05:00 -
[11]
If Hulks had an extra mid-slot or two and some more CPU, so that a decent shield tank could be made, then I think more people would be brave enough to venture into non-0.0 low sec places for the chance at more ISKies.
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eldiabloroho
State War Academy
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Posted - 2008.03.14 15:06:00 -
[12]
Well if your gunna venture into lowsec just to find better rats/ore your better off just joining a 0.0 alliance where at least you have intel channels which provides much better chance of survival than lowsec and the rats/ore is 10x better. Theres really no point in ratting or mining in lowsec basicly.
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Thenoran
The People's Liberation Army
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Posted - 2008.03.14 15:06:00 -
[13]
Low-sec is not worth mining except through High-sec exploration due to the current price of Nocxium, which dominates the low-sec ores (Jaspet, Hemorphite, Hedbergite) ------------------------
Mining over 4000m3 per cycle...with a Rokh |
Ieu Duin
Star Sabre Industries Dark Taboo
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Posted - 2008.03.14 15:10:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Nihilion Saro I recently decided that an honest Eve living wasn't for me and thought I'd try my hand at being a pirate. So I got myself a snazzy cruiser and took to the belts of low-sec empire looking for some roid-lubbers to gank. Lo and behold, I can't find anybody. Nobody ratting or mining in low-sec these days. What happened? It seems like the only people in low-sec are other "pirates", which just end up fighting each other.
Can't something be done to give low-sec a boost? Give pilots more incentive to venture out there.
Oh, this is rich.
I completely understand your request. What is befuddling is the complete misunderstanding that the reason there are no "roid-lubbers to gank" is because of you and your ilk.
People don't play MMOs to be sheep. So CCP is going to put some snazzy new element in low-sec belts and all the sheep are going to come baying? Don't think so.
Pirates are the reason no one is on low sec systems. There will never be a new "shiny" offered by CCP that will be worth me loosing my Hulk to get. Never.
As long as the combat system in EvE favors pirates and gank squad deaths have no consequences to the gankers, low sec systems will be left to the pirates.
The fact that you only found pirates in the low sec systems is absolutely hilarious. You guys have fun in your little circle. Respectable pilots are too busy making ISK.
Quote: There are no fair fights in EVE. If you're in a fair fight, you planned wrong.
-- Agent Li, Caldari, Galactic Defence Consortium, BLACKHAWK FEDERATION
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Jack Jombardo
The Last Samurais
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Posted - 2008.03.14 15:11:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Nihilion Saro I recently decided that an honest Eve living wasn't for me and thought I'd try my hand at being a pirate. So I got myself a snazzy cruiser and took to the belts of low-sec empire looking for some roid-lubbers to gank. Lo and behold, I can't find anybody. Nobody ratting or mining in low-sec these days. What happened? It seems like the only people in low-sec are other "pirates", which just end up fighting each other.
Can't something be done to give low-sec a boost?
There is nobody becouse of all the Pirates.
Can somethink be done? Sure: Remove Pirates.
If you get ganged once or twice there is no problem with it. But to be ganged every houre and most times if you have absolut no changs against them (Mining Frig against HAC) it's just to much to be funny anymore.
I'm awar that you will never understand the point of view from your targets but it is like it is: they DO NOT like to be ganged!
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Annaphera
The Green Machine
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Posted - 2008.03.14 15:12:00 -
[16]
Great, another "lowsec needs love" thread. The problem is one of realizing that there is no easy fix. Fear has nothing to do with the reason people avoid lowsec - it's all inconvenience and the almighty Bottom Line. They don't make isk for themselves by becoming targets for pirates, so they don't venture into lowsec.
One way would be for CCP to FORCE mission runners and other Empire-dwellers into lowsec - a move guaranteed to cause many to quit and more to complain bitterly. No matter what method they used, those that prefer not to make targets of themselves would find some other way to make their isk, leaving lowsec just as barren, or would quit, costing CCP revenue. This option in many forms has been tossed around in these forums a lot, and the only people that support it are those who want more low-risk targets for themselves. Who, really, are the carebears?
Another way to handle the problem would be to boost the incentives for entering lowsec. The problem there is, the best way to do it would be by opening a major isk faucet...and hoping the legit players manage to take as much advantage of it as the isk-farmers. This would also mess with the economy in unpredictable ways, which has the potential to cause a much bigger outcry than the pirates. Adding a faucet doesn't seem like a great option.
In short, if you want lowsec boosted - offer a new suggestion that doesn't screw over a large portion of the player base and doesn't potentially break the economy. I'll bet CCP would listen.
As far as I can tell, though, the only people who want the above changes are those that just want more low-risk targets to shoot at. Your protest isn't "some self-interest", it is ALL self-interest.
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Ishakaril
Skeleton Crew Ltd.
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Posted - 2008.03.14 15:12:00 -
[17]
Wouldn't it go a bit like this:
1) Boost reward for non-pirates in low sec 2) More targets for pirates in low sec 3) More pirates go to low sec 4) Risk goes up 5) Less targets again
No matter what the "rewards" are in low sec, the number of pirates will be determined by the amount of targets. So the more reward, the more pirates and the risk/reward ratio remains the same.
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Luna Nilaya
Ultrapolite Socialites GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.14 15:14:00 -
[18]
Exactly. There's no point in going to low-sec since there's nothing valuable there. Nothing to fight over with other players. CCP doesn't seem to realize this and I doubt they are going to say anything in this thread, because they have nothing positive to say about it(the usual CCP way).
I have no idea what the devs are doing when they want to PVP in their own game. I doubt they like to go around low-sec aimlessly for hours trying to find a good fight like the rest of us.
0.0 is the place where players can fight over something but the server can't handle large scale battles. In my opinion low-sec should be almost as valuable as 0.0 and there should be some sort of things that you can for example capture and hold for profit. There used to be complexes which drew people to fight against each other but those(the valuable ones) are gone.
Long time ago I actually used to live in low-sec doing missions but then CCP decided that going around low-sec to complete missions wasn't dangerous enough and enabled(or made it a lot easier) pirates to probe down the mission runners, so I didn't see any reason to stay there and left to high-sec for better profits and I guess I wasn't the only one.
So basicly CCP has been nerfing low-sec and I think it's time to boost it... a lot. -
Installing premium content... Deleting file: \boot.ini |
Andrue
Federation Of Space Loonies Culture Shock Initiative
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Posted - 2008.03.14 15:15:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Ieu Duin People don't play MMOs to be sheep. So CCP is going to put some snazzy new element in low-sec belts and all the sheep are going to come baying?
Sheep don't bay. They go 'baaaaaaaah'. Or sometimes 'blurrrrt'. It's a totally different spelling. -- (Sarcastic mission running veteran)
[Brackley, UK]
My budgie can say "ploppy bottom". You have been warned. |
Bohoba
dragons nest imPure.
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Posted - 2008.03.14 15:16:00 -
[20]
:) why go to low sec to get ganked, when you can get ganked in high sec lol
not enough isk there or in 0.0 am making more in empire than I ever did in 0.0 and I had a cool pos network going moon mining for penuts to much work not enough isk.
Windows VistaÖ Ultimate x64-based PC Gigabyte X38-DQ6 Processor Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Extreme CPU Q6850 Memory 4,093.69 MB 2X Crossfire ASUS EAH3870/G/HTDI/512M Radeon HD 3870 512MB
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Durzel
State War Academy
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Posted - 2008.03.14 15:23:00 -
[21]
I love the way the OP says "It seems like the only people in low-sec are other "pirates"" without apparently realising the irony of the words. Low-sec is the ultimate self-defeating prophecy - people who go there do so with the intention to find "chumps to deprive of their hard-earned assets". Is it little wonder therefore that people who have no interest in that side of the game avoid it entirely?
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Frogzuk
Dragonian Freelancers KIA Alliance
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Posted - 2008.03.14 15:23:00 -
[22]
There are many reasons as to why people dont venture into low sec, and one of the main ones is the introduction of capital ships camping the gates. New players learn very quickly that they have next to no chance of gaining access to low sec when there are several pirates that happen to camp in smartbombing cap ships. And before you scream 'adapt or die' or 'join an alliance' or 'make a gang to include hics' .. i would like to point to you the pirate as a major factor in the dimise of lowsec
The dimise of low sec is in fact a pirate issue that needs to be considered before looking at whether low sec is attractive or not. If pirates where to step out of the disco caps and return to traditional pirating methods perhaps we would see more pilots in eve actually going into low sec looking for a duel or an adventure, taking that risk...
froggy
DGF website killboard |
Imperator Jora'h
Hedion University
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Posted - 2008.03.14 15:23:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Tarminic CCP knows there's a problem, but coming up with a solution that both encourages more people to enter low-sec and makes both pirates and carebears happy is a tough proposition.
Agreed it is not a simple problem but this is an issue that has been discussed many times here and I think some good ideas have been put forward that balances carebears vs. pirates rather well.
A big part of the issue is guards for carebears who may be (say) mining are disadvantaged from the get go. A guard cannot be proactive when guarding and has to wait for the bad guys to attack else they will lose sec status. A ding here and there is no biggie but if you make a habit of being a guard you'd find yourself negative in short order which many people care about. That or wait for the pirates to make the first move (allowing them the initiative which is huge). The pirate who is already -10 doesn't give a crap.
Add to that pirates seem to invariably target the miners/haulers despite any guards around. And of course the miners/haulers pop real quick. So, all the pirates really need care about is a gank while the guards need to protect and gank (meaning they need more ships...some to guard via various boosts and some fit to gank attackers).
Now add that PvP fit is > PvE fit so ratters are SOL.
A lot of that I think is solvable if they bothered. Maybe a deployable shield bubble miners can sit under (but cannot warp out of while active). This allows time for the guards to engage the pirates and pirates pretty much have to deal with the guards first. If the guards die the miners are stuck or if the miners decide to drop the shield and scoot they become vulnerable. Fun decisions. :)
Or have a deployable that "claims" a belt temporarily. Anyone warping to the belt gets a message that it is essentially an NBSI zone for ALL parties. While active if pirates warp in guards can engage immediately with NO sec hit (likewise pirates get no sec hit if they shoot first). The deployables of course would be temporary and could be limited to having only one active for the person who dropped it (and they must remain in the area or the deployable self destructs).
In both cases above pirates are not nerfed and carebears have some reasonable means for protecting themselves (if they bother...if they don't and want to solo mine in low sec they get what's coming to them).
Doubtless there are other ideas (maybe having a guard use its shields to protect a miner/hauler and say only industrial class ships [in this case meaning haulers/miners] can accept such protection so other PvP is not unbalanced]). Whatever...a little creativity can solve a lot of this.
-------------------------------------------------- "Of course," said my grandfather, pulling a gun from his belt as he stepped from the Time Machine, "there's no paradox if I shoot you!"
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CmdoColin
Deep Core Mining Inc.
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Posted - 2008.03.14 15:24:00 -
[24]
Originally by: eldiabloroho Theres really no point in ratting or mining in lowsec basicly.
Quoted for truth. Risks in low sec without an Alliance guarding your space and back just means you are an accident waiting to happen.
I personally think low sec gate ganking is one of the huge reasons people don't go into low sec. We've all had it happen to us - we're in our n00b ship on autopilot dribbling at the gfx on our first day, and suddenly we're dead. We learn adapt and survive. For some this means they will never set a foot in anything but 0.5+ This is 86% of the eve population.
Personally think gate ganking should be made harder in 0.1-0.4 space. Then give player groups a reason to go into that space armed to the teeth. It realistically has to be money that sucks them in. I personally would want to see a massive increase in the population of low sec. Allowing slightly easier travel to/through those systems I *think* might help. Reward though is the only true carrot that will get players there realistically. Audita et altera pars |
Grainsalt
Free-Corp Foundation Liberty Alliance
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Posted - 2008.03.14 15:25:00 -
[25]
Edited by: Grainsalt on 14/03/2008 15:26:17 Y'see, once upon a time I used to love low sec.. Now I don't ... I don;t mine there after repeatedly having capital ships dropped on me by cowards looking for easy ganks on a miner. (seriously, a carrier to smack a miner ... wtf?)...
All the low sec "pirates" as you call them got organised and formed alliances etc. so now instead of 4 or 5 people shooting you, you get a dozen dropped on your ass when you enter.
Personally I go straight from high sec to null space or hang out every so often in the quietest of low sec and dont mine or mission run as it is pointless.
Oh and dont even get me started on level 5 missions. ---
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=554257
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The TX
Earth Inc.
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Posted - 2008.03.14 15:26:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Admai Sket If Hulks had an extra mid-slot or two and some more CPU, so that a decent shield tank could be made, then I think more people would be brave enough to venture into non-0.0 low sec places for the chance at more ISKies.
Dammit, for some reason I posted with alt.
---------------------------- Ive noticed that 99.9% of people on these forums have a signature. If you are one of the 0.1% that does not have a sig, copy this into your sig, and display your defiance |
Durzel
State War Academy
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Posted - 2008.03.14 15:28:00 -
[27]
It also doesn't really help that you have to make a clear distinction between fitting your ship for PvE and fitting it for PvP. In most cases the two are mutually exclusive and fitting a module which is great for PvE ends up being counter-productive for PvP. Dealing with low-sec means fitting warp stabilisers, inertia stabs, etc which have no benefit to PvE.
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Luna Nilaya
Ultrapolite Socialites GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.14 15:29:00 -
[28]
People in this thread seem to complain about the high amount of pirates in low-sec. My problem is the opposite. There isn't enough pirates to fight with or you can't find them quickly. They mostly travel with stabs or stay docked since there isn't a lot of preys around. -
Installing premium content... Deleting file: \boot.ini |
Brun Thorvald
Red. Red Republic
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Posted - 2008.03.14 15:33:00 -
[29]
Because it's too easy to be a pirate, and therefore we have too many pirates.
If being ganked was a once-a-week thing, then losec would be full.
But it isnt - its a once an hour thing. Maybe more.
Therefore, why mine in losec when you can make decent to good money mining Plag in 0.7 space ?
Make it harder to be a pirate via no insurance, anti-pirate missions, fixing bounties so they work and making the way to get security rating back to be ganking pirates in their ships rather than ganking dumb rats in 0.0, and we'll see fewer pirates and therefore more people in losec.
But piracy is EZ-mode. You summed it up - "So I got myself a snazzy cruiser and took to the belts of low-sec empire looking for some roid-lubbers to gank" ... no work, no effort, maybe a 40 million isk investment.
So whine, gankbear, whine.
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Xyn Rhais
Tessaract
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Posted - 2008.03.14 15:37:00 -
[30]
People have these naive ideea that if lowsec had a lot of rewards carebears would move in. No, if lowsec had lots of rewards, 0.0 alliances would start claiming chunks of it.
You can't make it worthwile for carebears in lowsec simply by upping the rewards a lot.
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