Why does not CCP enforce the gamechanges as the occur?

When something is removed from the game or some criteria is changed for where items etc. are allowed, why is this not retroactive making the game-mech the same for everyone?

One example is carriers in high-sec which used to be allowed but now it ain't. Technicly it is extreemly simple for CCP to move these to an area which they in fact are allowed.


So CCP, mind explaining to me using very simple language (I'm a bit dense as you might have noticed) why you don't clean up your mess?

OCD much?

Remove all T2 BPO's now! No compensation. Remove all moon goo now. GIve everyone 100B.

/c

Why does not CCP enforce the gamechanges as the occur?

When something is removed from the game or some criteria is changed for where items etc. are allowed, why is this not retroactive making the game-mech the same for everyone?

One example is carriers in high-sec which used to be allowed but now it ain't. Technicly it is extreemly simple for CCP to move these to an area which they in fact are allowed.


So CCP, mind explaining to me using very simple language (I'm a bit dense as you might have noticed) why you don't clean up your mess?

Troll much?

Seems your Norsk Testosteron or whatever is doing serious stuff to your brains my friend, I'm not sure you're the only one understanding what you just stated there, but be it, I'll give my answer and doesn't matter if my opinion is different from what you expect.

You fail to understand how high sec is rather a high risk place already with sub cap ships for the regular player, the only ones for who high sec is really safe is for gankers scamers grieffers yellow self proclaimed "pirates" (read pussies) of all sort.

Now go ahead and give those pussies more tools to make high sec even worst. By the way CCP should change starting systems from high sec 1.0 to big alliances homelands in null and the tutorial agents give missions related to said alliance, those noobs would be a lot safer and have a better game start than in that crap that is "high sec".

You keep arguing a point you haven't made. Why is this a problem for you or anybody else, and why does it need to be fixed?

I mean other than tidying things up?

You keep arguing a point you haven't made. Why is this a problem for you or anybody else, and why does it need to be fixed?

I mean other than tidying things up?

there are thing in EVE that he will never have, no matter how hard he tries!!!!!


(sales of high-sec capitals are forbidden)

Why even care ?
What's your point ?
Where do you see a mess ?

There's no need to remove them. Carriers in highsec are bound to strict rules
and any violation of these rules will put them to lowsec.

There is no point in doing it. There is no need to
and they actually add bonus value to where they are.

Besides, no dev/gm would ever dare to take away Chribbas VeldNaught from Amarr on purpose.

CCP never added a rule that disallowed carriers in high sec. What they did was add these rules:

Carriers may not enter high sec after a specific date,
Carriers may not be built in high sec after a specific date.

But they never made a rule that prohibits them from being in high sec. As there is no rule that prohibits them from existing in high sec, there is no mess to clean up.

It's quite simple. You are not allowed to build carriers in hi-sec. You are not allowed to jump a carrier into hi-sec. Ergo, you are not allowed to have a carrier in hi-sec.

It's not about what's it to me and what's it to you or whatever. It's about CCP following their own god dam gameplay rules.

Move them to low-sec, they have no business in hi (not arguing but stating a point). What does that mean to you?

Remove all T2 BPO's now! No compensation. Remove all moon goo now. GIve everyone 100B.

/c

Yup, sounds just like a jealousy rage thread to me.

Learn the subtle but important difference between the phrases "not allowed" and "no longer allowed".

CCP rules state clearly that those caps are grandfathered in unless they misbehave, so they ARE following their own rules... you simply don't like those rules.

I like how quickly you get angry\offensive with people.

Firstly,
Your logic fails.
You're not allowed to build caps in high sec + you're not allowed to jump caps into high sec doesn't = you're not allowed caps in high sec.

Secondly,
They're not doing anything, you can't fit them for aggression and you can't sell them so they're effecively just a bragging right. So where's the hard.

Lets here your rational well constructed argument for wht T2 BPOs must be removed from the game.
Taking into account that they're not respionsible for there "being no profit in T2 invention" as things like Damage Control II's used to run around 20-30mil before invention and the low profit margins have been proven time and again to be a mix of inventards not working things out, the "I R MINE IT SO R IS FREE" crew and the "right click sell, whatever" brigade.

There is always a way for you to get this though, get the isk, buy the bpos, destroy them yourself.

TO MAKE MY SELF CLEAR: I do not want carriers in Hi. I want them moved and never to be let in again.

Why are you talking about T2 BPOs? This is off topic no?

I agree!

edit: minus the 100B

But why? They are not allowed to do anything other than fly around or mine really. If they break the rules, then they get banned for a few weeks and the capital is moved in to lowsec. Other than the fact that you can not have your own one in Hi-sec, why should a piece of EVE history be removed from the game?

And on the 'special rules for some', well, hi-sec has its own special rules that seperate it from null-sec. Should we blend the two together, either making the entire game Hi-sec or the entire game null-sec, just because players in each may not like the way things work in the other?

Why do you think CCP changed the game?

They are not allowed in Hi, only to a handfull of special people so special that they infact require their own special rules.

Just give everyone tech 2 BPO's so you don't have certain people hoarding them so they can jack up the prices.

But you're logic for removing carriers from Hi is faulty.

It's a
If some herps are derps and some derps are gerps then some herps are definatly gerps.

Given that CCP have said that high sec carriers are ok and that as long as they follow rules they can stay there, they're fair game.

WHY: They should not and are not intended to be there

SPECIAL RULES: You choose to go to hi/lo/null and is gameplay mech. carriers in hi is not.

Capitals are allowed in HS as long as they were there before the change (and hence can never leave if the pilot wishes to use them in that system) and do not fit any weapons.

I see no problem here.


Also it is not for you to decide whether they should or should not be there. They are there and CCP lets them be there, therefore, they should be there. As long as they follow the rules.

Thisd is exactly what I'm talking about. CCP let's them stay there... WHY?

Because it's not breaking any rules

But they are intended to be there, as long as they were built there before the changes. Sure, captials that have been moved there since using exploits should be put back in to low, but the original capitals have every right to be there as you do

And they chose to build their capitals in hi-sec, under gameplay mechanics that were in place at the time that allowed it. No difference.

So, to be fair to all, why don't you run along and take a vote... then get back to us with the results.

I see that it may. Let me ask you this: What would make you stick your neck out and speak against common popular believs?

Yeah, let's make a vote out of it.

I think you fail to see the larger picture. We are playing a game where the rules are different (not chosen by te players themselves) and most people are ok with it because some high-profiled players are fronting this.

Don't give me the crap about new players get to see one etc. They can go to lo or null if they want to see one.

Yeah, let's make a vote out of it.

CCP rules say capitals cannot do missions or engage in pvp if they are in high sec.

So in short, the high sec capital relics are not breaking any rules simply by being in high sec if they were built there.

Well,at least your position is a little more clear. Something of a rules purist, and a guy not terribly afraid of ruffling feathers. You come off a bit thin-skinned for this stance, but ,again, you're defending your position.

Your chosen example, the carrier in HS, is perhaps not a well-chosen issue, due to it's lack of offense to pretty much anybody but you. But it does fit with your "everybody equal" concept. As you are not likely to get much traction with the carrier issue, have you considered your next step?

I see a future for you in a CSM campaign. You've taken the first step. If you have the chops, EVE is yours for the taking. You have just as much right as any other pilot to advance your causes. Have at it.

Guys, just let this die. Please.

When you're talking to a wall, it's not the wall that's the idiot.

If they were meant to be "removed" from hi-sec they would have been removed from there, but as I see it, they just changed the rules to "prohibit" them from hi-sec, not moving them out.
Some people left their cap ship there, CCP could have just moved them out if that was their intentions, but it wasn't and they made "special rules" for those willing to "sacrifice" a cap ship close to uselessness.

What they did was lach the backbone to proper implement a change.

Sorry, Didn't mean to ignore you, I just felt your arguments was covered elsewhere. I will however repeat myself so you can feel special too:

The rules you refeer to are "special rules" which only apply to a fraction of players in the game. I am uncomfertable with special rules for special people. It's like a fricking "Whites only" sign on a park bench.

The written and technicality regards to the rules are correct. However you and I both know that carriers where supposed to be removed from High but for "some" reason they are still there.

I'm just saying: Why is it so hard for CCP to make proper actions and execute the changes they do in a proper way so that we and they avoid this kind of crap.

That being said, I don't expect this to go anywhere but I expect CCP to understand that what they are doing is NOT COOL.

I give up and agree with your view point

I too hate history and think that everything in the past should be ignored and have current rules applied to it

A position/belief that was actually defensible.

Pssst.... the rules have never been chosen by the players.

However they can influence CCP's decisions concerning the rules they create.

This is why those ships are still there.

I eagerly await the results of your vote, good luck.

I believe in a Eve universe where the gameplay rules are the same for every paying customer and not favoured towards certain individuals or groups.

It's quite simple. You are not allowed to build carriers in hi-sec. You are not allowed to jump a carrier into hi-sec. Ergo, you are not allowed to have a carrier in hi-sec.

It's not about what's it to me and what's it to you or whatever. It's about CCP following their own god dam gameplay rules.

Move them to low-sec, they have no business in hi (not arguing but stating a point). What does that mean to you?

MOst high sec caps were jumped out into low and 0.0 because people wanted to use them (back then, these ships were game changers in fights). CCP never removed capitals from empire in some sort of giant purge. The handfull which remained were given special rules so they would become harmless showbits.

As such, the veldnought is now a tourist destination and part of EVE history as are the others. A GM mistakenly did move the veldnought into low sec the other year and the backlash from the playerbase was so large they moved it back to Amarr. Indeed the only reason Amarr has asteroid belts is because of the veldnought. These capitals are in high sec because the playerbase want them to be there.

It is these rare things which makes eve so special.

I'm just saying: Why is it so hard for CCP to make proper actions and execute the changes they do in a proper way so that we and they avoid this kind of crap.

No the rules was made to create special circumstances for a very few individuals allowing them to ignore major gamechange.

There is no bonus to having a cap in high other than notoriety. Some people are just better than you because they have a more interesting personality.
This is the problem with society now and no child left behind or no one is a loser. Because there are losers and there are people built to be trash collectors. Welcome to reality within fantasy.

You still haven't said why this is necessary.

Hi sec carriers can't be sold, used for aggression, be undocked while a friendly fleet is active in system, etc...

The only adverse effect they have is causing other ships to bounce off them when they undock.

At the moment your original post reads like this to the majority of visitors to this thread: 'Wah! I can't have a high sec carrier! Wah!'

I'm now contacting my government to force them to demolish any and all buildings that have been erecticed since the last building standards change.

This will include all listed and historical buildings that weren't built following the current ruleing and regulations.

The rules you refeer to are "special rules" which only apply to a fraction of players in the game. I am uncomfertable with special rules for special people. It's like a fricking "Whites only" sign on a park bench.

Which are you? You believe you are better then someone else?

Which are you? You believe you are better then someone else?

I understand your position, now please understand mine:

My problem is not the veldnaught or whatever inert out of place ship existing in Hi-Sec. My problem is that old "mess" are still an issue. I discuss this on a principal matter. I believe that all players should have the same posibillities within Eve and today this is not the case.

In order for CCP to show the playerbase that their game is operated by common and consistant rules, they need to get their hands dirty.

If CCP threw out the veldnaught, then why don't the owner find a system to put it where it belongs insted? What makes him so special that he needs special rules for his particular case?

Tourism??? Popular belief?? In that case, everyone should be allowed to build a carrier in 07 or lower as long as they stick to theese "rules" no?

Okay, lets overlook the stupidity of the comparison you just made for a moment. By your own admission it is also morally reprehensible to have special rules that protect the rights/health/safety of people with diasabilities... or special rules that ensure certain special oportunities exist for people considered to come from a disadvantaged back ground or economic situation (special grants, job/education oportunities, financial options).... the list goes on and on.

Really?

Big guy, it's just a game. Time to stop pretending you represent some non-existant moral high ground.


(Sometimes, when the wall is in front of you, it's best to emulate Joshua.)

Not really, no. They aren't allowed to ignore anything GÇö that's the part you're missing. In fact, they have to adhere to the rules very closely or they will be smacked about quite severely.

I agree!

edit: minus the 100B

You are aware of the fact that you just repeated my statement in slightly different selection of words right?

Thanks to make me think of that.

OP, do you think we, disabled persons, are special because we have parking close to the door ?
Do you think we are specials because we have helps to make changes to our homes etc ?
Do you think we are specials because people are "nicer" to us ?

The point is, special rules are everywhere in our world.

Geez, what did that carrier in Jita do to you? Did it molest your peepee?

you sir, seem to be missing the point.

I think (Yes you should do that in the church but anyway) that a person with disabilities or somesuch in real-life would welcome the chance to play a game where these things don't matter and there are no special considerations made.

Unfortunately it's not like that and to follow up your analogy: The close parking space you talked about, it just got occupied by Donald Trumph.

Yeah dumb to use OOG analogies but anyway....

Not really, it's reveresed, reversed irony.

I think (Yes you should do that in the church but anyway) that a person with disabilities or somesuch in real-life would welcome the chance to play a game where these things don't matter and there are no special considerations made.

Unfortunately it's not like that and to follow up your analogy: The close parking space you talked about, it just got occupied by Donald Trumph.

Yeah dumb to use OOG analogies but anyway....

So you agree, then, that it's not even remotely close to being a problem since they have to abide by the same rules as everyone else? Good, then you can stop bleating.

You have consistently failed to explain what the supposed problem or mess or GÇ£crapGÇ¥ is, and now you just agreed that there is none. We already know this. Now shush.

It didin't stop you.

By the way, those "special rules" you hate are what keeps Donald from taking his parking spot... not the other way around.

Any other points you'd like to make for us before you wind down?

That's it? I expected more...

The problem is: There are elements in this game which is not available to all players. Get rid of them and my problem is gone.

Why this is a problem: It's the principal of the matter. If it's there, all players should have access to it. Simple as that.

That's it? I expected more...

The problem is: There are elements in this game which is not available to all players.

Why this is a problem: It's the principal of the matter.

Remove all T2 BPO's now! No compensation. Remove all moon goo now. GIve everyone 100B.

/c

Confirming the OP's "crap" is simple jealousy, a.k.a. epeen envy.

You are not confirming anything. I have made several statements that the solution to this particular problem is to move them to losec.

That's it? I expected more...

The problem is: There are elements in this game which is not available to all players. Get rid of them and my problem is gone.

Why this is a problem: It's the principal of the matter. If it's there, all players should have access to it. Simple as that.

Why is that a problem?

Not enough. In fact, the whole game is built around some people having stuff others can't have. Moreover, if that's your supposed principle, why are you going after the most meaningless (non)example GÇö the one that causes absolutely no issues for anyone whatsoever? So no, again: why is it a problem?

GǪwhich doesn't change the fact the GǣcrapGǥ you're referring to is simple jealousy, and that you've pretty much confirmed it yourself at this point. You are completely unable to explain what the problem is without referring to this jealousy of yours.

You are wrong. The game is build on a fundation that what you don't have you steal, take or work for. So tell me all knowing tirpia: How do I go about doing this regarding a carrier in Hi-Sec?

Although this guy is a troll, i'd like to add something.


These people aren't special at all. Nope. Nada. In no way.

We don't see hundreds of threads popping up about this,
we don't have a threadnaught about it,
actually it seems that people do not give a **** ...

... hence: They aren't special.

The only one perceiving them as special is you,
hence the issue is with you.

Yeah, sounds like you're probably jelly ... but who cares, you're not special either
and you won't feel better after trying to make everybody as "equal" as you are.


/Thread.

Edit: Oh, others beat me to it already. *lol*

High sec caps have changed hands a few times. Its just the same as other rare ships such as the state issue raven and guardian-vexor.

Read on (You could have saved some internet space)....

I understand that you are all for fight for it or loose it mentality. However this "causes non issue" is a perfect example since it just illustrates the point.

I do however not agree that certain privileges are in place or will come in place which strengthen the already strong to a point where the sovreighnty cannot be challanged.

I worry more on what's to come than what has passed even thoug the past should be cleaned up.

How? According to the "special" rules you are not allowed to trade these items?

So exactly how is it possible to bring up something here without it being the "likes thread" or the pony stuff and get a message through?? Without being personally accused for jealousy?

You cant sell them.

It seems to be pretty clear that the only one who has a problem with this is the OP.

What are you hoping to accomplish with this? Since you are the only one who seems to be in favour of this change, this thread will accomplish absolutely nothing.

GǪand here's the question to the OP, if we are to pick one of the assorted principles strewn around and say that the problem is that not everyone can get their hands on a highsec capital: why aren't you saying they should rescind this silly rule, so you can buy one?

O.K. This thread is now about Zambonis.


http://www.tabletpcbuzz.com/forum/uploaded/WNewquay/20044227751_zamboni1.jpg

http://www.toxel.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/zamboni05.jpg

http://www.toxel.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/zamboni03.jpg

GǪand here's the question to the OP, if we are to pick one of the assorted principles strewn around and say that the problem is that not everyone can get their hands on a highsec capital: why aren't you saying they should rescind this silly rule, so you can buy one?

I bet you wish that sometimes there would be someone who took the bull by the horns and adressed certain problems which usually is 'shusshed' down when it comes to politics.

IF CCP acknowledged it was a misstake and unintentional to keep a small hand of unintended cap's in Hi and actually do something about it.

As it is today I do not trust CCP to do this in a proper way and I demand that they show their alegiance is towards all players and not some few.

Bacause you don't understand the fact that I don't want one.

I wish that sometimes, people who took the bull by the horns explained what problems they were trying to solveGǪ

GǪand that's a big if because the question remains: why would they do that? It's not like it actually was a mistake or unintentional.

They can do that by simply not listening to youGǪ vOv

Whether you want one or not is irrelevant. It's about applying your invented principle. Are you now saying that you don't want to do that either?

#1: I D O N ' T W A N T O T H E R S T O H A V E A C A R R I E R I N H I G H - S E C B E C A U S E I C A N ' T H A V E O N E
#2: But I disagree that they are present as they constitute a fovourable meaningless standing towards a small group of players from CCP's side.

Why would that address the "problem" (that no one see's but you) when the tools to deal with the issue are already available in game?

Gather your imaginary support and gank those carriers (it is certainly doable... if you have enough people drinking your kool Aid).

Better yet, scam them and self destruct or move them to low sec yourself.

It's hard to impress people with 'grabbing the bull by the horns" when the bull in question is actually a stuffed animal with horns made of felt.

People like you are the justification for my sig:

Maybee you are not looking at it from the right angle. It is not my responsibility to change your view, so you can disregard this as "I don't get it" and leave it with that.

Simple, Otherwise they woudn't bother moving the production to low sec and stopping these types of ships enter high sec.

What are you talking about?

#1: I D O N ' T W A N T A C A R R I E R I N H I G H - S E C

#2: But I disagree that they are present as they constitute a fovourable standing towards a small group of players from CCP's side.

FYP

Last but not least, it would be a clear message to everyone that in this game, CCP makes the rules and that no "democratic elected" player counsil may affect the execution of gameplay changes.

As it is today I do not trust CCP to do this in a proper way and I demand that they show their alegiance is towards all players and not some few.

That noone agrees doesen't invalidate my concerns the slightest.

For you: Meaningless in this context. But nevertheless Meaningless/favourable is still there, hence it's a problem in my book.

That noone agrees doesen't invalidate my concerns the slightest. You will see that most progressions throughout our RL history is made by those few who chose to stand outside mainstream and speak their mind.

GǪand the question remains: why is that a problem? It provides exactly zero benefit, and isn't particularly tied to any specific person.

For you: Meaningless in this context. But nevertheless Meaningless/favourable is still there, hence it's a problem in my book.

That noone agrees doesen't invalidate my concerns the slightest. You will see that most progressions throughout our RL history is made by those few who chose to stand outside mainstream and speak their mind.

Now we're getting somewhere. You're not working up to a run for the CSM, you're working to crush the CSM. It might take us e few more pages to drag out of you what is really behind this whole idea. But, hey, that's half the fun. It would be too easy if it was only that Darius or Mittens ganked your hulk or your incursion boat. I'm sure it's more complicated than that. Maybe a bit of real life misfortune mixed in.

Seriously, if you're committed to this line of reasoning/attack, then by all means start a corp and build a following of like-minded individuals to advance your cause. Don't be afraid to start small. Goonswarm didn't start out with 7000 pilots.

But really, pick a better lynchpin for your efforts. The carrier thing is just a no-go.

You question what problem a favourable standing from CCP towards a limited group poses?

I 'worry' about CCPs Bias.

Your position impossible to sell when no one else agrees with you, including the people who make and enforce the rules.

And yes, history is full "my view is the only view" zealots.

"they didn't listen"

Yes. What is the problem? What GÇ£favourable standingGÇ¥ do they get? How does it in any way affect anything? How does it in any way differ from the GÇ£favourable standingsGÇ¥ other limited groups get?

I 'worry' about CCPs Bias.

They executed the first docktors who had their medical students wash their hands after performing autopsies aswell untill someone spoke up.

Bet you're glad they did now even though you would be the executioner back then.

Ingame: Quite a lot. I think deep, deep really deeep inside your little tipria heart you agree asell. but now you just have to drag it out based on you principle of never loosing an arguement and always having the last word (regardless how meager it is).
OOG: Not my concern as I am master of my own life.

The one you just commented on... feeble..

Ingame: Quite a lot. I think deep, deep really deeep inside your little tipria heart you agree asell. but now you just have to drag it out based on you principle of never loosing an arguement and always having the last word (regardless how meager it is).
OOG: Not my concern as I am master of my own life.

Favourable standings from CCP towards certain groups of players is an isse which concerns me.

CCP admits they should not be there:

GM Quote regarding 6M logofski trick:

So why don't they just remove them? Because it's unpopular and they "cause no harm".
Problem is, next time CCP screws up can I be sure that they actually pull through and rectify previous misstakes?

CCP admits they should not be there:

GM Quote regarding 6M logofski trick:
This is pretty much the cause for almost all cases where a capital ship ends up in high sec space. This is a very old mechanic, predating capital ships, that had some unintended consequences. This hole will be closed at some point in time.

"Up until then, please file a petition if your capital ship (or someone else's) ends up in high sec that way and a GM will correct the issue."

Sure looks like something is not right here to me.

So why don't they just remove them? Because it's unpopular and they "cause no harm".

What GÇ£favourable standingGÇ¥ do they get? How does it in any way affect anything? How does it in any way differ from the GÇ£favourable standingsGÇ¥ other limited groups get? In short, what is the problem?

Source?

Since they have screwed up since and have indeed rectified it, yes. More to the point, though, where is the GÇ£screw upGÇ¥? Highsec caps have already been rectified.

I'm not sure I follow the problem, here, exactly.

There's no special consideration to any one person over another. If you manage to get a capital in high sec yuo are just as welcome to slowboat around in it waving to all the miners, too. You could buy one, if you really wanted.

Eve mechanics restricting awesomely cool things to only those who can afford the very best? That's a fundamental trait of the game.

Nobody's going to stop you from buying one. Well...you might have less prospective sellers after your baffling tantrums in here.

Favourable standings from CCP towards certain groups of players is an isse which concerns me. In this particular case it is easy to prove because the items in question basically are e-peen toys.

CCP admits they should not be there:

GM Quote regarding 6M logofski trick:
This is pretty much the cause for almost all cases where a capital ship ends up in high sec space. This is a very old mechanic, predating capital ships, that had some unintended consequences. This hole will be closed at some point in time.

"Up until then, please file a petition if your capital ship (or someone else's) ends up in high sec that way and a GM will correct the issue."

Sure looks like something is not right here to me.

So why don't they just remove them? Because it's unpopular and they "cause no harm".


Problem is, next time CCP screws up can I be sure that they actually pull through and rectify previous misstakes?

A start to reassure me this is the case is for them to rectify previous misstakes (like carriers in high f.ex.)

The question is why the hell should they be there at all?

Somone mentioned tourism.... then put up a NPC with a carrier or somthing and let it take it out for a spin once a day or so. this way you keep your tourism atraction but keep the god dam players out of it.

The source of this is in another thread called "jita carrier" in general forum. Read it there.

Quoting out of context, tsk, tsk.

The GM quote above refers to capital ships that were erroneously moved to high sec, not cap ships that were built there before players could no longer do that.

CCP will move cap ships that meet that criteria, not because of any perceived popularity issues, but because those cap ships should not have been moved to high-sec in the first place.

there are thing in EVE that he will never have, no matter how hard he tries!!!!!


(sales of high-sec capitals are forbidden)

You seriously haven't figgured out that I don't want one yet... scary.

And no you can't buy one as the special rules sais it's not allowed.

CCP should be neutral and no special treatment whatsoever. This matter is just insainly visible so it has become the spearhead of this (one man) operation.

The source of this is in another thread called "jita carrier" in general forum. Read it there.

This is pretty much the cause for almost all cases where a capital ship ends up in high sec space. This is a very old mechanic, predating capital ships, that had some unintended consequences. This hole will be closed at some point in time. Up until then, please file a petition if your capital ship (or someone else's) ends up in high sec that way and a GM will correct the issue.

Doesn't mean you cant get hold of one.

Still don't want one, just wan them gone.

Still don't want one, just wan them gone.

What GÇ£special treatmentGÇ¥ and GÇ£favourable standingGÇ¥ do they get? How does it in any way affect anything? How does it in any way differ from the GÇ£favourable standingsGÇ¥ other limited groups get? In short, what is the problem?

GǪso entirely irrelevant to the topic at hand. Since, if we actually quote the post in question in full, it says:
So no, it doesn't actually say that the highsec caps shouldn't be there.

In other words, you admit that your supposed principle isn't actually important.

If you read it clearly state this is for the 6 month ships. and if you also bothered reading, this is the way "MOST" of them ended up there.

What other limited groups get favourable standings Tipsia? Tell me and then I can include these cases aswell.

Read the bold text. then tell me how do we deal with those unintended ships?

What other limited groups get favourable standings Tipsia? Tell me and then I can include these cases aswell.

Read the bold text. then tell me how do we deal with those unintended ships?

I am well aware what conditions caused those ships to be in high-sec. Some of them were even moved there because of petitions and brain-dead GMs. However, your argument is that all cap ships be removed from high-sec because of some "favoritism" fallacy you perceive, even the few ships that CCP grandfathered because they were built and never left high-sec.

Why
Do
You
Care?

Seriously.

It doesn't affect you, you don't want one, you seem to have no actual interest in this topic beyond a somewhat obtuse means of attention-whoring.

So...what gives?

What other limited groups get favourable standings Tipsia? Tell me and then I can include these cases aswell.

Read the bold text. then tell me how do we deal with those unintended ships?

I care because of what I have written throughout this thread.

The classic paradox(?). You want CCP to give special consideration to your request that CCP stop giving players special consideration. And for your example you choose someone who is not getting special consideration.

The inequalities, the mistakes and flaws, the crazy, the unfair, the honor and the spite, the intentional lack of symmetry in the entire fabric of the game........it's what makes it worth playing. The insane depth of the complexity of the EVE universe is the nutty lure of the whole thing. Embrace the chaos. Or bend it to your will. Get out of the forum and play the game. I will, as soon as I get off work.

Interesting and a well put blow. But not full score as I only seek equality and not privileges.

I care because of what I have written throughout this thread. You should read it.

You understand how quotation marks are used, right?

Anyway: highsec players, lowsec players, nullsec players, anyone creating good content, anyone owning anything non-seededGǪ in effect, everyone GÇö they just belong to different limited groups that get different favourable standings.

Alternatively: no-one, since not even people owning highsec caps are given any kind of favourable standing. You see, the problem here is that you still haven't defined GÇ£favourable standingGÇ¥, even though I've been asking you to for a while.

In other words, you don't care. First, it was due to some principle concerning special treatment and not having to obey the rules, which has been proven false. Then it was due to some principle concerning equal access, which you have since admitted you don't actually subscribe to.

How is it "favoring a small, select group" when apparently anyone can take 6 months and have a carrier in high sec.

Pssst: Your trolling style bleeds through after a while. You did better this time, but I still can't rate you very highly.

Well then we more then half agree then.

How do you suggest this should be dealt with?

drivel.

Again, why do you care?

First, a permanent ban on your being able to forum post.

Notwithstanding your forum ban, it should be "dealt with" how it always has been. If a cap ship was built in high sec before that was no longer possible, and that ship has never left high-sec, and the owner has not violated the rules for it to remain there, it can remain there.

GǪexcept that you just said that you don't. You're arguing against things that would create equality. You are also completely unable to explain what supposed inequality there is.

whel there is one fundamental flaw in what you say... A new player can choose if he/she wishes to go to low/high etc. but can never choose to aquire a cap in high. The non-seeded I am unsure what you speak of but if it is unobtainable for new players i think it should be removed or re-seeded.

You should concider a career as a writer. You come up with good stories as you see fit.

Special treatment = big nono
Equal Access = Big yesyes

the priveleged ones are the ones who stay there with CCP's blessings.

Ok should you and I do this or should CCP do it?

The 6 monthers (let's call them that) are not the priveleged ones. they get kicked out once discovered.

the priveleged ones are the ones who stay there with CCP's blessings.

GǪexcept that he can, and that even if he couldn't, it wouldn't convey any favourable standing on him.

Also, why do you want to destroy the uniqueness and history that non-seeded items bring to the game?

GǪso why are you arguing against equal access?

What privilege are bestowed upon them? How are they GÇ£blessedGÇ¥ in any way? How does it in any way affect anything? How does it in any way differ from the GÇ£favourable standingsGÇ¥ other limited groups get? In short, what is the problem?

Do what? CCP handles enforcing rules violations. You could certainly play messenger and petition any cap ships you see engaging in high-sec combat (which is verboten) or ships you have evidence that were improperly moved there, such as the one in Jita that could never possibly have been built there.

As for me, I don't care, because cap ships in high-sec can't do anything that affects anyone other than possibly creating some epeen envy, and some wonderment in newbie players.

I don't like you and want you gone.

See ?

Why shouldnt they stay? They are breaking no rules.

Well regarding this CCP has made up their mind, they are out. sorry, guess you didn't belong to the favoured ones.

Well regarding this CCP has made up their mind, they are out. sorry, guess you didn't belong to the favoured ones.

You can continue to refuse to accept my position in this matter no worries. You will howeve never convince me that there is no spoon. And I think your convincing power is highly overrated.

MY STATEMENT: CCP bestowes priveleges (Be they beneficial or not) upon some selected players (be it consiently or based on random).

I don't like it and I want it gone.

You like it and you want it to stay OR you really like to discuss about things you don't care about (which is the more likely?)

Since you have concluded with the fact that the 6 monthers should be removed I ask you one last thing:

Why shouldn't they be allowed to stay?

Where did he/she said they are not ? The GM just said it was a known "bug", nothing about caps in hi-sec being prohibited.

The 6 monthers (let's call them that) are not the priveleged ones. they get kicked out once discovered.

the priveleged ones are the ones who stay there with CCP's blessings.

Check the linky in the last post in "Jita Carrier" then find the senior GM post there.

Check the linky in the last post in "Jita Carrier" then find the senior GM post there.

Check the linky in the last post in "Jita Carrier" then find the senior GM post there.

This is pretty much the cause for almost all cases where a capital ship ends up in high sec space. This is a very old mechanic, predating capital ships, that had some unintended consequences. This hole will be closed at some point in time. Up until then, please file a petition if your capital ship (or someone else's) ends up in high sec that way and a GM will correct the issue.

I don''t like you either, you best watch yourself

Or, what, you'll get him removed like you're failing to do with Empire capitals?

Still asking you to show me where it says as you say.

Hi Murrfa. I hate to rain on your parade. Sadly we will have to move this ship to a low sec. system. What has been said previously is correct, players have never been been able to build Rorquals in high sec systems. How the ship ended up there remains to be determined, but it will have to be moved.

I am getting scared.

Then the question I ask is this: Why are there any carriesr in Hi-Sec at all? WHY? History?? Tourism???

No it's because CCP "forgot" to move the existing fleet out (usual mockup).

The rest of you can showel it. You are only protecting your interests because you are afraid what will come next.

The rest of you can showel it. You are only protecting your interests because you are afraid what will come next.

CCP doesn't allow any carrier in hisec except for the ones who where there before the new 0.7 rules happened. This is a fact and I am sure a GM could support this (But I guess they won't since this is a ticking bomb). If you don't believe me, check the linky in the "jita carrier" thread.


Then the question I ask is this: Why are there any carriesr in Hi-Sec at all? WHY? History?? Tourism???


No it's because CCP "forgot" to move the existing fleet out (usual mockup). But clearly they don't want them there that stating anything else would be just plain stupid.

Now they lach the ability/will to deal with it so they do DC (as usual) and hope noone sais anything about it.

Well I say somthing about it and I demand to know why CCP allows this trovesty to continue.



The share interest and slaughter by concerned people of this thread should tell you something CCP so how about a statement???

Aleast tell me I'm wrong....



The rest of you can showel it. You are only protecting your interests because you are afraid what will come next.

CCP doesn't allow any carrier in hisec except for the ones who where there before the new 0.7 rules happened. This is a fact and I am sure a GM could support this (But I guess they won't since this is a ticking bomb). If you don't believe me, check the linky in the "jita carrier" thread.


Then the question I ask is this: Why are there any carriesr in Hi-Sec at all? WHY? History?? Tourism???


No it's because CCP "forgot" to move the existing fleet out (usual mockup). But clearly they don't want them there that stating anything else would be just plain stupid.

Now they lach the ability/will to deal with it so they do DC (as usual) and hope noone sais anything about it.

Well I say somthing about it and I demand to know why CCP allows this trovesty to continue.



The share interest and slaughter by concerned people of this thread should tell you something CCP so how about a statement???

Aleast tell me I'm wrong....



The rest of you can showel it. You are only protecting your interests because you are afraid what will come next.

What interests would those be exactly?