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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 15 post(s) |

KarmaHotelLobby
Aliastra Gallente Federation
6
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Posted - 2012.07.19 18:56:00 -
[301] - Quote
It'd be nice if, in the process, you don't remove a source of alliance income with no replacement of similar magnitude. I far prefer the model that generates income from members rather than POS standing around - but the alliances with active membership using space should be at least significantly wealthy off the backs of their minions.
A look into how to tax mining and ratting taxes would not go amiss. |

Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
1436
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 18:58:00 -
[302] - Quote
KarmaHotelLobby wrote:It'd be nice if, in the process, you don't remove a source of alliance income with no replacement of similar magnitude. Most alliances get by fine without technetium, no replacement needed. |

Rivver
Legions Ltd
1
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:00:00 -
[303] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:Two step wrote:Hakaru Ishiwara wrote:Maximus Stuu wrote:/me puts on tinfoil hat
How suprising that the market was brought out of Cobalt 2 months ago....probably the only way this new Dev was allowed to start playing with Tech, giving Goons the heads up before.... Funny how the CSM had their Newcastle, UK reach-around with CCP Unifex and friends ~2 months ago... call it a conspiracy or the delusions of the paranoid, but the CSM and Devs are only human. One thing leads to another, a hand-job is given and sekret game design information is the reward... Huh? The CSM summit was in Reykjavik, there was a player meet (open to the public) in Newcastle, UK a month or so ago. The CSM hasn't even known about this change for longer than a month, and only got the specific changes in the last few weeks, so perhaps your tinfoil hats need adjusting? Also, I would also like to point out that just like CCP devs, the CSM is monitored by CCP's Internal Affairs department. I know for a fact that some CSM members had piles of tech that they were unable to sell before this blog went public because of this policy. If you have a specific complaint, by all means post it here or send it to [email protected]. For what its worth, as stated we really just got the details recently. I can tell you I've been waiting for it to go public as at the start of the goon wars against us they called in a favor and super-capped our towers to oblivion. I was in the process of sorting out where we should put replacements and have deliberately stopped thinking about it until this was public so I wouldn't gain advantage. Funny thing is even before this was the case I was thinking about a cobalt moon because it is a big part of Gallente T2. Last time I looked though we found a lot of unoccupied cobalt moons but cadmium was elusive. I guess we can expect another rush to ignored moons now! So anyways, I didn't see any signs of insider information advantage from this and lets face it, having a tech moon is still better than alchemy. Until we get ring mining I think we still have a moon mining problem. Issler
And what have you really done for us?
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MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
473
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:01:00 -
[304] - Quote
Rivver wrote:MeBiatch wrote:Rivver wrote:MeBiatch wrote:EvilweaselSA wrote:also i think the en guarde dude, due to being extremely bad at eve, isn't factoring in insurance when we lose scads of drakes its not a very big loss you know you guys were to be cool like china in the simpsons... you guys even decalred how terribad you all were... now look at you... all leet and sstuff... the stench of bob is eminating from your collective crotches! What does this have to do with CCP fixing Tech? nothing tbh its just that cfc peeps are harrassing soco peeps due to collective butt smelling... so i atempted to put things in perspective... I'm not sure how you intend to convince anyone of your perspective when your writing is so horrible. At any rate, this has nothing to do with the changes described in the Devblog. I'm now of the belief that these changes will change nothing.
yes my style of pros is horrible... but still that should not detract from the point that cfc has turned into what they fought to kill all those years ago... its like how luke lashed out at darth and then ended up turing to the dark side in episode 7.
PLEX FOR PIZZA! -áThere are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... |

Grath Telkin
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
847
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:06:00 -
[305] - Quote
MeBiatch wrote:
yes my style of pros is horrible... but still that should not detract from the point that cfc has turned into what they fought to kill all those years ago... its like how luke lashed out at darth and then ended up turing to the dark side in episode 7.
Yea, how exactly are they like BOB, please enumerate the likenesses, spelling errors will of course be ignored in your 'special case'.
We'll wait right here while you get them together.
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Terrorfrodo
Deep Space Darwinian Law Enforcement Agency
102
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:10:00 -
[306] - Quote
Well you can't keep playing and winning EVE for years and not become l33t in the process can you? If Goons kept saying they are terribad I'd call them liars.
The large alliances need to have taken a large portion of their income away, imho. Not because I hate them but for the good of the game and their own good. When an alliance suffers a string of major defeats in battle, they should be in dire fiscal straits. If a major bloc sits on trillions on cash then what does it really mean to lose a war? If you lose half your territory your alliance should be beggared and ruined, like a country would be after it is invaded. The Invulnerability Sphere:Make mining/industrial vessels defendable, better fights for everyone! |

Rivver
Legions Ltd
1
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:11:00 -
[307] - Quote
Terrorfrodo wrote:Well you can't keep playing and winning EVE for years and not become l33t in the process can you? If Goons kept saying they are terribad I'd call them liars.
The large alliances need to have taken a large portion of their income away, imho. Not because I hate them but for the good of the game and their own good. When an alliance suffers a string of major defeats in battle, they should be in dire fiscal straits. If a major bloc sits on trillions on cash then what does it really mean to lose a war? If you lose half your territory your alliance should be beggared and ruined, like a country would be after it is invaded.
So you want people to take your stuff? Is that what you are saying? |

MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
473
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:13:00 -
[308] - Quote
Grath Telkin wrote:MeBiatch wrote:
yes my style of pros is horrible... but still that should not detract from the point that cfc has turned into what they fought to kill all those years ago... its like how luke lashed out at darth and then ended up turing to the dark side in episode 7.
Yea, how exactly are they like BOB, please enumerate the likenesses, spelling errors will of course be ignored in your 'special case'. We'll wait right here while you get them together.
oh thank you grath... i do apprichiate looking over my lack of using spell check... :)
well back in the day bob said to goons this is our game and goons were like we are fun loving guys so we dont like how you are all about leet pvp so well rifter gang bang you to death...
but then something changed when goons gost disbanded and all the good leaders went to ccp... they became what they hated... the new bob... they are the richest peeps who are not telling people litterally this is thier game and we all have to just accept that...
well i do hope that now the tech bro love fest will die and that will mean that goons can go back to thier roots and become just as terrible as they once were... and when most of eve lubed them for it...
I mean if RA can s[lit how many times and they eneded up in a death match... could we not eventually see goons fight test?
though for PL you guys never change even when you were merc alliance all those years ago... your still sucling on the richest persons bosums...
so kol ha kavod to you for staying true to your morals...
PLEX FOR PIZZA! -áThere are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... |

Armarrian Slave
Stargate SG-1 Fatal Ascension
0
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:14:00 -
[309] - Quote
As a fledgling indy/manu toon. I already fine it very daunting to figure out everything I need to do in order to create tech 2 items. And find PI very annoying and confusing at times. Wouldn't a good way of reducing cost be to simplify the manufacturing process as a whole? I understand that its supposed to take effort in order to create tech 2 ships and components. But at times I feel that it is a more time consuming effort then what it should be. I must admit that I can't give any examples on how I would change it, without risking making it to simple. |

Fiat Money
Perkone Caldari State
2
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:14:00 -
[310] - Quote
Linda Shadowborn wrote:Fiat Money wrote:So one semi-passive income is just replaced by another one and tech moons will keep in norther hands.
What's the deal?
Again I'm surprised why CCP hasn't chosen the most obvious solution. Wasn't CCP looking for more active income such as mining? Imo planetary ring mining and a new moon resource redistribution would be a much more appropriate solution. *facepalms* they are. this is just the first step as they do
Planetary ring was introduced during the last EVE fanfest, but CCP never mentioned a resource redistribution in the past and i frankly doubt this approach will come into consideration in the future. |
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Terrorfrodo
Deep Space Darwinian Law Enforcement Agency
102
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:14:00 -
[311] - Quote
Rivver wrote:
So you want people to take your stuff? Is that what you are saying?
I'm not in an alliance... but I'd say the same if I were, so basically yes. The Invulnerability Sphere:Make mining/industrial vessels defendable, better fights for everyone! |

Lord Zim
1045
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:14:00 -
[312] - Quote
Oh god, now I definitely need to run and buy popcorn, this is getting positively awful. :bunchies: |

Grath Telkin
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
849
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:18:00 -
[313] - Quote
MeBiatch wrote:Grath Telkin wrote:MeBiatch wrote:
yes my style of pros is horrible... but still that should not detract from the point that cfc has turned into what they fought to kill all those years ago... its like how luke lashed out at darth and then ended up turing to the dark side in episode 7.
Yea, how exactly are they like BOB, please enumerate the likenesses, spelling errors will of course be ignored in your 'special case'. We'll wait right here while you get them together. oh thank you grath... i do apprichiate looking over my lack of using spell check... :) well back in the day bob said to goons this is our game and goons were like we are fun loving guys so we dont like how you are all about leet pvp so well rifter gang bang you to death... but then something changed when goons gost disbanded and all the good leaders went to ccp... they became what they hated... the new bob... they are the richest peeps who are not telling people litterally this is thier game and we all have to just accept that... well i do hope that now the tech bro love fest will die and that will mean that goons can go back to thier roots and become just as terrible as they once were... and when most of eve lubed them for it... I mean if RA can s[lit how many times and they eneded up in a death match... could we not eventually see goons fight test? though for PL you guys never change even when you were merc alliance all those years ago... your still sucling on the richest persons bosums... so kol ha kavod to you for staying true to your morals...
So to clear this post up, I asked you to describe how Goons have become like BoB and your answer is "Because they got disbanded"....
How am I not supposed to call you dumb?
|

TheGunslinger42
Bite Me inc Exhale.
163
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:19:00 -
[314] - Quote
Rer Eirikr wrote:TheGunslinger42 wrote:Clearly the solution is to add moon goo into wormhole space. There's hundreds of completely empty wormholes just waiting to poop out tech. Combine that with NOT listening to the terrible ideas about "stabilisers" and whatnot and you'd actually have some interesting mechanics imo. Yea that and your request for Ice belts not 3 pages ago too right? 
Yup. Though I didn't mean as static ice belts, but just throw the occasional lump of it into the grav sites or whatever that pop up. Do that everywhere though, not just wormholes. |

Lord Zim
1045
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:21:00 -
[315] - Quote
I guess this is when we start talking about removing ice from hisec? |

EvilweaselSA
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
183
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:23:00 -
[316] - Quote
MeBiatch wrote:Lord Zim wrote:Are you really so angry you can't even spell properly? spelling is overrated... you got the just of it... its not just your inability to spell that makes your word salad incomprehensible |

RavenTesio
Liandri Corporation
46
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:25:00 -
[317] - Quote
Except that's not alliance income. That's member income that the alliance chooses to take from the members and redistribute. By "alliance income" I mean income that doesn't come from one player grinding NPCs or grinding rocks or whatnot, but from the whole alliance working together to hold a strategic objective.
If moon mining was removed with no replacement alliance level income (I'm not saying that it neccessarily will, but so far I haven't seen CCP even suggest otherwise), you would basically have two options on how to run an alliance. Either it's everyone for themselves, where in order to fight you have to grind personal income for hours first - or the alliance starts imposing ratting taxes, mining taxes, refining taxes, market taxes, to the point where a big part of membership is simply exploited for all they've got in order to afford the "military" to have ships to fight in.[/quote]
And I would say welcome to life OUTSIDE of Null-Sec. It isn't less difficult to earn billions each week in High-Sec or Low-Sec, but honestly you do have to take a more "every man for himself approach" because running POS are far more expensive ... in-fact ot the point where only the most valueable moon materials are even worth doing, let along the pain of trying to keep towers safe or even bloodty finding an empty moon that isn't useless.
On the whole this outlines the main problem with the Industrial aspect of EVE. That not only the further down the Sec Status you go, do the materials you can aquire become far more valuable in larger quantity but on top of that you also get bonus' to the running costs via direct means (i.e. Less Starbase Fuel use)
This frankly is just bulls**t, as if God himself came along and neatly ordered the universe proclaiming "Risk vs Reward" ... which is kinda crap in-of-itself because Null-Sec is often a far safer place to be than Low-Sec. I would also point out that Technium isn't broken, giving means to "suppliment" it will not help regardless what I've seen from many other players posts. All that will do is jigger around what becomes Moon Flavour of the Month to capture, hold and do nothing with to force up market prices in an agreement with many other Alliances to maintain your own stranglehold on the market with what in the real-world is the highly illegal act of INSIDER TRADING.
As it stands Null-Sec is just frankly inbalanced Resource-wise. The resources being tied to a specific aspect of the game is also kinda stupid on the whole... The reason why it is how it is makes sense, because systems have been added to the game without any major changes to other systems. I mean Moon Mining was introduced because of Tech 2 Production, as Planetry Interaction being added more specifically for DUST purposes (which haven't been fully realised yet).
Still it would make sense if rather than a bandaid solution (i.e. Alchemy) to a system that is broken, the better solution is to focus on redesigning Industry as a whole - so that Planet, Moon and Belt / Cloud Mining all result in Materials that are Refined to the same Common Elements, how many of those materials depends entirely upon the mining being done.
Still I will save that for another post, as it is a very comprehensive subject that would require some fairly dramatic changes that many players (particularly Alliances) might actually be quite against at first as it forces them to rethink their industry as a whole.
For now what I will do is make a counter solution to the "Alchemy" suggestion. Moon Interaction
As it stands one of the biggest issues with Moon Mining really stems from how Starbases are used.. for the most part with Technium for example, there are only say 10% of the Starbases around Moons that are actively mining. The rest are setup as Large Tower "Deathstars" designed to stop anyone else from accessing the resources there; in-fact if it wasn't for dotlan evemaps, the majority of us here would never even know what resources are on a given Moon.
To me the best solution would be to introduce Planetry Interaction Mechanics to Moons, with the current Raw Resource; becoming a Teir 3 Material. It would greatly reduce the materials an individual would be able to recover from any given Moon, forcing groups who want to have the same output as they currently have to work together as a group to achieve that.
This would of course make the Moon Mining Array obsolete, but this could be replace (temporarily until Starbases are redesigned) as a Customs Office with similar Fitting / Anchouring Requirements.
I mean to me two issues are really Moon Mining is not a group activity ... a single person can anchour, setup and maintain these. In-fact with no limitations on the number of Starbases someone can Anchour down past the whole "Can we Protect this?" - which let's be honest in Null-Sec or High-Sec often isn't even a question you need to ask.
Push for these to be group activities, they should require players to work together to achieve. It would also make sense if Moon Interaction was possible with Planetry Interaction skills, but the addition on specialised Moon Skills to help extend the number of Moons you can place Facilities on.
Seriously, think about it. This will make the most sense in the long-run. |

EvilweaselSA
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
183
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:25:00 -
[318] - Quote
i must say, i will miss when I could tell people that I controlled more money in my space job than I earned in my real job (even at reduced "buy video card and sell" rates instead of plex rates)
we were up to ~$180k per year |

MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
473
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:28:00 -
[319] - Quote
Grath Telkin wrote: So to clear this post up, I asked you to describe how Goons have become like BoB and your answer is "Because they got disbanded"....
How am I not supposed to call you dumb?
well when one suffers from selective reading its rather hard to come to anyother conclusion...
PLEX FOR PIZZA! -áThere are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... |

Lightmans
Building Empries
0
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:29:00 -
[320] - Quote
i like the idea and good luck ccp Foozie!!!
in the past i tried the t2 production but the rare mineral prices are to high on the market and its not worth to produce and learn the skills.
but now i like it!!! |
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MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
473
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:29:00 -
[321] - Quote
EvilweaselSA wrote:MeBiatch wrote:Lord Zim wrote:Are you really so angry you can't even spell properly? spelling is overrated... you got the just of it... its not just your inability to spell that makes your word salad incomprehensible
yes i agree its hard to read when your eyes are filled with tears of rage...
would you like my used tissue?
PLEX FOR PIZZA! -áThere are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... |

Grath Telkin
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
851
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:31:00 -
[322] - Quote
MeBiatch wrote:Grath Telkin wrote: So to clear this post up, I asked you to describe how Goons have become like BoB and your answer is "Because they got disbanded"....
How am I not supposed to call you dumb?
well when one suffers from selective reading its rather hard to come to anyother conclusion...
Ok feel free to point out all the reasons you detailed in the post i quoted about why goons are like BoB, I mean, maybe i didn't see all the reasons you listed out, OR, maybe you really didn't list any reasons at all why they're like bob and you're actually just sperging tard
|

Tako Satou
Muppet Fuggers
0
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:33:00 -
[323] - Quote
so glad i tried to read this goonwad circle jerk.
kindly let go of the ***** belonging to the man next to you and hit f1 again! your coalition needs you! |

EvilweaselSA
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
187
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:35:00 -
[324] - Quote
MeBiatch wrote: yes i agree its hard to read when your eyes are filled with tears of rage...
would you like my used tissue?
you're not really very good at posting, it's not really worth getting a read-only trading barbs with you because i'll just get boring crap like this that's not even good at being insulting
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Marcus Loon Black
V.O.I.D.
0
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:36:00 -
[325] - Quote
Quote:There are more problems with our current system of moon mining and tech two production than just the price of Technetium, which is why we now have a comprehensive plan to address these issues over multiple releases.
Glad to hear that this issue has been thought over. Look forward to see what the changes entail over time.
Kicking Technetium in the balls is a good start .. and interested to see how this plays out 
|

MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
473
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:36:00 -
[326] - Quote
Grath Telkin wrote:MeBiatch wrote:Grath Telkin wrote: So to clear this post up, I asked you to describe how Goons have become like BoB and your answer is "Because they got disbanded"....
How am I not supposed to call you dumb?
well when one suffers from selective reading its rather hard to come to anyother conclusion... Ok feel free to point out all the reasons you detailed in the post i quoted about why goons are like BoB, I mean, maybe i didn't see all the reasons you listed out, OR, maybe you really didn't list any reasons at all why they're like bob and you're actually just sperging tard
you grath perhaps i should not have turned down your offer of man love... you seem to be a rather strict but sensual lover...
PLEX FOR PIZZA! -áThere are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... |

Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
1438
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:37:00 -
[327] - Quote
I knew this thread was going to be bad but I didn't know it was going to be this bad. |

MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
473
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:38:00 -
[328] - Quote
EvilweaselSA wrote:MeBiatch wrote: yes i agree its hard to read when your eyes are filled with tears of rage...
would you like my used tissue?
you're not really very good at posting, it's not really worth getting a read-only trading barbs with you because i'll just get boring crap like this that's not even good at being insulting
its true i am terrible at this...
i feel that i have to go to a temple and study as a monk like bat man... i mean i am sure bat man can take on goons right? PLEX FOR PIZZA! -áThere are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... |

Grath Telkin
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
852
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:38:00 -
[329] - Quote
MeBiatch wrote:
you grath perhaps i should not have turned down your offer of man love... you seem to be a rather strict but sensual lover...
So this is your way of admitting you're an idiot and can't come up with any real ways that Goons have turned into BoB then?
I'll take it, since you're barely literate as it is and we dont need to push you into doing something drastic. |

Nomistrav
High Flyers RED.OverLord
68
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:40:00 -
[330] - Quote
Hey, I've got this awesome idea on how we can fix the moon goo problem since it's been festering for years now.
Instead of just randomizing moon materials - let's come up with a really complex system that will **** up the market prices even more. That way, if a certain tech material is in demand, you don't necessarily need it but you can use some other material - which will also sky rocket in price when an alliance owns the space in which it's produced.
Seriously, out of all the solutions CCP keeps throwing out, I'm starting to wonder how much of these are actually designed for the community as a whole and not just CCP throwing hail mary's wondering why the hell the community is so pissed off after not reading a hundred other suggestions provided by said community.
Do right by your players and stop coming up with completely different ideas when solutions are already being suggested. ****. |
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