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New Dev Blog - Learning skills are going away

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 24 post(s)
Ebisu Kami	Posted - 2010.12.11 15:33:00 - [1951] Originally by: YAMANTAKA few days left but one final question now that i understand finally what will happen. for example : i have in inteligence attribute 22 points that means 8 basic + 8 from learning skills + 5 from implant = 22 the question is after 14th dec will i have 22 + 12 points ? or 8 basic -8 from learning skills + 5 from implants +12 gift = 25 ? sorry if it answered but i miss it thank you 8 basic? That can't be right. Currently, the formula is: (3 basic + learning skills for that attribute + implant + freely remapable points)(1+0,05Learning Skill Level) After the change on 14th the formula will be: 15 basic + implant + freely remapable points
Quan Yu Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2010.12.11 15:46:00 - [1952] Originally by: Ebisu Kami Originally by: YAMANTAKA few days left but one final question now that i understand finally what will happen. for example : i have in inteligence attribute 22 points that means 8 basic + 8 from learning skills + 5 from implant = 22 the question is after 14th dec will i have 22 + 12 points ? or 8 basic -8 from learning skills + 5 from implants +12 gift = 25 ? sorry if it answered but i miss it thank you slighty wrong info You have currently: 22 ~ ( 5 basic + 3 remappable points + 8 learning skills + 5 implant )(1+0.05learning skill level) after the 14th you will have 17 base + 3 remappable points + 5 implant = 25
Ebisu Kami	Posted - 2010.12.11 16:46:00 - [1953] Edited by: Ebisu Kami on 11/12/2010 16:45:50 Originally by: Quan Yu You have currently: 22 ~ ( 5 basic + 3 remappable points + 8 learning skills + 5 implant )(1+0.05learning skill level) after the 14th you will have 17 base + 3 remappable points + 5 implant = 25 Whoops, thanks for correcting. Confused 5 and 3.
Darial Gallente Muffin Munchers	Posted - 2010.12.11 17:54:00 - [1954] I guess I owe CCP some beers
Ibhin Fharteen	Posted - 2010.12.11 19:09:00 - [1955] Originally by: Corbeau Lenoir CCP, why are you doing this? Firstly you removed attribute diversity for bloodlines, now learning skills. Do you realize, that they added depth to the game? Now everybody will be the same? What' the point? This game is getting too casual... Agreed... Seems like many are unwilling to put some time into learning a game. IMHO, 2 weeks or so is not unreasonable to get to know and understand a game of EVE's complexity and depth. As a newb I would rather see the addition of StarTrek like ground missions or for that matter more and varied missions would be nice. But people who need instant gratification seem to win out on the whining game. And so why then should we have to mine? Or grind?
Cornwalace	Posted - 2010.12.11 20:00:00 - [1956] If we purchase the Commissioned Officer Edition from a store, do we still have access to the Cerebral Accelerator, since it's an implant anyway? I would like to confirm.
Carulis	Posted - 2010.12.11 20:48:00 - [1957] Hmm not read all th post here, but it was nice to get the additional Attributes on sisi, however if you do a neural remap afterwards you will lose two attribute points
Aldera Discordus	Posted - 2010.12.12 11:52:00 - [1958] Originally by: Saul Dhampir Joy. What next? Removing the crafting system and replacing it with a nice simple buy from NPC vendor one? If I wanted a simple console game I'd go buy a console. Way to go SOE. Um....there is no crafting in EVE......If you want crafting, GO PLAY WOW!!!!!
Otto Toten Minmatar The Real OC Intergalactic Exports Group	Posted - 2010.12.12 16:17:00 - [1959] Great.
Rip Minner Gallente ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries	Posted - 2010.12.13 03:52:00 - [1960] Edited by: Rip Minner on 13/12/2010 03:55:40 Originally by: Aldera Discordus Originally by: Saul Dhampir Joy. What next? Removing the crafting system and replacing it with a nice simple buy from NPC vendor one? If I wanted a simple console game I'd go buy a console. Way to go SOE. Um....there is no crafting in EVE......If you want crafting, GO PLAY WOW!!!!! If you like crafting you would be better off in Istaria. Edit: But he is right we dont Craft here we Manufacture here. Is it a rock? Point a Lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship? Point a Lazer at it and profit. I dont realy see any differnces here.
Blackjack EvE	Posted - 2010.12.13 12:17:00 - [1961] Thank you for the new update. It seems X-mass comes early in the EvE Universe. To all the hate posts try to think of a change in the game as a whole, the mens to and end, as long as it affects everyone you basically have nothing to gain or lose in the long run. Anyway cya in the New Year EVE.
highlateralg	Posted - 2010.12.14 07:01:00 - [1962] CCP, Dont really comprehend removing something that actually fits into the whole sp thing. Having to make compromises to skill training is part of the depth of Eve. Not any different than the myriad of skill choices to improve ability in game.Removing them is short term gain for long term loss, if it attracts new players by making things even then your chippin away part of what makes eve a long term attraction. There are more games than any of us can count that wont keep your interest for a week much less a few years!
Jonah Sands	Posted - 2010.12.14 13:02:00 - [1963] Originally by: Einear Lightfingers WOW! Way to screw the pooch. Anyone remember Star Wars Galaxies when they converted all the potential characters had to 8 simple templates? This is the same idea. Dumb the game down to keep the noob kid base happy at the expense of the players who worked to understand the game. Like a lot of people I spent the 3 months training those extra skills to 5 to have the advantage over my pirate friends who spent the time grinding weapon skills and ****d me every time I stepped in the wrong system. Now those same people want the same advantage of the person who spent the time to train it and still keep their pew pew. Thank you CCP for becoming more like Star Wars Galaxies daily. First with the patch for more broken crap and now with taking one of the better parts of the games ability to create individuals away so PVPer can have their guns and all the skills they want to. I'll wait until next year see how this all works out, but this will more than likely be the end of my 4 year run in EVE. Can I have yer stuff?
Eradiani Imperial Academy	Posted - 2010.12.14 15:17:00 - [1964] as the dev blog pointed out, the max learning skill people were 2.3 points on average. I am one of the people who will be training slower come this patch. Sure I get 4.5 million skill points to distribute, but I will be training 40-50 sp per hour slower. really wished they would have went with 13 un-allocatable skill points
devonii	Posted - 2010.12.14 20:01:00 - [1965] CCP, IF you are reading this, can you please explain why you have completely ignored the very valid requests of people who have trained all skills to 5??? We're now aware that you aren't changing ANYTHING because of the complaints. You could have done several things to address this and apparently have chosen none of them. An explanation would at least be nice...by CCP...not Ebisu or any of the blog lurkers on here who are ardent defenders and probably do NOT have skills trained all trained to 5. Would like to at least have ONE reply from CCP to those who have raised valid points. Thanks, A paid subscriber of multiple accounts...
Ebisu Kami	Posted - 2010.12.14 20:53:00 - [1966] Originally by: devonii CCP, IF you are reading this, can you please explain why you have completely ignored the very valid requests of people who have trained all skills to 5??? We're now aware that you aren't changing ANYTHING because of the complaints. You could have done several things to address this and apparently have chosen none of them. An explanation would at least be nice...by CCP...not Ebisu or any of the blog lurkers on here who are ardent defenders and probably do NOT have skills trained all trained to 5. Baseless assumption, as said several times before. Also, it's in part a rebalance. We benefitted from our 5/5s and now are going on at a slightly reduced rate. Not much different to nerfing the FOTM.
Bubba Zennedi Gallente	Posted - 2010.12.15 04:13:00 - [1967] Originally by: Vito Parabellum Not that fair at all, we olduns that sacrificed months to get maximized learning will lose on this deal because we did not have +12 when we started (means xp lost, compared to new newbies). So this evens the field and our sacrifice (fun,time,xp,money) is nullified. Also the cost of the learningbooks is being dismissed because "we had some use from them?". If we had had +12 from the start we wouldnt have needed them at all. But surprised I'm not, must get moaar playerbase (money)! This guy makes a good point and I wonder how much old heads will have suffered by losing out exponentially, since now everyone new gets to have the equivalent of all learnings at level 5. Wonder what the real math is. I mean who trained all their learnings to 5 at the opening day? I think there should be some sort of extra bonus for trained learnings, not just the exact returned sp's and maxed base attributes. Also, how is the long term thinking player being rewarded for that early game sacrifice to train learnings rather than more interesting skills?
Jannx	Posted - 2010.12.15 10:34:00 - [1968] Ah, woe is me... The original announcement sadly passed me by a month ago which meant, reading CCP Greyscale's (yes, most excellent) blog this morning came as a it of a shock... ...mainly because I was one skill level away from a complete set of all 11 level 5 learning skills, which I would have accomplished on Boxing Day. Scream? The milk was curdled inside the cows 2 miles away. OK, we're getting reimbursed and it should all even out and the majority of longer players (which doesn't include me. I merely returned after finding other games pretty brainless) should benefit and all of the other stuff that's been said in the last sixty-odd pages, but what happens to the actual time invested and the sense of achievement that comes with dedicating your alt to the learning process? I know, so what? I can plug all those points into ships, guns, mining, whatever, and I'll have a much better alt than when I started (as will everybody else). But, what if I wanted to have a smarter character to play? Is the only way to become better, academically speaking, by neural remaps and cyber technology? Is there now no room for the "Big Brain" unless it's fully pimped out? I may have missed something, but I hope that this has been thought of. I understand the need to revamp the learning system (I think...) but, surely, there is room to have some sort of academic skill tree that can be taken up? After all, we don't want all capsuleers to end up exactly the same, and IRL the academics tend to write the text books from which the rest of us learn. Anyway, that's just me and my way of thinking. Hope it all works out. I will certainly be busy trying to figure out what to spend all those skill points on and, in a week, would probably have forgotten all about it. Boxing Day will be just a little bit sadder, though.
JcJet Caldari Pretenders Inc Tower of Dark Alliance	Posted - 2010.12.15 12:40:00 - [1969] Well, it's not just unfair if someone just get something for free, while others was train for monts. Think about how is it to train with bad learnings for some years and then this...:) so train it or not, it's sucks. But it's so cheap, who cares, older players will still have their advantage in SP, at least until next **** up from ccp. There is an issue with game philosophy - there is should be some difference, but i've wrote that many times. Who cares, it's buisness, no need to worry about quality of community, if we have quantity. Because all players pays a same subscription fee... ---
Viscar Ra'Torr	Posted - 2010.12.15 14:24:00 - [1970] "This is silly", "clearly hella awesome" and very entertaining. As for the changes....those are cool too :)
Malcanis Caldari Vanishing Point. The Initiative.	Posted - 2010.12.15 16:02:00 - [1971] Originally by: Eradiani Sure I get 4.5 million skill points to distribute, but I will be training 40-50 sp per hour slower. With that 4.5M SP, that means you'll have more SP than you otherwise would for 3,750 days, just over 10 years. How long do you intend to keep skill that particular character for? You'll have accumulated another 234,000,000 SP by then. Will you really care about training 50 SP/hr slower or quick when you have around 300 million SP? Really? Malcanis' Law: Whenever a mechanics change is proposed on behalf of "new players", that change is always to the overwhelming advantage of richer, older players.
Bluemorphium Republic-Commando	Posted - 2010.12.15 16:56:00 - [1972] Is there a date, that when i dont spent the SP on any skills, the SP get delete? Or they available, until i spent them to skills? (in 1 or 2 years maybe?)
Destination SkillQueue Are We There Yet	Posted - 2010.12.15 17:01:00 - [1973] Originally by: Bluemorphium Is there a date, that when i dont spent the SP on any skills, the SP get delete? Or they available, until i spent them to skills? (in 1 or 2 years maybe?) There is no time limit on them.
Bluemorphium Republic-Commando	Posted - 2010.12.15 17:23:00 - [1974] Originally by: Destination SkillQueue Originally by: Bluemorphium Is there a date, that when i dont spent the SP on any skills, the SP get delete? Or they available, until i spent them to skills? (in 1 or 2 years maybe?) There is no time limit on them. From who you know that? Source?
JeanClaude Solange	Posted - 2010.12.15 19:06:00 - [1975] To the complainers, I think it's great that they're getting rid of learning skills. The whole learning system takes way to long, in my opinion. Keep in mind people, this is a game, this isn't a career. You can't just have players with 4+ years of training and experience running around blowing up newbies. There's plenty to do in EVE to keep people occupied and subscribed, but if all I'm doing is looking at a skill queue and wondering when I'm finally going to be able to fly that next ship...please. CCP benefits greatly from the fact that there are no real other space-based MMOs. If there were, I think we'd have faster training, to keep people's interest.
Ebisu Kami	Posted - 2010.12.15 19:24:00 - [1976] Edited by: Ebisu Kami on 15/12/2010 19:26:13 Originally by: Bluemorphium Originally by: Destination SkillQueue Originally by: Bluemorphium Is there a date, that when i dont spent the SP on any skills, the SP get delete? Or they available, until i spent them to skills? (in 1 or 2 years maybe?) There is no time limit on them. From who you know that? Source? Experience. There has been a reimbursement already some time ago, when the server was out for an unexpected long time. Those points are still there since then. Same will hold true for this reimbursement. ;)
Mara Abraham Minmatar	Posted - 2010.12.15 19:40:00 - [1977] Greetings: Are we not supposed to get extra attribute points we can do with as we please? If not, then we did not get a fair exchange. Right now, it looks like CCP dumped the extra attributes where they wanted them, not where I would put them as a paying customer. Thank you.
Elrinarie Gallente Wraith.Wing Wildly Inappropriate.	Posted - 2010.12.15 20:01:00 - [1978] Edited by: Elrinarie on 15/12/2010 20:01:52 Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Eradiani Sure I get 4.5 million skill points to distribute, but I will be training 40-50 sp per hour slower. With that 4.5M SP, that means you'll have more SP than you otherwise would for 3,750 days, just over 10 years. How long do you intend to keep skill that particular character for? You'll have accumulated another 234,000,000 SP by then. Will you really care about training 50 SP/hr slower or quick when you have around 300 million SP? Really? I think the point is they are getting penalized for being patient when the impatient people are getting a bonus how is that right? --------------------- Creator of another Mining Calculator
Ebisu Kami	Posted - 2010.12.15 20:20:00 - [1979] Edited by: Ebisu Kami on 15/12/2010 20:22:15 Originally by: Mara Abraham Greetings: Are we not supposed to get extra attribute points we can do with as we please? If not, then we did not get a fair exchange. Right now, it looks like CCP dumped the extra attributes where they wanted them, not where I would put them as a paying customer. Thank you. The allocation of the free attribute points did not change. Learning skills were reimbursed and removed and everyone got a flat +12 to each base attribute value, so no, no extra freely distributable points.
Yodayar Caldari Knights of Apathy	Posted - 2010.12.15 21:01:00 - [1980] Originally by: Elrinarie Edited by: Elrinarie on 15/12/2010 20:01:52 Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Eradiani Sure I get 4.5 million skill points to distribute, but I will be training 40-50 sp per hour slower. With that 4.5M SP, that means you'll have more SP than you otherwise would for 3,750 days, just over 10 years. How long do you intend to keep skill that particular character for? You'll have accumulated another 234,000,000 SP by then. Will you really care about training 50 SP/hr slower or quick when you have around 300 million SP? Really? I think the point is they are getting penalized for being patient when the impatient people are getting a bonus how is that right? What CCP Needs to do is to add 1 more attribute point to each base, this would make up for the loss of SP/hour. I was getting 2674/hr now I'm getting 2610, for a loss of 64 sp/hr, if CCP added 1 more attribute point to each base I would get 2700 SP/hr giving me a slight increase of 26 sp/hr. As I only have +4 implants in someone with +5 implants would feel this effect even more as they would lose an additional 6 sp/hr for a total loss of 70 sp/hr (with perfect skills and +5 implants).

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