Nice job just pulling things out of your ass and assuming things.

Fighting outnumbered isn't easy, without OGBs it will be damn near impossible.

And I don't care about my ego at all, I don't know where you are getting these random accusations. And I never brag to anybody about how l33t I am or how awesome I am at PvP. I don't like it if somebody doesn't post on their main, but that is nothing like that.


If you can't come up with a logical argument and instead resort to making things up and insulting then I can't take you seriously.

The truth hurts, doesn't it?

What else could I get from the fact that you feel entitled to winning many vs one fights? Winning a many-person-vs-one fight is damn near impossible because you're fighting multiple other people who are very likely competent in PVP. Without boosters you could simply look for fights that are less "Nigh impossible", but no...you specifically want to go into fights where it's you against 2-3+ others and win. Why is that?

Moreover, why don't you just fly more expensive ships? Instead of trying to fight outnumbered against ships of your own class (which is folly unless you outplay the hell out of your opponents), why don't you just fly something shinier or bigger...Fly a rupture into a small gang of t1 frigates? Send a Hurricane against a couple cruisers.

There is only one reason why the above isn't acceptable to you. Your opponents would actually get to see your advantage. The killboard would show your advantage.

Moreover, you only need one boosting character for a fleet of virtually any size. It's dumb to say that OGBs are a boost to small gangs when it's far easier for a blob to have boosts.

Moreover, you only need one boosting character for a fleet of virtually any size. It's dumb to say that OGBs are a boost to small gangs when it's far easier for a blob to have boosts.

Moreover, why don't you just fly more expensive ships? Instead of trying to fight outnumbered against ships of your own class (which is folly unless you outplay the hell out of your opponents), why don't you just fly something shinier or bigger...Fly a rupture into a small gang of t1 frigates? Send a Hurricane against a couple cruisers.

Why do I like to fight more people? It's not because "I like to pad my KB" and "brag about being l33t to my friends", its because It is fun.

I like the rush of adrenaline I get when I play that way. Why don't I just faction fit everything? Because I can't afford to PLEX everytime I make a mistake and die, and I don't have enough RL time to grind level4s all day.

Having ganglinks gives your small gang more of a margin between being overwhelmed and holding a strategic position, even with both sides running links it still gives you a broader field to play in. It won't make up for lack of skill or negate the advantage of having a bigger, better gunned fleet, but it does give a smaller fleet, especially one pushing their skillset to the limits, more of a chance of making a good account of themselves against a bigger foe.

This is the typical behaviour of the OGB user in lowsec areas. Pretend to be prey, then proceed to demolish the unfortunate dudes who couldn't have possibly known that he's tanking about twice as much as he should while moving 50% faster.

This is the typical behaviour of the OGB user in lowsec areas. Pretend to be prey, then proceed to demolish the unfortunate dudes who couldn't have possibly known that he's tanking about twice as much as he should while moving 50% faster.

Maybe thats how it works in RvB joke pvp.

Even if it were true.

You pay $15 extra per month or ~500 million ISK, as well as the cost of the booster hull, to have that OGB alt. From a cost perspective that's no advantage. The only advantage to a booster alt is that while a more expensive ship or expensive fittings would show your advantage, whereas having an OGB does not.

Example? How does everyone on the field having 30% more shield HP, or more velocity, or longer point range, tip the scales in favor of a small gang?

Do you even PvP dude? If I faction fit every ship I flew, then when I jump into a 0.0 camp and just get blobbed with no hope of survival... I'd be grinding level4s 90% of the time while trying to pvp 10% of the time.

That is very anti-fun.

Because if OGBs are removed and the small gang doesn't have the extra 30% everything, they will just get raped.

Example? How does everyone on the field having 30% more shield HP, or more velocity, or longer point range, tip the scales in favor of a small gang?

No you haven't. I looked at your killboard and the links you provided. I notice very few kills outside of ammamake. Afraid to leave the alt boosters behind?

Very nice kills against eve university BTW. Whats that again? Oh yeah, thats the alliance where people who are new to eve can learn basic mechanics isn't it?

Again I am not saying I am the best at pvp. However, there is nothing in either of our killboards that would suggest you somehow outclass me in pvp. So your claim that I am just doing it wrong is going to fly unless you get more specific.

And no I didn't ship up for the fights I have had against boosted frigates. I just jump in the plex in whatever ship I happen to be in at the time. I actually go roaming system to system since I don't rely on alt boosters in a pos to be an iwin button.

So it's about ego. You want to be able to talk about how you fight outnumbered and win, and then brag to all your friends about it what an elite PVPer you are.

Fighting outnumbered is supposed to be hard. "I can't fight outnumbered and win" isn't a balance argument.

It gives you a bigger margin to play with - even when both sides are using it - which gives more room for mistakes to be made, more room for manouverability, etc. i.e. if your both pointing to 50km instead of 25km that means you can sit well outside the close range high damage turret ships and instead of getting instantly melted you can probe for weaknesses and try to pick stuff off, etc.

Moreover, you only need one boosting character for a fleet of virtually any size. It's dumb to say that OGBs are a boost to small gangs when it's far easier for a blob to have boosts.

Very few people use ganglinks to get an even bigger advantage over weaker prey anyhow, not to say no one does it, but most people use ganglinks to compliment their fleet capabilities or to give them a chance against harder foes.

You seem to be talking about the relative benefits of Loki speed/point range boosts when the small gang consists of nanoships and the blob consists of slow, close-range ships. The advantage to the small gang in your example comes from the fact that ships that take full advantage out of kiting close range high damage ships and pointing from far away happen to benefit most from a certain type of boost.

Now imagine the same situation except everyone has Tengu boosts. The nanogang still goes down fast if they get tackled or become trackable, and the 30% extra shield HP doesn't change that...But any individual ships that get separated from the group take longer to kill, and they have more time to fill weak points. In the same situation, Tengu boosts would advantage the blob far more than the small gang.

I'm talking about one example of many possible ones and it doesn't always work out in your favor, but in the position of smaller fleet V blob you'd be making use of the links that gave you the most chances to control range and get out if your overwhelmed.

This is you not understanding gang bonus mechanics.

-Liang

I'm talking about one example of many possible ones and it doesn't always work out in your favor, but in the position of smaller fleet V blob you'd be making use of the links that gave you the most chances to control range and get out if your overwhelmed.

[quote=Kahega Amielden]

How so? Set one person as the fleet booster and put the right people in the squad/wing/fleet command positions and everyone gets boosts. Where is this incorrect?

And with Loki boosts the larger gang has a better chance of running you down and stopping you from getting away. I fail to see the advantage.

Boosts from squad 1 don't go to squad 2. You need boosts for all the squads and all the wings.

And this leads back to what I've been saying: ships that are capable of providing links do not adequately fit into the gangs that really need them. There are some core problems with simply bringing links on the field that must be solved first.

And with Loki boosts the larger gang has a better chance of running you down and stopping you from getting away. I fail to see the advantage.

Not arguing that point - merely that off grid boosts are bullshit.

Bullshit or not, in the immediate future the game would be worse without off grid boosts. So let's see if we can come up with a list of problems that should be solved first. I guess I can't count on you for any sort of reasonableness on this subject though.

The game as it stands would be better without boosts at all...And if certain command ships were underpowered to the point that they weren't used, it would still be an improvement over the current situation. The only reason why I would call for a rebalance first rather than just nerfing them into the ground until they can be fixed is that it would be unfair to the people who currently have SP in leadership and dumped ISK into CS/boosting t3s.

The game as it stands would be better without boosts at all...And if certain command ships were underpowered to the point that they weren't used, it would still be an improvement over the current situation. The only reason why I would call for a rebalance first rather than just nerfing them into the ground until they can be fixed is that it would be unfair to the people who currently have SP in leadership and dumped ISK into CS/boosting t3s.

Yeah, but they aren't talking about removing boosts in general. Only Off grid boosters. And if this is the way that it is going to be then small gangs will have nothing to answer for a larger force who happens to also have a command ship on field.

But I guess your solution of "faction fit everything" could solve that.

I think your playing the wrong game... otherwise you'd better start calling to nerfs to implants, cynos, cloaking devices, etc. to.

The game as it stands would be better without boosts at all...And if certain command ships were underpowered to the point that they weren't used, it would still be an improvement over the current situation. The only reason why I would call for a rebalance first rather than just nerfing them into the ground until they can be fixed is that it would be unfair to the people who currently have SP in leadership and dumped ISK into CS/boosting t3s.