That said, two +5s only cost ~160mil, and that surely isn't a lot of ISK for any older player to replace on a regular basis, if you are obsessed about training times.

Show me where I said anything even remotely resembling this. You can't, because I didn't. My argument is that removing learning implants removes the risk of losing learning implants. It does, unequivocally. There's no debating that point. What is in debate is whether or not that risk should be removed from the game, and I'm doubting that you've provided a compelling argument for why they should.

No, there's no need to ditch learning implants.

Learning Skills were removed because they were skills that provided no in-game advantage, just a metagame advantage. They also discouraged new players from training fun skills because everyone told them to train learning skills.

Learning implants are implants that provide no in-game advantage, just a metagame advantage. They also discourage new players (and heck, plenty of older players*) from trying fun things because everyone tells them to go buy a set of +3s then avoid losing them.
Example


Learning Implants look a lot like Learning Skills and the rationale for removal is the same.


*Ughhh, my Jumpclone timer isn't up and I'm in my +4s, etc.

I am shocked that you seem to be towing the party line, as usual.

That wasn't my question.

People need to stop with ideology that you NEED +5s(or implants in general) in at all times. Flying what you can afford to lose applies to implants as well, if you can't afford +5s then downgrade or don't use them.

Learning Implants look a lot like Learning Skills and the rationale for removal is the same.


*Ughhh, my Jumpclone timer isn't up and I'm in my +4s, etc.

I'm shocked that you keep trying to poison the well of discourse.

No, seriously, it demeans you.

Your question was invalid.

Uggh, I'm in my officer fitted Golem and can't PVP -> remove marauders?

Your rationale is lacking all rationale.

As does your ability to only ever follow party lines. Your involvement in something like this is always guaranteed as are your personal attacks. Your masters say jump and you say "How High, Sir"

Pot, meet kettle.

So, since you're going to persist in accusing me of arguing in bad faith, how about you show the evidence you have to show that I am arguing in bad faith?

So, since you're going to persist in accusing me of arguing in bad faith, how about you show the evidence you have to show that I am arguing in bad faith?

How about you show instances where you have gone against them in issues of their creation?

How about you show instances where you have gone against them in issues of their creation?

It was not an invalid question, and the reason why you want to label it as invalid is because it does impact the newbies more than the old players.

Can you remove mods from your golem without losing them? Can you remove yourself from the golem without losing it? Yes?

Shocking how those two things work differently.

You seem to miss the point - only thing preventing you from PVPing in either is purely your personal issue, nobody forces you to own a 20bil Golem or wear a full set of +5s, and if you can't afford to lose either, the problem is your wallet and not game mechanics.

Learning implants, which provide no in game advantage to a pilot but cost money discourage participation in PvP when you might risk losing your pod (the same way clone costs discourage people from shipping down when they risk losing their pod).

Your Medical Clone is the same thing as a bunch of Implants. Upgrading your med clone costs ISK and gives you SP when you die. Plugging in implants cost ISK and give you SP until you die. Both discourage PvP.

What does? My point was that learning implants don't actually affect anyone, hence no point removing them. If you are obsessed over a few days and worry losing them, it's your problem.

You seem to miss the point - only thing preventing you from PVPing in either is purely your personal issue, nobody forces you to own a 20bil Golem or wear a full set of +5s, and if you can't afford to lose either, the problem is your wallet and not game mechanics.

So does the price of ships or the skills needed to fly them. Should we remove them too?

So does the price of ships or the skills needed to fly them. Should we remove them too?

Upgrading your med clone costs ISK and gives you SP when you die.

Remove supercarriers and titans, yes.

I seem to have missed the patch where upgrading your clone was changed from saving SP when your capsule is destroyed to giving you SP.

Funny I was talking about the price of ships and the skills needed to fly them. Not specific ships.