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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Jafit
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
346
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Posted - 2012.09.04 16:13:00 -
[481] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:Who the hell makes a few billion a week in nullsec? Certainly not me or anyone else I know.
168 hours in a week, -7 for downtime
20m ticks with your Vindicator (random guess) doing Forsaken Hubs without any pause or interruption (food, sleep, hostiles, etc)
You should be able to make 9.66 billion per week
This is how every ~ NULLBEAR~ plays the game.
Now I sure as hell can make 'a few billion per week'... if you trawl highsec and lowsec for gullable fools whom you can trick into giving you everything they own. |
Tau Prime
Blue Republic
RvB - BLUE Republic
8
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Posted - 2012.09.04 19:00:00 -
[482] - Quote
Doesn't this come down to rule number 1?
1. Don't fly what you cant afford to loose.
So if you cant afford to loose +4 skill implants, don't use them.
This whole argument is like proposing that a High Sec player is less likely to loose a 1bil faction fitted ship than someone in null sec is so we should just eliminate the possibility of owning such ships.
And as to this,
(quotes from Mittani)
"Newbies are generally encouraged to buy sets of +3 implants to speed up their skill training. Without a support network of older players, even the paltry cost of such a set is substantial to the new player who is surprised when his wallet reaches nine digits after mining or running missions for weeks on end. This GÇ£expensiveGÇ¥ set of implants contributes to a risk-averse attitude where the new player is afraid of ever leaving the supposed safety of highsec and finds himself leaving the game when this presumption of safety turns out to be untrue. While losses should matter, learning implants are only a superficial loss that ultimately contribute nothing to game play."
I remember training learning skills. I thought it was unique, tiresome but unique and at the time was a pretty cool idea as far as games go. I bought learning implants as I could afford them. I put more thought into what I was doing in game and my strategy because of the inherent danger of EVE and loosing those implants. This greatly improved my time in EVE as there was more risk. I went and earned my first jump clone just because of skill implants. IT WAS AWESOME.
Loosing implants is hardly superficial when you consider the time invested in obtaining them and using them wisely. No different than loosing a ship. A new player is just as risk adverse when they get into a new BC or other shiny and the financial or moral setback can be just as crushing.
"Empire players tend to have a huge advantage in this regard - they can do virtually everything with a full +5s and hardwirings since pods can warp out almost instantly in the event that they lose a ship, and NPCs never shoot pods in any case. Players in nullsec generally find themselves with implants that speed up the skills they may be training at that time and inexpensive hardwirings, simply because losing a pod is nearly inevitable after losing a ship when bubbled."
What a bunch of crap.
You don't want to loose your shinnies so easy? Go live in HighSec. Risk vs Reward.
Quit your bitching and HTFU. |
Pipa Porto
865
|
Posted - 2012.09.04 23:11:00 -
[483] - Quote
Tau Prime wrote:What a bunch of crap. Unnecessary cruft? How about we leave them in because people want them, they are desirable, have value, and effectively make life more interesting in EVE.
How specifically do items that provide no ingame benefit (only a meta game one) make life in the game of EVE more interesting?
EvE: Everyone vs Everyone
-RubyPorto |
Tau Prime
Blue Republic
RvB - BLUE Republic
8
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Posted - 2012.09.04 23:15:00 -
[484] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:Tau Prime wrote:What a bunch of crap. Unnecessary cruft? How about we leave them in because people want them, they are desirable, have value, and effectively make life more interesting in EVE. How specifically do items that provide no ingame benefit (only a meta game one) make life in the game of EVE more interesting?
EVE is a meta game. |
Pipa Porto
865
|
Posted - 2012.09.04 23:20:00 -
[485] - Quote
Tau Prime wrote:Pipa Porto wrote:Tau Prime wrote:What a bunch of crap. Unnecessary cruft? How about we leave them in because people want them, they are desirable, have value, and effectively make life more interesting in EVE. How specifically do items that provide no ingame benefit (only a meta game one) make life in the game of EVE more interesting? EVE is a meta game.
EVE's meta game in that sense is not about SP.
EvE: Everyone vs Everyone
-RubyPorto |
Tau Prime
Blue Republic
RvB - BLUE Republic
9
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Posted - 2012.09.04 23:27:00 -
[486] - Quote
player A takes advantage of skill bonusing using implants
player b does not.
player B meets player A in two years in space and duke it out
Player A may have a slight advantage on player B due to higher skill count in certain areas.
Player A wins due to this. (granted player B could also win but in this scenario this is the case, and not an unlikely one)
Player B wishes he would have thought about this 2 years ago.
Player A likes how many skill points he has, shoots pod, gathers corpse, sells loot.
..
Player A learned the 7 Ps of planning and brought his A game. |
Lord Zim
1270
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Posted - 2012.09.04 23:30:00 -
[487] - Quote
Player A has played for 5 years, and has 100m SP. Player B has played for 3 months, and has 5m SP. Player tackles Player A's megathron with an iteron 5 and proceeds to pop his ship. |
Frying Doom
Zat's Affiliated Traders
742
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Posted - 2012.09.04 23:33:00 -
[488] - Quote
Lord Zim wrote:Player A has played for 5 years, and has 100m SP. Player B has played for 3 months, and has 5m SP. Player tackles Player A's megathron with an iteron 5 and proceeds to pop his ship.
Well done player A for learning so much so fast. Oh and finding a moron in a megathron
Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge.
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Tau Prime
Blue Republic
RvB - BLUE Republic
9
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Posted - 2012.09.04 23:37:00 -
[489] - Quote
Lord Zim wrote:Player A has played for 5 years, and has 100m SP. Player B has played for 3 months, and has 5m SP. Player tackles Player A's megathron with an iteron 5 and proceeds to pop his ship.
Happens. And funny. I was thinking of two players that start at the same time and follow similar training plans. There are times when over the long run using implants to increase your fictional knowledge increases your performance.
I likened it to staying in school when I trained the learning skills and then started buying and investing in implants. |
Theodoric Darkwind
PonyWaffe
Test Alliance Please Ignore
176
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Posted - 2012.09.05 01:50:00 -
[490] - Quote
Learning implants are fine.
Just because I fly around in +3s (since yes you do lose pods in nullsec) instead of +5s like most highseccers doesn't bother me a bit. The tradeoff is I make a ton more isk (and spend more since ships tend to go pop in null), and dont have to travel far for PvP (lately its "press undock, start shooting"). |
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Andski
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
4526
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Posted - 2012.09.05 02:23:00 -
[491] - Quote
Jafit wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:Who the hell makes a few billion a week in nullsec? Certainly not me or anyone else I know. 168 hours in a week, -7 for downtime 20m ticks with your Vindicator (random guess) doing Forsaken Hubs without any pause or interruption (food, sleep, hostiles, etc) You should be able to make 9.66 billion per week
A Vindicator in Forsaken Hubs makes ~40-50m ticks but it requires near-perfect skills and hardwirings (which I conveniently have on an alt, 'heh')
But even though it may be Highly Efficient Ratting it's still ratting~
please leave |
Historical Research Advocate
State War Academy
Caldari State
1
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Posted - 2012.09.05 03:30:00 -
[492] - Quote
Andski wrote:Jafit wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:Who the hell makes a few billion a week in nullsec? Certainly not me or anyone else I know. 168 hours in a week, -7 for downtime 20m ticks with your Vindicator (random guess) doing Forsaken Hubs without any pause or interruption (food, sleep, hostiles, etc) You should be able to make 9.66 billion per week A Vindicator in Forsaken Hubs makes ~40-50m ticks but it requires near-perfect skills and hardwirings (which I conveniently have on an alt, 'heh') But even though it may be Highly Efficient Ratting it's still ratting~
If you stop replying, you cease to exist.
Post on, Little Prince, post on |
Ghazu
100
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Posted - 2012.09.05 03:52:00 -
[493] - Quote
Historical Research Advocate wrote:Andski wrote:Jafit wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:Who the hell makes a few billion a week in nullsec? Certainly not me or anyone else I know. 168 hours in a week, -7 for downtime 20m ticks with your Vindicator (random guess) doing Forsaken Hubs without any pause or interruption (food, sleep, hostiles, etc) You should be able to make 9.66 billion per week A Vindicator in Forsaken Hubs makes ~40-50m ticks but it requires near-perfect skills and hardwirings (which I conveniently have on an alt, 'heh') But even though it may be Highly Efficient Ratting it's still ratting~ If you stop replying, you cease to exist. Post on, Little Prince, post on
Tell me more, day 1 gimmick alt |
Historical Research Advocate
State War Academy
Caldari State
1
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Posted - 2012.09.05 04:01:00 -
[494] - Quote
Ghazu wrote:Historical Research Advocate wrote:Andski wrote:Jafit wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:Who the hell makes a few billion a week in nullsec? Certainly not me or anyone else I know. 168 hours in a week, -7 for downtime 20m ticks with your Vindicator (random guess) doing Forsaken Hubs without any pause or interruption (food, sleep, hostiles, etc) You should be able to make 9.66 billion per week A Vindicator in Forsaken Hubs makes ~40-50m ticks but it requires near-perfect skills and hardwirings (which I conveniently have on an alt, 'heh') But even though it may be Highly Efficient Ratting it's still ratting~ If you stop replying, you cease to exist. Post on, Little Prince, post on Tell me more, day 1 gimmick alt
srsly, if you stop replying, you cease to exist. replying to threads creates an existential angst. reply or not? |
Ghazu
100
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Posted - 2012.09.05 04:10:00 -
[495] - Quote
Historical Research Advocate wrote:
Tell me more, day 1 gimmick alt
srsly, if you stop replying, you cease to exist. replying to threads creates an existential angst. reply or not?[/quote]
And? |
Aruken Marr
BSC LEGION
Tactical Narcotics Team
320
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Posted - 2012.09.05 09:06:00 -
[496] - Quote
Andski wrote:
A Vindicator in Forsaken Hubs makes ~40-50m ticks but it requires near-perfect skills and hardwirings (which I conveniently have on an alt, 'heh')
But even though it may be Highly Efficient Ratting it's still ratting~
I can get ~30m in my Naga, without fighters assigned. It's a bit less but with a 130mil ship theres a lot less stress so I dont mind the hit.
Still, I can only run a few hubs a day (@ ~25-30mil a piece) before I get the urge to choke myself. So yea nullsec isk making is surprisingly unproductive if youre anywhere near sain. |
Dennis Gregs
Dawn of Fire
29
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Posted - 2012.09.05 10:23:00 -
[497] - Quote
Ivy Romanova wrote:well the thing is
CCP is trying to split the gamer population.. giving it a more defined definition.
High sec : Safe zone for the anti-social and timid nerds
Low sec : Low life that gets bullied in school and now is trying to make up for it, and incursion runners too.
Null sec : For the gladiators and intellectuals of the society , trying to make a name for themselves by exploring the riches of the unknown.
So... EVEN if people buys your argument, the very aim of it alone would make the chances of it actually being implemented VERY slim
Rofl. |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
1302
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Posted - 2012.09.06 04:23:00 -
[498] - Quote
Ah, that was an interesting article.
The comments at the bottom are also worth a read 
Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd
Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
RAGE QU1T
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
6
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Posted - 2012.09.06 05:05:00 -
[499] - Quote
Conferming Fail FC's is the reason people don't join fleets not implants. What game are you playing again? |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation
RAZOR Alliance
627
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Posted - 2012.09.06 05:06:00 -
[500] - Quote
RAGE QU1T wrote:Conferming Fail FC's is the reason people don't join fleets not implants. What game are you playing again?
NPC corpie talking about fail FCs. Yeah, okay.
http://themittani.com/features/local-problem
A simple fix to the local intel problem |
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Ghazu
122
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Posted - 2012.09.06 05:18:00 -
[501] - Quote
Aruken Marr wrote:Andski wrote:
A Vindicator in Forsaken Hubs makes ~40-50m ticks but it requires near-perfect skills and hardwirings (which I conveniently have on an alt, 'heh')
But even though it may be Highly Efficient Ratting it's still ratting~
I can get ~30m in my Naga, without fighters assigned. It's a bit less but with a 130mil ship theres a lot less stress so I dont mind the hit. Still, I can only run a few hubs a day (@ ~25-30mil a piece) before I get the urge to choke myself. So yea nullsec isk making is surprisingly unproductive if youre anywhere near sain.
Wow 30m ticks? May I have that Naga fit please. Time to dump my mach. |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power.
Cascade Imminent
1540
|
Posted - 2012.09.06 05:30:00 -
[502] - Quote
OP confuses concept of relative competitive advantage/disadvantage with the concept of safety, 24 page thread ensues |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation
RAZOR Alliance
627
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Posted - 2012.09.06 05:51:00 -
[503] - Quote
Tau Prime wrote:Doesn't this come down to rule number 1?
1. Don't fly what you cant afford to loose.
So if you cant afford to loose +4 skill implants, don't use them.
No, it doesn't.
Because you don't have to fly the implants to use them, and for PVPers using the implants discourages flying.
This is against the spirit of the game and it flies in the face of risk vs. reward as well - you get the same reward regardless of the risk you place yourself in.
http://themittani.com/features/local-problem
A simple fix to the local intel problem |
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ISD TYPE40
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
148
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Posted - 2012.09.06 05:51:00 -
[504] - Quote
Off topic and troll posts have been removed. Please try and stay on topic and post sensibly, thank you - ISD Type40.
ISD Type40
Lieutenant
Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)
Interstellar Services Department |
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MotherMoon
Blue Republic
RvB - BLUE Republic
1116
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Posted - 2012.09.07 21:51:00 -
[505] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:Tau Prime wrote:Doesn't this come down to rule number 1?
1. Don't fly what you cant afford to loose.
So if you cant afford to loose +4 skill implants, don't use them. No, it doesn't. Because you don't have to fly the implants to use them, and for PVPers using the implants discourages flying. This is against the spirit of the game and it flies in the face of risk vs. reward as well - you get the same reward regardless of the risk you place yourself in.
this is why I advocate removing learning implants and adding their bonuses to every single other implant in the game. So low tier implants would give +1 and higher tier implants would give +3. This makes learning speed an after thought, and buffs implants across the board meaning that combat implants now work when your not in combat. Like the advanced snake sets and such.
give everyone 2 more points in every stats if you must, but this madness must stop.
http://dl.eve-files.com/media/1206/scimi.jpg |
Herping yourDerp
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
674
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Posted - 2012.09.07 21:53:00 -
[506] - Quote
not sure why removing +attribute implants would be a good thing in any way shape or form. |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation
RAZOR Alliance
636
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Posted - 2012.09.07 21:55:00 -
[507] - Quote
Herping yourDerp wrote:not sure why removing +attribute implants would be a good thing in any way shape or form.
Then maybe reading the thread would be a good idea?
http://themittani.com/features/local-problem
A simple fix to the local intel problem |
Paul Oliver
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
1132
|
Posted - 2012.09.07 21:59:00 -
[508] - Quote
Herping yourDerp wrote:not sure why removing +attribute implants would be a good thing in any way shape or form. As a new player who spent a relative fortune on a set to help train all these skills a little bit faster I find the idea of putting them in jeopardy by pvping to be most unfun.
So as much as I hate agreeing with these nerf threads I gotta admit the idea of losing implants does turn me off of pvp a lot more than just losing a cheap ship.
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must undergo the fatigues of supporting it." - Thomas Paine |
Johan Civire
Dirty Curse inc.
105
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Posted - 2012.09.07 22:14:00 -
[509] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:Herping yourDerp wrote:not sure why removing +attribute implants would be a good thing in any way shape or form. As a new player who spent a relative fortune on a set to help train all these skills a little bit faster I find the idea of putting them in jeopardy by pvping to be most unfun. So as much as I hate agreeing with these nerf threads I gotta admit the idea of losing implants does turn me off of pvp a lot more than just losing a cheap ship.
I agree on that one to sinds i have +5 inplants my life in eve is so strongly scary that i lose them that i have no way to pay them back when i die i think the need to change that to. My clone or jumpclone is the only one that have the action afther some time i go back to my self and i can play carebear again..... |
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
493
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Posted - 2012.09.07 22:27:00 -
[510] - Quote
I'm coming in late... but I think altering attribute implant slots is a reasonable idea.
I think an interesting option would be to keep attribute implants in game, but make them illegal to have or use in highsec, such that if you detected with them, you will gain a suspect flag. Allow ship scanners to detect them... This will make their use in highsec interesting and risky. Hell, all implants for slots 1-5 should just be illegal <-- This would be really interesting actually!!!
Another option... increase the align time of capsules, so that a very-fast-locking inty can tackle capsules cold-warping from gate cloak.... This wouldn't really solve the primary problem of implants discouraging PvP, but instead would increase the death rate of capsules, potentially amplifying the disouragement...
I don't see a particular NEED for attribute implants, and i kind of feel like they are wasted implant slots.... When I first started living in nullsec, I used primarily +2's.... these days I almost always use +4's... and just accept the implants as part of my clone upgrade costs...
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