I dont know Aruken? What do you tell them? HTFU? Stop crying? Go back to highsec? Steal mommy's credit card and buy some PLEX? How should I know what terrible advice you're offering to the idiots you hang around with?

Why should newbies be punished for being new?

I get it. You're gonna say "In that case why not just let them hop straight into a BS?!" It's not the same. Being new doesnt restrict their ability to pvp (as they can do it in a frigate) but implants prevent them from training skills at peak rates where as a point on a frigate stops a ship warping off as good as any other ship. This is like the learning skills argument all over again. Its like saying you need to earn a certain amount of isk for +4s so that you can start training skills like everyone else. It's become that much of a necessity these days it prevents some players from venturing out of hisec. It's not so much about their risk aversion but more about bad habits and a poor mentality acquired during the first few months of playing.

I dont care so much about skill training times now as I usually just use +3s but I remember it was an issue as a low sp player because sp/hr was all important. I worry more about it presenting a problem to newer players who think that you need to have +5s to be level with everyone else.

Someone probably has - they have in other threads. If not, they were bound to.

Right, when you're a brain dead Goon-pet, it's much easier just to make **** up than to actually come prepared to a discussion with silly things like facts or verifiable quotes.

So, what you're saying is, people who intentionally PVP where they put their pods in greater danger than the rest of EVE should have the mechanics of the entire game changed to suit their playstyle and diminish the risks they take every time they undock or waddle out of range of the POS shields?

COOOoooool.

razor's far higher on the totem pole than npc corps, though

now, do you have something valuable to add to the discussion other than dismissing it as some kind of "null agenda?" what, you don't?

Razor is barely higher on your fictional totem pole than NPC corps, and you goddamn well know it. Stop pandering.

I've added much value to this discussion, you just don't agree with it. And, it's clearly a nullsec agenda since the people who would benefit most from removing the risk of losing learning implants while pvping are those who pvp in nullsec.

So, what you're saying is, you don't want to even listen to ideas such as "remove learning implants, boost base stats" or "be able to unplug implants" because oh god it was suggested by people from nullsec.

Okay, then.

Its a progression thing. You don't want newbies to rush to a BS who don't know how to properly fly it nor afford to lose it, that's why you go through the paces. Eve isn't about instant gratification, its not about streamlining to the top. You work your way up. Having newbies think that they NEED to be inline with players who are 5-6 year vets is a poor mentality and argument. That's usually where most fail and end up quitting. They see everyone else in a T3 or BS and rush too it, get it blown up then they are broke. That's not a game mechanic problem that's a mentality issue. Same goes for implants.

Once again if you do bump attributes up +5 and remove learning implants, then people will just look at that as baseline and want more ways to speed it up, it would be a endless cycle. So look at non implant speed as normal and any increase is a bonus, not mandatory.

Razor is barely higher on your fictional totem pole than NPC corps, and you goddamn well know it. Stop pandering.

I've added much value to this discussion, you just don't agree with it. And, it's clearly a nullsec agenda since the people who would benefit most from removing the risk of losing learning implants while pvping are those who pvp in nullsec.

I just think it's a terrible idea, for many obvious reasons.

No, I listened to it alright. I just think it's a terrible idea, for many obvious reasons. Not because it was proposed by somebody from nullsec, it's just terrible in it's own right. That it benefits nullsec more than the rest of EVE is self-evident. That nullsec residents are crying for nerfs to all of EVE to benefit their style of gaming really isn't surprising as you do it all the time. That's not me being biased against nullsec, that's me being unbiased. Unlike, you know, the rag that this terrible idea came from.

Well luckily our actual standing has nothing to do with the baseless opinion of some random pubbie.


Naturally, seeing as you don't have warp disruption fields anywhere else in the game.

Glad you have to resort to calling me a "rag" to make your point.

LOL. I'm not calling you a rag. Rag is another word for a newspaper or, in this case, a news website. Man it's funny when people make stupid mistakes like the one you just made.

WAIT! HOLD UP! Are you trying to tell me that there are mechanics in nullsec that dont exist elsewhere in EVE and that those mechanics both make nullsec unique and increase the risk of existing in nullsec? HOLY ****! Somebody get CCP on the phone right now, we need to address this injustice.

So let's say that this would ONLY benefit nullsec PvPers and nobody else (which is blatantly untrue anyway) - who would it punish, assuming that anybody with a huge stockpile in implants is getting some form of compensation?

That argument would be reasonable if this idea only benefited one group while punishing another - sound familiar?

WAIT! HOLD UP! Are you trying to tell me that there are mechanics in nullsec that dont exist elsewhere in EVE and that those mechanics both make nullsec unique and increase the risk of existing in nullsec? HOLY ****! Somebody get CCP on the phone right now, we need to address this injustice.

Who said this would ONLY benefit nullsec pvp? I certainly didn't. Was it you? I might have missed it. Lord Zim maybe? No, he just puppets whatever you say. I'm so lost.

Who said this would ONLY benefit nullsec pvp? I certainly didn't. Was it you? I might have missed it. Lord Zim maybe? No, he just puppets whatever you say. I'm so lost.

Actually, you did

Nobody did, I'm just asking you who this would punish even if the extreme I stated was true. Thankfully, posting with a sockpuppet alt means that you can shitpost to your heart's content without it reflecting on you!

And what are these "obvious reasons"?

WTF is going on?

I'm just asking you a question. Don't freak out.

Still waiting.

Terrible movie.

LOL, who's freaking out? You're the one who can't make up your mind about who or what I am. First I'm just an NPC alt. Then you claim I did say somehting, then you recant and say I didn't. Then you accuse me of sockpuppeting. Make up your mind.