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Corey Fumimasa
The Advent of Faith
57
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Posted - 2013.01.24 17:30:00 -
[1] - Quote
Some kid was just on help saying that he tried to sell a PLEX and another player convod him and got the kid to just do an in station swap. Is that frowned upon? And does CCP do anything to discourage it?
Just curious, I felt kind of bad about the story. The kid was like "my mom bought it for my birthday =-(
It was awful!
This is a youtube playlist going over my first 30 ship losses. Video sucks but the audio came out well.There are some good lessons, and if you know the game there's some funny stories. |
Solstice Project
T E R R O R I S T S
2652
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Posted - 2013.01.24 17:32:00 -
[2] - Quote
Corey Fumimasa wrote:Some kid was just on help saying that he tried to sell a PLEX and another player convod him and got the kid to just do an in station swap. Is that frowned upon? And does CCP do anything to discourage it?
Just curious, I felt kind of bad about the story. The kid was like "my mom bought it for my birthday =-(
It was awful! :/
Sitting in the official helpchat and scamming noobs who seek help ... that's really low, even for EvE players ...
Inappropriate signature removed. Spitfire |
De'Veldrin
East India Ore Trade
The East India Co.
802
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Posted - 2013.01.24 17:33:00 -
[3] - Quote
AFAIK, the only think you are explicitly forbidden from scamming with are character trades. Some helpful GM may come along and correct me, but if the kid feels like it violated the rules, they should file a petition.
The Margin Trading Scam: If you fell for it, it's your own damned fault.
Malcanis for CSM 8 |
Mai Khumm
Carbon Circle
Tactical Narcotics Team
410
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Posted - 2013.01.24 17:33:00 -
[4] - Quote
As long as it wasn't done in the public chat but in a private convo, he's pretty much screwed...
*insert witty saying here*
twitter - @AzamiNevinyrall |
Some Rando
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
790
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Posted - 2013.01.24 17:34:00 -
[5] - Quote
Whoever did that should be banned. Of course, CCP could also help us out by concretely defining what a "new player" is, too.
Malcanis for CSM8 |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation
RAZOR Alliance
3496
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Posted - 2013.01.24 17:35:00 -
[6] - Quote
I'm fairly sure scamming complete newbies isn't allowed.
The solution would be for the scammee to file a petition.
Malcanis for CSM 8
Phrases like "you can't nerf / buff X EVE is a Sandbox" have the same amount of meaning as "If this is a sack of potatoes then you can not carrot." - Alara IonStorm |
Jita iswhereIsit
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
19
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Posted - 2013.01.24 17:36:00 -
[7] - Quote
Its part of the game, as long as he didn't use the recruitment channel or the help channel directly then whoever scammed him did nothing wrong. |
Corey Fumimasa
The Advent of Faith
57
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Posted - 2013.01.24 17:39:00 -
[8] - Quote
Thanks, I think he ended up running a petition.
This is a youtube playlist going over my first 30 ship losses. Video sucks but the audio came out well.There are some good lessons, and if you know the game there's some funny stories. |
Corey Fumimasa
The Advent of Faith
57
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Posted - 2013.01.24 17:42:00 -
[9] - Quote
Jita iswhereIsit wrote:Its part of the game, as long as he didn't use the recruitment channel or the help channel directly then whoever scammed him did nothing wrong.
Against the rules and Wrong are 2 different things. It was wrong. Scamming a few million isk is one thing, but that was 20$, and now the kid feels like **** about the game. No reason for that.
This is a youtube playlist going over my first 30 ship losses. Video sucks but the audio came out well.There are some good lessons, and if you know the game there's some funny stories. |
Psychotic Monk
The Skunkworks
563
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Posted - 2013.01.24 17:44:00 -
[10] - Quote
Yes, there are new players and people in unfortunate circumstances who play, but you can't know which of these people are telling you lies in order to try and get out of a sticky situations and you often can't tell the difference between someone who's a terrible communicator because they're 13 or just dumb.
Your assumption has to be that every player in the game is equal. If information presented to you later makes you change your mind, then fine, but you should be aware that people will say pretty much anything to you in order to try and get out of a sticky situation.
Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement. |
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Andski
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
6458
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Posted - 2013.01.24 17:48:00 -
[11] - Quote
I'm sorry but no matter how new you are you shouldn't be dumb enough to give a PLEX to someone else via station trade
"New" is not a synonym for "stupid"
~*a proud belligerent undesirable*~
TheMittani.com: The premier source for news, commentary and discussion of EVE Online and other games of interest.
Malcanis for CSM 8 |
Dave Stark
1671
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Posted - 2013.01.24 17:48:00 -
[12] - Quote
not sure if i should be sympathetic or amused.
"100k for notifications of stupidity, i love this bounty system." |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
3397
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Posted - 2013.01.24 17:50:00 -
[13] - Quote
Corey Fumimasa wrote:Jita iswhereIsit wrote:Its part of the game, as long as he didn't use the recruitment channel or the help channel directly then whoever scammed him did nothing wrong. Against the rules and Wrong are 2 different things. It was wrong. Scamming a few million isk is one thing, but that was 20$, and now the kid feels like **** about the game. No reason for that.
That is my gut reaction also, but then I thought about it for a moment.
Scamming someone out of $20 should be bannable, however once purchased that PLEX became an item just like any other and therefore subject to risks just like anything else in game.
Secondly, if "his mom gave it to him" it was to give him a month of game time... so why was he trying to sell it to begin with. If I was his mom I'd be a little pissed off about that. That fact negates some of my sympathy.
No, the only issue is "is scamming allowed in the help channel, and did this event happen in the help channel or a convo?".
To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors.
If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
Andski
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
6458
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Posted - 2013.01.24 17:59:00 -
[14] - Quote
From the eve-live logs, the guy didn't get scammed from the help channel, it looks like it happened outside of it entirely.
From the looks of it, he made a private contract without specifying a price.
~*a proud belligerent undesirable*~
TheMittani.com: The premier source for news, commentary and discussion of EVE Online and other games of interest.
Malcanis for CSM 8 |
De'Veldrin
East India Ore Trade
The East India Co.
805
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Posted - 2013.01.24 18:09:00 -
[15] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:
Secondly, if "his mom gave it to him" it was to give him a month of game time... so why was he trying to sell it to begin with. If I was his mom I'd be a little pissed off about that. That fact negates some of my sympathy.
Gotta disagree with you here. Remember this is the same age group that is paying all those f2p pay to win games on Facebook and PSN and the like. Parents give their kids in game money for stuff all the time (I've bought my kids cards for their games for their birthdays before).
The problem is, in Eve, your stuff can be taken away from you pretty easily, whereas in those other games, it generally is yours once you get it.
Quote:
No, the only issue is "is scamming allowed in the help channel, and did this event happen in the help channel or a convo?".
Fundamentally, I agree with you.
However, the headache for CCP will be when mom calls her credit card company and says "That's an invalid charge because my son didn't get the thing I bought." TBH, I was surprised when CCP started allowing you to undock with PLEX - it's got to be mkore of a hassle for them than they first anticipated.
The Margin Trading Scam: If you fell for it, it's your own damned fault.
Malcanis for CSM 8 |
Gogela
Freeport Exploration
Loosely Affiliated Pirates Alliance
2265
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Posted - 2013.01.24 18:10:00 -
[16] - Quote
I don' know about you guys, but as a new player I was in NO POSITION to buy PLEX at all. If it was available at the time, I'd have been SELLING PLEX! What noob has 550 mil to kick around? It took me forever just to scrape together enough ISK for a battleship! If you can scam a noob w/ PLEX I got news for ya: he's hot a noob.
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Andski
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
6458
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Posted - 2013.01.24 18:10:00 -
[17] - Quote
De'Veldrin wrote:True, but the headache for CCP will be when mom calls her credit card company and says "That's an invalid charge because my son didn't get the thing I bought." TBH, I was surprised when CCP started allowing you to undock with PLEX - it's got to be mkore of a hassle for them than they first anticipated.
i'm pretty sure chargebacks get you permabanned
~*a proud belligerent undesirable*~
TheMittani.com: The premier source for news, commentary and discussion of EVE Online and other games of interest.
Malcanis for CSM 8 |
Demolishar
United Aggression
744
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Posted - 2013.01.24 18:12:00 -
[18] - Quote
Gogela wrote:I don' know about you guys, but as a new player I was in NO POSITION to buy PLEX at all. If it was available at the time, I'd have been SELLING PLEX! What noob has 550 mil to kick around? It took me forever just to scrape together enough ISK for a battleship! If you can scam a noob w/ PLEX I got news for ya: he's hot a noob.
The noob was selling. |
De'Veldrin
East India Ore Trade
The East India Co.
805
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Posted - 2013.01.24 18:12:00 -
[19] - Quote
Andski wrote:De'Veldrin wrote:True, but the headache for CCP will be when mom calls her credit card company and says "That's an invalid charge because my son didn't get the thing I bought." TBH, I was surprised when CCP started allowing you to undock with PLEX - it's got to be mkore of a hassle for them than they first anticipated. i'm pretty sure chargebacks get you permabanned
I doubt mom will care if her son's account gets banned as long as her credit card balances.,
The Margin Trading Scam: If you fell for it, it's your own damned fault.
Malcanis for CSM 8 |
Gogela
Freeport Exploration
Loosely Affiliated Pirates Alliance
2265
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Posted - 2013.01.24 18:13:00 -
[20] - Quote
Demolishar wrote:Gogela wrote:I don' know about you guys, but as a new player I was in NO POSITION to buy PLEX at all. If it was available at the time, I'd have been SELLING PLEX! What noob has 550 mil to kick around? It took me forever just to scrape together enough ISK for a battleship! If you can scam a noob w/ PLEX I got news for ya: he's hot a noob. The noob was selling.
Ah. That's something different. You're right that's f'd up. Just like you can't hang out in starter systems and grief noobs you shouldn't be able to pull $20 off of them like that. Ban the scammer if that's the case.
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Mistah Ewedynao
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
353
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Posted - 2013.01.24 18:14:00 -
[21] - Quote
Make all the conditions you like but scamming noobs, ganking noobs, sucking noobs into BS gank the noob corps etc, are all total Bullcrap and anyone caught doing such should be permabanned.
The game will be much better off without them. AND the whole scamming plex thing has gotten out of control IMO. Sure, those of us who have been around don't pay attention to them so why are they there? The only person who will fall for one is a noob, otherwise they just contribute to the local spam overload in trade hubs.
Nerf Goons
Nuke em from orbit....it's the only way to be sure. |
Kamii Yo
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2013.01.24 18:18:00 -
[22] - Quote
Andski wrote:I'm sorry but no matter how new you are you shouldn't be dumb enough to give a PLEX to someone else via station trade
"New" is not a synonym for "stupid"
And how is a new player to know this? If you want to buy and sell something - and the person was in the same station as you - why wouldn't you use the trade system? Every other MMO in the world has a trade system that operates in a similar fashion...it would be the natural port of call.
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Andski
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
6459
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Posted - 2013.01.24 18:20:00 -
[23] - Quote
Mistah Ewedynao wrote:Make all the conditions you like but scamming noobs, ganking noobs, sucking noobs into BS gank the noob corps etc, are all total Bullcrap and anyone caught doing such should be permabanned.
The game will be much better off without them. AND the whole scamming plex thing has gotten out of control IMO. Sure, those of us who have been around don't pay attention to them so why are they there? The only person who will fall for one is a noob, otherwise they just contribute to the local spam overload in trade hubs.
They can't prohibit scamming newbies without prohibiting scamming in its entirety, since making special cases for new players adds excessive GM workload when everyone who gets scammed regardless of how long they have been playing tries to get their stuff back under a vague provision.
Scamming is allowed in this game and it hasn't hindered its growth.
~*a proud belligerent undesirable*~
TheMittani.com: The premier source for news, commentary and discussion of EVE Online and other games of interest.
Malcanis for CSM 8 |
Demolishar
United Aggression
744
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Posted - 2013.01.24 18:21:00 -
[24] - Quote
Kamii Yo wrote:Andski wrote:I'm sorry but no matter how new you are you shouldn't be dumb enough to give a PLEX to someone else via station trade
"New" is not a synonym for "stupid" And how is a new player to know this? If you want to buy and sell something - and the person was in the same station as you - why wouldn't you use the trade system? Every other MMO in the world has a trade system that operates in a similar fashion...it would be the natural port of call.
It's a pretty graphical interface for trade windows. Point being that you can easily see that you are getting NOTHING back. |
baltec1
Bat Country
4900
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Posted - 2013.01.24 18:21:00 -
[25] - Quote
Kamii Yo wrote:Andski wrote:I'm sorry but no matter how new you are you shouldn't be dumb enough to give a PLEX to someone else via station trade
"New" is not a synonym for "stupid" And how is a new player to know this? If you want to buy and sell something - and the person was in the same station as you - why wouldn't you use the trade system? Every other MMO in the world has a trade system that operates in a similar fashion...it would be the natural port of call.
Would have thought learning how many zeros make up a number is a thing you learn in year one of school. |
Google Voices
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
8
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Posted - 2013.01.24 18:22:00 -
[26] - Quote
So, if I read this correctly, which is unlikely.....
New player gets a plex to sell, gets scammed by some player.....
Technically, the scammer stole $15 from a kid, I wonder if it's actionable as petty theft?
I am the voices of Google! Want answers? Learn to read...... |
Pookie McPook
The Whiskers of Kurvi-Tasch
24
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Posted - 2013.01.24 18:23:00 -
[27] - Quote
Kids shouldn't be allowed in spaceships on their own. Were his parents insane? |
Rengerel en Distel
Amarr Science and Industry
1074
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Posted - 2013.01.24 18:25:00 -
[28] - Quote
Once you use money for a game item, that item no longer has a RL value. So saying the scammer stole 15/20 bucks from his is wrong. As to a "new" player talking in the help channel about being scammed, more than likely he's yet another scammer looking to dupe people into giving him isk.
Also, I kind of liked it better when Thomas Hurt would post obvious troll posts vs his new alt posting vague ones.
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DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
592
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Posted - 2013.01.24 18:31:00 -
[29] - Quote
Andski wrote:De'Veldrin wrote:True, but the headache for CCP will be when mom calls her credit card company and says "That's an invalid charge because my son didn't get the thing I bought." TBH, I was surprised when CCP started allowing you to undock with PLEX - it's got to be mkore of a hassle for them than they first anticipated. i'm pretty sure chargebacks get you permabanned
If it came to that point I doubt the kid would care if they were perma banned.
Ripard Teg-á for CSM 8 |
KaarBaak
249
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Posted - 2013.01.24 18:31:00 -
[30] - Quote
Google Voices wrote:So, if I read this correctly, which is unlikely..... New player gets a plex to sell, gets scammed by some player..... Technically, the scammer stole $15 from a kid, I wonder if it's actionable as petty theft?
There is no 'technically..." aspect about it. If that were the case, then you could argue that someone scamming you out of anything in game is stealing "technically" since, due to the transitive property, item X is worth 600M isk (in-game) and that is equivalent to the price of a PLEX (an in-game item) which can be purchased for $15.
Heck...for that matter, if someone violences my tricked out mining boat...can I take them to small claims court?
It's slippery slope that CCP has consistently cutoff by reminding you that once you convert at GTC to PLEX or have a PLEX in-game, it is a virtual, in-game item and holds no real world value.
And, reading the OP, it sounds like the supposed new player went to the Help channel to whine about being scammed...the actual scam took place in private convo.
KB |
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