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Should Ganking be profitable?

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 4 post(s)
Murk Paradox Red Tsunami No Value 282	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:00:00 - [631] - Quote Caldari Citizen 1897289768188 wrote: NocturnalDeath wrote: Quote: Again hi-sec does not exist just to be exploited it should be the best balanced space of the three. SUBSCRIBER RETAINMENT What is one of the best ways for CCP to retain new subscribers? For those subscribers to interact with others and develop relationships with other pilots. How does CCP do this? By encouraging new pilots to huddle together for fun, profit, and protection. 1. Create incentive to join a player corp 2. Create incentive to invest time/isk in the corporation entity 3. Create incentive to work together instead of solo 4. Create a need for pilots to play smarter - allow/buff HiSec Antagonists such as thieves, gankers, scammers, etc 5. Create incentive to fight for each other - functioning wardecs and mercenary mechanics. __________ "The greatest aspect of this game is not acually the sandbox, ...but is the competitive nature of the game" - Psychotic Monk This ties into the topic how? So I need 20 of my friends on line to run a solo mission? Even with those 20 friends online the mechanics of hi-sec still favor the gankers. Again this also part of the balance. If you want to be a pirate then I say yarr avast me me scurvy prutid ship mates....then you should be shoot on sight in hi-sec the first time you gank the first person till the day you bio mass. Some one brought up the pirates of old. Were they allowed to sail around the seas unmolested? No they were hunted down and hung. Oh this is good. First, #4. Specifically; gankers. Second. Don't need 20 people to do a mission. Especially when you are talking about miners' exhumers getting ganked for profit. 3rd, pirates generally have -10 standings. Which in fact means they are shoot on sight. We have a standings system in place, pod kills being VERY detrimental to those standings. Since eve is first and foremost combat oriented, simple agressing will not incur those steep penalties, although you will get a small penalty. And lastly, not all pirates of old were hung. Some were simply imprisoned, but that's not the point, because even merchant ships in those times had escorts or even had some guns on deck (in hold/ports) for that very reason. Enjoy. "I say tomato, you say tomaCCP BAN ALL TOMATOES THEY ARE HARASSING ME I WANT TOMATO FREE HIGHSEC."-á -TheGunslinger42 Proud enforcer of the Code, see [url]http://www.minerbumping.com[/url]-á for details.
Murk Paradox Red Tsunami No Value 282	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:01:00 - [632] - Quote Caldari Citizen 1897289768188 wrote: Murk Paradox wrote: Nowhere, NOWHERE in this thread, is it even referenced, or mentioned, about how powerful certain ships could be. Sure it has several times. This tells me you havent read it. "numbers?" "I say tomato, you say tomaCCP BAN ALL TOMATOES THEY ARE HARASSING ME I WANT TOMATO FREE HIGHSEC."-á -TheGunslinger42 Proud enforcer of the Code, see [url]http://www.minerbumping.com[/url]-á for details.
Caldari Citizen 1897289768188 State War Academy Caldari State 178	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:02:00 - [633] - Quote Tippia wrote: Caldari Citizen 1897289768188 wrote: This ties into the topic how? Ok. That answer the previous question about reading comprehension at leastGÇª Try #4 againGÇª Quote: Some one brought up the pirates of old. Were they allowed to sail around the seas unmolested? No they were hunted down and hung. GÇªor taken back home and given medals for their service to the empire. Point being gankers/pirates are allowed to roam around in hi-sec because? This is a hi-sec safety net which only adds to the already existing balance issue.
baltec1 Bat Country 5711	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:02:00 - [634] - Quote Caldari Citizen 1897289768188 wrote: Some one brought up the pirates of old. Were they allowed to sail around the seas unmolested? No they were hunted down and hung. We knighted pirates.
Murk Paradox Red Tsunami No Value 282	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:02:00 - [635] - Quote Zyress wrote: Murk Paradox wrote: Zyress wrote: Caldari Citizen 1897289768188 wrote: Dev soundwave wrote. "Yeah my point is that I don't think they should be profitable to gank. I think it should be possible, but not necessarily profitable (profitable might be the wrong word, but more that the expenses should be higher for the attacker than the defender)." What is everyones opinion? No matter how despicable you or I feel that activity to be, there are always going to be jerks in the sandbox out to ruin your day.. Its your responsibility to insure that their sick idea of fun is not profitable. With the changes to mining barges there is no longer a good excuse not to tank them. If its freight that is particularly valuable you may want to use one of the freight services, you can easily insure it for more than it is worth so they don't get your isk and the freight corp can see to the miscreants. I've personally never been ganked in highsec when I wasn't autopiloting. I consider that my fault. They should probably fix autopilot to warp to zero and jump or just take the button out. Its just a trap of convenience ccp has put on the screen, possibly solely for the benefit of gankers. Or enforce you are indeed at the helm and not afk =). If they want to enforce that they should just remove the button and take away all doubt of their intentions. They used to have it that way in fact. You used to have to own every bm in order to travel. Before warp to 0 existed. "I say tomato, you say tomaCCP BAN ALL TOMATOES THEY ARE HARASSING ME I WANT TOMATO FREE HIGHSEC."-á -TheGunslinger42 Proud enforcer of the Code, see [url]http://www.minerbumping.com[/url]-á for details.
Caldari Citizen 1897289768188 State War Academy Caldari State 178	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:03:00 - [636] - Quote Murk Paradox wrote: Caldari Citizen 1897289768188 wrote: Murk Paradox wrote: Nowhere, NOWHERE in this thread, is it even referenced, or mentioned, about how powerful certain ships could be. Sure it has several times. This tells me you havent read it. "numbers?" Sorry do your own research not doing it for you.
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops 13369	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:04:00 - [637] - Quote Caldari Citizen 1897289768188 wrote: Point being gankers/pirates are allowed to roam around in hi-sec because? Because the game would suffer from mechanically enforcing restrictions on players' movement. Quote: This is a hi-sec safety net which only adds to the already existing balance issue. What balance issue? What safety net? Being -10 is, if anything, an unsafety net. Vote Malcanis for CSM8.
Caldari Citizen 1897289768188 State War Academy Caldari State 178	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:05:00 - [638] - Quote baltec1 wrote: Caldari Citizen 1897289768188 wrote: Some one brought up the pirates of old. Were they allowed to sail around the seas unmolested? No they were hunted down and hung. We knighted pirates. One became a Vice Admiral of the royal navy. Was this before or after being kicked from the country?
Caldari Citizen 1897289768188 State War Academy Caldari State 178	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:07:00 - [639] - Quote Tippia wrote: Caldari Citizen 1897289768188 wrote: Point being gankers/pirates are allowed to roam around in hi-sec because? Because the game would suffer from mechanically enforcing restrictions on players' movement. Quote: This is a hi-sec safety net which only adds to the already existing balance issue. What balance issue? What safety net? Being -10 is, if anything, an unsafety net. Quote: Sorry do your own research not doing it for you. So in other words, you have nothing to offer that would prove him wrong and you right. The very ones that have and are being discussed through out this thread Tippia.
Whitehound 1371	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:07:00 - [640] - Quote baltec1 wrote: Caldari Citizen 1897289768188 wrote: Some one brought up the pirates of old. Were they allowed to sail around the seas unmolested? No they were hunted down and hung. We knighted pirates. One became a Vice Admiral of the royal navy. And we chopped the heads off of kings, too. Loss is meaningful. Therefore is the loss of meaning likewise meaningful. It is the source of all trolling.

Murk Paradox Red Tsunami No Value 282	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:09:00 - [641] - Quote Drinks all around! "I say tomato, you say tomaCCP BAN ALL TOMATOES THEY ARE HARASSING ME I WANT TOMATO FREE HIGHSEC."-á -TheGunslinger42 Proud enforcer of the Code, see [url]http://www.minerbumping.com[/url]-á for details.
Touchin Myself Silver Octopus Infernal Octopus 3	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:09:00 - [642] - Quote This thread makes me sad... Lets take away what makes EVE EVE for the sake of some crybabies that got suicide ganked. How many of you guys complaining have actually had it happen to you? How many have just heard about it and are being little scaredy cats? The whole point of EVE is to be an anything goes player run sandbox. What you guys are asking for goes against the very essence of EVE. This is not supposed to be your hand holding solo friendly MMO, if you thought so you where very mistaken. "Oh but, hi sec is supposed to be safe" WRONG.
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops 13369	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:10:00 - [643] - Quote Caldari Citizen 1897289768188 wrote: The very ones that have and are being discussed through out this thread Tippia. What balance issues? What safety net? Describe them. Because all we're doing here is watching you making baseless claim after baseless claim about things that exist, without you ever proving it or showing what the actual problem is. No issues or safety nets have been discussed GÇö just implied by you and questioned by everyone else because you can't actually articulate them. Vote Malcanis for CSM8.
baltec1 Bat Country 5711	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:12:00 - [644] - Quote Caldari Citizen 1897289768188 wrote: Was this before or after being kicked from the country? Knighted for his piracy against the spanish. Made second in command of the royal fleet that defeated the spanish armada. Seems you know as little history in RL as in this game.
Murk Paradox Red Tsunami No Value 282	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:14:00 - [645] - Quote Caldari Citizen 1897289768188 wrote: Tippia wrote: Caldari Citizen 1897289768188 wrote: Point being gankers/pirates are allowed to roam around in hi-sec because? Because the game would suffer from mechanically enforcing restrictions on players' movement. Quote: This is a hi-sec safety net which only adds to the already existing balance issue. What balance issue? What safety net? Being -10 is, if anything, an unsafety net. Quote: Sorry do your own research not doing it for you. So in other words, you have nothing to offer that would prove him wrong and you right. The very ones that have and are being discussed through out this thread Tippia. Let's get back on track then... What would you propose be done? Keep in mind we want something that can be argued, not for argument sake, but for balance. There has to be pros and cons therefore some thought must be given to such a proposal. You said I should do my research in this thread, and I have. I started with the OP that referenced exhumers being changed as to not offer a profit from the hull being salvaged after being destroyed (which ganking is a facet of obviously, but a wreck is a wreck). So what changes would you like to be made, that haven't already been made? "I say tomato, you say tomaCCP BAN ALL TOMATOES THEY ARE HARASSING ME I WANT TOMATO FREE HIGHSEC."-á -TheGunslinger42 Proud enforcer of the Code, see [url]http://www.minerbumping.com[/url]-á for details.
Murk Paradox Red Tsunami No Value 282	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:15:00 - [646] - Quote baltec1 wrote: Caldari Citizen 1897289768188 wrote: Was this before or after being kicked from the country? Knighted for his piracy against the spanish. Made second in command of the royal fleet that defeated the spanish armada seven years later. Also a close companion of the queen. Seems you know as little history in RL as in this game. I don't think he was ever kicked from his country to be honest. "I say tomato, you say tomaCCP BAN ALL TOMATOES THEY ARE HARASSING ME I WANT TOMATO FREE HIGHSEC."-á -TheGunslinger42 Proud enforcer of the Code, see [url]http://www.minerbumping.com[/url]-á for details.
Jonah Gravenstein Khalkotauroi Defence Labs 6980	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:16:00 - [647] - Quote Caldari Citizen 1897289768188 wrote: baltec1 wrote: Caldari Citizen 1897289768188 wrote: Some one brought up the pirates of old. Were they allowed to sail around the seas unmolested? No they were hunted down and hung. We knighted pirates. One became a Vice Admiral of the royal navy. Was this before or after being kicked from the country? The man baltec1 refers to is Sir Francis Drake, Pirate, Privateer, Member of Parliament, Knight, Slaver, and Vice Admiral of the Royal Navy are amongst his achievements. For the record he was never kicked out of England, at least as far as the history books go. Whitehound wrote: And we chopped the heads off of kings, too. If only we could do the same to bad posters. Why shouldn't you be able to rob people of their valuables for profit? Eve in a nutshell, it's you vs the universe, and every machiavellian space bastard in it.
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises 1243	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:17:00 - [648] - Quote Touchin Myself wrote: This thread makes me sad... Lets take away what makes EVE EVE for the sake of some crybabies that got suicide ganked. How many of you guys complaining have actually had it happen to you? How many have just heard about it and are being little scaredy cats? The whole point of EVE is to be an anything goes player run sandbox. What you guys are asking for goes against the very essence of EVE. This is not supposed to be your hand holding solo friendly MMO, if you thought so you where very mistaken. "Oh but, hi sec is supposed to be safe" WRONG. Thankfully, it seems to be one or two people saying 'ganking is bad', with a larger number of people saying 'no it isn't, just stop carrying 15 billion in your freighter, and stick a tank on your barge' Ganking: It's not good. It's not bad. It's just EVE. Live with it, or leave. Steve Ronuken for CSM 8 Handy tools and SDE conversions Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Murk Paradox Red Tsunami No Value 282	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:19:00 - [649] - Quote Jonah Gravenstein wrote: Caldari Citizen 1897289768188 wrote: baltec1 wrote: Caldari Citizen 1897289768188 wrote: Some one brought up the pirates of old. Were they allowed to sail around the seas unmolested? No they were hunted down and hung. We knighted pirates. One became a Vice Admiral of the royal navy. Was this before or after being kicked from the country? The man baltec1 refers to is Sir Francis Drake, Pirate, Privateer, Member of Parliament, Knight, Slaver, and Vice Admiral of the Royal Navy are amongst his achievements. For the record he was never kicked out of England, at least as far as the history books go. Whitehound wrote: And we chopped the heads off of kings, too. If only we could do the same to bad posters. Why shouldn't you be able to rob people of their valuables for profit? Sounds like an Amarr. I like him already. "I say tomato, you say tomaCCP BAN ALL TOMATOES THEY ARE HARASSING ME I WANT TOMATO FREE HIGHSEC."-á -TheGunslinger42 Proud enforcer of the Code, see [url]http://www.minerbumping.com[/url]-á for details.
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops 13369	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:19:00 - [650] - Quote Steve Ronuken wrote: Ganking: It's not good. It's not bad. It's just EVE. Specifically, it GÇ£was, is and will remain a proper endorsed activity in EVEGÇ¥, according to the devs. Vote Malcanis for CSM8.

Whitehound 1371	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:20:00 - [651] - Quote Jonah Gravenstein wrote: Why shouldn't you be able to rob people of their valuables for profit? Why should you? Loss is meaningful. Therefore is the loss of meaning likewise meaningful. It is the source of all trolling.
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops 13369	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:21:00 - [652] - Quote Whitehound wrote: Jonah Gravenstein wrote: Why shouldn't you be able to rob people of their valuables for profit? Why should you? Because it was, is and will remain a proper endorsed activity in EVE. Vote Malcanis for CSM8.
Takseen University of Caille Gallente Federation 377	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:21:00 - [653] - Quote Whitehound wrote: Jonah Gravenstein wrote: Why shouldn't you be able to rob people of their valuables for profit? Why should you? It adds interesting gameplay possibilities, and helps prevent mudflation.
Caldari Citizen 1897289768188 State War Academy Caldari State 178	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:23:00 - [654] - Quote I have all day if you want to keep playing this dumb game. I told you I am just as capable as being just as obtuse and pig headed as some of you have already shown to be. You think because you can continue to ask the same questions over and over that have already been answered that this some how makes that persons point of view or opinion any less valid. Sorry it does not. There is a imbalance in the game at the moment in regards to the mechanics of hi-sec ganking/pirates and the profit associated with it. Asking the same questions over and over doesnGÇÖt change the fact that it exist. I can understand why those who abuse or exploit this imbalance choose not to acknowledge it. NIMBY Not in my back yard. This game like all things can and will change. Just like when they proposed the barge change. Prior to the change there was the very exact same arguments and methods used to try and counter or invalidate the need for that change also. Guess what the game changed. Pointing out imbalance is not a bad thing and I will continue to do so until they kick from the forums.
Murk Paradox Red Tsunami No Value 282	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:23:00 - [655] - Quote Whitehound wrote: Jonah Gravenstein wrote: Why shouldn't you be able to rob people of their valuables for profit? Why should you? Because I can. "I say tomato, you say tomaCCP BAN ALL TOMATOES THEY ARE HARASSING ME I WANT TOMATO FREE HIGHSEC."-á -TheGunslinger42 Proud enforcer of the Code, see [url]http://www.minerbumping.com[/url]-á for details.
baltec1 Bat Country 5711	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:23:00 - [656] - Quote Whitehound wrote: Jonah Gravenstein wrote: Why shouldn't you be able to rob people of their valuables for profit? Why should you? To get rich.
Whitehound 1371	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:24:00 - [657] - Quote Takseen wrote: Whitehound wrote: Jonah Gravenstein wrote: Why shouldn't you be able to rob people of their valuables for profit? Why should you? It adds interesting gameplay possibilities, and helps prevent mudflation. The majority hates being robbed. So why should you? Loss is meaningful. Therefore is the loss of meaning likewise meaningful. It is the source of all trolling.
Jonah Gravenstein Khalkotauroi Defence Labs 6980	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:24:00 - [658] - Quote Whitehound wrote: Jonah Gravenstein wrote: Why shouldn't you be able to rob people of their valuables for profit? Why should you? Because we can, because it's a sandbox and the game mechanics allow us to, because people refuse to tank their ships, excluding freighters, because people insist on putting obscene ISK values in cargo and because some people are so damn lazy they can't be bothered to actually be at the keyboard while they "play" the game. Eve in a nutshell, it's you vs the universe, and every machiavellian space bastard in it.
Caldari Citizen 1897289768188 State War Academy Caldari State 178	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:24:00 - [659] - Quote Tippia wrote: Whitehound wrote: Jonah Gravenstein wrote: Why shouldn't you be able to rob people of their valuables for profit? Why should you? Because it was, is and will remain a proper endorsed activity in EVE. Not valid reason..see how that works
Ignitious Hellfury Minmatar Republic Military Skool 7	Posted - 2013.03.23 18:31:00 - [660] - Quote Caldari Citizen 1897289768188 wrote: Dev soundwave wrote. "Yeah my point is that I don't think they should be profitable to gank. I think it should be possible, but not necessarily profitable (profitable might be the wrong word, but more that the expenses should be higher for the attacker than the defender)." What is everyones opinion? You can't control how profittable ganking is. It's not worth it to gank 99% of players, it's the 1% of retards hauling their billions in 1 afk untanked autopiloting hauler. It's only profittable now because people are stupid.



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