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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 63 post(s) |
5hadow 1
The Shadow's Of Eve TSOE Consortium
0
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Posted - 2011.10.18 21:14:00 -
[571] - Quote
Again CCP has given the SUPER CAP BLOB Alliance the upper hand.
The greif of having one is just not worth it. Supers will just RF it in 5 min or less. Come back within 24 hrs and do it again. Any smart alliance will just move all there PI with alt to high sec and avoid the grief. Price will skyrocket till the high sec alts ramp up production and the zero zero deep BOTTERS ramp up theres.
And only one custom office per planet means only the SuperCap Blob Alliances with control all the LOW SEC PI. For they will just blob any small corp or alliace who put one up. So you either pay the massive fee which they will set to discourage others from doing PI in Low Sec. So you either join the Blob alliace and become a pet or go high sec or just dont bother with it.
Thanks CCP.
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Korvin
Shadow Kingdom Best Alliance
9
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Posted - 2011.10.18 21:19:00 -
[572] - Quote
CCP Greyscale (I hate to quote Greyscale, but here I go) wrote:http://www.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&nbid=2351
Lessons learned
- Shooting at stationary structures is boring -See: Starbase warfare, Dominion sov warfare. Even the good fights that do happen around such objectives could be improved by having better objectives. - Shooting at things with hitpoints scales very efficiently with fleet size, which encourages lag-producing behavior
-Having to spend significant amounts of effort defeating an enemy which isn't even fighting back is really boring - See: Starbase warfare, Dominion sov warfare. See in particular how long it took to clear IT Alliance's ownership out of Delve, as a recent example
- Waking up every morning and having to clean up the mess made while you were asleep is boring - See: station ping-pong pre-sov, repairing station services. Having to do something tedious every day before you can actually play the game is not cool
- Doing something just "because it would be cool/neat/awesome" is always a bad idea and will come back to bite you later - See: Jump bridges, cyno jammers, Sov 4, AoE doomsdays, titans in general, supercarrier boost... Note that we should still obviously strive to make everything cool/neat/awesome, but when we start off with an awesome idea rather than an actual problem we want to fix or a feature that has a clear, functional and necessary goal, it generally requires painful fixes further down the road
- Cost is a useful variable to tune but an unwise thing to rely on to enforce scarcity or balance - players will always be richer than you think - See: outposts, titans, supercarriers
- Making something tedious will not stop players doing it if it's very clearly the best option. They'll do it, and they'll hate it - See: everything involving starbases. As a counterpoint though, things like the one-per-corp-per-system-per-day starbase rule demonstrate that if something doesn't make a big difference but is sufficiently awkward to do, then any theoretical "exploit" scenarios tend to fall out of favor quickly as they're just not worth the effort.
- People like to do one-stop shopping, and will "go to Jita" for everything unless doing so is comparatively very inconvenient - See: moon mineral distribution, high-strength booster resource distribution, neither of which achieved much in the way of the nullsec-to-nullsec trade that they hoped to encourage
"F" for homework. |
Smoking Blunts
Zebra Corp BricK sQuAD.
105
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Posted - 2011.10.18 21:23:00 -
[573] - Quote
EI Digin wrote:Smoking Blunts wrote:are you too dumb to see that? Return amounts were talked about in a previous post. 1) If you're not large enough or don't have enough friends to be able to respond to something 24 hours in advance, you got problems. 2) Structure shoots are a bad concept, but really it has the same EHP as a small tower, it doesnt have any defenses, and it doesn't take long to reinforce at all, even with like 10-15 people. If/when they decide to change how sov structures work in terms of killing them, then yeah you can change this structure to that system, but since they have not yet thought of something this will work in the interim. 3) PI is fine for what it is, you just have no idea what you are talking about. 4) I'M NOT EMOTIONAL YOU ARE A DUMB PET.
1. so this shafts the small players/corps/allainces. tbh wont effect me, but it woudl be nice to see these groups not being punished for being small. 2. any addition structures to shoot is a bad idea. need to be moving away from shooting stuff that dosnt shoot back, its boring and mind numbing 3. ive done pi. teh first and the 2nd incarnation. and its mind numbing, its dull and its far from the vision that impressed everyone back when it was shown, look it up, population pollution all kinds of cool things, making skill books were even talked about. 4. you are in a pet alliance, didnt you get that memo? CCP-áare full of words and no action. We watch what they do and its nothing but false statements and lies.
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Zoe Alarhun
The Proactive Reappropriation Corporation
29
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Posted - 2011.10.18 21:23:00 -
[574] - Quote
I like the changes. Become friends with local pirate corp. They don't blow you up and escort you if needed. You do PI in low sec and get out. A small fee per month covers that expense. New friends, New interaction and maby even some hair raising last minute runs out as your pirate friends jam/destroy aggressors while you get your squishy indi ship out.
I like. |
Chicken Pizza
Penumbra Institute Inver Brass
2
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Posted - 2011.10.18 21:23:00 -
[575] - Quote
CCP Nullarbor wrote:Bodega Cat wrote:Can the Offices be named? Oh I know the answer to this one - no you cannot name them (sorry). Also, popping my dev post cherry.
Good, maybe you can answer some of the more important questions and concerns CCP Omen blatantly ignored. Forgive me if I missed a response of his in this garbage can of posts. Reading through 550 comments is almost as much of a clickin' chore as PI itself, considering roughly 70% of them are useless responses and +1's. Sorry if I seem overly blunt about it, but I'm a tad irritated by this proposed change and the fact that it's "ready to go" despite the fact that we haven't heard jack about it until now. This is not a change you bring up after already developing it to the point of "ready to go".
My 3 biggest questions/concerns at the moment:
1. How will GCC work with this new structure? Defending it will be difficult. Someone brought up earlier that once the POCO comes out of reinforced, the attacking fleet will now be neutral to the defending fleet, putting the defenders at a disadvantage. CCP Omen said that you could potentially place one near a station(considering some stations are well within 100,000 km away from a planet). Now we have to consider station guns coming into play. Is there anything being done about this? Or is that going to be chalked up as "working as intended"? I'm fairly certain this wasn't addressed, so there needs to be some sort of minimum distance from stations so that sentries don't enter the equation.
2. We need bigger launch cans. A 500m3 launch is hardly compensation for possible tax hikes that can potentially kill the income of the "smaller guy". Believe it or not, the little guys make up a hefty amount of the PI goods supplied to the market. Some of these lone wolves manage over 30 planets at a time.
3. As far as I've seen, there is nothing being done to balance out the risk/reward factor here. The risk and cost of indulging in this new system for the smaller corporations and single players has only increased, and the only counterbalance is that we have bigger links. That's great, except bigger links only compensate the idiots who don't know how to properly set up their planets. We need more output from low security systems. The price of robotics has already doubled! There are inevitably going to be less people doing PI in low sec. They will either cease doing PI or move it to high sec. We need more incentive to continue PI in low sec, or we are going to see a sharp decrease in low sec PI return. Believe it or not, that's where a vast amount of PI on the market comes from. |
Liquidus Lamnia
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2011.10.18 21:25:00 -
[576] - Quote
The proposed change lacks economic incentive, corporate-level functionality, and managibile defenses
1) As others have pointed out, the ROI for the station cost is dismal. It will not be installed for the tax income alone.
- 0.0 Sec Corporations will not allow others to use the PCO
- Wormhole Corporations will not allow others to use the PCO
2) Enable Corporate Hangers in the PCO, this would allow for the exchange of PI between characters remotely without moving it from the PCO
- This would reduce the number of Planets needing PCOs
- The PCO owning corp would reduce tax to 0% therefore saving 5% over current taxes or more if tax is raised at NPC COs
3) Do not remove the existing NPC COs
- Increase the taxes charged by NPC COs in LS/0.0/w-space to 500% or more
- Allow them to be attacked except in HS, giving them less HP than a CPO
- Increase the capacity of the Command Center planetary ejection system to enable tax evasion.
4) Using FW and Incursion LP for BPC purchase prevents characters with less than 18 months of experience from earning them (ability to fly Macherial/Nightmare/High-End BS), provide another market.
5) As previously requested, implement the ability to access courier contracted items from a PCO, this will enable low-sec PI
6) The HP as stated is good, but the ability to mount ECM/Batteries must be included as well.
7) Currently only the following are used in other products: (P2)
- Transmitter
- Synthetic Oil
- Superconductor
- Rocket Fuel
- Miniature Electronics
- Mechanical Parts
- Coolant
- Consumer Electronics
- Construction Blocks
- Enriched Uranium
(P3)
- Guidance Systems
- Robotics
All the other P2/P3/P4 products need to be used in non-POS recipes to justify/balance PI. This needs to be addressed to increase demand and justify PCO defense risk.
8) Clarify Low-Sec requirements for attacking PCOs, is a war dec needed to avoid GCC?
For PCOs to succeed, DO NOT IMPLEMENT WITHOUT items 2, 3, and 6 |
Deviana Sevidon
Jades Falcon Guards
53
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Posted - 2011.10.18 21:26:00 -
[577] - Quote
I hope everyone likes these changes also likes flying T1. Because T2 and T3 will become a lot more expensive. |
Pat Irvam
15 Minute Outliers Chained Reactions
7
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Posted - 2011.10.18 21:27:00 -
[578] - Quote
Zoe Alarhun wrote:I like the changes. Become friends with local pirate corp. They don't blow you up and escort you if needed. You do PI in low sec and get out. A small fee per month covers that expense. New friends, New interaction and maby even some hair raising last minute runs out as your pirate friends jam/destroy aggressors while you get your squishy indi ship out.
I like.
lol
why do you think pirate corps are only interested in money. Half the time I dont even bother looting what I kill and have to fight the urge to blow up corp mates haulers. |
Iosue
Black Sky Hipsters
11
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Posted - 2011.10.18 21:28:00 -
[579] - Quote
so these custom offices will be fairly easy prey to anyone that wants to knock one down. i think someone mentioned it would take a harbinger a little over 4 hours to reinforce one solo. not sure it that is correct, but based on my rough calculation at 500 dps, that sounds right.
why not allow customs offices to function more like outposts? have construction occur once, then any subsequent takeover activity will transfer control of the office but not destroy the structure. that way the initial investment doesn't go out the window every time someone wants to take it over. and those on the planet could still use the office even if they didn't control it anymore.
having to replace the office every time it is contested will be extremely costly given the slow payback on the initial capital investment. |
Smoking Blunts
Zebra Corp BricK sQuAD.
105
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Posted - 2011.10.18 21:28:00 -
[580] - Quote
Deviana Sevidon wrote:I hope everyone likes these changes also likes flying T1. Because T2 and T3 will become a lot more expensive.
wont effect the big alliances, there moon goo will keep flowing and fund full replacment funds. only the little guy ccp loves so much will be effected CCP-áare full of words and no action. We watch what they do and its nothing but false statements and lies.
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Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
49
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Posted - 2011.10.18 21:28:00 -
[581] - Quote
Chicken Pizza wrote:Ranger 1 wrote:Handsome ******* wrote:Dominus Alterai wrote:Holy One wrote:I guess I'll just go do incursions like everyone else. Same here. I think i'll join the mass exodus from PI and start doing incursions instead. 3 more PI alts up for sale.... Confirming that my hauling/PI alt is already training for a Tengu. I did not have time to read the entire thread, can someone bring me up to speed on why people would rather waste their PI characters on another profession instead of: 1: Continuing to do PI in Empire Space, just as they always have. Granted, the fee for import/export will be 10% instead of 5% now. 2: Use the CO someone else has put up if it is in low or null sec, assuming the taxes aren't too high. 3: If those taxes are too high, or you are not allowed access, simply use the launchpad as you always could. 4: If there is no CO in place, form a small PI corp for the purposes of putting up your own CO. You may even earn extra income from the taxing of other people using those planets. Did I miss something meaningful? Or are people just throwing up their hands because they don't understand or didn't read the blog correctly? 1. I don't know why so many people think high sec PI is going to be very fruitful with a doubled tax. I blame CCP sympathizers. They don't actually know how economies work and just act like yes-men for CCP. High sec PI is already a fairly crappy chore for very little output, and continuing PI in high sec will remain an only slightly fruitful task. 2. The taxes WILL be too high. Such is the nature of any large corporation/alliance; put as much pressure on a niche as possible to exploit the market in your favor. Goonswarm is trying to do that with ice belts as we speak. Now, instead of just ice belt ganking, we're going to see a lot of POCO's we can't access or get taxed heavily on because the major alliances are going to hog them up so they can manipulate the PI market to their benefit. 3. You must be crazy to think a 500m3 launch is going to solve this problem. If they made it a 5000m3 launch, I could maybe understand. But 500? No, I'm just going to ditch my PI and find some other way to make my ISK. 4. What small PI corp is going to be able to maintain and defend that POCO? When a larger corporation decides they want the moon your small corp's POS is sitting at, what happens to that POS? It gets destroyed. The same will happen to your POCO. All you will have accomplished is wasting time, ISK, and materials to get it up and running. What incentive would people have to use your POCO when they can either hire a mercenary to blast it to bits for probably a pretty cheap fee, or just blow it up themselves? A small corp, PI or otherwise, is typically going to run during one or two time zones. It won't last very long. You missed a lot of meaningful things said in this thread. But most of them are from the people who oppose this being implemented. All I have seen so far from the people who like this idea(I've read at least 200 posts) is a bunch of bull about how people are going to work together, or how alliances and corporations will be reasonable with the taxes and standings, just a bunch of unrealistic bull****. This is EvE. If they aren't being paid, you aren't getting laid.
Fortunately, the same ill informed opinions are being regurgetated and shot down repeatedly, so I am up to speed now thanks.
1: I am well aware of the profitability of high, low, and null sec PI and have worked it to various degree's in all three environments for some time now. If you can't make a decent return on the minute amount of time necessary to maintain a PI chain, even in high sec, you are doing it wrong. It's about as close to being "passive income" as it gets, and with the ability to set taxes on planets that others will be using it gets closer still.
2: You will always run into players that value tears over good business sense. The opposite is also true. Just as null sec alliances rent space to those less powerful than themselves for a profit, so too will people set up PCO's that have reasonable tax rates for people to use. People that do not have the ISK or the desire to defend them if necessary. You can set up as many PCO's as you like, use some of them to enhance your own PI profit margin, and gain passive revenue from the rest.
3: Ninja PI teams use launches all of the time in dangerous space. Granted, CCP should probably look at increasing the payload.
4: As long as your taxes aren't out of line, why would most people care to go to the trouble. There are huge numbers of players that are not in a corp, or are in small corps that would love to use someone's PCO without risk, the hassel, or outlandish fee's. Sure, a larger corp could blow it up, but you risk that with anything in EVE. You DO realize just how many 10's of thousands of planets there are in EVE right?
So yeah, I didn't miss much. Just a lot of fear mongering, far fetched what if's about large alliances spending huge amounts of time policing 10's of thousands of planets to ensure a very modest return , and a lot of opinions from people who either didin't read or didin't understand the dev blog... or no nothing about PI or the EVE economy yet feel the need to voice an opinion.
This is EvE. If they aren't being paid, you aren't getting laid... and it's more profitable to keep your ho's working hard and take your percentage than it is to blow up the cat house. To kill the enemy and break their toys!
It's not so much a mission statement,-áit's more like a family motto. |
Demon View
24th Imperial Crusade Amarr Empire
1
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Posted - 2011.10.18 21:31:00 -
[582] - Quote
1. This would be less of a nerf to 'ninja PI' if you could crash materials onto the planet to be eventually collected by the CC, the reverse of the CC's launches. Maybe with a constructible 'planetary drop' container?
2. All the people worrying about long-run bad consequences from this change, remember that PI is special: PI is the feature where CCP said "hey, let's have this team stick around and keep improving this". And this isn't the first major update to PI since it was released. So if badness comes to pass wrt. PI, we can actually expect a fix sooner than two years from now. |
Adunh Slavy
Ammatar Trade Syndicate
32
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Posted - 2011.10.18 21:32:00 -
[583] - Quote
CCP Omen wrote:Starr Tookus wrote:So this makes setting up your planets for launches important in case jerks run the customs office. I like that.
Question: What kinds of defenses can be installed? Currently: Nothing. You will have to defend your customs office with space ships, (beside the reinforcement). From comments to the blog, we realize there is a worry that all customs offices will be griefed all the time. I promise we will keep an eye on this, but our hope is that a new type of players/corporations can emerge that are paid to protect customs office etc.
Time to revisit the viceroy idea perhaps |
Lolmer
Merciless Reckoning
1
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Posted - 2011.10.18 21:36:00 -
[584] - Quote
Also, can you see what the tax rate is of the Customs Office for each planet before you take your Command Center out there to deploy? I'd hate to get everything ready to go, only to show up and find the tax rate is high, or even worse, build my CC, design my routes, and then find the tax rate to be high when I go to take my PI out, or yet even worse unable to do so because I do not have access to the CO.
The more I think about it, the more I do not like the idea of denying access to a public property (planet, owned by CONCORD in all but null-sec and w-space). Change the access rights based on standing to a tax rate based on standing and all's good. I'll still be able to get stuff out of any planet, but will just have to pay an exorbitant amount of ISK to get it out, especially if the owner changes hands to someone who really doesn't like me. |
Blue Harrier
12
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Posted - 2011.10.18 21:36:00 -
[585] - Quote
Umm can I ask a small question here?
I can see how all this works/not works (depends on your point of view) in Empire, Low Sec and 0.0 but how will this work in NPC 0.0, you know like, Syndicate, Outer Ring etc?
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Frakir Shedimuthgur
Vacation Spot
0
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Posted - 2011.10.18 21:37:00 -
[586] - Quote
Sooo... let me see if I get it: No one can have Sov in a WH. However, you can now block (or at lest severely restrict) access to the planets in a WH using structures... HMMM. Also, give big alliances another easy way to make money... HMMM. I can see absolutely no way those changes will backfire massively, none at all, no sir. |
Havegun Willtravel
Mobile Alcohol Processing Units
0
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Posted - 2011.10.18 21:38:00 -
[587] - Quote
reserved |
Deviana Sevidon
Jades Falcon Guards
53
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Posted - 2011.10.18 21:44:00 -
[588] - Quote
Frakir Shedimuthgur wrote:Sooo... let me see if I get it: No one can have Sov in a WH. However, you can now block (or at lest severely restrict) access to the planets in a WH using structures... HMMM. Also, give big alliances another easy way to make money... HMMM. I can see absolutely no way those changes will backfire massively, none at all, no sir.
Reminds me on POS-alchemy, anyone remember that failure? Only when this goes down, a good part of the eve economy will also fail. |
Demon View
24th Imperial Crusade Amarr Empire
1
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Posted - 2011.10.18 21:44:00 -
[589] - Quote
Liquidus Lamnia wrote:4) Using FW and Incursion LP for BPC purchase prevents characters with less than 18 months of experience from earning them (ability to fly Macherial/Nightmare/High-End BS),
Uh, no. They're 3000 LP for FW. I can make more than that with one trip in a T1 frig doing L1 militia missions. |
Firanas Erin
ROC Deep Space
0
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Posted - 2011.10.18 21:45:00 -
[590] - Quote
CCP Omen wrote: but our hope is that a new type of players/corporations can emerge that are paid to protect customs office etc.
Those already exist, they are called pirate corporations... You know, like the ******-swarm "protecting" people who mine ice... |
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Memoocan
Adhocracy Incorporated Adhocracy
3
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Posted - 2011.10.18 21:45:00 -
[591] - Quote
Omen...nobody in Wspace will operate for neutrals. The idea that people won't shoot PI runners same as before in hopes of some tiny profit is naive
Frakir Shedimuthgur wrote:Sooo... let me see if I get it: No one can have Sov in a WH. However, you can now block (or at lest severely restrict) access to the planets in a WH using structures... HMMM. Also, give big alliances another easy way to make money... HMMM. I can see absolutely no way those changes will backfire massively, none at all, no sir.
lawl this makes it better in wspace. Now it's free so idk what you're whining about. Before this, you can still "severely restrict" access by sticking a CC down and nuking all the resources on the planet if you want. Or you can gank the hauler. Or any number of other things.
Wspace is lawless so thinking you will have full access to any system you come across is a bit ignorant |
5hadow 1
The Shadow's Of Eve TSOE Consortium
0
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Posted - 2011.10.18 21:47:00 -
[592] - Quote
Adunh Slavy wrote:CCP Omen wrote:Starr Tookus wrote:So this makes setting up your planets for launches important in case jerks run the customs office. I like that.
Question: What kinds of defenses can be installed? Currently: Nothing. You will have to defend your customs office with space ships, (beside the reinforcement). From comments to the blog, we realize there is a worry that all customs offices will be griefed all the time. I promise we will keep an eye on this, but our hope is that a new type of players/corporations can emerge that are paid to protect customs office etc. Time to revisit the viceroy idea perhaps
hahahahahahahahaahahhaahhahaha- OMG - CCP hope is that a new type of players/corporations can emerge that are paid to protect customs office etc.
Really? You are a Wolf in a Sheep Skin. You say you want to help industry players. You say you wanted PI to be helpful to all. PI is just fine as it is. Adding just a base tax that cant be modified to help SOV owners is good.
But we hold SOV. A big Blob Alliace now doesn't have to take SOV, they just have to pimp smaller SOV holders. Just Come in our system and blow up our Customs Office. Red Blob puts up there own and put a tax of 50 to 100 percent. If we attack it they will just blob us up if we touch it. Please get your head out your Locker CCP Omen. By this comment you have never been on the recieving side of a NCDot / Raiden Super Cap Blob. Please wake up mate. |
Trespasser
Isotope Incorporated Exiled Collective
0
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Posted - 2011.10.18 21:49:00 -
[593] - Quote
Of all the things that need to be done to PI this is not it.
Leave High sec and wormholes alone and make customs offices become taxable to the alliance that owns the system.
But before all of that, how about we get the option to select all our factory's at once and set them?
why dont we have drop down box for the link upgrade we want?
Why is there a session timer on PI?
Pos fuel is already high, this will only make it even more so as most small and medium sized gangs will just cruise around blowing them up
Leave it be and make PI on the planet less ******** |
Xintri Ra'Virr
Six Kin Mining and Development Group
1
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Posted - 2011.10.18 21:52:00 -
[594] - Quote
someone wrote:
1. I don't know why so many people think high sec PI is going to be very fruitful with a doubled tax. I blame CCP sympathizers. They don't actually know how economies work and just act like yes-men for CCP. High sec PI is already a fairly crappy chore for very little output, and continuing PI in high sec will remain an only slightly fruitful task.
2. The taxes WILL be too high. Such is the nature of any large corporation/alliance; put as much pressure on a niche as possible to exploit the market in your favor. Goonswarm is trying to do that with ice belts as we speak. Now, instead of just ice belt ganking, we're going to see a lot of POCO's we can't access or get taxed heavily on because the major alliances are going to hog them up so they can manipulate the PI market to their benefit.
3. You must be crazy to think a 500m3 launch is going to solve this problem. If they made it a 5000m3 launch, I could maybe understand. But 500? No, I'm just going to ditch my PI and find some other way to make my ISK.
4. What small PI corp is going to be able to maintain and defend that POCO? When a larger corporation decides they want the moon your small corp's POS is sitting at, what happens to that POS? It gets destroyed. The same will happen to your POCO. All you will have accomplished is wasting time, ISK, and materials to get it up and running. What incentive would people have to use your POCO when they can either hire a mercenary to blast it to bits for probably a pretty cheap fee, or just blow it up themselves? A small corp, PI or otherwise, is typically going to run during one or two time zones. It won't last very long.
You missed a lot of meaningful things said in this thread. But most of them are from the people who oppose this being implemented. All I have seen so far from the people who like this idea(I've read at least 200 posts) is a bunch of bull about how people are going to work together, or how alliances and corporations will be reasonable with the taxes and standings, just a bunch of unrealistic bull****.
This is EvE. If they aren't being paid, you aren't getting laid.
1. Some planets in low have 80% richness in specific mineral. You will never find that in hi. 2. 100% tax will scare off any competitor. Tax is calculated from item units. Low Tier PI will kill you. 3. I't takes 23 hours to make 5000-8000m3 of Tier 2 products in lowsec. 4. Yup you are propably right. |
Inappropriate Euphemism
Probability Directive
0
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Posted - 2011.10.18 21:53:00 -
[595] - Quote
I am typically a big fan of changes that increase player interaction and risk. I like the idea of where this change is going. I don't profess to know with certainty the results of the change, but I think that my own PI will be drastically and negatively affected.
I primarily produce P2 products, though I do have one planet producing P3 products. I do PI in low-sec where there aren't a lot of other residents. I expect that if I don't put up a customs office of my own, none will exist. While I have the capability to do this, it's a fairly big investment for the risk I'm undertaking. I live near null-sec and there are a few big alliances nearby; at least one is a very notable alliance with a large supercap fleet and reputation for using them for everything except sov warfare. Never underestimate the will of players to do something just to ruin another player's day -- especially if that player is a combat pilot and the other player is an industrialist or a "carebear".
I don't think the planets I use are housing facilities for any other players; I used the "see structures from other players" feature to see who else might be there, and no new structures appear -- but I kind of figured it was just broken. So there is really very little benefit to offset the risk as nobody will be paying me anything.
I can't find enough information on rocket launches to know if it's a viable alternative -- I see lots of references to a small capacity which suggests to me it's not.
Low-sec has always been a good place for small groups of industrialists who are good at evading criminals. It's been the half-way house between high-sec safety and null-sec politics. There are no warp disruption bubbles. There are gate guns and global criminal countdown timers. There are NPC stations. This change kind of drops low-sec PI into the deep end of risk with null-sec without offering any additional reward -- null-sec planets are better than low-sec planets.
I've seen it suggested in the thread already, but why couldn't CONCORD sponsor the low-sec customs offices (or perhaps the NPC faction which holds sovereignty in that space) with the same tax rate as high-sec until a player comes along to take over and build a customs office? Barring that, at least make rocket launches competitive with customs offices in high-sec in capability and rates. |
gfldex
9
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Posted - 2011.10.18 21:54:00 -
[596] - Quote
VaMei wrote:With the BPC only comming from the FW & Concord LP stores, we're going to need some serious time to get the supply chain filled with enough units to meet the early demand.
I have 700kLP with concord right now. Have me a mail, I can set you up.
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Leocadminone
Gem Concordance
0
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Posted - 2011.10.18 21:58:00 -
[597] - Quote
Where is the justification for DOUBLE the damned taxes on Concord-run custom offices? Failing to see how that does anything but SHAFT folks that run PI and those that make stuff out of PI-made items and those that USE such items. PI return on time investment in highsec it ALREADY poor-to-marginal, why do you want to make it even worse?
Blueprint copy availability is WAY to damned restrictive. ANY NPC CORP should have them available in their LP store.
Oooo, space increase - like how do you manage to have to worry about running out of space in a customs office when your launchpad can only store 10K m3 max? THAT chance is no benefit at all and makes ZERO sense to even claim to be a benefit.
With the "you can kill them now" factor what idiot would LEAVE anything in one more than a few seconds while unloading stuff from / loading stuff to a planet?
This seems to be "YET ANOTHER NOT THOUGHT OUT" concept from CCP that just screws players for NO benefit.
I am now VERY happy I've been working my way OUT of doing PI due to the already poor ratio of "time investment vs. profit".
As far as that "minute amount of time" comment - you still have to go COLLECT the stuff and get it sold. The time investment is NOT minute, though I grant it's small - but the profits also are small. You also are failing to take the time investment of FINDING and SETUP for even a "marginal" planet to do PI on into account.
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Frakir Shedimuthgur
Vacation Spot
2
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Posted - 2011.10.18 22:01:00 -
[598] - Quote
Memoocan wrote:Omen...nobody in Wspace will operate for neutrals. I dare say no one will operate for neutrals... period
Memoocan wrote:Before this, you can still "severely restrict" access by sticking a CC down and nuking all the resources on the planet if you want. Or you can gank the hauler. Or any number of other things. All of which require active involvement. planting a CC and nuking resources is both time consuming and requires some money to do. Catching the hauler mean you have to be online to do it.
POCO is just a fire and forget type of thing. |
Agente
Milking Interstellar Incorporated.
0
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Posted - 2011.10.18 22:03:00 -
[599] - Quote
For the ones that are worried about the taxes, with the prices that we have today, a 100% tax is around 1% of the product value, so tahts not going to be a problem.
Access to the PCO and return of the investment in the PCO will be the problem. |
gfldex
9
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Posted - 2011.10.18 22:05:00 -
[600] - Quote
Andrea Griffin wrote:The problem with a HP-only target is that you can drop a bob on the CO, reinforce it in 5 minutes, and move on. Plus, the HP is large enough to discourage small gang activity.
It's basically a large POS without any hardeners. Have 5 dreads for 5 minutes and the job is done. What exactly do you want to have a blob for?
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