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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 37 post(s) |
Turelus
Caldari Independent Navy Reserve The Fourth District
757
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:31:00 -
[181] - Quote
Marlona Sky wrote:Literally 95% of the naysayers in this thread so far are Goonswarm Federation. So here is a message for you guys, maybe you missed it.
You do not have to use the ESS if you do not want to.
mind = blown Well I am not Goonswarm and as it is now it's most likely not going to deployed by Providence Sov holders. However if I am correct in reading anyone can drop one of these so even if the Sov Holder doesn't want to ruin the system for their line members any roaming red can do so instead, it's a interesting "fight creation" tool but the blog is selling it more as a "look at this great new upgrade for your space!" which it really isn't. Lieutenant Turelus
Caldari Independent Navy Reserve
The Fourth District |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation Goonswarm Federation
8331
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:31:00 -
[182] - Quote
Marlona Sky wrote:Literally 95% of the naysayers in this thread so far are Goonswarm Federation. I guess that means we're smarter than you. My EVE Videos |
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed Agony Empire
3350
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:31:00 -
[183] - Quote
Others have brought up several valid concerns:
1.) Response Times: I love giving roaming gangs the opportunity to mess with ratters that don't defend their space. On one level, that is exactly what this does. Unfortunately, it doesn't give the locals enough time to actually form up a response to the incoming fleet. 20 seconds access time is frankly, way, way, way to short. Hell, 75% of ships in the game couldn't warp on grid before the ESS is accessed. Furthermore, once it is accessed and the take all feature is implemented, the ESS is reset to no longer give its full reward. Next, the locals get an extra 40s to respond before the ESS dumps the isk-tags. To be quite frank, that's 60-90s to respond to a hostile interceptor entering the system, warping straight to the ESS beacon, and snagging the bounty payouts. If you have someone in combat fit dessie/frig ready to go, you can respond timely, but in most circumstances a pilot has to warp to a POS/station, swap ships, and then get to the ESS to defend it, and 90 seconds is no where near enough time to respond. To be quite frank, the "access time" needs to be increased to the point that the locals can form up and defend it. If they don't have time to defend it, the risks for using it will completely negate the rewards for using it. This MUST be addressed. I would recommend 3-5 minutes to access the item, and another 3-5 minutes before the isk-tag drops. This way the locals have time to form up and defend it, and perhaps battle for the loot.
2.) Risk vs Reward: The new baseline is 95% of the bounties on the rats. Your risk (immediate loss) if you deploy one of these: 15.7% of your new income level. Your reward if you keep it online: 10.5%. To put this in terms, you give me $15 dollars now, and I will attempt to give you back $25 dollars later if everything works out. The primary issue is, these are very risky in their current form, meaning the reward may not be high enough to bother with the hassle. Fruthermore, when scamming other players, isn't the norm to double the money. Meaning it should pay out 110% at the minimum.
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Antisun
Pervicax Socium
2
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Posted - 2014.01.14 17:32:00 -
[184] - Quote
Marlona Sky wrote:[quote=Antisun][quote=Steve Ronuken] ....
Regardless, having a guy setup to murder interceptors chill at the ESS while his buddies rat seems like a good idea.
A quick Lachesis with a friendly ESS anchored under the guns of a POS will kill many an interceptor. |
Proletariat Tingtango
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
806
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:33:00 -
[185] - Quote
Marlona Sky with her ever so 'uselful' insight and weird hate-boner for goons typing a bunch of words while saying absolutely nothing, yet maintaining an air of bitterness that's almost admirable. |
BoomBoss
Grim Determination Nulli Secunda
4
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:33:00 -
[186] - Quote
CCP SoniClover wrote:Qoi wrote:Where will you be able to convert ISK tags into ISK? The empire fleets stations (Federation Navy stations, etc.).
So let me get this straight. You want us to move all the way to empire to get our ISK? We, the 0.0 players that try to avoid that place at all cost. Going to empire with only like a few mil is just not worth it. Going there with a bil calls for a gank.
So, not only is there a huge risk in getting the tags stolen, but also being blown up while going to highsec. Seriously? At least make the tages rightclickale so they can be funded to the wallet from any station. Not just empire stations. That is just stupid.
risk vs reward... but this goes way too far. |
Zeppo Miromme
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:33:00 -
[187] - Quote
While everybody talk about bounties and pirates, please note that cash (money that can be physically moved around and exchanged) has been introduced, in four new currencies. |
Hatsumi Kobayashi
Origin. Black Legion.
342
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:33:00 -
[188] - Quote
Marlona Sky wrote:Literally 95% of the naysayers in this thread so far are Goonswarm Federation. So here is a message for you guys, maybe you missed it.
You do not have to use the ESS if you do not want to.
mind = blown
I thought you had more sense than this, but I guess I've been overestimating you. No sig. |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
5318
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:34:00 -
[189] - Quote
Innominate wrote:Longdrinks wrote:Looking forward to these as a way to maybe force a fight from bears who usually dock up untill i leave system. What makes you think that will happen? They won't anchor them because the ESS helps you more than it helps them. If you anchor one they'll still stay docked up until you leave, then blow up the ESS and go back to ratting. If they are truly pathetic, they won't defend their ESS, this is true. Sad, considering how easy it would be, but true.
However if you drop one and leave, you'll be notified the moment they get in it's area. Since they are unlikely to blow it up with a few interceptors they'll have to bring something bigger... in a bubble.... to a spot you can warp to directly.
To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
Rekkr Nordgard
The Ardency of Faith
260
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:35:00 -
[190] - Quote
Fix POSes? Nope. Fix Sov? Nope. Fix TiDi? Nope. Fix Corp roles? Nope. Iterate on FW? Nope. Rework PvE? Nope.
Nerfing nullsec income to make it even more empty and less desirable? YES, now THAT'S the important thing CCP needs to be spending its time and resources on. |
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Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
5318
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:35:00 -
[191] - Quote
Hatsumi Kobayashi wrote:Marlona Sky wrote:Literally 95% of the naysayers in this thread so far are Goonswarm Federation. So here is a message for you guys, maybe you missed it.
You do not have to use the ESS if you do not want to.
mind = blown I thought you had more sense than this, but I guess I've been overestimating you. You might note that the more intelligent goons have suddenly stopped complaining about them.
There's a reason for that. To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
greiton starfire
Eternity INC. Goonswarm Federation
37
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:36:00 -
[192] - Quote
Anariasis wrote:Really looking forward to the ESS. Everytime we get a new WH into a system with ratters there's either the option to go stealing or setup an own one - and maybe get a fight. I don't get the problems people seem to have with interceptors setting up the ESS or stealing from them. Let me address a few of the possible situations.
- If CCP wants to avoid interceptors deploying the units, just make them too big for their cargo. They all got <100m-¦ of space, which of course can be boosted quite a bit (373m-¦ max I guess) but yeah, then the interceptor has lost quite some fighting capabilities.
- If an single enemy enters the system and drops an ESS, you can do what you do now anyway: stop ratting until he's gone. Or get intel what he's flying (shouldn't be too hard, you have intel channels, scanners, a POS/station to exchange ships), get in a proper pvp ship and blast his ESS. Minus 30 million for him. Done.
- If an enemy fleet drops an ESS in your system, do what you do now anyway. Stop ratting. Destroy the thing when they are gone. Or get some friends and defend your space!
- Single enemy in an interceptor tries to steal the tags. Well, from the moment he enters system you got approx. a minute to get to the ESS. If you didn't place the ESS stupidly close to the gate where he enters but close to your POS (as close as CCP allows), you will most likely make it. And then it's you in a sensor boosted anti-frig ship vs. an interceptor. Both waiting for a can to spawn to which the inty most likely needs to burn first... Did I mention you shouldn't rat alone in system. It might be even you and a few corpmates vs the inty trying to steal
- Enemy fleet enters your ratting system and empties your ESS. Your intel has messed up, you deserve the loss.
- WH spawns into your system with active people behind. You really want to have an ESS deployed then already, or one just might pop up at the WH and you won't have fun finding out what else lurks behind it ;)
There's s.th. seriously wrong with risk vs reward in ratting though. The ISK/h should be 0.0 Ratting >>> FW > HS Incursions. Edit: Forgot something. If you rat all day together with your corp/allymates and then one of them warps to it and presses the button to keep all the money for himself... then maybe you should change corp. Or maybe get him kicked before he can move all his belongings out of your 0.0 staging...
no people arn't complaining about ninja dropping them, we are saying no group will use it for themselves as it is susceptible to inties. as for ninja droping them ratters would react like they do when a hostile force drops in... just dock up. once you leave they will blow it up together and go on ratting.
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Proletariat Tingtango
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
809
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:37:00 -
[193] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:Hatsumi Kobayashi wrote:Marlona Sky wrote:Literally 95% of the naysayers in this thread so far are Goonswarm Federation. So here is a message for you guys, maybe you missed it.
You do not have to use the ESS if you do not want to.
mind = blown I thought you had more sense than this, but I guess I've been overestimating you. You might note that the more intelligent goons have suddenly stopped complaining about them. There's a reason for that.
A smarter man might still notice that ratter income is taking a hit for exactly zero reason because CCP wants to introduce a conflict-creating module that won't get used, so the net effect being that people who shoot red crosses to finance their pvp, get to pvp less.
This is moronic. No, they won't be deployed. Yes, this is still comletely asinine. Stop pretending otherwise. |
l0rd carlos
Friends Of Harassment
844
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:38:00 -
[194] - Quote
BoomBoss wrote:CCP SoniClover wrote:Qoi wrote:Where will you be able to convert ISK tags into ISK? The empire fleets stations (Federation Navy stations, etc.). So let me get this straight. You want us to move all the way to empire to get our ISK? We, the 0.0 players that try to avoid that place at all cost. Going to empire with only like a few mil is just not worth it. Going there with a bil calls for a gank. So, not only is there a huge risk in getting the tags stolen, but also being blown up while going to highsec. Seriously? At least make the tages rightclickale so they can be funded to the wallet from any station. Not just empire stations. That is just stupid. risk vs reward... but this goes way too far. Press the share button and recive ISK, press the I WANT EVERYTHING button (Like a thief would do it) and get the tags. German blog about smallscale lowsec pvp: http://friendsofharassment.wordpress.com |
Ravcharas
Infinite Point Nulli Secunda
269
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:38:00 -
[195] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote: However if you drop one and leave, you'll be notified the moment they get in it's area. Since they are unlikely to blow it up with a few interceptors they'll have to bring something bigger... in a bubble.... to a spot you can warp to directly.
Three dudes in torpbombers knocks one down in a minute and a half |
ckinoutdahoe
Void.Tech Get Off My Lawn
1
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:39:00 -
[196] - Quote
This is the biggest waste of code I have seen in a while.
Why not do sometthing productive !!!!!
Such as How corp admin works or pos roles.
This is so long over due it is not even funny.
So ya already figured out how to waste code...... make it for for the empire and null sec too.
I will be more than happy to fly an interceptor into the bubble and steal isk.
That is what it is all about right.
What is good for the goose is good for the gander so to speak.
Let all sectors feel the pain you are willing to inflict in null space.
For so long you have tried to get people into null space and now you want to do the reverse.
All I can see in the future is more pain for empire space since it is more fun to kill everyone no matter where hostiles/nuets hide.
For that matter; it dont matter what so ever.
If you have a big wallet and many of us old members have; we can now buy our way back to positive sec statis.
So waste you time on Important stuff.
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James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation Goonswarm Federation
8333
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:39:00 -
[197] - Quote
Rekkr Nordgard wrote:Fix POSes? Nope. Fix Sov? Nope. Fix TiDi? Nope. Fix Corp roles? Nope. Iterate on FW? Nope. Rework PvE? Nope.
Nerfing nullsec income to make it even more empty and less desirable? YES, now THAT'S the important thing CCP needs to be spending its time and resources on. It's no wonder CCP says they don't have time to work on those other things when they keep putting out ******** token **** like this.
If they spent their time working on things that need to be fixed rather than adding stupid new mechanics that make no sense and which ultimately hurt the game we'd all be much better off. My EVE Videos |
Snowflake Tem
The Order of Symbolic Measures
101
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:40:00 -
[198] - Quote
I see some interesting possibilities for using these as checkpoints for sensitive transactions. Looking forward to having a play to see how far they can be perverted. |
Saab Kado
0.0-TAX
10
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:45:00 -
[199] - Quote
TL, DR
Nullsec ratting income is nerfed by 5%
Period. |
Anariasis
Boris Johnson's Love Children
34
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:45:00 -
[200] - Quote
greiton starfire wrote:Anariasis wrote:Really looking forward to the ESS. Everytime we get a new WH into a system with ratters there's either the option to go stealing or setup an own one - and maybe get a fight. I don't get the problems people seem to have with interceptors setting up the ESS or stealing from them. Let me address a few of the possible situations.
- If CCP wants to avoid interceptors deploying the units, just make them too big for their cargo. They all got <100m-¦ of space, which of course can be boosted quite a bit (373m-¦ max I guess) but yeah, then the interceptor has lost quite some fighting capabilities.
- If an single enemy enters the system and drops an ESS, you can do what you do now anyway: stop ratting until he's gone. Or get intel what he's flying (shouldn't be too hard, you have intel channels, scanners, a POS/station to exchange ships), get in a proper pvp ship and blast his ESS. Minus 30 million for him. Done.
- If an enemy fleet drops an ESS in your system, do what you do now anyway. Stop ratting. Destroy the thing when they are gone. Or get some friends and defend your space!
- Single enemy in an interceptor tries to steal the tags. Well, from the moment he enters system you got approx. a minute to get to the ESS. If you didn't place the ESS stupidly close to the gate where he enters but close to your POS (as close as CCP allows), you will most likely make it. And then it's you in a sensor boosted anti-frig ship vs. an interceptor. Both waiting for a can to spawn to which the inty most likely needs to burn first... Did I mention you shouldn't rat alone in system. It might be even you and a few corpmates vs the inty trying to steal
- Enemy fleet enters your ratting system and empties your ESS. Your intel has messed up, you deserve the loss.
- WH spawns into your system with active people behind. You really want to have an ESS deployed then already, or one just might pop up at the WH and you won't have fun finding out what else lurks behind it ;)
There's s.th. seriously wrong with risk vs reward in ratting though. The ISK/h should be 0.0 Ratting >>> FW > HS Incursions. Edit: Forgot something. If you rat all day together with your corp/allymates and then one of them warps to it and presses the button to keep all the money for himself... then maybe you should change corp. Or maybe get him kicked before he can move all his belongings out of your 0.0 staging... no people arn't complaining about ninja dropping them, we are saying no group will use it for themselves as it is susceptible to inties. as for ninja droping them ratters would react like they do when a hostile force drops in... just dock up. once you leave they will blow it up together and go on ratting.
If you would have read my post, you would see that's exactly one of the points I covered. I marked it for your convenience.
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Innominate
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
396
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:45:00 -
[201] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote: However if you drop one and leave, you'll be notified the moment they get in it's area. Since they are unlikely to blow it up with a few interceptors they'll have to bring something bigger... in a bubble.... to a spot you can warp to directly.
The broadcast is made in local. If you leave, you do not get any notification. They also only have battleship level hitpoints, a few interceptors are perfectly capable of blowing it up. Ten long range crows can blow one up in under five minutes. Five close range interceptors can do it in under three minutes. |
Zerb Arus
WormSpaceWormS
98
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:46:00 -
[202] - Quote
ESS + MSI + disco-ship = electric fly-trap
Although I find the Idea great in principle, I personally would not bother with all the hassle for 5-10% benefit.
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greiton starfire
Eternity INC. Goonswarm Federation
39
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:47:00 -
[203] - Quote
My suggestion for making the ess make more sense. only set access to hanger access in corp. so that person can at anytime come and share, take, or donate to corp wallet. as for risk make it so if an enemy fleet comes in and pops it drops all the tags it has in store. give it a 15-30 min structure timer, and alerts like the poss. so a fleet goes in and shoots a bunch of them, turns around fights and victor keeps the spoils. promote more fights, without the emphasis on grinding sov.
this works with the fields and farm nullsec we have been pushed into, promotes rapid response fights, allows for spies and thieves, and puts ratting income at risk. seriously give it a thought. |
Anariasis
Boris Johnson's Love Children
34
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:48:00 -
[204] - Quote
Innominate wrote:Ranger 1 wrote: However if you drop one and leave, you'll be notified the moment they get in it's area. Since they are unlikely to blow it up with a few interceptors they'll have to bring something bigger... in a bubble.... to a spot you can warp to directly.
The broadcast is made in local. If you leave, you do not get any notification. They also only have battleship level hitpoints, a few interceptors are perfectly capable of blowing it up. Ten long range crows can blow one up in under five minutes. Five close range interceptors can do it in under three minutes.
You can also warp there with an interceptor or s.th. cloaky, burn some clicks in any direction (not the one you just came from...), bookmark it... Congrats, you have just created a warp-in for yourself to go to and safely shoot it from outside of the bubble, aligned to warp if the baddies show up. |
Vacant Glare
Ghost Recon Inc
0
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:49:00 -
[205] - Quote
Georgiy Giggle wrote:And DEVs will lose respect from many carebears. Too late.
But don't forget to add the CSM into that statement also. |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
5318
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:49:00 -
[206] - Quote
Proletariat Tingtango wrote:Ranger 1 wrote:Hatsumi Kobayashi wrote:Marlona Sky wrote:Literally 95% of the naysayers in this thread so far are Goonswarm Federation. So here is a message for you guys, maybe you missed it.
You do not have to use the ESS if you do not want to.
mind = blown I thought you had more sense than this, but I guess I've been overestimating you. You might note that the more intelligent goons have suddenly stopped complaining about them. There's a reason for that. A smarter man might still notice that ratter income is taking a hit for exactly zero reason because CCP wants to introduce a conflict-creating module that won't get used, so the net effect being that people who shoot red crosses to finance their pvp, get to pvp less. This is moronic. No, they won't be deployed. Yes, this is still comletely asinine. Stop pretending otherwise. 1: It's taking a hit if you are incredibly bad, yes. 2: Another objective for small gang combat, which is exactly what this is, is hardly "no reason". In fact, that's exactly what we have been asking for. 3: It's quite obviously a double edged sword. You can either be a victim of the mechanic, or you can be smart enough to use it against others. To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
Major Templar
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
49
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:50:00 -
[207] - Quote
greiton starfire wrote:My suggestion for making the ess make more sense. only set access to hanger access in corp. so that person can at anytime come and share, take, or donate to corp wallet. as for risk make it so if an enemy fleet comes in and pops it drops all the tags it has in store. give it a 15-30 min structure timer, and alerts like the poss. so a fleet goes in and shoots a bunch of them, turns around fights and victor keeps the spoils. promote more fights, without the emphasis on grinding sov.
this works with the fields and farm nullsec we have been pushed into, promotes rapid response fights, allows for spies and thieves, and puts ratting income at risk. seriously give it a thought.
HA! No! Another fail idea from the CFC. You want no risk for all the rewards. Nope. |
Snowflake Tem
The Order of Symbolic Measures
101
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:51:00 -
[208] - Quote
just a normal "jet" can you say? So tractors are going to have some pull here. Why not sit at the edge of the bubble with a loot machine or a cheat noctis. That's what they wee made for, right? |
darius mclever
59
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:52:00 -
[209] - Quote
BoomBoss wrote:CCP SoniClover wrote:Qoi wrote:Where will you be able to convert ISK tags into ISK? The empire fleets stations (Federation Navy stations, etc.). So let me get this straight. You want us to move all the way to empire to get our ISK? We, the 0.0 players that try to avoid that place at all cost. Going to empire with only like a few mil is just not worth it. Going there with a bil calls for a gank. So, not only is there a huge risk in getting the tags stolen, but also being blown up while going to highsec. Seriously? At least make the tages rightclickale so they can be funded to the wallet from any station. Not just empire stations. That is just stupid. risk vs reward... but this goes way too far.
there are surely some lowsec stations from each navy ... at least each of their lvl5 agents are in lowsec. |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
5318
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 17:52:00 -
[210] - Quote
Innominate wrote:Ranger 1 wrote: However if you drop one and leave, you'll be notified the moment they get in it's area. Since they are unlikely to blow it up with a few interceptors they'll have to bring something bigger... in a bubble.... to a spot you can warp to directly.
The broadcast is made in local. If you leave, you do not get any notification. They also only have battleship level hitpoints, a few interceptors are perfectly capable of blowing it up. Ten long range crows can blow one up in under five minutes. Five close range interceptors can do it in under three minutes. So you know exactly where these interceptor flying carebears will be for several minutes. Yep, you're right, nothing you can do with that. I'd just give up too.
Of course, your average ratter will just take a ship that can do more damage, but lets ignore that shall we? To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
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