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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 56 post(s) |
Squelch
Imperial Collective Unsettled.
0
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Posted - 2014.04.15 15:32:00 -
[61] - Quote
Soz if this has already been mentioned, but where you say all mention the new R.A.M requirements (in your example, you'll need 60 R.A.M where you needed 1 before), that will effectivley de-value any current stocks of R.A.M by a huge amount (example, 60 times less valuable).
Will existing stocks be multiplied to compensate, or is this something that players with R.A.M stocks will just have to deal with? |
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation Ineluctable.
380
|
Posted - 2014.04.15 15:32:00 -
[62] - Quote
So, and how do we find out how high the current price for the installation of an industry job on a given station is? Hopefully not by moving around in a freighter full with the stuff required for the manufacturing and checking every desired station individually... then again, as I came to know CCP wants more interaction ... Oh god, what have I done. |
probag Bear
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
14
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Posted - 2014.04.15 15:36:00 -
[63] - Quote
Quote:Remove the ability for players to use stations to safely store their blueprints without putting them at risk in Starbase structures. Players will still be able to start their jobs remotely (via the use of Supply Chain Management and Scientific Networking skills), but will now have to move their blueprints directly into the starbase structures that require it, like other materials.
My chief complaint:
I have about 25,000 blueprints and blueprint copies and more than a half-dozen POSes. The only reason I can deal with such a quagmire is because of stations and containers.
Currently, in order to produce a specific item, all I have to do is go to a certain station, open a certain container, and move some of its contents to the station floor.
Under this new system, judging by the way you phrase it ("like other materials"), I would need to do one of two things:
1. Let all my blueprints pile up in various POS arrays, and thus have to scroll through at least hundreds of items every time I start a job.
2. Store all my blueprints in nice organized containers as I do now, and thus every time I start a job be forced to go to every one of my POSes, individually open every single POS array I'm using, scroll to the right container, and remove a simple handful of blueprints each time.
#2 would be a lot more clicks, a lot of downtime as I warp between POSes, and in general a lot of annoyance. Even if the S&I interface is revamped to where I don't need to click the exact same 8 spots on my screen 10 times for every character I own, the amount of time wasted by clunky game mechanics would still increase significantly.
Long story short, when you work on your filtering mechanisms, please keep in mind that many of us manage more than a single POS and definitely more than just a handful of arrays, cycle through several dozen blueprint types rather than only producing Megathrons, and in general go to extremes that you, Developers, may not expect. |
Maximus Andendare
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
870
|
Posted - 2014.04.15 15:36:00 -
[64] - Quote
WOW. This is awesome!! Button spam will finally be removed for industrialists! Step onto the battlefield, and you're already dead, born again at the end of the battle to live on and fight another day.
>> Play Dust 514 FREE! Sign up for exclusive gear today! << |
Kitty Bear
Disturbed Friends Of Diazepam Disturbed Acquaintance
1260
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Posted - 2014.04.15 15:38:00 -
[65] - Quote
Squelch wrote:Soz if this has already been mentioned, but where you mention the new R.A.M requirements (in your example, you'll need 60 R.A.M where you needed 1 before), that will effectivley de-value any current stocks of R.A.M by a huge amount (example, 60 times less valuable).
Will existing stocks be multiplied to compensate, or is this something that players with R.A.M stocks will just have to deal with?
Additionally, will existing sources of R.A.M items have their drop quantities increased?
but won't it make them more valuable by increasing demand ?
sorry if it's a basic question, but I don't really get involved in the industrial side of eve. except as a consumer of end products. |
Sweet Felicia
Coreli Drive Yards Corelum Syndicate
1
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Posted - 2014.04.15 15:39:00 -
[66] - Quote
Will this effect Insurance, which is not rather low on former low tier ships, like Dominix, Typhoon and Armageddon? |
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
3446
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Posted - 2014.04.15 15:39:00 -
[67] - Quote
What about BPO lockdown if we have to move them to POS? |
Herbinator d'Arcadie
Arkadian Knight
65
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Posted - 2014.04.15 15:39:00 -
[68] - Quote
Good stuff happening EXCEPT for the h-sec nerf of Standings removal. POCOs ... miss. POS ... miss.
It's the wrong way to go. It only temporarily relieves Vet boredom. Then the game is left drier than before.
"Block" pigs. Refuse to fly with them.
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Mr Karson
Fuctifino
0
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Posted - 2014.04.15 15:40:00 -
[69] - Quote
I fully appreciate the fact that this is eve and that risk is omnipresent (or should be). I also believe that being able to research/copy BPO's while keeping them in a station is practically a no risk situation (aside from trusting the wrong person). But given the theme of "Risk vs. Reward" combined with the immense value, not just in isk but in time, of these BPO's, I really hope that the "reward" for researching in a POS is on a scale comparable to the value at risk. |
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CCP Ytterbium
C C P C C P Alliance
3277
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Posted - 2014.04.15 15:41:00 -
[70] - Quote
Xaniff wrote: 2. I predict there will be even more abandoned POSes out hogging all the spaces next to the moons. There needs to be some mechanic for these to be abandoned and destroyed in a reasonable amount of time after running out of fuel and failing to be maintained (like the secure containers that are lost, whether they hold goods or not).
Yeah, that's a good point, we'll note that one down. |
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H3llHound
Koshaku Gentlemen's Agreement
15
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Posted - 2014.04.15 15:42:00 -
[71] - Quote
Kitty Bear wrote:Squelch wrote:Soz if this has already been mentioned, but where you mention the new R.A.M requirements (in your example, you'll need 60 R.A.M where you needed 1 before), that will effectivley de-value any current stocks of R.A.M by a huge amount (example, 60 times less valuable).
Will existing stocks be multiplied to compensate, or is this something that players with R.A.M stocks will just have to deal with?
Additionally, will existing sources of R.A.M items have their drop quantities increased? but won't it make them more valuable by increasing demand ? sorry if it's a basic question, but I don't really get involved in the industrial side of eve. except as a consumer of end products.
One RAM now will become 100 RAM after the patch. The RAM BPOs will output 100RAM instead of one like now with the same min requirements. Market orders will prolly be multiplied by 100 while the asking price per RAM is divided by 100.
I hope they decrease the RAM volume in a similar fashion. |
Theng Hofses
Blackwater USA Inc. Pandemic Legion
21
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Posted - 2014.04.15 15:42:00 -
[72] - Quote
These changes make sense when industry is done as a hobby. When industry is done on an industrial scale, the proposed changes become a nightmare. |
Grarr Dexx
Snuff Box
353
|
Posted - 2014.04.15 15:43:00 -
[73] - Quote
CCP Ytterbium wrote:Xaniff wrote: 2. I predict there will be even more abandoned POSes out hogging all the spaces next to the moons. There needs to be some mechanic for these to be abandoned and destroyed in a reasonable amount of time after running out of fuel and failing to be maintained (like the secure containers that are lost, whether they hold goods or not).
Yeah, that's a good point, we'll note that one down.
What, that hasn't been on the table at all, before? |
Juliette Asanari
Saeder-Krupp Trading Division
57
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Posted - 2014.04.15 15:43:00 -
[74] - Quote
Finally, I'll be able to research all the things without waiting a month or two. Why did I grind my Caldari Faction Standing to 8.0? (Yes, I know, taxes... but that wasn't the intent...) |
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CCP Greyscale
C C P C C P Alliance
2013
|
Posted - 2014.04.15 15:44:00 -
[75] - Quote
Aliventi wrote:Quote:Reduce copy time on all blueprints to be less time consuming than manufacturing something out of it. This gives the option to use blueprint copies to build items at Starbases without risking the original. Any chance this would also apply to T2 BPOs? Right now it takes longer to make a copy than to just manufacture from the BPO. It would be a great way for a new market to spring up around T2 BPO BPCs and make it easier for new people to get in to T2 manufacturing without having to get in to invention.
That's the current plan, yes.
Weaselior wrote:also, w/r/t this: Quote:Reduce copy time on all blueprints to be less time consuming than manufacturing something out of it. This gives the option to use blueprint copies to build items at Starbases without risking the original. will you be looking at runs as well? for example, bpcs of capital ship components are hilariously useless as they're capped at 5 runs, so you need to reinstall every eight hours or so if you wanted to use them, a huge slowdown unless you can reinstall like clockwork
This is now on my to-fix list :) |
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Mostlyharmlesss
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
118
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Posted - 2014.04.15 15:46:00 -
[76] - Quote
How about market tabs for researched BPO's? Follow me on Twitter for the latest regarding GoonSwarm Federation and our recruitment drives!https://twitter.com/EVE_MHarmlesss-á |
Maximus Andendare
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
870
|
Posted - 2014.04.15 15:48:00 -
[77] - Quote
This may be in the cost scaling blog, but will the 0-14% cost increase be reflected in the UI in some way, or will we have to learn this from our spreadsheets? Step onto the battlefield, and you're already dead, born again at the end of the battle to live on and fight another day.
>> Play Dust 514 FREE! Sign up for exclusive gear today! << |
Soldarius
Deadman W0nderland Test Alliance Please Ignore
626
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Posted - 2014.04.15 15:48:00 -
[78] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:Aliventi wrote:Quote:Reduce copy time on all blueprints to be less time consuming than manufacturing something out of it. This gives the option to use blueprint copies to build items at Starbases without risking the original. Any chance this would also apply to T2 BPOs? Right now it takes longer to make a copy than to just manufacture from the BPO. It would be a great way for a new market to spring up around T2 BPO BPCs and make it easier for new people to get in to T2 manufacturing without having to get in to invention. That's the current plan, yes. Weaselior wrote:also, w/r/t this: Quote:Reduce copy time on all blueprints to be less time consuming than manufacturing something out of it. This gives the option to use blueprint copies to build items at Starbases without risking the original. will you be looking at runs as well? for example, bpcs of capital ship components are hilariously useless as they're capped at 5 runs, so you need to reinstall every eight hours or so if you wanted to use them, a huge slowdown unless you can reinstall like clockwork This is now on my to-fix list :)
I agree with Weaselior's concern, and am pleased to see it being addressed. Coming soon... |
Kitty Bear
Disturbed Friends Of Diazepam Disturbed Acquaintance
1260
|
Posted - 2014.04.15 15:49:00 -
[79] - Quote
H3llHound wrote:Kitty Bear wrote:Squelch wrote:Soz if this has already been mentioned, but where you mention the new R.A.M requirements (in your example, you'll need 60 R.A.M where you needed 1 before), that will effectivley de-value any current stocks of R.A.M by a huge amount (example, 60 times less valuable).
Will existing stocks be multiplied to compensate, or is this something that players with R.A.M stocks will just have to deal with?
Additionally, will existing sources of R.A.M items have their drop quantities increased? but won't it make them more valuable by increasing demand ? sorry if it's a basic question, but I don't really get involved in the industrial side of eve. except as a consumer of end products. One RAM now will become 100 RAM after the patch. The RAM BPOs will output 100RAM instead of one like now with the same min requirements. Market orders will prolly be multiplied by 100 while the asking price per RAM is divided by 100. I hope they decrease the RAM volume in a similar fashion.
aah, gotcha I guess I skimmed through that part of the blog a little too quickly
thanks for the explanation. |
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CCP Nullarbor
C C P C C P Alliance
560
|
Posted - 2014.04.15 15:49:00 -
[80] - Quote
Yinmatook wrote:With these Industry changes and now the requirement to place your BPO/BPC out in the POS, I certainly hope that the game client will be able to see what you have out there (you know, like with the Corportation->Assets->Search interface).
Yes the new blueprint browser will show you all blueprints in stations or assembly arrays etc. CCP Nullarbor //-áExotic Dancer-á// DEVGIFS |
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penifSMASH
ElitistOps Pandemic Legion
356
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Posted - 2014.04.15 15:49:00 -
[81] - Quote
How will cost scaling affect industry in conquerable stations? Will there be unlimited manufacturing/research/etc slots like in npc stations? If so will the station owner still be able to set costs of running jobs? |
Squelch
Imperial Collective Unsettled.
0
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Posted - 2014.04.15 15:50:00 -
[82] - Quote
Kitty Bear wrote:Squelch wrote:Soz if this has already been mentioned, but where you mention the new R.A.M requirements (in your example, you'll need 60 R.A.M where you needed 1 before), that will effectivley de-value any current stocks of R.A.M by a huge amount (example, 60 times less valuable).
Will existing stocks be multiplied to compensate, or is this something that players with R.A.M stocks will just have to deal with?
Additionally, will existing sources of R.A.M items have their drop quantities increased? but won't it make them more valuable by increasing demand ? sorry if it's a basic question, but I don't really get involved in the industrial side of eve. except as a consumer of end products.
Nope, Here is a simple example (not real numbers)
Currently to construct Frigate A, you need 1 unit of R.A.M as input material. 1 unit of R.A.M costs 600k Frigate A sells on the market anything higher than 600k to make a profit.
After the change, you now need 60 units of R.A.M as input materials to build the same frigate A. 2 things can happen now.
1) The Frigate sell price stays the same, which means the approxomate build price must be the same. Your 60 R.A.M units are worth 600k, totalling 10k each. The price of 1 R.A.M unit has dropped from 600k to 10k.
2) The price of R.A.M stays the same, and the sell price of Frigate A shoots upwards. Frigate A is built out of 60 R.A.M at 600k each, totalling 36million ISK. Frigate A must now be sold for more that 36mil to be profitable. Before it was 600k
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David Magnus
244
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Posted - 2014.04.15 15:50:00 -
[83] - Quote
Theng Hofses wrote:These changes make sense when industry is done as a hobby. When industry is done on an industrial scale, the proposed changes become a nightmare.
Theng is totally right. Having to constantly physically move thousands of blueprints around to your dozens of POSes will be a nightmare after this. And it's not even just moving an item from station to POS, but it's managing the items in all your individual POS arrays.
Not to mention the fact that you can't lockdown BPOs in POSes.
I'm not even a major industrialist and I have over a hundred BPOs and thousands of BPCs. This is adding so much additional and unnecessary work. http://soundcloud.com/davidkmagnus/fight-us-maybe http://soundcloud.com/davidkmagnus/winterupdate http://soundcloud.com/davidkmagnus/supercaps http://soundcloud.com/davidkmagnus/pandemiclegion |
Grarr Dexx
Snuff Box
354
|
Posted - 2014.04.15 15:50:00 -
[84] - Quote
Will there be fees for building in 0.0 or can they just set them all to 0? Is there going to be any point to building anything outside of 0.0? |
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CCP Nullarbor
C C P C C P Alliance
560
|
Posted - 2014.04.15 15:50:00 -
[85] - Quote
probag Bear wrote:Quote:Remove the ability for players to use stations to safely store their blueprints without putting them at risk in Starbase structures. Players will still be able to start their jobs remotely (via the use of Supply Chain Management and Scientific Networking skills), but will now have to move their blueprints directly into the starbase structures that require it, like other materials. My chief complaint: I have about 25,000 blueprints and blueprint copies and more than a half-dozen POSes. The only reason I can deal with such a quagmire is because of stations and containers. Currently, in order to produce a specific item, all I have to do is go to a certain station, open a certain container, and move some of its contents to the station floor. Under this new system, judging by the way you phrase it ("like other materials"), I would need to do one of two things: 1. Let all my blueprints pile up in various POS arrays, and thus have to scroll through at least hundreds of items every time I start a job. 2. Store all my blueprints in nice organized containers as I do now, and thus every time I start a job be forced to go to every one of my POSes, individually open every single POS array I'm using, scroll to the right container, and remove a simple handful of blueprints each time. #2 would be a lot more clicks, a lot of downtime as I warp between POSes, and in general a lot of annoyance. Even if the S&I interface is revamped to where I don't need to click the exact same 8 spots on my screen 10 times for every character I own, the amount of time wasted by clunky game mechanics would still increase significantly. Long story short, when you work on your filtering mechanisms, please keep in mind that many of us manage more than a single POS and definitely more than just a handful of arrays, cycle through several dozen blueprint types rather than only producing Megathrons, and in general go to extremes that you, Developers, may not expect.
You will be able to see all your blueprints in assembly arrays etc and remotely start jobs from containers, so that should cover your use case.
EDIT: There is also a nice search / filter interface, you will get some time on SiSi to give us feedback on how this works before we go live too. CCP Nullarbor //-áExotic Dancer-á// DEVGIFS |
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Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation Ineluctable.
382
|
Posted - 2014.04.15 15:52:00 -
[86] - Quote
Also, what about the Labs/Hangars/Arrays; can we get the possibility to get the stuff out of them when the tower is reinforced? I am aware of that you wrote in your novel that people should be active and get the stuff out of the modules during the RF process ... but some people are not online 24/7 or hang around their POS all the time, which puts those who do more than industry in EVE and those who don't put their sleep back into the retirement age at a massive disadvantage.
Do you expect that people take down POS when they go to bed or move to another region to do exploration or mission running? |
Jai Centarium
Anqara Expeditions
9
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Posted - 2014.04.15 15:52:00 -
[87] - Quote
I'm slightly concerned about the removal of standings requirements for high-sec POSes. POS spam is bad, and should be something reserved for high-end industrial corps, not every 1-month old character with Anchoring III and a ton of ISK from selling a PLEX.
Maybe change how those standings requirements are used?
Something like instead of charters as fuel, you're required to pay the soverign empire a certain amount of ISK every month for anchoring rights, or else their navy shows up and blows your POS to hell? That way a corp with mixed members can just pay the fee (opening up high-sec POSes to larger corps that may have diverse members, but consequently, better tax income), while a small, focused corp can still get in the door. I'm a little teapot, short and stout. |
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CCP Ytterbium
C C P C C P Alliance
3278
|
Posted - 2014.04.15 15:53:00 -
[88] - Quote
Maximus Andendare wrote:This may be in the cost scaling blog, but will the 0-14% cost increase be reflected in the UI in some way, or will we have to learn this from our spreadsheets?
The new UI will show you the accurate price before you actually install the job. |
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Two step
Aperture Harmonics No Holes Barred
4575
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Posted - 2014.04.15 15:53:00 -
[89] - Quote
Given that you want people to move to POS industry, ant chance you can just delete the 8 million different POS factory things and make a more sensible set of them? Give people efficient/fast and just a few sizes, but don't make us anchor 15 different stupid factories and move stuff between then?
Also, as was mentioned above, people *need* to be able to see into their POS inventories remotely, without having to use the API (especially because the assets API is, what, a 6 hour cache time?). The API also currently doesn't return ME/PE levels for BPOs/BPOs, so it isn't a real replacement anyway. CSM 7 Secretary CSM 6 Alternate Delegate @two_step_eve on Twitter My Blog
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Squelch
Imperial Collective Unsettled.
0
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Posted - 2014.04.15 15:54:00 -
[90] - Quote
H3llHound wrote: One RAM now will become 100 RAM after the patch.
Where did you see this? The only thing I see in the Devblog is:
Multiply number of R.AM. and R.Db. given for each run of their respective blueprint by 100. Multiply all R.A.M. and R.Db. job requirements by 100, then further multiply that number by the old damage per run percentage.
That doesn't mention existing stocks. |
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