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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 10 post(s) |

Marlona Sky
D00M. Northern Coalition.
5201
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Posted - 2014.05.17 19:11:00 -
[61] - Quote



 The Paradox |

Kismeteer
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
611
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 19:17:00 -
[62] - Quote
Also requesting in the 10k cargo hold range with expanders, it can hold an 8k SMA/CHA and some randome crap. Please drop fleet hanger appropriately. |

Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness
1362
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Posted - 2014.05.17 19:23:00 -
[63] - Quote
FT Diomedes wrote:Yes, these things are going to be tough to catch - going to require team work. At a glanceGǪ it will take 10 points to catch an Impel on a low sec gate, or a Heavy Interdictor with a scram. Then the tank kicks inGǪ but functionally, once you catch these things, they are dead.
Hint puttign so many points is irrelevant. Only the MJD helps. A single MWD sttabber can bump you out of alignment so efficiently that you will never warp. "If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!" |

Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness
1362
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 19:26:00 -
[64] - Quote
Alundil wrote:Tahna Rouspel wrote:That is some sexy changes. I can't wait to fit 7 warp core stabilizers and a medium micro jump drive on my Impel :D
Does MJD work if you get scrambled but have warp core stabilizers? This will be awesome. Dual prop transport for lols. Mjd + ab. Slowboating out of bubbles and tackle hehe
try it.... that is not what gonna save you.
These changes only make small scale huntign harder. But they are IRRELEVANT for large gate camps. 3-4 ships can EASILY still kill these. Jsut again solo has been nerfed even more.
TO the awesomed ones you just need 1 interceptor to scramble fast this thing and collide with it givign time to a MWD cruiser colide soon after and take it completely out of alignment. RInse and repeat. You will NOT get out.
At most you can try to get back to gate with a MWD simply tanking 2-3 ships. "If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!" |

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
21819
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 19:29:00 -
[65] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Hook it up to a turret and we can have our much wanted corpse launcher. I like this idea. I like it a lot. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skill plan 2.1. |

Marlona Sky
D00M. Northern Coalition.
5202
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Posted - 2014.05.17 19:36:00 -
[66] - Quote
Trying to turn these into PvP ships will be hard to do. They can do well in fighting off small things, but to try and tank, hard tackle them enough to apply solid DPS will be difficult. I suppose that is for the best. The Paradox |

SpaceSaft
Sub Par. The East India Co.
78
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Posted - 2014.05.17 19:42:00 -
[67] - Quote
I don't get what the goal is.
If you've got special goods you'd use the new specialised industrials and stab them, if you want to transport something in a secure way, you scout anyway and can then take advantage of the superior cargo capacity / isk relation of other ships. The +2 warp core strength is exactly good against one guy at most, if you're getting camped you die just like the lower tier versions, except slower. The MJD gets you out of nowhere really since spool up is 12s (- seconds for skills, no idea what you have planned there). Which is how much slower/faster than warping off? Why would I want this kind of ship?
Can't you make them immune to bubbles and scram have them take a long time to warp with best skills? Because in that case tank would make sense and it would be a fun thing to chase that transport from gate to gate, beating him down every time.
No really I don't get it, I wouldn't fly one. Not sold on the idea. Hope restored. |

Marlona Sky
D00M. Northern Coalition.
5202
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 19:50:00 -
[68] - Quote
I'm inclined to agree on an agility boost when you consider the nerf to the JF. The Paradox |

Zakarumit CZ
Zakarum Industries Exiliar Syndicate
182
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Posted - 2014.05.17 19:52:00 -
[69] - Quote
Interesting changes, but I second the idea of allowing DST to launch POS and their modules. Its a huge disadvantage. Giving them some lowered spool up time for MJD would be very nice too. |

Pashino
Venice Academy
29
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Posted - 2014.05.17 19:57:00 -
[70] - Quote
SpaceSaft wrote:Can't you make them immune to bubbles and scram have them take a long time to warp with best skills? Because in that case tank would make sense and it would be a fun thing to chase that transport from gate to gate, beating him down every time.
This was more along the lines that I was pitching in the earlier discussion thread - essentially make them slow juggernauts, unstoppable aside from raw firepower. Dev solution to the vulnerability of bumping seems to be the new MJD but as pointed out, alert gate camps will handle that fine. Current solution is a considerable improvement and should allow them to shrug off small fry/poorly thought out gate camps but not much else. The new setup will work well compared to before for escorted scenarios, but the question has to be asked of the devs whether they expect these DST's to be used solo much or just within the framework of a corp or fleet.
If the answer is 'corp/fleet/escort', then only change really needed is resolving the POS deploying problem.
If they expect us to use these flying solo, then we're still pretty far short of the mark.
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Deacon Abox
Justified Chaos
325
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Posted - 2014.05.17 19:59:00 -
[71] - Quote
Seidenpfote wrote:Every serious gatecamp brings a remote boosted single-point hic. If you don't have one, then don't try to go after a DST, plenty of other ships around. I like the cut of your jib CCP, there are off buttons for ship explosions, missile effects, turret effects, etc. "Immersion" does not seem to be harmed by those. So, please give us an off button for the jump gate and autoscan visuals. |

MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
1860
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 20:02:00 -
[72] - Quote
Tippia wrote:MeBiatch wrote:heck why not give them a clone vat bay too? Because there's no need to and because it doesn't seem like a simple design oversight that they can't use one?
well deep space and all right?
Hell i just wish the clone vat bay was not toally useless... would make living in a pos in deep stain bareable. There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... Winter Expansion new ship request |

Eija-Riitta Veitonen
Unicorn Enterprise
203
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 20:11:00 -
[73] - Quote
Finally a reason to buy a Bustard. BattleBustard, here i come! |

Dramaticus
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
559
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 20:13:00 -
[74] - Quote
The EASes of the industrial world The 'do-nothing' member of the GoonSwarm Economic Warfare Cabal
The edge is REALLY hard to see at times but it DOES exist and in this case we were looking at a situation where a new feature created for all of our customers was being virtually curbstomped by five of them |

Kniht
Narwhals Ate My Duck. Narwhals Ate My Duck
51
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Posted - 2014.05.17 20:20:00 -
[75] - Quote
CynoNet Two wrote:Michael Harari wrote:CynoNet Two wrote:The weedy cargo means DSTs can no longer handle starbase mods - you can't scoop / launch them from a fleet hangar. What about a slightly bigger base cargo, around 3-4k?
If the additional WCS role bonus doesn't protect the MJD, these things aren't going to live long. The spool time is more than long enough to be webbed + scrambled, and no amount of overheating will help then. What about instead of 5% velocity per level, they get -5% to MJD spool time bonus per level? They can tank 2-3k dps Can they tank like that until the next downtime? Because with a scram+web they ain't going anywhere but a killboard. Does no one use scouts for haulers with expensive cargo anymore?
We don't need a hauler that's solo-invulnerable in every case. Risk vs reward; choose the right hauling strategy for the situation. |

Kniht
Narwhals Ate My Duck. Narwhals Ate My Duck
51
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Posted - 2014.05.17 20:27:00 -
[76] - Quote
Neutral Jita Hauler wrote:So why are we going through the gimmick of a fleet hanger instead of just giving them a 'general goods' bay ala the rebalanced t1's?
If you don't want fleet/corp to have access to your Fleet Hangar, just turn those off. And then it's "General Goods" that you want. |

Priestess Lin
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
114
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 20:29:00 -
[77] - Quote
Why don't you just make DPT able to carry more and be gain the speed and tank to get out of interdictor bubbles? Make them immune to webs.
Make them into what they should be, tanky tranports that can survive a gate camp.
They should be useful for setting up a customs office and gain enough cargobay space to do that at least. Blockade runners can't do that. |

FT Diomedes
The Graduates RAZOR Alliance
408
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 20:40:00 -
[78] - Quote
I do not think there is a "right hauling strategy" that involves the DST. Seriously, what would you use this thing for?
The current scale of hauling ships goes something like this:
1. Interceptor -
Pros: properly fit, essentially cannot be caught, except by smart bombs. Cons: Small cargo hold.
2. T3 cruiser -
Pros: properly fit, cannot be caught, except by lag. Cons: cost, but that is going down. Decent cargo hold to carry expensive dead space mod to market.
3. Blockade runner -
Pros - hard to catch, but not impossible. MWD+cloak+warp works most of the time. Cons - can be caught by a skilled interdictor + decloaker combination. Can only haul 10k worth of stuff, which is more than enough for most purposes.
4. Deep Space Transport -
Pros - Can haul 50-62.5K m3 worth of cargo. Cons - while it is not a complete sitting duck, it can be caught.
5. Orca
Pros - can haul a good amount, can refit to a variety of different fits. Cons - expensive
6. Freighter - sitting duck outside of high sec, big loot pi+¦ata inside of high sec. Unless you are Titan bridging them, irrelevant for 0.0 hauling.
7. Jump Freighter - about to get even more expensive. This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine. |

Dramaticus
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
560
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 20:48:00 -
[79] - Quote
Um if any part of your hauling plan involves tanking then your plan is pretty **** The 'do-nothing' member of the GoonSwarm Economic Warfare Cabal
The edge is REALLY hard to see at times but it DOES exist and in this case we were looking at a situation where a new feature created for all of our customers was being virtually curbstomped by five of them |

PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
1810
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 20:49:00 -
[80] - Quote
While I like the concept, I don't really see the point. The only thing this might get used for is moving deadspace/officer mods on fitted ships in the fleet hanger in hisec since they won't be scannable. But that's not really a deep space thing, and people are more likely to use a blockade runner/t3 for that anyway.
In nullsec (deep space), these things will die to the first half decent camp they come across plain and simple. Sure, you can escort them. But I can escort a badger just as well, and for a lot less isk to boot.
Maybe take a look at the clone vat bay idea? It would give them a deep space role, and the clone vat bay is (probably) massively under-utilized anyway.
Dramaticus wrote:Um if any part of your hauling plan involves tanking then your plan is pretty **** Pretty much this. |
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Priestess Lin
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
114
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 20:49:00 -
[81] - Quote
CynoNet Two wrote:The weedy cargo means DSTs can no longer handle starbase mods - you can't scoop / launch them from a fleet hangar. What about a slightly bigger base cargo, around 3-4k?
If the additional WCS role bonus doesn't protect the MJD, these things aren't going to live long. The spool time is more than long enough to be webbed + scrambled, and no amount of overheating will help then. What about instead of 5% velocity per level, they get -5% to MJD spool time bonus per level?
Exactly. These are of poor design and their equal cargoholds will make one better than the others.
How about instead of all these transports being so similar, they make them different?
If it is not possble to do this simplest and most reasonable thing and give them larger cargobay, make each one have a separate cargo designed for something different. One could be for carrying customs offices and planetary commities. Another for starbase components ect.
A MJD isn't going to do anything against gate camp. Pull your head out, devs. It needs web immunity to get out of bubbles. |

Irya Boone
Never Surrender.
357
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 20:55:00 -
[82] - Quote
The DST have a +2 warp core strenght does it means the MJD will still be active if you put only one or 2 points on the ship or Only need to scramble It ( like usual) to cut off the MJD? RENAME WH systems With the name of REAL Universe Stellar Name like KOI-730 etc etc It will be awesome.
GalMIl>>ALL |

PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
1811
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 20:57:00 -
[83] - Quote
Irya Boone wrote:The DST have a +2 warp core strenght does it means the MJD will still be active if you put only one or 2 points on the ship or Only need to scramble It ( like usual) to cut off the MJD? The MJD will be disabled by any scrambler (not longpoint) regardless of warp core strength or applied points, just like the MWD. |

Justin Cody
AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse
215
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 21:07:00 -
[84] - Quote
Yes I can't quite be sure why deploying POS structures is being overlooked at the moment. I don't understand on the fleet hangar over discreet cargo bay either. Not quite sure what CCP is up to here. Perhaps a design philosophy post is in order. Otherwise make sure we can launch towers and other structures from the fleet hangar. Stop being dumb. |

Kyshonuba
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
28
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 21:09:00 -
[85] - Quote
It doesn't look like a good change for high sec haulers/industrialist
Rite now, before the change, only T2 deep space transports can haul valuable goods above 20.000 m-¦ .....and ii f you know how to fit them (hint: cloaky warp trick) you can even fly them through the (gank/) gates of niarja and uedama.
in high sec, PI/module/loot /ammo haulers have this kind of problem because the tech 1 industrials are gank targets as soon as they transport goods above 40.000.000 ISK. The only option for valauable stuff beyond the freighter will now be the blockade runner. ..which means 50% less cargo capacity. ( unless you wanna call a 400m-¦ courrier tengu an industrial ship)
This whole idea reminds me of the barge change in summer 2012, where you also underestimated the value high sec industrialist put in big cargo (ore) bays.
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Kat Ayclism
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
251
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 21:14:00 -
[86] - Quote
These are... ughh... changes...
None of which make these any more viable...
Would be nice to at least be able to launch pos stuff with them... I guess... if you're ever using these at all... |

MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
1860
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 21:19:00 -
[87] - Quote
What if a long point slowed down the spool time for the mjd giving you Time to get close enough to activate the scram?
Think of the warp inhibitors in sins of a solar empire There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... Winter Expansion new ship request |

Sipphakta en Gravonere
4S Corporation Goonswarm Federation
602
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 21:27:00 -
[88] - Quote
Kyshonuba wrote:It doesn't look like a good change for high sec haulers/industrialist
Rite now, before the change, only T2 deep space transports can haul valuable goods above 20.000 m-¦ .....and ii f you know how to fit them (hint: cloaky warp trick) you can even fly them through the (gank/) gates of niarja and uedama.
in high sec, PI/module/loot /ammo haulers have this kind of problem because the tech 1 industrials are gank targets as soon as they transport goods above 40.000.000 ISK. The only option for valauable stuff beyond the freighter will now be the blockade runner. ..which means 50% less cargo capacity. ( unless you wanna call a 400m-¦ courrier tengu an industrial ship)
I don't understand your post. After the change, DST will be able to haul 50.000m3 (+5% per skill) while having a ~80k EHP tank with a ~12 second align time. Seems like a buff to me.
(USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS POST) |

Justin Cody
AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse
215
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 21:38:00 -
[89] - Quote
Sipphakta en Gravonere wrote:Kyshonuba wrote:It doesn't look like a good change for high sec haulers/industrialist
Rite now, before the change, only T2 deep space transports can haul valuable goods above 20.000 m-¦ .....and ii f you know how to fit them (hint: cloaky warp trick) you can even fly them through the (gank/) gates of niarja and uedama.
in high sec, PI/module/loot /ammo haulers have this kind of problem because the tech 1 industrials are gank targets as soon as they transport goods above 40.000.000 ISK. The only option for valauable stuff beyond the freighter will now be the blockade runner. ..which means 50% less cargo capacity. ( unless you wanna call a 400m-¦ courrier tengu an industrial ship)
I don't understand your post. After the change, DST will be able to haul 50.000m3 (+5% per skill) while having a ~80k EHP tank with a ~12 second align time. Seems like a buff to me.
It seems that way except now you can't deploy towers or other POS equipment. Big Ass Nerf (BAN) |

JAF Anders
Quantum Cats Syndicate Repeat 0ffenders
196
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 22:08:00 -
[90] - Quote
I'm sure you both had quite the chuckle when you ran the numbers for min/max'd MAAR. QCATS is Recruiting: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=146180 |
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