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Tranquility will be patched on Thurs, 31 August from 0800 to 1500 GMT

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 14 post(s)
pizdec	Posted - 2006.08.30 14:18:00 - [481] Edited by: pizdec on 30/08/2006 14:27:19 Edited by: pizdec on 30/08/2006 14:26:36 Excellent excellent changes! Cloak: do not use them, can care less. What ***** needs cloak if I got 7 BS sniper gang on a gate? BMs: I have 14 regions neatly arranged in folders 10 each. With the change I will be making a couple of dreads per day in instas. The money (as usually but more) will go to the alt that now thanks to the queue change will give me dozens more targets in 0.1-0.4. Gate camp is just about to get real evil again. Even if I tried to come up with a more evil patch that works for ME I would have failed. Finally I get to play the way I wanted it to. I have almost unlimited isk supply and more juicy targets in semi-empire. Thank you, thank you, thank you CCP.
Chewan Mesa Beagle Corp	Posted - 2006.08.30 14:30:00 - [482] Originally by: pizdec Edited by: pizdec on 30/08/2006 14:27:19 Edited by: pizdec on 30/08/2006 14:26:36 Excellent excellent changes! Cloak: do not use them, can care less. What ***** needs cloak if I got 7 BS sniper gang on a gate? BMs: I have 14 regions neatly arranged in folders 10 each. With the change I will be making a couple of dreads per day in instas. The money (as usually but more) will go to the alt that now thanks to the queue change will give me dozens more targets in 0.1-0.4. Gate camp is just about to get real evil again. Even if I tried to come up with a more evil patch that works for ME I would have failed. Finally I get to play the way I wanted it to. I have almost unlimited isk supply and more juicy targets in semi-empire. Thank you, thank you, thank you CCP. It makes me all warm and fuzzy inside to see CCP made you happy :)
Stein Voorhees Caldari Agony Unleashed	Posted - 2006.08.30 14:34:00 - [483] For all those saying that something needs to be done about Cloaking, it's too powerful etc etc, if you read the Dev blogs about Kali and the new scanning system, you will see that CovOps ships will become detectable and, in my view, much more balanced. That will take some of the 'uber-ness' from them. As for this current change, it is a mistake as told by Tuxford and will be fixed in the, hopefully, near future.
Arvo Henderson Draconis Navitas Aeterna Pure.	Posted - 2006.08.30 14:37:00 - [484] Originally by: Chain Gang Edited by: Chain Gang on 30/08/2006 14:10:29 Quote: You say Recon is a huge skilltree? Yeah, it is - I have them trained, do you remember? IMO, regarding ships, if you want trulyHUGE (caps are yours) skilltree go for command ships. Cough Capital ships ....... I have them trained, do you remember? but lets not start a "mine is bigger than yours" Yet another better example of huge a skilltree. But since I don't think I will starting that path anytime soon, I didn't feel like talking about it. The ASCN guy implied I was a nub. Compared to many I am a nub. But a nub with that skilltree trained. No e-peen contests - fair enough. My fault for tackling the ASCN guy from that angle. Originally by: Chain Gang Quote: You also talk about HUGE cpu requirements. That's right, cov ops module has huge cpu requirements. But cov ops ships also have HUGE CPU. Not really, the ships fitting the module get a reduction in fitting requirements they don't have HuGE CPU. Okay, they have quite a bit of CPU left after fitting the module to play with. Originally by: Chain Gang Quote: Obviously, not enough for fitting much or powerful weapons (with the exception of Bombers), but hey, I take "recon" as "lightly armed". And their main weapon should be "relaying intel" - You can take it anyway you like but stating that "recons" main weapon should be "relaying Intel" is rather narrow minded .... 90% of the people I know flying Pilgrims etc etc do it solely for PvP. That's true - it is narrowminded to say that their only weapon is "relaying intel". But you don't seem to think that "intel" is a weapon at all Scouting isn't PVP? What's the first thing that a gang leader should sort out? To decide who is the guy that will be scouting ahead (or behind). But I must admit they are also very useful for setting up ambushes and other fun stuff. Originally by: Chain Gang Quote: Though it wouldn't be so easy - and that's the problem. Not at all ........ but giving any decent Insta locking frigate / gate camp a almost guaranteed kill is not what CCP intended .. 1 - Was CCP intention to release a series of "cheaper hacs" (recons)? in the case of the Combat Recon class I think the answer is "yes". Does it make sense to discuss about which should be the role the ships in game "must have"? Not at all. Intrinsic bonuses matter - when they work. When they don't do, then all depends on the fitting, the skills, the intention one has and the planning one does. 2 - Almost guaranteed kill? Under what circumstances? The dictor camp? Again, how often do you come across one? Which ship would you like to be in if you came across one? Why? Answer these questions and you'll get the point in my reasoning.
ForceAttuned Krogoth InterGalactic Corp. Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2006.08.30 14:41:00 - [485] Originally by: Cmdr Lamborghini #1 I think a warp to 3km option needs to be added...this will eliminate the game of the billions of BM's...and in effect give everyone in the game the instas...there are already PLENTY of ways to kill people even with instas. #2 Make a limit of 500 BM's per character allowed and make copying them only allowed in stations...not in space...this will eliminate the BM's being exploited in PVP. Now the only BM's anyone will really need are instas to favorite spots, etc. #3 for the whining pirates that want to see everyone slow-boat it to the gate so they can get more easy kills....learn how to use a small warp bubble...it's already SSSsooooooo easy to kill people in this game. #4 As for the Cov-ops issue, It has been mentioned that the Cov-ops is nearly invunerable...so here is a "counter" to the Cov-Ops...it adds a bit of strategy without making the Cov-ops completely useless. We need a ship fitable mod to counter the cov-ops...someting that fits in a high-slot and takes alot of CPU/PG to fit and consumes 80% of the ships cap on use...and acts sort of like a ping from a submarine...give it a 20km radius, and make it temporarily make the cov-ops visible...giving the gate campers at least a chance of locating the cov-ops. It will be a 1 second visibility thing...it does not break the Cov-Ops cloak The mod cant be used again till the ships cap recharges...and this ship will have little room to do anything but be a dedicated ping boat. thoughts? I like this idea but i was thinking 20km is a bit on the short side of things, but its a good starting place, i would be fine with 50km or so. Also instead of taking loads of cap it could take fuel like a lot of the new mods that are comming out. This way Ammar ships will not have an advantage over caldari because of cap size and recharge(i fly ammar and i know how much caldari hurt when they get into a 200 au system). Also if they wanted to make something big out of it a new class of ships would be nice that could be able to find cloaked ships. Just like the support cruisers you could make a support ship that could fit this module, also get a bonus to ECCM, sensor boosting, remote tracking etc... kinda like what a griffin's job is at a gate camp.
Azulios Incarnation of Evil	Posted - 2006.08.30 14:53:00 - [486] I dont really want to have to trawl 19 pages - but I know there must be a few dev posts amongst these somewhere. Let's hope for a blog update soon. Piracy Stuff, arrrr
Arvo Henderson Draconis Navitas Aeterna Pure.	Posted - 2006.08.30 14:57:00 - [487] Edited by: Arvo Henderson on 30/08/2006 14:57:10 Originally by: Azulios Let's hope for a blog update soon. There are a couple by tuxford. But yes, let's hope for a blog update, where everything is carefully worded, and clearly explained.
Lisento Slaven Amarr The Drekla Consortium New Eve Order	Posted - 2006.08.30 14:58:00 - [488] I just recently moved my corporation to a new area. We are in the process of copying countless sets of instas to the region and neighboring area we will be working in. Does this mean wednesday is going to be the "insta-copying" day of EVE? August 30th, 2006 - INSTA DAY. So named because of the mass rush of copying that will occur on this day. I will attempt to copy a region of 600+ instas at least 5 times today before the nerf...so that 5 more corp mates won't be at a disadvantage. At least tell us if copy speed will be increased since the amount copied is being decreased greatly. I'm used to copying in batches of 40 - 60. I'm surprised there aren't as many posts about instas on here in comparison to the covops not being able to cloak while it's being targetted. Instas are a much bigger problem...or...at least "bigger bad news" in my eyes. --- Lisento Slaven wants to be a Space Whaler in EVE. Put in space whales!
Chain Gang	Posted - 2006.08.30 15:00:00 - [489] Quote: 2 - Almost guaranteed kill? Under what circumstances? The dictor camp? Again, how often do you come across one? Which ship would you like to be in if you came across one? Why? Answer these questions and you'll get the point in my reasoning I fully support the idea that "once your locked you cannot cloak" but with the current "change" any "thought out" gate camp with be able to kill 90%+ off all recons / coverts jumping into their gate camp ... Insta locking harpies, Interceptors ect etc etc ..... currently as soon as they "click lock" you know you have 1-2 secs to warp out as you will be decloaked at the end of the lock cycle ... I'm not saying there shouldn't be a chance of you being detected but the odds need to be balanced.
Bismarck vonDresden Queens of the Stone Age Chimaera Pact	Posted - 2006.08.30 15:03:00 - [490] Regarding the insta copying - I'm all for it, and I'm glad it's being done... but one thing this will do is create a large gap between the folks that have numerous regions worth of instas compared to new players for whom it will be unfeasable to copy all those instas 5 at a time... I vote for a nerf of all instas and an introduction of a system to allow any player to warp to 0km. With the bookmark nerf, I think this will become a requirement. Exactly how to implement an easily accessible insta warp - be it skills or modules - is for another thread (there have been several on this topic before) - but in my opinion it really needs to get done.

dabster Minmatar Celestial Apocalypse	Posted - 2006.08.30 15:03:00 - [491] deleted a load of CAPSLOCK cursing to avoid being banned Worst god damn ***** up non-thought through nerf EVER that i can remember since april 2004 when i started. Im speechless at the incompetence displayed about bookmark issues and "solving" it. ___________________________ Brutors Rule! My Eve-vids; Click.
Zooish	Posted - 2006.08.30 15:06:00 - [492] Remove bookmarks, 0km warp option (with skills) and save about 900GB of database space and server processing
Butter Dog ISS Navy Task Force Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2006.08.30 15:12:00 - [493] Edited by: Butter Dog on 30/08/2006 15:12:03 Originally by: Arvo Henderson Okay, they have quite a bit of CPU left after fitting the module to play with. Er, try fitting a Cloak and Probe Launcher and see how much CPU you have left... oh, NONE. In fact an Anathema with maxed out skills needs 2 Co-processor II fitted just to fit the 'essential' cov ops modules.
Harisdrop Gallente RONA Deepspace Rule of Three	Posted - 2006.08.30 15:15:00 - [494] Tuxford was out of the loop when the fix was placed. He stated that there was a change to covert op cloaks. The old way worked fine. He was going to look into getting it changed. He did not know it was called a bug that only was at the cloakers side not the effect of locking had on cloaking. I will use my great globe of 3 years of patches and say that as it is now is what most dev's wanted. That the group as a whole want cloaking to be less used as a sniper ship and an annoyance. They want them to be used as part of a fleet where they are one of many and you can be in and out of battle with out notice. I believe this is where we are. Consider they want more fleet battles where there are two forces with cargo cans everywhere. They want covert ops in the middle opening up on certain targets and noit being noticed and recloaking. If you are noticed then you are not covert. You cover is blown and try again. I believe that we are getting to the most detail specifics of EVE and we are transforming each battle with each patch. I say horray.
Arvo Henderson Draconis Navitas Aeterna Pure.	Posted - 2006.08.30 15:15:00 - [495] Originally by: Chain Gang Quote: 2 - Almost guaranteed kill? Under what circumstances? The dictor camp? Again, how often do you come across one? Which ship would you like to be in if you came across one? Why? Answer these questions and you'll get the point in my reasoning I fully support the idea that "once your locked you cannot cloak" but with the current "change" any "thought out" gate camp with be able to kill 90%+ off all recons / coverts jumping into their gate camp ... Insta locking harpies, Interceptors ect etc etc ..... currently as soon as they "click lock" you know you have 1-2 secs to warp out as you will be decloaked at the end of the lock cycle ... I'm not saying there shouldn't be a chance of you being detected but the odds need to be balanced. Dictor camps aren't thought of, if you are referring to that. In fact, dictors come in handy because they allow you to improvise a bubble camp on the spot. You're equating locking with death - you're dead when you see your pod, not just right after you get locked (assuming lag-free conditions, of course). When you might die? When you turn up too close from the tacklers, or a insta-lock sniping BS (which is fantasy - Booster Stacking nerf). But again, you can stab your ship. Yes, you won't have much CPU to fit fancy weapons, fit ECM stuff instead. You can try to dampen/jam the snipers/tacklers - you'll lock the sniper BS much faster than him can. The likelihood of surviving a dictor camp is low unless you run for the gate or get lucky. Who can do otherwise while being [b]alone[b/]? Which are the odds, with pre-Dragon mechanics, of escaping a dictor camp unscathed while in a covops frig? 10/90? C'mon. I'd say 70/30, or even, 80/20. If they can't tackle, you warp and live and come back. If they can't lock and insta pop you, you warp and live and come back. If everything above fails, run for the gate. If even running for the gate fails, your mates waiting on the other side will come and avenge you. If there are no mates, then you say "sh*t happens". Eve is a hard place.
Arvo Henderson Draconis Navitas Aeterna Pure.	Posted - 2006.08.30 15:18:00 - [496] Originally by: Butter Dog Edited by: Butter Dog on 30/08/2006 15:12:03 Originally by: Arvo Henderson Okay, they have quite a bit of CPU left after fitting the module to play with. Er, try fitting a Cloak and Probe Launcher and see how much CPU you have left... oh, NONE. In fact an Anathema with maxed out skills needs 2 Co-processor II fitted just to fit the 'essential' cov ops modules. Fit the Probe launcher if you want. But it doesn't need to be online unless you're going to use it, or you will be using it while trying to break through a camp?. Get to a safespot, offline the cloak and online the probe launcher.
Butter Dog ISS Navy Task Force Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2006.08.30 15:20:00 - [497] Originally by: Arvo Henderson When you might die? When you turn up too close from the tacklers, or a insta-lock sniping BS (which is fantasy - Booster Stacking nerf). But again, you can stab your ship. Yes, you won't have much CPU to fit fancy weapons, fit ECM stuff instead. You can try to dampen/jam the snipers/tacklers - you'll lock the sniper BS much faster than him can. You don't have the first clue what you are talking about, and clearly have no experience actually fitting and using Covert Ops ships. You CANNOT fit stabs on covert ops ships without offlining either the cloak or probe launcher. FACT. As someone demonstrated on the test server, an Ares with no sensor booster and a 20km scram under the current patch conditions, can LOCK and SCRAM a covert ops before it even enters warp. They are not the most agile of ships. This means, dictor bubbles aside, that a single ceptor on a gate with one 20km scram = CERTAIN DEATH for covert ops.
DriveCrash Malium Imperium	Posted - 2006.08.30 15:20:00 - [498] Originally by: Zooish Remove bookmarks, 0km warp option (with skills) and save about 900GB of database space and server processing Theres so many problems with this, which have been addressed before. What is it that everyone hates about bookmarks, and people are saying "this is a good thing, the 5bm copy limit" for? Because they hate insta's. Pirates, esp 0.1-0.4 gate gankers hate the idea of more and more people with instas. It means they cant snag thier favorite prey (which is too easy with out insta's imo.) They cant use warp bubbles in empire.. and if everyone had a warp to 0km option.. they could only catch them leaving a gate.. and they would yell and hollar and whine. At the same time 0.0 alliances would have a hissy fit because people who had never been to the area could easily skim past a group of people guarding an area, unless they got snagged in a bubble. Theres alot more problems I cant remember.. The point is this. There is no 0km warp to option. theres no solution AT ALL. Instead they nerf BM's to an extreme, leaving a huge gap between those with bm's and those without. This gap will come into play even within corps. As with the gate que's and the thought to be covert ops problem.. the BM solution is ill devised. There will still be bookmarks in the game. Insta's will still be around. You'll just see a shift in the direction mining has gone. Because of the short cycle copys and much more predictable timing of copying.. you will see Macro Insta Makers! to go along with our hordes of Macro Miners. Only.. you cant steal the bm's from these macro'rs.. in fact, you cant even attack them. So again CCP will allow macro'rs to make loads and tons of isk of something that they shouldn't be. I hate copying bookmarks as it is. But I also have alot of friends that join this game, in fact. Have one that joined last week. But will I have time to get him the insta's for our area, stations, safe spots? no. And I'm not going to sit and copy 500+ bookmarks 5 at a time for each person. I get pains in my click finger bad enough as it is. This is just an all around BAD idea. Give us a solar system thats it's OWN cluster, and let us go there to copy bookmarks until CCP / Dev's can devise a true solution to this nearly 4 year old gripe. -DCO ./~Malium Imperium~\.
Azulios Incarnation of Evil	Posted - 2006.08.30 15:21:00 - [499] Actually, I've always wondered why they never just had a trainable skill that could reduce the warp to option - seems they had a skill for just about everything else so why not this. BMs started off quietly, but quickly became standard and as popular as they are today - but they were not designed to be used by us in this way - we were just clever and figured out that we could. That said and done, they cant just go and nerf BMs altogther - not now that were used to it. But it definately seems that they plan to ween us off. I wont argue the pro's and con's of this, I'm just stating it as it is. Though the trainable skill idea could definately be introduced along side this nerf, to at least allow ALL players (new and old) to have a fair and equal chance to benefit from the changes. Piracy Stuff, arrrr
Butter Dog ISS Navy Task Force Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2006.08.30 15:22:00 - [500] Originally by: Arvo Henderson Fit the Probe launcher if you want. But it doesn't need to be online unless you're going to use it, or you will be using it while trying to break through a camp?. Get to a safespot, offline the cloak and online the probe launcher. What and then sit there unable to warp to your results while you wait for you cap to get up to 95%? Get real.

Arvo Henderson Draconis Navitas Aeterna Pure.	Posted - 2006.08.30 15:25:00 - [501] Edited by: Arvo Henderson on 30/08/2006 15:25:53 Originally by: Butter Dog Originally by: Arvo Henderson Fit the Probe launcher if you want. But it doesn't need to be online unless you're going to use it, or you will be using it while trying to break through a camp?. Get to a safespot, offline the cloak and online the probe launcher. What and then sit there unable to warp to your results while you wait for you cap to get up to 95%? Get real. How much cap does eat a probe launcher? Not much. How fast is the cap recharge rate in a Helios with capacitor skills maxed (or at level 4)? Fast. How long take your probes to yield any result? Longer than your cap recharges to 100%. Do you need to have the scan probe launcher online for the probes to work (once launched, ofc)? I haven't ever tried to do that It wasn't necessary
Butter Dog ISS Navy Task Force Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2006.08.30 15:31:00 - [502] Originally by: Arvo Henderson How much cap does eat a probe launcher? Not much. How fast is the cap recharge rate in a Helios with capacitor skills maxed (or at level 4)? Fast. How long take your probes to yield any result? Longer than your cap recharges to 100%. Do you need to have the scan probe launcher online for the probes to work (once launched, ofc)? I haven't ever tried to do that It wasn't necessary What are you talking about? Are you even playing the same game as me? To online an offline module requires 95% cap, and uses most of that to online the module. However, to online the probe launcher you would have to offline the cloak if you had no CPU II's fitted. Obviously you can't warp to a target uncloaked, so you would have to wait for your cap to regen to 95% before onlining the cloak again. This is frankly ridiculous. Give it up, because you lost the argument the moment Tux said things WERE being returned to the pre-Dragon stage.
Irishi Ka	Posted - 2006.08.30 15:36:00 - [503] Maybe insta copying 5 at a time will take less time than copying loads at a time now and be more acurate because of it. IE less insta loss on multiple copying. The good thing with that change is the lag issue. People cant just use alts and copy 1000's of instas at a time while protecting there pos's. If they did they would have to copy them every 5 bm's and take an active role in doing it possibly keeping there mind of battles etc. The thing is we just dont know untill its happened.
Kim Chee Caldari	Posted - 2006.08.30 15:42:00 - [504] Just to get this straight.... Covert Ops ships currently can't shoot while cloaked, can't target while cloaked, can't warp while cloaked (unless you're flying the EWAR version with the god-awful expensive cloak), and if they decloak, fire missiles, and re-cloak.... the missiles mysteriously vanish if they have to travel more than about 40km... even if their range is double that. Once said missiles are away, the ability to re-cloak and avoid being vaporized depands on your cloaking device taking hold before their targeting system gets a lock on you... quite often people with sensor boosters can lock you fast enough to get you anyways. The NEW patch will remove the ability to re-cloak at all, by causing the cloak to disengage as soon as anyone attempts to obtain a target lock. Since NPC's and most player auto-target you back, that means always. In addition, supposedly the Kali expansion will eventually provide ways for folks with scanners to detect cloaked ships, even if they're sitting around doing nothing (which is all we can do now)? Hmmmm.... can I ask that my next clone mark those sectors of my brain as empty, so I can reuse it for Vaccuum Basket Weaving V, or something else useful? Maybe I can sell my manticore if I bundle it with some anaconda mines.... <=----=> *Vila Restal: I'm entitled to my opinion. Kerr Avon*: It is your assumption that we are entitled to it as well that is irritating.
Tas Devil JUDGE DREAD Inc. Forces of Freedom	Posted - 2006.08.30 15:48:00 - [505] Originally by: Harisdrop Tuxford was out of the loop when the fix was placed. He stated that there was a change to covert op cloaks. The old way worked fine. He was going to look into getting it changed. He did not know it was called a bug that only was at the cloakers side not the effect of locking had on cloaking. I will use my great globe of 3 years of patches and say that as it is now is what most dev's wanted. That the group as a whole want cloaking to be less used as a sniper ship and an annoyance. They want them to be used as part of a fleet where they are one of many and you can be in and out of battle with out notice. I believe this is where we are. Consider they want more fleet battles where there are two forces with cargo cans everywhere. They want covert ops in the middle opening up on certain targets and noit being noticed and recloaking. If you are noticed then you are not covert. You cover is blown and try again. I believe that we are getting to the most detail specifics of EVE and we are transforming each battle with each patch. I say horray. online translation FTL... its impossible to understand what you are trying to say... The best Laugh ever ... Credit goes to Killer8 for this ! Oh and apparently the mods tell me there is bad language on his site so beware kids :)
Eteoneus Nun Amun Veritas Immortalis	Posted - 2006.08.30 15:58:00 - [506] Originally by: Tuxford About the cloaking issue. There has been a little in house misunderstanding. The problem is that the way cloaking works now is that if you are being targetted but aren't locked you can cloak but the lock attempt isn't broken so when you're locked you get uncloaked but there is a bug where the uncloaking visual effect isn't performed so you happily think you're still cloaked. The fix in the patch notes and the one Kieron mentioned fixes the issue of not seeing you uncloak. However cloaks didn't use to work this way, if nobody had you locked when you cloaked, all locking attempts were broken and you stayed happily cloaked. That is the way it supposed to work and we'll be restoring it back the way it was. I don't really know when that will happen though. It was really news to me that this "wasn't a bug" until this morning so I've been talking to other devs and bughunters about this. So what will happen to pilots who already lost a ship due to this bug? ---
Lo3d3R Implant Liberation Front	Posted - 2006.08.30 15:58:00 - [507] Edited by: Lo3d3R on 30/08/2006 15:59:45 I hope CCP will never lower the jump too range as a bookmark fix, will be so game breaking not only for pirates... for every pvp minded player. ___________________ Eating Chopped Bear:
Cpt Roberts	Posted - 2006.08.30 16:08:00 - [508] Originally by: Arvo Henderson Originally by: Damien Smith Originally by: Arvo Henderson Originally by: "Chewan Mesa" snip if I was a cov ops pilot, who knows that attempts to lock on my ship (lock in progress) will negate to use my cloak, I am sure of one thing: I won't stay there sitting waiting for the lock to complete. I warp to a planet/moon/whatever and warp back cloaked. Where is the 'retard' part? First, Nemesis can't warp cloaked and needs to uncloak, to eat their shoot, as far as I know. Second, you are pointing at the right thing to do, with both the Arazu & Nemesis, which is to dampen the guys so they can't lock (and shoot) you, giving ample time to warp out of harms way or your buddies to come up. In my post I pointed out what CCP could do about bombers: allow to mount an extra cruise launcher/tweak damage bonuses. You are complaining about a very concrete thing: the very same tactic I've grown sick of seen being employed. Which consists in: 1) A gang is waiting on a gate for targets to come 2) a cov ops jumps in 3) everyone tries to lock the cov ops 4) cov ops cloaks and stays there without any further need to worry about being shooted unless they uncloak. I guess that from someone employing this tactic, you feel very uber and have a laugh about the guys on the gate. But me, usually one of the guys at the gate, it is quite frustrating, and unfair tbh. So difficult is to warp away (uncloaked) and back (cloaked)? Really? What are stabs/nanos for? In a 1v1 situation like the one you depicted, why you can't dampen the guy? Originally by: Damien Smith I'm glad we've had an official word on this and I'm happy to wait patiently now that we know it's going to be fixed. Boo to all you cloak haters too. I don't hate cloaks: I have trained to level 4 almost all cloaking skills. I just don't use them much, nor abuse the cloak power. So I don't have get addicted to that advantage too much. More on the contrary. Boo to those that use and abuse "I-Win" buttons and complain loud when CCP tries to remove them. Even GingerMagician, a character I wouldn't like to be related with and a guy that knows about PVP much more than you and me together, thinks that changing the cloak mechanics wouldn't be as bad. yu are a BIG carebear that im even saw.... sorry man yu never fly a manticore, never understand how it works, iem 100 % sure yu are one from 1000 carebears +decad that spammed CCp with petitions about that a manticore : can only use cloak 1 or tech2 or named a manticore cannt warp cloaked a manticore is so slow like a BC to going in to warp , how yu dude want after jumpe move yu ass fast enough? a manticore is a hit and run ship , or runn hit runn yu need unlcoak to fire a covertops is a scout/spy ship do yu saw anytime a spy that came to hostil and saed hello iem spy ? fix here yu can scan covertops with a scaner, for the warpins on covertops manticore have no defense... papership... he is slow as hell, only cloaked fast so where is here the LOGIC?? manticores was beutyfull but hard to fly ships, now unflyable THX CAREBEARS FTW Recon ships/cloak are the dam idiotic new future,the ships have defense and , and the bonuses on the cloeaked version with Jamm or scramble are UEBR yu heve here no chance to engange first yu dont say that a falcon move behind yu ass, in a sniper BS / hac yu have longrange mountet, how yu want engange it ? leason two, covert ops on recon very bad maybe yu change like SB¦s only to a tech2 cloak ? it would be better than yu understand ? here no more logics
Verite Rendition Caldari AUS Corporation CORE.	Posted - 2006.08.30 16:12:00 - [509] Considering it's what? 4pm in CCP-land right now, I think it's safe to assume that CCP is not going to respond to the majority of our criticism before implementing the patch. ---- AUS Corp Lead Megalomanic
Carah Chorn	Posted - 2006.08.30 16:18:00 - [510] Originally by: Alex Harumichi This has got to be a joke. First off, covops ships which are already iffy to fly because they require a currently 60M module (price direct result of sloppy game design with t2 cloaks and the broken BPO system) become instant road kill if anyone so much as manages to start locking them? Second, the jump queue system, which already has a near-20-page thread detailing why it's killing pvp in the game, will be left as is? Do the devs have any idea of what the above two will do to the game? Covops are already screwed due to cloak issues, and now this. And since this thread might actually get some proper dev response (unlike aforementioned N-page thread), how about someone official coming here and telling us how: a) we're supposed to move gangs system-to-system without them trickling one-by-one into the waiting arms of a gate camp b) we're supposed to escort anything, when the escorts might get randomly separated from the target at any gate? c) we're supposed to have tactical warfare in general, when any gate might randomly not function with no way to know in advance? And don't give me crap about "it only happens in major hub system". It happens all the time, sometimes with systems with only 2-3 other people in them. It happens in 1.0. It happens in 0.4. It happens in 0.0. People are losing ships to it all the time, and there is no way they can fight it. Other than not use jump gates. Seriously, these two points seriously make me question where CCP is headed right now, and if the people in charge have a clue anymore. Or if there really is anyone in charge, is everyone competent in panic mode scrambling after server performance problems and the rest are making these decisions? If these changes are intended to stay, we need discussion right now about: 1) the complete plan for covert ops and cloaking, assuming there is one. Why was the cloaking change implemented, what problem is it trying to solve. 2) an explanation of how we're supposed to have tactical PVP in the game with the random gate queues, ideally with a discussion of what real problem this was trying to solve (and why that problem is bigger than the disaster it's causing), and an explanation of what the final system will look like. We're waiting. And skip the pseudo-funny "we were drunk at the time" stuff, if ceased to be funny some time ago as a response to serious player issues, and just looks like what it is (an attempt to skirt the issue). signed



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