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CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 348	Posted - 2015.10.02 17:04:01 - [1] - Quote Hello fellow Capsuleers! CCP Terminus here to share some design stats for the new T2 Expedition Frigate. As some of you may know from the Evesterdam presentation by CCP Foxfour, this new frigate will be focusing on ice mining in the far reaches of New Eden. We think it will give a chance for the more adventurous miners out there to explore and mining valuable ice in places they havenGÇÖt had a chance to before, such as shattered wormholes and null-sec. So without further ado, here are the stats: Discovery Expedition Frigates bonuses (per skill level): 5% reduction to Ice Harvesting duration 4% bonus to all shield resistances Mining Frigate bonuses (per skill level): 5% reduction to Ice Harvesting duration 5% bonus to Mining yield Role Bonuses: 200% bonus to Mining yield 50% reduction to Ice Harvesting duration 50% reduction in Cloaking Devices CPU requirement Cloak reactivation delay and targeting delay reduced to 5 seconds No penalty to ship max velocity when using Cloaking Devices Slot layout: 3 H, 4 M, 3 L, 1 Turret 2 Rig Slots, 400 Calibration Fittings: 40 PWG, 280 CPU Defense (shields / armour / hull): 1100 / 400 / 500 Base shield resistances (EM/Therm/Kin/Exp): 0 / 50 / 40 / 20 Base armor resistances (EM/Therm/Kin/Exp): 60 / 10 / 25 / 35 Capacitor (amount / recharge rate / average cap per second): 300 / 125s / 2.4 Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / warp speed / align time): 420 / 2.4 / 1,600,000 / 5.5 / 5.32s Drones (bandwidth / bay): 15 / 30 Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 20km / 750 / 4 Sensor strength: 10 Magnetometric Signature radius: 40 Cargo capacity (cargo / ore): 200 / 15000 The Discovery will also be able to fit one of three new frigate sized Ice Mining Lasers, which can only be fitted to expedition frigates. They have the following stats: Ice Mining Laser I Skill Requirements: Mining IV, Ice Harvesting I Fittings: 5 PWG, 50 CPU Activation Cost: 10 GJ Optimal Range: 7 Km Duration: 360s Mining Amount: 1000 m3 Ice Mining Laser II Skill Requirements: Mining IV, Ice Harvesting V Fittings: 6 PWG, 60 CPU Activation Cost: 15 GJ Optimal Range: 8 Km Duration: 330s Mining Amount: 1000 m3 ORE Ice Mining Laser Skill Requirements: Mining IV, Ice Harvesting I Fittings: 6 PWG, 60 CPU Activation Cost: 15 GJ Optimal Range: 11 Km Duration: 330s Mining Amount: 1000 m3 Some notes: The Discovery mines ice slightly slower than mining barges, but mines individual blocks at a rapid pace with all its duration reductions. Standard ore mining in a Discovery will be about as fast as a Venture due to the 200% role bonus to mining yield, but will be slower than a Prospect. While the Prospect can fit the new Ice Mining Laser modules, and has an extra turret slot to fit two, it is still much slower at mining ice than the Discovery, and will require more trips back due to the smaller ore bay. The Discovery cannot fit covert ops cloaking devices, though it does get bonuses and penalty reductions to fitting regular ones. The Discovery and Prospect will be the only ship capable of mining ice from the frigate only Shattered Wormholes. WeGÇÖre hoping the Discovery works well for ninja mining the more valuable ice from null-sec. With its speed, shield tanking, and cloaking bonuses players should be able to make runs into null-sec for some of the crunchier ice. PS. Check for an update from Seagull later today on more stuff that's upcoming from us @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters


CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 348	Posted - 2015.10.02 17:04:45 - [2] - Quote Reserved for Clarifications additional comments @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters

Selto Black Pan Galactic Gargle Blasters Ocularis Inferno 3	Posted - 2015.10.02 17:19:29 - [3] - Quote I like this, however, it does put a bit of a skill wall up for younger players who wish to gather resources under hostile conditions.
MuraSaki Siki Minmatar Ship Construction Services 64	Posted - 2015.10.02 17:20:38 - [4] - Quote when does Discovering plan to ship? EDIT : oh i see the update in heading
Baali Tekitsu AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse 919	Posted - 2015.10.02 17:21:51 - [5] - Quote The powercreep has now arrived in the ice belts aswell. RATE LIKE SUBSCRIBE
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE 1829	Posted - 2015.10.02 17:51:01 - [6] - Quote beware ninja ice miners! @ChainsawPlankto
Laenatus ElitistOps Pandemic Legion 3	Posted - 2015.10.02 17:53:56 - [7] - Quote Neat. When is this going to be on sisi? :x
Xindi Kraid Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd. 1050	Posted - 2015.10.02 17:54:14 - [8] - Quote Why can't the Venture fit the new ice miners?

CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 350	Posted - 2015.10.02 17:55:44 - [9] - Quote Xindi Kraid wrote: Why can't the Venture fit the new ice miners? You have to be part of the cool club to mine ice of course. i.e train for 8 days into a mining barge @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters

Jiulia Amok. Goonswarm Federation 2	Posted - 2015.10.02 17:57:55 - [10] - Quote To bad you are not announcing upgrades for the rorqual.
Bienator II madmen of the skies 3399	Posted - 2015.10.02 17:58:33 - [11] - Quote the actual question is: what color is it? how to fix eve: 1) remove ECM 2) rename dampeners to ECM 3) add new anti-drone ewar for caldari 4) give offgrid boosters ongrid combat value
Laetitia Nzero Southern Cross Incorporated Flying Dangerous 243	Posted - 2015.10.02 17:59:38 - [12] - Quote What colour will it be?

CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 353	Posted - 2015.10.02 18:00:01 - [13] - Quote Bienator II wrote: the actual question is: what color is it? Laetitia Nzero wrote: What colour will it be? lol, art has the final say but I'm hoping for something icy @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters

Laenatus ElitistOps Pandemic Legion 3	Posted - 2015.10.02 18:01:34 - [14] - Quote Anyone wanna guess what isk/hour you could make with one of these in null?
FT Diomedes The Graduates Get Off My Lawn 1780	Posted - 2015.10.02 18:03:23 - [15] - Quote Selto Black wrote: I like this, however, it does put a bit of a skill wall up for younger players who wish to gather resources under hostile conditions. No, it does not. They can still attempt the same thing in cheap ships. Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. So, why do I post here? I'm stubborn.
Thanatos Marathon Black Fox Marauders 521	Posted - 2015.10.02 18:04:31 - [16] - Quote What size FW plex gate restrictions will it have (if any)?
FT Diomedes The Graduates Get Off My Lawn 1780	Posted - 2015.10.02 18:05:20 - [17] - Quote I like the idea. I'm sure it will have some use for WH folks, but I have yet to ever see someone ninja mining ores in null sec - gas, yes - but not ores. Not sure ninja ice mining will ever be a thing. Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. So, why do I post here? I'm stubborn.
Querns GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation 1979	Posted - 2015.10.02 18:19:54 - [18] - Quote The two utility highs on the Discovery are very interesting. This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
FT Diomedes The Graduates Get Off My Lawn 1780	Posted - 2015.10.02 18:31:28 - [19] - Quote Thanatos Marathon wrote: What size FW plex gate restrictions will it have (if any)? I like the cut of your jib. Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. So, why do I post here? I'm stubborn.
Querns GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation 1979	Posted - 2015.10.02 18:36:39 - [20] - Quote Will there be a Small Ice Harvesting Accelerator rig? This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
Ransu Asanari AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse 361	Posted - 2015.10.02 18:46:11 - [21] - Quote The Prospect with the Covert Ops Cloaking Device makes a great hotdrop vehicle, as well as a way to ninja booster gas in Nullsec. Having the Discovery not able to use a covert cloak, but have better tank and ability to store more ore makes it a more focused, dedicated ore/ice mining ship. A unique feature for the Discovery over the Prospect would be to have an auto-compression ore/ice bay, to reduce the size of the collected ore. Ice is so bulky that getting 15 blocks and having to go back to drop off means you're going to spend a lot of time just warping back to your home system or wormhole gate to gate. Adding this would mean much less trips back, but you are still exposed since you can't warp while cloaked.
PhilKenSebben much shell such corp 0	Posted - 2015.10.02 18:46:42 - [22] - Quote Querns wrote: The two utility highs on the Discovery are very interesting. more like one, no reason to not fit a cloak to this ever with that kind of role bonus
Amarisen Gream Divine Demise Apocalypse Now. 132	Posted - 2015.10.02 18:54:47 - [23] - Quote Me personally I like this... It really helps the Frigate sized hulls. And in which - they fill a role. But, i'm still waiting for my BS sized Mining ship, and this sort of helps lead to that point (just make sure the base price is about 750 million to one billion ISK) xoxo Amarisen Gream
Winter Archipelago Autumn Industrial Enterprises 411	Posted - 2015.10.02 18:56:37 - [24] - Quote Hellooooooo Shattered Ice Fields! I look forward to losing these in Thera! Planning a trip to Thera? Check out http://eve-scout.com/ for a list of the current connections. Once you've made your choice, join the *EvE-Scout* channel and request a scout to make sure your connection is clear!
Harkin Issier Aliastra Gallente Federation 43	Posted - 2015.10.02 19:09:16 - [25] - Quote FT Diomedes wrote: Selto Black wrote: I like this, however, it does put a bit of a skill wall up for younger players who wish to gather resources under hostile conditions. No, it does not. They can still attempt the same thing in cheap ships. To which cheap ships are you referring? The Venture can't fit these new modules. Barges can't fit through frigate-sized WHs. On release, there will be exactly two hulls which can utilize the new ice harvesting modules, both of which are T2.
Ransu Asanari AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse 361	Posted - 2015.10.02 19:16:43 - [26] - Quote I agree- I don't see why the Venture shouldn't be able to fit these small ice harvesting lasers. It doesn't have any bonuses to ice harvesting, and only a 5000m3 cargobay, so it will be extremely inefficient compared to the Prospect/Discovery, but for a very new player at least it would let them participate during group ice mining operations without requiring a Mining Barge. The main thing here is to make sure they are not excluded from participating because of their low SP.
Max Kolonko WATAHA. Unseen Wolves 557	Posted - 2015.10.02 19:27:39 - [27] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: P.S Keep an eye out for an announcement later today from CCP Seagull who will be going over some upcoming features, as well as more announcements in the weeks leading up to EVE Vegas. When you say "later today" and its already well past working hours in Iceland... Read and support: Don't mess with OUR WH's What is Your stance on WH stuff?
Strata Maslav V0LTA WE FORM V0LTA 141	Posted - 2015.10.02 19:29:15 - [28] - Quote Ransu Asanari wrote: I agree- I don't see why the Venture shouldn't be able to fit these small ice harvesting lasers. It doesn't have any bonuses to ice harvesting, and only a 5000m3 cargobay, so it will be extremely inefficient compared to the Prospect/Discovery, but for a very new player at least it would let them participate during group ice mining operations without requiring a Mining Barge. The main thing here is to make sure they are not excluded from participating because of their low SP. I agree, even though from my perspective barges have a low SP ceiling there doesn't seem to be enough justification to stop the venture from using the new Ice mining lasers. We should stay clear of artificially limited modules, otherwise we will miss out on players finding interesting interactions.
Ransu Asanari AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse 362	Posted - 2015.10.02 19:31:49 - [29] - Quote The main thing here is to make sure they are not excluded from participating because of their low SP. For example if the corp decides to take a wormhole chain through the frigate only wormholes to get to a mining source, the SP needed to fly an Expedition Frigate to come along is fairly high. The new player couldn't even haul back ore in a Miasmos, since it can't fit through those holes. CCP Terminus said - it's only 8 days into a Mining Barge, but that doesn't help in this scenario. I don't see the harm in allowing ice mining with a cheap frigate like the Venture, as long as the bonus is VERY weak.
Schelyra Elyte Heeresversuchsanstalt The Bastion 5	Posted - 2015.10.02 19:31:50 - [30] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: Bienator II wrote: the actual question is: what color is it? Laetitia Nzero wrote: What colour will it be? lol, art has the final say but I'm hoping for something icy How about an ice cream truck? with sounds?
Jessica Keyes Phoenix Rising Fleet Dirt Nap Squad. 38	Posted - 2015.10.02 19:32:08 - [31] - Quote I may be dumb but 50% reduction to ice duration role bonus, 5% per level in ice duration for mining frigate and 5% reduction in ice duration for expedition frigate... So if expedition frigate is level 5 then 50% + 5%(5) + 5%(5) = 100% reduction to ice harvest duration. Im sure there is stacking of some sort?
Querns GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation 1980	Posted - 2015.10.02 19:34:45 - [32] - Quote Jessica Keyes wrote: I may be dumb but 50% reduction to ice duration role bonus, 5% per level in ice duration for mining frigate and 5% reduction in ice duration for expedition frigate... So if expedition frigate is level 5 then 50% + 5%(5) + 5%(5) = 100% reduction to ice harvest duration. Im sure there is stacking of some sort? Reductions to ice mining speed stack multiplicatively, not additively. This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
KuroVolt The Legion of Spoon Curatores Veritatis Alliance 2252	Posted - 2015.10.02 19:35:06 - [33] - Quote What colours will it have?! I demand to know the colours! BoBwins Law: As a discussion/war between two large nullsec entities grows longer, the probability of one comparing the other to BoB aproaches near certainty.
Bob Shaftoes TURN LEFT The Camel Empire 53	Posted - 2015.10.02 19:36:49 - [34] - Quote Any particular reason why this and the prospect dont get tech II resists? :p
Jessica Keyes Phoenix Rising Fleet Dirt Nap Squad. 38	Posted - 2015.10.02 19:39:36 - [35] - Quote Querns wrote: Jessica Keyes wrote: I may be dumb but 50% reduction to ice duration role bonus, 5% per level in ice duration for mining frigate and 5% reduction in ice duration for expedition frigate... So if expedition frigate is level 5 then 50% + 5%(5) + 5%(5) = 100% reduction to ice harvest duration. Im sure there is stacking of some sort? Reductions to ice mining speed stack multiplicatively, not additively. Ahh thanks
Kibitt Kallinikov Crimson Serpent Syndicate Heiian Conglomerate 12	Posted - 2015.10.02 19:40:23 - [36] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: So without further ado, here are the stats: Base shield resistances (EM/Therm/Kin/Exp): 0 / 50 / 40 / 20 Base armor resistances (EM/Therm/Kin/Exp): 60 / 10 / 25 / 35 Interesting resist profile you have there. Did you swap Therm and Exp on accident? Also, t2 ORE resists when? (said the PvP pilot)
Ix Method Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic 467	Posted - 2015.10.02 19:52:38 - [37] - Quote Querns wrote: The two utility highs on the Discovery are very interesting. +1, it's something the Prospect could use too too tbh. Travelling at the speed of love.
Harvey James The Sengoku Legacy 1200	Posted - 2015.10.02 19:55:25 - [38] - Quote so is there any difference between covert cloaks and when a normal cloaking device is put on this ship? T3's need to be versatile not have T2 resists, OP dps and tank obsoleting T2 ships entirely. ABC's are clearly T2 in all but name, remove drone assist, nerf sentries, -3 highslots for droneboats Nerf web strength, Make the blaster Eagle worth using
Winter Archipelago Autumn Industrial Enterprises 411	Posted - 2015.10.02 19:55:58 - [39] - Quote Schelyra Elyte wrote: CCP Terminus wrote: Bienator II wrote: the actual question is: what color is it? Laetitia Nzero wrote: What colour will it be? lol, art has the final say but I'm hoping for something icy How about an ice cream truck? with sounds? Ding-a-ling-a ring-a-ding, ring-a-ling-ding-dong, ring-a-ling-a-ling-a-ding dong-a-ling-a-ring-a-dong (bing-gong)! Planning a trip to Thera? Check out http://eve-scout.com/ for a list of the current connections. Once you've made your choice, join the *EvE-Scout* channel and request a scout to make sure your connection is clear!
Kaarous Aldurald Black Hydra Consortium. 14565	Posted - 2015.10.02 19:57:36 - [40] - Quote Quick question. Will the frigate ice lasers be able to be instantly de-activated without any cooldown on their use? Specifically, will this frigate be able to drop it's lasers and instantly activate a cov ops cloak? "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
SpaceSaft Capts Deranged Cavaliers Gentlemen's.Club 160	Posted - 2015.10.02 20:16:51 - [41] - Quote New hulls are always appreciated. Sorry math clarification question: procurer has 300 * 0.4 ( 1-skill0.02) = 108s / block ? and 12k ore hold + 2 low slots discovery has 360 * 0.5 (1-skill0.05)(1-skill0.05) = 101.25s / block ? and 15k ore hold + 3 low slots At max skills the discovery will mine faster than a procurer? Makes sense since one of the main reason to use the proc is the tank, but at least the cargohold seems rather large to me. Quote: The Discovery and Prospect will be the only ship capable of mining ice from the frigate only Shattered Wormholes. That doesn't really make sense to me. Everything can mine or harvest gas, nobody will harvest gas in something else than a venture or a prospect though, Why do you want to deny people the ability to mine ice (in ventures, with say half the boni), when you're not restricting gas? From a technical point of view I assume you're doing the expedition frigate restriction because you want to restrict the module to a ship class and the venture isn't it's own class, it's just a frigate, because :legacy code:? Doesn't explain why you want to restrict it in the first place... The one real complaint I have is that the 'discovery' is not a very fitting name for an industrial ship. Especially one that is as themed as this one. Can't really think of a... cool... name either. Reading up on southpole expeditions "Endurance" seems better, but not optimal either. Idk, maybe someone else in the thread has a better one? Anyway you should really keep "discovery" for an exploration themed ship.
Max Kolonko WATAHA. Unseen Wolves 558	Posted - 2015.10.02 20:28:27 - [42] - Quote Strata Maslav wrote: Ransu Asanari wrote: I agree- I don't see why the Venture shouldn't be able to fit these small ice harvesting lasers. It doesn't have any bonuses to ice harvesting, and only a 5000m3 cargobay, so it will be extremely inefficient compared to the Prospect/Discovery, but for a very new player at least it would let them participate during group ice mining operations without requiring a Mining Barge. The main thing here is to make sure they are not excluded from participating because of their low SP. I agree, even though from my perspective barges have a low SP ceiling there doesn't seem to be enough justification to stop the venture from using the new Ice mining lasers. We should stay clear of artificially limited modules, otherwise we will miss out on players finding interesting interactions. in wh there would be tons of people using them instead of training for t2 variant. Read and support: Don't mess with OUR WH's What is Your stance on WH stuff?
Selaria Unbertable POS Mortem Renegades Of Silence 101	Posted - 2015.10.02 20:34:54 - [43] - Quote Querns wrote: Jessica Keyes wrote: I may be dumb but 50% reduction to ice duration role bonus, 5% per level in ice duration for mining frigate and 5% reduction in ice duration for expedition frigate... So if expedition frigate is level 5 then 50% + 5%(5) + 5%(5) = 100% reduction to ice harvest duration. Im sure there is stacking of some sort? Reductions to ice mining speed stack multiplicatively, not additively. And if I did the math correctly, you end up with a reduction from 330s to 123,75s for the T2 ice lasers... Which means that the base harvesting time of the Discovery will be almost en par with a Skiff with a T2 Ice Harvester, since it will mine 2 blocks per cycle. Pretty amazing.
Selaria Unbertable POS Mortem Renegades Of Silence 101	Posted - 2015.10.02 20:44:20 - [44] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: Discovery ... Role Bonuses: 200% bonus to Mining yield Are you sure it's not 100%? 200% would mean it can harvest 3 blocks per cycle. With all those duration reductions, that seems pretty strong. I mean, that would theoretically even surpass a Hulk. Not that I'm not fond of a pure ice harvesting ship, but that seems a lot... Looks like I have to train another alt into Expedition frigates sooner than later.
Harvey James The Sengoku Legacy 1200	Posted - 2015.10.02 20:45:10 - [45] - Quote SpaceSaft wrote: New hulls are always appreciated. Sorry math clarification question: procurer has 300 * 0.4 ( 1-skill0.02) = 108s / block ? and 12k ore hold + 2 low slots discovery has 360 * 0.5 (1-skill0.05)(1-skill0.05) = 101.25s / block ? and 15k ore hold + 3 low slots At max skills the discovery will mine faster than a procurer? Makes sense since one of the main reason to use the proc is the tank, but at least the cargohold seems rather large to me. Quote: The Discovery and Prospect will be the only ship capable of mining ice from the frigate only Shattered Wormholes. That doesn't really make sense to me. Everything can mine or harvest gas, nobody will harvest gas in something else than a venture or a prospect though, Why do you want to deny people the ability to mine ice (in ventures, with say half the boni), when you're not restricting gas? From a technical point of view I assume you're doing the expedition frigate restriction because you want to restrict the module to a ship class and the venture isn't it's own class, it's just a frigate, because :legacy code:? Doesn't explain why you want to restrict it in the first place... The one real complaint I have is that the 'discovery' is not a very fitting name for an industrial ship. Especially one that is as themed as this one. Can't really think of a... cool... name either. Reading up on southpole expeditions "Endurance" seems better, but not optimal either. Idk, maybe someone else in the thread has a better one? Anyway you should really keep "discovery" for an exploration themed ship. maybe the extractor T3's need to be versatile not have T2 resists, OP dps and tank obsoleting T2 ships entirely. ABC's are clearly T2 in all but name, remove drone assist, nerf sentries, -3 highslots for droneboats Nerf web strength, Make the blaster Eagle worth using
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE 1831	Posted - 2015.10.02 21:46:46 - [46] - Quote Selaria Unbertable wrote: CCP Terminus wrote: Discovery ... Role Bonuses: 200% bonus to Mining yield Are you sure it's not 100%? 200% would mean it can harvest 3 blocks per cycle. With all those duration reductions, that seems pretty strong. I mean, that would theoretically even surpass a Hulk. Not that I'm not fond of a pure ice harvesting ship, but that seems a lot... Looks like I have to train another alt into Expedition frigates sooner than later. it says mining yield, so I was assuming that doesn't count vs ice. otherwise I think it would be insane for mining ice @ChainsawPlankto
elitatwo Eve Minions The-Company 865	Posted - 2015.10.02 21:55:17 - [47] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: Discovery Expedition Frigates bonuses (per skill level): 5% reduction to Ice Harvesting duration 4% bonus to all shield resistances Mining Frigate bonuses (per skill level): 5% reduction to Ice Harvesting duration 5% bonus to Mining yield Thank you for listening! Now I have one concern. The Discovery will be the first tech 2 ship in EVE that has a tech 2 ship as requirement. Is that intended? It has never been the case that a tech2 ships comes from a tech2 ship. It would make much more sense if the Discovery would be a second tech2 iteration of the Venture like assault frigates do. Tired of low and nullsec? Join Eve Minions and experience the beauty of wormholes!
Alundil Isogen 5 1031	Posted - 2015.10.02 21:58:02 - [48] - Quote FT Diomedes wrote: I like the idea. I'm sure it will have some use for WH folks, but I have yet to ever see someone ninja mining ores in null sec - gas, yes - but not ores. Not sure ninja ice mining will ever be a thing. Shattered Wormholes have shattered ice belts. This ship will be the only ice miner capable of getting to those and harvesting ice. So there will be people using them for that in the interest of self-sufficiency. That would be my guess. I'm right behind you
Petrified Old and Petrified Syndication TOG - The Older Gamers Alliance 293	Posted - 2015.10.02 22:00:33 - [49] - Quote I am a bit curious how many people actually use the Prospect for mining? I would assume enough to generate the development of this new ship?
DarkAsh Andrard KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation 0	Posted - 2015.10.02 22:02:42 - [50] - Quote Quote: CCP Terminus wrote: Discovery Expedition Frigates bonuses (per skill level): 5% reduction to Ice Harvesting duration 4% bonus to all shield resistances Mining Frigate bonuses (per skill level): 5% reduction to Ice Harvesting duration 5% bonus to Mining yield What I always wonder is why put that 2nd (per skill level) bonuses there, like if you had the option to train for it less. From what I've seen, all T2's require you to have that secondary skill (destroyer, frigate, cruiser, etc) to V before you can even start to train in the primary T2 skill, in this case Expedition Frigate. Why don't they just put that secondary skill set at x5 into the Role bonus or part of the stats. It would make things a lot clearer, since you have to train it anyway to V. e.g. Discovery Expedition Frigates bonuses (per skill level): 5% reduction to Ice Harvesting duration 4% bonus to all shield resistances Role Bonuses: 200% bonus to Mining yield 75% reduction to Ice Harvesting duration 50% reduction in Cloaking Devices CPU requirement 25% bonus to Mining yield Cloak reactivation delay and targeting delay reduced to 5 seconds No penalty to ship max velocity when using Cloaking Devices
Centurax Unsettled Unsettled. 67	Posted - 2015.10.02 22:03:45 - [51] - Quote Firstly this is very cool, cant wait to have these available. Not sure if 15,000 (15 ice blocks) is enough cargo space, how about giving it the ability to compress the ice blocks? Kinda a side note, but related: Ok we have the Venture, Prospect and now the Discovery, is there any chance of having a destroyer sized or a covert ops variation of the Noctis as a mining boost ship to go along with these ships?
DarkAsh Andrard KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation 0	Posted - 2015.10.02 22:03:56 - [52] - Quote Petrified wrote: I am a bit curious how many people actually use the Prospect for mining? I would assume enough to generate the development of this new ship? I use it for gas mining (or did) all the time when I was in WH space. The bonus + covert cloak is awesome for ninja gas mining :)
Durakili Mindstar Technology Get Off My Lawn 1	Posted - 2015.10.02 22:49:16 - [53] - Quote Centurax wrote: Firstly this is very cool, cant wait to have these available. Not sure if 15,000 (15 ice blocks) is enough cargo space, how about giving it the ability to compress the ice blocks? Thats a Skiff hold..... so it should be ok.... Plus, its designed as the Ninja ice miner- so filling up fast and GFTO should be its M.O..... Although- if those yields stay, I'm going to ditch my Hulk miners and just run these puppies. The yield puts it in Hulk territory, with a faster align potential (and sig tanking rats as well)...
Tseehn Marhn Rat Duck 1	Posted - 2015.10.02 22:54:09 - [54] - Quote Harvey James wrote: so is there any difference between covert cloaks and when a normal cloaking device is put on this ship? You can't use a standard cloak while in warp.
Ersahi Kir Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic 425	Posted - 2015.10.02 23:22:21 - [55] - Quote SpaceSaft wrote: New hulls are always appreciated. Sorry math clarification question: procurer has 300 * 0.4 ( 1-skill0.02) = 108s / block ? and 12k ore hold + 2 low slots discovery has 360 * 0.5 (1-skill0.05)(1-skill0.05) = 101.25s / block ? and 15k ore hold + 3 low slots At max skills the discovery will mine faster than a procurer? You're math is off. The procurer has 2x 2% bonuses (one for mining barge, one for exhumer). That will knock off another 10.8 seconds. elitatwo wrote: CCP Terminus wrote: Discovery Expedition Frigates bonuses (per skill level): 5% reduction to Ice Harvesting duration 4% bonus to all shield resistances Mining Frigate bonuses (per skill level): 5% reduction to Ice Harvesting duration 5% bonus to Mining yield Thank you for listening! Now I have one concern. The Discovery will be the first tech 2 ship in EVE that has a tech 2 ship as requirement. Is that intended? It has never been the case that a tech2 ships comes from a tech2 ship. It would make much more sense if the Discovery would be a second tech2 iteration of the Venture like assault frigates do. This ship uses the same skill as the prospect. They're not adding a new skill for it, they're adding another ship that is available to people who already have expedition frigates.
Harvey James The Sengoku Legacy 1200	Posted - 2015.10.02 23:24:18 - [56] - Quote Tseehn Marhn wrote: Harvey James wrote: so is there any difference between covert cloaks and when a normal cloaking device is put on this ship? You can't use a standard cloak while in warp. Ah, true, good point T3's need to be versatile not have T2 resists, OP dps and tank obsoleting T2 ships entirely. ABC's are clearly T2 in all but name, remove drone assist, nerf sentries, -3 highslots for droneboats Nerf web strength, Make the blaster Eagle worth using
Captain Davison Malachi Keep Detachments 30	Posted - 2015.10.02 23:27:40 - [57] - Quote Petrified wrote: I am a bit curious how many people actually use the Prospect for mining? I would assume enough to generate the development of this new ship? I do. Vastly safer than a conventional mining barge or ship for lowsec and nullsec mining. Well, maybe not friendly nullsec, but hostile? I know literally just yesterday I used one to evade a battlecruiser ambush squad. Cloaked when they dropped on the grid, angled myself nearly straight down off the ecliptic and burned to safety under cloak at 500 m/s. Poor guy couldn't catch me and sat around trying to figure out which way I might have gone while I orbited him at 75 km.
Galphii Oberon Incorporated Get Off My Lawn 346	Posted - 2015.10.02 23:39:05 - [58] - Quote Seems like a reasonable frigate with a very niche purpose (as t2 ships generally are). I do question the value of the ORE mining lasers and strips. Slightly better range is basically useless, especially for the prices these things tend to go for. How about a slightly better cycle time instead? More incentive to use them and of course more to lose when the ships explodes "Wow, that internet argument completely changed my fundamental belief system," said no one, ever.
Mr Grape Drink Sugar - Water - Purple Winmatar Republic 42	Posted - 2015.10.02 23:48:02 - [59] - Quote Can we discuss the faction variant? A range bonus isn't going to cut it on a frig sized module for ice. Look at the ORE Miner. It gets a bonus to M3 AND range. Making it kinda worth the value. Can you think about matching this to the Ice Miner as well? Thank you, A concerned resident of Outer Ring :D
Mr Grape Drink Sugar - Water - Purple Winmatar Republic 42	Posted - 2015.10.02 23:48:49 - [60] - Quote Galphii wrote: Seems like a reasonable frigate with a very niche purpose (as t2 ships generally are). I do question the value of the ORE mining lasers and strips. Slightly better range is basically useless, especially for the prices these things tend to go for. How about a slightly better cycle time instead? More incentive to use them and of course more to lose when the ships explodes Another who agrees with me :D
Aivlis Eldelbar Caldari Independent Navy Reserve Curatores Veritatis Alliance 108	Posted - 2015.10.03 01:58:59 - [61] - Quote Sorry if this has been asked already, but why allow the Prospect to fit a covops cloak and not this one? Alternatively, could you decouple the covert bridgeability from the covops cloak to allow this new frigate to be inserted via blops portal like the Prospect?
Selaria Unbertable POS Mortem Renegades Of Silence 101	Posted - 2015.10.03 02:27:03 - [62] - Quote Chainsaw Plankton wrote: Selaria Unbertable wrote: CCP Terminus wrote: Discovery ... Role Bonuses: 200% bonus to Mining yield Are you sure it's not 100%? 200% would mean it can harvest 3 blocks per cycle. With all those duration reductions, that seems pretty strong. I mean, that would theoretically even surpass a Hulk. Not that I'm not fond of a pure ice harvesting ship, but that seems a lot... Looks like I have to train another alt into Expedition frigates sooner than later. it says mining yield, so I was assuming that doesn't count vs ice. otherwise I think it would be insane for mining ice You're right, a 200% bonus to ice harvesting would be a little too much and quite overpowered.
Querns GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation 1981	Posted - 2015.10.03 02:27:18 - [63] - Quote Aivlis Eldelbar wrote: Sorry if this has been asked already, but why allow the Prospect to fit a covops cloak and not this one? Alternatively, could you decouple the covert bridgeability from the covops cloak to allow this new frigate to be inserted via blops portal like the Prospect? If they did this, then the Prospect would have no reason to exist. Tradeoffs are important. This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
elitatwo Eve Minions The-Company 867	Posted - 2015.10.03 02:30:53 - [64] - Quote Ersahi Kir wrote: This ship uses the same skill as the prospect. They're not adding a new skill for it, they're adding another ship that is available to people who already have expedition frigates. Thank you, dear for clearing that up. Tired of low and nullsec? Join Eve Minions and experience the beauty of wormholes!
elitatwo Eve Minions The-Company 867	Posted - 2015.10.03 02:37:18 - [65] - Quote Petrified wrote: I am a bit curious how many people actually use the Prospect for mining? I would assume enough to generate the development of this new ship? I do sometimes. It may only be 3 or 4 times a year that I mine but the Prospect is an amazing mining boat, so I have my depot nearby and put either mining lasers or deep core miners on - that mercoxite doesn't mine itself. The first time it was a necessaty because I lost my dearest Procurer with a failed bait attempt. Mining speed it roughly even to the Procurer a (tiny) bit less orebay but I mean you already have 10k m-¦ and frigate mobility - what's not to like? Can't wait to sneak into the next c13 and collect some ice. Oh btw, can we get a 20 or 35mbit dronebay? Tired of low and nullsec? Join Eve Minions and experience the beauty of wormholes!
Selaria Unbertable POS Mortem Renegades Of Silence 101	Posted - 2015.10.03 02:55:48 - [66] - Quote Okay, just did the math again (I assume this is correct, slightly drunk at the moment ): An Ice Harvester II has a cycle time of 250s. Ice Harvesting 5 reduces the cycle time by 25%. This results in (I use the Skiff for comparison, since I usually use it for ice harvesting): Skiff: Mining Barge 5: 10% reduction in cycle time Exhumer 5: 10% reduction in cycle time Role Bonus 5: 60% reduction in cycle time That results (all bonuses are multiplied) in: 0.75 * 0.9 * 0.9 * 0.4 * 250s = 60.75s (without rigs or Ice Harvester Upgrades) Discovery: Expedition Frigate 5: 25% reduction in cycle time Mining Frigat 5: 25% reduction in cycle time Role Bonus 5: 50% reduction in cycle time That results (all bonuses are multiplied) in: 0.75 * 0.75 * 0.75 * 0.5 * 330s = 69.91s (Ice Mining Laser II without rigs or Ice Harvester Upgrades) This is actually pretty close. Both ships have the same ore hold size, but the Discovery will be much cheaper (at least after a few weeks). If you don't want to skill into mining barges/exhumers, this seems to be a valid alternative. Can't wait to get my hands on a few of those.
Rowells ANZAC ALLIANCE Fidelas Constans 2760	Posted - 2015.10.03 03:14:47 - [67] - Quote So about that small mercoxit mining rig...
Eternus8lux8lucis Primus Inc. LEGIO ASTARTES ARCANUM 511	Posted - 2015.10.03 05:19:52 - [68] - Quote I think the cargo hold is a bit to big and the mining bonus a bit to strong comparatively imo but its not bad and will fill that role very well. But 9 secs difference in cycle times for a max skilled skiff and this new ship is a bit close. And the likely price difference between ships is huge. It will also nearly make ganking a miner impossible. Gank starts landing you cloak up and bugger off. Orbit a roid with full AB on with skiff sized ore bay potential? Yeah you need to nerf it a bit in one area either cargo hold or cycle time. The other factor will be price imo. To create a ship thats roughly the same as the cost of the prospect means you get skiff abilities for a fraction of the cost for replacement and made them cheaper than the t1 barges for the job. As much as I will love to see the ganker tears as miners retrain and use these to blot out the skies Id love to see a restriction on their use in high sec only, that is to say to NOT be able to be used in high at all. These are perfect for low, null and whs and should be restricted to it as such. Leaving them able to fly in all areas of space(high sec) as will be a mistake imo. As for the people wondering why the venture shouldnt have this is this fact: Skill for operation of Expedition Frigates. This skill cannot be trained on Trial Accounts. If you give the ice mining laser to the venture youll get this.... BOTS!! BOTS AS FAR AS THE EYE CAN SEE!! And on trial accounts as throwaway ice miners. Yeah no sorry thatd be DUMB! As it stands itll take a full paid account to get there. And a yes to the small ice and merc rigs as well. Imam: Have you heard anything I've said? Richard B. Riddick: You said it's all circling the drain, the whole universe. Right? Imam: That's right. Richard B. Riddick: Had to end sometime.
Ransu Asanari AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse 370	Posted - 2015.10.03 05:27:14 - [69] - Quote So just make the Ice Harvesting skill not trainable on Trial accounts. Problem solved. I don't think we should be balancing based on what we think bots could do anyways.
Glasgow Dunlop The Dark Space Initiative Scary Wormhole People 290	Posted - 2015.10.03 07:09:07 - [70] - Quote This ship better come as a default blue/white ;) with a nice 'X' design ;D @glasgowdunlop #tweetfleet TDSIN Director : Join 'TDSIN pub' for more info, Join today! Glasgow / Newcastle EVE Meets Organiser
Trinkets friend Sudden Buggery 2781	Posted - 2015.10.03 07:22:38 - [71] - Quote Cool. Dat turret slot, nothing could go wrong. nothing. Doctor Prince Field Marshall of Prolapse. Alliance and Grand Sasquatch of Bob We take Batphones. Contact us at Hola Batmanuel - Free call 1800-UR-MOMMA ~~ Localectomy Blog ~~
Brokk Witgenstein Extreme Agony The Wraithguard. 32	Posted - 2015.10.03 10:03:11 - [72] - Quote ..... 15 Icecubes? That does not compare well to mining barges and exhumers alike. A cruiser sized hull is supposed to carry MORE, not less than a frig! The 10k a Prospect could carry sounded okay-ish for the price, and I get that the non-cloaky version has to do better; but then I'd rather go for 7500 on the Prospect and 10000 on the Discovery. Otherwise, you risk obsoleting the Exhumer series altogether.
Aurure Krautfleet Goonswarm Federation 7	Posted - 2015.10.03 11:09:22 - [73] - Quote With respective skills to V, a Tech 2 or ORE miner and 2 Tech 2 ILUs, this thing should fill it's cargo in just under 13 minutes and, assuming jetcanmining, be able to pull about 42m ISK/hr mining Dark Glitter. Neat!
Malice Redeemer Redeemer Group 159	Posted - 2015.10.03 11:15:09 - [74] - Quote Mr Grape Drink wrote: Galphii wrote: Seems like a reasonable frigate with a very niche purpose (as t2 ships generally are). I do question the value of the ORE mining lasers and strips. Slightly better range is basically useless, especially for the prices these things tend to go for. How about a slightly better cycle time instead? More incentive to use them and of course more to lose when the ships explodes Another who agrees with me :D Ya, I'm sure that will help with the prices. * eyeroll*

CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 384	Posted - 2015.10.03 11:15:31 - [75] - Quote Kibitt Kallinikov wrote: CCP Terminus wrote: So without further ado, here are the stats: Base shield resistances (EM/Therm/Kin/Exp): 0 / 50 / 40 / 20 Base armor resistances (EM/Therm/Kin/Exp): 60 / 10 / 25 / 35 Interesting resist profile you have there. Did you swap Therm and Exp on accident? Also, t2 ORE resists when? (said the PvP pilot) Might have, should be the same as the Prospect, which has the Gallente spread @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters


CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 385	Posted - 2015.10.03 11:33:50 - [76] - Quote Selaria Unbertable wrote: CCP Terminus wrote: Discovery ... Role Bonuses: 200% bonus to Mining yield Are you sure it's not 100%? 200% would mean it can harvest 3 blocks per cycle. With all those duration reductions, that seems pretty strong. I mean, that would theoretically even surpass a Hulk. Not that I'm not fond of a pure ice harvesting ship, but that seems a lot... Looks like I have to train another alt into Expedition frigates sooner than later. That's the bonus to ore yield, it doesn't affect ice. @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters

Arthur Aihaken CODE.d 4689	Posted - 2015.10.03 14:29:31 - [77] - Quote Why not just give this a Covert Ops cloak and be done with it? I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
Aurure Krautfleet Goonswarm Federation 7	Posted - 2015.10.03 21:18:15 - [78] - Quote Arthur Aihaken wrote: Why not just give this a Covert Ops cloak and be done with it? Because they obviously want you to see it on dscan when it's warping.
Lelira Cirim The Graduates Get Off My Lawn 229	Posted - 2015.10.03 21:34:24 - [79] - Quote Discoverice? Dicecovery? Da ice recovery? Just spitballing my ship names, carry on. Do not actively tank my patience. \|\| EVE University Wiki Team
Beta Maoye 80	Posted - 2015.10.03 23:47:45 - [80] - Quote Remove the cloaking bonuses. Give it turrets, ewar mid slots and damage bonus, i.e. a combat mining frigate.
Justin Cody Hard Knocks Inc. Hard Knocks Citizens 307	Posted - 2015.10.03 23:50:35 - [81] - Quote make that a 400% mining bonus for the single turret and it will be acceptable
Scuzzy Logic Nightmare Machinery 149	Posted - 2015.10.04 03:17:15 - [82] - Quote Gas Mining model WHEN?!
Zevix Industrial Pursuits 10	Posted - 2015.10.04 04:10:58 - [83] - Quote I see someones been listening and adapting my ideas again: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5942986#post5942986
GrandLynx University of Caille Gallente Federation 2	Posted - 2015.10.04 04:58:45 - [84] - Quote Q1 Will there be a nerf to existing Ice sources so that there is increased attraction risk? Currently why would a high-sec miner or enclave null miner leave safety? Q2. Drop the frigate mining bonus for a probe/scan bonus? This is thing is expected to be able to get through WHs Q3. Will the invention/manufacture path for the Ice Miner 2 will be a convoluted as Strip Miner? Q4. Needs to be more incentive for the ORE Ice Laser. The only way to get these things will be through the LP store in Outer Ring. Or is that also to change? For the price of one, I bet you'll be able to buy 10 frigates. (a fool and their isk are soon parted, I guess) Q5 why not throw in ORE upgrades for ice and mining? Q6. another voice to the request for small Ice/Mex rigs Q7. additional range to the gas harvesters?
RainReaper RRN Assembly INC Straw Hat Legion 21	Posted - 2015.10.04 10:36:10 - [85] - Quote so your telling me i will now be able to mine glare crust in lowsec space to get a lot more heavy water and liquid ozone and not have to mine 1000 blocks of glacial mass just to power my tower for a fev days because the glassial mass got a **** amount of that stuff and is prety much just isotopes? i love you guys
Moac Tor Cy-Core Industries Stain Confederation 156	Posted - 2015.10.04 11:43:12 - [86] - Quote It is a shame this can't use a covert ops cloak and go through a jump portal. That limits a lot of its uses in null sec imo. Suggestion for a rebalance of ECM - Modulated ECM Effects
Blade Darth Room for Improvement Limited Expectations 0	Posted - 2015.10.04 12:01:51 - [87] - Quote 2 coins from me: - Cov Ops cloak. Regular cloak in null is like free meal. - Strip miner? I'm sure the art team would make the hull look awesome with it, and there is no need for a new module meant especially for a single, niche ship.
PecX Ocedei Perkone Caldari State 5	Posted - 2015.10.04 12:16:03 - [88] - Quote Blade Darth wrote: 2 coins from me: - Cov Ops cloak. Regular cloak in null is like free meal. - Strip miner? I'm sure the art team would make the hull look awesome with it, and there is no need for a new module meant especially for a single, niche ship. Why would the regular cloak be a free meal in null in this case? Normally, yes I would agree, but the Discovery doesn't take a speed hit from using the normal cloak. So I realy don't see the difference between this and hitting a bubble in a Prospect. I have been decloaked on several bubbles in the Prospect and managed to get out alive by using the cloak, and manuvering out of the bubble.
Haatakan Reppola Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 94	Posted - 2015.10.04 12:35:47 - [89] - Quote GrandLynx wrote: Q1 Will there be a nerf to existing Ice sources so that there is increased attraction risk? Currently why would a high-sec miner or enclave null miner leave safety? Q2. Drop the frigate mining bonus for a probe/scan bonus? This is thing is expected to be able to get through WHs Q3. Will the invention/manufacture path for the Ice Miner 2 will be a convoluted as Strip Miner? Q4. Needs to be more incentive for the ORE Ice Laser. The only way to get these things will be through the LP store in Outer Ring. Or is that also to change? For the price of one, I bet you'll be able to buy 10 frigates. (a fool and their isk are soon parted, I guess) Q5 why not throw in ORE upgrades for ice and mining? Q6. another voice to the request for small Ice/Mex rigs Q7. additional range to the gas harvesters? 1: The RISK will be almost non existing, when it comes down to risk vs reward that would play a huge role. Less than 50% cost compared to mining barge but frigate agility + cloak 2: probe/scan bonus would be nice but mostly not needed, how often do those bonuses alow you to scan something you would not be able to scan without? 4: Incentive for ORE laser is a problem with the LP store not this new ship 5: Another one thats more tied to LP store than this ship 6: Mercoxit rig is not related to this ship (already have 2 ships that could benefit, bouth better ore miners). Ice rig possibly makes it to good, add that rig and the ship will have to be balanced assuming that rig is used
Justa Hunni State War Academy Caldari State 10	Posted - 2015.10.04 17:12:56 - [90] - Quote Eternus8lux8lucis wrote: It will also nearly make ganking a miner impossible. Aren't gankers the ones always telling miners to HTFU? It would be nice to have some sortof counter to be able to survive when someone attacks your totally unarmed ship. As to why people might chose an exhumer instead of this, the Skiff is still very survivable and can at least fight back to some degree. This just adds a different survival strategy to mining.
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM 5603	Posted - 2015.10.04 17:26:34 - [91] - Quote Justa Hunni wrote: Eternus8lux8lucis wrote: It will also nearly make ganking a miner impossible. Aren't gankers the ones always telling miners to HTFU? It would be nice to have some sortof counter to be able to survive when someone attacks your totally unarmed ship. As to why people might chose an exhumer instead of this, the Skiff is still very survivable and can at least fight back to some degree. This just adds a different survival strategy to mining. Aside from that, the barges will still beat the expedition frigates hands down, when it comes to yield. Woo! CSM X! Fuzzwork Enterprises Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Lugh Crow-Slave 1243	Posted - 2015.10.04 21:42:01 - [92] - Quote Selto Black wrote: I like this, however, it does put a bit of a skill wall up for younger players who wish to gather resources under hostile conditions. The venture is still an option for them in fact it lowers the barrier for ice mining in general Fuel block colors? Missiles for Caldari T3? Corp Stasis
Lugh Crow-Slave 1243	Posted - 2015.10.04 22:04:16 - [93] - Quote Have you considered letting them be bridged even with no covet ops cloak? One of the best ways prospects are used in a group is with blops mining it would be nice to extend this to the ice miner as well. Of course if this breaks something balance wise that's understandable Fuel block colors? Missiles for Caldari T3? Corp Stasis
Sabriz Adoudel Black Hydra Consortium. 5386	Posted - 2015.10.05 00:05:50 - [94] - Quote Happy to see this, I look forward to both building and blowing these up. I support the New Order and CODE. alliance. www.minerbumping.com Sabriz's Rule: "Any time someone argues for a game change claiming it is a quality of life change, the change is actually a game balance change".
Scott Weaver Aideron Robotics 1	Posted - 2015.10.05 12:06:53 - [95] - Quote Quote: targeting delay reduced to 5 seconds I understand cloak re-activation bonus, but why does it have targeting recalibration bonus? Not even covops/recons have that advantage

CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 389	Posted - 2015.10.05 14:47:34 - [96] - Quote Scott Weaver wrote: Quote: targeting delay reduced to 5 seconds I understand cloak re-activation bonus, but why does it have targeting recalibration bonus? Not even covops/recons have that advantage Black Ops have no targeting delay, as do stealth bombers. This just reduces it to 5 seconds instead. @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters

My Little Friend Amok. Goonswarm Federation 0	Posted - 2015.10.05 16:26:34 - [97] - Quote I would like to request that the requirement of having a turret slot be removed from both the new ice mining lasers and the old mining lasers. It is discriminatory towards the Caldari who use mostly missile based ships and as a result are unable to mine in many of these ships. The ability to fit mining lasers on these ships will result in new and emergent game play such as Leviathan mining that will surely create PVP content for all. Thanks
Haatakan Reppola Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 96	Posted - 2015.10.05 17:48:22 - [98] - Quote My Little Friend wrote: I would like to request that the requirement of having a turret slot be removed from both the new ice mining lasers and the old mining lasers. It is discriminatory towards the Caldari who use mostly missile based ships and as a result are unable to mine in many of these ships. The ability to fit mining lasers on these ships will result in new and emergent game play such as Leviathan mining that will surely create PVP content for all. Thanks Caldari have access to enough ships with turrets, removing the need for turret hardpoints would do more harm than good. Without the need for a turret hardpoint for mining laser or the new ice mining laser the mining frigates have to be rebalanced (nerfed) with using all high slots for mining lasers. Venture/Prospect would get +50% yield (3 high vs 2 hardpoints) and would need to loos alot of its mining bonus to stay at the same yield with 1 extra miner (loose utility high)
Alexis Nightwish 333	Posted - 2015.10.05 18:27:52 - [99] - Quote Just curious as to the rationale behind not letting the Discovery warp while cloaked. CCP approaches problems in one of two ways: nudge or cludge EVE Online's "I win!" Button Fixing bombs, not the bombers
Bagrat Skalski Poseidaon 9965	Posted - 2015.10.05 19:26:34 - [100] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: What colour will it be? - Icy I hope :) From this spectrum. Custom ship skins, character creator style "repaint". Bring it!
Asuka Solo Instant Annihilation This Isn't Going To End Well 3000	Posted - 2015.10.05 21:22:43 - [101] - Quote frigates with ore bays bigger than some industrial ship's cargoholds... Oh rly? Eve is about Capital ships, WiS, Boobs, PI and Isk!

CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 390	Posted - 2015.10.06 02:13:27 - [102] - Quote Alexis Nightwish wrote: Just curious as to the rationale behind not letting the Discovery warp while cloaked. We wanted to differentiate the Discovery from the Prospect, while still having them feel like they're in the same class of ship. So it gets cloaking bonuses and is also good at a more active style of ninja mining, but it accomplishes those abilities in different ways. @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters


CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 390	Posted - 2015.10.06 02:18:00 - [103] - Quote Asuka Solo wrote: frigates with ore bays bigger than some industrial ship's cargoholds... Oh rly? I would say in those cases the Prospect probably already was beating them as well. And if you're talking about Mining Barges, the Prospect has a bigger ore bay than the Hulk (10,000m3 to 8,500m3) @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters

Justin Cody Hard Knocks Inc. Hard Knocks Citizens 307	Posted - 2015.10.06 04:05:37 - [104] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: Some Q&A: What colour will it be? - Icy I hope :) Will there be a small Ice Harvesting Accelerator Rig? - There is not one planned at this time, the Discovery has been balanced assuming there isn't one. Will this have FW restrictions? - Not that I know of, I'll have to check the Prospect and it should be similar to that. Does the 200% bonus to mining yield affect the ice mining yield? - No, that bonus affects ore mining yields only. This applies to the 5% mining yield bonus per level on the mining frigate skill as well. please have it ice harvest more faster. Otherwise it won't be worth it for ninja mining in shattered holes. crap isk/hour
Justin Cody Hard Knocks Inc. Hard Knocks Citizens 307	Posted - 2015.10.06 04:20:31 - [105] - Quote GrandLynx wrote: Q1 Will there be a nerf to existing Ice sources so that there is increased attraction risk? Currently why would a high-sec miner or enclave null miner leave safety? Q2. Drop the frigate mining bonus for a probe/scan bonus? This is thing is expected to be able to get through WHs Q3. Will the invention/manufacture path for the Ice Miner 2 will be a convoluted as Strip Miner? Q4. Needs to be more incentive for the ORE Ice Laser. The only way to get these things will be through the LP store in Outer Ring. Or is that also to change? For the price of one, I bet you'll be able to buy 10 frigates. (a fool and their isk are soon parted, I guess) Q5 why not throw in ORE upgrades for ice and mining? Q6. another voice to the request for small Ice/Mex rigs Q7. additional range to the gas harvesters? Q2: I hope they take that suggestion Q3: One would hope not Q4: Agreed - ORE should be expanding its presence in space Q5: yes a low slot faction ORE ice mining accellerator or something like it would be interesting Q6: Not necessary Q7: Not pertinent to this thread but - yes please Annnd Q1: It is pretty much the same question as to why people don't leave high sec for low and null. There is too much reward for high sec and disproportionate pain in low and null for the off chance of a reward. So solve Q1 you need to eliminate ISK payouts on incursions and eliminate ice in high sec completely. Belts should dry up over time leaving only the least used systems with any ore at all. Pilots even in high sec should be declaring wars and fighting over valuable resources. 0.5 systems should be battle grounds for more than just freighters and catalysts. 0.6 systems for adventurous industrial corps and above that mostly dry desert wastelands. The pressure to move to low sec should be high
ISD Rontea ISD RUS 577	Posted - 2015.10.06 10:22:40 - [106] - Quote Note: you can hauling 36m tritanium in Discovery ore hold from highsec to nullsec (all5 skills). ISD Rontea Vice Admiral -Æ-+-+-+-+-é-æ-Ç -¦-Ç-â-+-+-ï -+-+ -¦-+-¦-+-+-+-¦-¦-¦-ü-é-¦-+-Ä -ü -+-¦-Ç-+-¦-¦-+-+ Interstellar Services Department
Shalmon Aliatus Bluestar Enterprises The Craftsmen 3	Posted - 2015.10.06 10:41:02 - [107] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: Asuka Solo wrote: frigates with ore bays bigger than some industrial ship's cargoholds... Oh rly? I would say in those cases the Prospect probably already was beating them as well. And if you're talking about Mining Barges, the Prospect has a bigger ore bay than the Hulk (10,000m3 to 8,500m3) So maybe buff the ore bays on the hulk ? (at least +500m-¦, so you can run your ice harvesters 3 times before they shut down. CCPls)

CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 391	Posted - 2015.10.06 11:43:00 - [108] - Quote ISD Rontea wrote: Note: you can hauling 36m tritanium in Discovery ore hold from highsec to nullsec (all5 skills). Ore Holds can't hold minerals. @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters

Corraidhin Farsaidh Farsaidh's Freeborn 1707	Posted - 2015.10.06 11:50:41 - [109] - Quote Asuka Solo wrote: frigates with ore bays bigger than some industrial ship's cargoholds... Oh rly? Why not? The hold is to carry only one product and can be optimized as such. Ore does not need any kind of safe atmosphere or packaging either so the structure to carry it can be very very simple, doesn't even need to be pressurized etc...
Omnathious Deninard Novis Initiis 3200	Posted - 2015.10.06 12:36:20 - [110] - Quote CCP Terminus, is the Expedition Frigate skill line going to be exclusively to ORE ships or will there be a chance of Gallente, Amarr, Caldari,and Minmatar Expedition Frigates? If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.
Mr Grape Drink Sugar - Water - Purple Winmatar Republic 45	Posted - 2015.10.06 13:13:32 - [111] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: ISD Rontea wrote: Note: you can hauling 36m tritanium in Discovery ore hold from highsec to nullsec (all5 skills). Ore Holds can't hold minerals. But they can hold compressed ore :)
naed21 The Dark Space Initiative Scary Wormhole People 38	Posted - 2015.10.06 13:36:47 - [112] - Quote Mr Grape Drink wrote: CCP Terminus wrote: ISD Rontea wrote: Note: you can hauling 36m tritanium in Discovery ore hold from highsec to nullsec (all5 skills). Ore Holds can't hold minerals. But they can hold compressed ore :) Would it be possible for it to have the ice compressed as it mined it? The ore hold would be reduced to compensate but I think that would be pretty interesting. It'll also help allow you to have enough cargo room to make stealing ice worth the potential distance you need to travel without having to give it massive cargo space.
Mr Grape Drink Sugar - Water - Purple Winmatar Republic 45	Posted - 2015.10.06 13:59:11 - [113] - Quote naed21 wrote: Mr Grape Drink wrote: CCP Terminus wrote: ISD Rontea wrote: Note: you can hauling 36m tritanium in Discovery ore hold from highsec to nullsec (all5 skills). Ore Holds can't hold minerals. But they can hold compressed ore :) Would it be possible for it to have the ice compressed as it mined it? The ore hold would be reduced to compensate but I think that would be pretty interesting. It'll also help allow you to have enough cargo room to make stealing ice worth the potential distance you need to travel without having to give it massive cargo space. I think that would be a little silly. But what you can do is go with a cloaky hauler, toss in a small tower, a compression array, and a few hours of fuel. then you can carry out 150 blocks at a time with a 15k hold. What ninja mining is all about yea? Of course this way takes a bit more investment, but honestly, theres not enough difference in ice values between high/low/null to make it worth going several jumps in, and coming back with only 15 blocks. You may as well just mine in high sec and you'd make the same because of loss from travel time. I see this ship used mainly in a smaller corp setting, wanting to make small pushes into low/null. Get the tower up, take 5-6 guys in them, come out with 750-900 compressed blocks in all the ore holds, then its probably worth it.

CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 392	Posted - 2015.10.06 14:14:30 - [114] - Quote Omnathious Deninard wrote: CCP Terminus, is the Expedition Frigate skill line going to be exclusively to ORE ships or will there be a chance of Gallente, Amarr, Caldari,and Minmatar Expedition Frigates? I don;t know for sure, but I would suspect it will remain ORE only. @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters

Mr Grape Drink Sugar - Water - Purple Winmatar Republic 45	Posted - 2015.10.06 14:18:44 - [115] - Quote "Fuel consumption has been moved to service modules, which will use a new type of fuel blocks, made of the materials from all existing fuel blocks, plus strontium clathrates." The new frig may help with this as well. Maybe make stront more valuable and mining the low/null ores that have stront worth a little more? We can only hope :D Can also run around to all 4 empires and work on getting all the isotopes you may need, without having to haul around barges. I guess I'm seeing a lot more utility out of these things than I originally did. Also..cough cough again...fix ORE Ice Miner stats to make it useful. Range /= useful on a frig ice miner. ;)
Franklin en Chalune Stark's Kerbside Hauler Universal Logistics 0	Posted - 2015.10.06 14:50:00 - [116] - Quote Mr Grape Drink wrote: Also..cough cough again...fix ORE Ice Miner stats to make it useful. Range /= useful on a frig ice miner. ;) It's pretty much the same bonus assigned to all other ORE mining equipment. Making the bonus different for the ORE Ice Miner would warrant doing the same for all other ORE equipment, which would be a chore for CCP. Better, in my opinion, to simply just give ORE some high sec presence, so that ORE LP (and hence equipment) is actually mildly accessible
Haatakan Reppola Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 96	Posted - 2015.10.06 14:58:05 - [117] - Quote Way to mine in hostile space: 1: Place POS 2: Jump Rorqual and park it in POS to boost 3: Jump # players to system, either cov ops then change ship at rorqual, normal bridge or gates 4: Mine all you want and compress it, when that Rorqual is filled you jump it back out with alot of ice or ore
naed21 The Dark Space Initiative Scary Wormhole People 39	Posted - 2015.10.06 15:14:18 - [118] - Quote Citadels don't seem to be easy to put down and pick up. So ninja mining might not really be a thing outside of whs once POS towers are removed. I agree that the discovery having ore compression would be weird, but purhaps a cloaky ORE industrial that can compress would be able to make this possible.
Mr Grape Drink Sugar - Water - Purple Winmatar Republic 45	Posted - 2015.10.06 15:14:39 - [119] - Quote Franklin en Chalune wrote: Mr Grape Drink wrote: Also..cough cough again...fix ORE Ice Miner stats to make it useful. Range /= useful on a frig ice miner. ;) It's pretty much the same bonus assigned to all other ORE mining equipment. Making the bonus different for the ORE Ice Miner would warrant doing the same for all other ORE equipment, which would be a chore for CCP. Better, in my opinion, to simply just give ORE some high sec presence, so that ORE LP (and hence equipment) is actually mildly accessible Check ORE Miner. It gets a yield bonus, along with a range bonus compared to T2. Range on strips is different to an extent. A hulk gets a range bonus, and doesnt move fast. So extra makes a difference. A frig moves fast, and has no range bonus. thus an extra few km is next to worthless. If they are going to put out new mods, they may as well do them right the first time or they'll end up like so many other faction mods...never used.
Franklin en Chalune Stark's Kerbside Hauler Universal Logistics 0	Posted - 2015.10.06 15:37:20 - [120] - Quote Mr Grape Drink wrote: Franklin en Chalune wrote: It's pretty much the same bonus assigned to all other ORE mining equipment. Making the bonus different for the ORE Ice Miner would warrant doing the same for all other ORE equipment, which would be a chore for CCP. Better, in my opinion, to simply just give ORE some high sec presence, so that ORE LP (and hence equipment) is actually mildly accessible Check ORE Miner. It gets a yield bonus, along with a range bonus compared to T2. Range on strips is different to an extent. A hulk gets a range bonus, and doesnt move fast. So extra makes a difference. A frig moves fast, and has no range bonus. thus an extra few km is next to worthless. If they are going to put out new mods, they may as well do them right the first time or they'll end up like so many other faction mods...never used. It's a measly 5m3 difference between the T2 Miner and the ORE Miner per cycle, not something to write home about considering how inaccessible it is. That's the real issue with ORE equipment. A cycle time bonus to the ORE Ice Miner... perhaps? Seeing as a yield bonus would have to at least double the yield, which would be too strong. Still, either way, if the stuff was at least obtainable then maybe it'd see better usage
Grorious Reader Mongorian Horde 34	Posted - 2015.10.06 15:54:07 - [121] - Quote Hmm...lets make a mining frigate that can hold millions of isk worth of ice, but is incapable of beating a dual scram tackle, can't field a full set of ECM drones, can't warp while cloaked, and has no discernible offensive capability. Yeah, that's something I want to blow my isk on and fly into hostile systems with no local chat. This thing isn't made to mine ice in shattered holes. It's made to pad bomber kill boards. Get a nemesis. Fit rockets, 2 warp scrams, sebo, one prop. Enter wormhole. Warp to belts while cloaked. Approach target. When within 2km, activate prop and sebo, lock with 2 scrams, keep at range 500, kill target. Frigate can't cloak because you're within 2km. Frigate can't escape because it's mwd is off and AB isn't fast enough. How exactly will this frigate ever survive that?
Mr Grape Drink Sugar - Water - Purple Winmatar Republic 45	Posted - 2015.10.06 17:08:09 - [122] - Quote Grorious Reader wrote: Hmm...lets make a mining frigate that can hold millions of isk worth of ice, but is incapable of beating a dual scram tackle, can't field a full set of ECM drones, can't warp while cloaked, and has no discernible offensive capability. Yeah, that's something I want to blow my isk on and fly into hostile systems with no local chat. This thing isn't made to mine ice in shattered holes. It's made to pad bomber kill boards. Get a nemesis. Fit rockets, 2 warp scrams, sebo, one prop. Enter wormhole. Warp to belts while cloaked. Approach target. When within 2km, activate prop and sebo, lock with 2 scrams, keep at range 500, kill target. Frigate can't cloak because you're within 2km. Frigate can't escape because it's mwd is off and AB isn't fast enough. How exactly will this frigate ever survive that? I do believe the point is defensive, not offensive when it comes to a miner. Its also a frig, so if you fit a ship like your bomber there to kill a frig, guess what, its gonna die. What if I fit the new ship with a web, scram, ab, extender dcu, drone damage amps and turrets. If your bomber shows up, its gonna die in a fire. <---Answer to your question "How exactly will this frigate ever survive that?" You can also orbit a mobile depot, refit to stabs, warp to safe, cloak, and get away from most situations if you're paying attention. Thus preparation and perception leading to another way to survive in hostile space.
Mr Grape Drink Sugar - Water - Purple Winmatar Republic 45	Posted - 2015.10.06 17:22:51 - [123] - Quote Franklin en Chalune wrote: Mr Grape Drink wrote: Franklin en Chalune wrote: It's pretty much the same bonus assigned to all other ORE mining equipment. Making the bonus different for the ORE Ice Miner would warrant doing the same for all other ORE equipment, which would be a chore for CCP. Better, in my opinion, to simply just give ORE some high sec presence, so that ORE LP (and hence equipment) is actually mildly accessible Check ORE Miner. It gets a yield bonus, along with a range bonus compared to T2. Range on strips is different to an extent. A hulk gets a range bonus, and doesnt move fast. So extra makes a difference. A frig moves fast, and has no range bonus. thus an extra few km is next to worthless. If they are going to put out new mods, they may as well do them right the first time or they'll end up like so many other faction mods...never used. It's a measly 5m3 difference between the T2 Miner and the ORE Miner per cycle, not something to write home about considering how inaccessible it is. That's the real issue with ORE equipment. A cycle time bonus to the ORE Ice Miner... perhaps? Seeing as a yield bonus would have to at least double the yield, which would be too strong. Still, either way, if the stuff was at least obtainable then maybe it'd see better usage You may see it as only 5M3, but I see it as an 8% increase in base yield, which is pretty nice over a period of time. I was thinking something similar on the Ice variant. but as you said, it would be for time instead of yield. The mods are far from inaccessible. I mine in Outer Ring every night and am sitting on top of 400k LP right now. The reason the low end miners are so damn expensive is because they cost the same LP as an ORE Ice Harvester. The LP stores are just broken. Frig sized mods costing so much LP that they aren't worth putting on frigs. But never fear for ORE prices come several months from now. My corp will work on getting them to acceptable prices for all :D But only if CCP works at making the items more useful in more cases ;)

CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 393	Posted - 2015.10.06 17:51:33 - [124] - Quote Mr Grape Drink wrote: You may see it as only 5M3, but I see it as an 8% increase in base yield, which is pretty nice over a period of time. I was thinking something similar on the Ice variant. but as you said, it would be for time instead of yield. The mods are far from inaccessible. I mine in Outer Ring every night and am sitting on top of 400k LP right now. The reason the low end miners are so damn expensive is because they cost the same LP as an ORE Ice Harvester. The LP stores are just broken. Frig sized mods costing so much LP that they aren't worth putting on frigs. So the funny thing is the ORE Mining Laser module is the only one to have gone through the tiericide process. I'll look in to giving the Ice mining laser a small duration bonus over the T2. Also I want to make sure the cost of the ORE Ice Mining Laser isn't nearly as high in terms of LP and ISK. @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters

Mr Grape Drink Sugar - Water - Purple Winmatar Republic 45	Posted - 2015.10.06 18:30:04 - [125] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: Mr Grape Drink wrote: You may see it as only 5M3, but I see it as an 8% increase in base yield, which is pretty nice over a period of time. I was thinking something similar on the Ice variant. but as you said, it would be for time instead of yield. The mods are far from inaccessible. I mine in Outer Ring every night and am sitting on top of 400k LP right now. The reason the low end miners are so damn expensive is because they cost the same LP as an ORE Ice Harvester. The LP stores are just broken. Frig sized mods costing so much LP that they aren't worth putting on frigs. So the funny thing is the ORE Mining Laser module is the only one to have gone through the tiericide process. I'll look in to giving the Ice mining laser a small duration bonus over the T2. Also I want to make sure the cost of the ORE Ice Mining Laser isn't nearly as high in terms of LP and ISK. Yes, I think the tiericide done to it made it an awesome item, don't get me wrong. If you don't want the Ice harvester to to be nearly in high in terms of LP and ISK though, I think you'll have to look at the LP/ISK cost on the standard ORE Miner as well to match. Would be kinda silly to make them different because they only really see any use on the ORE T1/T2 frigs anymore. Thanks for letting me know your thoughts!
unidenify Plundering Penguins Solyaris Chtonium 147	Posted - 2015.10.06 19:31:21 - [126] - Quote some member in my corp are looking forward to see this. and I am appreciated how CCP Terminus give us answers and stuff on this thead. Big thanks to CCP Terminus
Mikkir Freelance Mining Company 15	Posted - 2015.10.06 19:59:12 - [127] - Quote Grorious Reader wrote: Hmm...lets make a mining frigate that can hold millions of isk worth of ice, but is incapable of beating a dual scram tackle, can't field a full set of ECM drones, can't warp while cloaked, and has no discernible offensive capability. Yeah, that's something I want to blow my isk on and fly into hostile systems with no local chat. This thing isn't made to mine ice in shattered holes. It's made to pad bomber kill boards. Get a nemesis. Fit rockets, 2 warp scrams, sebo, one prop. Enter wormhole. Warp to belts while cloaked. Approach target. When within 2km, activate prop and sebo, lock with 2 scrams, keep at range 500, kill target. Frigate can't cloak because you're within 2km. Frigate can't escape because it's mwd is off and AB isn't fast enough. How exactly will this frigate ever survive that? Without getting all the PvP elements, I agree that this ship in a wormhole is just setting up the fat kid at the bus stop. The risk of flying a T2 ship in a wormhole when everyone knows where you're going to be are enormous, and you're mining at an unbonused rate. The most likely use for these as a miner are going to be null and high sec. Maybe in a quiet low sec system, but meh to that.
Uriam Khanid New Machinarium Corporation 14	Posted - 2015.10.06 20:26:28 - [128] - Quote Mikkir wrote: Grorious Reader wrote: Hmm...lets make a mining frigate that can hold millions of isk worth of ice, but is incapable of beating a dual scram tackle, can't field a full set of ECM drones, can't warp while cloaked, and has no discernible offensive capability. Yeah, that's something I want to blow my isk on and fly into hostile systems with no local chat. This thing isn't made to mine ice in shattered holes. It's made to pad bomber kill boards. Get a nemesis. Fit rockets, 2 warp scrams, sebo, one prop. Enter wormhole. Warp to belts while cloaked. Approach target. When within 2km, activate prop and sebo, lock with 2 scrams, keep at range 500, kill target. Frigate can't cloak because you're within 2km. Frigate can't escape because it's mwd is off and AB isn't fast enough. How exactly will this frigate ever survive that? Without getting all the PvP elements, I agree that this ship in a wormhole is just setting up the fat kid at the bus stop. The risk of flying a T2 ship in a wormhole when everyone knows where you're going to be are enormous, and you're mining at an unbonused rate. The most likely use for these as a miner are going to be null and high sec. Maybe in a quiet low sec system, but meh to that. Prospect - Covert Cloak; Discavery - nothing Prospect - less ice, but safe; Discavery - lots of ice, but ... nothing safe. Prospect can mine more ore and gas, so discavery goes ... to be new useless toy (at least for me) so what you talk about nullsec and highsec?
Uriam Khanid New Machinarium Corporation 14	Posted - 2015.10.06 20:42:49 - [129] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: Some notes: The Discovery mines ice slightly slower than mining barges, but mines individual blocks at a rapid pace with all its duration reductions. Standard ore mining in a Discovery will be about as fast as a Venture due to the 200% role bonus to mining yield, but will be slower than a Prospect. While the Prospect can fit the new Ice Mining Laser modules, and has an extra turret slot to fit two, it is still much slower at mining ice than the Discovery, and will require more trips back due to the smaller ore bay. The Discovery cannot fit covert ops cloaking devices, though it does get bonuses and penalty reductions to fitting regular ones. The Discovery and Prospect will be the only ship capable of mining ice from the frigate only Shattered Wormholes. WeGÇÖre hoping the Discovery works well for ninja mining the more valuable ice from null-sec. With its speed, shield tanking, and cloaking bonuses players should be able to make runs into null-sec for some of the crunchier ice. this is strange. or Discavery the ONLY frig for mining ice (and nothing else). or you need to look again for his stats. cut the ore hold to 8-10k, give him covert cloake, eliminate drone bay. and why Discavery get 3 high slots? if Discavery can not fit Covert CLoake, may be 2H/5-6M/2-3L wiith some EWAR bonus will be better (for sensor dampening or/and ECM)?
Reaver Glitterstim Dromedaworks inc Test Alliance Please Ignore 2655	Posted - 2015.10.06 21:16:34 - [130] - Quote Grorious Reader wrote: Hmm...lets make a mining frigate that can hold millions of isk worth of ice, but is incapable of beating a dual scram tackle, can't field a full set of ECM drones, can't warp while cloaked, and has no discernible offensive capability. Yeah, that's something I want to blow my isk on and fly into hostile systems with no local chat. This thing isn't made to mine ice in shattered holes. It's made to pad bomber kill boards. Get a nemesis. Fit rockets, 2 warp scrams, sebo, one prop. Enter wormhole. Warp to belts while cloaked. Approach target. When within 2km, activate prop and sebo, lock with 2 scrams, keep at range 500, kill target. Frigate can't cloak because you're within 2km. Frigate can't escape because it's mwd is off and AB isn't fast enough. How exactly will this frigate ever survive that? I take it you're using rockets to kill the Discovery? Otherwise I don't know how you intend to kill it. To defend against stealth bombers, I would probably fit a warp scrambler and an afterburner. For those of you trying to run the math and thinking that the Discovery Expedition Frigate mines ice too fast, here's a description of how all the math works: I'll compare a Discovery to a Procurer Ice Strip Miner I: base 1 block per 10 minutes Ice Mining Laser I: base 1 block per 6 minutes Skills and t2 variants: same bonuses on either side I believe (can be eliminated from comparison) Procurer role bonus: -60% duration -- 1 block per 4 minutes Discovery role bonus: -50% duration -- 1 block per 3 minutes Procurer skill bonus (at 5): -10% duration -- 1 block per 216 seconds* Procurer skill bonus (at 5): -10% duration -- 1 block per 180 seconds** Discovery skill bonus (at 5): -43.75% duration -- 1 block per 101.25 seconds* Discovery skill bonus (at 5): -50% duration -- 1 block per 90 seconds** * if duration reduction bonuses are cumulative ** if duration reduction bonuses are additive I may be wrong about skills affecting both modules the same. The mining bonuses on either ship do not affect ice harvester yields. It would appear that this ship can mine ice over twice as fast as the Procurer if neither one has module or rig bonuses. The Procurer has one fewer low slots but can fit the more powerful ice harvester accelerator rigs and thus gain some advantage, but unless there's something I'm missing, it looks like the Discovery still mines ice much faster than the Procurer. Keep in mind that the Procurer still gets just one block of ice per cycle, unlike other barges which can fit more than one ice harvester. Pirate ship Nightmare, can you fathom Larger but with smaller spikes than Phantasm The Succubus looks meaner But the Revenant cleaner Seems as they get bigger, the smaller spikes they has'm
Franklin en Chalune Stark's Kerbside Hauler Universal Logistics 0	Posted - 2015.10.06 21:22:11 - [131] - Quote Uriam Khanid wrote: CCP Terminus wrote: Some notes: The Discovery mines ice slightly slower than mining barges, but mines individual blocks at a rapid pace with all its duration reductions. Standard ore mining in a Discovery will be about as fast as a Venture due to the 200% role bonus to mining yield, but will be slower than a Prospect. While the Prospect can fit the new Ice Mining Laser modules, and has an extra turret slot to fit two, it is still much slower at mining ice than the Discovery, and will require more trips back due to the smaller ore bay. The Discovery cannot fit covert ops cloaking devices, though it does get bonuses and penalty reductions to fitting regular ones. The Discovery and Prospect will be the only ship capable of mining ice from the frigate only Shattered Wormholes. WeGÇÖre hoping the Discovery works well for ninja mining the more valuable ice from null-sec. With its speed, shield tanking, and cloaking bonuses players should be able to make runs into null-sec for some of the crunchier ice. this is strange. or Discovery the ONLY frig for mining ice (and nothing else). or you need to look again for his stats. cut the ore hold to 8-10k, give him covert cloak, eliminate drone bay. and why Discavery get 3 high slots? if Discavery can not fit Covert Cloak, maybe 2H/5-6M/2-3L wiith some EWAR bonus will be better (for sensor dampening or/and ECM)? It has intended use inside the frigate-only Shattered Wormholes, so the 3 high slots would be for an Ice Miner, a Cloaking device (because yes it IS bonused to use one, just not a Covert Ops one) and a Core Probe Launcher. I'm quite happy with its slot layout in all fairness. CCP Terminus wrote: So the funny thing is the ORE Mining Laser module is the only one to have gone through the tiericide process. I'll look in to giving the Ice mining laser a small duration bonus over the T2. Also I want to make sure the cost of the ORE Ice Mining Laser isn't nearly as high in terms of LP and ISK. Interesting input, and I'm certainly happy to hear that. Does this mean that other ORE harvesting equipment could be subject to similar tiericide changes too, resulting in a similar change across the board? If so then perhaps ORE equipment won't be so pointless after all. Just a case of actually working on LP for them then ahaha
Franklin en Chalune Stark's Kerbside Hauler Universal Logistics 0	Posted - 2015.10.06 21:38:14 - [132] - Quote Reaver Glitterstim wrote: For those of you trying to run the math and thinking that the Discovery Expedition Frigate mines ice too fast, here's a description of how all the math works: I'll compare a Discovery to a Procurer Ice Strip Miner I: base 1 block per 10 minutes Ice Mining Laser I: base 1 block per 6 minutes Skills and t2 variants: same bonuses on either side I believe (can be eliminated from comparison) Procurer role bonus: -60% duration -- 1 block per 4 minutes Discovery role bonus: -50% duration -- 1 block per 3 minutes Procurer skill bonus (at 5): -10% duration -- 1 block per 216 seconds* Procurer skill bonus (at 5): -10% duration -- 1 block per 180 seconds** Discovery skill bonus (at 5): -43.75% duration -- 1 block per 101.25 seconds* Discovery skill bonus (at 5): -50% duration -- 1 block per 90 seconds** * if duration reduction bonuses are cumulative ** if duration reduction bonuses are additive I may be wrong about skills affecting both modules the same. The mining bonuses on either ship do not affect ice harvester yields. It would appear that this ship can mine ice over twice as fast as the Procurer if neither one has module or rig bonuses. The Procurer has one fewer low slots but can fit the more powerful ice harvester accelerator rigs and thus gain some advantage, but unless there's something I'm missing, it looks like the Discovery still mines ice much faster than the Procurer. Keep in mind that the Procurer still gets just one block of ice per cycle, unlike other barges which can fit more than one ice harvester. You've made a key error right at the beginning. The Ice Harvester I (the Ice "strip miner") has a base cycle time of 300 seconds, which is 5 minutes, not 10 minutes, which would result in a cycle time of 81 seconds with all skills at level 5, whereas the Discovery would get a projected cycle time of roughly 75.9375 seconds (you missed off the skill bonus from Ice Harvesting for both). The difference is only roughly 5 seconds between them; a fair amount, but not a massive amount of difference. Plus, it's fair to point out that the Discovery will be a T2 ship, so it would be fairer to compare it to a Skiff (which it quite closely resembles, funnily enough) We've already calculated a cycle time of 75.9375 seconds for the Discovery with the T1 Ice Mining Laser, so we'll compare the Skiff against that: Ice Harvester I Cycle Time: 300 seconds Skiff Role Bonus: -60% cycle time - 120 seconds Ice Harvesting Skill Bonus: -25% cycle time - 90 seconds Skiff Skill Bonus (Mining Barges): -10% cycle time - 81 seconds Skiff Skill Bonus (Exhumers): -10% cycle time - 72.9 seconds So comparing the Discovery to a comparable mining barge, we find that the Skiff gets a better cycle time, and therefore yield

CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 397	Posted - 2015.10.06 21:48:00 - [133] - Quote Reaver Glitterstim wrote: For those of you trying to run the math and thinking that the Discovery Expedition Frigate mines ice too fast, here's a description of how all the math works: I'll compare a Discovery to a Procurer Ice Strip Miner I: base 1 block per 10 minutes Ice Mining Laser I: base 1 block per 6 minutes Skills and t2 variants: same bonuses on either side I believe (can be eliminated from comparison) Procurer role bonus: -60% duration -- 1 block per 4 minutes Discovery role bonus: -50% duration -- 1 block per 3 minutes Procurer skill bonus (at 5): -10% duration -- 1 block per 216 seconds* Procurer skill bonus (at 5): -10% duration -- 1 block per 180 seconds** Discovery skill bonus (at 5): -43.75% duration -- 1 block per 101.25 seconds* Discovery skill bonus (at 5): -50% duration -- 1 block per 90 seconds** * if duration reduction bonuses are cumulative if duration reduction bonuses are additive I may be wrong about skills affecting both modules the same. The mining bonuses on either ship do not affect ice harvester yields. It would appear that this ship can mine ice over twice as fast as the Procurer if neither one has module or rig bonuses. The Procurer has one fewer low slots but can fit the more powerful ice harvester accelerator rigs and thus gain some advantage, but unless there's something I'm missing, it looks like the Discovery still mines ice much faster than the Procurer. Keep in mind that the Procurer still gets just one block of ice per cycle, unlike other barges which can fit more than one ice harvester. The Ice Harvester (ice strip miner) has a 300 second cycle time, which is 5 minutes not 10. Min/maxed for duration the Procurer will be a few seconds faster than the Discovery with T2 Ice mining equipment and a few seconds slower with T1. Below is the theoretical maximum cycle time reduction for both hulls. Procurer Ice Harvester II - 1 block / 250 sec Procurer Role Bonus (50% reduction) - 100 sec Mining Barge 5 Bonus (10% reduction) - 90 sec Ice Harvesting Skill 5 (25% reduction) - 67.5 sec Inherent Implants 'Yeti" Ice Harvester IH-1005 (5% reduction) - 64.12 sec Medium Ice Harvester Accelerator I (Rig) (12% reduction) - 56.43 sec 'Ingenii' Ice Harvester Upgrade (10%) - 50.78 sec 'Ingenii' Ice Harvester Upgrade (10%) - 45.70 sec Fastest Cycle = 45.70 seconds Discovery Ice Mining Laser II - 1 block / 330 sec Discovery Role Bonus (50% reduction) - 165 sec Mining Frigate 5 Bonus (25% reduction) - 123.75 sec Expedition Frigate 5 Bonus (25% reduction) - 92.81 sec Ice Harvesting Skill 5 (25% reduction) - 69.60 sec Inherent Implants 'Yeti" Ice Harvester IH-1005 (5% reduction) - 66.12 sec 'Ingenii' Ice Harvester Upgrade (10%) - 59.51 sec 'Ingenii' Ice Harvester Upgrade (10%) - 53.56 sec 'Ingenii' Ice Harvester Upgrade (10%) - 48.20 sec Fastest Cycle = 48.20 seconds** @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters

Ele Rebellion Dead Star Syndicate 51	Posted - 2015.10.06 23:42:14 - [134] - Quote Could you make it to where it can use Cov-Ops bridges even though it isn't technically a Cov-Ops? One of the things that makes to prospect so useful. Especially since it won't be able to warp cloaked. (makes it a bit hard to move gate to gate.. especially through null bubbles/camps) The other thing I would like to see changed is the Ice Harvester's range. I would prefer the Tech 1 to have a range of only 2,000m This prevents someone from just immediately cloaking as soon as there is a possible threat. 2km range forces the pilot to actually maneuver away from the mining target (can we call it an ice-roid?) before they can cloak.
Ele Rebellion Dead Star Syndicate 51	Posted - 2015.10.06 23:45:43 - [135] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: Ice Harvester II - 1 block / 250 sec Procurer Role Bonus (50% reduction) - 100 sec Umm.. Math? Wouldn't a 50% Reduction of 250 be 125?
Franklin en Chalune Stark's Kerbside Hauler Universal Logistics 0	Posted - 2015.10.06 23:59:42 - [136] - Quote Ele Rebellion wrote: CCP Terminus wrote: Ice Harvester II - 1 block / 250 sec Procurer Role Bonus (50% reduction) - 100 sec Umm.. Math? Wouldn't a 50% Reduction of 250 be 125? The Procurer's Role Bonus is 60% reduction, not 50%, so his numbers are correct, he just mistyped
Grorious Reader Mongorian Horde 36	Posted - 2015.10.07 00:21:42 - [137] - Quote Mr Grape Drink wrote: I do believe the point is defensive, not offensive when it comes to a miner. Its also a frig, so if you fit a ship like your bomber there to kill a frig, guess what, its gonna die. The point was that it has basically nothing to defend itself in any meaningful way. Venture gets +2 warp strength. Prospector gets covert ops cloak. This gets nothing. If you can't escape tackle (like this ship can't) then offense is your only defense. Quote: What if I fit the new ship with a web, scram, ab, extender dcu, drone damage amps and turrets. If your bomber shows up, its gonna die in a fire. <---Answer to your question "How exactly will this frigate ever survive that?" Assuming you could keep your drones alive you might have a slim chance. But rockets are pretty good at killing light drones, and you only get 3 at a time, and you can only fit 2 amps if you have a DCII, and you probably won't be fitting much else because of limited CPU, and that cloaking module cripples your targeting, and you have to refit and load ammo to use your one turret, and I'm getting the drop on you with no warning. Basically, the attacker has every advantage. Quote: You can also orbit a mobile depot, refit to stabs, warp to safe, cloak, and get away from most situations if you're paying attention. Thus preparation and perception leading to another way to survive in hostile space. A nice sentiment, but with only 3 low slots you can't refit to enough stabs to break the tackle of just one typical explorer hunting frigate. This isn't even an unusual bomber fit. This is typical for hunting exploration frigs. Lets not even get started with how fast you'll die to a sabre in a nullsec belt. If a bomber didn't work, a slightly more expensive astero sure would. Effective 10 drones to your 3. Higher scan res so it doesn't need a sebo, so it fits a web with its 2 scrams. And it has an ancillary rep tank that you can't field enough DPS to break. This ship needs a full flight of light drones. Either that or a 4th low slot. It's very close to being a good ship, but not quite there.
Noslen Nosilla Federal Logistics Initiative Conglomerate United Interests 24	Posted - 2015.10.07 00:43:03 - [138] - Quote While you are discovering the Discovery how about discovering a drone bay for the Prospect? Room for 5 light drones would be nice for at least swatting at belt rats instead of cloaking and hiding like a little kid! Since the Discovery has them..... Be polite. Be professional. But have a plan to kill everyone you meet.
Ele Rebellion Dead Star Syndicate 51	Posted - 2015.10.07 01:02:07 - [139] - Quote Grorious Reader wrote: A nice sentiment, but with only 3 low slots you can't refit to enough stabs to break the tackle of just one typical explorer hunting frigate. Just this past weekend I killed a Prospect that was fit with 3 stabs and no cloak. Rapid Light/Triple Sebo Onyx > Stabbed Prospect ..sad part is.. I wasn't even hunting him.. he just warped right into my bubble on WH.
Ersahi Kir Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic 427	Posted - 2015.10.07 01:11:42 - [140] - Quote Uriam Khanid wrote: Prospect - Covert Cloak; Discavery - nothing Prospect - less ice, but safe; Discavery - lots of ice, but ... nothing safe. Prospect can mine more ore and gas, so discavery goes ... to be new useless toy (at least for me) so what you talk about nullsec and highsec? I don't think the cloak bonus is all that important to the ship. People have different preferences on what ships to use where, but I could see people who would want to use the discovery in high and null sec. It warps fast, it's fairly cheap, and it does the job well enough. It can also clear belt rats, which is something the prospect cannot do. I'm not saying that it's hand down better than the other options, I think I would still prefer a skiff for ice, but some people will enjoy playing with it. I do think it's fairly useless for the role of shattered wormhole miner though, and it seems like it's a terrible trade off in risk/reward, especially when you factor in losing all mining boosts.
A'Tolkar Carlson's Raiders 37	Posted - 2015.10.07 02:40:05 - [141] - Quote Other than maybe art, why not just release this ship (and corresponding modules) at the next update?
Jeremiah Saken The Fall of Leviathan 398	Posted - 2015.10.07 06:18:24 - [142] - Quote How many shattered wormholes are there anyway? "(...) I am tormented with an everlasting itch for things remote. I love to sail forbidden seas (...)"
Lugh Crow-Slave 1260	Posted - 2015.10.07 06:52:21 - [143] - Quote Jeremiah Saken wrote: How many shattered wormholes are there anyway? 100 iirc Fuel block colors? Missiles for Caldari T3? Corp Stasis
Jeremiah Saken The Fall of Leviathan 398	Posted - 2015.10.07 07:04:27 - [144] - Quote Lugh Crow-Slave wrote: 100 iirc I found it. 100 total, but only 25 of them are small ship holes. So hull specially designed for 25 systems? OT: can we have more range on gas cloud harverster? (and some animation too, maybe like new salvager one?) "(...) I am tormented with an everlasting itch for things remote. I love to sail forbidden seas (...)"
Lugh Crow-Slave 1261	Posted - 2015.10.07 07:19:56 - [145] - Quote Jeremiah Saken wrote: Lugh Crow-Slave wrote: 100 iirc I found it. 100 total, but only 25 of them are small ship holes. So hull specially designed for 25 systems? OT: can we have more range on gas cloud harverster? (and some animation too, maybe like new salvager one?) No I could see this being used in low and a good deal in null mainly by what corps that want to make fuel without importing (larger groups probably will not use it) This is why I feel giving it the ability to be blops bridged would open it up to more people but I'm not sure ccp would be willing to do that on a ship with no covet ops cloak and I would not give on to this ship Fuel block colors? Missiles for Caldari T3? Corp Stasis
Jeremiah Saken The Fall of Leviathan 399	Posted - 2015.10.07 07:55:31 - [146] - Quote Funny name btw: Discovery. Like exploration ship. It will be based on Venture hull? Same as Prospect? "(...) I am tormented with an everlasting itch for things remote. I love to sail forbidden seas (...)"
Darkblad Hilf Dir selbst in EVE 2329	Posted - 2015.10.07 08:47:51 - [147] - Quote Jeremiah Saken wrote: It will be based on Venture hull? Same as Prospect? We have to assume that's the case for now. There no new ship model as of yet (but also no new shaders for the prospect hull) and the current model is just a placeholder To take a look on sisi, paste this into a note within the client: \|url=showinfo:37135>Discovery\|/url> (change \| to <, the forums don't allow html tags) EVE Infolinks GÇó Mining Guide GÇó Missions (EN & DE)
ISD Rontea ISD RUS 583	Posted - 2015.10.07 08:51:56 - [148] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: ISD Rontea wrote: Note: you can hauling 36m tritanium in Discovery ore hold from highsec to nullsec (all5 skills). Ore Holds can't hold minerals. Ore holds can hold compressed ore. Compressed veldspar > reprocess > tritanium ISD Rontea Vice Admiral -Æ-+-+-+-+-é-æ-Ç -¦-Ç-â-+-+-ï -+-+ -¦-+-¦-+-+-+-¦-¦-¦-ü-é-¦-+-Ä -ü -+-¦-Ç-+-¦-¦-+-+ Interstellar Services Department
Lloyd Roses Artificial Memories 1275	Posted - 2015.10.07 10:54:16 - [149] - Quote Please correct me when I made mistakes anywhere here: Ice mining cycle is 330secs x 0.5 role x (0.75 (mining frig) x 0.75 (ice mining skill), for 93secs rounded total cycle time per 1k block. Then adding three Icing lows puts them to 70secs. Is the ice mining rig intentionally left out (61sec cycle time) to increase the yield difference to a procurer (49sec)?

CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 399	Posted - 2015.10.07 11:18:01 - [150] - Quote Lloyd Roses wrote: Please correct me when I made mistakes anywhere here: Ice mining cycle is 330secs x 0.5 role x (0.75 (mining frig) x 0.75 (ice mining skill), for 93secs rounded total cycle time per 1k block. Then adding three Icing lows puts them to 70secs. Is the ice mining rig intentionally left out (61sec cycle time) to increase the yield difference to a procurer (49sec)? I put up some math on the previous page if you want to see a maxed out Discovery versus and maxed out Procurer. You're missing implants and the expedition frigate bonuses. And yes we don't plan on making a small ice mining rig. @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters

ISD Rontea ISD RUS 583	Posted - 2015.10.07 12:18:16 - [151] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: And yes we don't plan on making a small ice mining rig. What about small gas harvesting rig? Tech 1. 200 calibration, -5% gas cloud harvesters duration Tech 2. 250 calibration, -7.5% gas cloud harvesters duration ISD Rontea Vice Admiral -Æ-+-+-+-+-é-æ-Ç -¦-Ç-â-+-+-ï -+-+ -¦-+-¦-+-+-+-¦-¦-¦-ü-é-¦-+-Ä -ü -+-¦-Ç-+-¦-¦-+-+ Interstellar Services Department
My Little Friend Amok. Goonswarm Federation 1	Posted - 2015.10.07 14:15:37 - [152] - Quote Haatakan Reppola wrote: My Little Friend wrote: I would like to request that the requirement of having a turret slot be removed from both the new ice mining lasers and the old mining lasers. It is discriminatory towards the Caldari who use mostly missile based ships and as a result are unable to mine in many of these ships. The ability to fit mining lasers on these ships will result in new and emergent game play such as Leviathan mining that will surely create PVP content for all. Thanks Caldari have access to enough ships with turrets, removing the need for turret hardpoints would do more harm than good. Without the need for a turret hardpoint for mining laser or the new ice mining laser the mining frigates have to be rebalanced (nerfed) with using all high slots for mining lasers. Venture/Prospect would get +50% yield (3 high vs 2 hardpoints) and would need to loos alot of its mining bonus to stay at the same yield with 1 extra miner (loose utility high) Thank you for missing the whole point of my post asking for the ability to fit mining lasers on the Leviathan.
unidenify Plundering Penguins Solyaris Chtonium 147	Posted - 2015.10.07 14:26:27 - [153] - Quote My Little Friend wrote: Haatakan Reppola wrote: My Little Friend wrote: I would like to request that the requirement of having a turret slot be removed from both the new ice mining lasers and the old mining lasers. It is discriminatory towards the Caldari who use mostly missile based ships and as a result are unable to mine in many of these ships. The ability to fit mining lasers on these ships will result in new and emergent game play such as Leviathan mining that will surely create PVP content for all. Thanks Caldari have access to enough ships with turrets, removing the need for turret hardpoints would do more harm than good. Without the need for a turret hardpoint for mining laser or the new ice mining laser the mining frigates have to be rebalanced (nerfed) with using all high slots for mining lasers. Venture/Prospect would get +50% yield (3 high vs 2 hardpoints) and would need to loos alot of its mining bonus to stay at the same yield with 1 extra miner (loose utility high) Thank you for missing the whole point of my post asking for the ability to fit mining lasers on the Leviathan. this is discrimination we have to live our life as Caldari pilot
My Little Friend Amok. Goonswarm Federation 1	Posted - 2015.10.07 14:34:30 - [154] - Quote unidenify wrote: My Little Friend wrote: Haatakan Reppola wrote: My Little Friend wrote: I would like to request that the requirement of having a turret slot be removed from both the new ice mining lasers and the old mining lasers. It is discriminatory towards the Caldari who use mostly missile based ships and as a result are unable to mine in many of these ships. The ability to fit mining lasers on these ships will result in new and emergent game play such as Leviathan mining that will surely create PVP content for all. Thanks Caldari have access to enough ships with turrets, removing the need for turret hardpoints would do more harm than good. Without the need for a turret hardpoint for mining laser or the new ice mining laser the mining frigates have to be rebalanced (nerfed) with using all high slots for mining lasers. Venture/Prospect would get +50% yield (3 high vs 2 hardpoints) and would need to loos alot of its mining bonus to stay at the same yield with 1 extra miner (loose utility high) Thank you for missing the whole point of my post asking for the ability to fit mining lasers on the Leviathan. this is discrimination we have to live our life as Caldari pilot I refuse to accept this unacceptable racial discrimination against Caldari pilots that want to use their titans to mine ore/ice/gas.

CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 403	Posted - 2015.10.07 17:57:34 - [155] - Quote ISD Rontea wrote: CCP Terminus wrote: And yes we don't plan on making a small ice mining rig. What about small gas harvesting rig? Tech 1. 200 calibration, -5% gas cloud harvesters duration Tech 2. 250 calibration, -7.5% gas cloud harvesters duration The specialized mining rigs only exist as a holdover from previous Mining Barge designs. A little while ago they were all specialized for one type of mining. When that was removed, the rigs were added to keep similar mining rates without having the bonuses be on the ships. Since the Prospect and Discovery are already bonused toward certain types of mining, a rig bonus would be somewhat redundant. @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters

Mr Grape Drink Sugar - Water - Purple Winmatar Republic 47	Posted - 2015.10.07 18:11:56 - [156] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: ISD Rontea wrote: CCP Terminus wrote: And yes we don't plan on making a small ice mining rig. What about small gas harvesting rig? Tech 1. 200 calibration, -5% gas cloud harvesters duration Tech 2. 250 calibration, -7.5% gas cloud harvesters duration The specialized mining rigs only exist as a holdover from previous Mining Barge designs. A little while ago they were all specialized for one type of mining. When that was removed, the rigs were added to keep similar mining rates without having the bonuses be on the ships. Since the Prospect and Discovery are already bonused toward certain types of mining, a rig bonus would be somewhat redundant. Any particular reason you are making frigates specialized like how the old barges were?
Lugh Crow-Slave 1265	Posted - 2015.10.07 22:53:59 - [157] - Quote people seem to think that w/o a cov ops cloak this thing is screwed with the cloak bonus it does get it will be able to get to warp speed de-cloak and run similar to a BLOPs is it as easy on the pilot? no does it lower the risk on a pilot who knows what they are doing? yes only thing extra i could see this thing needing a the ability to be bridged but i'm sure it will be used even w/o that my guys will just stick with the prospect if that's the case Fuel block colors? Missiles for Caldari T3? Corp Stasis
Lugh Crow-Slave 1265	Posted - 2015.10.07 22:56:07 - [158] - Quote Mr Grape Drink wrote: CCP Terminus wrote: ISD Rontea wrote: CCP Terminus wrote: And yes we don't plan on making a small ice mining rig. What about small gas harvesting rig? Tech 1. 200 calibration, -5% gas cloud harvesters duration Tech 2. 250 calibration, -7.5% gas cloud harvesters duration The specialized mining rigs only exist as a holdover from previous Mining Barge designs. A little while ago they were all specialized for one type of mining. When that was removed, the rigs were added to keep similar mining rates without having the bonuses be on the ships. Since the Prospect and Discovery are already bonused toward certain types of mining, a rig bonus would be somewhat redundant. Any particular reason you are making frigates specialized like how the old barges were? Barges now you kinda have to decide between yield, cargo, or tank. But frigs you kind of get forced into what you fly by what you're mining based on the bonuses its still a choice just based on different things if i go ice mining it is still safer that i do it in a prospect but i could do it faster in the discovery its just more nice Fuel block colors? Missiles for Caldari T3? Corp Stasis
Haatakan Reppola Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 96	Posted - 2015.10.07 23:35:54 - [159] - Quote Mr Grape Drink wrote: Any particular reason you are making frigates specialized like how the old barges were? Barges now you kinda have to decide between yield, cargo, or tank. But frigs you kind of get forced into what you fly by what you're mining based on the bonuses Yield is already covered by Hulk, Ore bay is covered by Mackinaw and EHP is covered by Skiff (including their t1 variants) How do you balance 2-3 smaller/cheaper ships around the same metrics without them being useless or OP? Find new ways to balance them (diffrent roles).
Justin Cody Hard Knocks Inc. Hard Knocks Citizens 311	Posted - 2015.10.07 23:36:40 - [160] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: ISD Rontea wrote: CCP Terminus wrote: And yes we don't plan on making a small ice mining rig. What about small gas harvesting rig? Tech 1. 200 calibration, -5% gas cloud harvesters duration Tech 2. 250 calibration, -7.5% gas cloud harvesters duration The specialized mining rigs only exist as a holdover from previous Mining Barge designs. A little while ago they were all specialized for one type of mining. When that was removed, the rigs were added to keep similar mining rates without having the bonuses be on the ships. Since the Prospect and Discovery are already bonused toward certain types of mining, a rig bonus would be somewhat redundant. or awesome if you're into min maxing
Lidia Caderu Harbingers of Chaos Inc Gentlemen's.Club 45	Posted - 2015.10.08 08:01:35 - [161] - Quote It would be better to make one frig just for general purpose without mining bonuses and other just for mining ore/ice/gas without cyno bonus. And give both ships +2warp stab
Lidia Caderu Harbingers of Chaos Inc Gentlemen's.Club 45	Posted - 2015.10.08 08:09:22 - [162] - Quote ISD Rontea wrote: CCP Terminus wrote: ISD Rontea wrote: Note: you can hauling 36m tritanium in Discovery ore hold from highsec to nullsec (all5 skills). Ore Holds can't hold minerals. Ore holds can hold compressed ore. Compressed veldspar > reprocess > tritanium Potentially possible, but why would one do this? You may haul out some Arkonor for example, but not such big amount. And you can do this in any small ship. Also if you hauling through WH you just may wait until direct to hisec one opens.
Haatakan Reppola Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 97	Posted - 2015.10.08 19:00:31 - [163] - Quote All races have a T1 industrial that can haul 20k+ with max skills and extender (not counting rigs), these ships cost around 2.5m including fitting. 15k ore hold on a 15m T2 frigate will not change much...
Damjan Fox Fox Industries and Exploration 166	Posted - 2015.10.08 20:46:52 - [164] - Quote Sounds interesting. I'll definately get some of those, once they hit TQ. Quote: What colour will it be? - Icy I hope :) >> I hope so, too. <<
Civ Kado Dutch East Querious Company Phoebe Freeport Republic 98	Posted - 2015.10.08 22:39:31 - [165] - Quote very excited for this
Rek Seven Hidden Agenda Deep Space Engineering 2030	Posted - 2015.10.09 13:49:51 - [166] - Quote A frigate with a 15000 m3 ore holed? Dumb It should have been a cruiser class venture that does multiple things including ice mining, ore mining and gas harvesting. The venture and the prospector are two ships that are either too hard to catch or not worth the effort involved in catching them. A cruiser hull would be better balanced. A cruiser class industrial with low mass, the best gas harvesting in game and the ability to fit these new small ice harvesters would have been perfect... But no, we get another dumb little frigate. Dear eve players, please try and use the word "content" less and instead, be specific. Thanks
Franklin en Chalune Stark's Kerbside Hauler Universal Logistics 1	Posted - 2015.10.09 19:04:48 - [167] - Quote Rek Seven wrote: A frigate with a 15000 m3 ore holed? Dumb It should have been a cruiser class venture that does multiple things including ice mining, ore mining and gas harvesting. The venture and the prospect are two ships that are either too hard to catch or not worth the effort involved in catching them. A cruiser hull would be better balanced. A cruiser class industrial with low mass, the best gas harvesting in game and the ability to fit these new small ice harvesters would have been perfect... But no, we get another dumb little frigate. Well... aren't the mining barges technically cruiser-sized vessels? A 15km3 Ore Hold on the Discovery isn't going to break the balance of mining ships or ore delivery, and bear in mind it's designed as an ice miner, it needs the space to hold the ice if we're not gonna be getting auto-ice-compression like people have asked for. For its designed usage, the Discovery will be as easy to catch as any non-interceptor non-covert ops frigate could be, what with not being nullified or being able to warp while cloaked. It would still have to burn to the outside of warp bubbles, and could quite easily be decloaked on the way. I think it's fine as it is.
Herzog Wolfhammer Sigma Special Tactics Group 7180	Posted - 2015.10.09 23:00:29 - [168] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: Bienator II wrote: the actual question is: what color is it? Laetitia Nzero wrote: What colour will it be? lol, art has the final say but I'm hoping for something icy Make it transparent so it fills up with ice cubes as it mines. Bring back DEEEEP Space!
Dracvlad Taishi Combine Second-Dawn 1143	Posted - 2015.10.10 08:40:02 - [169] - Quote I am so glad you are doing this, however it really needs a covert ops cloak, and a throw away T1 ice mining frigate would be a very good idea too while you are at it. My earlier comments on the Prospect being naff in another thread was incorrect, I fitted an AB and a specific rat tank and speed tanked the cruiser rats in NPC 0.0 and it did OK, though I had to bring in another toon every so often to clear the rats if the tank got eaten into too much. I note that the Discovery has drones which helps a bit, but at the cost of the covert ops cloak, damn that. But it does give me options now for ice mining and hence to get the fuel for the new structures that I did not have before in my logistic hell location in Stain. Ella's Snack bar. With all the data supplied on API/CREST the game should be renamed to Jabber Online, look something to kill, ping everyone!!!!
Azazel The Misanthrope Proioxis Assault Force Exodus. 73	Posted - 2015.10.11 09:25:50 - [170] - Quote I do not feel like this addition is very out of the box. When will there be a miner that can reasonably defend itself and still mine efficiently?
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM 5615	Posted - 2015.10.11 18:15:00 - [171] - Quote Azazel The Misanthrope wrote: I do not feel like this addition is very out of the box. When will there be a miner that can reasonably defend itself and still mine efficiently? You mean like the Skiff and Procurer? Woo! CSM X! Fuzzwork Enterprises Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Scuzzy Logic Nightmare Machinery 149	Posted - 2015.10.11 23:08:55 - [172] - Quote As much as I appreciate getting more hulls for existing resource harvesting types, can we PLEASE at least know if you're ever going to work on a ship tailored for gas harvesting? I'm getting very irritated that being able to fit more than 2 gas cloud harvesters is completely useless, making the description of the skill completely redundant (except at stopping me from making the 8-vacuum ship I've always dreamed of). All I've ever wanted is a ship with 6 highs, 5 turret hardpoints and an ore bay, CCP...
Scuzzy Logic Nightmare Machinery 149	Posted - 2015.10.11 23:11:02 - [173] - Quote Steve Ronuken wrote: Azazel The Misanthrope wrote: I do not feel like this addition is very out of the box. When will there be a miner that can reasonably defend itself and still mine efficiently? You mean like the Skiff and Procurer? He said defend, not writhe in pain for 5 minutes until backup arrives or its tank ruptures. The drones could at least gat a durability bonus or something. Even the rats scoff at them.
Franklin en Chalune Stark's Kerbside Hauler Universal Logistics 1	Posted - 2015.10.12 00:18:30 - [174] - Quote Scuzzy Logic wrote: Steve Ronuken wrote: You mean like the Skiff and Procurer? He said defend, not writhe in pain for 5 minutes until backup arrives or its tank ruptures. The drones could at least gat a durability bonus or something. Even the rats scoff at them. Umm... The Skiff and Procurer both have a 50% role bonus to drone damage and hitpoints, that's pretty much exactly what you just described
Barrogh Habalu Forever Winter Absolute Zero. 1076	Posted - 2015.10.12 07:58:10 - [175] - Quote Azazel The Misanthrope wrote: I do not feel like this addition is very out of the box. When will there be a miner that can reasonably defend itself and still mine efficiently? About the same time we'll get a combat ship that can mine for its own replacement reasonably well while still being effective combat vessel. Future of T3 cruisers - multi-tool they aspired to be instead of sledgehammer they have become
Syri Taneka Un4seen Development Sev3rance 121	Posted - 2015.10.13 17:24:24 - [176] - Quote FT Diomedes wrote: I like the idea. I'm sure it will have some use for WH folks, but I have yet to ever see someone ninja mining ores in null sec - gas, yes - but not ores. Not sure ninja ice mining will ever be a thing. I'm not saying it definitely will happen, but in territories prone to ganking, it has a fair chance. The ship is probably going to be a smaller loss (financially) than a mining barge, and generally easier to escape with - although, like always, the best way to not get caught is to safe up when reds/unknowns enter local.
Argyle Wynter Rura-Penthe 0	Posted - 2015.10.13 18:37:02 - [177] - Quote Not sure that this will be very interesting game play for expeditionary pilots. It will take awhile to scan into and out of shattered WHs. Even then, with a small cargo bay for ice, time and effort required for such miniscule payouts will make this short lived. You might as well do data sites in high sec. You should consider removing ice belts from high sec and having them as random spawns throughout ALL WH space. Similar to ore. - The argument about restricting ice from WH space is old now. We have no moon goo, ice would be fine. - Frankly, living in POSs is enough of a freak show. Bring the snow... - More day trippers, more targets. Lastly, I am disappointed you did not take the opportunity to make this a T3 hull. It is an obvious fit. Will we need to wait another 7 years before you give us anything else T3? Viability of WH space is a demand problem, not a supply problem. Seven more years is too long to wait. You could easily fix the T3 D price point by introducing another T3 ship to compete with materials instead of having to throttle melted nano-ribbons drop rates... yet again. Please look at this. AW
Bogo Shardani CBC Interstellar Fidelas Constans 0	Posted - 2015.10.13 19:16:11 - [178] - Quote Haatakan Reppola wrote: Mr Grape Drink wrote: Any particular reason you are making frigates specialized like how the old barges were? Barges now you kinda have to decide between yield, cargo, or tank. But frigs you kind of get forced into what you fly by what you're mining based on the bonuses Yield is already covered by Hulk, Ore bay is covered by Mackinaw and EHP is covered by Skiff (including their t1 variants) How do you balance 2-3 smaller/cheaper ships around the same metrics without them being useless or OP? Find new ways to balance them (diffrent roles). i will help you Yield is already covered by Hulk, Ore bay is covered by Mackinaw and EHP is covered by Skiff and mobility is covered by Discovery
GrandLynx University of Caille Gallente Federation 3	Posted - 2015.10.14 02:35:38 - [179] - Quote When the Discovery becomes available on Sisi - would be possible to have a fixed/permanent Shattered Wormhole which can be used to test this ship? and naturally, when this will be available to put through some paces?
Justa Hunni State War Academy Caldari State 12	Posted - 2015.10.14 02:41:04 - [180] - Quote Scuzzy Logic wrote: As much as I appreciate getting more hulls for existing resource harvesting types, can we PLEASE at least know if you're ever going to work on a ship tailored for gas harvesting? I'm getting very irritated that being able to fit more than 2 gas cloud harvesters is completely useless, making the description of the skill completely redundant (except at stopping me from making the 8-vacuum ship I've always dreamed of). All I've ever wanted is a ship with 6 highs, 5 turret hardpoints and an ore bay, CCP... You can get a ship now with 5 gas harvesters, just unbonused. Look at the old Ferox gas mining builds. I would argue the Venture is definately optomized for gas harvesting. Regardless of the skill description, the fact you need GH5 to fit harvester 2s is sufficient to train to that level.
Lady Rift What Shall We Call It 228	Posted - 2015.10.14 04:08:10 - [181] - Quote Scuzzy Logic wrote: As much as I appreciate getting more hulls for existing resource harvesting types, can we PLEASE at least know if you're ever going to work on a ship tailored for gas harvesting? I'm getting very irritated that being able to fit more than 2 gas cloud harvesters is completely useless, making the description of the skill completely redundant (except at stopping me from making the 8-vacuum ship I've always dreamed of). All I've ever wanted is a ship with 6 highs, 5 turret hardpoints and an ore bay, CCP... the venture mines gas faster than any other ship. and they made it cheap by only needing 2 harvesters. lv 5 of the skill gives t2 harvesters which is worth the train just for that. so there is already a gas mining ship, then its t2 version is a ice mining ship (although not better than some barges) and the other t2 is just a better ninja than the t1.

CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 409	Posted - 2015.10.14 17:53:54 - [182] - Quote GrandLynx wrote: When the Discovery becomes available on Sisi - would be possible to have a fixed/permanent Shattered Wormhole which can be used to test this ship? and naturally, when this will be available to put through some paces? When sis is updated to the December release it should be fully available to test. Before then there might be something there to test with, but it'll probably only be the pieces which needed to be submitted in order for art to do their part. @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters


CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 409	Posted - 2015.10.14 17:57:02 - [183] - Quote Lady Rift wrote: Scuzzy Logic wrote: As much as I appreciate getting more hulls for existing resource harvesting types, can we PLEASE at least know if you're ever going to work on a ship tailored for gas harvesting? I'm getting very irritated that being able to fit more than 2 gas cloud harvesters is completely useless, making the description of the skill completely redundant (except at stopping me from making the 8-vacuum ship I've always dreamed of). All I've ever wanted is a ship with 6 highs, 5 turret hardpoints and an ore bay, CCP... the venture mines gas faster than any other ship. and they made it cheap by only needing 2 harvesters. lv 5 of the skill gives t2 harvesters which is worth the train just for that. so there is already a gas mining ship, then its t2 version is a ice mining ship (although not better than some barges) and the other t2 is just a better ninja than the t1. Or if you feel you need to be a little safer, the Prospect has the same gas harvesting bonuses. @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters

Haatakan Reppola Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 106	Posted - 2015.10.14 18:07:37 - [184] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: GrandLynx wrote: When the Discovery becomes available on Sisi - would be possible to have a fixed/permanent Shattered Wormhole which can be used to test this ship? and naturally, when this will be available to put through some paces? When sis is updated to the December release it should be fully available to test. Before then there might be something there to test with, but it'll probably only be the pieces which needed to be submitted in order for art to do their part. Is there any plan to remove Medium Ice Harvester Accelerator or add a small? If my math is correct (big if :P) only Procurer and Retriever will be beaten for Ice harvesting at max skills with same number of ice rigs (0 or 1) with Covetor without rig is mine ice faster than Discovery would with rig. With a rig the Discovery should beat Mackinaw/Skiff (without rig) by around 1.3sec per block I see no harm in letting this ship get that extra 12% cycle bonus when its still on the same level as unrigged exhumers that either have massive EHP or cargo advantages

CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 409	Posted - 2015.10.14 18:17:23 - [185] - Quote Haatakan Reppola wrote: Is there any plan to remove Medium Ice Harvester Accelerator or add a small? If my math is correct (big if :P) only Procurer and Retriever will be beaten for Ice harvesting at max skills with same number of ice rigs (0 or 1) with Covetor without rig is mine ice faster than Discovery would with rig. With a rig the Discovery should beat Mackinaw/Skiff (without rig) by around 1.3sec per block I see no harm in letting this ship get that extra 12% cycle bonus when its still on the same level as unrigged exhumers that either have massive EHP or cargo advantages At this point there are no plans to remove the medium Ice Harvester Accelerator, nor will we be adding in a Small for the Discovery and Prospect to use. The Discovery is, by design, the slowest ice mining ship (high individual block speed, slowest blocks/min). This is because it's not only cheaper to field one, but we want it to fulfill its own role instead of stepping on the toes of the mining barges and exhumers. @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters

Mai Khumm Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State 684	Posted - 2015.10.16 18:15:34 - [186] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: Expedition Frigates bonuses (per skill level): 5% reduction to Ice Harvesting duration 4% bonus to all shield resistances Mining Frigate bonuses (per skill level): 5% reduction to Ice Harvesting duration 5% bonus to Mining yield This is something I really don't understand.... To fit your ass into a T2 ship you need the T1 ship prerequisites to lvl 5. (Minus the odd grandfather here and there.) So why have (in this case) "Mining Frigate bonuses (per skill level)" Instead have "MISC Bonuses" or something similar. Example wrote: Expedition Frigates bonuses (per skill level): 5% reduction to Ice Harvesting duration 4% bonus to all shield resistances Mining Frigate/MISC bonuses: 25% reduction to Ice Harvesting duration 25% bonus to Mining yield Toronto EVE Thread! [email protected] @Toronto_EVE
bunzing heet Internet Terrorists SpaceMonkey's Alliance 10	Posted - 2015.10.16 20:44:20 - [187] - Quote Ty ccp I'm allready getting rich shooting astero's and other scanning and mining ships so all mining frigs viable for me to kill and loot are more then welcome They only got to remember to bring me better loot :) Fly safe keep killing And remember I'm watching you !!!!
Lady Rift What Shall We Call It 228	Posted - 2015.10.17 02:08:54 - [188] - Quote Mai Khumm wrote: CCP Terminus wrote: Expedition Frigates bonuses (per skill level): 5% reduction to Ice Harvesting duration 4% bonus to all shield resistances Mining Frigate bonuses (per skill level): 5% reduction to Ice Harvesting duration 5% bonus to Mining yield This is something I really don't understand.... To fit your ass into a T2 ship you need the T1 ship prerequisites to lvl 5. (Minus the odd grandfather here and there.) So why have (in this case) "Mining Frigate bonuses (per skill level)" Instead have "MISC Bonuses" or something similar. Example wrote: Expedition Frigates bonuses (per skill level): 5% reduction to Ice Harvesting duration 4% bonus to all shield resistances Mining Frigate/MISC bonuses: 25% reduction to Ice Harvesting duration 25% bonus to Mining yield when you could lose sp there were edge cases where you could fly T2 ships with out lv5 of the t1
Thonys Visser Green Visstick High 10	Posted - 2015.10.19 12:08:23 - [189] - Quote Well it is just a ship ,to fill a gap in low nothing more its not a real mining vessel (there are better ships) its just a compromise minnig = the cuckoo in the nest. or deliberate a neglected profession i am still waiting for a BS mining vessel (i never asked for this vessel) but perhaps ccp is waiting for the day...... i stop with EVE what is not unlikely to happen soon and that is for one reason i will not be FORCED to go to low ,because ccp wants it that way HS is on a death track ,and this ship is not going to change that.. Greeting to.... the oh so lovely community and the ccp people
Perrdy Lady Hedion University Amarr Empire 5	Posted - 2015.10.19 19:42:55 - [190] - Quote 15000 ore hold ON A FRIGATE ?!?!?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ?????? I look forward to the ore hold increase on every single barge and exhumer then, otherwise this makes no sense whatsoever.
Franklin en Chalune Stark's Kerbside Hauler Universal Logistics 3	Posted - 2015.10.20 02:42:31 - [191] - Quote Perrdy Lady wrote: 15000 ore hold ON A FRIGATE ?!?!?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ?????? I look forward to the ore hold increase on every single barge and exhumer then, otherwise this makes no sense whatsoever. It wouldn't make sense for it to have a smaller ore hold though. It's purely designed as an ice mining ship, and ice is 1000m3 per block. If you had the same ore hold as the Prospect, then your hold would fill up too quickly to make trips worthwhile. Hell, it's a bit too small to begin with on that front anyway! Now, if it had, say, auto-ice-compression, like some people have suggested, then it could afford to have a smaller ore hold, perhaps even on the order of the Venture's hold, because with auto-ice-compression it'd be able to hold 50 blocks of ice then, while the ship itself already puts people off from mining regular asteroids with it. As things stand though, because it's an ice miner it needs the larger ore hold. Plus, that's not THAT large a hold, it's not exactly unbalanced
Fourteen Maken Omega Industry Inc. The Ditanian Alliance 216	Posted - 2015.10.20 07:57:21 - [192] - Quote Perrdy Lady wrote: 15000 ore hold ON A FRIGATE ?!?!?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ?????? I look forward to the ore hold increase on every single barge and exhumer then, otherwise this makes no sense whatsoever. not even big enough as far as im concerned considering it's purpose is to mine in one system and haul it back to base in another system. I think it should mine + automatically compress the ore so you can mine for a long time before you have to haul it back. but i still like the concept of these expedition ships. Support a fairer loyalty point market for faction war: The sinews of war; infinite money.
Ix Method Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic 475	Posted - 2015.10.20 11:06:30 - [193] - Quote Fourteen Maken wrote: I think it should mine + automatically compress the ore so you can mine for a long time before you have to haul it back. Honestly if that was a unique property of Expedition Ships (coupled with a capacity nerf obv.) that would be pretty interesting. Travelling at the speed of love.
Lex Gabinia Res Repetundae 17	Posted - 2015.10.20 19:39:32 - [194] - Quote Selto Black wrote: I like this, however, it does put a bit of a skill wall up for younger players who wish to gather resources under hostile conditions. Because everyone should be able to do everything instantly? Honestly, it's becoming ridiculous.
Amarisen Gream Divine Demise Apocalypse Now. 140	Posted - 2015.10.21 07:37:25 - [195] - Quote I want echo the others in the cargo/ore bay size. Repackaged frigates are 2500 m3 Unpacked they are what 20-30k m3 This ships ore bay is like half its size. I feel CCP is doing a great job at giving as a new ship with a purpose ( as they failed to do so with the shattered wh even when those places have ore and ice), but the aspects of that new ship unbalance everything else. Skiff = 100k m3 has an ore bay of 15k Mac = 150k m3 has an ore bay of 35k Hulk = 200k m2 has an ore bay of 8.5 (Check numbers - I remember you can fit 4 skiffs in an orca or two hulks.) The ships M3 aka their area consumes while unpackaged and what they can have inside needs to have some logic - specially between purposes. All theses ships have common build components by the lore - and thus should have near the same capacity xoxo Amarisen Gream
Franklin en Chalune Stark's Kerbside Hauler Universal Logistics 4	Posted - 2015.10.21 10:20:06 - [196] - Quote Amarisen Gream wrote: I want echo the others in the cargo/ore bay size. Repackaged frigates are 2500 m3 Unpacked they are what 20-30k m3 This ships ore bay is like half its size. I feel CCP is doing a great job at giving as a new ship with a purpose ( as they failed to do so with the shattered wh even when those places have ore and ice), but the aspects of that new ship unbalance everything else. Skiff = 100k m3 has an ore bay of 15k Mac = 150k m3 has an ore bay of 35k Hulk = 200k m2 has an ore bay of 8.5 (Check numbers - I remember you can fit 4 skiffs in an orca or two hulks.) The ships M3 aka their area consumes while unpackaged and what they can have inside needs to have some logic - specially between purposes. All theses ships have common build components by the lore - and thus should have near the same capacity Volume* Not area. As far as logic goes with regards to the ore hold sizes, lore-wise, you should bear in mind that the ore hold isn't likely just a giant box with ore chucked inside it. It could be any number of compartments around the ship. If I recall correctly, the Venture has "special ore loading mechanisms" which result in its higher ore yield from just two mining lasers. Well, if the Discovery can only fit a single laser anyway, half of the loading mechanisms could be stripped out, freeing up more space for ore to be stored. Just a thought. That said, as has been suggested by many others in the thread, I'd be all for it having an ore hold size nerf combined with giving it ore-compression so that it could viably mine ice. Say, a 5km3 ore hold with automatic ore compression; that would let it hold 50 ice blocks, giving it a bit more staying power and more point to actually taking it into shattered WHs to mine ice. Of course, a 10km3 ore hold like the Prospect's would be even nicer with that, but that may be asking a little bit much :D. Having to return a station or whathaveyou to deposit every 15 chunks of ice, when it mines as fast as it does, would get very tedious, very fast, especially if you're having to navigate through wormholes to actually get there and back, so it really could do with being able to compress the ice it's mining
DrysonBennington Aliastra Gallente Federation 237	Posted - 2015.10.22 14:15:18 - [197] - Quote Are we going to see a Gas Expedition Frigate in the future as well? Kind of biased against the Gas People not developing one for them. I would think that the color scheme should be a new type of cloak that would mimic the environment it was around thus becoming that environment. It wouldn't be able to be seen visually but would appear on the Overview. Once locked though the frigate would be become visible to the naked eye as a blur of what the ship was reflecting and close to. If not then a simple mixture of Ice colors would be nice.
Penance Toralen School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State 0	Posted - 2015.10.22 21:32:55 - [198] - Quote Hello CCP Terminus, Why does the Expedition Frigate skill require Electronics Upgrades V - when this skill does not provide a direct benefit to the hull? I can see that you'd want the same (or greater) length training time as the Covert Op line - to prevent a short cut. Just my thought that the pre-reqs should help develop the intended use/purpose of the ship.
Tyberius Franklin Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 1657	Posted - 2015.10.22 21:47:38 - [199] - Quote Lady Rift wrote: when you could lose sp there were edge cases where you could fly T2 ships with out lv5 of the t1 Which edge cases were those? For as long as I've played using T2 ships required level V on the associated T1 ship skill (JFs aside) so if you lost the level V you wouldn't be able to fly the ship.
Justin Cody Hard Knocks Inc. Hard Knocks Citizens 320	Posted - 2015.10.22 23:25:33 - [200] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: Haatakan Reppola wrote: Is there any plan to remove Medium Ice Harvester Accelerator or add a small? If my math is correct (big if :P) only Procurer and Retriever will be beaten for Ice harvesting at max skills with same number of ice rigs (0 or 1) with Covetor without rig is mine ice faster than Discovery would with rig. With a rig the Discovery should beat Mackinaw/Skiff (without rig) by around 1.3sec per block I see no harm in letting this ship get that extra 12% cycle bonus when its still on the same level as unrigged exhumers that either have massive EHP or cargo advantages At this point there are no plans to remove the medium Ice Harvester Accelerator, nor will we be adding in a Small for the Discovery and Prospect to use. The Discovery is, by design, the slowest ice mining ship (high individual block speed, slowest blocks/min). This is because it's not only cheaper to field one, but we want it to fulfill its own role instead of stepping on the toes of the mining barges and exhumers. so what you're saying is... its terrible
Jajuka Cirim 6	Posted - 2015.10.24 07:10:37 - [201] - Quote CCP Seagull used a different name than Discovery during the Vegas keynote. Did anyone catch it? DrysonBennington wrote: Are we going to see a Gas Expedition Frigate in the future as well? Kind of biased against the Gas People not developing one for them. Not sure if sarcasm or you never looked at the traits on the current frigates? The Venture replaced the Ferox, after all. Having huffed a lot of gas, I can't think of any meaningful way to improve them without risking an imbalance.
Jeremiah Saken The Fall of Leviathan 463	Posted - 2015.10.24 12:02:50 - [202] - Quote Jajuka Cirim wrote: CCP Seagull used a different name than Discovery during the Vegas keynote. Did anyone catch it? Endurance. The ship used in antarctica expedition. "(...) I am tormented with an everlasting itch for things remote. I love to sail forbidden seas (...)"

CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 454	Posted - 2015.10.27 13:52:04 - [203] - Quote Jajuka Cirim wrote: CCP Seagull used a different name than Discovery during the Vegas keynote. Did anyone catch it? The Discovery has had it's name changed to the Endurance. This is to avoid confusion with Project Discovery, the citizen science initiative coming to EVE soon. @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters

Tabris Katz New Moon Harvesters 46	Posted - 2015.10.27 14:08:35 - [204] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: Jajuka Cirim wrote: CCP Seagull used a different name than Discovery during the Vegas keynote. Did anyone catch it? The Discovery has had it's name changed to the Endurance. This is to avoid confusion with Project Discovery, the citizen science initiative coming to EVE soon. Endurance? Ew, I can't say I'm found of it and it doesn't fit the theme of mining frigates. Up till now we've had Venture and Prospect. Both these names call to mind images acquiring good (aka ores and gases) and have business feel to them. Endurance doesn't have either of these feels. Personally, I think Discovery is a much better name and fits the theme.
Destoya Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion 546	Posted - 2015.10.27 15:45:42 - [205] - Quote Endeavour fits it much better in my opinion, even continues with the space shuttle theme
Lady Rift What Shall We Call It 235	Posted - 2015.10.27 17:14:14 - [206] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: Lady Rift wrote: Scuzzy Logic wrote: As much as I appreciate getting more hulls for existing resource harvesting types, can we PLEASE at least know if you're ever going to work on a ship tailored for gas harvesting? I'm getting very irritated that being able to fit more than 2 gas cloud harvesters is completely useless, making the description of the skill completely redundant (except at stopping me from making the 8-vacuum ship I've always dreamed of). All I've ever wanted is a ship with 6 highs, 5 turret hardpoints and an ore bay, CCP... the venture mines gas faster than any other ship. and they made it cheap by only needing 2 harvesters. lv 5 of the skill gives t2 harvesters which is worth the train just for that. so there is already a gas mining ship, then its t2 version is a ice mining ship (although not better than some barges) and the other t2 is just a better ninja than the t1. Or if you feel you need to be a little safer, the Prospect has the same gas harvesting bonuses. thats what i was referring to by calling it a better ninja.
Lady Rift What Shall We Call It 235	Posted - 2015.10.27 17:16:47 - [207] - Quote Tyberius Franklin wrote: Lady Rift wrote: when you could lose sp there were edge cases where you could fly T2 ships with out lv5 of the t1 Which edge cases were those? For as long as I've played using T2 ships required level V on the associated T1 ship skill (JFs aside) so if you lost the level V you wouldn't be able to fly the ship. maybe i was thinking of something else. oh well also jump freighters don't require freighter at 5.
Tyberius Franklin Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 1688	Posted - 2015.10.27 21:55:30 - [208] - Quote Lady Rift wrote: Tyberius Franklin wrote: Lady Rift wrote: when you could lose sp there were edge cases where you could fly T2 ships with out lv5 of the t1 Which edge cases were those? For as long as I've played using T2 ships required level V on the associated T1 ship skill (JFs aside) so if you lost the level V you wouldn't be able to fly the ship. ...also jump freighters don't require freighter at 5. Hence "(JFs aside)"
Jajuka Cirim 11	Posted - 2015.10.28 04:16:09 - [209] - Quote Tabris Katz wrote: Endurance? Ew, I can't say I'm found of it and it doesn't fit the theme of mining frigates. Up till now we've had Venture and Prospect. Both these names call to mind images acquiring good (aka ores and gases) and have business feel to them. Endurance doesn't have either of these feels. Personally, I think Discovery is a much better name and fits the theme. Couldn't agree more. Unless they make it tank like a Skiff. In which case, ok.
Tabris Katz New Moon Harvesters 46	Posted - 2015.10.28 07:07:40 - [210] - Quote Jajuka Cirim wrote: Tabris Katz wrote: Endurance? Ew, I can't say I'm found of it and it doesn't fit the theme of mining frigates. Up till now we've had Venture and Prospect. Both these names call to mind images acquiring good (aka ores and gases) and have business feel to them. Endurance doesn't have either of these feels. Personally, I think Discovery is a much better name and fits the theme. Couldn't agree more. Unless they make it tank like a Skiff. In which case, ok. At that point just call it for what it is, Brick
Bla5to Frigate The Praxus Consortium 0	Posted - 2015.10.30 14:27:54 - [211] - Quote I for one, am looking forward to this ship. Being a wormhole dweller this will make a nice addition for me once those shattered frigate systems link up with ours. It will make for a great corp ice mining fleet in those systems. In and out kinda stuff.
Xeator soldiers.fi 63	Posted - 2015.11.02 04:07:47 - [212] - Quote Ill point this out again, like I did back when the Prospect was realeased. Why do frigate sized ships have larger ore bays than mining barges or exhumers? A Covetor has 7000m3. I mean for gameplay purposes it makes sense, if they had holds the size of 1000m3 or something you couldnt really mine in them. So, does that mean the current barge/exhumer balance is still off? I mean, they did just get rebalanced...
Nocturhnal Goats out of Authority Emergent Dawn 1	Posted - 2015.11.03 17:35:33 - [213] - Quote Xeator wrote: Why do frigate sized ships have larger ore bays than mining barges or exhumers? A Covetor has 7000m3. Bigger ore bay, more mobility, but less mining yield, it's a matter of choice, mining barge and exhumers will stay the rolls royce of ice mining. This ship has been designed for ninja ice mining in frigate sized shattered wormhole. And in my opinon, mining 15 blocks and returning in base represent too much risk for few isk involved. If there was a new kind of magic expensive ice only found in shattered wormhole why not, but for mining dark glitter or whatever else, isk / h is still poor, ninja gas harvesting C320 is really more interesting for the same risks. But 15000 m3 ore hold.... can we fit gas harvester on ?
Orge Snorrsen German Evefreaks 0	Posted - 2015.11.03 18:50:23 - [214] - Quote Quote: Standard ore mining in a Endurance will be about as fast as a Venture due to the 200% role bonus to mining yield, but will be slower than a Prospect. Did i do the wrong maths myself, or is there something else faulty happening? Using a Miner II will grant 60m-¦/min in a rookie ship for example, so 120m-¦/min fitted in the Venture due to the 100% Role Bonus With 2 Mining Turrets the Venture can harvest around 240m-¦/min. The Endurance although will still get a 180m-¦/min yield due to the 1 miner and 200% bonus. Correctly a 300% would be needed, considering the same mining frigate skill bonus between venture/endurance
Lady Rift What Shall We Call It 235	Posted - 2015.11.03 19:50:13 - [215] - Quote Nocturhnal wrote: Xeator wrote: Why do frigate sized ships have larger ore bays than mining barges or exhumers? A Covetor has 7000m3. Bigger ore bay, more mobility, but less mining yield, it's a matter of choice, mining barge and exhumers will stay the rolls royce of ice mining. This ship has been designed for ninja ice mining in frigate sized shattered wormhole. And in my opinon, mining 15 blocks and returning in base represent too much risk for few isk involved. If there was a new kind of magic expensive ice only found in shattered wormhole why not, but for mining dark glitter or whatever else, isk / h is still poor, ninja gas harvesting C320 is really more interesting for the same risks. But 15000 m3 ore hold.... can we fit gas harvester on ? the prospect has 10k bay and is the fastest ship in eve for gas mining with the ability to warp cloaked
Bla5to Frigate The Praxus Consortium 0	Posted - 2015.11.04 03:04:08 - [216] - Quote Everyone is complaining about the size comparison between the ore holds of the barges and the Endurance frigate. I have a friend with a corvette engine in a Volkswagen beetle. When compared to the Corvette, the beetle is small as hell, but puts out the same power as the Corvette. To someone that doesn't know "the secret" they wonder how can this be. Everyone is looking at the size of the hull without seeing the goodies inside filling that space up. Use your imaginations and think about all of the neat and tidy insides of the Endurance allowing it to cram in as much storage space as it gets while the mining barges are just thrown together with wires all slung out everywhere and bits and pieces scattered about. Have fun with it! Maybe that will help, it is just a game folks.... Keep it going CCP.
Irya Boone Never Surrender. 468	Posted - 2015.11.04 03:23:00 - [217] - Quote Why only 5% bonus ? be bold and put a 10% instead please CCP it's time to remove Off Grid Boost and Put Them on Killmail too, add Logi on killmails .... Open that damn door !! you shall all bow and pray BoB
Goldensaver Lom Corporation Just let it happen 410	Posted - 2015.11.04 05:22:02 - [218] - Quote Bla5to Frigate wrote: Everyone is complaining about the size comparison between the ore holds of the barges and the Endurance frigate. I have a friend with a corvette engine in a Volkswagen beetle. When compared to the Corvette, the beetle is small as hell, but puts out the same power as the Corvette. To someone that doesn't know "the secret" they wonder how can this be. Everyone is looking at the size of the hull without seeing the goodies inside filling that space up. Use your imaginations and think about all of the neat and tidy insides of the Endurance allowing it to cram in as much storage space as it gets while the mining barges are just thrown together with wires all slung out everywhere and bits and pieces scattered about. Have fun with it! Maybe that will help, it is just a game folks.... Keep it going CCP. Yep. We've got here an efficient little use of space. Meanwhile on the Barges we have powerhouses dedicated to stripping an asteroid bare in moments. It has a whole hell of a lot of hardware taking up its larger frame. It also has more powerful defenses, stronger shields, thicker armour, bigger engines, etc. There are perfectly good reasons as to why something with a smaller volume can have a more efficient use of space inside. As to balance, it's because it's supposed to get in, fill up and get out. It's a slower miner than most of the barges despite the larger hold than half so you won't see it used sitting in a local belt jetcan mining over a Skiff or Hulk. It'll be used to go multiple jumps and fill up in... less than welcoming space, so it needs to have enough capacity to make it worth a trip. Tyberius Franklin wrote: Lady Rift wrote: Tyberius Franklin wrote: Lady Rift wrote: when you could lose sp there were edge cases where you could fly T2 ships with out lv5 of the t1 Which edge cases were those? For as long as I've played using T2 ships required level V on the associated T1 ship skill (JFs aside) so if you lost the level V you wouldn't be able to fly the ship. ...also jump freighters don't require freighter at 5. Hence "(JFs aside)" T1 skill to V was required to inject T2 skill. T2 skill was the only real requirement to fly the ship. If things played out in a certain way before you could lose, for example, Amarr Cruiser V but still have the HAC skill trained up and be able to fly a Zealot.
Rek Seven Hidden Agenda Deep Space Engineering 2099	Posted - 2015.11.04 11:13:36 - [219] - Quote I have given up with the mining frigates and probably won't bother with this one either. The venture and the prospector are too slow at gas mining for my taste. I want a cruiser (or larger) size hull that can gas mine 2 to 3 times faster than a venture! It should of happened years ago but i still think new subsystems should be added to T3 cruisers that would allow them to fill a harvesting/extraction role, amongst other things. The wishlist is pretty much complete...
Goldensaver Lom Corporation Just let it happen 410	Posted - 2015.11.04 11:24:23 - [220] - Quote Rek Seven wrote: I have given up with the mining frigates and probably won't bother with this one either. The venture and the prospector are too slow at gas mining for my taste. I want a cruiser (or larger) size hull that can gas mine 2 to 3 times faster than a venture! It should of happened years ago but i still think new subsystems should be added to T3 cruisers that would allow them to fill a harvesting/extraction role, amongst other things. I too want the price of gas to drop by 50% or more. It would certainly make gas based things cheaper. Drugs are gas based, right? I've always wanted to use the stronger ones more.
elitatwo Eve Minions The-Company 904	Posted - 2015.11.04 15:51:09 - [221] - Quote Xeator wrote: Ill point this out again, like I did back when the Prospect was realeased. Why do frigate sized ships have larger ore bays than mining barges or exhumers? A Covetor has 7000m3. I mean for gameplay purposes it makes sense, if they had holds the size of 1000m3 or something you couldnt really mine in them. So, does that mean the current barge/exhumer balance is still off? I mean, they did just get rebalanced... If you are so worries, the Prospect is close to the size of a destroyer. I can put up to 5 fitted interceptors in a Bustards fleet hangar but the Prospect won't fit inside, she is too tall. You happy? Eve Minions is recruiting. Learn from about pvp, learn about ships and how to fly them correctly. Small gang and solo action in high, low and nullsec and w-space alike. We will teach you everything you need and want to know.
Lady Rift What Shall We Call It 235	Posted - 2015.11.04 16:17:07 - [222] - Quote Rek Seven wrote: I have given up with the mining frigates and probably won't bother with this one either. The venture and the prospector are too slow at gas mining for my taste. I want a cruiser (or larger) size hull that can gas mine 2 to 3 times faster than a venture! It should of happened years ago but i still think new subsystems should be added to T3 cruisers that would allow them to fill a harvesting/extraction role, amongst other things. you know both those frigs mine gas faster than what we had before they where released.
Mr Grape Drink Sugar - Water - Purple The Mutiny 56	Posted - 2015.11.04 19:41:36 - [223] - Quote Lady Rift wrote: Rek Seven wrote: I have given up with the mining frigates and probably won't bother with this one either. The venture and the prospector are too slow at gas mining for my taste. I want a cruiser (or larger) size hull that can gas mine 2 to 3 times faster than a venture! It should of happened years ago but i still think new subsystems should be added to T3 cruisers that would allow them to fill a harvesting/extraction role, amongst other things. you know both those frigs mine gas faster than what we had before they where released. IMPOSSIBLE! The frigs only have 2 harvesters, but I can toss 5 on a cruiser; 2 < 5. Bonuses? What are bonuses?
Mr Grape Drink Sugar - Water - Purple The Mutiny 56	Posted - 2015.11.04 19:42:22 - [224] - Quote Where my dev blog gone?
Lady Rift What Shall We Call It 236	Posted - 2015.11.04 20:40:43 - [225] - Quote Mr Grape Drink wrote: Lady Rift wrote: Rek Seven wrote: I have given up with the mining frigates and probably won't bother with this one either. The venture and the prospector are too slow at gas mining for my taste. I want a cruiser (or larger) size hull that can gas mine 2 to 3 times faster than a venture! It should of happened years ago but i still think new subsystems should be added to T3 cruisers that would allow them to fill a harvesting/extraction role, amongst other things. you know both those frigs mine gas faster than what we had before they where released. IMPOSSIBLE! The frigs only have 2 harvesters, but I can toss 5 on a cruiser; 2 < 5. Bonuses? What are bonuses? this is eve man. 2>5 gas harvesters 4 guns=8 guns space is a strange place.
Rek Seven Hidden Agenda Deep Space Engineering 2100	Posted - 2015.11.04 22:33:03 - [226] - Quote Lady Rift wrote: Rek Seven wrote: I have given up with the mining frigates and probably won't bother with this one either. The venture and the prospector are too slow at gas mining for my taste. I want a cruiser (or larger) size hull that can gas mine 2 to 3 times faster than a venture! It should of happened years ago but i still think new subsystems should be added to T3 cruisers that would allow them to fill a harvesting/extraction role, amongst other things. you know both those frigs mine gas faster than what we had before they where released. Yes they mine SLIGHTLY faster than a ship with 5 harvesters on but that doesn't mean is isn't a painfully slow process. The wishlist is pretty much complete...
Bla5to Frigate The Praxus Consortium 0	Posted - 2015.11.04 22:38:48 - [227] - Quote Rek Seven wrote: I have given up with the mining frigates and probably won't bother with this one either. The venture and the prospector are too slow at gas mining for my taste. I want a cruiser (or larger) size hull that can gas mine 2 to 3 times faster than a venture! It should of happened years ago but i still think new subsystems should be added to T3 cruisers that would allow them to fill a harvesting/extraction role, amongst other things. It doesn't apply in the real world. Otherwise, Lamborgini's would come with bigger trunks so one could haul the family groceries. Perhaps pack up some chairs and an umbrella for a family outing at the beach. Oh wait. They are built for a specific purpose, and that is speed. Same with spaceships.
Goldensaver Lom Corporation Just let it happen 410	Posted - 2015.11.05 03:52:06 - [228] - Quote Rek Seven wrote: Lady Rift wrote: Rek Seven wrote: I have given up with the mining frigates and probably won't bother with this one either. The venture and the prospector are too slow at gas mining for my taste. I want a cruiser (or larger) size hull that can gas mine 2 to 3 times faster than a venture! It should of happened years ago but i still think new subsystems should be added to T3 cruisers that would allow them to fill a harvesting/extraction role, amongst other things. you know both those frigs mine gas faster than what we had before they where released. Yes they mine SLIGHTLY faster than a ship with 5 harvesters on but that doesn't mean is isn't a painfully slow process. Funny thing is if you speed it up then the price of gas drops because it'll be lower risk since you're gankable for less time, and the supply is higher due to the higher yield. So in essence you net zero there.get more gas, but it's worth less.
Lady Rift What Shall We Call It 237	Posted - 2015.11.05 06:35:42 - [229] - Quote Rek Seven wrote: Lady Rift wrote: Rek Seven wrote: I have given up with the mining frigates and probably won't bother with this one either. The venture and the prospector are too slow at gas mining for my taste. I want a cruiser (or larger) size hull that can gas mine 2 to 3 times faster than a venture! It should of happened years ago but i still think new subsystems should be added to T3 cruisers that would allow them to fill a harvesting/extraction role, amongst other things. you know both those frigs mine gas faster than what we had before they where released. Yes they mine SLIGHTLY faster than a ship with 5 harvesters on but that doesn't mean is isn't a painfully slow process. it could be worst it could be mining rocks
Rek Seven Hidden Agenda Deep Space Engineering 2100	Posted - 2015.11.05 09:31:13 - [230] - Quote Goldensaver wrote: Rek Seven wrote: Lady Rift wrote: Rek Seven wrote: I have given up with the mining frigates and probably won't bother with this one either. The venture and the prospector are too slow at gas mining for my taste. I want a cruiser (or larger) size hull that can gas mine 2 to 3 times faster than a venture! It should of happened years ago but i still think new subsystems should be added to T3 cruisers that would allow them to fill a harvesting/extraction role, amongst other things. you know both those frigs mine gas faster than what we had before they where released. Yes they mine SLIGHTLY faster than a ship with 5 harvesters on but that doesn't mean is isn't a painfully slow process. Funny thing is if you speed it up then the price of gas drops because it'll be lower risk since you're gankable for less time, and the supply is higher due to the higher yield. So in essence you net zero there.get more gas, but it's worth less. My original argument was that there should be a bigger ship that is better at gas mining. This would balance it's self out in terms of risk. Currently we have these little frigate that are very cheap and either come warp disruptor resistance or a covert cloak. This makes them pretty hard to catch and thus, fairly risk free. If anything the introduction of the venture drove the price down. Now if you introduce a more expensive cruiser class gas miner that didn't have the warp core strength or a cloak, they would be easier to catch and as a result, the risk to reward factor would be better. Considering this, i don't think the price would drop too much but if it did, it would probably be to the point where venture pilots would want to upgrade to the riskier ship so they earn more per hour. The wishlist is pretty much complete...
Rek Seven Hidden Agenda Deep Space Engineering 2100	Posted - 2015.11.05 09:41:24 - [231] - Quote Bla5to Frigate wrote: Rek Seven wrote: I have given up with the mining frigates and probably won't bother with this one either. The venture and the prospector are too slow at gas mining for my taste. I want a cruiser (or larger) size hull that can gas mine 2 to 3 times faster than a venture! It should of happened years ago but i still think new subsystems should be added to T3 cruisers that would allow them to fill a harvesting/extraction role, amongst other things. It doesn't apply in the real world. Otherwise, Lamborgini's would come with bigger trunks so one could haul the family groceries. Perhaps pack up some chairs and an umbrella for a family outing at the beach. Oh wait. They are built for a specific purpose, and that is speed. Same with spaceships. So what is your point? Your analogy is a bad one and what i said does apply to the real world. Using the car analogy, Prosche, at one time, only made fast luxury cars but now they make luxury 4x4's and all sorts. Like the 4x4, a cruiser class venture would sacrifice mobility for added luxury (speed of gas miners) and added utility (more cargo or probe bonuses). The wishlist is pretty much complete...
Shadowforge Dawkins Catastrophic Overview Failure Brave Collective 27	Posted - 2015.11.06 00:04:59 - [232] - Quote out of curiosity, currently only ore mining (mining lasers) have upgrades such as those that fill low slots. will you be adding any that can be used for both ice harvesting and gas harvesting? right now, as i know it, mining laser upgrades do not affect gas harvesters or ice lasers. correct me if i'm wrong i'm a wormhole pvper not an industrialist.
Franklin en Chalune Stark's Kerbside Hauler Universal Logistics 4	Posted - 2015.11.06 00:10:47 - [233] - Quote Shadowforge Dawkins wrote: out of curiosity, currently only ore mining (mining lasers) have upgrades such as those that fill low slots. will you be adding any that can be used for both ice harvesting and gas harvesting? right now, as i know it, mining laser upgrades do not affect gas harvesters or ice lasers. correct me if i'm wrong i'm a wormhole pvper not an industrialist. There are ice harvester upgrades, which I assume will affect the new ice mining lasers as well as the regular ice harvesters, due to the mining laser upgrades affecting both strip miners and regular mining lasers. There are not ones for gas harvesters though, you're right on that front
Shadowforge Dawkins Catastrophic Overview Failure Brave Collective 27	Posted - 2015.11.06 00:16:42 - [234] - Quote correct me if i'm wrong i'm a wormhole pvper not an industrialist.[/quote] There are ice harvester upgrades, which I assume will affect the new ice mining lasers as well as the regular ice harvesters, due to the mining laser upgrades affecting both strip miners and regular mining lasers. There are not ones for gas harvesters though, you're right on that front[/quote] thanks for filling the void for me. hopefully they add some upgrades for gas harvesting. we have 4 low slots on prospects and having something useful for them would be great when it comes to gas
Bla5to Frigate The Praxus Consortium 1	Posted - 2015.11.06 18:18:36 - [235] - Quote Rek Seven wrote: Bla5to Frigate wrote: Rek Seven wrote: I have given up with the mining frigates and probably won't bother with this one either. The venture and the prospector are too slow at gas mining for my taste. I want a cruiser (or larger) size hull that can gas mine 2 to 3 times faster than a venture! It should of happened years ago but i still think new subsystems should be added to T3 cruisers that would allow them to fill a harvesting/extraction role, amongst other things. It doesn't apply in the real world. Otherwise, Lamborgini's would come with bigger trunks so one could haul the family groceries. Perhaps pack up some chairs and an umbrella for a family outing at the beach. Oh wait. They are built for a specific purpose, and that is speed. Same with spaceships. So what is your point? Your analogy is a bad one and what i said does apply to the real world. Using the car analogy, Prosche, at one time, only made fast luxury cars but now they make luxury 4x4's and all sorts. Like the 4x4, a cruiser class venture would sacrifice mobility for added luxury (speed of gas miners) and added utility (more cargo or probe bonuses). Perhaps you're right. If the market demands change the manufactures can and will add other lines and more features to existing models. However, I was making the point that this is a game and complaining doesn't amount to much change (but I've only been in the game for about 3-4 months so I don't have much experience to speak of). I guess I was more thinking that we should enjoy the diversity provided. I do think that other ships and options would be nice, but then CCP would be spending so much time and resources trying to find out ways to make the community "happy" with ships that not much else would improve with the game. I'm sure they are trying to balance on a fine line between useful ships and ships that offer an unfair advantage. I'd rather take a few ships coming out every so often (whether they fit my needs and wishes or not) and more improved and streamlined gameplay on a more regular basis. Have a great day!
Bla5to Frigate The Praxus Consortium 1	Posted - 2015.11.06 18:22:26 - [236] - Quote Shadowforge Dawkins wrote: correct me if i'm wrong i'm a wormhole pvper not an industrialist. There are ice harvester upgrades, which I assume will affect the new ice mining lasers as well as the regular ice harvesters, due to the mining laser upgrades affecting both strip miners and regular mining lasers. There are not ones for gas harvesters though, you're right on that front[/quote] thanks for filling the void for me. hopefully they add some upgrades for gas harvesting. we have 4 low slots on prospects and having something useful for them would be great when it comes to gas Edit; if a dev or someone could let us know if there will ever be gas harvesting upgrades, would be great thanks.[/quote] I think I remember reading that there aren't any plans for such a thing. But , I don't remember where I read it (or if I am confusing it with ice harvesting upgrades) and can't find it in searches at least. Hopefully we can get clarification.
Soul-on-Ice ICEBERG MINING CO. 66	Posted - 2015.11.08 04:22:53 - [237] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: Some Q&A: What colour will it be? - Icy I hope :) Would you kindly consider an arctic camouflage, digital arctic camouflage or something perhaps more modern. Something like this might be nice: Camouflaged Endurance
Lady Rift What Shall We Call It 239	Posted - 2015.11.08 06:39:10 - [238] - Quote Rek Seven wrote: Goldensaver wrote: Rek Seven wrote: Lady Rift wrote: Rek Seven wrote: I have given up with the mining frigates and probably won't bother with this one either. The venture and the prospector are too slow at gas mining for my taste. I want a cruiser (or larger) size hull that can gas mine 2 to 3 times faster than a venture! It should of happened years ago but i still think new subsystems should be added to T3 cruisers that would allow them to fill a harvesting/extraction role, amongst other things. you know both those frigs mine gas faster than what we had before they where released. Yes they mine SLIGHTLY faster than a ship with 5 harvesters on but that doesn't mean is isn't a painfully slow process. Funny thing is if you speed it up then the price of gas drops because it'll be lower risk since you're gankable for less time, and the supply is higher due to the higher yield. So in essence you net zero there.get more gas, but it's worth less. My original argument was that there should be a bigger ship that is better at gas mining. This would balance itself out in terms of risk. Currently we have these little frigate that are very cheap and either come with warp disruptor resistance or a covert cloak. This makes them pretty hard to catch and thus, fairly risk free. If anything the introduction of the venture drove the price down. Now if you introduce a more expensive cruiser class gas miner that didn't have the warp core strength or a cloak, they would be easier to catch and as a result, the risk to reward factor would be better. Considering this, i don't think the price would drop too much but if it did, it would probably be to the point where venture pilots would want to upgrade to the riskier ship so they earn more per hour. show me how much the price of gas tanked with the release of the gas mining frig,
Tear Jar Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec 344	Posted - 2015.11.08 19:45:25 - [239] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: Some Q&A: What colour will it be? - Icy I hope :) Will there be a small Ice Harvesting Accelerator Rig? - There is not one planned at this time, the Endurance has been balanced assuming there isn't one. Will this have FW restrictions? - Not that I know of, I'll have to check the Prospect and it should be similar to that. Does the 200% bonus to mining yield affect the ice mining yield? - No, that bonus affects ore mining yields only. This applies to the 5% mining yield bonus per level on the mining frigate skill as well. How fast can the Endurance harvest Ice? Endurance Ice Mining Laser II - 1 block / 330 sec Endurance Role Bonus (50% reduction) - 165 sec Mining Frigate 5 Bonus (25% reduction) - 123.75 sec Expedition Frigate 5 Bonus (25% reduction) - 92.81 sec Ice Harvesting Skill 5 (25% reduction) - 69.60 sec Inherent Implants 'Yeti" Ice Harvester IH-1005 (5% reduction) - 66.12 sec 'Ingenii' Ice Harvester Upgrade (10%) - 59.51 sec 'Ingenii' Ice Harvester Upgrade (10%) - 53.56 sec 'Ingenii' Ice Harvester Upgrade (10%) - 48.20 sec Fastest Cycle = 48.20 seconds I don't see why anyone would want to use this over highsec mining in a procurer or skiff.
Rek Seven Hidden Agenda Deep Space Engineering 2101	Posted - 2015.11.08 22:17:09 - [240] - Quote Lady Rift wrote: Rek Seven wrote: Goldensaver wrote: Rek Seven wrote: Lady Rift wrote: you know both those frigs mine gas faster than what we had before they where released. Yes they mine SLIGHTLY faster than a ship with 5 harvesters on but that doesn't mean is isn't a painfully slow process. Funny thing is if you speed it up then the price of gas drops because it'll be lower risk since you're gankable for less time, and the supply is higher due to the higher yield. So in essence you net zero there.get more gas, but it's worth less. My original argument was that there should be a bigger ship that is better at gas mining. This would balance itself out in terms of risk. Currently we have these little frigate that are very cheap and either come with warp disruptor resistance or a covert cloak. This makes them pretty hard to catch and thus, fairly risk free. If anything the introduction of the venture drove the price down. Now if you introduce a more expensive cruiser class gas miner that didn't have the warp core strength or a cloak, they would be easier to catch and as a result, the risk to reward factor would be better. Considering this, i don't think the price would drop too much but if it did, it would probably be to the point where venture pilots would want to upgrade to the riskier ship so they earn more per hour. show me how much the price of gas tanked with the release of the gas mining frig, Why would you want me to do that? If I'm wrong then it supports my point that the introduction of a faster mining ship wouldn't affect the market and if i'm right, it supports my argument for an easier to catch gas mining ship to be added. The wishlist is pretty much complete...
Lady Rift What Shall We Call It 242	Posted - 2015.11.08 22:27:52 - [241] - Quote Rek Seven wrote: Lady Rift wrote: show me how much the price of gas tanked with the release of the gas mining frig, Why would you want me to do that? If I'm wrong then it supports my point that the introduction of a faster mining ship wouldn't affect the market and if i'm right, it supports my argument for an easier to catch gas mining ship to be added. cause it hasn't the cheap fast mining frig didn't destroy gas values. Even though it mines faster than the stardard bc that was used before.
Rek Seven Hidden Agenda Deep Space Engineering 2101	Posted - 2015.11.08 23:49:00 - [242] - Quote Greate! So based on that, the argument that a faster gas mining ship would drive the price down is unfounded and thus, there is no reason to not introduce a faster gas mining ship. I'm not complaining, I am simply saying that there should be a progression in the gas mining class, just like there already is within the ore and ice mining class. The wishlist is pretty much complete...
Lady Rift What Shall We Call It 242	Posted - 2015.11.09 01:12:52 - [243] - Quote Rek Seven wrote: Greate! So based on that, the argument that a faster gas mining ship would drive the price down is unfounded and thus, there is no reason to not introduce a faster gas mining ship. I'm not complaining, I am simply saying that there should be a progression in the gas mining class, just like there already is within the ore and ice mining class. there is progression already.
Rek Seven Hidden Agenda Deep Space Engineering 2101	Posted - 2015.11.09 06:36:10 - [244] - Quote Not in the same way there is with mining barges. The wishlist is pretty much complete...
Bla5to Frigate The Praxus Consortium 5	Posted - 2015.11.09 15:24:58 - [245] - Quote Just visit a c13 shattered wormhole ice field..... You will be convinced that this ship needs to exist! (at least in my opinion) They really are a site to see.... I'm amped for the possibilities as a wormholer, just to harvest ice in dangerous space is what drives me. I like the risk, keeps me excited. Skilling up for ice 5 now in preparation. But, the haters gonna hate.... I can't wait for the expedition frigate boosting ship to come out next! Cause, why not be able to boost these little guys......
Penance Toralen School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State 0	Posted - 2015.11.10 03:25:15 - [246] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: Slot layout: 3 H, 4 M, 3 L, 1 Turret I am curious to know why there are 4 M and 3 L on a armour tank hull? I would assume it is to limit the upgrades which can in fitted. CCP Terminus would you please share how you would typically see this ship would be fitted?
Lady Rift What Shall We Call It 242	Posted - 2015.11.10 04:15:08 - [247] - Quote Rek Seven wrote: Not in the same way there is with mining barges and pretty much every other class of ship in the game. exploration
Rek Seven Hidden Agenda Deep Space Engineering 2106	Posted - 2015.11.12 08:21:09 - [248] - Quote Lady Rift wrote: exploration You're just going to throw that out their apropo of nothing? Weak! The venture has nothing to do with exploration. The wishlist is pretty much complete...
Mr Grape Drink Sugar - Water - Purple The Mutiny 56	Posted - 2015.11.12 13:37:22 - [249] - Quote The Foz said numbers for all these new ships were probably going to be out last week. We're almost through this next week :( Any news on when they will be coming so I don't have to sit here staring for a dev blog for another week? :D
Gadolf Agalder Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 17	Posted - 2015.11.12 19:59:43 - [250] - Quote [Insert reply in this box with a transponder rather than an EMP device...] And it is not a Covert Ship. Why do I know, I had to BR jump a Mining Barge only to see it blowed up.? It is even worst to try in Wormhole. Let's see how this works... I never made profit on Ice yet and all jump fuel (or other fuel) always was more profitable to buy from traders, so far.

CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 461	Posted - 2015.11.13 14:51:50 - [251] - Quote Shadowforge Dawkins wrote: Franklin en Chalune wrote: There are ice harvester upgrades, which I assume will affect the new ice mining lasers as well as the regular ice harvesters, due to the mining laser upgrades affecting both strip miners and regular mining lasers. There are not ones for gas harvesters though, you're right on that front thanks for filling the void for me. hopefully they add some upgrades for gas harvesting. we have 4 low slots on prospects and having something useful for them would be great when it comes to gas Edit; if a dev or someone could let us know if there will ever be gas harvesting upgrades, would be great thanks. We could certainly make gas harvester upgrades. At the moment there are no plans to, but it seems like an interesting idea. As for the ice harvester upgrades, they should work with the new Ice Mining Lasers yes. @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters

FT Diomedes The Graduates Get Off My Lawn 1931	Posted - 2015.11.13 15:04:53 - [252] - Quote Gadolf Agalder wrote: I never made profit on Ice yet and all jump fuel (or other fuel) always was more profitable to buy from traders, so far. You must be doing something wrong. CCP should add more NPC 0.0 space to open it up and liven things up: the Stepping Stones project.

CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 462	Posted - 2015.11.13 15:11:03 - [253] - Quote Penance Toralen wrote: CCP Terminus wrote: Slot layout: 3 H, 4 M, 3 L, 1 Turret I am curious to know why there are 4 M and 3 L on a armour tank hull? I would assume it is to limit the upgrades which can in fitted. CCP Terminus would you please share how you would typically see this ship would be fitted? The Endurance is designed to be shield tanked. It has more mid slots at 4 It has more shield than armour (1100 to 400) It has a 4% bonus to all shield resistances per level of Expedition frigates Mining ships in general are almost all shield tanked. If there's a specific reason why you think it's designed to be armour tanked please let me know. @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters

Harvey James The Sengoku Legacy 1243	Posted - 2015.11.13 15:17:14 - [254] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: Penance Toralen wrote: CCP Terminus wrote: Slot layout: 3 H, 4 M, 3 L, 1 Turret I am curious to know why there are 4 M and 3 L on a armour tank hull? I would assume it is to limit the upgrades which can in fitted. CCP Terminus would you please share how you would typically see this ship would be fitted? The Endurance is designed to be shield tanked. It has more mid slots at 4 It has more shield than armour (1100 to 400) It has a 4% bonus to all shield resistances per level of Expedition frigates Mining ships in general are almost all shield tanked. If there's a specific reason why you think it's designed to be armour tanked please let me know. 1100 is quite a lot of HP for a mining frig especially one with T2 resists and resist bonus don't you think? T3's need to be versatile not have T2 resists, OP dps and tank obsoleting T2 ships entirely. ABC's should be T2, remove drone assist, separate HAM's and Torps range, -3 highslots for droneboats Nerf web strength, Make the blaster Eagle worth using

CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 462	Posted - 2015.11.13 15:42:33 - [255] - Quote Orge Snorrsen wrote: Quote: Standard ore mining in a Endurance will be about as fast as a Venture due to the 200% role bonus to mining yield, but will be slower than a Prospect. Did i do the wrong maths myself, or is there something else faulty happening? Using a Miner II will grant 60m-¦/min in a rookie ship for example, so 120m-¦/min fitted in the Venture due to the 100% Role Bonus With 2 Mining Turrets the Venture can harvest around 240m-¦/min. The Endurance although will still get a 180m-¦/min yield due to the 1 miner and 200% bonus. Correctly a 300% would be needed, considering the same mining frigate skill bonus between venture/endurance You are correct, good catch. I'll change it to 300%. There is also the mining frigate bonus, but for consistency I'll leave it as is. So the Endurance will be slightly slower at mining regular ore. @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters


CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 465	Posted - 2015.11.13 16:14:50 - [256] - Quote Harvey James wrote: 1100 is quite a lot of HP for a mining frig especially one with T2 resists and resist bonus don't you think? It has the same EHP (without the resist bonuses) as the Prospect, just focused more in shields. It's also less stealthy than a Prospect. If we find the Endurance is being primarily used as a combat ship we'll take appropriate actions. @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters

Lady Rift What Shall We Call It 242	Posted - 2015.11.13 16:48:26 - [257] - Quote Rek Seven wrote: Lady Rift wrote: exploration You're just going to throw that out their apropos of nothing? Weak! The venture is not part of exploration path. exploration ships have no advancement path like you claim gas mining doesn't.
Gadolf Agalder Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 18	Posted - 2015.11.13 20:22:20 - [258] - Quote FT Diomedes wrote: Gadolf Agalder wrote: I never made profit on Ice yet and all jump fuel (or other fuel) always was more profitable to buy from traders, so far. You must be doing something wrong. Do you mean it's wrong that I make a profit from buying from other traders?
Rek Seven Hidden Agenda Deep Space Engineering 2107	Posted - 2015.11.13 21:20:26 - [259] - Quote Lady Rift wrote: Rek Seven wrote: Lady Rift wrote: exploration You're just going to throw that out their apropos of nothing? Weak! The venture is not part of exploration path. exploration ships have no advancement path like you claim gas mining doesn't. T1 exploration frigs > t2 exploration frigs > SOE ships > t3 exploration setup Stop talking about things you know nothing about The wishlist is pretty much complete...
Penance Toralen School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State 0	Posted - 2015.11.13 21:41:02 - [260] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: It has more mid slots at 4 It has more shield than armour (1100 to 400) It has a 4% bonus to all shield resistances per level of Expedition frigates Mining ships in general are almost all shield tanked. If there's a specific reason why you think it's designed to be armour tanked please let me know. Sorry, Terminus. I am used to the slot layout of the Prospect - and armor tank that. Thanks for the feedback. CCP Terminus wrote: We could certainly make gas harvester upgrades. At the moment there are no plans to, but it seems like an interesting idea. As for the ice harvester upgrades, they should work with the new Ice Mining Lasers yes. What about ORE versions of the Upgrades?
DrysonBennington Aliastra Gallente Federation 242	Posted - 2015.11.14 10:20:32 - [261] - Quote Shouldn't there be some type of bonus when Exploration Frigates and Exploration Cruisers are in the same fleet? Maybe an Exploration Command Ship is order to provide both types of exploration ships with bonuses when the Command Ship is the center piece for the exploration group. Bonuses would include mining rate and yields as well as analyzer bonuses, etc. The main bonus would be that the Exploration Command Ship could be in one system providing the bonuses to the exploration types of ships in the fleet that would range from 2 to 10 jumps from the Command Ships location.
Gadolf Agalder Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 18	Posted - 2015.11.14 15:49:43 - [262] - Quote Perhaps the Exploration Theme is intended to let new players explore the game function? What about it?
Hal Morsh Hmmzor. Battlecruisin' Space Goats 443	Posted - 2015.11.15 16:29:03 - [263] - Quote Selaria Unbertable wrote: CCP Terminus wrote: Discovery ... Role Bonuses: 200% bonus to Mining yield Are you sure it's not 100%? 200% would mean it can harvest 3 blocks per cycle. With all those duration reductions, that seems pretty strong. I mean, that would theoretically even surpass a Hulk. Not that I'm not fond of a pure ice harvesting ship, but that seems a lot... Looks like I have to train another alt into Expedition frigates sooner than later. But how gankable are they. Unbonused ice lasers allowed on ventures wouldn't break anything btw. It would be abysmally slow. Dun'Gal > Hal is simply an imperfect ai, though if drunkeness ever gets programmed into ai's I foresee both a hilarious and tragic end to humanity.
Gadolf Agalder Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 19	Posted - 2015.11.15 16:43:19 - [264] - Quote Hal Morsh wrote: Selaria Unbertable wrote: CCP Terminus wrote: Discovery ... Role Bonuses: 200% bonus to Mining yield Are you sure it's not 100%? 200% would mean it can harvest 3 blocks per cycle. With all those duration reductions, that seems pretty strong. I mean, that would theoretically even surpass a Hulk. Not that I'm not fond of a pure ice harvesting ship, but that seems a lot... Looks like I have to train another alt into Expedition frigates sooner than later. But how gankable are they. Unbonused ice lasers allowed on ventures wouldn't break anything btw. It would be abysmally slow. Hulks have more space to store Ice though. They also have more tank and carry more drones. Some of the main draw backs are: - signature. - cargo space to haul the hull to null sec (ice space) - packed cargo space to jump the thing at the same place as above. - speed, which rivals with titans, battleship, freigthers and what not. - no cloak at 3 xtimes 100% strip mining turrets loaded and running. As for the new Exp ship, I would think that , if you already trained a Prospect, which is the older Exp ship (frig or not for now), it won't take long to get the new Exp trained. Plus, ..., it would still be easier to train faster than a new player would be able to use it to do the Ice mining test and explore her/his potential.

CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 466	Posted - 2015.11.16 10:37:52 - [265] - Quote Hal Morsh wrote: Selaria Unbertable wrote: CCP Terminus wrote: Discovery ... Role Bonuses: 200% bonus to Mining yield Are you sure it's not 100%? 200% would mean it can harvest 3 blocks per cycle. With all those duration reductions, that seems pretty strong. I mean, that would theoretically even surpass a Hulk. Not that I'm not fond of a pure ice harvesting ship, but that seems a lot... Looks like I have to train another alt into Expedition frigates sooner than later. But how gankable are they. Unbonused ice lasers allowed on ventures wouldn't break anything btw. It would be abysmally slow. The bonus only affects ore mining yield, not ice. I've updated it to mention that. Also the bonus has been changed to 300% to make it much closer to the ore mining rate of the Venture and Prospect. @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters

Hopelesshobo Tactical Nuclear Penguin's 507	Posted - 2015.11.18 04:39:39 - [266] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: How fast can the Endurance harvest Ice? Endurance Ice Mining Laser II - 1 block / 330 sec Endurance Role Bonus (50% reduction) - 165 sec Mining Frigate 5 Bonus (25% reduction) - 123.75 sec Expedition Frigate 5 Bonus (25% reduction) - 92.81 sec Ice Harvesting Skill 5 (25% reduction) - 69.60 sec Inherent Implants 'Yeti" Ice Harvester IH-1005 (5% reduction) - 66.12 sec 'Ingenii' Ice Harvester Upgrade (10%) - 59.51 sec 'Ingenii' Ice Harvester Upgrade (10%) - 53.56 sec 'Ingenii' Ice Harvester Upgrade (10%) - 48.20 sec Fastest Cycle = 48.20 seconds Have you considered to change ice blocks to ice cubes which take up 1m3, while changing any refining to require 1000 ice cubes to refine? This would give the option to cut your cycles early and still get something for your time. Would also make it so you wouldn't have to have long cycle times on the harvesters as they could just harvest fewer ice cubes per cycle for balance purposes. Lowering the average to make you look better since 2012.
Capsuleer Service Executive Estel Arador Corp Services 0	Posted - 2015.11.19 02:53:52 - [267] - Quote I'd just like to point out there is a graphic of the Endurance on the Eve: Online homepage, on the December 8th update section. IT LOOKS BEEYOOTIFULLLL!!! /cse EACSGäó - Estel Arador Capsuleer & Corp Services - Spreading the Love

CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 472	Posted - 2015.11.19 18:35:30 - [268] - Quote Capsuleer Service Executive wrote: I'd just like to point out there is a graphic of the Endurance on the Eve: Online homepage, on the December 8th update section. IT LOOKS BEEYOOTEEFULLLL!!! /cse I'm sure the art guys love hearing that :) I told them icey and they delivered. @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters

Gadolf Agalder Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 22	Posted - 2015.11.19 18:45:59 - [269] - Quote 741 Frostline http://updates.eveonline.com/date/2015-12-08/
Mr Grape Drink Sugar - Water - Purple The Mutiny 74	Posted - 2015.11.19 18:52:34 - [270] - Quote Speaking of the picture, it shows it with 3x lasers on it. Though it only has 1x laser slot. Hacks! Of course, it wouldn't look so pretty with just one of the slots with turrets like it will have. Also, what do you see being used for the second utility slot on a ship like this? Miner, cloak, ?lolnos?
Gadolf Agalder Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 22	Posted - 2015.11.19 19:02:30 - [271] - Quote Mr Grape Drink wrote: Speaking of the picture, it shows it with 3x lasers on it. Though it only has 1x laser slot. Hacks! Of course, it wouldn't look so pretty with just one of the slots with turrets like it will have. Also, what do you see being used for the second utility slot on a ship like this? Miner, cloak, ?lolnos? Sometimes, only one turret works at a time. That prevent from cap overloading or the electronic circuit from getting mixed up... Miner cloak and , salvager.
Kibitt Kallinikov Crimson Serpent Syndicate Heiian Conglomerate 12	Posted - 2015.11.19 19:46:08 - [272] - Quote ORE ships are supposed to be Gallente with their armor resists, right? All of the frigates have Minmatar resist profile (60/35/25/10). Why is this?
FT Diomedes The Graduates Get Off My Lawn 1956	Posted - 2015.11.19 19:53:42 - [273] - Quote Mr Grape Drink wrote: Speaking of the picture, it shows it with 3x lasers on it. Though it only has 1x laser slot. Hacks! Of course, it wouldn't look so pretty with just one of the slots with turrets like it will have. Also, what do you see being used for the second utility slot on a ship like this? Miner, cloak, ?lolnos? Most ship models show more than one turret for each fitted turret. CCP should add more NPC 0.0 space to open it up and liven things up: the Stepping Stones project.
elitatwo Eve Minions The-Company 909	Posted - 2015.11.20 00:01:52 - [274] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: Capsuleer Service Executive wrote: I'd just like to point out there is a graphic of the Endurance on the Eve: Online homepage, on the December 8th update section. IT LOOKS BEEYOOTEEFULLLL!!! /cse I'm sure the art guys love hearing that :) I told them icey and they delivered. That they did, can't wait. Eve Minions is recruiting. Learn from about pvp, learn about ships and how to fly them correctly. Small gang and solo action in high, low and nullsec and w-space alike. We will teach you everything you need and want to know.
Liaura Nightwing Deaths Shadows Corp 0	Posted - 2015.11.20 07:18:48 - [275] - Quote Laenatus wrote: Anyone wanna guess what isk/hour you could make with one of these in null? Well if you are mining Dark Glitter it'll take 12 minutes to fill up the hull, after that if you have a hauler you can keep mining so 60minutes/12minutes = 5 so you can mine 5 full hulls before an hour hits I'm assuming Dark glitter is 1,000m3 so that's 15 pieces/12 minutes 15x5=75 pieces in an hour Dark Glitter values at 350,000isk x 75 pieces = 26,250,000isk/hour Now normally miners mine for more than 1 hour so lets just say for 6 hours (average time I spend mining) 26,250,000 x 6 = 157,500,000isk and I play 5 - 7 days of the week so we'll say 6 days = 945,000,000isk/hour depending if you are solo mining or with a group, I usually travel with 3 - 5 so we'll say 4 all running the same ship and mining 945,000,000isk x 4 = 3,780,000,000 isk This is only if you have all upgrades maxed out and the time down to the 48 seconds to mine ice in nulsec without being bothered :)
Tribal Trogdor Trauma Ward The Mutiny 15	Posted - 2015.11.20 14:21:14 - [276] - Quote Anything on stats one the new faction ice miner? Is it still range bonus? LP cost? Is there going to be a dev blog on all that, or do we just have to wait and try to find it when it shows up on the test server? :D
Estella Osoka Perkone Caldari State 871	Posted - 2015.11.20 18:09:17 - [277] - Quote Am I the only person who thinks we need to have one mining ship in the game called the "Eureka"?

CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 474	Posted - 2015.11.20 18:26:21 - [278] - Quote Tribal Trogdor wrote: Anything on stats one the new faction ice miner? Is it still range bonus? LP cost? Is there going to be a dev blog on all that, or do we just have to wait and try to find it when it shows up on the test server? :D Should be showing up on the test server in the near future. The ORE Ice Mining Lasers stats are unchanged from the original post. It will be purchasable from the ORE LP store as usual, and probably won't be quite so expensive as other ORE faction modules. @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters

Pooffy Astral Mineral Research 0	Posted - 2015.11.20 18:46:04 - [279] - Quote I'm curious to find out how a fairly smaller vessel can yield more than a barge? EDIT: grammar
Mr Grape Drink Sugar - Water - Purple The Mutiny 76	Posted - 2015.11.20 19:34:49 - [280] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: Tribal Trogdor wrote: Anything on stats one the new faction ice miner? Is it still range bonus? LP cost? Is there going to be a dev blog on all that, or do we just have to wait and try to find it when it shows up on the test server? :D Should be showing up on the test server in the near future. The ORE Ice Mining Lasers stats are unchanged from the original post. It will be purchasable from the ORE LP store as usual, and probably won't be quite so expensive as other ORE faction modules. Welp...We had saved up several million LP to get these on the market, but looks like that wont be happening now Back to the expanded cargohold market.
Zevix Industrial Pursuits 10	Posted - 2015.11.21 01:59:51 - [281] - Quote I think I might have an answer to the flexibility to shattered wormhole ice mining. 3 little words; "Mobile Compression Depot" huh, huh?
Bellasarius Baxter Zilog Enterprises 47	Posted - 2015.11.21 12:29:17 - [282] - Quote Sorry if this has been asked before, but will there be a Small Ice Harvester Accelerator to go along with a frig capable of mining ice ??
Gadolf Agalder Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 25	Posted - 2015.11.21 15:26:01 - [283] - Quote Liaura Nightwing wrote: Laenatus wrote: Anyone wanna guess what isk/hour you could make with one of these in null? Well if you are mining Dark Glitter it'll take 12 minutes to fill up the hull, after that if you have a hauler you can keep mining so 60minutes/12minutes = 5 so you can mine 5 full hulls before an hour hits I'm assuming Dark glitter is 1,000m3 so that's 15 pieces/12 minutes 15x5=75 pieces in an hour Dark Glitter values at 350,000isk x 75 pieces = 26,250,000isk/hour Now normally miners mine for more than 1 hour so lets just say for 6 hours (average time I spend mining) 26,250,000 x 6 = 157,500,000isk and I play 5 - 7 days of the week so we'll say 6 days = 945,000,000isk/hour depending if you are solo mining or with a group, I usually travel with 3 - 5 so we'll say 4 all running the same ship and mining 945,000,000isk x 4 = 3,780,000,000 isk This is only if you have all upgrades maxed out and the time down to the 48 seconds to mine ice in nulsec without being bothered :) 26,250,000 x 6 = 157,500,000isk and I play 5 - 7 days of the week so we'll say 6 days = 945,000,000isk/hour = 945,000,000 ISK / week(s, even if it is more than one consecutive week, although that amount would double), not per hour.
Taligor Sathul Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic 0	Posted - 2015.11.22 08:20:28 - [284] - Quote I don't know if it was mentioned before, the shattered frig holes have all class 6 "Wolf Rayet" effects. That means this ICE mining frig will have almost no tank in it seeing it has a shield bonus and has to stand against 1k dps frigates/destroyers. Any thoughts about this?
FT Diomedes The Graduates Get Off My Lawn 1960	Posted - 2015.11.22 12:25:20 - [285] - Quote Taligor Sathul wrote: I don't know if it was mentioned before, the shattered frig holes have all class 6 "Wolf Rayet" effects. That means this ICE mining frig will have almost no tank in it seeing it has a shield bonus and has to stand against 1k dps frigates/destroyers. Any thoughts about this? Don't get caught? CCP should add more NPC 0.0 space to open it up and liven things up: the Stepping Stones project.
Taligor Sathul Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic 0	Posted - 2015.11.22 13:37:53 - [286] - Quote Well I don't want to discuss WR tactics. I'm just curious that a ship that claims to be seeded in a WR has not much of a counter to survive there. Anyway lets see how it works.
Cerulean Ice EVE University Ivy League 49	Posted - 2015.11.22 17:59:54 - [287] - Quote Will the Endurance have the full penalty to scan resolution from cloaking devices? It would make sense to remove or reduce that penalty, since the targeting delay is also reduced. The Prospect doesn't have this penalty due to covops cloaks not having it. I'm curious about why the Endurance won't have the covops cloak though. Why did it not get that ability? Cerulean Ice, Professor, E-UNI
Gadolf Agalder Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 25	Posted - 2015.11.22 19:25:48 - [288] - Quote I used to have to tank with the 5 drones and at the time , I don't think that I ran T2 drones yet. I may be wrong on that, but I think I have screenshots to verify. Looks like if any explorer wants to go to null-sec ice systems, that they need to get the proper protection to survive the conditions, like I did.
destur TURK FLEET The Mutiny 1	Posted - 2015.11.23 08:11:55 - [289] - Quote sory engi+ƒh bad :) venture +ƒhip size 133 m - 5000 m3 ore hold prospect ship size 139 m - 10 000 m3 discover /maybe ship size 150m / 15 000 m3 hulk ship size 509 m - 8500 m3 what is this o7 destur-gangway
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM 5736	Posted - 2015.11.23 13:29:01 - [290] - Quote destur wrote: sory engi+ƒh bad :) venture +ƒhip size 133 m - 5000 m3 ore hold prospect ship size 139 m - 10 000 m3 discover /maybe ship size 150m / 15 000 m3 hulk ship size 509 m - 8500 m3 what is this o7 The hulk obviously doesn't dedicate much of its internal space to Ore storage, instead having the power systems to power its three strip miners, and improve them, so it gets the best yield. Woo! CSM X! Fuzzwork Enterprises Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Choo Mi Sneggy Pit 10	Posted - 2015.11.23 15:39:32 - [291] - Quote As a hi-sec ice miner the only time I may use these ships is when setting up in a new system, they will be easy to setup in my HQ then load into an orca or transport. I am a little worried about the size of the hold though, 15000 is too big for a frigate, it is just making life easier for those who will use it. At worst drop it down to 12000 the same as a prospect, at best 10000 is more than enough. Looking back at previous posts it appears there will only be 25 places to use this ship at its best, so gankers paradise, add that to the fact they cannot get a mining boost in frigate only areas or even decent hauling and this ship will be used by a couple of wh'ers. So a bit of a waste of time for almost everyone in the game, instead of making ships this like this please give us a dedicated ice miner with all round capabilities like tank/hold, its about time. And as a side note putting ore compression on this will suddenly turn it into the most used mining ship in the game and make most of the others pointless for solo miners. Compressor's should be kept out of mining ships, although putting one on an Orca would be fun.
Capsuleer Service Executive Estel Arador Corp Services 2	Posted - 2015.11.24 21:14:27 - [292] - Quote This thing will be exceedingly hard to gank in high-sec. This assumes you keep you d-scan going and you have known gankers (e.g. CODE.) set red. This thing will be able to orbit ice-mine at high speed and cloak instantly, with a pretty insane align time depending on fitting. If you wanna sit and AFK ice-mine, get a Procurer. /cse EACSGäó - Estel Arador Capsuleer & Corp Services - Spreading the Love
Regulus Scyssor Arsenic. The Volition Cult 2	Posted - 2015.11.25 05:17:33 - [293] - Quote A Blue Venture repeat A Blue Venture yeaaaahhh Quote: This thing will be exceedingly hard to gank in high-sec. Exactly Venture is love
Penance Toralen School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State 0	Posted - 2015.11.25 22:09:18 - [294] - Quote Choo Mi wrote: As a hi-sec ice miner the only time I may use these ships is when setting up in a new system, they will be easy to setup in my HQ then load into an orca or transport. I am a little worried about the size of the hold though, 15000 is too big for a frigate, it is just making life easier for those who will use it. At worst drop it down to 12000 the same as a prospect, at best 10000 is more than enough. Looking back at previous posts it appears there will only be 25 places to use this ship at its best, so gankers paradise, add that to the fact they cannot get a mining boost in frigate only areas or even decent hauling and this ship will be used by a couple of wh'ers. So a bit of a waste of time for almost everyone in the game, instead of making ships this like this please give us a dedicated ice miner with all round capabilities like tank/hold, its about time. And as a side note putting ore compression on this will suddenly turn it into the most used mining ship in the game and make most of the others pointless for solo miners. Compressor's should be kept out of mining ships, although putting one on an Orca would be fun. The Prospect has a orehold of 10,000. The new command destroyers should also be able to enter "Frigate Only" wormholes - which would allow for a squad to bring a Foreman boost if they were inclined. (even if there is no mining link gain on the destroyer hull). Adding a second hull to the Exploration Frigate skill improves the utility to its training. Adding incentive to learn the skill. It lowers the bar for new players to experience all aspects of mining, before the greater investment of time and isk - of barges/exhumers. And has the potential (though I personally believe unlikely) to attract high-sec miners into risk areas, because a frigate hull is certainly a cheaper loss. Currently Prospects sell under the 20m isk, which would be a gauge to expected cost of the Endurance. Historically the Mackinaw was the dedicated Ice Miner, which it ceased to be following tieracide of the ORE lineup in 2012. A medium rig for Ice Harvesting allows for any Barge/Exhumer to function as a dedicated Ice Miner. Allowing greater flexibility with hull section and remaining a semblance to the theme of "performance vs defence" in fitting choices.
Orca Platypus Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic 85	Posted - 2015.11.25 23:11:41 - [295] - Quote Ninja mining never worked and never going to work. About the best it did is ninjaing some arkonor from wh for megacyte, but was never essential, never profitable, never viable.
Orca Platypus Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic 85	Posted - 2015.11.25 23:20:29 - [296] - Quote Penance Toralen wrote: It lowers the bar for new players to experience all aspects of mining, before the greater investment of time and isk - of barges/exhumers. Both time and isk are less on Procurer. Penance Toralen wrote: And has the potential (though I personally believe unlikely) to attract high-sec miners into risk areas, because a frigate hull is certainly a cheaper loss. Currently Prospects sell under the 20m isk, which would be a gauge to expected cost of the Endurance. Zero likely. I presume it will be used by low/null dwellers (aside obvious wh use) to have an ice miner which can cloak up. But that use isn't going to be much as the first ganktard coming in and seeing someone in local would just camp the system, making it all irrelevant - there is no barge in the game which can mine with hostiles in local (skiff would just die longer). Penance Toralen wrote: Historically the Mackinaw was the dedicated Ice Miner, which it ceased to be following tieracide of the ORE lineup in 2012. A medium rig for Ice Harvesting allows for any Barge/Exhumer to function as a dedicated Ice Miner. Allowing greater flexibility with hull section and remaining a semblance to the theme of "performance vs defence" in fitting choices. There are no fitting choices currently because all barges currently suck, Hulk and Covetor just suck a bit less. Mining in anything but Hulk is self-ganking every few hours due to lost profit from not mining in Hulk. It makes stupid people mad when you mine in Skiff because they can't gank you, but as far as mining goes, the cost you pay for not being ganked by third-party stupid is being self-ganked by your own stupid.
Capsuleer Service Executive Estel Arador Corp Services 2	Posted - 2015.11.26 05:49:28 - [297] - Quote Again, tried Google translate on the wall of text above, couldn't decipher the intent. This will be used A LOT in high-risk areas, and even in vanilla high-sec anoms. There are PLENTY of other uses for this ship, if you can't theorycraft it or figure it out you are doing it wrong. I'm not talking PvP, either, though Endurancelol fleets are possible. I personally have crafted a gas/ice expedition frigate alt just for this ship/family. Cant wait! /cse EACSGäó - Estel Arador Capsuleer & Corp Services - Spreading the Love
Orca Platypus Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic 85	Posted - 2015.11.26 12:11:21 - [298] - Quote Capsuleer Service Executive wrote: Again, tried Google translate on the wall of text above, couldn't decipher the intent. You mean me? Capsuleer Service Executive wrote: This will be used A LOT in high-risk areas No. Even wormholers would probably only deploy miners after sealing the exits. Capsuleer Service Executive wrote: and even in vanilla high-sec anoms. Never. It loses in everything but the hold to the worst barge - Procurer. Capsuleer Service Executive wrote: There are PLENTY of other uses for this ship, if you can't theorycraft it or figure it out you are doing it wrong. I'm not talking PvP, either, though Endurancelol fleets are possible. I personally have crafted a gas/ice expedition frigate alt just for this ship/family. Cant wait! /cse Costs too much for a lolfleet, cruisers are cheaper. Compressed ore hauler - too weak and no covops cloak.
Franklin en Chalune Stark's Kerbside Hauler Universal Logistics 5	Posted - 2015.11.26 17:28:17 - [299] - Quote Orca Platypus wrote: Never. It loses in everything but the hold to the worst barge - Procurer. "Worst" barge? Depends on your idea of what is good or bad. I personally quite like the Procurer, and solo mining it performs significantly better than the Covetor. Orca Platypus wrote: There are no fitting choices currently because all barges currently suck, Hulk and Covetor just suck a bit less. Mining in anything but Hulk is self-ganking every few hours due to lost profit from not mining in Hulk Hulk and Covetor are only good if you're mining with hauling support, otherwise the Retriever/Mackinaw or Procurer/Skiff are far better
Capsuleer Service Executive Estel Arador Corp Services 2	Posted - 2015.11.26 18:02:51 - [300] - Quote I fail to see how this is worse than a Procurer (for ice mining). Lets use a classic CODE. gank scenario. Assuming your head is up your and you fail to recognize reds enter the system. A fast cruiser or frigate will be the warp-in for the gankers. With a Procurer/Retreiver, you will more than likely be holding still and be easily killed/bumped/dead. With the Endurance, you SHOULD be orbiting well off the ice rock at high speed, giving the ability to instantly change direction, evade the bump, cloak and/or warp off, or at the very least move out of Catalyst optimal range. Tell me again why these won't be used? /cse EACSGäó - Estel Arador Capsuleer & Corp Services - Spreading the Love
Anke Eyrou Hades Sisters 56	Posted - 2015.11.26 19:01:44 - [301] - Quote As an inventor and producer i presume the bpc required will come from the invention of the venture. Will the material requirements to build it be the same as that required to build the prospect? I expect to get this post deleted or locked. So much for freedom of expression.

CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 476	Posted - 2015.11.27 11:29:51 - [302] - Quote Anke Eyrou wrote: As an inventor and producer i presume the bpc required will come from the invention of the venture. Will the material requirements to build it be the same as that required to build the prospect? Not exactly the same but it should be in a the ballpark. @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters

Mr Grape Drink Sugar - Water - Purple The Mutiny 78	Posted - 2015.11.30 06:42:58 - [303] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: Tribal Trogdor wrote: Anything on stats one the new faction ice miner? Is it still range bonus? LP cost? Is there going to be a dev blog on all that, or do we just have to wait and try to find it when it shows up on the test server? :D Should be showing up on the test server in the near future. The ORE Ice Mining Lasers stats are unchanged from the original post. It will be purchasable from the ORE LP store as usual, and probably won't be quite so expensive as other ORE faction modules. Will the ORE Miner get the same cost as the new Ice Miner? They are both pretty much "Frig Only" at this point.
VoxOrange Frontline Developments 0	Posted - 2015.12.06 02:20:25 - [304] - Quote Hello CCP Terminus, The ORE Miner has both range and yield ahead of the tech2. 60m-¦: 65m-¦ and 12km: 16km But the ORE Ice Mining Laser only has range ahead of the tech2. 8km : 11km they are both 330sec cycled. Intended because the LP cost of the ice version is cheaper?
Walksalone THE GWG 0	Posted - 2015.12.08 21:37:54 - [305] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: Anke Eyrou wrote: As an inventor and producer i presume the bpc required will come from the invention of the venture. Will the material requirements to build it be the same as that required to build the prospect? Not exactly the same but it should be in a the ballpark. I did not see any blue prints for the ice harvesters with this patch
Thor TinBender Ship Builders Loacal 69 0	Posted - 2015.12.11 16:10:21 - [306] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: Some Q&A: How fast can the Endurance harvest Ice? Endurance Ice Mining Laser II - 1 block / 330 sec Endurance Role Bonus (50% reduction) - 165 sec Mining Frigate 5 Bonus (25% reduction) - 123.75 sec Expedition Frigate 5 Bonus (25% reduction) - 92.81 sec Ice Harvesting Skill 5 (25% reduction) - 69.60 sec Inherent Implants 'Yeti" Ice Harvester IH-1005 (5% reduction) - 66.12 sec 'Ingenii' Ice Harvester Upgrade (10%) - 59.51 sec 'Ingenii' Ice Harvester Upgrade (10%) - 53.56 sec 'Ingenii' Ice Harvester Upgrade (10%) - 48.20 sec Fastest Cycle = 48.20 seconds i might be late and it was probably asked and answered, but i didn't see it. what would the times be with boost? Rorqual, Orca, Mindlink? or do you just minus the the % from the time? i guess i'm just confused on the math.

CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 487	Posted - 2015.12.13 00:14:43 - [307] - Quote Walksalone wrote: I did not see any blue prints for the ice harvesters with this patch The blueprint is in the market under: Blueprints -> Ship Equipment -> Mining Lasers It's called the Ice Mining Laser I Blueprint. Note that the ORE Ice Mining Laser can only be bought for LP and ISK from an ORE station. @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters

ultimatefox02 Core Industry. Circle-Of-Two 0	Posted - 2015.12.13 06:20:52 - [308] - Quote i look for the rig ( Small Ice Harvester Accelerator I) ? why i can find ? and why you dont put 2 turret hardpoints , same at the Prospect,and why you put 300% bonus on the ORE, if the freg is for the ice mining first, and why we can not fit , the covert ops cloaking same at the Prospect . sorry for my english
Jaantrag 41	Posted - 2015.12.13 15:16:33 - [309] - Quote ultimatefox02 wrote: i look for the rig ( Small Ice Harvester Accelerator I) ? why i can find ? and why you dont put 2 turret hardpoints , same at the Prospect,and why you put 300% bonus on the ORE, if the freg is for the ice mining first, and why we can not fit , the covert ops cloaking same at the Prospect . sorry for my english * no ice- frig as pointed in the 2nd post of this topic .. * 1 turret hardpoint with faster cycles gives option to fit 2 utility mods in the other 2 slots less time sitting still to get the last cycle if ur in a hurry, 2 turret hardpoints would have made it the cycle slower to keep it below mining barge levels. * ore bonus, perhaps so u dont need to have 2 difrent ships but can use one with just refitting the mods * no cov-ops cloak .. to keep it diffrent from prospect .. else little other tweaking and u could just rename it to "prospect 2 "
ultimatefox02 Core Industry. Circle-Of-Two 0	Posted - 2015.12.13 16:03:11 - [310] - Quote to go in WH , an industrial use cover ops cloaking, me if i dont have my cover ops cloaking , i dont go there , and why i change my mack for a safe part of space,to a WH with a freg lower a mack no interest , the interest is having the same stats at the barge or better to do ninja ice mining , to reduce the chance the ennemy find you no interest for the WH , no interest for noting fly same
Jaantrag 41	Posted - 2015.12.13 18:34:18 - [311] - Quote ultimatefox02 wrote: to go in WH , an industrial use cover ops cloaking, me if i dont have my cover ops cloaking , i dont go there , and why i change my mack for a safe part of space,to a WH with a freg lower a mack no interest , the interest is having the same stats at the barge or better to do ninja ice mining , to reduce the chance the ennemy find you no interest for the WH , no interest for noting fly same "safe part of space" .. u wanna think u talk about hs .. but to start comparing the mack for safe and frig for wh id quess u talk about sov nullsec .. and that place aint really safe .. little bit more then wh if u are digged in and got good intel going . but then not everyone have that comparing mack in hs and the frig in wh u actualy make more in wh with the option to pick the most isk/h ice in the belt as belts in wh-s have ALL types of ice ... but hey .. if ur not intrested of the option to get some thrill of wh - ninja-ing then im sorry ..
Roa Elim North Star Exploration Industries 2	Posted - 2015.12.16 14:39:42 - [312] - Quote Hi, i have full skills for this ship. It seems for me there is a bug. I only have an ore mining yield from 455 m3/min. With 300% boost from ship bonus, it should have a yield round about 700m3/min (3 mlu). Please tell me your experiences or investigate this. So the venture has a better yield. Thank you.

CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 487	Posted - 2015.12.16 23:08:45 - [313] - Quote Roa Elim wrote: Hi, i have full skills for this ship. It seems for me there is a bug. I only have an ore mining yield from 455 m3/min. With 300% boost from ship bonus, it should have a yield round about 700m3/min (3 mlu). Please tell me your experiences or investigate this. So the venture has a better yield. Thank you. Part of it will be the number of turrets. The Endurance should have a slightly lower ore yield than a Venture. The Venture and the Endurance both have a 5% bonus to ore Mining yield per level of mining Frigate, but for the Venture this bonus is being applied to 2 Mining Lasers while the Endurance only fits 1. That's also why the role bonus for the Endurance had to be 300% instead of 100% to bring it closer to the Venture and Prospect. @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters

Penance Toralen School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State 2	Posted - 2015.12.17 00:31:53 - [314] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: Roa Elim wrote: Hi, i have full skills for this ship. It seems for me there is a bug. I only have an ore mining yield from 455 m3/min. With 300% boost from ship bonus, it should have a yield round about 700m3/min (3 mlu). Please tell me your experiences or investigate this. So the venture has a better yield. Thank you. Part of it will be the number of turrets. The Endurance should have a slightly lower ore yield than a Venture. The Venture and the Endurance both have a 5% bonus to ore Mining yield per level of mining Frigate, but for the Venture this bonus is being applied to 2 Mining Lasers while the Endurance only fits 1. That's also why the role bonus for the Endurance had to be 300% instead of 100% to bring it closer to the Venture and Prospect. The Venture wil mine at a ratio of 4 compared to the Endurance 3. (before factoring any MLU). The Endurance really only shines as a ice miner.
Rautha Harkonnen Silver Guardians Fidelas Constans 0	Posted - 2015.12.17 03:10:05 - [315] - Quote is it just my machine or does the ice mining laser have no sound to it when mining? YES! i do use eve sounds lol. . .
Cristl 281	Posted - 2015.12.17 15:18:55 - [316] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: Roa Elim wrote: Hi, i have full skills for this ship. It seems for me there is a bug. I only have an ore mining yield from 455 m3/min. With 300% boost from ship bonus, it should have a yield round about 700m3/min (3 mlu). Please tell me your experiences or investigate this. So the venture has a better yield. Thank you. Part of it will be the number of turrets. The Endurance should have a slightly lower ore yield than a Venture. The Venture and the Endurance both have a 5% bonus to ore Mining yield per level of mining Frigate, but for the Venture this bonus is being applied to 2 Mining Lasers while the Endurance only fits 1. That's also why the role bonus for the Endurance had to be 300% instead of 100% to bring it closer to the Venture and Prospect. Stop talking nonsense, that's not how percentages work. The number of turrets isn't the issue here. The venture lists a '100% bonus to mining yield', and in the attributes section has a 'mining amount multiplier' of 2. That's correct. The endurance lists a '300% bonus to mining yield', and in the attributes section has a 'mining amount multiplier' of 3. These are inconsistent. What you want is either: role bonus: '300% bonus to mining yield', and in the attributes section: 'mining amount multiplier' of 4 or '200% bonus to mining yield', and in the attributes section: 'mining amount multiplier' of 3 Personally, I couldn't give a crap either way, but let's all be on the same page as far as percentages go.
Iria Ahrens Space Perverts and Forum Pirates 548	Posted - 2015.12.17 20:45:48 - [317] - Quote I only have a problem with the name, Expedition Frigate. It is confusing with Expeditions in Exploration and Mission running. From the name it sounds like a good frigate to go run Expeditions. Of course looking at the stats of the ship should clear up that confusion for a normal explorer, but what about someone who never ran an expedition before? They might hop in their expedition frigate to chase down this great expedition site that just popped in their Journal. Call them Prospecting Frigates, or Poaching Frigates instead. Prospecting has a good adventurous ring to it without the negative connotations of Poaching. My choice of pronouns is based on your avatar. Even if I know what is behind the avatar.

CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 487	Posted - 2015.12.19 13:54:39 - [318] - Quote Cristl wrote: The venture lists a '100% bonus to mining yield', and in the attributes section has a 'mining amount multiplier' of 2. That's correct. The endurance lists a '300% bonus to mining yield', and in the attributes section has a 'mining amount multiplier' of 3. These are inconsistent. I took a look at it, and the multiplier was indeed off. It's been fixed internally to be a full 300% bonus, and should be fixed on TQ in the new year (no holiday patching). @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters

Roa Elim North Star Exploration Industries 2	Posted - 2015.12.19 17:06:30 - [319] - Quote Dear Developer. Please can you tell us, what ore mining yield is intended at the end, with max skills to the Endurance? I made much maths, but you better know, where you want to have the Endurance positioned. Thank you and happy holidays. Roa Elim

CCP Terminus C C P C C P Alliance 487	Posted - 2015.12.21 12:12:51 - [320] - Quote Roa Elim wrote: Dear Developer. Please can you tell us, what ore mining yield is intended at the end, with max skills to the Endurance? I made much maths, but you better know, where you want to have the Endurance positioned. Thank you and happy holidays. Roa Elim Sure. It should be less efficient to mine ore in an Endurance than the Prospect. Here's what I've calculated: All values are rounded to the nearest whole number. Miner II - 60 m3/m Mining V (skill, 25%) - 75 m3/m Astrogeology V (skill, 25%) - 93 m3/m Endurance Role Bonus (300%) - 375 m3/m Endurance Mining Frigate Bonus V (25%) - 469 m3/m Low Slot 1 - 'Aoede' Mining Laser Upgrade (10%) - 515 m3/m Low Slot 2 - 'Aoede' Mining Laser Upgrade (10%) - 567 m3/m Low Slot 3 - 'Aoede' Mining Laser Upgrade (10%) - 623 m3/m Inherent Implants 'Highwall' Mining MX-1005 (5%) - 655 m3/m So, unless I'm missing some bonuses the highest ore mining rate you'll get with a solo character is 655.1 m3 per minute. With the same math I get max ore mining rate of the other mining frigates: Venture - 541.4 m3/m Prospect - 900.7 m3/m (this is due to the extra 25% expedition frigate mining bonus, and the 4 low slots) So unless you're worried about the ore bay size, you should probably mine ore in a Prospect. @CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters

Roa Elim North Star Exploration Industries 2	Posted - 2015.12.21 19:14:32 - [321] - Quote Thank you very much for this clearness and your informations. I understand the different tanking-concept of the Prospect and the Endurance. Honestly, i think there are situations, where i sacrifice a little amount of yield for the advantage of some drones. Sometimes i am little worry, speed - and signature - tanking 6 rats in 0.5, what is possible. Maybe it is also a venture-upgrade so. (Ice mining is fine indubitale) I am awaiting impatiently the server-update, maybe sooner ;-) Greetings, Roa Eim
Lors Dornick Kallisti Industries Solar Assault Fleet 1197	Posted - 2015.12.22 13:17:12 - [322] - Quote CCP Terminus wrote: math This is why we love our ccp devs. CCP Greyscale: As to starbases, we agree it's pretty terrible, but we don't want to delay the entire release just for this one factor.
ultimatefox02 Core Industry. Circle-Of-Two 0	Posted - 2016.01.05 00:47:52 - [323] - Quote "safe part of space" .. u wanna think u talk about hs .. but to start comparing the mack for safe and frig for wh id quess u talk about sov nullsec .. and that place aint really safe .. little bit more then wh if u are digged in and got good intel going . but then not everyone have that comparing mack in hs and the frig in wh u actualy make more in wh with the option to pick the most isk/h ice in the belt as belts in wh-s have ALL types of ice ... but hey .. if ur not intrested of the option to get some thrill of wh - ninja-ing then im sorry . NO HS is not secure, 0.0 is secure , WH is to have fun , but i dont want to saccrify my ISK , mack is better , no interest , the interest is having the same stats at the barge or better to do ninja ice mining . if the Endurance is interesting if he have the same stat at the mack , if yes , i take the Endurance to do PVP in WH in same time i mine. lol :)
Estella Osoka Perkone Caldari State 972	Posted - 2016.01.05 15:53:36 - [324] - Quote ultimatefox02 wrote: "safe part of space" .. u wanna think u talk about hs .. but to start comparing the mack for safe and frig for wh id quess u talk about sov nullsec .. and that place aint really safe .. little bit more then wh if u are digged in and got good intel going . but then not everyone have that comparing mack in hs and the frig in wh u actualy make more in wh with the option to pick the most isk/h ice in the belt as belts in wh-s have ALL types of ice ... but hey .. if ur not intrested of the option to get some thrill of wh - ninja-ing then im sorry . NO HS is not secure, 0.0 is secure , WH is to have fun , but i dont want to saccrify my ISK , mack is better , no interest , the interest is having the same stats at the barge or better to do ninja ice mining . if the Endurance is interesting if he have the same stat at the mack , if yes , i take the Endurance to do PVP in WH in same time i mine. lol :) Mack might be better, but only by a small margin. Mack also cost more. Endurance is fast, small sig, good passive shield tank, ore hold of 15k, has drones to kill rats, and significant reduction in cost. Also, the fact that I am orbiting at a speed of +1000m/s while mining, means I am less likely to be ganked or bumped.

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