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pos bowling goes legit -or- i had a dream

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Dungheap Caldari Dragon's Rage Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2007.05.07 11:00:00 - [1] i had a dream last night. a mothership bumped one of my ships out of our pos, scooped the ship on the fly, and then let out a mothership-sized burp. a thread in CAOD has strayed a bit off-topic, hard as that is to believe... http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=515660 onto the subject of bumping ships out of pos's. those ships bumped out can then be destroyed or stolen. none less than the esteemed pod-pilot, farjung, commented that this has been ruled a legitimate use of game mechanics. his statement has been backed in a written response from ccp, as a GM affirms this is indeed allowed. so, for those that wonder, or perhaps in the past have been told otherwise, 'pos bowling', as it's become known, is now an official sport of the eve universe. like it? then practice your way to free ships left floating at pos's. hi-sec dwellers can also partake, as pos's aren't set to shoot unless aggro'd. as you're seeking financial gain, (free ships) this can't be ruled griefing. right? hate it? then abuse the crap out of it, until ccp is forced to fix this 'broken' game mechanic, ala privateers and the war dec system.
EVIL SYNNs Minmatar Shadows of the Dead Aftermath Alliance	Posted - 2007.05.07 11:02:00 - [2] Or, maybe... nah, this is silly Have a ship maint. array.. and emmm use it! Thats what they are for.
Captain Thunk Captain Morgan Society	Posted - 2007.05.07 11:03:00 - [3] Edited by: Captain Thunk on 07/05/2007 11:00:27 Anything CCP can't actually stop or prove even if they wanted to gets labelled legitimate. Personally, it suits me to the ground - it makes the whole 0.0 thing the joke that it is. Welcome to Eve Originally by: EVIL SYNNs Or, maybe... nah, this is silly Have a ship maint. array.. and emmm use it! Thats what they are for. And capital ships are for bowling right? See this hook? variable speed and five alternate attatchments baby.
EVIL SYNNs Minmatar Shadows of the Dead Aftermath Alliance	Posted - 2007.05.07 11:06:00 - [4] And POS shields are there to let you have 100's of ships unpiloted sitting in them?
Captain Thunk Captain Morgan Society	Posted - 2007.05.07 11:08:00 - [5] Originally by: EVIL SYNNs And POS shields are there to let you have 100's of ships unpiloted sitting in them? Clue is in the fact you need a password to enter that shield. Think it over. Take your time. See this hook? variable speed and five alternate attatchments baby.
LeZbo Liza Minmatar LeZbo Liza Corp	Posted - 2007.05.07 11:09:00 - [6] Edited by: LeZbo Liza on 07/05/2007 11:06:30 STOP CRYING!!!! want a hug?
Karunel Princeps Corp YouWhat	Posted - 2007.05.07 11:10:00 - [7] Quote: And POS shields are there to let you have 100's of ships unpiloted sitting in them? Yes? ____ Originally by: elbenito The problem with large fleet engagements is that the hamsters stop to watch.
Glitch 10240 Caldari Dragon's Rage Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2007.05.07 11:11:00 - [8] I see what you are saying about the ship maint array, however, what if your ship has alot of stuff onboard, you have to store it in the corp hanger array, so then the POS comes under attack, what can you do for the stuff in the corp hanger array then? nothing I think a quick fix until they fix the game mechanic might be, have the corp hangers work while in reinforced?
Grimster Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.05.07 11:12:00 - [9] Originally by: Glitch 10240 I see what you are saying about the ship maint array, however, what if your ship has alot of stuff onboard, you have to store it in the corp hanger array, so then the POS comes under attack, what can you do for the stuff in the corp hanger array then? nothing I think a quick fix until they fix the game mechanic might be, have the corp hangers work while in reinforced? Last time I checked you could anchor more than 1 ship maint array - did they change that? Blog at: The Jammy Blog
Elenia Kheynes Caldari Avatars of Doom Apocalyptica.	Posted - 2007.05.07 11:24:00 - [10] This is a scandal! As long as it's not me or one of my allies who is doing it Dear friendly customer... Can I have your money ?
Mattduk Gallente Universal Army	Posted - 2007.05.07 11:29:00 - [11] Originally by: EVIL SYNNs And POS shields are there to let you have 100's of ships unpiloted sitting in them? Yeppers... The purpose of the POS force field (It's not a shield, muppet), is to prevent anyone who does not have permission from entering that field. Seems people have found a way to exploit the fact that the force field does't really work properly by using warp & bump mechanics to enter the bubble at speed and force a stationary, unmanned vessel to be pushed outside of the field. My best advice is to not leave ships inside a bubble unmanned unless it's absolutely necessary. I agree you should be able to, but without a change in game physics, your ships will never be safe from those who wish to gain financial gain through exploiting the science fiction physics of this game. Pity. Regards Mattduk
Righteous Fury Slacker Industries Exuro Mortis	Posted - 2007.05.07 11:30:00 - [12] Oh the humanity
Fubarski Caldari Centauri Project	Posted - 2007.05.07 11:36:00 - [13] Originally by: Grimster Last time I checked you could anchor more than 1 ship maint array - did they change that? I think titans should just ignore passords, force fields, and the like anyway. Let em dock with the station! Hey, we could do this with ALL the capital ships, it'd be even better gameplay. In fact, I think once you're inside the shield bubble, even if you're hostile, any guns should stop firing at you. Hell, you got in, right? You must be allowed. Oooh, and Titans and supercaps should have a T1 module that raises a HUUUUUUGE frickin flag on it, and makes a permanent monument in a system that says "Mine". It'll establish Sov, until it's destroyed. Give the flag... err, monument 99.99% (99.999 would have been too much, I did the math) resists to all, and somewhere along the lines of 8 million shield, 8 million armor, and 8 million structure points. Hey, we can make the flag racially marked by the race of ship it pops from, thereby setting sov for not only your alliance, but also earning you points, and fabulous prizes from empire factions! There. One patch, everything will be fixed. Won't have to deal with the slow spiral into mediocrity, won't have to deal with having any semblance of hope, that maybe, somewhere, someone will fix something... just have to reach over, and hit "cancel subscription" and go watch a sunrise. Fubarski
Bloedkopp Minmatar Simian Cell Systems	Posted - 2007.05.07 11:37:00 - [14] Originally by: Grimster Originally by: Glitch 10240 I see what you are saying about the ship maint array, however, what if your ship has alot of stuff onboard, you have to store it in the corp hanger array, so then the POS comes under attack, what can you do for the stuff in the corp hanger array then? nothing I think a quick fix until they fix the game mechanic might be, have the corp hangers work while in reinforced? Last time I checked you could anchor more than 1 ship maint array - did they change that? As far as I know is all stuff of a reinforced POS useless or - did they change that ? Maybe you will think different when someone bumps your carrier out and kill you in the time you taking a pee ? Real question should be: Is there any need for an alliance with 4 Titans and several MSs to use such lame tactics that claims that they never do metagameing ?
Dungheap Caldari Dragon's Rage Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2007.05.07 11:49:00 - [15] Originally by: EVIL SYNNs Or, maybe... nah, this is silly Have a ship maint. array.. and emmm use it! Thats what they are for. in fact, this is the response we got from ccp. while not addressing the extra fuel and logistics of anchoring a ship maint. array, your vessel is safe and the array stays online when the pos goes to reinforced mode. corp. hangar arrays, however, do not. leaving the problem of what to do with your ammo, as stored ships must have empty cargo holds. plz don't suggest flying amarr, either...
Jotan Veer HUN Corp. HUN Reloaded	Posted - 2007.05.07 12:08:00 - [16] To be perfectly honest, I don't mind this as 100s of frigates under the forcefield can make quite a bit of lag at POS fights. Bowling can solve that I guess. I'm guilty for leaving like 5 ships (BS, Cruiser, dictor, ceptors) at a POS during the ASCN war to avoid docking and then not storing them in a maint. array so I won't judge people who do the same.
Goberth Ludwig eXceed Inc. INVICTUS.	Posted - 2007.05.07 12:08:00 - [17] Originally by: Righteous Fury Oh the humanity You know I dont think bob would feel terribly offended if you decided to think with your own head once or twice :p Besides I dont think this even needs a comment, it looks more redicoulus than nanophoon and the only justification I heard so far is "that'll teach em for hiding at the pos" ... As someone pointed out all it takes now is massive abuse of this crap until it gets out of hand of ccp fixes it. Just like nanophoons. Yayyyy \o/ - Gob
Grimster Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.05.07 12:14:00 - [18] Originally by: Bloedkopp Edited by: Bloedkopp on 07/05/2007 12:03:03 Originally by: Grimster Originally by: Glitch 10240 I see what you are saying about the ship maint array, however, what if your ship has alot of stuff onboard, you have to store it in the corp hanger array, so then the POS comes under attack, what can you do for the stuff in the corp hanger array then? nothing I think a quick fix until they fix the game mechanic might be, have the corp hangers work while in reinforced? Last time I checked you could anchor more than 1 ship maint array - did they change that? Maybe you will think different when someone bumps your carrier out and kill you in the time you taking a pee ? Real question should be: Is there any need for an alliance with 4 Titans and several MSs to use such lame tactics that claims that they never do metagameing ? You don't fit a catheter for fleet? It's never gonna happen anyway - I'm too much of a newbie to fly a carrier. Blog at: The Jammy Blog
Elmicker Unscoped Myriad Alliance	Posted - 2007.05.07 12:17:00 - [19] Originally by: EVIL SYNNs Have a ship maint. array.. and emmm use it! Unfortunately, this can be impossible in a warzone environment. For example; during the fight in I-N, Maelstrom were desperate to buy time; so left every one of their ships out, at their poses, so that their allies could use them. Had they used a maintenance array, this would not have been possible. Another situation is simply leaving the ships out because otherwise, you can't get the bleeding ammo back out of the hangar array, due to the tower being in reinforced. That is, however, if you're actually lucky enough to be able to use your maintenance array, which always seems to have some muppet go AFK just inside its usage radius.
CaPsA Caldari Section XIII Tau Ceti Federation	Posted - 2007.05.07 12:27:00 - [20] Allies, or Ennemies, I don't care, using Game mechanics is never repectable. But a simple solution to this bowling problem is : - The ForceField work as a Warp Disrupt Buble. - All ships who are not allowed into the forcefield with Standings or Password have to be stop at the limit. POS (Player Owner Station) should be a Safe Spot, so it have to be ! It's not difficult to fix it, but ... If CCP don't want ... TITANs kill lot of fun blocking the fleet engagements ... TITANs don't fight but play bowling ... TITANs will kill EvE on the long term if CCP doesn't fix some problems ! Please don't tell me "blabla you haven't got one blabla" the proposition will only affect TITANs, and all know now that TITANs are on the both sides (The Alliance & The Cohalition). This reply is only my personal opinion. CaPsOUiLLe La FriPoUiLLe
Cadiz Caldari No Quarter. Vae Victis.	Posted - 2007.05.07 12:27:00 - [21] Edited by: Cadiz on 07/05/2007 12:30:21 Originally by: Captain Thunk Edited by: Captain Thunk on 07/05/2007 11:00:27 Anything CCP can't actually stop or prove even if they wanted to gets labelled legitimate. An accurate summary of the situation, best I can tell. It's a rather ridiculous state of affairs (if warp bubbles can stop people dead at their edges, why can't POS shields?), but it's rather difficult for the GMs to go tracking every little case of this and following up on it, so until the devs figure out some way of making this impossible, it is allowed out of impossibility for it to be anything but. Kinda like ye olde logontrapski in that regard, really - lame as hell and clearly a slap in the face of intended design, but permissible until further code/design changes because the alternative is wildly impractical. So with that in mind, not really anything to do but try to cope with it, I suppose. Ships closer to the tower seem to be less vulnerable than ones at the periphery of the shields, and large towers are harder to effectively bowl than smaller ones. These are my observations, anyways. So if you can't use SMAs, then keep your ships as close to the tower as possible and hope for the best. Oh, and you can do this with any capital ship, not just supercapitals. It seems that some people might be thinking this is a titan-specific thing; it is not. You can do it just as easily with a few carriers or dreadnaughts. ------ Director, No Quarter "There is no problem that cannot be solved by the judicious application of violence."
Sokratesz Paradox v2.0 1 Shot 1 Kill	Posted - 2007.05.07 12:36:00 - [22] Can people stop saying 'use maint. array'? Its used to gain an unfair advantage, so its a sploit, period. This sig is confirmed ISD-Proof«
Cadiz Caldari No Quarter. Vae Victis.	Posted - 2007.05.07 12:41:00 - [23] Originally by: Sokratesz Can people stop saying 'use maint. array'? Its used to gain an unfair advantage, so its a sploit, period. It's a permissible exploit, if that's the case. Multiple and consistent (!!) GM rulings and all that. Yes, GM rulings can actually be consistent sometimes; I once thought it impossible too. And it will probably continue to be a permissible exploit right up until the day where they patch in a way to make POS bowling impossible to do, so in the meanwhile you'll just have to cope however you can. I think it sucks too, but hey, welcome to EVE and whatnot. ------ Director, No Quarter "There is no problem that cannot be solved by the judicious application of violence."
Sir Mumm The X-Trading Company Dusk and Dawn	Posted - 2007.05.07 12:46:00 - [24] Thats fun. You warp your fleet to the POS to avoid a DD, the the Titan bumps half of your fleet out of the POS and set off his DD. And its no exploit. Thx GMs. Mumm PS: yes we have a titan
Glitch 10240 Caldari Dragon's Rage Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2007.05.07 13:03:00 - [25] Originally by: Sir Mumm PS: yes we have a titan lmao
Rhaegor Stormborn Sturmgrenadier Inc R i s e	Posted - 2007.05.07 13:14:00 - [26] I dock my ships in maintenance arrays or stations to prevent this from happening. Seems pretty easy to me. Don't let your POSes get into reinforced if you want to use arrays.
Boobaker	Posted - 2007.05.07 13:19:00 - [27] Ok i will explain it again in slow motion. You warp to a POS to bring your fleet in a position to attack a gate, capitals or whatever. In this moment a titan warps to your tower at zero. There goes your fleet, its bumped outside the forcefield. Same goes for the enemy titan. and just in this moment he fires his DD. And now explain to me that ship arrays are very useful against bumping. Mumm
Shrike Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.07 13:20:00 - [28] As a now professional bowler, i will say this. Gangwarping 20 capitals into a POS and do starbursts is, rather nice to look at. However, this is broken, totally and utterly borked. It should not be possible, but, people should also be forced to use Ship Maint arrays to park a ship. So, find us a solution where people have to use the ship array, and where we professional bowlers gets the finger. [center]
x bunny The Rabbit Syndicate	Posted - 2007.05.07 13:24:00 - [29] Isn't ramming a valid and known naval tactic ? Why it should be considered an exploit ?
Juan Andalusian TAOSP Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.07 13:25:00 - [30] Originally by: Boobaker Ok i will explain it again in slow motion. You warp to a POS to bring your fleet in a position to attack a gate, capitals or whatever. In this moment a titan warps to your tower at zero. There goes your fleet, its bumped outside the forcefield. Same goes for the enemy titan. and just in this moment he fires his DD. And now explain to me that ship arrays are very useful against bumping. Mumm By the time the DD finishes the Titan will be anywhere between 400km and the adjacent grid due to the bounce. Pain is meant to be felt
Boobaker	Posted - 2007.05.07 13:27:00 - [31] maybe. Hope we will never have to find out.
Fred0 Cutting Edge Incorporated RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2007.05.07 13:29:00 - [32] As much as it hurts. RF and Shrike are the ones I agree with here.
SamuraiJack Caldari Celestial Horizon Corp. Valainaloce	Posted - 2007.05.07 13:32:00 - [33] Originally by: Shrike As a now professional bowler, i will say this. Gangwarping 20 capitals into a POS and do starbursts is, rather nice to look at. However, this is broken, totally and utterly borked. It should not be possible, but, people should also be forced to use Ship Maint arrays to park a ship. So, find us a solution where people have to use the ship array, and where we professional bowlers gets the finger. And what about those that you are bumping out of the shield while /in/ ships eh? meta game away... SJ. CLS Co-CEO and Standings Director =-
Myz Toyou Black Lance NBSI Alliance	Posted - 2007.05.07 14:02:00 - [34] Originally by: Shrike As a now professional bowler, i will say this. Gangwarping 20 capitals into a POS and do starbursts is, rather nice to look at. However, this is broken, totally and utterly borked. It should not be possible, but, people should also be forced to use Ship Maint arrays to park a ship. So, find us a solution where people have to use the ship array, and where we professional bowlers gets the finger. So you say that these guys should all dock there ships in array as soon as they go into POS force field ??? LOL is all that I could say ! CYVOK > All you station jockies better get out their and start killing these idiots
Malachon Draco eXceed Inc. INVICTUS.	Posted - 2007.05.07 14:11:00 - [35] Originally by: x bunny Isn't ramming a valid and known naval tactic ? Why it should be considered an exploit ? Because its not about the ramming nitwit. Its about being able to get into a protective bubble no ship should be able to penetrate except when they have the password or after they bash it down with a dreadfleet. signature removed - please contact us to find out why (include the URL of your sig) - Jacques([email protected])
iqplayer Caldari Dragon's Rage Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2007.05.07 14:13:00 - [36] Originally by: Shrike As a now professional bowler, i will say this. Gangwarping 20 capitals into a POS and do starbursts is, rather nice to look at. However, this is broken, totally and utterly borked. It should not be possible, but, people should also be forced to use Ship Maint arrays to park a ship. So, find us a solution where people have to use the ship array, and where we professional bowlers gets the finger. Ok, let's totally leave out the fact that the use of SMA's is rather borked atm because of the cargo/CHA mechanics.... Bowling is equally effective - and used - against piloted ships. POS's are meant to be areas that are (relatively) safe. The (relatively) part of this equation is already taken care of by the fact that they can be destroyed. There is no reason why hostile ships should be allowed into POS shields for any amount of time, nor any reason why they should have an effect on ships inside the shields.
Trask Kilraen The Older Gamers R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.05.07 14:55:00 - [37] This is possibly the lamest tactic ever...
Dal Thrax Caldari Multiverse Corporation	Posted - 2007.05.07 15:00:00 - [38] Originally by: Cadiz Originally by: Sokratesz Can people stop saying 'use maint. array'? Its used to gain an unfair advantage, so its a sploit, period. It's a permissible exploit, if that's the case. Multiple and consistent (!!) GM rulings and all that. Yes, GM rulings can actually be consistent sometimes; I once thought it impossible too. And it will probably continue to be a permissible exploit right up until the day where they patch in a way to make POS bowling impossible to do, so in the meanwhile you'll just have to cope however you can. I think it sucks too, but hey, welcome to EVE and whatnot. Quote: The following exploits were addressed in the Revelations 1.3 Patch Deployment: * It is no longer possible to steal from a Starbase using a Carrier / Mothership / Titan. - attribution http://myeve.eve-online.com/updates/patchnotes.asp?patchlogID=111 Originally by: CCP Sharkbait we are screwed. delaying startup again. soon as i have time i will fill you in on the details
Suboran Gallente Sphinx Inc Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2007.05.07 15:02:00 - [39] Originally by: x bunny Isn't ramming a valid and known naval tactic ? Why it should be considered an exploit ? ramming usualy incurs damage on both parties involved, and naval ships dont have a forcefield around them.
Kweel Nakashyn Minmatar Aeden Tau Ceti Federation	Posted - 2007.05.07 15:13:00 - [40] Originally by: Shrike As a now professional bowler, i will say this. Gangwarping 20 capitals into a POS and do starbursts is, rather nice to look at. However, this is broken, totally and utterly borked. It should not be possible, but, people should also be forced to use Ship Maint arrays to park a ship. So, find us a solution where people have to use the ship array, and where we professional bowlers gets the finger. Well, Titan pilots are somehow 12/15, rest of Eve is 5373464346344353 people so... Please stop ? ----- History is made by whinners Originally by: DB Preacher (...) Ignore what the coalition muppets are saying on their forums (...)
Farham AWE Corporation Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2007.05.07 15:22:00 - [41] "So, find us a solution where people have to use the ship array, and where we professional bowlers gets the finger." You are asking for solutions to two different problems Molle. The problem of knocking out "unmanned" ships is really not much of a big deal since as you point out and others, use the ship array. Fine. The second and more pressing issue is slow moving but occupied ships that can be bounced out to a waiting Mothership or a currently sieging dred fleet. Ship array's are meaningless for this situation. It is only a matter of time as more of the super capitals find their way into space that the tactics will be honed for bouncing out battleships and capitals that are trying to defend a POS to a science. Honestly though, don't you think the act is just petty? Oh yea, my solution would be to change the collision detection "check" to the POS forcefield vs the POS. I am sure since they haven't done it yet it would be yet another nightmare for POS code but it would fix it.
ta tula	Posted - 2007.05.07 15:55:00 - [42] so wait.. let me get this right.. people are whining that their unoccupied ships are getting bumped out of a bubble? or are they occupied? tbh if theyre unoccupied then you damn well deserve to lose capships to bowling.
NATMav F.R.E.E. Explorer EVE Animal Control	Posted - 2007.05.07 16:08:00 - [43] It works whether the ship is occupied or not. And of course BoB is so disappointed by this, they tag team and use 2 titans to ram the POS, along with a sniper fleet sitting 150KM away. I'm sure they're just "trying to convince CCP to fix it" though. I know they aren't the only ones participating, but they are definitely making every attempt to take full advantage of it. It one thing when a pilot or two takes part, but when you have an entire fleet standing by watching this happen, its sickening IMO. It's like jet can baiting day old noobs in high sec. It might be amusing the first few times, but after that you just feel dirty about it. -------------------------------------
Atreus Minmatarius Port Royal Independent Kontractors Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2007.05.07 16:15:00 - [44] good old bob, never disapoints what i say is my own opinion and does not represent any entity other than myself
C4R3B34R Amarr Captial Productions Unlimited	Posted - 2007.05.07 16:22:00 - [45] Edited by: C4R3B34R on 07/05/2007 16:19:18 Thats funny! Sad thing is, if it wasn't BoD doing it, it'd be an exploit. Way to go on finding another way to kill the game! AFAIK this is an exploit, a cheap way to use game mechanics to bypass sa***uards put forth to defend pos's and the stuff that are inside them. CCP should do something about this, and soon! Safe guard is caught by the filters!?!?! -----------------------------------------------
Exortius Amarrus The Clearwater Society Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.05.07 16:23:00 - [46] Edited by: Exortius Amarrus on 07/05/2007 16:21:37 Speaking on game lore, it doesn't seem too terribly far-fetched to think that a ship as large as a Titan or Mothership would have the mass and shield strength to pass through the shields of a POS briefly. Is it really that ridiculous? I've seen the vids, and while i'm not sure that's what the developers intended, i don't feel like i'm watching anything too crazy. But hey, that's just me. Also, ship maintanence arrays ftw. You're within your rights to argue about this on forums, but please actually try and do something about it while you argue. Use the damn arrays. ------------------------
Raketefrau Caldari Di-Tron Heavy Industries Sparta Alliance	Posted - 2007.05.07 16:32:00 - [47] Originally by: EVIL SYNNs Or, maybe... nah, this is silly Have a ship maint. array.. and emmm use it! Thats what they are for. Here's the situation: You're in a corp that lives out of a POS. There are daily incursions of hostiles into your system, griefing your miners. Hostiles arrive, call goes out, "Attack in belt 5-3!" Everyone rushes to the POS Everyone argues over who gets to use the maint array first. "Get back 3500m!" "My turn!" "Come on, hurry up!" "Crap, I still have to get all my ammo!" It's ridiculous. There's a very good reason why people leave combat ships floating in POSes. It's because when the alarm goes out, you need a ship at-the-ready, not a line forming at the maint arrays, then a swarm at the hangar array. The fact of the matter is, if you leave something in a POS shield, it should be safe. I don't understand why there's such an argument around it, except for "we don't feel like fixing it."
Turkantho Asgard Schiffswerften Ev0ke	Posted - 2007.05.07 16:42:00 - [48] ship arrays need fixing, it's more than annoyance that you can put a ship into the array as long as it has anything (like AMMO maybe) in the cargohold ________ we bring the fun in funeral
Grim Faust Kinetic Vector Freelancer Alliance	Posted - 2007.05.07 16:47:00 - [49] By definition an exploit is taking advantage of a situation in which the exploiter has a marginal gain through means that aren't intended. So let's think about this for a second, what's the point of a POS shield? To keep enemy ships out as well as protect you from enemy fire. How is this being exploited then? Not only are people using this 'bowling' tactic to get IN to POS shields, they're also using it to destroy enemy ships or steal them. The fundamental aspect that makes this an exploit, above all the side factors of losing ships is that someone is ENTERING a POS shield when they should not be allowed. In my honest opinion, the dev's are probably looking at this mechanic and going 'oh ****!'. Meanwhile they're playing it off as if everything is fine and working as intended. My guess is the problem in the games physics is too hard to fix in a prompt manner so they'll play it off until they're closer to knowing why their system is messed up. You could imagine of course how bad it would be for them if they admitted it was a bug and couldn't fix it fast, right? They'd have petitions coming out their ass to replace all the ships that have been lost to this exploit. And what would be the main problem with that is, how do you prove through game logs that your ship was bumped out of a POS field and then stolen or destroyed? Yeah, exactly, a GM's nightmare. My suggestion would be of two things; 1. Everyone exploit the hell out of this, so it becomes a big issue. and 2. If you don't want to lose a ship to this, don't park it in a POS shield thinking it's safe. What else can you do when the powers that be, say; "Nothing to see here, move along!". __________________________________________________ I survived CCP eating all my sigs and all I got was a crappy colorful moderator message...
NATMav F.R.E.E. Explorer EVE Animal Control	Posted - 2007.05.07 17:23:00 - [50] Originally by: Exortius Amarrus Also, ship maintanence arrays ftw. You're within your rights to argue about this on forums, but please actually try and do something about it while you argue. Use the damn arrays. Try reading the thread before hitting the reply button. -------------------------------------
CaPsA Caldari Section XIII Tau Ceti Federation	Posted - 2007.05.07 17:27:00 - [51] Stop with the Shipyard maintenance blabla ... Now when you defend your POS underfire, don't go in, you will be bump and killed ... You just have to look at its destruction if you have a covert ... In the video, all the ships was with pilots. Please stop to tell ouinnnn ouinn you lost your ship because you leave it alone in forcefield ... Well i have an idea , When you have to defend your POS, stay in pods near the tower with yours pvp ships docked, and be ready to board it when the shield is coming down ... Seems to be THE SOLUTION, isn't it CCP ??? ... CCP you have to fix some problems quickly ! CaPsA
Murukan Minmatar Chaos Reborn	Posted - 2007.05.07 17:28:00 - [52] Originally by: C4R3B34R Edited by: C4R3B34R on 07/05/2007 16:19:18 Thats funny! Sad thing is, if it wasn't BoD doing it, it'd be an exploit. Way to go on finding another way to kill the game! AFAIK this is an exploit, a cheap way to use game mechanics to bypass sa*uards put forth to defend pos's and the stuff that are inside them. CCP should do something about this, and soon! Safe guard is caught by the filters!?!?! ahoy idiot everyone with a supercap is doing this not just BoB. TBH i would do it to if i was in a mom cause it's rather hilarious. Manlove by Zaphod Jones**
Serapis Aote Minmatar TBC TALIONIS ALLIANCE	Posted - 2007.05.07 17:33:00 - [53] Some things in this game are just getting stupid. Supercapitals are just making the stupid things even more retarded. Anyone that sees this going on and doesnt think its an idiotic game mechanic needs to really try to figure out why. Is it funny? yes, should it be in the game, NO.
X0TPO534 Old School Players	Posted - 2007.05.07 18:51:00 - [54] Edited by: X0TPO534 on 07/05/2007 18:49:08 Originally by: CaPsA Stop with the Shipyard maintenance blabla ... Now when you defend your POS underfire, don't go in, you will be bump and killed ... You just have to look at its destruction if you have a covert ... In the video, all the ships was with pilots. Please stop to tell ouinnnn ouinn you lost your ship because you leave it alone in forcefield ... Well i have an idea , When you have to defend your POS, stay in pods near the tower with yours pvp ships docked, and be ready to board it when the shield is coming down ... Seems to be THE SOLUTION, isn't it CCP ??? ... CCP you have to fix some problems quickly ! CaPsA I can't understand why ppl talk about this in CAOD. You guys need to stop whining here and get some kills imo. I salute goons and intrepids that defend frontlines. RA whoring complexes (soon nerfed \o/) and TCF sitting at a pos, frapsing and crying in CAOD about a game issue do not deserve any respect. Go get titans, go get motherships, go get cap ships and fight like men. Anyways, last TCF I killed a week ago in lowsec havent posted his loss yet, this is a more important issue to me. Edit: spelling. ________________________________________________ Killing **** since 2K3.
CaPsA Caldari Section XIII Tau Ceti Federation	Posted - 2007.05.07 19:10:00 - [55] Originally by: X0TPO534 Edited by: X0TPO534 on 07/05/2007 18:49:08 Originally by: CaPsA Stop with the Shipyard maintenance blabla ... Now when you defend your POS underfire, don't go in, you will be bump and killed ... You just have to look at its destruction if you have a covert ... In the video, all the ships was with pilots. Please stop to tell ouinnnn ouinn you lost your ship because you leave it alone in forcefield ... Well i have an idea , When you have to defend your POS, stay in pods near the tower with yours pvp ships docked, and be ready to board it when the shield is coming down ... Seems to be THE SOLUTION, isn't it CCP ??? ... CCP you have to fix some problems quickly ! CaPsA I can't understand why ppl talk about this in CAOD. You guys need to stop whining here and get some kills imo. I salute goons and intrepids that defend frontlines. RA whoring complexes (soon nerfed \o/) and TCF sitting at a pos, frapsing and crying in CAOD about a game issue do not deserve any respect. Go get titans, go get motherships, go get cap ships and fight like men. Anyways, last TCF I killed a week ago in lowsec havent posted his loss yet, this is a more important issue to me. Edit: spelling. It's only my personnal opinion guy, please don't take what i said as an official annoucement of my alliance ... So boring, do you want I write a beautifull disclaimer each post I made ?? ... Anyway you killed a TCF clap clap clap ... It's not about this thread, make a battle report in a new thread if you are so proud about it Back to subject please :) Les titans c'est taboo on en viendra tous a bou ! Enjoy the game ! CaPsA
Pesadel0 Ordem dos Templarios Te-Ka	Posted - 2007.05.07 19:27:00 - [56] Who gives a **** CCP will just make that a feature. I was sworn to absolute secrecy BY CCP.
Cadiz Caldari No Quarter. Vae Victis.	Posted - 2007.05.07 21:24:00 - [57] Originally by: Dal Thrax Originally by: Cadiz Originally by: Sokratesz Can people stop saying 'use maint. array'? Its used to gain an unfair advantage, so its a sploit, period. It's a permissible exploit, if that's the case. Multiple and consistent (!!) GM rulings and all that. Yes, GM rulings can actually be consistent sometimes; I once thought it impossible too. And it will probably continue to be a permissible exploit right up until the day where they patch in a way to make POS bowling impossible to do, so in the meanwhile you'll just have to cope however you can. I think it sucks too, but hey, welcome to EVE and whatnot. Quote: The following exploits were addressed in the Revelations 1.3 Patch Deployment: * It is no longer possible to steal from a Starbase using a Carrier / Mothership / Titan. - attribution http://myeve.eve-online.com/updates/patchnotes.asp?patchlogID=111 We tried that line of argument when it happened to us, in fact. GMs still shot it down. ------ Director, No Quarter "There is no problem that cannot be solved by the judicious application of violence."
Hast Refused.	Posted - 2007.05.07 22:06:00 - [58] Originally by: omeega PICTURE TOO BIG, KGB INCOMING HAVE FUN.
Torm Ilmater No Quarter. Vae Victis.	Posted - 2007.05.07 22:30:00 - [59] Originally by: Murukan ahoy snip everyone with a supercap is doing this not just BoB. I'll have to repeat what Cadiz said. You can do it in ANY capital ship (not just supercap ships). With regular capitals it's slightly harder against a large POS but against smaller POSes it's very viable.
Tobruk Black Omega Security	Posted - 2007.05.07 22:40:00 - [60] Just consider how unrealistic the whole idea of "bumping" is in the first place. real objects don't have perfectly elastic collisions (for my physics grads out there). Especially if they are billion ton space objects slamming into each other at 100s of KM a second. The whole thing is just absurd. then throw in a pos, which has a shield with a password and is designed to protect ships and it achieves a whole new level ridiculousness. Granted, ccp seems hell bent on allowing Titans to ruin the game but if they intend to win another gaphics award in 2007-2008 then they should probly fix this. but never fear, as soon as some other alliance bowls it will become an exploit and be fixed. ---------------------------------------------- [gold]Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes -HornFrog (mods@ccpga
Chowdown Gallente Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.07 23:14:00 - [61] Bumpy bumpy, Nerf Titans! http://www.eve-battlestars.net/chow.html
Asylum Seaker Celtic Anarchy Anarchy Empire	Posted - 2007.05.07 23:22:00 - [62] Edited by: Asylum Seaker on 07/05/2007 23:25:47 Although its a stupid tactic and really should be an exploit.. At least maybe people will start docking their ships in the maintenance bay so I don't get four hundred iterons and kestrals every time I try to scan a system. If the game was any sort of realistic, ships would probably disintegrate into vapor and shrapnel when they slam into a force field at that speed. The universe is hostile, so impersonal, devour to survive, so it is, so it's always been.
scabbsssjr Gallente M'8'S	Posted - 2007.05.07 23:40:00 - [63] JW, but what do you have to knock out for a strike? --------------------------- Originally by: Ductoris At this rate I'm going to ask for a BOB sub-forum.
Grimster Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.05.07 23:43:00 - [64] Originally by: scabbsssjr JW, but what do you have to knock out for a strike? 10 Naglfars' probably. Blog at: The Jammy Blog
Brunswick2 eXceed Inc. INVICTUS.	Posted - 2007.05.08 00:27:00 - [65] Originally by: Shrike As a now professional bowler, i will say this. Gangwarping 20 capitals into a POS and do starbursts is, rather nice to look at. However, this is broken, totally and utterly borked. It should not be possible, but, people should also be forced to use Ship Maint arrays to park a ship. So, find us a solution where people have to use the ship array, and where we professional bowlers gets the finger. Post with your main(s)!
Koronos Interstellar eXodus R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.05.08 03:01:00 - [66] Originally by: Asylum Seaker OMFG Asylum your sig is so pwn. Maybe its because I love Alien and Aliens, and vagabonds, but love it. Koronos
Bozse Caldari Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.08 03:18:00 - [67] Make ships anchroable inside the forcefield, solves the issue with beeing a dread pilot wanting to switch for a faster ship once in a while aswell (pw required for this), restriction would be time to anchor / unanchor (fast timers if piloted slow in not piloted)and no unachoring below 50% shield. Just a random thought for a sollution. Originally by: CCP Wrangler EVE is designed to be a dark and harsh world
Budwagon Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2007.05.08 03:52:00 - [68] Edited by: Budwagon on 08/05/2007 03:49:23 I would love to see a solution to this promblem I lost a BS to a strike from a motherhip and they came close to getting my dread outside the shields while i was using a faster ship. People say use a ship maintenance arrary... I could put my Dread in it but that would almost fill it. You would need a ship maintenance arrary for each person in your corp that drives a capital ship. Some people would needed 2 arrarys for their own ships. They are going to have to make the arrarys hold a lot more or the shields are going to have to stop the bowling balls.
pxmars Caldari Dragon's Rage Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2007.05.08 03:55:00 - [69] I would love to see a solution to this promblem I lost a BS to a strike from a motherhip and they came close to getting my dread outside the shields while i was using a faster ship. People say use a ship maintenance arrary... I could put my Dread in it but that would almost fill it. You would need a ship maintenance arrary for each person in your corp that drives a capital ship. Some people would needed 2 arrarys for their own ships. They are going to have to make the arrarys hold a lot more or the shields are going to have to stop the bowling balls. sorry for the double post but I try not to reply with a alt.
Grimster Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.05.08 06:35:00 - [70] Originally by: Bozse Make ships anchroable inside the forcefield, solves the issue with beeing a dread pilot wanting to switch for a faster ship once in a while aswell (pw required for this), restriction would be time to anchor / unanchor (fast timers if piloted slow in not piloted)and no unachoring below 50% shield. Just a random thought for a sollution. Best idea yet tbh - you could have those parking bays you see in rat 'plexes. Blog at: The Jammy Blog
Ket Halpak ANZAC ALLIANCE Southern Cross Alliance	Posted - 2007.05.08 07:18:00 - [71] Originally by: Grimster Originally by: Bozse Make ships anchroable inside the forcefield, solves the issue with beeing a dread pilot wanting to switch for a faster ship once in a while aswell (pw required for this), restriction would be time to anchor / unanchor (fast timers if piloted slow in not piloted)and no unachoring below 50% shield. Just a random thought for a sollution. Best idea yet tbh - you could have those parking bays you see in rat 'plexes. Best idea yet, all you have to do is buy a ship anchoring array and you can anchor your ships in place in a pos, brilliant! _ Check out my blog at RantingsofaCarebear.blogspot.com Privateers: Those who don't adapt become victims of harsh irony
Tran MD Caldari AWE Corporation Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2007.05.08 07:36:00 - [72] I keep reading the sentence from a famous movie: "A wizard should know better!" I consider Shrike, other Titan owners and most of the EVE community as adults (IRL that is). Adults should know better then kids. When a GM asks a player to stop doing something what is in a 'grey area' I expect that player to respect that GM and follow his request. This bowling is such a grey area. Whenever GM's are contradicting each other about this subject the request still stands: please stop doing it untill -insert argument here -. A Titan / MS / Capship owner got a huge responsiblity. Not only for himself because of the time, ISK and effort which have been put to build it, but also for the game play / mechanics of EVE. EVE as game is not perfect, mistakes are made, exploits are possible, scams are allowed. I expect from this ingame strong elite corporation / alliance that they take their responsibility as adults and stop acting like kids. Only kids say 'he done it too, and I get a reprimande! Unfair, I'm going to do the same thing he did neener'. To be fair, watching a Titan warping inside a POS (which should not be possible) and bumping ships outside its protective shield is a funny sight. However, it is not fun for the pilots involved.
Aliesta	Posted - 2007.05.08 07:47:00 - [73] Edited by: Aliesta on 08/05/2007 07:43:29 -
Tran MD Caldari AWE Corporation Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2007.05.08 07:48:00 - [74] Edited by: Tran MD on 08/05/2007 07:44:18 For the people who never seen a POS and don't know how a POS and hangars work, here a tiny short summary. POS: Player Owned Station, have a shield. You cannot lock any ships inside and the ships inside cannot lock at all. Ship Maintenance Hangar: A structure inside the POS, used to store vessels (ships). Problem 1: only 1 person can access at same time. Problem 2: stored ships's cargohold is empty. Huge Hangar: Simulair like an Outpost / NPC station hangar, 7 different hangars, each his own use. Here you put mods, ammo, ore - whatever. Main problem of BOTH Hangars: Only the CORP who's POS it is can access these hangars. So the other corporations in the alliance and friendlies should have an own POS. That is not always possible (and certainly not possible in DB and ZS since the POS spamming). So what options do you have left? - dock ships at the outpost -- not smart during 23/h attacks, cannot undock due warp bubble outside undocking outpost - fly all ships you have to a friendly POS and leave your ships there -- not smart when a carrier, dreadnough, mothership and / or titan bumps them all out the protective shield. - fly all ships to an SS -- not smart since hostiles can scan, find, and wait till u show up / steal ships / blow them up
Mr Friendly That it Should Come to This	Posted - 2007.05.08 07:56:00 - [75] Edited by: Mr Friendly on 08/05/2007 07:55:14 Why CCP doesn't simply temp ban any and all 'bowlers' is beyond me, tbh. I just don't see how this is an intended effect, nor how it is a reasonable outgrowth of existing ship or POS mechanics. In fact, banning seems so obvious, I really do wonder at the IQ levels of CCP's game directors (whoever it is that makes these sorts of decisions). Are you all on holiday, CCP?
X0TPO534 Old School Players	Posted - 2007.05.08 08:09:00 - [76] Originally by: Mr Friendly Edited by: Mr Friendly on 08/05/2007 07:55:14 Why CCP doesn't simply temp ban any and all 'bowlers' is beyond me, tbh. I just don't see how this is an intended effect, nor how it is a reasonable outgrowth of existing ship or POS mechanics. In fact, banning seems so obvious, I really do wonder at the IQ levels of CCP's game directors (whoever it is that makes these sorts of decisions). Are you all on holiday, CCP? Bumping isnt considered as an exploit, so the bans u mentioned are not so obvious as you would like. I still think it's a Game Discussion subject and not CAOD. ________________________________________________ Killing **** since 2K3.
Krystian Caldari No Quarter. Vae Victis.	Posted - 2007.05.08 08:19:00 - [77] Yet another form of metagaming that honestly sucks. Cool when you do it but not so cool when done to you.
Mr Friendly That it Should Come to This	Posted - 2007.05.08 08:20:00 - [78] Originally by: X0TPO534 Bumping isnt considered as an exploit, so the bans u mentioned are not so obvious as you would like. I still think it's a Game Discussion subject and not CAOD. Hmm, since it seems to have been employed by major alliances against other major alliances during a time of najor war, I think it has COAD relevance ;) How do you think it's not obviously an unintended effect of game mechanics being used to gain an unfair advantage? I'm a high-sec carebear, so it doesn't directly affect me anyways, but I've seen the vids and they seem pretty intuitively 'unintended' to me. I guess I don't go by the idea that 'if it's not expressly forbidden, it's implicitly allowed'. Sure, it's a game and all, but those ships represent people's time and effort. Using lame tactics that 'duck' the presumed game rules is simply cheap.
X0TPO534 Old School Players	Posted - 2007.05.08 08:39:00 - [79] Originally by: Mr Friendly Originally by: X0TPO534 Bumping isnt considered as an exploit, so the bans u mentioned are not so obvious as you would like. I still think it's a Game Discussion subject and not CAOD. Hmm, since it seems to have been employed by major alliances against other major alliances during a time of najor war, I think it has COAD relevance ;) How do you think it's not obviously an unintended effect of game mechanics being used to gain an unfair advantage? I'm a high-sec carebear, so it doesn't directly affect me anyways, but I've seen the vids and they seem pretty intuitively 'unintended' to me. I guess I don't go by the idea that 'if it's not expressly forbidden, it's implicitly allowed'. Sure, it's a game and all, but those ships represent people's time and effort. Using lame tactics that 'duck' the presumed game rules is simply cheap. I must agree with that one. ________________________________________________ Killing **** since 2K3.
Tran MD Caldari AWE Corporation Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2007.05.08 08:48:00 - [80] People are right when this subject should be a Game Discussion because its about a grey area of use of supercapital ships. But! Because this particulair Alliance uses this 'mechanic' against another Alliance(s) we have the right to call the supercapital pilots for account.
Dungheap Caldari Dragon's Rage Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2007.05.08 10:55:00 - [81] the reason for posting this in CAOD was to inform those most affected by this tactic. at one time or another, various alliances have been told it isn't, or is, allowed, depending on which gm responded to the petition. my intention was not to point fingers at any single alliance or corp, as you can see none are mentioned in the OP. only to enlighten the eve community about ccp's unwillingness or inability to do anything about, what appears to me, an obvious abuse of game mechanics. it certainly gives lie to the patch notes that say it's now impossible to steal ships from a pos. if a mod wishes to move this thread to general discussion, i'd have no objection. it would let even more subscribers know about ccp's impotence in dealing with some of the more marginal tactics that our ingenious player base continues to think up.
hybridundertaker Amarr coracao ardente Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.05.08 11:32:00 - [82] there is a lot of ships around in those shields, probably those ships add up considerably to server charge. Also bowlers rick their ships when bowling. If supercaps are used the risk is very low but thats a problem of supercapitalships and not poses in my humble opinion. And all those ships in shileds make scanning much harder, me not likes it. EvE +NLINE - T+TALHELLDEATH SUPPORTER
Iasius Warp Angels	Posted - 2007.05.08 11:38:00 - [83] I have never laughed so hard when i was holed up in a small pos watching dreads bounce of the control tower through the bubble ,after being ensnared in a warp bubble - booooing! Pinball eve physics is the way. If you want pro mode eve then you will look at an air traffic control screen all day shooting at ships going at hyper velocities hundreds of thousands of km away. ................................................ I post with my main, so should you. Alt's are hecklers
Gorjer Itto-Ryu Cruel Intentions	Posted - 2007.05.08 11:50:00 - [84] Edited by: Gorjer on 08/05/2007 11:46:28 So many people are looking at this from the wrong perspective. Pos's have been overpowered ever since they were introduced. This tactic is a saviour for 0.0 warfare. Back in the days without Pos warfare you had to be smart about living in 0.0, now any old fool can park up, npc to his delight then go to safety in a nice pos. It's absurd. Alot of people are crying like its an endgame bug, however, how often do you think a supercapital is gonna jump all the way over to your system, set himself up to 'bowl' and perform. By that time you should be at a different pos/logged or in a different system. It's 0.0, it shoudnt be a pram! As for empty ships .... maintantence array.
Evil Thug Rage and Terror Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2007.05.08 11:58:00 - [85] There is 2 cases here. 1st. Bumping ships with goal to steal them. Could it be prevented ? Yes. If you have extra ship on your pos - put it into ship maintance array. If you didn`t - pay for your stupidity. 2nd. Bumping ships with pilots inside. Could it be prevented ? No. With new scan system - you need 22 seconds to bust safespot. So, if POS isn`t safe - what is ?
Voculus E X O D U S Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2007.05.08 12:18:00 - [86] Just a few weeks ago, Shrike was denying any wrong-doing, and now he's bragging about gaming the game. Honestly, BOB is the worst thing that ever happened to Eve. All you cheats do is make this a worse game. _________________________________________________________
Captain Thunk Captain Morgan Society	Posted - 2007.05.08 12:18:00 - [87] Edited by: Captain Thunk on 08/05/2007 12:18:45 Originally by: Mr Friendly Edited by: Mr Friendly on 08/05/2007 07:55:14 Why CCP doesn't simply temp ban any and all 'bowlers' is beyond me, tbh. I just don't see how this is an intended effect, nor how it is a reasonable outgrowth of existing ship or POS mechanics. In fact, banning seems so obvious, I really do wonder at the IQ levels of CCP's game directors (whoever it is that makes these sorts of decisions). Are you all on holiday, CCP? Because the people involved understand the rules implicitly. CCP cannot and will not rule this as an exploit for the simple reason screenshots/fraps isn't acceptable as evidence. Only server logs can be used as evidence and they won't show the effects of bumping, so any accusation will be indistinguishable from an ordinary ship theft. SirMolle himself could even come and post in this thread saying "yep, it's ridiculous isn't it? But...what exactly are you going to do about it?" because he has plausible deniability and he knows it. You need to remember that CCPs definition of 'exploit' has to be verifiable through server logs, the mistake is that many people confuse it with the actual English definition of 'exploit' which in reality has no place in this game. The loophole may or may not be plugged eventually, whatever...it's just another short term step in a long term game - it will be something else soon enough. Best solution is to take down your POS's and move to Empire and be content with Agent Missions - CCP are expanding the range and difficulty of missions to accomodate the exodus from 0.0 CAPTAIN THUNK See this hook? variable speed and five alternate attatchments baby.
Tarron Sarek Gallente Cadien Cybernetics	Posted - 2007.05.08 12:26:00 - [88] One more reason to stay out of 0.0 for the time being. It's not a bug, it's a feature, eh? Purely hilarious. _________________________________ - People are people wherever you go -
Karma Kahn Amarr Blue Star Brotherhood Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.05.08 12:37:00 - [89] Originally by: Bozse Make ships anchroable inside the forcefield, solves the issue with beeing a dread pilot wanting to switch for a faster ship once in a while aswell (pw required for this), restriction would be time to anchor / unanchor (fast timers if piloted slow in not piloted)and no unachoring below 50% shield. Just a random thought for a sollution. /signed My views are my own they do not reflect those of my corp or alliance
Raketefrau Caldari Di-Tron Heavy Industries Sparta Alliance	Posted - 2007.05.08 15:28:00 - [90] Edited by: Raketefrau on 08/05/2007 15:26:05 Edited by: Raketefrau on 08/05/2007 15:25:33 Just to drag this topic back into CAOD land.... A pilot showed up in his alliance's home system in a brand new carrier. He bragged about how the owner (a corpmate of mine) had left it floating outside the bubble. A diplomat for his alliance called shenanigans, because a) he knows my corpmate and how he plays the game, and b) he has a lot of respect for the game in general. He took the ship back from the bowler, and returned it to my corpmate. I won't name the alliance involved here, I'll leave it up to them to decide whether they want to be named or not. The point is that there are still some pilots who respect even their enemies, and respect the game enough to not pull this kind of ****. It was refreshing to see this level of respect, I just wish it was more common in Eve.
ED 209 Old Detroit Crime Syndicate	Posted - 2007.05.08 15:41:00 - [91] bob:1 cryalition:0 It's geat how their posts have gone from 'We'll own delve by June', to 'waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa ccp waaaaaaaaaaaa'. Is it just me or are the former ASCN guys posting in all the bob related threads past bitter and approaching stalker level?
Havras The Syndicate Inc DeStInY.	Posted - 2007.05.08 16:18:00 - [92] Originally by: ED 209 bob:1 cryalition:0 It's geat how their posts have gone from 'We'll own delve by June', to 'waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa ccp waaaaaaaaaaaa'. Is it just me or are the former ASCN guys posting in all the bob related threads past bitter and approaching stalker level? Umm.. newsflash. ASCN is dead. Leave it dead as it has nothing to do with this. This has to do with a game mechanic that is obviously borked. Hell even Shrike is saying it is borked and needs fixing.
Gant Stryker AWE Corporation Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2007.05.08 16:24:00 - [93] Edited by: Exortius Amarrus on 07/05/2007 16:21:37 Speaking on game lore, it doesn't seem too terribly far-fetched to think that a ship as large as a Titan or Mothership would have the mass and shield strength to pass through the shields of a POS briefly. Is it really that ridiculous? I've seen the vids, and while i'm not sure that's what the developers intended, i don't feel like i'm watching anything too crazy. But hey, that's just me. And instantaneous deceleration will do no damage to the ramming ship.... I have no problem with POS bowling if the ball comes up with appropriate sized knicks in it. [url=http://killboard.intrepidcrossing.org/?a=pilot_detail&plt_id=50] [/url]
ElCoCo KIA Corp KIA Alliance	Posted - 2007.05.08 16:57:00 - [94] Heh. I find this bowling business funny and sad at the same time I wouldn't do it myself tbh... it's pretty obvious that it shouldn't be happening, so don't hide behind your finger.
Apollyon X FIRMA	Posted - 2007.05.08 16:59:00 - [95] As long as anyone can do it I don't see a problem
Plim Gallente Celestial Apocalypse Insurgency	Posted - 2007.05.08 17:00:00 - [96] Yes, EVE is a really crappy, buggy, flawed game, in which the devs are clearly high as kites 90% of the time. But it is sadly a bit addictive. Didn't we all realise this years ago? ----------------- OMG! SiGnAtUrE gO mEnTaLz
Alts Are bypsassing the forum rules.	Posted - 2007.05.08 17:43:00 - [97] BoB using their money and metagaming to ruin the game for everyone else. We can thank BoB or should I say BoD. At least they get to cheat and call it legit in the face of all of EVE. And everyone thinks the Alliance is good and for the improvement of EVE? WTF ever. This clearly shows that BOB will do whatever they can to win. They have had Devs help them, they exploit every possible shady game mechanic and call it kosher. Now what do they do. They get some ships that cant be stopped, and flat out rub it in our faces that they can do what they want and we are helpless to stop them. ôhah hah ha EVE community. The Joke is on you we will break the rules and BLAME YOU. Hah ha ha pathetic players of EVE.ö That is BoB. Call them your God if you want. I will not. Who cares, BoB will get their way until they are gone or someone else manages to upstage their acts of Evil. Who cares, i sure dont
Dukath Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.08 18:03:00 - [98] Edited by: Dukath on 08/05/2007 18:00:52 Originally by: Alts Are BoB using their money and metagaming to ruin the game for everyone else. We can thank BoB or should I say BoD. At least they get to cheat and call it legit in the face of all of EVE. And everyone thinks the Alliance is good and for the improvement of EVE? WTF ever. This clearly shows that BOB will do whatever they can to win. They have had Devs help them, they exploit every possible shady game mechanic and call it kosher. Now what do they do. They get some ships that cant be stopped, and flat out rub it in our faces that they can do what they want and we are helpless to stop them. ôhah hah ha EVE community. The Joke is on you we will break the rules and BLAME YOU. Hah ha ha pathetic players of EVE.ö That is BoB. Call them your God if you want. I will not. Who cares, BoB will get their way until they are gone or someone else manages to upstage their acts of Evil. Anyone who thinks this is about winning is an idiot. I have been pos bowling a bit the last days and the only reason is pure boredom. So what do you do while being on standby for a dreadfleet that is killing yet another pos spam? Sit and wait or have some fun, make a bet with your alliance mates and try to win the bet by bumping out more ships than them. Maybe if the coalition would actually mount a defense once in a while we woudln't have to keep ourselves busy this way. Does anyone really believe that bumping and killing a cruiser has any effect at all on the war? The problem here is not capitals bumping stuff, the problem is the pos wars. It is far too easy to anchor a pos right now. Territory is not defended anymore, people just spam more and more poses to keep sovereignity. first remove POS from market and add blueprints for them. Get mineral cost to be about the same as the buy cost right now. Build time should be around a week for a large tower. Then make anchoring more difficult. When you anchor a tower you need to stay within 10km of the tower while it is being anchored. If you get killed the anchoring is pauzed and someone else in your corporation can continue the anchoring. This will prevent a single person from spamming a while system in 30 minutes. Finally make towers harder to kill. Give the guns a better AI, no more constant cycling where the guns become ineffective as soon as there are 20 people. Make the guns focus fire for 1 to 2 minutes, then compare the hitpoints of the target and if they haven't lowered significantly switch target. Basically go from easy and many poses to very few poses that really count.
Moonlight Express Amarr Moonlight Express Inc.	Posted - 2007.05.08 18:08:00 - [99] Originally by: Alts Are BoB using their money and metagaming to ruin the game for everyone else. We can thank BoB or should I say BoD. At least they get to cheat and call it legit in the face of all of EVE. And everyone thinks the Alliance is good and for the improvement of EVE? WTF ever. This clearly shows that BOB will do whatever they can to win. They have had Devs help them, they exploit every possible shady game mechanic and call it kosher. Now what do they do. They get some ships that cant be stopped, and flat out rub it in our faces that they can do what they want and we are helpless to stop them. ôhah hah ha EVE community. The Joke is on you we will break the rules and BLAME YOU. Hah ha ha pathetic players of EVE.ö That is BoB. Call them your God if you want. I will not. Who cares, BoB will get their way until they are gone or someone else manages to upstage their acts of Evil. Listen up. Let me explain it to you in small words so that your tiny brain can understand. IT WAS NOT BOB THAT CAME UP WITH THIS TACTIC. Just like it was not BoB that invented log on traps or logoffski or POS spamming.
Grim Faust Kinetic Vector Freelancer Alliance	Posted - 2007.05.08 18:45:00 - [100] Originally by: Dukath Anyone who thinks this is about winning is an idiot. I have been pos bowling a bit the last days and the only reason is pure boredom. So what do you do while being on standby for a dreadfleet that is killing yet another pos spam? Sit and wait or have some fun, make a bet with your alliance mates and try to win the bet by bumping out more ships than them. Maybe if the coalition would actually mount a defense once in a while we woudln't have to keep ourselves busy this way. Does anyone really believe that bumping and killing a cruiser has any effect at all on the war? The problem here is not capitals bumping stuff, the problem is the pos wars. It is far too easy to anchor a pos right now. Territory is not defended anymore, people just spam more and more poses to keep sovereignity. first remove POS from market and add blueprints for them. Get mineral cost to be about the same as the buy cost right now. Build time should be around a week for a large tower. Then make anchoring more difficult. When you anchor a tower you need to stay within 10km of the tower while it is being anchored. If you get killed the anchoring is pauzed and someone else in your corporation can continue the anchoring. This will prevent a single person from spamming a while system in 30 minutes. Finally make towers harder to kill. Give the guns a better AI, no more constant cycling where the guns become ineffective as soon as there are 20 people. Make the guns focus fire for 1 to 2 minutes, then compare the hitpoints of the target and if they haven't lowered significantly switch target. Basically go from easy and many poses to very few poses that really count. How does your solution stop people from POS bowling? It doesn't actually, you just kinda went off on a tangent trying to blame some other reason for why people are angry. The fact of it is that you've boasted that you make a game of it with other pilots to get past POS shields at ships you otherwise shouldn't be able to touch. It doesn't matter how much fun you're having or how light-hearted you make what you're doing out to be. Anyone that POS bowls is exploiting the primary aspect of shields, to keep people out. Not only are POS bowlers getting in, they're also causing loss of property where it otherwise should not have been lost. That's the problem. It's not about arrays and where people park ships. It's not about scanners and people cluttering up your scan results, it's not about the lag these ships cause. It's about people doing something they shouldn't be able to do. Sure, go ahead and do it if GM's say it's ok. It still doesn't change the fact that it's an incredibly poor taste in sportsmanship. __________________________________________________ I survived CCP eating all my sigs and all I got was a crappy colorful moderator message...
Alts Are bypsassing the forum rules.	Posted - 2007.05.08 19:21:00 - [101] Edited by: Alts Are on 08/05/2007 19:18:36 Originally by: Dukath Edited by: Dukath on 08/05/2007 18:00:52 Originally by: Alts Are BoB using their money and metagaming to ruin the game for everyone else. We can thank BoB or should I say BoD. At least they get to cheat and call it legit in the face of all of EVE. And everyone thinks the Alliance is good and for the improvement of EVE? WTF ever. This clearly shows that BOB will do whatever they can to win. They have had Devs help them, they exploit every possible shady game mechanic and call it kosher. Now what do they do. They get some ships that cant be stopped, and flat out rub it in our faces that they can do what they want and we are helpless to stop them. ôhah hah ha EVE community. The Joke is on you we will break the rules and BLAME YOU. Hah ha ha pathetic players of EVE.ö That is BoB. Call them your God if you want. I will not. Who cares, BoB will get their way until they are gone or someone else manages to upstage their acts of Evil. Anyone who thinks this is about winning is an idiot. I have been pos bowling a bit the last days and the only reason is pure boredom. So what do you do while being on standby for a dreadfleet that is killing yet another pos spam? Sit and wait or have some fun, make a bet with your alliance mates and try to win the bet by bumping out more ships than them. Maybe if the coalition would actually mount a defense once in a while we woudln't have to keep ourselves busy this way. Does anyone really believe that bumping and killing a cruiser has any effect at all on the war? The problem here is not capitals bumping stuff, the problem is the pos wars. It is far too easy to anchor a pos right now. Territory is not defended anymore, people just spam more and more poses to keep sovereignity. first remove POS from market and add blueprints for them. Get mineral cost to be about the same as the buy cost right now. Build time should be around a week for a large tower. Then make anchoring more difficult. When you anchor a tower you need to stay within 10km of the tower while it is being anchored. If you get killed the anchoring is pauzed and someone else in your corporation can continue the anchoring. This will prevent a single person from spamming a while system in 30 minutes. Finally make towers harder to kill. Give the guns a better AI, no more constant cycling where the guns become ineffective as soon as there are 20 people. Make the guns focus fire for 1 to 2 minutes, then compare the hitpoints of the target and if they haven't lowered significantly switch target. Basically go from easy and many poses to very few poses that really count. Is that all you can say? Just say blah blah blah... side step the issue of you EXPLOITING game mechanics. Originally by: Moonlight Express Listen up. Let me explain it to you in small words so that your tiny brain can understand. IT WAS NOT BOB THAT CAME UP WITH THIS TACTIC. Just like it was not BoB that invented log on traps or logoffski or POS spamming. You just need to STFU and sit down BoB pet. You were the one who Responded to an Obvious Alt. Truth = BoB using super capitals to exploit the game Everything else is spin by you to make it look like less of an issue then it really is. You worship BoB if you want to. Some people do tend to worship false Idols. Who cares, i sure dont
Moonlight Express Amarr Moonlight Express Inc.	Posted - 2007.05.08 19:31:00 - [102] Originally by: Alts Are Originally by: Moonlight Express Listen up. Let me explain it to you in small words so that your tiny brain can understand. IT WAS NOT BOB THAT CAME UP WITH THIS TACTIC. Just like it was not BoB that invented log on traps or logoffski or POS spamming. You just need to STFU and sit down BoB pet. You were the one who Responded to an Obvious Alt. Truth = BoB using super capitals to exploit the game Everything else is spin by you to make it look like less of an issue then it really is. You worship BoB if you want to. Some people do tend to worship false Idols. Waaaa, cry me a river. I hope they don't fix it, so that you can whine some more before you quit the game. And it's not ONLY BoB that's doing it. Is a matter a fact, it was AAA that invented POS bowling. You should go cry about them inventing it, just like they invented log on traps, plex farming, logoffski and every other dirty trick in the book. Oh and btw. If it upsets you, than I'm all for it. Keep up the good job BoB. You are my heroes.
xeom Exit 13 Anarchy Empire	Posted - 2007.05.08 20:01:00 - [103] POS bowling is just pure comedy. Can we get like a movie with voice overs as if tho it was a real bowling match. Or maybe even live POS bowling on bob radio! Featuring AAA/RA/Esta any all big name POS bowlers! --- "Those nuclear missiles are for domestic heating." - Scagga
Alts Are bypsassing the forum rules.	Posted - 2007.05.08 20:03:00 - [104] I didnt say they invented it. Pos Bowling has been around for a while. Just now its being done with ships that are Invulnerable to POS effects. So no matter what you put on your tower. their Super Caps can bounce around a POS all day long. You are the type of player who should just look around and see how alone you really are. BoB are actively doing this and BRAGGING about it. Seems they would have the stones to tell their pilots to not do this and try to actually be Honorable. But hey when they have Devs helping them out and stuff.. honor really doesnt apply to BoB. Cry all you wish puppet. BoB = Pure Evil Everyone else not as evil but still evil. Celebrate your slavery BoB Pets. Who cares, i sure dont
Hans Roaming Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.05.08 21:31:00 - [105] Some nice suggestions, personally I think that moving the warp dropout point to just outside the shield would be the solution unless that person has the ability to be inside the POS anyway, like standings or password. This happens with a warp bubble so the in game mechanism exists and could be adapted for warp ins to points inside a POS shield.
Tobruk Black Omega Security	Posted - 2007.05.08 22:19:00 - [106] Originally by: Gant Stryker Edited by: Exortius Amarrus on 07/05/2007 16:21:37 Speaking on game lore, it doesn't seem too terribly far-fetched to think that a ship as large as a Titan or Mothership would have the mass and shield strength to pass through the shields of a POS briefly. Is it really that ridiculous? I've seen the vids, and while i'm not sure that's what the developers intended, i don't feel like i'm watching anything too crazy. But hey, that's just me. And instantaneous deceleration will do no damage to the ramming ship.... I have no problem with POS bowling if the ball comes up with appropriate sized knicks in it. the fact that your speculating on weather an imaginary space object (titan) could pass through an imaginary force field (shield) neither of which the composition is known and then further speculate that it would be reasonable only if it were "briefly" makes me think that yes, it is really that ridiculous. i would base your argument instead on features. Bottom line: pos shields were not intended to be breached, titan blowing breaches pos shields. there is one of two fixes as i see it. 1) it is made an exploit (most reasonable solution) or 2) more than one person can use a ship maint array at once and ships can keep ammo in cargo. further, what would you have the game to if the rammer wasnt "massive enough" or had enough "sheild power" (whatever sheild power is)? would it explode? ---------------------------------------------- [gold]Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed level of truth-HornFrog (mods@ccpga
ED 209 Old Detroit Crime Syndicate	Posted - 2007.05.08 22:27:00 - [107] Originally by: xeom POS bowling is just pure comedy. Can we get like a movie with voice overs as if tho it was a real bowling match. Or maybe even live POS bowling on bob radio! Featuring AAA/RA/Esta any all big name POS bowlers! /signed
Goberth Ludwig eXceed Inc. INVICTUS.	Posted - 2007.05.08 22:44:00 - [108] Originally by: ED 209 bob:1 cryalition:0 It's geat how their posts have gone from 'We'll own delve by June', to 'waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa ccp waaaaaaaaaaaa'. Is it just me or are the former ASCN guys posting in all the bob related threads past bitter and approaching stalker level? You mean why we dont do it with alts like you? - Gob
Ace101 Dark Knights of Deneb	Posted - 2007.05.08 23:21:00 - [109] i dont know why you are moaning about titans... i herd its possible to do it with a well placed BS
Baun 4S Corporation Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2007.05.08 23:28:00 - [110] I really don't care who is doing this, it is probably the lamest thing in the history of EVE. It seems like my internal hyperbole alarm should be going off ... but it is not. I cannot think of anything lamer than taking advantage of the relative invulnerability of super capitals in order to steal or otherwise render destructible ships that were intentionally placed in an area that cannot be accessed without being directly attacked. I also don't see how anyone can defend doing this from a "health of the game" standpoint. The only leg people have to stand on is that they won't be banned for doing this. That shouldn't be enough for some people, but sadly it is. The Enemy's Gate is Down
Shirei Minmatar Cutting Edge Incorporated	Posted - 2007.05.08 23:28:00 - [111] Originally by: Ace101 i dont know why you are moaning about titans... i herd its possible to do it with a well placed BS Immune to scrambling and webbing...
Ace101 Dark Knights of Deneb	Posted - 2007.05.08 23:29:00 - [112] Originally by: Shirei Originally by: Ace101 i dont know why you are moaning about titans... i herd its possible to do it with a well placed BS Immune to scrambling and webbing... some people live cap ships inside POS with no scrams or... POS wich dont even shoot back
Baun 4S Corporation Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2007.05.08 23:30:00 - [113] Originally by: Ace101 i dont know why you are moaning about titans... i herd its possible to do it with a well placed BS It is. Thats no better from my standpoint. The only difference is that its alot more difficult to do succesfully. Doing this with supercapitals is a riskless mindless way to steal and destroy ships that you have no business being able to touch. The Enemy's Gate is Down
dastommy79 Artic Blue Freelancer Alliance	Posted - 2007.05.08 23:31:00 - [114] Well chowdown just bumped me out of my pos in O-2. It seems to be a really lame tactic but gives these guys with oversize e-peens something to do i guese. I dont like it but ccp allows it so its fair game i think. Titans, makeing the game not fun since 2006 http://www.scoutca.com/fekesig2.jpg
turnschuh Beyond Divinity Inc	Posted - 2007.05.08 23:40:00 - [115] Instead of whining about this mechanic you have to keep in mind how utterly stupid it actually is. Noone realises that you could just let them "bowl" and you can setup a nice trap to kill the titan and a few other cap ships? By warping in a 70bil sip + few other capitals right into the hostile POS and getting bumped off a couple of 100km they put themself at a VERY high risk to get ganked. Dont like the bowl? setup a trap and kill them. Get some common sense.
xeom Exit 13 Anarchy Empire	Posted - 2007.05.08 23:57:00 - [116] Originally by: turnschuh Instead of whining about this mechanic you have to keep in mind how utterly stupid it actually is. Noone realises that you could just let them "bowl" and you can setup a nice trap to kill the titan and a few other cap ships? By warping in a 70bil sip + few other capitals right into the hostile POS and getting bumped off a couple of 100km they put themself at a VERY high risk to get ganked. Dont like the bowl? setup a trap and kill them. Get some common sense. Nah they are bumped out at insane speed and sent like 500KM into the next grid in which direction is anybodys guess so really trap isnt possible. --- "Those nuclear missiles are for domestic heating." - Scagga
Rebellion Caldari Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.08 23:57:00 - [117] Edited by: Rebellion on 08/05/2007 23:58:12 Here's a solution: Remove Warp from EVE. Seriously. Find some other way to bridge distances. Also, if you people started piloting these ships instead of leaving them at a POS, where they don't do anything anyway, we wouldn't have these issues. POS spamming is being used as a way to defend a system while being away. Instead of committing people and effort to system defense, you commit inanimate objects. I doubt that POS shields were intended to define parking lot areas. It would be rather sad to think that we've been waging a war against parking lots the whole time. Parked, unpiloted ships do not have any rights in EVE. Piloted ships getting bumped out and subsequently destroyed are a little different. However, one must question if they don't fight because they are outnumbered or if they are outnumbered because they just don't want to fight. It's a gray area, and difficult to solve IMO. Besides, bumping in general has always been a tricky topic and has become a fact of life. IMO I think this is just an issue because BoB uses it, which therefore turns it into an exploit, just like all of the things we do. The discussion about our being able to kill logoffski titans by excellent covert ops piloting, where people just stopped short of demanding that logoffski ought to be legitimately protected from BoB hunting, comes to mind. I'm sorry for being jaded, bit I'd believe the legitimacy of the complaint more if not for the recent campaign to nerf capitals so that people who don't want to commit similar effort have a chance against them. Instead of pulling us down, why don't you bring yourselves up? </rant> I believe that POS were intended to be resistant to some level of attacks while the owners were sleeping or unable to play EVE, not to be used as an excuse for the owners to just send a token force and avoid fighting. This should not even be an issue with the Coalition. Where is the audacity that led you to gather 200+ capitals on your spectacular assault on an empty shipyard? Why can't you do a fraction of that in defense of a system? Do you really hate us so much that you'd petulantly deny us a battle in the hopes that we go away in boredom? We just want to play! With trains!
Niobe Farstar Synergetic Tactics SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.05.09 00:01:00 - [118] Originally by: turnschuh Instead of whining about this mechanic you have to keep in mind how utterly stupid it actually is. Noone realises that you could just let them "bowl" and you can setup a nice trap to kill the titan and a few other cap ships? By warping in a 70bil sip + few other capitals right into the hostile POS and getting bumped off a couple of 100km they put themself at a VERY high risk to get ganked. Dont like the bowl? setup a trap and kill them. Get some common sense. With all due respect, this is a ridiculous idea. Titans can't be trapped, because they can't be scrambled. Even dictor bubbles they can clear with an officer smartbomb. They can also fire their DDs and then immediately jump to another system.
turnschuh Beyond Divinity Inc	Posted - 2007.05.09 00:03:00 - [119] Originally by: xeom Originally by: turnschuh Instead of whining about this mechanic you have to keep in mind how utterly stupid it actually is. Noone realises that you could just let them "bowl" and you can setup a nice trap to kill the titan and a few other cap ships? By warping in a 70bil sip + few other capitals right into the hostile POS and getting bumped off a couple of 100km they put themself at a VERY high risk to get ganked. Dont like the bowl? setup a trap and kill them. Get some common sense. Nah they are bumped out at insane speed and sent like 500KM into the next grid in which direction is anybodys guess so really trap isnt possible. Last time, wich has indeed been a while, I saw capital ships get bumped off they get around 200km ish away and dont leave the grid. So unless you have seen a bowl recently and live, dont state something wich is not the case.
turnschuh Beyond Divinity Inc	Posted - 2007.05.09 00:06:00 - [120] Originally by: Niobe Farstar Originally by: turnschuh Instead of whining about this mechanic you have to keep in mind how utterly stupid it actually is. Noone realises that you could just let them "bowl" and you can setup a nice trap to kill the titan and a few other cap ships? By warping in a 70bil sip + few other capitals right into the hostile POS and getting bumped off a couple of 100km they put themself at a VERY high risk to get ganked. Dont like the bowl? setup a trap and kill them. Get some common sense. With all due respect, this is a ridiculous idea. Titans can't be trapped, because they can't be scrambled. Even dictor bubbles they can clear with an officer smartbomb. They can also fire their DDs and then immediately jump to another system. bumping? dd dont kill cap ships? there are other capital ships to kill aswell? some people have way to mutch fear of titans. A propper setup trap could easly pull something like that off.
Baun 4S Corporation Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2007.05.09 00:08:00 - [121] Edited by: Baun on 09/05/2007 00:07:05 Rebellion, your entire post is just a way to qualify a ridiculously stupid and unintended game mechanic. None of what you say is an argument for its legitimacy just an apology for its stupidity and an attempt to undercut the reason people complain about it instead of addressing how completely retarded it is. There are many problems with POS warfare but none of them makes bowling an invulnerable ship the size of the POS into the POS a legitimate way to play the game. No one can stop you from doing this and the GMs have already said that they won't stop you. So, if you are going to do it just do it and be quiet about it. You don't need to be lame and simultaneously insult the intelligence of every person who plays this game by trying to qualify your lameness. This goes for everyone who does it. I don't care if they are in D2 or if they are in BoB or if they are my best and oldest friend in EVE. This tactic is wrong and it makes a mockery of the game. The Enemy's Gate is Down
Niobe Farstar Synergetic Tactics SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.05.09 00:15:00 - [122] Originally by: turnschuh bumping? dd dont kill cap ships? there are other capital ships to kill aswell? some people have way to mutch fear of titans. A propper setup trap could easly pull something like that off. DDs don't kill cap ships, but they do clear any obstruction to the Titan jumping out, therefore a Titan can't be trapped unless it's owner logs off or screws up (by not having an escape cyno ready).
turnschuh Beyond Divinity Inc	Posted - 2007.05.09 00:30:00 - [123] Originally by: Niobe Farstar Originally by: turnschuh bumping? dd dont kill cap ships? there are other capital ships to kill aswell? some people have way to mutch fear of titans. A propper setup trap could easly pull something like that off. DDs don't kill cap ships, but they do clear any obstruction to the Titan jumping out, therefore a Titan can't be trapped unless it's owner logs off or screws up (by not having an escape cyno ready). Im not arguing with you about how titans "cant be trapped" (aka "cant be killed") [2 are dead allready]. Just one note: The owner did allready screw up when doing pos "bowling". people just dont realise the opportunity they been giving.
D1ck Jones Old Detroit Crime Syndicate	Posted - 2007.05.09 00:53:00 - [124] Originally by: Goberth Ludwig Originally by: ED 209 bob:1 cryalition:0 It's geat how their posts have gone from 'We'll own delve by June', to 'waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa ccp waaaaaaaaaaaa'. Is it just me or are the former ASCN guys posting in all the bob related threads past bitter and approaching stalker level? You mean why we dont do it with alts like you? - Gob Happy now? How about you guys find a new avenue for your excuse-train. choo-choo and stuff
fugazii Deep Space Productions	Posted - 2007.05.09 04:11:00 - [125] Originally by: Shrike As a now professional bowler, i will say this. Gangwarping 20 capitals into a POS and do starbursts is, rather nice to look at. However, this is broken, totally and utterly borked. It should not be possible, but, people should also be forced to use Ship Maint arrays to park a ship. So, find us a solution where people have to use the ship array, and where we professional bowlers gets the finger. how about instead of them having to fix it you just dont do it? not because your forced to but because you know its "broken..borked" and you want to have people come fight you. called respect for your opponents, yes i know i know, respect is earned blah blah, but you also want people to fight you right? this whole war is what you wanted, if you employ tactics that are shady and broken what invasions and large fights in the future can you honestly expect? its fine that you play to win, so do i but using tactics such as this isnt the way to do it nor will ever actually alow you to win. sure your going to "win" this war thats evident to anyone who has 1 eye, but there will always be "ands"...you will never be able to just say "we won this war because we are better pvp'rs" you will only be able to say "we won this war because we are better pvp'rs and we cheated". oh ya, and fit a cloak. problem solved.
Mr Friendly That it Should Come to This	Posted - 2007.05.09 08:03:00 - [126] Originally by: Captain Thunk Because the people involved understand the rules implicitly. CAPTAIN THUNK Sir, on this issue, you are so wrong. Exploits are targeted BECAUSE lots of people end up employing them to their advantage at the expense of others'. It's not because a 'small' bug gets used to a few players advantage. In Ex., 'bowling' will get nerfed because the lost ships from this tactic cost a whole bunch and happen in an important context where those ships could have a real impact. If my Atron could make an extra 50k isk an hour because I could target an extra npc in my tutorial missions, no one would care (and really, rightly so). Most importantly though, if people understood the 'rules implicitly', we wouldn't be having as many discussions of this type. Just as 'bowling' is a funny but lame and costly exploit, so too was multiple mwds back in the day, nano-BS's, or 100's of python mines on the gate-warp-in points. How many of those exist now in the same form they did before? Think a moment WHY they don't... m'kay? I guess you could also keep ganking guys in Jita when they take 45 secs to resolve during undock... but, doesn't that also seem lame to you as well as me? Smelling an exploit basically means exploit (to me). Maybe you're different. We're all gamers here, m8. Indeed we are playing an MMO; maybe we should act like gamers playing an MMO. Other people exist, and perhaps I should think of the integrity of the game at times before I think of my goals. This is one of those issues, m8. Maybe I'm insane.
Captain Thunk Captain Morgan Society	Posted - 2007.05.09 08:16:00 - [127] Originally by: Mr Friendly Originally by: Captain Thunk Because the people involved understand the rules implicitly. CAPTAIN THUNK Sir, on this issue, you are so wrong. Exploits are targeted BECAUSE lots of people end up employing them to their advantage at the expense of others'. It's not because a 'small' bug gets used to a few players advantage. In Ex., 'bowling' will get nerfed because the lost ships from this tactic cost a whole bunch and happen in an important context where those ships could have a real impact. If my Atron could make an extra 50k isk an hour because I could target an extra npc in my tutorial missions, no one would care (and really, rightly so). Most importantly though, if people understood the 'rules implicitly', we wouldn't be having as many discussions of this type. Just as 'bowling' is a funny but lame and costly exploit, so too was multiple mwds back in the day, nano-BS's, or 100's of python mines on the gate-warp-in points. How many of those exist now in the same form they did before? Think a moment WHY they don't... m'kay? I guess you could also keep ganking guys in Jita when they take 45 secs to resolve during undock... but, doesn't that also seem lame to you as well as me? Smelling an exploit basically means exploit (to me). Maybe you're different. We're all gamers here, m8. Indeed we are playing an MMO; maybe we should act like gamers playing an MMO. Other people exist, and perhaps I should think of the integrity of the game at times before I think of my goals. This is one of those issues, m8. Maybe I'm insane. If you've quite finished... I was referring to the rules that bind CCP and GMs not game mechanics and rules. If you know you cannot be banned for it because the GMs are in no position to declare it an exploit then you have nothing to fear in doing it if you're of a mindset to push such things. As I said, there is no way for a GM looking at a petition of an event that's passed to determine if the ship was bounced out of the forcefield or if it was moved by a more legitimate mechanism. This is what I meant - the actual definition of 'exploit' has nothing to do with what occurs ingame, because if there is no litmus test to determine if the 'exploit' was used then the GMs have absolutely no choice but to declare it legitimate and hope that it doesn't become public knowledge while the devs get to work fixing it. In this case, if GMs made it an official exploit they'd have to return many ships lost around POSs and give players the benefit of the doubt as there are no server logs for when bowling occurs. Passive targetting...bowling...it's a continuous trend, something else will no doubt replace bowling once it's been fixed. I concurr absolutely with your opinion on the game, but many don't - they will and do anything to "win" - the integrity of the game means nothing to them. CAPTAIN THUNK See this hook? variable speed and five alternate attatchments baby.
Mr Friendly That it Should Come to This	Posted - 2007.05.09 09:37:00 - [128] Edited by: Mr Friendly on 09/05/2007 09:38:45 Originally by: Captain Thunk If you've quite finished... I was referring to the rules that bind CCP and GMs not game mechanics and rules. If you know you cannot be banned for it because the GMs are in no position to declare it an exploit then you have nothing to fear in doing it if you're of a mindset to push such things. As I said, there is no way for a GM looking at a petition of an event that's passed to determine if the ship was bounced out of the forcefield or if it was moved by a more legitimate mechanism. This is what I meant - the actual definition of 'exploit' has nothing to do with what occurs ingame, because if there is no litmus test to determine if the 'exploit' was used then the GMs have absolutely no choice but to declare it legitimate and hope that it doesn't become public knowledge while the devs get to work fixing it. In this case, if GMs made it an official exploit they'd have to return many ships lost around POSs and give players the benefit of the doubt as there are no server logs for when bowling occurs. Passive targetting...bowling...it's a continuous trend, something else will no doubt replace bowling once it's been fixed. I concurr absolutely with your opinion on the game, but many don't - they will and do anything to "win" - the integrity of the game means nothing to them. CAPTAIN THUNK hehe, I haven't quite finished ;P In part, my ire arises because GM's haven't been consistent on this issue (and prob won't be 100% consistent). Even the patch notes obliquely mention this. Yet the problem remains. Further, we have seen no consistemt CCP reponse to this. Frankly, I'd expect a 'yay or nay' post on CCp's part until they can adress this in an official patch. Something like, 'okay, this is stupid, but it's okay till we can correct it' or 'crap no, you'll all be banzorred if we see it' . After all, it's not chicken scatch that's being ping-ponged out of POS's. I agree with you about the 'rules and regs that bind' bit... but how does anyone know about this sort of thing unless people talk about it? Further, how do problems get fixed, unless people SQUACK about them? That's MY point. In MMO's, that's your 'litmus test'... forum *****ing VS in-game rules. Right now, on this issue, it's out of wack. Anyways, cheers.
Captain Thunk Captain Morgan Society	Posted - 2007.05.09 09:59:00 - [129] Obviously we can only speculate on the GM inconsistency, my take would be something along the lines of: GM > Well, obviously this isn't meant to happen and these people are obviously exploiting it to the max for their own advantage Senior GM > Yep. But there's jack all we can do about it, devs are working on the problem their end but it's extremely complex for them to fix and if rushed could lead to more problems. We'll rule that it's legitimate as we can't stop them doing it - these are high up members of the community, hopefully they won't shaft the game for us and stop. There does appear to be some slight policy change, again I'm just speculating here. I remember when people could leave the local channel at will through an accidental bug, it was fixed promptly but as there was no way to see if people were exploiting the bug it was ruled legitimate until the patch. Difference was that each and every forum thread that mentioned it was deleted to try and contain knowledge of the legitimate exploit - as a result many were unaware of it and so lost ships in low sec and 0.0 which of course couldn't be petitioned for back. I think it's fair to say CCP doesn't discuss it's policys and decision making processes precisely because they don't want people to exploit their own rules against them. I think CCP would be better off sucking half these alliances into a great big black hole deleting their characters and assets in the process. The game would be much better for it. I'm sure Amarrian astromers using a powerful telescope focussed onto the heart of the black hole would find the goatse picture or something as the legacy they left behind. CAPTAIN THUNK See this hook? variable speed and five alternate attatchments baby.
Necronomicon Caldari KIA Corp KIA Alliance	Posted - 2007.05.09 11:22:00 - [130] Originally by: Baun I really don't care who is doing this, it is probably the lamest thing in the history of EVE. It seems like my internal hyperbole alarm should be going off ... but it is not. I cannot think of anything lamer than taking advantage of the relative invulnerability of super capitals in order to steal or otherwise render destructible ships that were intentionally placed in an area that cannot be accessed without being directly attacked. I also don't see how anyone can defend doing this from a "health of the game" standpoint. The only leg people have to stand on is that they won't be banned for doing this. That shouldn't be enough for some people, but sadly it is. I dunno, those muppets who set off that Shuttle bomb in Jita were pretty fuggin retarded. Carlsberg dont make Eve Pilots, but if they did, i wouldnt be one of them.
Voculus E X O D U S Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2007.05.09 11:33:00 - [131] Quote: Also, if you people started piloting these ships instead of leaving them at a POS, where they don't do anything anyway, we wouldn't have these issues. "These issues" are caused by your alliance, which is infamous for cheating and exploiting. Don't blame the rest of Eve in an attempt to cover for the completely lame way in which you and your Titan pilots play the game. _________________________________________________________
Kruzenshtern Aeria Gloris Inc United Legion	Posted - 2007.05.09 12:27:00 - [132] We had some ships stolen by Chowdown and his cheater crew that way from our alliance, and I had a long entertaining petition-based chat with GMs about it, which was concluded by the confirmation that indeed this is not an exploit. The wording of conclusion, even though I cannot disclose it for obvious reasons, left no doubt that the current state of thought in CCP does not consider creating game-designer sanctioned and directed cheating to be a problem, in fact (this is a projection of mine, not based on any specific words from above) we can safely assume more of those are coming our way. This, combined with the lack of realization that involving game developers heavily in the gameplay without balancing their involvement between various sides of the game has visibly skewed the developers' understanding and feeling of direction, is manifesting itself in such things as the current POS warfare modification proposal. Good luck sawing that branch you sit on. P.S. No, you can't have our stuff.
Massao Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.09 12:54:00 - [133] Originally by: Kruzenshtern P.S. No, you can't have our stuff. Quite obviously, seeing as we've already stolen it.
Gyro DuAquin1 Tri Optimum Ev0ke	Posted - 2007.05.09 13:08:00 - [134] Originally by: Massao Originally by: Kruzenshtern P.S. No, you can't have our stuff. Quite obviously, seeing as we've already stolen it. See thats the problem with the whole GIANT WAR thing. Missing respect, Shrike points out that its broken but he and his SuperCaps do it, to win. Not using anything you coulde have used (metagaming/exploting/Spying) is not a sign of being weak, but a sign that its still a game where anyone should have fun, probally for some ppl wining=fun notWininf!=notfun. Anyhow Bob doenst care what other think of them, but when they realy love the game, what some pretend i dont get why you always use such rotten tricks. U know how good you are, most of the other entieties cant stand you even when not using all of that stuff u used to do.
Captain Thunk Captain Morgan Society	Posted - 2007.05.09 13:08:00 - [135] Originally by: Massao Originally by: Kruzenshtern P.S. No, you can't have our stuff. Quite obviously, seeing as we've already stolen it. Lolz, that's the spirit. hey, can you guys put those sigs back...you know...the ones that said "hey guys we cheat and there's nothing you can do about it" or something. I found them really funny. Nearly as funny as that guy at ccp who was caught cheating and changed his personal page to "get a clue" when said clue had just been delivered in sql db format, something he's qualified to read. All this 0.0 stuff sounds really fantastic and fun, one day I may send an alt to go look. CAPTAIN THUNK See this hook? variable speed and five alternate attatchments baby.
Plim Gallente Celestial Apocalypse Insurgency	Posted - 2007.05.09 15:09:00 - [136] Originally by: Massao Originally by: Kruzenshtern P.S. No, you can't have our stuff. Quite obviously, seeing as we've already stolen it. "Better to keep your mouth closed and be thought a fool than to open it and remove all doubt". That quote sums up why BoB members should still stfu on the forum. You never seem to quite understand that you don't do your rep any good with this idiotic stuff. ----------------- OMG! SiGnAtUrE gO mEnTaLz
Exortius Amarrus The Clearwater Society Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.05.09 15:25:00 - [137] Originally by: Tobruk Originally by: Gant Stryker Edited by: Exortius Amarrus on 07/05/2007 16:21:37 Speaking on game lore, it doesn't seem too terribly far-fetched to think that a ship as large as a Titan or Mothership would have the mass and shield strength to pass through the shields of a POS briefly. Is it really that ridiculous? I've seen the vids, and while i'm not sure that's what the developers intended, i don't feel like i'm watching anything too crazy. But hey, that's just me. And instantaneous deceleration will do no damage to the ramming ship.... I have no problem with POS bowling if the ball comes up with appropriate sized knicks in it. the fact that your speculating on weather an imaginary space object (titan) could pass through an imaginary force field (shield) neither of which the composition is known and then further speculate that it would be reasonable only if it were "briefly" makes me think that yes, it is really that ridiculous. i would base your argument instead on features. Bottom line: pos shields were not intended to be breached, titan blowing breaches pos shields. there is one of two fixes as i see it. 1) it is made an exploit (most reasonable solution) or 2) more than one person can use a ship maint array at once and ships can keep ammo in cargo. further, what would you have the game to if the rammer wasnt "massive enough" or had enough "sheild power" (whatever sheild power is)? would it explode? We're discussing a space ship on the internet, what part of this isn't ridiculous? I'm not a developer nor do i know the first thing about game design, thus pointed questions about "what i would have the game do" are really pointless. I simply can't envision a ship the size of a Titan coming out at high speed and just bouncing off the shields of a small POS. That would probably be the only thing funnier then this POS bowling. Cheers ------------------------
Speed Burnout GIT-R-DUN Southern Connection	Posted - 2007.05.09 15:31:00 - [138] I used to run a game server. Part of my website for the game server was a page full of server rules. It clearly spelled out what would get you banned. From time to time people would find ways around the rules or new exploits. I would then update the server rules to fix the new problems. I think that it would be nice if CCP would host a server rules page. This way we would all know what is not allowed and there would be less petitions. -------------------------------------------- We've secretly replaced their dilithium crystals with new Folgers crystals. Now let's watch them go to warp!
Saladin Minmatar Eternity INC. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.05.09 15:46:00 - [139] Edited by: Saladin on 09/05/2007 15:43:45 To be honest this belongs in the Starbase thread, not the CAOD forums. What is happening with this issue is people are exploiting the mechanic CCP uses to keep people out of a bubble to bump static ships out as well. The whiners saying fit a ship maintenance array... I am sorry it does not have infinite space. The risk here is that ships out in the pos bubble can be stolen by corp mates or people with the password, or when the pos destroyed. They should not be at risk from someone stupidly bouncing against a POS when he knows he cannot get entry. Its like having a door to your house that bounces a theif around inside, allowing him to knock something out of the house before being ejected himself. Anyone to undertakes this kind of activity is a human pig in need of electro-shock therapy. Just like the people who shoot cans or light smartbombs to engage an aggro timer. ----
Fubarski Caldari Centauri Project	Posted - 2007.05.09 15:53:00 - [140] Originally by: Exortius Amarrus We're discussing a space ship on the internet, what part of this isn't ridiculous? I'm not a developer nor do i know the first thing about game design, thus pointed questions about "what i would have the game do" are really pointless. I simply can't envision a ship the size of a Titan coming out at high speed and just bouncing off the shields of a small POS. That would probably be the only thing funnier then this POS bowling. You should watch high speed barrier impact tests then. It displays pretty much what SHOULD happen when, say, a tractor-trailer at 70mph... hits a moderately reinforced barricade. Then think envision it again. And if CCP does something like that, they should just implement it with zero warning, and zero notification. It's ridiculous. Everyone knows it's ridiculous. Even the ones doing it know it is. Yet they still abuse it to gain an edge. Glad to see the true colors of a large entity that touts itself as having been built on "honor" and "skill". Fubar
Karosiak	Posted - 2007.05.09 15:55:00 - [141] Originally by: Fubarski Glad to see the true colors of a large entity that touts itself as having been built on "honor" and "skill". ??? I don't think RA built themselves on honor and skill tbh.
Morris Falter The Collective Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2007.05.09 16:34:00 - [142] Originally by: Saladin Edited by: Saladin on 09/05/2007 15:43:45 To be honest this belongs in the Starbase thread, not the CAOD forums. What is happening with this issue is people are exploiting the mechanic CCP uses to keep people out of a bubble to bump static ships out as well. The whiners saying fit a ship maintenance array... I am sorry it does not have infinite space. The risk here is that ships out in the pos bubble can be stolen by corp mates or people with the password, or when the pos destroyed. They should not be at risk from someone stupidly bouncing against a POS when he knows he cannot get entry. Its like having a door to your house that bounces a theif around inside, allowing him to knock something out of the house before being ejected himself. Anyone to undertakes this kind of activity is a human pig in need of electro-shock therapy. Just like the people who shoot cans or light smartbombs to engage an aggro timer. How interesting. Is this MC official position regarding your current "employers"?
xeom Exit 13 Anarchy Empire	Posted - 2007.05.09 16:45:00 - [143] Originally by: turnschuh Originally by: xeom Originally by: turnschuh Instead of whining about this mechanic you have to keep in mind how utterly stupid it actually is. Noone realises that you could just let them "bowl" and you can setup a nice trap to kill the titan and a few other cap ships? By warping in a 70bil sip + few other capitals right into the hostile POS and getting bumped off a couple of 100km they put themself at a VERY high risk to get ganked. Dont like the bowl? setup a trap and kill them. Get some common sense. Nah they are bumped out at insane speed and sent like 500KM into the next grid in which direction is anybodys guess so really trap isnt possible. Last time, wich has indeed been a while, I saw capital ships get bumped off they get around 200km ish away and dont leave the grid. So unless you have seen a bowl recently and live, dont state something wich is not the case. Watch the video bro the avatar leaves the grid and the 2nd minmatar one is almost out of the grid by the time the fraps ends. --- "Those nuclear missiles are for domestic heating." - Scagga
Parallax Error Amarr Imperial Dreams Curatores Veritatis Alliance	Posted - 2007.05.09 17:12:00 - [144] The thing that gets me, is the CCP decision that this is not an exploit. If the forcefield from a POS is not supposed to stop enemy ships from moving through it (as has been claimed) then why can't I MWD into a hostile POS bubble with an interceptor and orbit it at 5km? Blatantly the current CCP line on this issue, that its not an exploit because POS bubbles are only supposed to stop people locking targets inside the bubble is stupidity. Why would the POS bounce off smaller ships if that were the case?
Popsikle Shadows of the Dead Aftermath Alliance	Posted - 2007.05.09 17:23:00 - [145] Originally by: fugazii Originally by: Shrike As a now professional bowler, i will say this. Gangwarping 20 capitals into a POS and do starbursts is, rather nice to look at. However, this is broken, totally and utterly borked. It should not be possible, but, people should also be forced to use Ship Maint arrays to park a ship. So, find us a solution where people have to use the ship array, and where we professional bowlers gets the finger. how about instead of them having to fix it you just dont do it? not because your forced to but because you know its "broken..borked" and you want to have people come fight you. called respect for your opponents, yes i know i know, respect is earned blah blah, but you also want people to fight you right? this whole war is what you wanted, if you employ tactics that are shady and broken what invasions and large fights in the future can you honestly expect? its fine that you play to win, so do i but using tactics such as this isnt the way to do it nor will ever actually alow you to win. sure your going to "win" this war thats evident to anyone who has 1 eye, but there will always be "ands"...you will never be able to just say "we won this war because we are better pvp'rs" you will only be able to say "we won this war because we are better pvp'rs and we cheated". oh ya, and fit a cloak. problem solved. IF one side stopped, the other may not, giving the other side an advantage. You cant just tell one half of a war to stop doing things because you happen to be on the other side ;( __________________________________________
Kruzenshtern Aeria Gloris Inc United Legion	Posted - 2007.05.09 19:20:00 - [146] Edited by: Kruzenshtern on 09/05/2007 19:16:25 Originally by: Gyro DuAquin1 Originally by: Massao Originally by: Kruzenshtern P.S. No, you can't have our stuff. Quite obviously, seeing as we've already stolen it. See thats the problem with the whole GIANT WAR thing. Missing respect, Shrike points out that its broken but he and his SuperCaps do it, to win. Not using anything you coulde have used (metagaming/exploting/Spying) is not a sign of being weak, but a sign that its still a game where anyone should have fun, probally for some ppl wining=fun notWininf!=notfun. With all due respect, Gyro, they are not doing these things to win. They do it for the sheer fun of illustrating that they are immune to CCP overseeing process, and to **** off opponents (also to be able to make smartass remarks on the forums, of course). It's like kleptomania - the kleptomaniac doesn't really NEED the things he steals, just can't resist the urge. And CCP ignore this out of some weird suicidal desire to destroy at the very core the game they make all the motions to evolve. Rot at the core spreads outward. EDIT: spelling
MrLobster Cosmic Odyssey YouWhat	Posted - 2007.05.09 21:40:00 - [147] Yes i havent read all the posts, but... how hard would it be to just have the ship come out of warp outside the bubble? Warp bubbles on gates can do it. __________________________ My sig changes once work gets boring... yes it was a slow day today.
Rebellion Caldari Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.09 23:12:00 - [148] You know, I think some of you are too dense to realize that maybe this is being done for 2 reasons: 1. It's allowed. 2. To illustrate that it's broken. But hey, don't let me stop you heroes from your exposition of BoB-hate. We're used to it anyway, and it motivates us to present you with oodles and oodles of misery. To even think that the bumping of the ships inside a POS factors in any way to the success or failure of system defense is naive. Those POS are already lost because no one defends them. Don't you koalas have a titan too? Why not bowl our POS for a change. I promise that we won't whine. We'd even welcome your titan into our systems with open arms and a 21 gun salute. This entire thing has even secret benefits for you because you won't have to post loss mails for ships bowled into oblivion and won't have to close down your killboards to the public. My advice to you: ACTIVATE PETITION GENERATORS When CCP fixes it or stops saying that it's legit, we will stop. This is CCP's game and they make the rules. So just fire off the petitions and actually fight for a change, instead of planting POS and parking ships while you run off and despair as to why everything is falling apart. Parking lots have no business being in EVE, and we will destroy them all. Now, please resume in your exposition of BoB-hate.
Righteous Fury Slacker Industries Exuro Mortis	Posted - 2007.05.09 23:30:00 - [149] I find it amusing that a number of people have been throwing around the idea of 'respect' as a reason for not doing this. Please do tell me, exactly when has anyone in the coalition EVER treated anyone in BoB with the respect you demand in return from them? Every discussion regarding anything remotely related to BoB is turned into an utter **fest with everyone and their half-****** sister screaming devs, hax, and exploits. It's absolutely no wonder its being done to you, not only is it hilarious, its working brilliantly to irritate you.
Bozl1n Caldari Shiva Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2007.05.10 07:21:00 - [150] Originally by: Fred0 As much as it hurts. RF and Shrike are the ones I agree with here. Yea me2, its not often you can say that is it. Somethings wrong, very wrong Sig returned after a victory with the appeal \o/ ;)~
fugazii Deep Space Productions	Posted - 2007.05.10 08:14:00 - [151] Originally by: Popsikle Originally by: fugazii Originally by: Shrike As a now professional bowler, i will say this. Gangwarping 20 capitals into a POS and do starbursts is, rather nice to look at. However, this is broken, totally and utterly borked. It should not be possible, but, people should also be forced to use Ship Maint arrays to park a ship. So, find us a solution where people have to use the ship array, and where we professional bowlers gets the finger. how about instead of them having to fix it you just dont do it? not because your forced to but because you know its "broken..borked" and you want to have people come fight you. called respect for your opponents, yes i know i know, respect is earned blah blah, but you also want people to fight you right? this whole war is what you wanted, if you employ tactics that are shady and broken what invasions and large fights in the future can you honestly expect? its fine that you play to win, so do i but using tactics such as this isnt the way to do it nor will ever actually alow you to win. sure your going to "win" this war thats evident to anyone who has 1 eye, but there will always be "ands"...you will never be able to just say "we won this war because we are better pvp'rs" you will only be able to say "we won this war because we are better pvp'rs and we cheated". oh ya, and fit a cloak. problem solved. IF one side stopped, the other may not, giving the other side an advantage. You cant just tell one half of a war to stop doing things because you happen to be on the other side ;( you are 100% correct..on 1 part. one side may not stop, but there is only 1 way to find out if they would or wouldnt, and that is for you to stop and see. there would be no advantage givin to the other side to try, because after all its not like pos bowling is going on on shifts 23 hrs a day. and no, im not on either side and i dont want 1 side to stop, i want both sides to stop. pos warfare is bad enough, this just makes it even worse. whether ccp says its cheating or not doesnt matter. if there wasnt a law against murdering people it wouldnt make going out and stabbing the first person you see a right thing to do, would it?
Happster Polaris Project	Posted - 2007.05.10 08:43:00 - [152] Read somewhere in this long tread about BOB using two Titans to push out fleet inside a POS to snipe them... My first thought about it was. Why not use DD, and kill all the ships in one go? Bowl and DD...nice mix.
Splagada Minmatar Tides of Silence Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2007.05.14 15:51:00 - [153] select all in array, launch i did that once and it makes quite some bowling :p ------
Dianabolic Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.14 15:59:00 - [154] Originally by: Farham Quote: All you need to know is a bob carrier was killed. How it was done, is down to the ppl fighting on the frontlines to know. I will take that as a yes. If you look at the context of this thread you know why the question is rather pertinent. Not really, Farham. They do it, we do it, I dont' think anyone knows who started it first, nor do we care, it's part of the game as we accept it, or until it gets changed. It brings another dimension to sitting in a pos, no longer can you do so afk with impunity... and thank god for that. What we found most amusing is that the carrier died, quite literally, 1s before dt. Never before have I seen a kill come quite so close. Reikoku Diplomatic Forums
Farham AWE Corporation Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2007.05.14 16:06:00 - [155] I wasn't trying to rub the incident in anyone's face. The fact it happened this morning proves that all sides do it but I will still poke back and say anything that happens as a result of bad coding can't ever be a good thing for the game. I am also a full believer in the idea that if you kick my rear end straight up, more power to you. I just seriously dislike "cheesy" ways of taking a beating.
Karim alRashid Gallente Igneus Auctorita GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.05.14 16:25:00 - [156] Originally by: Farham The fact it happened this morning proves that all sides do it I have the impression that one side had the ethics to not do it untill it was declared legal. Am I wrong?
Dianabolic Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.14 16:26:00 - [157] Originally by: Farham I wasn't trying to rub the incident in anyone's face. The fact it happened this morning proves that all sides do it but I will still poke back and say anything that happens as a result of bad coding can't ever be a good thing for the game. I am also a full believer in the idea that if you kick my rear end straight up, more power to you. I just seriously dislike "cheesy" ways of taking a beating. Sure, it's a vicious circle, bad implementation of even good ideas ultimately leads to bad gameplay, no one does (nor can, or should) dispute that... which is all great to say in the development forums, but this is caod, so suuuuuuuuuuure you weren't trying to rub it in anyones face... ;) We managed to get a carrier that cyno'd in to even the score a little bit and, as I said above, POS have been the lamer and smacktalkers heaven for far too long now, it's funny to see one broken mechanic giving us the ability to counter another (imo) broken mechanic. - + - = + and all that :D Reikoku Diplomatic Forums
Dianabolic Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.14 16:27:00 - [158] Originally by: Karim alRashid Originally by: Farham The fact it happened this morning proves that all sides do it I have the impression that one side had the ethics to not do it untill it was declared legal. Am I wrong? That's right, we didn't do it until the gms' said it was legal, thanks for noting it. Reikoku Diplomatic Forums
Karim alRashid Gallente Igneus Auctorita GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.05.14 16:35:00 - [159] Originally by: Dianabolic Originally by: Karim alRashid Originally by: Farham The fact it happened this morning proves that all sides do it I have the impression that one side had the ethics to not do it untill it was declared legal. Am I wrong? That's right, we didn't do it until the gms' said it was legal, thanks for noting it. Thank you. Do we have opinions from the other side ?
Ozzie Asrail Exploited	Posted - 2007.05.14 16:45:00 - [160] Please be respectful to other players - Kreul Intentions ([email protected]) -----
Gallente Caliente Anti-BoB Flash Mob	Posted - 2007.05.14 18:10:00 - [161] Originally by: Dianabolic Originally by: Karim alRashid Originally by: Farham The fact it happened this morning proves that all sides do it I have the impression that one side had the ethics to not do it untill it was declared legal. Am I wrong? That's right, we didn't do it until the gms' said it was legal, thanks for noting it. Lies. ----------------------------------------------- www.nobob.info
Avon Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.14 19:48:00 - [162] Originally by: Gallente Caliente Originally by: Dianabolic Originally by: Karim alRashid Originally by: Farham The fact it happened this morning proves that all sides do it I have the impression that one side had the ethics to not do it untill it was declared legal. Am I wrong? That's right, we didn't do it until the gms' said it was legal, thanks for noting it. Lies. Let's put it a slightly different way. We didn't do it whilst we thought it wasn't legal. You can accuse me of also being a liar if you wish, but it does nothing to discredit the validity of my statement. Wild finger pointing and stomping of feet, whilst certainly attention grabbing, a reasoned arguement does not make. If you want to shout about GM bias, and other such nonsense, I positively encourage you to do so. Maybe we could compare notes between the information given to Shrike, and that given to Evil Thug. One of those two was told that everything is cool, and they can bowl away to their hearts content. Clear proof that CCP favour one side over the other, right? Also, let me clear up your poor use of rhetoric while I am here. An accusation of "lies" would require you to have proof that the contrary position is true. What you actually mean is "I don't believe you", which is more a statement of your ignorance, and thus far more accurate. If you want to waste your time trolling on the forums, a small amount of effort may actually bring you more success, and may give you a greater feeling of accomplishment. You can thank me later. The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
Elspeth Vigneron Caldari Phoenix Logistics Industries	Posted - 2007.05.14 19:53:00 - [163] Originally by: Fubarski Originally by: Grimster Last time I checked you could anchor more than 1 ship maint array - did they change that? I think titans should just ignore passords, force fields, and the like anyway. Let em dock with the station! Hey, we could do this with ALL the capital ships, it'd be even better gameplay. In fact, I think once you're inside the shield bubble, even if you're hostile, any guns should stop firing at you. Hell, you got in, right? You must be allowed. Oooh, and Titans and supercaps should have a T1 module that raises a HUUUUUUGE frickin flag on it, and makes a permanent monument in a system that says "Mine". It'll establish Sov, until it's destroyed. Give the flag... err, monument 99.99% (99.999 would have been too much, I did the math) resists to all, and somewhere along the lines of 8 million shield, 8 million armor, and 8 million structure points. Hey, we can make the flag racially marked by the race of ship it pops from, thereby setting sov for not only your alliance, but also earning you points, and fabulous prizes from empire factions! There. One patch, everything will be fixed. Won't have to deal with the slow spiral into mediocrity, won't have to deal with having any semblance of hope, that maybe, somewhere, someone will fix something... just have to reach over, and hit "cancel subscription" and go watch a sunrise. Fubarski You win this thread. Phoenix Logistics Industries
Evil Thug Rage and Terror Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2007.05.14 20:12:00 - [164] Bumping is fun
Xarax Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.14 20:20:00 - [165] Originally by: Evil Thug Bumping is fun LIES!!!!! Only BoB pilots use the unethical technique!!!! _______
Gallente Caliente Anti-BoB Flash Mob	Posted - 2007.05.14 21:06:00 - [166] Originally by: Avon An accusation of "lies" would require you to have proof that the contrary position is true. What you actually mean is "I don't believe you", which is more a statement of your ignorance, and thus far more accurate. If you want to waste your time trolling on the forums, a small amount of effort may actually bring you more success, and may give you a greater feeling of accomplishment. You can thank me later. Proof is never required and quite optional in the forum PVP BoB has basically championed. All you have to do is twist and twist and twist. As far as I'm concerned Evil Thug and all others now have a free ticket to ride. A ticket purchased by BoB. A golden ticket if you will. Mmmm chocolate... ----------------------------------------------- www.nobob.info
Flinx Evenstar Minmatar Momentum. Dusk and Dawn	Posted - 2007.05.14 21:11:00 - [167] Originally by: Avon We didn't do it whilst we thought it wasn't legal. Thats true, POS bowling IS legal. So is scamming markets, logging of while cloaked at gates, and a whole bunch of other dirty tactics. Does that mean we all have to do it? You claim to be the best pvp'rs, but it is becoming clear as to how you achieve it Shouldn't you guys be trying to clean up your image instead of inventing new ways to break flawed code Sig removed...coz like, you know sometimes I pirate...no, not pirating..err defending the gurista..yes that's the one
Darkstar BP Caldari eXceed Inc. INVICTUS.	Posted - 2007.05.14 21:23:00 - [168] Originally by: Dianabolic That's right, we didn't do it until the gms' said it was legal, thanks for noting it. Which GM, Dice's, BNC's, TAOSP's, Evolution's or RKK's? Signature removed. Please email us at [email protected] if you would like to know why. -Conuion Meow ([email protected])
Pilgrippa 0utbreak	Posted - 2007.05.14 21:42:00 - [169] I can't help but wonder when a mothership pilot is gonna accidentally board one of the ships that he/she bumped, get blown up by the pos, and have his/her ride stolen. (I'm not jealous)
elohllird Gallente Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.14 21:54:00 - [170] Originally by: Darkstar BP Originally by: Dianabolic That's right, we didn't do it until the gms' said it was legal, thanks for noting it. Which GM, Dice's, BNC's, TAOSP's, Evolution's or RKK's? Such wit Darkstar, you must have thought long and hard about that witty reply
Princess Jodi Vendetta Underground Rule of Three	Posted - 2007.05.14 21:56:00 - [171] Originally by: Avon Let's put it a slightly different way. We didn't do it whilst we thought it wasn't legal. So..in other words...you discovered a game mechanic that you thought you could exploit, and until someone else caught you and the GM's began to question its validity, you used it as much as you could. Then you took a temporary hiatus while the uproar considered it illegal, and are now back to doing it cuz CCP won't ban you for it. Way to take the moral high ground. But hey, anything that gets you the win, right? Isn't that what Bob is based on?
Danton Marcellus Nebula Rasa Holdings	Posted - 2007.05.14 22:06:00 - [172] Originally by: x bunny Isn't ramming a valid and known naval tactic ? Why it should be considered an exploit ? Yes and it's also a valid and known fact that ships ramming another can and often do take damage doing this. It's however not know that a ship has moved another for miles keeping it intact to be salvaged by the own forces. Collision damage now! Also Known As
Dianabolic Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.14 22:12:00 - [173] Originally by: Darkstar BP Originally by: Dianabolic That's right, we didn't do it until the gms' said it was legal, thanks for noting it. Which GM, Dice's, BNC's, TAOSP's, Evolution's or RKK's? The same ones that helped ASCN put up the first outpost, so far from anywhere and with absolutely no bugs whatsoever (because, there were none, right...?) Reikoku Diplomatic Forums
Ariella Macha Pulsar Productions Inc.	Posted - 2007.05.14 23:06:00 - [174] More POS bowling in action, this time with four titans flying in formation. Bowling
Byzan Zwyth Dark Centuri Inc. Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.05.14 23:32:00 - [175] sounds like a cool feature though I'm going to have to whip over to a couple of POS and secure my ships ---------------------- Rank: Tech 1 and a 1/2 cannon fodder Pointless forum slowing bandwidth hogging signature pic inc?
nickky01 The Collective Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2007.05.14 23:35:00 - [176] Originally by: Ariella Macha More POS bowling in action, this time with four titans flying in formation. Bowling sorry for being a noob at "pos bowling" but could one of the "bowlers" (i.e. titan owners) please explain if that was a strike or a split??
Galactic Overlord CAOD Corp	Posted - 2007.05.15 07:50:00 - [177] Originally by: Ariella Macha More POS bowling in action, this time with four titans flying in formation. Bowling Ah yes, let's all enjoy the show and gaze at the joke BoB has made of alliance warfare. PHEAR THE AWESOME POWER OF THE TITANS AND MOTHERSHIPS AS THEY BOUNCE IN AND OUT OF SHIELDS ATTACKING AND STEALING EMPTY SHIPS WITH NO OPPOSITION!!!
Darkwolfi Conisor Excavations Syndicate Antagonistic Assembly	Posted - 2007.05.18 23:38:00 - [178] Well they have to do something usefull with their time while they wait for their DD to recharge. Just decrease the recharge time on DD and i think we will not see so much more bowling in the future.. But in some weird funny way i will not get into detail with it's quite funny to watch pos bowling..
Resipsa Loquitor Black Eclipse Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.19 03:25:00 - [179] Edited by: Resipsa Loquitor on 19/05/2007 03:24:58 Originally by: Galactic Overlord Originally by: Ariella Macha More POS bowling in action, this time with four titans flying in formation. Bowling Ah yes, let's all enjoy the show and gaze at the joke BoB has made of alliance warfare. PHEAR THE AWESOME POWER OF THE TITANS AND MOTHERSHIPS AS THEY BOUNCE IN AND OUT OF SHIELDS ATTACKING AND STEALING EMPTY SHIPS WITH NO OPPOSITION!!! Ok. <watches video> Yeah, that was pretty funny! Thanks for pointing that out to me! NA tz folks usually only hear about this kinda stuff - nice to see them in action. ---
Royaldo KVA Noble Inc.	Posted - 2007.05.19 15:00:00 - [180] oh well... dunno what ccp are thinking. would have been nice to see them grow a pair for once and not run away from subjects like this. but they would rather smack people in the boost-the-new-regions-thread or tell us how much money they lose every month on banning cheaters.
ElweSingollo Starlancers Forces of Freedom	Posted - 2007.05.19 17:16:00 - [181] Yay it's legal according to the GM's lets all go be the lamest buggers on the face of the planet gj Evil Thug, Shrike, Chow, Farjung you are obviously shining lights for all of the Eve popualtion to follow lets all play this game in the lamest possible manner because of course owning a 50 bil isk epeen entitles you to do that... and people wonder why so many people get fed up of 0.0 alliance **e. CCP and Eve Online... It's not a bug, it's a feature**
Kyria Timeyu Pie Vendor	Posted - 2007.05.19 21:20:00 - [182] So did that GM that they said they'd appoint to investigate GM corruption actually do anything except post pretty words? Because the situation in Eve really is as bad as ever, the GMs keep cheating, bending rules and handing freebies to their 50m skill point circle of friends and nobody seems to care or even investigate it.
Namingway Important Yet Underrated Video Game Characters	Posted - 2007.05.20 03:02:00 - [183] Originally by: x bunny Isn't ramming a valid and known naval tactic ? Why it should be considered an exploit ? Last time I checked, Naval ships didn't bypass force fields to ram other ships. Bowling drops you in the POS shields, at warp-exiting speeds, casuing you to ram the hell out of stuff, then the game goes 'oh ****, you shouldn't be here', and flings you couple hundred KM away.
Plim Gallente Celestial Apocalypse Insurgency	Posted - 2007.05.20 04:02:00 - [184] Navies also have giant lasers and battle in space in a MMORPG. ----------------- OMG! SiGnAtUrE gO mEnTaLz
Doragee Minmatar Unknown Society	Posted - 2007.05.30 16:54:00 - [185] I thought i just bring this because of the topicality: Quote: Greetings, The so-called "POS Bowling" will from here on be considered an exploit. While it is true that this is not verifiable after the fact by way of logs, GMs are able to go ingame and monitor situations at will, and do it without anyone knowing. If we catch anyone doing this we will take the appropriate action against them. We therefore urge Titan and Mothership pilots to refrain from using their ships to bump ships out of POS forcefields, or risk facing punitive measures for exploiting. All the best, GM Grimmi Lead Game Master EVE Online Customer Support --
SencneS Amarr Balsarferskratchin Inc Axiom Empire	Posted - 2007.05.30 17:10:00 - [186] I didn't read all the thread but it seems to me if CCP just made sheilds like a warp bubble which stops you before you enter everything would be ok. ---------------------------------- Send ISK to SencneS for good Kama!
Tasuric Orka Antares Fleet Yards SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.05.30 17:14:00 - [187] I'm glad CCP took a stance on this, though im sure some people will complain over this as another one of their "creative" aka "haxploitive" "tactics" has been nerfed. Not that i care, today is a good day.
Galactic Overlord CAOD Corp	Posted - 2007.05.30 17:25:00 - [188] Well that only took far longer then necessary to come to the only common sense/logical solution already provided by the players.
Shiny McJangles GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.05.30 17:26:00 - [189] BoB has titan POS bowling is a game mechanic Goonfleet gets titan POS bowling is an exploit and no longer allowed Always looking good CCP.
mazzilliu Caldari Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2007.05.30 17:35:00 - [190] Edited by: mazzilliu on 30/05/2007 17:34:00 Originally by: Tasuric Orka I'm glad CCP took a stance on this, though im sure some people will complain over this as another one of their "creative" aka "haxploitive" "tactics" has been nerfed. Not that i care, today is a good day. "qft" or rather, "wish i had a mothership while this was still legit" imagine if SNIGG were friends of the devs. do you think EVE would be different if their creators were always being fed negative feedback about capital ships and positive feedback about solo piracy?
Dramaticus GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.05.30 17:38:00 - [191] If I see this happening I'll be sure to tell all my friends via MSN. Your signature was inappropriate, email [email protected] to find out why (don't forget to include a link to it) -Sahwoolo
Nikos Iscariot GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.05.30 17:44:00 - [192] Originally by: Jotan Veer To be perfectly honest, I don't mind this as 100s of frigates under the forcefield can make quite a bit of lag at POS fights. Bowling can solve that I guess. I'm guilty for leaving like 5 ships (BS, Cruiser, dictor, ceptors) at a POS during the ASCN war to avoid docking and then not storing them in a maint. array so I won't judge people who do the same. I hope your alliance doesn't avarage five ships per player at a pos, but at least they were expensive! It's a well documented fact that less costly ships cause proportionatly more lag. _______
Buxaroo Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.30 17:47:00 - [193] Originally by: Shiny McJangles BoB has titan AAA has Titan and uses it as well POS bowling is a game mechanic Goonfleet gets titan POS bowling is an exploit and no longer allowed Always looking good CCP. Very nice try at sowing disinformation numbnuts. Try harder next time. "No matter where you go, there you are" - Buckaroo Banzai
Galactic Overlord CAOD Corp	Posted - 2007.05.30 17:55:00 - [194] Originally by: Buxaroo Edited by: Buxaroo on 30/05/2007 17:46:30 Originally by: Shiny McJangles BoB has titan BoB creates POS bowling Majority of EVE cries foul CCP says its legit so everyone can do it Goonfleet gets titan POS bowling is an exploit and no longer allowed Always looking good CCP. Fixed for you. Nice try at sowing disinformation numbnuts. Try harder next time. Fixed for you. Nice try at sowing disinformation numbnuts. Try harder next time.
Chirinako Caldari Legionari Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.05.30 18:02:00 - [195] Originally by: Shiny McJangles BoB has titan POS bowling is a game mechanic Goonfleet gets titan POS bowling is an exploit and no longer allowed Always looking good CCP. Janus Drake has been doing it for a while
Shiny McJangles GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.05.30 18:17:00 - [196] Originally by: Buxaroo Edited by: Buxaroo on 30/05/2007 17:46:30 Originally by: Shiny McJangles BoB has titan AAA has Titan and uses it as well POS bowling is a game mechanic Goonfleet gets titan POS bowling is an exploit and no longer allowed Always looking good CCP. Fixed for you. Nice try at sowing disinformation numbnuts. Try harder next time. So which dev did you msn to figure out how to originally bowl a POS, I'm sure you didn't discover it by accident. Which dev did you msn to get them to make it an exploit, now that we are on board with a titan. Try to cheat less hard next time numbnuts.
Chirinako Caldari Legionari Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.05.30 18:24:00 - [197] Originally by: Shiny McJangles Originally by: Buxaroo Edited by: Buxaroo on 30/05/2007 17:46:30 Originally by: Shiny McJangles BoB has titan AAA has Titan and uses it as well POS bowling is a game mechanic Goonfleet gets titan POS bowling is an exploit and no longer allowed Always looking good CCP. Fixed for you. Nice try at sowing disinformation numbnuts. Try harder next time. So which dev did you msn to figure out how to originally bowl a POS, I'm sure you didn't discover it by accident. Which dev did you msn to get them to make it an exploit, now that we are on board with a titan. Try to cheat less hard next time numbnuts. Awww the ickle goonie is throwing a fit because he's losing to Bob. Shame that. You should look closer to home to realise why you're losing instead of screaming "DEV HAX" every time Bob rips you a new *******.
Dramaticus GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.05.30 18:25:00 - [198] Originally by: Chirinako Originally by: Shiny McJangles Originally by: Buxaroo Edited by: Buxaroo on 30/05/2007 17:46:30 Originally by: Shiny McJangles BoB has titan AAA has Titan and uses it as well POS bowling is a game mechanic Goonfleet gets titan POS bowling is an exploit and no longer allowed Always looking good CCP. Fixed for you. Nice try at sowing disinformation numbnuts. Try harder next time. So which dev did you msn to figure out how to originally bowl a POS, I'm sure you didn't discover it by accident. Which dev did you msn to get them to make it an exploit, now that we are on board with a titan. Try to cheat less hard next time numbnuts. Awww the ickle goonie is throwing a fit because he's losing to Bob. Shame that. You should look closer to home to realise why you're losing instead of screaming "DEV HAX" every time Bob rips you a new *******. HAHAH YOU TELL THOSE GOONIES Your signature was inappropriate, email [email protected] to find out why (don't forget to include a link to it) -Sahwoolo
Phelan Driscoll GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.05.30 18:33:00 - [199] Originally by: Chirinako Shame that. You should look closer to home to realise why you're losing instead of screaming "DEV HAX" every time Bob rips you a new *******. He has a point, guys. I think our (goonswarm's) biggest problem is that, obviously, God is on FIX's side and nobody elses. I mean, we're just too busy to pray over our stations.
Interval The Triad Alliance	Posted - 2007.05.30 19:14:00 - [200] Quote: Greetings, The so-called "POS Bowling" will from here on be considered an exploit. While it is true that this is not verifiable after the fact by way of logs, GMs are able to go ingame and monitor situations at will, and do it without anyone knowing. If we catch anyone doing this we will take the appropriate action against them. We therefore urge Titan and Mothership pilots to refrain from using their ships to bump ships out of POS forcefields, or risk facing punitive measures for exploiting. All the best, GM Grimmi Lead Game Master EVE Online Customer Support Well, that ends this thread.
Wyehr Shadow Of The Light R i s e	Posted - 2007.05.30 20:32:00 - [201] Originally by: Namingway Originally by: x bunny Isn't ramming a valid and known naval tactic ? Why it should be considered an exploit ? Last time I checked, Naval ships didn't bypass force fields to ram other ships. Bowling drops you in the POS shields, at warp-exiting speeds, casuing you to ram the hell out of stuff, then the game goes 'oh **, you shouldn't be here', and flings you couple hundred KM away. In our minds, the POS bubble is a barrier that is supposed to be impossible to cross. What really happens in the game though is that anything on the inside of it that shouldn't be there is hit with an acceleration vector towards the edge proportional to the distance from the edge. What the game really should do instead is relocate intruders to the outside edge with velocity zero, and, this is important, have this done BEFORE the collision detection/bump phase**. No more bowling, no need to have GMs watch, no drama, problem solved. Also then a ship hitting the bubble will appear to have lag, which we are used to and don't mind, rather than the trampoline effect they have now. [ 2007.03.18 18:45:59 ] (notify) Typhoon belonging to Gandolf self-destructs.
dralid M. Corp M. PIRE	Posted - 2007.05.30 20:33:00 - [202] And the goonies keep crying :) First because its allowed, and now because it is not allowed :p You guys ;p Where do the wild roses grow?
Borgholio Minmatar Quantum Industries Prime Orbital Systems	Posted - 2007.05.30 20:37:00 - [203] Originally by: Interval Quote: Greetings, The so-called "POS Bowling" will from here on be considered an exploit. While it is true that this is not verifiable after the fact by way of logs, GMs are able to go ingame and monitor situations at will, and do it without anyone knowing. If we catch anyone doing this we will take the appropriate action against them. We therefore urge Titan and Mothership pilots to refrain from using their ships to bump ships out of POS forcefields, or risk facing punitive measures for exploiting. All the best, GM Grimmi Lead Game Master EVE Online Customer Support Well, that ends this thread. So for weeks they say POS Bowling is legitimate, then only one day after their latest Public Relations disaster they suddenly change their minds and make it an exploit? My my...what interesting timing. ----------------------------------- You will be assimilated...bunghole!
Kyp13	Posted - 2007.05.30 20:45:00 - [204] Half-assed corrections only give you half-assed forgiveness. When will we see some real exploits fixed?
Shiny McJangles GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.05.30 20:53:00 - [205] Originally by: dralid And the goonies keep crying :) First because its allowed, and now because it is not allowed :p You guys ;p
Qual Gallente Cornexant Research	Posted - 2007.05.30 21:39:00 - [206] Originally by: Shiny McJangles BoB has titan POS bowling is a game mechanic Goonfleet gets titan POS bowling is an exploit and no longer allowed Always looking good CCP. No actually: BoB gets a Titan BoB discovers POS bowling POS bowling get declared exploit'ish (One GM's call) BoB stops POS bowling AAA gets Titan, POS bowling is suddenly OK (Another GM's call) AAA, BoB POS bowl to thier hearts content with that info in mind Goons leads the Colaition in a forum war on Titan's as a concept Lead GM get some balls and declares POS bowling an exploit Get your facts straight. Oh, a Goon, can't really expect that of you guys now, can we? "The short version: Qual is right." -Papa Smurf
Karim alRashid Gallente Igneus Auctorita GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.05.30 22:01:00 - [207] Originally by: Qual Oh, a Goon, can't really expect that of you guys now, can we? You never know what to expect.
Smith Caldari Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.31 08:14:00 - [208] Originally by: Qual BoB discovers POS bowling I thought it was the ingenious IAC who discovered this past time? I know BOB are good but I got to say even BOB can't take all the credit all the time.
Kyria Timeyu Pie Vendor	Posted - 2007.05.31 09:17:00 - [209] Others did it first, but they got petitioned and a GM told them to stop Then BoB did it, they got petitioned too but a GM said it was ok. Par for the course, obviously.
Chowdown Gallente Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.31 09:28:00 - [210] Originally by: Smith Originally by: Qual BoB discovers POS bowling I thought it was the ingenious IAC who discovered this past time? I know BOB are good but I got to say even BOB can't take all the credit all the time. Some would argue it was LV Your signature has been reomved, please email us with a link to your signature for clarification - Kreul Intentions ([email protected])
Ceasarian Pullo Minmatar Merch Industrial We Are Nice Guys	Posted - 2007.05.31 13:45:00 - [211] Edited by: Ceasarian Pullo on 31/05/2007 13:47:45 /EDIT didnt feel like getting banned for flaming chowdown

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